Jean

 I am in the process of reading this book. What an eye opener! I have learned so much from this book. The chapter titled "Schooling: The Hidden Agenda" by Daniel Quinn gave me such an awaking experience. It really made me think, look back on my son's learning as a small child, how we've done things the past few years, etc.

I must admit 6 months ago I didn't know a thing about unschooling (I still am learning but know much more). I also must admit I assumed a lot...mostly things that fell under a negative light. Unschooling was nothing I thought it was. I was wrong to assume. Knowledge is power. I am now becoming knowledgeable. I realized that my son actually unschooled all his earlier life, up until 5 years and 1 week old, when he got on that bus for his first day of public school kindergarten (I lived in an area where homeschooling was not talked about and didn't even know there was such a thing - I wish I had). Actually he still carried on with an unschooling lifestyle outside of school. He carried on an unschooling lifestyle outside of our lessons we did when I started homeschooling him. Our lessons got less in the way then public school education did, but I have learned that he learns and grows much more through the unschooling lifestyle.
 
I was public schooled myself, so homeschooling in a way that was not school-at-home was something to get used to. Unschooling I feel will be even harder for me to get used to. I will just need to take a couple breaths in those hard moments and remind myself of all the things he taught himself (to sit-up, crawl, walk, read, use the potty, talk, etc, etc). For example right now he has a stack of books about South America he is reading. He also asked if I would buy him the evan-mor workbook on South America, and is doing lots of research on-line (he would like to learn more about each continent). I know what my boy was like before public school. I felt that pure enjoyment to soak up everything and anything was just not able to happen. It was much improved once homeschooling. I can see that in fact that joy can actually remain throughout life. He knows what he wants, along with God's help.  

 
~ Jean, homeschooling mom to an 11-year-old boy and daycare provider to 6

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-. I realized that my son actually unschooled all his earlier life,
up until 5 years and 1 week old, when he got on that bus for his first
day of public school kindergarten (I lived in an area where
homeschooling was not talked about and didn't even know there was such
a thing - I wish I had). Actually he still carried on with an
unschooling lifestyle outside of school.-=-

Rather than think of that as "unschooling," think of it as natural
learning.

-=-Unschooling I feel will be even harder for me to get used to. I
will just need to take a couple breaths in those hard moments and
remind myself of all the things he taught himself (to sit-up, crawl,
walk, read, use the potty, talk, etc, etc). -=-

It that's all it took, deschooling would be EASY!

It will take a bit more, but you can do it.

http://sandradodd.com/deschooling

There are links to several articles on deschooling there, and lots of
practical suggestions.

-=- For example right now he has a stack of books about South America
he is reading. He also asked if I would buy him the evan-mor workbook
on South America, and is doing lots of research on-line (he would like
to learn more about each continent).-=-

A stack of books, a workbook and lots of research is a tiny sliver of
the real world.

What about music, art, movies, costume, tectonic plates, monkeys, the
equator, religions, languages?

http://sandradodd.com/geography
http://sandradodd.com/connections

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

" Rather than think of that as "unschooling," think of it as natural
learning."

I definitely view this as natural learning. Of what I have read so far about unschooling I feel it itself is a natural learning lifestyle, then a method of homeschooling. I'm still growing in this and every day will learn more.

"It will take a bit more, but you can do it."

Thank you so much!

"A stack of books, a workbook and lots of research is a tiny sliver of the real world."

What about music, art, movies, costume, tectonic plates, monkeys, the equator, religions, languages?"

He is doing so much more then a workbook, books, and research. He is taking *tours* of each area, finding recipes to make, etc, etc. I just didn't type it all. I didn't want to end up with an email that was a length of a story. ;-) Once my son gets going there is no stopping him, just like all children if they were given space to explore...as all of you quite well know.

Thank you much for the links!

Jean

Sandra Dodd

-=-
He is doing so much more then a workbook, books, and research. He is
taking *tours* of each area, finding recipes to make, etc, etc. I just
didn't type it all. I didn't want to end up with an email that was a
length of a story. ;-)-=-

The problem, though, was that you left it the length of a school-unit-
study.

If he's touring each area... you don't mean REAL touring, right?
Because if you can afford to go to every continent, don't worry about
finding recipes or workbooks at all.

Here's the faggot I ate in Wales recently:
http://sandradodd.com/faggot

And Holly's been to the UK twice, once with me and once without. The
"without" time, she also went to France, but many of the photos that
used to be online have disappeared and we haven't located the disk to
replace them all. Someday...

http://sandradodd.com/england
http://sandradodd.com/eastyorkshire

My boys didn't go; Holly's good friend was living there, though, so it
was a Holly deal.

