Intro & Meals/Eating
Scott & Marygrace Sorensen
Hi,
We've just started homeschooling/unschooling this fall and just found this
group. We have one son, 10 years old, who has mostly been in private
schools except for seven awful months of public school in 1st grade. His
school experience in private, after we rescued him from public school, was
wonderful. It only took me 3 days to get my joyful, happy child back in
private school, however, the economy finally made that route no longer
possible this fall.
Son is fine. Happy with directing his learning. In the two months since
we've started unschooling, though I suppose we really started the day fourth
grade let out, we've been through arches, columns, roadrunners, Greek
mythology, craters, meteors, monkey's flexibility, the origins of Halloween,
farming, castles, fall foliage and why it happens, more physics stuff than I
can recount and on and on.
Though, I am constantly going back and forth between controlling and being.
It's a struggle for me to just let it be.
Anyhow, my question is about eating and mealtimes. My son is just not
eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment. I
figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry usually,
but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for anything to
eat or drink. I just concerned, especially since he's so slender for his
height and age (~65% for height; ~20% for weight) that he's not getting the
proper nutrition or hydration.
Also, we've always tried to sit down as a family to eat dinner and now he
sometimes ds doesn't want to come to the table. It's my husband's time to
check in to see what we've done for the day, so it's important to DH.
Let it go?
Marygrace
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
We've just started homeschooling/unschooling this fall and just found this
group. We have one son, 10 years old, who has mostly been in private
schools except for seven awful months of public school in 1st grade. His
school experience in private, after we rescued him from public school, was
wonderful. It only took me 3 days to get my joyful, happy child back in
private school, however, the economy finally made that route no longer
possible this fall.
Son is fine. Happy with directing his learning. In the two months since
we've started unschooling, though I suppose we really started the day fourth
grade let out, we've been through arches, columns, roadrunners, Greek
mythology, craters, meteors, monkey's flexibility, the origins of Halloween,
farming, castles, fall foliage and why it happens, more physics stuff than I
can recount and on and on.
Though, I am constantly going back and forth between controlling and being.
It's a struggle for me to just let it be.
Anyhow, my question is about eating and mealtimes. My son is just not
eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment. I
figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry usually,
but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for anything to
eat or drink. I just concerned, especially since he's so slender for his
height and age (~65% for height; ~20% for weight) that he's not getting the
proper nutrition or hydration.
Also, we've always tried to sit down as a family to eat dinner and now he
sometimes ds doesn't want to come to the table. It's my husband's time to
check in to see what we've done for the day, so it's important to DH.
Let it go?
Marygrace
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
plaidpanties666
"Scott & Marygrace Sorensen" <sorensen@...> wrote:
http://sandradodd.com/eating/monkeyplatter
If dinner is a really big deal for you dh, let your son know enough in advance of dinner that he can wrap up what he's doing. Also, don't require him to sit through a whole meal. Let him tell his dad what he's been doing and then go if he wants. Since he'll have had other things to eat during the day, dinner doesn't have to be about food, it can be about socializing and connecting with loved ones.
>> Anyhow, my question is about eating and mealtimes. My son is just notBring food and drinks to where he is - we have some little plastic garden tables that work well for snacks anytime. Make it Easy for him to eat and drink. If he's not a big eater give him small portions or plates of mixed foods. Have you heard of monkey plates? There are some fun ideas here:
> eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment.
http://sandradodd.com/eating/monkeyplatter
> Also, we've always tried to sit down as a family to eat dinner and now heWould your dh be willing to "check in" with his son separately - make dinner time special for the two of you. Once your son has had some time to deschool, he might join in just because it looks so nice and cozy.
> sometimes ds doesn't want to come to the table. It's my husband's time to
> check in to see what we've done for the day, so it's important to DH.
If dinner is a really big deal for you dh, let your son know enough in advance of dinner that he can wrap up what he's doing. Also, don't require him to sit through a whole meal. Let him tell his dad what he's been doing and then go if he wants. Since he'll have had other things to eat during the day, dinner doesn't have to be about food, it can be about socializing and connecting with loved ones.
>>Happy with directing his learning.
> Hi,
>
>
>
> We've just started homeschooling/unschooling this fall and just found this
> group. We have one son, 10 years old, who has mostly been in private
> schools except for seven awful months of public school in 1st grade. His
> school experience in private, after we rescued him from public school, was
> wonderful. It only took me 3 days to get my joyful, happy child back in
> private school, however, the economy finally made that route no longer
> possible this fall.
