DISSER420

Hi all, Just wanted to introduce myself. My name is Mary and I have been, for 10 years a homeschooler to 3 boys (10, 5 1/2, 19 months) along with my husband Jeff. I have felt for a few years now that something was just not quite working. 2 1/2 years ago we moved to Costa Rica (which has been fabulous) from CT and experienced an unschooling lifestyle for about 6 months. Then I reverted back to what society says is important and started to force the actual lessons again. Since then we have all been getting increasingly more angry and sad. I recently had my son in a local school which did not work out at all but was a great learning experience of what we really wanted to prioritize. We pulled him out and have been reading a great un schooling book and have realized that this is the answer we have been looking for. The motivation that we needed to change is upon us and we have been working really hard to make the changes we feel are important. We really need the support and guidance of a great group that has been through it. I imagine it will take a little time and there will be many questions for us to get to where we are headed and that is to be the best parents we can be. I know we haven't been lately and that has just broken our hearts. I am confident that we can make the change we so deperately need. I look forward to all of your insight and hope you will bear with me as I adjust and ask probably too many questions:) Thanks for having us!

k

>>>> I look forward to all of your insight and hope you will bear with me as I adjust and ask probably too many questions <<<<

Asking is fine and so is reading. Here's a link you might enjoy:
http://sandradodd.com/help

Here's a link that goes somewhere different on Sandra Dodd's site
everytime you click it: http://sandradodd.com/random And there's a
randomizer on Joyce's site as well. Look on the top right of every
page and click "Go to a random page": http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/

~Katherine

Jenny C

>>>We pulled him out and have been reading a great un schooling book and
have realized that this is the answer we have been looking for. >>>

Which book have you been reading? That might be interesting to know!

The best resources are the online ones, in my opinion, but I did enjoy
many of the John Holt books, and Grace Llewellyn's "Teenage liberation
handbook". Those, for me were the most influetial books, I know others
have had other books they could relate to more and better.

Mary Hickcox

To also answer the new post by Jen, a great book I just read is Parenting a Free Child: an Unschooled Life by Rue Kream.  It took me only 2 days to read it (with 3 kids that says a lot on how easy it was to read)  It opened my eyes to so many things that we have been doing and showed me that the parents need the change for the kids sake.  It is so hard to step away from the norm and stop comparing or worrying about what is "suppoed" to be.  This book helped so much.  It is honestly changing my entire family for GOOD!!

Mary mama to Dylan (10), Colin (5 1/2) and Theo Benjamin (born 8-28-07)
"Be who you want your children to be."    Unknown   "Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle."







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Sandra Dodd

-=-To also answer the new post by Jen, a great book I just read is
Parenting a Free Child: an Unschooled Life by Rue Kream. It took me
only 2 days to read it (with 3 kids that says a lot on how easy it was
to read) It opened my eyes to so many things that we have been doing
and showed me that the parents need the change for the kids sake. -=-

Rue learned those things on the Unschooling Discussion list and at
Live and Learn conferences. <g>

It's a good book, but they're not Rue's own personal revelations. She
did a great job summarizing and compiling them, though, and there's a
link to buy one from her here:
http://sandradodd.com/books (on the right)

Sandra

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Rue Kream

>> Rue learned those things on the Unschooling Discussion list and at
Live and Learn conferences. <g>

**Well, no. I joined UD at the end of 2000 and our first conference was
the second Live and Learn a couple of years later. We were already
living what I describe in my book by 2000. Not that I haven't learned
from email lists and conferences - I have and I'm sure I'll continue to
- but the larger portion of my understanding of living an unschooled
life came from interacting with and learning from my children and from
my own just-about-lifelong fascination with how and why people learn and
how children are viewed and treated. What was great for us about finding
UD, RUL, unschooling.com, the conferences, and John Holt was that we
realized we were not alone in how we saw things, where before we had
been feeling so.

My mom is a special education 'expert' who is well-known in her field.
We've been talking about and (pleasantly) arguing about learning for
much of my life. I like to tell her she has only herself to blame that
my kids don't go to school, since she's the one who first recommended
books for me to read about brain development and learning and childhood,
which led me to think about those things all the more. We were just
talking on Sunday about how I remember feeling while I was in school
that life had to be bigger than that. She didn't argue with that :o).

