Sandra Dodd

-=-maybe you didnt want to be put back in your place by a new member.
i dont really know and quite frankly i dont really care. in Australia
we believe in everyone having a say. but obviously thats not what its
about over there. i think i will stay with Aussie groups in future.
-=-

A new member wrote and complained about this list. I didn't put the
complaint through but sent some encouraging links and a link to the
archives.

I want to say a word about being "put back in my place." This list
is nearly six years old. There are over 1400 members listed. I'm
sure a third of them are no-mail and have forgotten they're even on
the list, so let's say there are nearly 1000 members. It's my
list; I created it; I am in my place and don't need to be put back in
my place.

I want to say something bout "over there." One of the things I've
done (and had complaints about last week!) is to try to keep this
list international, and not have it be about one jurisdiction, nor
about ANY jurisdictions.

The description at yahoogroups says (and has said for nearly six years):

--------------
Discussion for homeschooling fans of John Holt, whose books Learning
All the Time, Never Too Late, and Teach your Own have made
unschooling a sweet and viable option for thousands of families. This
is a moderated group, with trapdoors for the uncooperative. (Not
moderated in the advance-approval way, but in the be-nice-to-play
way.) It's an idea group and is intended to lean more toward pure
unschooling than neutral, general homeschooling discussion�there are
hundreds of general homeschooling discussions for newcomers. It's to
focus more toward how people learn no matter where in the world they
are, rather than on what's legal in any particular country or
jurisdiction. If you have questions or complaints, write to
Sandra@...
------------------

If "this is a moderated group" means something different in Australia
than it does "over here," and if we discuss that, it will be still
discussing language, which I never mind doing. Clarity with words is
clarity with thought, and the clearer people can be with words, the
clearer their thinking will be.

Those who think discussion of terminology is stupid should really be
on another list, I think. "Just semantics" isn't a phrase that leads
to clarity; it's a shield used by those who have no real interest in
words (or probably more likely by those without what Howard Gardner
calls linguistic intelligence.

Sandra




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dawn

I have found that when something I read on this list annoys,
aggravates, agitates or pushes my buttons, it's about me and what I
need to look at about my behavior and belief systems and it's an
opportunity to deschool me even further.

Over the years of being on this list I've had those first feelings
and yet I still read this list and see what others are "doing" in
order to deschool themselves and let their kids make decision about
their own lives that work for them (the child that is).

It's still fascinates me that people come to this list, say
something "schooly" get affronted and then take off in a huff.

I am eternally grateful to women like Sandra, Ren, Joyce etc who are
role models of how it can be when I let go.

I'll keep coming back; even when I write something that I'm
challenged on… For me it's the only way I learn.


Namaste

Dawn
Tucson, AZ
Zak 11, Max 7





--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>
> -=-maybe you didnt want to be put back in your place by a new
member.
> i dont really know and quite frankly i dont really care. in
Australia
> we believe in everyone having a say. but obviously thats not what
its
> about over there. i think i will stay with Aussie groups in future.
> -=-
>
> A new member wrote and complained about this list. I didn't put
the
> complaint through but sent some encouraging links and a link to
the
> archives.
>
> I want to say a word about being "put back in my place." This
list
> is nearly six years old. There are over 1400 members listed.
I'm
> sure a third of them are no-mail and have forgotten they're even
on
> the list, so let's say there are nearly 1000 members. It's my
> list; I created it; I am in my place and don't need to be put back
in
> my place.
>
> I want to say something bout "over there." One of the things
I've
> done (and had complaints about last week!) is to try to keep this
> list international, and not have it be about one jurisdiction,
nor
> about ANY jurisdictions.
>
> The description at yahoogroups says (and has said for nearly six
years):
>
> --------------
> Discussion for homeschooling fans of John Holt, whose books
Learning
> All the Time, Never Too Late, and Teach your Own have made
> unschooling a sweet and viable option for thousands of families.
This
> is a moderated group, with trapdoors for the uncooperative. (Not
> moderated in the advance-approval way, but in the be-nice-to-play
> way.) It's an idea group and is intended to lean more toward pure
> unschooling than neutral, general homeschooling discussion—there
are
> hundreds of general homeschooling discussions for newcomers. It's
to
> focus more toward how people learn no matter where in the world
they
> are, rather than on what's legal in any particular country or
> jurisdiction. If you have questions or complaints, write to
> Sandra@...
> ------------------
>
> If "this is a moderated group" means something different in
Australia
> than it does "over here," and if we discuss that, it will be
still
> discussing language, which I never mind doing. Clarity with words
is
> clarity with thought, and the clearer people can be with words,
the
> clearer their thinking will be.
>
> Those who think discussion of terminology is stupid should really
be
> on another list, I think. "Just semantics" isn't a phrase that
leads
> to clarity; it's a shield used by those who have no real interest
in
> words (or probably more likely by those without what Howard
Gardner
> calls linguistic intelligence.
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Helen Cain

<snip>

>If "this is a moderated group" means something different in Australia
>than it does "over here," and if we discuss that, it will be still
>discussing language, which I never mind doing. Clarity with words is
>clarity with thought, and the clearer people can be with words, the
>clearer their thinking will be.