>
>
>
> Son is fine. Happy with directing his learning. In the two months since
> we've started unschooling, though I suppose we really started the day fourth
> grade let out, we've been through arches, columns, roadrunners, Greek
> mythology, craters, meteors, monkey's flexibility, the origins of Halloween,
> farming, castles, fall foliage and why it happens, more physics stuff than I
> can recount and on and on.
>
>
>
> Though, I am constantly going back and forth between controlling and being.
> It's a struggle for me to just let it be.
>
>
>
> Anyhow, my question is about eating and mealtimes. My son is just not
> eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment. I
> figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry usually,
> but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for anything to
> eat or drink. I just concerned, especially since he's so slender for his
> height and age (~65% for height; ~20% for weight) that he's not getting the
> proper nutrition or hydration.
>
>
>
> Also, we've always tried to sit down as a family to eat dinner and now he
> sometimes ds doesn't want to come to the table. It's my husband's time to
> check in to see what we've done for the day, so it's important to DH.
>
>
>
> Let it go?
>
>
>
> Marygrace
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Sacha Davis
Marygrace - my son is quite a bit younger, 3.5 y/o, but we have the same
issue of him not eating and he's actually lost a pound in the last couple
months. Being a skinny kiddo to start it's hard not to worry and I've had
to do a lot of letting go but I do my best and trust that he'll get what
he needs because he knows what he needs instinctively. And I make him
some high protein tasty cottage cheese pancakes for breakfast to get a
little extra into him.
Have you considered involving your son in the kitchen? Coming up with
meals, researching different cuisines, learning different things to cook,
might inspire him to ingest some of those creations as well.
Best of luck!!!
Sacha
issue of him not eating and he's actually lost a pound in the last couple
months. Being a skinny kiddo to start it's hard not to worry and I've had
to do a lot of letting go but I do my best and trust that he'll get what
he needs because he knows what he needs instinctively. And I make him
some high protein tasty cottage cheese pancakes for breakfast to get a
little extra into him.
Have you considered involving your son in the kitchen? Coming up with
meals, researching different cuisines, learning different things to cook,
might inspire him to ingest some of those creations as well.
Best of luck!!!
Sacha
> Hi,
>
>
>
> We've just started homeschooling/unschooling this fall and just found this
> group. We have one son, 10 years old, who has mostly been in private
> schools except for seven awful months of public school in 1st grade. His
> school experience in private, after we rescued him from public school, was
> wonderful. It only took me 3 days to get my joyful, happy child back in
> private school, however, the economy finally made that route no longer
> possible this fall.
>
>
>
> Son is fine. Happy with directing his learning. In the two months since
> we've started unschooling, though I suppose we really started the day
> fourth
> grade let out, we've been through arches, columns, roadrunners, Greek
> mythology, craters, meteors, monkey's flexibility, the origins of
> Halloween,
> farming, castles, fall foliage and why it happens, more physics stuff than
> I
> can recount and on and on.
>
>
>
> Though, I am constantly going back and forth between controlling and
> being.
> It's a struggle for me to just let it be.
>
>
>
> Anyhow, my question is about eating and mealtimes. My son is just not
> eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment.
> I
> figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry
> usually,
> but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for anything
> to
> eat or drink. I just concerned, especially since he's so slender for his
> height and age (~65% for height; ~20% for weight) that he's not getting
> the
> proper nutrition or hydration.
>
>
>
> Also, we've always tried to sit down as a family to eat dinner and now he
> sometimes ds doesn't want to come to the table. It's my husband's time to
> check in to see what we've done for the day, so it's important to DH.
>
>
>
> Let it go?
>
>
>
> Marygrace
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
Joyce Fetteroll
On Oct 28, 2010, at 1:18 PM, Scott & Marygrace Sorensen wrote:
you find the kinds of things it's easy for him to take a moment to eat.
If he were an amazing artist creating beautiful sculptures the world
loved who couldn't break his brain's attention long enough to notice
his body had needs of its own, wouldn't it feel like a gift to him to
bring food to him and take care of the things he was too consumed to
notice?
See that same passion for accomplishment in your son and give him the
gift of helping him do that :-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> My son is just notBring food and drink to him! Make it easy to grab. Change it up until
> eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the
> moment. I
> figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry
> usually,
> but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for
> anything to
> eat or drink
you find the kinds of things it's easy for him to take a moment to eat.