I can barely remember a time I wasn't questioning and thinking about
parenting practices. I came from a large family and became an aunt for
the first time when I was 9 years old. We all lived together on one
property for years. Something about being a kid myself but being given
'adult' power (I was often left 'in charge' of the kids and was
instructed that I could slap their hands as punishment) really affected
me, as did seeing that my siblings were in essence making up the rules
as they went along.

Then I met Jon. We were teenagers, and we talked a lot about what sort
of family we would want - what sort of relationships between parents and
children? What accepted wisdom seemed like nonsense? What parts of our
childhoods did we like? What didn't we like? Not too far from childhood
ourselves, we could easily remember what felt right for us and what
didn't - what felt respectful of us as whole humans and what didn't -
and we determined that we would not forget those things, but in the end
what has always mattered most to us is what feels respectful to Dagny
and Rowan.

>> It's a good book, but they're not Rue's own personal revelations.

**For me it is very much a record of my own personal revelations.
Revelations about the relationships in my family, revelations about our
place in society as a family, as children, as adults, revelations about
learning from each other and from our lives how our relationships can
best grow and flourish, revelations about my kids and myself, and
revelations about how and why the way we choose to live as a family
works for us, what it means to us, and how I think it translates on a
larger scale to how other families can live happy lives together.

Others had revelations about natural learning and respectful parenting
before I even had kids, of course, and I'm hopeful that in the history
of the world John Holt wasn't the first and none of us reading and
writing here will be the last.

~Rue


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Sandra Dodd

-=->> Rue learned those things on the Unschooling Discussion list and at
Live and Learn conferences. <g>

**Well, no. I joined UD at the end of 2000 and our first conference was
the second Live and Learn a couple of years later. We were already
living what I describe in my book by 2000.-=-



Okay. I'm really sorry. I thought it was more summary of what was
being discussed in those days.

My mistake.

Sandra

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Pam Sorooshian

On 3/31/2009 2:01 PM, Rue Kream wrote:
> My mom is a special education 'expert' who is well-known in her field.
> We've been talking about and (pleasantly) arguing about learning for
> much of my life. I like to tell her she has only herself to blame that
> my kids don't go to school, since she's the one who first recommended
> books for me to read about brain development and learning and childhood,
> which led me to think about those things all the more.

That is SO interesting. I have had the exact same experience with my
mom. She was an expert on developmentally appropriate curriculum for
preschoolers and on the negative effects of pushing academics down into
kindergarten and preschool. A HUGE proponent of delaying reading
instruction.

I remember asking her, "So what makes you think all that pushing
academics that is so harmful for 5 year olds is perfectly all right for
6 year olds? And if not for 6 year olds, why for 7 year olds.?"

-pam

Pam Sorooshian

On 3/31/2009 2:01 PM, Rue Kream wrote:
>
> **For me it is very much a record of my own personal revelations.
> Revelations about the relationships in my family, revelations about our
> place in society as a family, as children, as adults, revelations about
> learning from each other and from our lives how our relationships can
> best grow and flourish, revelations about my kids and myself, and
> revelations about how and why the way we choose to live as a family
> works for us, what it means to us, and how I think it translates on a
> larger scale to how other families can live happy lives together.
>

I never got a chance to tell Rue about this, but I was at a conference
in California (some others on this list were there and can vouch for me
on this) and we had a big huge group discussion about unschooling -
maybe 50 to 75 people involved, maybe 8 of us radical unschoolers on
the panel. It was kind of awkward to get started and someone just said,
"Does anybody have any questions?" And one woman said, (paraphrasing a
little, but not much), "A group of us have been reading this book,
Parenting a Free Child, and, well, we just don't buy it. We don't
believe they really live that way."

There were at least 4 or 5 of us sitting in the center of the room who
knew Rue and Jon and their kids and we all kind of looked at each other
and our jaws dropped. It had never occurred to me that anybody would
read it and think it was just a pack of lies. But I guess they found it
SO unbelievable that people really would choose to live this kind of
life and that it would work for them, that that was the only conclusion
they could come to.

-pam

Ren Allen

~~Okay. I'm really sorry. I thought it was more summary of what was
being discussed in those days.~~

You were probably thinking of me...since people mix us up sometimes.;)
I was the one arguing for some tv/video game controls at that time (2000/2001) and still learning how to really let go of our old ways.

