<mypersonalmessages1@...>

I have been reading the recent posts, and i would like to thank you for extending yourself to  write and elucidate the tenets so clearly. i am so appreciative because it has given me the opportunity to  embrace my daily philosophy as well as yours..."always learning".


I have an incredible son, and life is joyous. There is one issue that I would like your input...My son eats fast. Though we use a small fork and spoon, he fills it full and takes the next bite before he has finished swallowing. He eats what he wants and chooses very healthy food and has ostensibly no physical repercussions.. However, the judgmental parent in me believes it would be safer and healthier to eat slower. 

I would be grateful for your thoughts.

Pam Sorooshian

My advice is to stop trying to "fine tune" your son. Let him be human - with human flaws. It won't be good for you and your relationship with him if you pay attention to things like this.

-pam


On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 3:31 PM, <mypersonalmessages1@...> wrote:


I have been reading the recent posts, and i would like to thank you for extending yourself to  write and elucidate the tenets so clearly. i am so appreciative because it has given me the opportunity to  embrace my daily philosophy as well as yours..."always learning".


I have an incredible son, and life is joyous. There is one issue that I would like your input...My son eats fast. Though we use a small fork and spoon, he fills it full and takes the next bite before he has finished swallowing. He eats what he wants and chooses very healthy food and has ostensibly no physical repercussions.. However, the judgmental parent in me believes it would be safer and healthier to eat slower. 

I would be grateful for your thoughts.



chris ester

I think that this is a small thing that would probably go away, if left alone, as he grows up.  But if you make it into a point of contention and judgement and control, then he may feel judged and controlled and hold on to that small behavior and it will certainly not be joyous.
chris


On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 6:31 PM, <mypersonalmessages1@...> wrote:
 

I have been reading the recent posts, and i would like to thank you for extending yourself to  write and elucidate the tenets so clearly. i am so appreciative because it has given me the opportunity to  embrace my daily philosophy as well as yours..."always learning".


I have an incredible son, and life is joyous. There is one issue that I would like your input...My son eats fast. Though we use a small fork and spoon, he fills it full and takes the next bite before he has finished swallowing. He eats what he wants and chooses very healthy food and has ostensibly no physical repercussions.. However, the judgmental parent in me believes it would be safer and healthier to eat slower. 

I would be grateful for your thoughts.


Karen

>>>>>My son eats fast.<<<<<

I'm wondering if he is racing to finish for some reason? Is he hoping to go somewhere or do something? Finish a project up? Was he called away to eat?

If so, you could bring him food where he's working or playing, so that he can take his time and eat it at his own pace.

>>>>>However, the judgmental parent in me believes it would be safer and healthier to eat slower. <<<<<

My husband eats very fast. He has since I've known him. He seems safe and healthy. I don't imagine he would prefer me to tell him to slow down.

Karen.

Sandra Dodd

-=-He eats what he wants and chooses very healthy food and has ostensibly no physical repercussions..-=-

"Ostensibly" meaning what?  (You don't have to tell us; I'm pointing out that you wrote "ostensibly" which implies something critical.

-=-I have an incredible son, and life is joyous. -=-

But you're unhappy with him.

-=- However, the judgmental parent in me believes it would be safer and healthier to eat slower. -=-

I've seen some people who eat quickly, and some others who are always the last at the table.  Some people can vary their speed to match dinner companions and some seem not to do that.  Accepting that there is a range of normal will be better for you than defending "the judgmental parent" in you.

The negativity is always negative.  The speedy intake of food is not.

Sandra

Sandra Dodd

GOOD QUESTIONS!  

-=-I'm wondering if he is racing to finish for some reason? Is he hoping to go somewhere or do something? Finish a project up? Was he called away to eat?

-=-If so, you could bring him food where he's working or playing, so that he can take his time and eat it at his own pace. -=-

There have been a few scenarios in the past involving a child's relationship with food at the table, and it turned out that the parents had made too big a deal about having to stop a game or miss something to sit and eat, and called them away before the food was ready, so they were fidgety and resentful and impatient before the food even came and had ZERO interest in a leisurely dinner with lame questions about what they were doing that day.  What they were doing was being prevented from doing what they wanted to do!  