Even if you can't get your son to an exotic foreign land, there are
places within a day's journey of you (within an hour's, maybe) he
hasn't seen but that tourists DO go see.

Don't forget to see the beautiful and historical sites in your own
region!

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

bhmjones

I think it great, and all, that some of our children are excelling at learning these scholastics young as they are, but I would like to ask the group if we should only celebrate "excelling" in scholastics versus the celebrating of "excelling" in other things they are engrossed by, such as: mastering a video game, knowing every word of a favorite tv show, being able to cook, teaching them self how to build a bike or skateboard ramp, etc etc.. ?

Brad Jones




________________________________
From: "mum_to_colin@..." <mum_to_colin@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 3:07:44 PM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: "The unschooling Unmanual...plus more



" Rather than think of that as "unschooling, " think of it as natural
learning."

I definitely view this as natural learning. Of what I have read so far about unschooling I feel it itself is a natural learning lifestyle, then a method of homeschooling. I'm still growing in this and every day will learn more.

"It will take a bit more, but you can do it."

Thank you so much!

"A stack of books, a workbook and lots of research is a tiny sliver of the real world."

What about music, art, movies, costume, tectonic plates, monkeys, the equator, religions, languages?"

He is doing so much more then a workbook, books, and research. He is taking *tours* of each area, finding recipes to make, etc, etc. I just didn't type it all. I didn't want to end up with an email that was a length of a story. ;-) Once my son gets going there is no stopping him, just like all children if they were given space to explore...as all of you quite well know.

Thank you much for the links!

Jean







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pam Sorooshian

>
> I think it great, and all, that some of our children are excelling at learning these scholastics young as they are, but I would like to ask the group if we should only celebrate "excelling" in scholastics versus the celebrating of "excelling" in other things they are engrossed by, such as: mastering a video game, knowing every word of a favorite tv show, being able to cook, teaching them self how to build a bike or skateboard ramp, etc etc.. ?
>
> Brad Jones
>

Some people will remember me celebrating Rosie's immersion in two TV
shows - Roseanne and The Cosby Show - when she was 10 or 11 years old.

It was so great - she watched and watched and watched - for maybe a
year....lots of the same episodes over and over. And then she began to
talk about them and what she'd been watching, very very carefully, was
how the parents treated the children, mostly, plus how the families
interacted with each other. Her conclusion was that Bill Cosby was
pretty heartless - that he pretended to love his kids, but never
hesitated to shame them or belittle them and NEVER asked what they
thought - always assumed he knew what was best for them, was pretty
controlling and sometimes mean. Roseanne and Dan, on the other hand,
were also sarcastic and funny, often at their kids' expense, they talked
things out, they apologized, they changed their minds when they'd
overreacted, they really listened hard to what the kids had to say, etc.

We supported this interest EVEN before she started talking about it -
bought Roseanne and the Cosby Show on DVD so she could watch as much as
she wanted. Took her to see Bill Cosby, live, when he was on tour. The
whole experience gave us confidence that when the kids have interests
that we do NOT understand, there is really likely something purposeful,
something imortant they are learning, even if we're not hearing about it.

-pam

jenstarc4

--- In [email protected], bhmjones <bhmjones@...> wrote:
>
> I think it great, and all, that some of our children are excelling at
learning these scholastics young as they are, but I would like to ask
the group if we should only celebrate "excelling" in scholastics versus
the celebrating of "excelling" in other things they are engrossed by,
such as: mastering a video game, knowing every word of a favorite tv
show, being able to cook, teaching them self how to build a bike or
skateboard ramp, etc etc.. ?
>
> Brad Jones
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "mum_to_colin@..." mum_to_colin@...
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 3:07:44 PM
> Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: "The unschooling Unmanual...plus more
>
>
>
> " Rather than think of that as "unschooling, " think of it as natural
> learning."
>
> I definitely view this as natural learning. Of what I have read so far
about unschooling I feel it itself is a natural learning lifestyle, then
a method of homeschooling. I'm still growing in this and every day will
learn more.
>
> "It will take a bit more, but you can do it."
>
> Thank you so much!
>
> "A stack of books, a workbook and lots of research is a tiny sliver of
the real world."
>
> What about music, art, movies, costume, tectonic plates, monkeys, the
equator, religions, languages?"
>
> He is doing so much more then a workbook, books, and research. He is
taking *tours* of each area, finding recipes to make, etc, etc. I just
didn't type it all. I didn't want to end up with an email that was a
length of a story. ;-) Once my son gets going there is no stopping him,
just like all children if they were given space to explore...as all of
you quite well know.
>
> Thank you much for the links!
>
> Jean
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