If he were an amazing artist creating beautiful sculptures the world
loved who couldn't break his brain's attention long enough to notice
his body had needs of its own, wouldn't it feel like a gift to him to
bring food to him and take care of the things he was too consumed to
notice?
See that same passion for accomplishment in your son and give him the
gift of helping him do that :-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
plaidpanties666
When Mo was younger and so busy as to forget to eat, I'd "dress up" foods with fancy tooth-picks or serve it on a colorful plate, even use plastic toys as plates and cups. That would help her notice the food. Eating got to be part of playing, not something she had to stop playing to do.
Making food attractive is also a good strategy if you want to "level the playing field" between home-made and commercial foods. Attractiveness and convenience are two big big factors in making commercial foods more desirable - I know there's a lot of fuss about ingredients like sugar or artificial flavors tricking kids into liking certain foods more, but I've consistently seen that "effect" diminishes significantly when you make sure home-made foods are just as convenient and attractive as store bought. That can be a bit more work: when Mo was little, she especially liked individually wrapped items - all the fun of a birthday party and you get to eat the "gift" too! So I would wrap up home-made foods in pretty papers and cellophane, or make little origami boxes so that she wouldn't be choosing between fun commercial foods and hum-drum home-made.
---Meredith
Making food attractive is also a good strategy if you want to "level the playing field" between home-made and commercial foods. Attractiveness and convenience are two big big factors in making commercial foods more desirable - I know there's a lot of fuss about ingredients like sugar or artificial flavors tricking kids into liking certain foods more, but I've consistently seen that "effect" diminishes significantly when you make sure home-made foods are just as convenient and attractive as store bought. That can be a bit more work: when Mo was little, she especially liked individually wrapped items - all the fun of a birthday party and you get to eat the "gift" too! So I would wrap up home-made foods in pretty papers and cellophane, or make little origami boxes so that she wouldn't be choosing between fun commercial foods and hum-drum home-made.
---Meredith
Scott & Marygrace Sorensen
Thanks for the tip. I used to do this when he was younger. I've never
heard of monkey platters, but had made them anyway.
Great ideas.
Thank you.
Marygrace
heard of monkey platters, but had made them anyway.
Great ideas.
Thank you.
Marygrace
Scott & Marygrace Sorensen
He does like to cook, but getting him interested takes some doing, it means
time away from another activity he'd choose first. I'll suggest some
things.
Thanks.
Marygrace
time away from another activity he'd choose first. I'll suggest some
things.
Thanks.
Marygrace
Tamara Account
I love the sound of those cellophane and origami wraps. any tips on whereto find tutorials?
We use stickers and seek out interesting commercial packaging to make our homemade snacks appealing.
We use stickers and seek out interesting commercial packaging to make our homemade snacks appealing.
plaidpanties666
Tamara Account <tamara@...> wrote:
For paper and cellophane, I would hunt through stores for discounted wrapping paper, actually. Look in party sections or floral sections for different colors of cellophane. Last year, in the "after xmas" sales I stocked up on wrapping paper (we still use it for all kinds of crafts) and found some fun xmas foils and plastic wraps that I've used to pack lunches in when all the plastic containers are dirty :P
Here's a good site for free origami patterns:
http://www.origami-fun.com/
---Meredith
>*****************
> I love the sound of those cellophane and origami wraps. any tips on whereto find tutorials?
For paper and cellophane, I would hunt through stores for discounted wrapping paper, actually. Look in party sections or floral sections for different colors of cellophane. Last year, in the "after xmas" sales I stocked up on wrapping paper (we still use it for all kinds of crafts) and found some fun xmas foils and plastic wraps that I've used to pack lunches in when all the plastic containers are dirty :P
Here's a good site for free origami patterns:
http://www.origami-fun.com/
---Meredith
Scott & Marygrace Sorensen
"Anyhow, my question is about eating and mealtimes. My son is just not
eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment. I
figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry usually,
but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for anything to
eat or drink. I just concerned, especially since he's so slender for his
height and age (~65% for height; ~20% for weight) that he's not getting the
proper nutrition or hydration."
Thank you for all the great tips. I've been taking food to him and the
monkey platter has worked great, he's still not trying new things or things
he hasn't liked previously, but that doesn't bother me.