This might go more slowly, if there's gaming or a movie at the same time:

Sandra

<cheri.tilford@...>

=> the judgmental parent in me believes it would be safer and healthier to eat slower <=


Let go of your belief and look openly and clearly at your son.  Is he experiencing any problems from eating quickly?



I'm a very fast eater.  My nickname at the dinner table as a kid was "hoover" - my mom would put my plate down in front of me, return to the kitchen get her own (or everybody else's) and by the time she sat down to eat I'd sometimes be finished.  

I was warned I'd get indigestion.  That's never happened - not even when I was pregnant.  I've been told I should chew more.  Nothing catastrophic has ever happened from swallowing partially chewed food. 

My husband is also a very fast eater.  We both thoroughly enjoy the act of stuffing our faces quickly.  We also know how to slow down appropriately (like at a fancy restaurant or with slower eaters) so we don't feel out of place. 


Eating fast is an incredibly useful skill!  I've had several customer service jobs that didn't allow lunch breaks (such as waiting tables and bar tending) and being able to eat an entire meal in the time it takes most people to go to the bathroom means I could stay nourished while working a busy shift. 


and running around after a toddler - I never would have survived if I couldn't shovel my food at lightning speed!


There's nothing inherently wrong or bad about eating fast.  Some people just like to. 


cheri




Jo Isaac

My husband tends to eat that way. And his sister too. I don't know whether it's a genetic thing, whether food was limited in the house by way of 'first come first served' when they were growing up, or whether it's just a 'thing' they do. Their younger brother doesn't do it.

Others have mentioned the possibility that your son may be be rushing to get back to something - that  may certainly apply to my husband and SIL who would have been made to 'eat at the table' when they were kids, and might have started rushing to get back to whatever they were doing before being interrupted to eat dinner.

They are both in their 40's and have no issues - either in terms of safety nor health - as a result of eating large fork-fulls very fast for most of their lives.  

Jo


<mypersonalmessages1@...>

thank you for your comments


what i meant by ostensibly is that i am unaware of any problems. 


he eats whenever he wants. he decides when, what, and how much


i appreciate your comment that though i think i am very happy with him, my asking him to eat a little slower is telling him i am not happy with him.  i do not wish to do that or ever be negative, though i understand that i am.


i do recognize that my asking him to eat slower is being judgmental.


admittedly, i do understand what you are saying to some extent, would you mind elucidating further,,,my son plays a musical instrument and enjoys it very much, however, lately, he will get sad with himself for not playing it as he would wish to, he will do this if he has just gotten the piece from the conductor, though he says that he  appreciates  the ideas of perseverance and learning and growing, how would your recommend dealing with this?


again, i am so grateful that you are willing to extend yourself to share your time and your thoughts,  i appreciate the opportunity you have so graciously provided  to learn



Joyce Fetteroll


On Jan 9, 2014, at 4:02 AM, <mypersonalmessages1@...> <mypersonalmessages1@...> wrote:

though i think i am very happy with him, my asking him to
eat a little slower is telling him i am not happy with him.

It not only makes him believe you aren't happy with him it indicates you really aren't happy with him. He is falling short of some ideal you have in your head. 

People who point out what someone is doing "wrong" (someone who isn't hurting or irritating another) think they're being helpful. But they're just seeing imperfections rather than the person.

What if you'd never mentioned you wanted to lose weight. But out of the blue your husband said he had some recommendations that are good for losing weight. Would your first thought be "Wow, he must really love me to want to help me be a better person!"? I suspect not.

my son plays a musical instrument and enjoys it very much, however, lately, 
he will get sad with himself for not playing it as he would wish to, 

Maybe the pieces aren't what he really wants to play. Maybe he could take a break from the instrument. Maybe he could try out another teacher or three so he can experience different approaches. Maybe he could try a different instrument for a while. Maybe he could play on his own for a bit. Maybe you could find a group (that may or may not be just kids) for him to play with.