jenstarc4

--- In [email protected], "jenstarc4" <jenstarc4@...>
wrote:
>
>
> --- In [email protected], bhmjones bhmjones@ wrote:
> >
> > I think it great, and all, that some of our children are excelling
at
> learning these scholastics young as they are, but I would like to ask
> the group if we should only celebrate "excelling" in scholastics
versus
> the celebrating of "excelling" in other things they are engrossed by,
> such as: mastering a video game, knowing every word of a favorite tv
> show, being able to cook, teaching them self how to build a bike or
> skateboard ramp, etc etc.. ?
> >
> > Brad Jones
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: "mum_to_colin@" mum_to_colin@
> > To: [email protected]
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 3:07:44 PM
> > Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: "The unschooling Unmanual...plus more
> >
> >
> >
> > " Rather than think of that as "unschooling, " think of it as
natural
> > learning."
> >
> > I definitely view this as natural learning. Of what I have read so
far
> about unschooling I feel it itself is a natural learning lifestyle,
then
> a method of homeschooling. I'm still growing in this and every day
will
> learn more.
> >
> > "It will take a bit more, but you can do it."
> >
> > Thank you so much!
> >
> > "A stack of books, a workbook and lots of research is a tiny sliver
of
> the real world."
> >
> > What about music, art, movies, costume, tectonic plates, monkeys,
the
> equator, religions, languages?"
> >
> > He is doing so much more then a workbook, books, and research. He is
> taking *tours* of each area, finding recipes to make, etc, etc. I just
> didn't type it all. I didn't want to end up with an email that was a
> length of a story. ;-) Once my son gets going there is no stopping
him,
> just like all children if they were given space to explore...as all of
> you quite well know.
> >
> > Thank you much for the links!
> >
> > Jean
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

Lyla Wolfenstein

jenny - you seem to be having trouble posting!

lyla

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-jenny - you seem to be having trouble posting!-=-

She is. She's aware, and doesn't know how to fix it. What she writes
is disappearing. Maybe it's a time-travel problem, like when Marty
McFly's disappearing at the end of Back to the Future, while he's
trying to play guitar. Maybe that's why Jen's so smart--she's a time
traveller.

Or maybe yahoo is just screwy with some accounts this week.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

bhmjones

> -=-jenny - you seem to be having trouble posting!-=-
>
> She is. She's aware, and doesn't know how to fix it. What she writes
> is disappearing. Maybe it's a time-travel problem, like when Marty
> McFly's disappearing at the end of Back to the Future, while he's
> trying to play guitar. Maybe that's why Jen's so smart--she's a time
> traveller.
>
> Or maybe yahoo is just screwy with some accounts this week.
>
> Sandra

That happens to me sometimes when I'm using email to reply to a post. It is if my email program is sending it is a format that yahoo groups won't allow through.

Brad

jenstarc4

>>>> I think it great, and all, that some of our children are excelling
at learning these scholastics young as they are, but I would like to ask
the group if we should only celebrate "excelling" in scholastics versus
the celebrating of "excelling" in other things they are engrossed by,
such as: mastering a video game, knowing every word of a favorite tv
show, being able to cook, teaching them self how to build a bike or
skateboard ramp, etc etc.. ?
> >>>

Chamille hasn't really excelled in anything "scholastic". She's really
good at making clothing, doing hair and make-up, giving advice, making
myspaces, photography, and many other things, but none of them things
that she would've learned in school. She is really good at spelling and
grammar though!

Scholastic is anything of or having to do with school, same root word.
So, in a sense UNschooling is the opposite of scholastic.

Howard Gardner has written about multiple intelligences and that makes a
lot of sense to me. Some of those things are highly valued in the
school setting, but most of them aren't. Sandra has a page on her site
about it... http://sandradodd.com/intelligences/
<http://sandradodd.com/intelligences/>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

john_cyphers

> Maybe it's a time-travel problem, like when Marty
> McFly's disappearing at the end of Back to the Future, while he's
> trying to play guitar. Maybe that's why Jen's so smart--she's a time
> traveller.
>
> Or maybe yahoo is just screwy with some accounts this week.
>
> Sandra
>
Although Jenny is popping in and out of the space time continuum here
and we are always glad when she re-appears...we believe that Google
Chrome may be behind the disappearing posts. Still trying to figure out
why her "Jenny C" is not appearing on her posts.

Robin Bentley

Michelle (14) is a skilled clay animal/Pokemon/WoW character model
maker, a voracious reader of fiction and manga, keen watcher of anime,
a fanfic writer (and like Chamille, she is good at spelling, grammar
and punctuation, plus she likes wordplay including puns), a fast
typist, an enthusiastic gamer (online and handheld) and a pretty good
singer. She likes to help me identify birds that come to our feeder,
is protective of the family of raccoons that live in our neighborhood
(especially now that our backyard neighbor wants to cut down their
favorite tree), and loves to go for a drive, just to look at the
landscape. She's keen on learning archery this year.