I just have one concern now. I feel like I'm teaching him that he will get
waited on. I don't want him to embody that idea. Though I'm hoping it will
translate out in him being a more helpful person in the long run. He's
always the first in a group to check on someone who falls or gets hurt,
however, he's always the last when it comes to volunteering to help out with
chores.
I know it will be alright, but just one of those back of the mind concerns I
have that occasionally makes it's screaming way to the forefront of my mind!
Thank for all the great reading. This is a terrific resource.
Marygrace
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
eating, he's so interested and focused in what he's doing at the moment. I
figure he won't starve, he eventually does let me know he's hungry usually,
but it can be 3pm before he's listened to his body and asked for anything to
eat or drink. I just concerned, especially since he's so slender for his
height and age (~65% for height; ~20% for weight) that he's not getting the
proper nutrition or hydration."
Thank you for all the great tips. I've been taking food to him and the
monkey platter has worked great, he's still not trying new things or things
he hasn't liked previously, but that doesn't bother me.
I just have one concern now. I feel like I'm teaching him that he will get
waited on. I don't want him to embody that idea. Though I'm hoping it will
translate out in him being a more helpful person in the long run. He's
always the first in a group to check on someone who falls or gets hurt,
however, he's always the last when it comes to volunteering to help out with
chores.
I know it will be alright, but just one of those back of the mind concerns I
have that occasionally makes it's screaming way to the forefront of my mind!
Thank for all the great reading. This is a terrific resource.
Marygrace
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joyce Fetteroll
On Nov 10, 2010, at 9:41 AM, Scott & Marygrace Sorensen wrote:
his diaper for him? Wiped his butt when he could go on his own? Pushed
him in a stroller or carried him around? And read to him?
I wiped my daughter's butt for quite a few years after she could do it
herself. I read to her even after she could read herself. (In fact I
still do and she's 19.) I cook for her even though she's capable of
cooking some simple meals herself.
Why do kids out grow that good deal? They could choose to just lie
there and have everything done for them. No choices to make. No effort
to put out.
And yet they don't. Why?
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I just have one concern now. I feel like I'm teaching him that heYou fed him when he was an infant right? Fed him as a toddler? Changed
> will get
> waited on. I don't want him to embody that idea.
his diaper for him? Wiped his butt when he could go on his own? Pushed
him in a stroller or carried him around? And read to him?
I wiped my daughter's butt for quite a few years after she could do it
herself. I read to her even after she could read herself. (In fact I
still do and she's 19.) I cook for her even though she's capable of
cooking some simple meals herself.
Why do kids out grow that good deal? They could choose to just lie
there and have everything done for them. No choices to make. No effort
to put out.
And yet they don't. Why?
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
otherstar
From: Joyce Fetteroll
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2010 11:13 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] RE: Intro & Meals/Eating
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2010 11:13 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] RE: Intro & Meals/Eating
On Nov 10, 2010, at 9:41 AM, Scott & Marygrace Sorensen wrote:
> I just have one concern now. I feel like I'm teaching him that he
> will get
> waited on. I don't want him to embody that idea.
You fed him when he was an infant right? Fed him as a toddler? Changed
his diaper for him? Wiped his butt when he could go on his own? Pushed
him in a stroller or carried him around? And read to him?
*************************
A thought that I had as I read this exchange was to think about the times that you have asked your kids to do stuff for you. If my daughter is in the kitchen and is coming right by me, I will ask her if she can bring me my water. How many times in a day do you ask your children to do stuff? How would you feel if your children said that they were afraid to do stuff for you because they felt like they were teaching you that you will get waited on?
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Julie
I offer my kids stuff all the time and I just don't recognize the mindset that it could "teach them to be waited on". I offer them food, attention, access to a new thing or experience, etc because I love them and care about their happiness. Unschooling is very hard if you're worried about future results. You really have to live in the now and meet today's needs rather than worry about tomorrow's possibilities.
Julie M
james 2005
tyler 2007
audrey 2009
Julie M
james 2005
tyler 2007
audrey 2009
--- In [email protected], "Scott & Marygrace Sorensen" <sorensen@...> wrote:
>
> I just have one concern now. I feel like I'm teaching him that he will get
> waited on. I don't want him to embody that idea. Though I'm hoping it will
> translate out in him being a more helpful person in the long run. He's
> always the first in a group to check on someone who falls or gets hurt,
> however, he's always the last when it comes to volunteering to help out with
> chores.