It doesn't (mean anything different).

Is that clear enough? <bwg>

Helen in Melbourne Australia

Ed Wendell

Here are my thoughts as a newbie to the list.

The list information that is given before joining or even after joining that I read when I joined stated all this very clearly.

This is a discussion list for more of the philosophy of radical unschooling than discussing personal situations per se. AND once released to the group it is free to flow into any numerous directions - it ceases to be about your specific situation, people are not necessarily discussing your particular situation and what you SHOULD do but how they might approach it from their unschooling perspective. They are not judging you as wrong in any way. They are simply challenging you to see it from a different perspective - to try on new thoughts - to stretch and grow - to consider the possibilities of what is you looked at it from this perspective (to possibly change or not) or to at least know why you are doing what you are doing.

We are told up front that this in not the place to come to get your back patted (to have what you already do validated) but to challenge yourself. I am surprised when people post things contrary to the information given when joining and then are upset when they are given a response I pretty much knew was coming based upon the information given when joining. Or they immediately argue with every suggestion as to why that cannot be done/even considered or tried. Or why would one try to tell the list owner how to run things - or put her back in her place - when if you read for awhile as asked to do - you know where Sandra's place is and she is firmly there ;) ?

This group IS about challenging my thought processes about unschooling and raising our child - that is the purpose of the group IMO. That is why I joined - to be challenged in my thinking and to go to the next level.

I too have found in the past (not necessarily only on this group as I've only been a member for about a month but in life) that when something annoys, aggravates or pushes my buttons - it is usually about my way being challenged and I often have to reevaluate and rethink things - sometimes I change my mind and sometimes I do not. But at least I've made a decision based on more information not just because (meaning having no idea why really). Sometimes I discard a new thought as no way! Then revisit it later when I'm not so in the moment. I don't always change in an instant but gradually over time. Something I said no way to a year or two ago is now just my way. Constantly evolving, stretching, growing.

There have been a couple of times I've almost unsubscribed because I feel some of the angst people have and I'm thinking I don't need nor want more stress in my life from reading these other's angry posts - but I then tell myself what if the next thread holds some key information for me in my thought processes?


Lisa W.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Cathy

"It's my list; I created it; I am in my place and don't need to be put back
in my place."

Well said Sandra. Although I choke a bit sometimes on your 'strong curry',
and need time to think and digest it, I for one am very very glad that you
are in your place!
Regards
Cathy

infreondscipe

" have found that when something I read on this list annoys,
aggravates, agitates or pushes my buttons, it's about me"

Hail!

I really identified with this.

I used to get riled and annoyed easily. I was fairly self-centered,
seeing the advice as something to do with me as a mother when really
it's everything to do with the health and well being of my
kid. I've already had my shot at growing up. The run families are
here for my boy, not to pacify and flatter me.

I also think people in general are very application oriented. I
always hear "yes but how do you DO that? Tell me what to DO". Our
family don't DO anything because it's already happening, the quesion
is how much are we getting in the way of that? For us it's the
mindset that leads to our actions rather than actions we take to
develop a mindset.

Chris

Sandra Dodd

-=-There have been a couple of times I've almost unsubscribed because
I feel some of the angst people have and I'm thinking I don't need
nor want more stress in my life from reading these other's angry
posts --=-

And people do drop off the list sometimes for not liking strife, and
some drop off because they weren't allowed to sow more strife.

I try for just the right amount of strife, knowing it's impossible to
keep everyone happy. <g>

People who never are challenged don't learn as much as if sometimes
they really think, or do something hard. And this list is ALL
choice. Nobody "has to" be here. I don't even have to be here.
There are hundreds of other lists and webpages and books and
magazines people can go to instead of this.

The batch of lists that branched off the original aol homeschooling
forum (that went to unschooling.com after a while, and then that
site's mailing list becameUnschoolingDiscussion, after it spawned
this list; and after it was UnschoolingDiscussion it spawned
UnschoolingBasic and AlwaysUnschooled, all for particular purposes
and slants and with different rules...) are listed here:
http://sandradodd.com/lists/other
and unschooling.dotcom or some such was started back up too, later,
and is operational (though not its original self).

This list can't and shouldn't be everything to anybody. Let it be one
of several resources.

Sandra




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]