She's a "Monty Python and the Holy Grail" fan, not to mention
"Mythbusters" and "Animal Cops." She has one Level 80 (level cap),
one level 77, one level 60 and a multitude of lower level characters
in World of Warcraft. Her favorite is a hunter and she's very attached
to her pets in the game. She and I made a costume for Blizzcon (the
Blizzard gaming convention) last year, then buffed it up a bit for
this year so she could enter the official costume contest. You can see
her on stage at around the 6:17 mark in this YouTube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UDMYMd5izE

She's acquiring patience <g>, having been painted and costumed for
about an hour, then standing around for 2 1/2 hours before she even
made it to the stage.

Michelle is a loyal friend, a gracious guest, a creative thinker; she
has a keen sense of justice and a terrific sense of humor.

I guess a couple of those would be considered "scholastic" but most
wouldn't be.

Robin B.


On Sep 2, 2009, at 3:07 PM, jenstarc4 wrote:

>
>
>>>>> I think it great, and all, that some of our children are excelling
> at learning these scholastics young as they are, but I would like to
> ask
> the group if we should only celebrate "excelling" in scholastics
> versus
> the celebrating of "excelling" in other things they are engrossed by,
> such as: mastering a video game, knowing every word of a favorite tv
> show, being able to cook, teaching them self how to build a bike or
> skateboard ramp, etc etc.. ?
>>>>>
>
> Chamille hasn't really excelled in anything "scholastic". She's
> really
> good at making clothing, doing hair and make-up, giving advice, making
> myspaces, photography, and many other things, but none of them things
> that she would've learned in school. She is really good at spelling
> and
> grammar though!
>
> Scholastic is anything of or having to do with school, same root word.
> So, in a sense UNschooling is the opposite of scholastic.
>
> Howard Gardner has written about multiple intelligences and that
> makes a
> lot of sense to me. Some of those things are highly valued in the
> school setting, but most of them aren't. Sandra has a page on her
> site
> about it... http://sandradodd.com/intelligences/
> <http://sandradodd.com/intelligences/>
>

Lyla Wolfenstein

i am using chrome....i don't think my posts are having that problem - wierd!
Lyla

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

gktbdm

Pam, I want to say THANK YOU! This post has really encouraged me. My two older boys (12 & 15) have been deeply immersed in the "Friends" sitcom for some time. They've watched and rewatched episode after episode after episode. Sometimes I've been fine with this, and sometimes I've struggled. I've found it difficult to "delight" in it, though. I've found it hard to see much value in it, to be honest. Your post has encouraged me to delight in THIS moment, but also to have faith and hope that something else may come out of it later. I guess, really, even if its just pure enjoyment, that ain't a bad thing!

The one thing I have noticed is that my 12yo seems to be very aware of various actors (and occasionally producers). He notices if an actor from one show or movie is in another one, and has enjoyed looking their info up on sites like IMDB to see what else they've been in. This has then led to him watching some of their other movies.

"Friends" is the definite main focus in terms of TV though. Comedy, really, I'd say, because he (the 12yo) also enjoys various other comedy shows. Perhaps it is an antidote to the depression he seems to sit in a lot of the time.

Anyway, thanks again for the encouragement to delight in their interests even if I can't see much of substance in them.

Karen

--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>
> Some people will remember me celebrating Rosie's immersion in two TV
> shows - Roseanne and The Cosby Show - when she was 10 or 11 years old.
>
> It was so great - she watched and watched and watched - for maybe a
> year....lots of the same episodes over and over. And then she began to
> talk about them

> We supported this interest EVEN before she started talking about it -
> bought Roseanne and the Cosby Show on DVD so she could watch as much as
> she wanted. Took her to see Bill Cosby, live, when he was on tour. The
> whole experience gave us confidence that when the kids have interests
> that we do NOT understand, there is really likely something purposeful,
> something imortant they are learning, even if we're not hearing about it.
>
> -pam
>

Sandra Dodd

-=-"Friends" is the definite main focus in terms of TV though. Comedy,
really, I'd say, because he (the 12yo) also enjoys various other
comedy shows. Perhaps it is an antidote to the depression he seems to
sit in a lot of the time.-=-

It might be a love of language, and a curiosity about relationships,
for Friends fans, too.

-=-Anyway, thanks again for the encouragement to delight in their
interests even if I can't see much of substance in them.-=-


More encouragement about appreciating kids' hobbies:
http://sandradodd.com/focus

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]