>
>
>
> I know it will be alright, but just one of those back of the mind concerns I
> have that occasionally makes it's screaming way to the forefront of my mind!
>
>
>
> Thank for all the great reading. This is a terrific resource.
>
>
>
> Marygrace
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Toby Rosenberg
What about if I don't want to do something for my kids because I don't feel like it or more likely I am too busy. For example, I'm cleaning up in the house and my chid is hungry. All of my kids (12, 9, 3) except my 3 year old is capable of making themselves a sandwich. I don't want to always do things for them because I am not getting my needs filled like having a clean space. If I were sitting around doing nothing, of course I would help them out. When anyone other than my children asks me for a favor I'm willing, but if they keep asking for one thing after another, I would and have said no. Aren't I just being real by telling my kids I don't want to do something for them when I am busy? At the same time if I see that they are not physically and mentally able to do something, I am always available for help.
Toby
Toby
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
<<<<,,"What about if I don't want to do something for my kids because I don't
feel like it or more likely I am too busy. For example, I'm cleaning up in the
house and my chid is hungry. All of my kids (12, 9, 3) except my 3 year old is
capable of making themselves a sandwich. I don't want to always do things for
them because I am not getting my needs filled like having a clean space. If I
were sitting around doing nothing, of course I would help them out. When anyone
other than my children asks me for a favor I'm willing, but if they keep asking
for one thing after another, I would and have said no. Aren't I just being real
by telling my kids I don't want to do something for them when I am busy? At the
same time if I see that they are not physically and mentally able to do
something, I am always available for help.">>>>>
Sometimes I am super busy and my husband asks me for a favor and I gladly d it
for him. Sometimes I am the one who asks for a favor from my super busy husband,
and when I say busy I meant he works everyday 365 from 4:30 AM until 9:00PM and
sometimes more, and he stops what he is doing ( unless he literally cannot) and
doe it for me.
Its so sweet!'
I do it for my kids as well and they do it for me. There has been time when my
son was doing something or in the middle of something that he paused it to do
something for me, specially when his little sister was younger.
I try not to ask for favors when they are busy but sometimes I do and I have to
say that they almost always help me out because do the same for them.
Another thing I remember when I was your children's age and could make my own
food, sandwiches and all , was that food made by my mom tasted better than made
by me.
I loved when my mom made me a grilled cheese. I still do and my 70 year old
mother still makes for me!!!!!!!!
If you do not want to take the time to give your kids the gift of a snack or
saml meal when they are hungry then don't.
But you will be missing out on so much. That I can assure you.
If you do it with love and as a gift to your children you will see how much more
important it is to give those small gives of love than to stay on task cleaning
the house.
Alex Polikowksy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
plaidpanties666
Toby Rosenberg <philipntoby@...> wrote:
It can help to look for ways to move away from the idea that your needs are in competition with your kids' needs and desires. As a parent, a certain amount of pleasure and satisfaction comes from being with and doing for my kids. That's a win-win, if I choose to see it as such: I "get" to take care of the people I love.
If you are having a hard time meeting your needs, its worth re-evaluating those needs. I don't mean "say no to yourself" I mean think about what you really do need so you can meet your needs better, and have more energy for other things. If a clean space meets a need for you, how *much* of a clean space do you need? Can you clean one room, or one part of a room and feel satisfied?
But at the same time, if you're clinging to "my needs" too tightly, it can be easy to keep busy as a way of being able to say "No". I'm not saying you do that, but its something to look for if you tend to see your needs as being in competition with your kids. If you can keep "working" you can keep "winning".
If I'm up and around its easier for me to do one more thing - easier than if I'm resting, since I'm more likely to cling to my "down time". So if I'm feeling cranky and resentful, I'm more likely to "go there" with the flip side of the above statement - I'd be happy to do it if I were up. Woops.
If its a massive hassle to do one more thing right now, say so. But if its a pattern of not having time and energy to help the people you love, its worth looking for a way to change that pattern. Offer food before you start cleaning, maybe, and clean your way over to where the empty plates will be in ten minutes. Or invite your kids to help you, if they're not obviously in the middle of something else.
"Being real" can be a good thing if it fosters connection - some adults will keep their "real" selves from their kids, put on a happy face too much, not express their own boundaries enough, or not let people know when they're overwhelmed until they crack. So being real or authentic in the sense of honoring and communicating your own humanity is a good thing. But at the same time, "being real" sometimes gets used to mean dumping the worst of our human nature on our loved ones: "get your own f'ing sandwich, I'm busy."