If he's feeling vaguely dissatisfied, he's likely to grow frustrated if he believes his instructor knows the one right way to learn. He may not know exactly what he wants to do with the instrument. But if he's dissatisfied, unless he experiences different ways to learn, it will be *really* hard for him to discover what he wants. It's likely he'll learn to silence the voice in his head that's saying "This doesn't feel right. This isn't helping me with what I want."

though he says that he  appreciates  the ideas of perseverance and learning 
and growing, how would your recommend dealing with this?

As Clare pointed out in the "Teen with conflicting motivations/desires" thread, doing something you don't enjoy to get better at something is likely to backfire.

What he does to improve won't necessarily be fun or easy but it should feel satisfying. It might be quite challenging! But he should feel he's making progress at something *he* finds satisfying even if it isn't something the instructor believes he should be learning.

When my daughter first started learning to play the guitar, she spent hours and hours figuring out how to do the tapping that Eddie Van Halen does. She played around with it and learned how to make nifty sounds, and do cool tricks. *In the process* she learned a lot of the basics about how to play the guitar. When she decided to take lessons her guitar teacher thought it amusing that she could do some really advanced stuff but there were some basics that she didn't know how to do. The point, though, was that when *she* found her progress hampered by not knowing something, *she* was then motivated to put time into learning it. Before that the skills weren't helping her do what she wanted to do. And practicing that wasn't moving her in the direction she wanted to go would have slowed her progress.

Joyce

<plaidpanties666@...>

>>,my son plays a musical instrument and enjoys it very much, however, lately, he will get sad with himself for not playing it as he would wish to, he will do this if he has just gotten the piece from the conductor, though he says that he  appreciates  the ideas of perseverance and learning and growing, how would your recommend dealing with this?<<


Maybe it's not a bad thing for him to be sad. One of the things he's figuring out is how much time he wants to spend on the various things he does - and part of that process is noticing when he's not meeting his own standards and deciding what to do about that. This is something artists (and small business owners) experience as a regular part of life - how much time to put into "the work"? 

Instead of talking about perseverance, ask him what would make it easier for him to play music more, or longer. Does it help to have company? An audience or someone working on a project in the same room? I like to work with the tv on... that probably doesn't apply so well to playing music, but maybe it would - something with a lot of talking rather than a musical soundtrack. 

Or maybe he'd rather spend time playing different kinds of music - playing along with a soundtrack, or the radio, or with you, if you play an instrument. That might not help him learn a particular piece, but it certainly is a way to practice his skills in a more general sense, including the skills involved in playing with other people.  

<mypersonalmessages1@...>

thank you so very much for taking the time and energy to share your thoughts with me.  i am so appreciative.
you are exactly right...he gets upset if he misses one note. he believes he is playing a wrong note, and his standard for himself is to play the right note.  i like the fact that you see it [as i do] that it is his decision what to do about it.  he does like practicing, and we do do it together. therein is the rub...because neither one of us [yet]  can hear a wrong note, i am the one who points it out. 
i am trying to understand the ideas here...so is telling him he is playing an incorrect note something that is deemed negative and showing him i am unhappy with him?  we do go over the music and see how many right notes he plays. afterwards, he is always glad that he went back and played it and he is very proud of himself.  i recognize that i may sound defensive. i am wanting to know what you would suggest to be supportive in his quest.
thank you once again for your assistance.

Sandra Dodd

-=-
Or maybe he'd rather spend time playing different kinds of music - playing along with a soundtrack, or the radio, or with you, if you play an instrument. That might not help him learn a particular piece, but it certainly is a way to practice his skills in a more general sense, including the skills involved in playing with other people.  -=-

YES.
Great idea from Meredith.

Just as a child who reads all kinds of things will be a better reader than one who sticks to nothing but school assignments, and someone who cooks for fun at home will do better in a home ec class, someone who is familiar with and at ease with his instrument will be able to hold it better, ear it better, compenstae for problems better, and then reading music or learning a single piece will be a small part of a larger life with that instrument.