Rue was one of the people trying to gently thunk me over the head. Must have worked, though it took a few of you and a lot of patience!


Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com

Rue Kream

>>"A group of us have been reading this book, Parenting a Free Child,
and, well, we just don't buy it. We don't believe they really live that
way."

**I'm sad to hear it. Sad to hear they wouldn't believe they could have
it for themselves and their own children.

My dad died last August. Like I said, we're a big family, so there were
always a bunch of us at the hospital while my dad was sick and we all
really held each other together in a pretty amazing way. There was one
young mother who was visiting her own very ill dad every day. She had no
support. We adopted her, made sure she was eating, hugged her, listened
to her talk about her dad. She kept saying she wished she had what we
have, if not with her grown relatives, then with her husband and kids.
I told her what I'd tell those skeptical people at the conference: You
get to decide what you have. It's not going to just happen, but you can
make it happen.

~Rue


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Rue Kream

>> I remember asking her, "So what makes you think all that pushing
academics that is so harmful for 5 year olds is perfectly all right for
6 year olds? And if not for 6 year olds, why for 7 year olds.?"

**Did she have an answer for you? I have to admit, I do love to stump
my mom <g>. ~Rue


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Rue Kream

Thanks, Sandra.

I can't believe how long it's been since I first 'met' a bunch of people
as weird as me (not quite as weird as Jon.) on these lists and
Unschooling.com. I hadn't thought about it for quite a while.

Time's flying, but I'm having fun :o). ~Rue


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Pam Sorooshian

On 3/31/2009 5:44 PM, Rue Kream wrote:
>>> I remember asking her, "So what makes you think all that pushing
>>>
> academics that is so harmful for 5 year olds is perfectly all right for
> 6 year olds? And if not for 6 year olds, why for 7 year olds.?"
>
> **Did she have an answer for you? I have to admit, I do love to stump
> my mom<g>. ~Rue
>

Yeah - she was stumped. And, she got it over time. She was really
interested in unschooling - it appealed to her. She got on the old AOL
forums and asked questions in one of the unschooling chats and she was
very impressed.

-pam

Jennifer Croce

-=-My dad died last August. Like I said, we're a big family, so there were
always a bunch of us at the hospital while my dad was sick and we all
really held each other together in a pretty amazing way. There was one
young mother who was visiting her own very ill dad every day. She had no
support. We adopted her, made sure she was eating, hugged her, listened
to her talk about her dad. She kept saying she wished she had what we
have, if not with her grown relatives, then with her husband and kids.
I told her what I'd tell those skeptical people at the conference: You
get to decide what you have. It's not going to just happen, but you can
make it happen.-=-

The more I learn and embrace the unschooling lifestyle the more I think who wouldn't want to live this way?  It just seems like a more natural and happy way to live.  We have such a short time that our kids are young and want to be with us, sending them off to school and exposing them to that un natural and destructive learning environment just seems wrong.  I am so glad I joined this group and have such great people willing to share their experiences with me.  I am happily on the unschooling path!

Take care,
Jen 






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Sandra Dodd

-=- I know we haven't been lately and that has just broken our hearts.
-=-

This line stuck with me and I wanted to come back to it.

Living in the moment might be the best tool for you right now. Every
time you have a thought about guilt or the past or the future, try to
breathe a deep breath and smile. Just breathing and smiling will
take you from the bottom of a dark pit up to the crest of a hill where
you can see around you.

Sandra

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Mary Hickcox

Thanks so much, it is very true and is exactly what I have been doing.  I feel so good about myself, better then in a few years.  I am trying to think only of living in the moment and not stressing what might happen if this or that.  I feel like I am finally fully awake and it is just wonderful!

Mary mama to Dylan (10), Colin (5 1/2) and Theo Benjamin (born 8-28-07)
"Be who you want your children to be."    Unknown   "Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle."

--- On Wed, 4/1/09, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

From: Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] New to this group and unschooling
To: [email protected]
Date: Wednesday, April 1, 2009, 11:56 AM












-=- I know we haven't been lately and that has just broken our hearts.

-=-



This line stuck with me and I wanted to come back to it.



Living in the moment might be the best tool for you right now. Every

time you have a thought about guilt or the past or the future, try to

breathe a deep breath and smile. Just breathing and smiling will

take you from the bottom of a dark pit up to the crest of a hill where

you can see around you.



Sandra



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