A lot of this depends on personal baggage. I was raised that "its better to be a bitch than a doormat" so I have had to work on finding the parts of me that are truly kind - kind to me And to other people, rather than stomping on everyone's emotions (including my own) because I didn't want to be walked on. Other women are raised with expectations that its better to be a martyr than a meanie (to flip my mother's saying around the other way), and will overlook their own needs too often in order to be "nice". Neither of those extremes are particularly good for building partnerships.
---Meredith
> I don't want to always do things for them because I am not getting my needs filled like having a clean space.***************
It can help to look for ways to move away from the idea that your needs are in competition with your kids' needs and desires. As a parent, a certain amount of pleasure and satisfaction comes from being with and doing for my kids. That's a win-win, if I choose to see it as such: I "get" to take care of the people I love.
If you are having a hard time meeting your needs, its worth re-evaluating those needs. I don't mean "say no to yourself" I mean think about what you really do need so you can meet your needs better, and have more energy for other things. If a clean space meets a need for you, how *much* of a clean space do you need? Can you clean one room, or one part of a room and feel satisfied?
>>If I were sitting around doing nothing, of course I would help them out.**************
But at the same time, if you're clinging to "my needs" too tightly, it can be easy to keep busy as a way of being able to say "No". I'm not saying you do that, but its something to look for if you tend to see your needs as being in competition with your kids. If you can keep "working" you can keep "winning".
If I'm up and around its easier for me to do one more thing - easier than if I'm resting, since I'm more likely to cling to my "down time". So if I'm feeling cranky and resentful, I'm more likely to "go there" with the flip side of the above statement - I'd be happy to do it if I were up. Woops.
>Aren't I just being real by telling my kids I don't want to do something for them when I am busy?***************
If its a massive hassle to do one more thing right now, say so. But if its a pattern of not having time and energy to help the people you love, its worth looking for a way to change that pattern. Offer food before you start cleaning, maybe, and clean your way over to where the empty plates will be in ten minutes. Or invite your kids to help you, if they're not obviously in the middle of something else.
"Being real" can be a good thing if it fosters connection - some adults will keep their "real" selves from their kids, put on a happy face too much, not express their own boundaries enough, or not let people know when they're overwhelmed until they crack. So being real or authentic in the sense of honoring and communicating your own humanity is a good thing. But at the same time, "being real" sometimes gets used to mean dumping the worst of our human nature on our loved ones: "get your own f'ing sandwich, I'm busy."
A lot of this depends on personal baggage. I was raised that "its better to be a bitch than a doormat" so I have had to work on finding the parts of me that are truly kind - kind to me And to other people, rather than stomping on everyone's emotions (including my own) because I didn't want to be walked on. Other women are raised with expectations that its better to be a martyr than a meanie (to flip my mother's saying around the other way), and will overlook their own needs too often in order to be "nice". Neither of those extremes are particularly good for building partnerships.
---Meredith
otherstar
From: Toby Rosenberg
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 11:02 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] RE: Intro & Meals/Eating
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 11:02 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] RE: Intro & Meals/Eating
>>>What about if I don't want to do something for my kids because I don't feel like it or more likely I am too busy.<<<<I always try to reframe everything and think of how it would make me feel if my husband or children had that attitude. For example, how would I feel if my husband or children didn't want to do stuff for me because they don't feel like it or are too busy? If it was once in a while, it might be understandable. If my husband (or children) were always telling me that they didn't want to help me, I might feel rejected. I might wonder what I was doing wrong.
>>>>For example, I'm cleaning up in the house and my chid is hungry. All of my kids (12, 9, 3) except my 3 year old is capable of making themselves a sandwich.<<<<Why can't you ask them to wait a few minutes while you finish up what you are doing? Even if they are capable of making a sandwich, that doesn't mean that they actually want a sandwich. Sometimes my kids will want stuff to eat that is more complicated than making a sandwich. If they want something more complicated, I might ask them if they can help me finish up what I am doing or even take over. There are a lot more choices than telling them no or dropping everything and doing it right that second. A lot of times, my 9 year old doesn't realize that I am busy because she is distracted doing her own thing.
>>>>I don't want to always do things for them because I am not getting my needs filled like having a clean space. If I were sitting around doing nothing, of course I would help them out.<<<<How often do moms or dads actually get to sit around and do nothing? I always feel like I am busy doing something. If I were to reserve my help for times when I am not busy, then I would never help my kids.