Sandra

<mypersonalmessages1@...>

yes, he plays in a youth symphony orchestra and the conductor is terrific with the children and is very supportive.  

he does like practicing, and we do do it together. 

but therein is the rub...because neither one of us [yet]  can hear a wrong note, i am the one who points it out. 

i am trying to understand the ideas here...so is telling him he is playing an incorrect note something that is deemed negative and showing him i am unhappy with him?  we do go over the music and see how many right notes he plays. afterwards, he is always glad that he went back and played it and he is very proud of himself.  i recognize that i may sound defensive. i am wanting to know what you would suggest to be supportive in his quest.
thank you once again for your assistance.

Joyce Fetteroll

On Jan 10, 2014, at 2:38 AM, <mypersonalmessages1@...> <mypersonalmessages1@...> wrote:

> yes, he plays in a youth symphony orchestra and the conductor
> is terrific with the children and is very supportive.

I let this through even though it was all a repeat except for this one sentence.

This sentence was important to help people picture what you're talking about.

But please don't repeat. It wastes members' time rereading something to figure out if there might be some new information mixed into the old.

> he plays in a youth symphony orchestra

When a child is playing for himself, what he plays only impacts him as much as he wants to be bothered by it. If a child is playing with others getting the notes right is important. It impacts everyone in the group.

> so is telling him he is playing an incorrect note something that is
> deemed negative and showing him i am unhappy with him?

I'm confused by your asking. *He* know there are right notes and wrong notes. *He* knows it's important to play the right notes. Why would you pointing out what he knows he needs to get right be about you at all?

> because neither one of us [yet] can hear a wrong note, i am the one who points it out.

I'm not sure how you're pointing them out if neither of you can hear them?

But, anyway ... As with learning anything, if he can't catch when he's doing something wrong himself, it will be harder for him to fix it. When a child is learning something for himself, noticing when something's wrong will come naturally when he's ready to focus on that area. A parent can help if they notice something getting in the way of what a child wants to do, but it should be an *occasional* thing.

But when a child is voluntarily learning something that impacts others -- like playing in an orchestra -- mom pointing out his mistakes is getting in the way of him learning to sense what he's doing right and wrong. Right now he's dependent on you and not developing the confidence that he can notice. Unless I'm missing something that's special about this instrument at a young age, he needs a way to notice when a note is wrong so he can correct himself. That would be something to ask his instructor about.

Joyce

Sandra Dodd

-=-i am trying to understand the ideas here...so is telling him he is playing an incorrect note something that is deemed negative and showing him i am unhappy with him? -=-

We can't see all of your life.  We can't read your son's body language or facial clues.

Building a supportive relationship with him is important, and it won't be built just around one thing.  Having credit in the bank with him will make a difference.  Your tone and prior recrod will.  His personality will.

The same way yoga can make people emotional (Holly has shown me examples of this; she does more yoga than I do) and sometimes they'll cry, I was that way with lessons.  I might've thought it was something about breathing or posture, because I've cried during clarinet instruction and even in college in a one-on-one session where I was being pressed to ornament originally on a Telemann sonata for recorder.  But it happened with piano, too.    Something about the mindset and pressure and confusion, even though I was fairly musical and in every situation was there by my own choice and arrangemement, still had me on an emotional edge, and I don't know why.  

IF (I have not idea) your son is like me in that (whatever that was) then correction from you would be worse than correction from the director.
If his line isn't right in a rehearsal, the conductor will hear that and correct him.  

He doesn't need a lifetime relationship with that conductor, but he does (especially if he doesn't have school as an escape) with his mom.
When a child doesn't like school, or an orchestra rehearsal, it's good if he can go home to a sweet, understanding mom.
If he doesn't like mom, where can he go?  

If you consider yourself the home base, it might be easier to decide whether to correct him about a note or let someone else.  

There are lots of things he WILL learn from your own coaching, but music doesn't need to be one of them.

Sandra