>>>>When anyone other than my children asks me for a favor I'm willing, but if they keep asking for one thing after another, I would and have said no.<<<<Why are you helpful for anyone other than your children? Your children aren't everyone else. You chose to have them. What if the favor is giving them a hug or a kiss? Would you feel the same way if they continually asked for a hug or a kiss? Each thing that I do for my children is like giving them a hug or a kiss. It is a way of saying "I love you."
>>>>Aren't I just being real by telling my kids I don't want to do something for them when I am busy? At the same time if I see that they are not physically and mentally able to do something, I am always available for help.<<<<There is a huge difference between not wanting to do something and not being able to do something. If my kids ask for something while I am elbow deep in dishwater, it is not a matter of not wanting to help. It is a matter of not being able to help until I get my hands out of the water and dry my hands. A lot of times, my kids will ask for stuff while they are in a different room and can't actually see what I am doing. If I explain what I am doing, they will usually wait for me to get to a stopping point. My younger kids may not understand but my older ones do. Think about how many times you ask your kids to do stuff while they are busy. Do you extend them the courtesy of letting them get to a stopping point or do you insist that they do what you want them to do?
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joyce Fetteroll
On Nov 11, 2010, at 12:02 PM, Toby Rosenberg wrote:
above nothing.
Is that what you want to say to them?
Often our actions say things we don't intend to say. But other people
don't react to our intentions. They react to how our actions make them
feel. Our intentions mean nothing if the actions say something
different.
If your kids are asking for something they're saying it's important
enough to ask for help. It may not be about the thing. What they may
be asking for is a connection with you. They're saying they feel cut
off, that there's a whole lot of important things you're putting
between you and them and they want to reconnect. By saying no they're
hearing, "No, you're not important enough."
When kids are positive about their position on your priority list,
when your actions are proving it, then "Let me finish this," when it's
not something that can be dropped will sound to them a whole lot
different. It will just be reality.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> If I were sitting around doing nothing, of course I would help themWhat that action says to your kids is they rank in priority right
> out.
above nothing.
Is that what you want to say to them?
Often our actions say things we don't intend to say. But other people
don't react to our intentions. They react to how our actions make them
feel. Our intentions mean nothing if the actions say something
different.
If your kids are asking for something they're saying it's important
enough to ask for help. It may not be about the thing. What they may
be asking for is a connection with you. They're saying they feel cut
off, that there's a whole lot of important things you're putting
between you and them and they want to reconnect. By saying no they're
hearing, "No, you're not important enough."
When kids are positive about their position on your priority list,
when your actions are proving it, then "Let me finish this," when it's
not something that can be dropped will sound to them a whole lot
different. It will just be reality.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
I'm glad you included this part, Joyce. Unschooling is not a way to have Mom jumping. It is a way to live well together, helping each other and doing what you can realistically do.
Now when 15-year-old DD wants to go to the football game at the last minute (last night's event) and knows I have a very full plate, she brainstorms with me to figure out how to make it happen, how to juggle, who to ask what about timing and rides, etc. She knows it may not happen but that, together, we will try to meet everyone's needs.
When 17-year-old DS is on his way to bed but sees I am trying to load the dishwasher, he lingers with the 4-year-old and everyone gets what they want done. Instead of my morning starting off hectic, with chores either undone or done in between playing with the "baby," everything just flows smoothly. Not from being assigned or even asked, just from being part of a household where everyone is paying attention, in a nice way.
Nance
Now when 15-year-old DD wants to go to the football game at the last minute (last night's event) and knows I have a very full plate, she brainstorms with me to figure out how to make it happen, how to juggle, who to ask what about timing and rides, etc. She knows it may not happen but that, together, we will try to meet everyone's needs.
When 17-year-old DS is on his way to bed but sees I am trying to load the dishwasher, he lingers with the 4-year-old and everyone gets what they want done. Instead of my morning starting off hectic, with chores either undone or done in between playing with the "baby," everything just flows smoothly. Not from being assigned or even asked, just from being part of a household where everyone is paying attention, in a nice way.
Nance
>
> When kids are positive about their position on your priority list,
> when your actions are proving it, then "Let me finish this," when it's
> not something that can be dropped will sound to them a whole lot
> different. It will just be reality.
>
> Joyce
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>