Sandra Dodd

This is from e-mail.  There are people here who know about makeup and might be able to help.  The family is in Australia.

_____________
I don't mind you asking in either of the group on my behalf if you don't have the time to answer personally.

My 9yo daughter was diagnosed with 2 rare and chronic liver diseases in June this year.  It's been an horrendous time for us all but we are finally settling down into our "new normal" which seems some days to consist of just giving medication (as she resists taking it).  She seems to have accepted that she has no choice really - the alternative is eventual liver failure.  She also has to have fortnightly bloods taken and we see the consultant fortnightly.  She doesn't particularly like going to either but we try to make it bearable for her by going to a few other places she likes on the way and she goes into the hospital cafe and has her favourite jelly and biscuits which has become a bit of a routine.  So all in all it's a pretty rough time for all of us but mainly Chayton who doesn't really like the diseases or the side affects of the medication (one being she has put a lot of weight on).

Really the thing I am struggling with is she has started taking an interest in make-up and beauty products.  She loves watching all the youtube videos of girls' room tours and closet tours and vanity tours.  I'm beginning to wonder if is interested in beauty due to her being unhappy with her weight and make up help make her feel prettier.  Although I'm not sure - maybe she just likes beauty and it's nothing to do with her weight gain.  

Anyway she loves makeup and wants to start up a make up collection. The issue is, I don't want her wearing all the cheap products which are full of chemicals.  She isn't in remission yet and I don't want anything to comprise her health.  

The products I gave her were organic products and I bought her a few really nice (and expensive) natural products for Christmas. But she wants more for her collection - she currently has 2 lipsticks, one small eyeshadow pallette, mascara and a blush and some make up brushes.  I understand from the youtube videos we have watched together than this amount isn't anywhere near what she wants to have. She wants lots of pallettes - which I could pick up really cheap but there is no way I can afford to buy her the pallettes she wants in the organic/natural range.  But neither do I want to get her the cheap stuff either.

I have bought her other beauty items such as make up storage but I know it's not what she wants. She is really upset and angry with me right now. 
__________________________end of that post__________________________

Here's blog post by the daughter, so you'll have some of her side, too; she's pretty upset.

The mom wrote:  I just don't know how to deal with a situation like this.

Thanks for any ideas!  

Sandra


Chris Sanders

I wonder if she might like to make some of her own natural makeup.  I'm sure there are loads of websites and videos explaining how to do so.  Just an idea.

Chris

On Jan 5, 2014, at 8:26 AM, Sandra Dodd wrote:

 

This is from e-mail.  There are people here who know about makeup and might be able to help.  The family is in Australia.

_____________
I don't mind you asking in either of the group on my behalf if you don't have the time to answer personally.

My 9yo daughter was diagnosed with 2 rare and chronic liver diseases in June this year.  It's been an horrendous time for us all but we are finally settling down into our "new normal" which seems some days to consist of just giving medication (as she resists taking it).  She seems to have accepted that she has no choice really - the alternative is eventual liver failure.  She also has to have fortnightly bloods taken and we see the consultant fortnightly.  She doesn't particularly like going to either but we try to make it bearable for her by going to a few other places she likes on the way and she goes into the hospital cafe and has her favourite jelly and biscuits which has become a bit of a routine.  So all in all it's a pretty rough time for all of us but mainly Chayton who doesn't really like the diseases or the side affects of the medication (one being she has put a lot of weight on).

Really the thing I am struggling with is she has started taking an interest in make-up and beauty products.  She loves watching all the youtube videos of girls' room tours and closet tours and vanity tours.  I'm beginning to wonder if is interested in beauty due to her being unhappy with her weight and make up help make her feel prettier.  Although I'm not sure - maybe she just likes beauty and it's nothing to do with her weight gain.  

Anyway she loves makeup and wants to start up a make up collection. The issue is, I don't want her wearing all the cheap products which are full of chemicals.  She isn't in remission yet and I don't want anything to comprise her health.  

The products I gave her were organic products and I bought her a few really nice (and expensive) natural products for Christmas. But she wants more for her collection - she currently has 2 lipsticks, one small eyeshadow pallette, mascara and a blush and some make up brushes.  I understand from the youtube videos we have watched together than this amount isn't anywhere near what she wants to have. She wants lots of pallettes - which I could pick up really cheap but there is no way I can afford to buy her the pallettes she wants in the organic/natural range.  But neither do I want to get her the cheap stuff either.

I have bought her other beauty items such as make up storage but I know it's not what she wants. She is really upset and angry with me right now. 
__________________________end of that post__________________________

Here's blog post by the daughter, so you'll have some of her side, too; she's pretty upset.

The mom wrote:  I just don't know how to deal with a situation like this.

Thanks for any ideas!  

Sandra




CASS KOTRBA

-=- Anyway she loves makeup and wants to start up a make up collection. The issue is, I don't want her wearing all the cheap products which are full of chemicals.  She isn't in remission yet and I don't want anything to comprise her health.  -=-
 
Maybe she would be interested in making her own make-up.  I did this awhile back, there are a variety of micas and oxides that are naturally occurring that can be used to make your own.  I thought it was fun and think my daughter and I will enjoy doing it together at some point.  If you make your own you can choose ingredients you feel good about while you and your daughter focus on the fun of creation!  This is the site that I used, although I'm sure there are others:  http://www.diycosmetics.com/.  They provide recipes and ingredients, kits, etc...
 
Here is a good website where you can check the safety of/implications to the liver of individual ingredients:  http://www.ewg.org/skindeep/
 
Good luck!
Cass
 

haydee deldenovese

Although the fact that organic make up does lack in pigmentation is true,  it is meant to give a more natural beauty look. Because of her health situation,  I wouldn't recommend any regular make up, other than bare minerals.  They seem to have more colors now, and although they are not super bright, they can give a nice and pretty color to the face.
However,  I would suggest organic edible make up! It is easy and it is creative. She gets to make it herself! I do this myself,  and I love it. Although I don't use foundation anymore, I can still look pretty with simple fruits.
Here is how:
Buy some frozen organic raspberries, blackberries and even strawberries. Take 1 or 2 raspberries, and kind of smooch them with your fingers to thaw them a bit with your fingers body heat. Use that as a blush (it comes out pretty red, so it will take a few tries for her to get the hang of it) do the same with the blackberries,  or smash them even, and apply to the lips. Strawberry can be used as eye shadow, mixed with a little raspberry.
For mascara:
I use a little spirulina with blackberries. Kind of smash together and mix well to where is still a bit wet. To apply she can use an old mascara brush that has been washed,  or a qtip without the cotton at the end.
For eye liner, spirulina can also be used, as well as other foods. Once she has this basic ingredients,  she can build her collection from there. It just has to be kept in the fridge or frozen, but it doesn't mean is not there!
For other shades, she could try bee pollen, or any other powdery food with color. Have her mix some, or use them alone... it is all  about creating,  and being the creator of your own beautiful face masterpiece.
There is another girl by the name of Megan Elizabeth,  who also has videos on YouTube,  about food make up.

Good luck!
H.

 

This is from e-mail.  There are people here who know about makeup and might be able to help.  The family is in Australia.

_____________
I don't mind you asking in either of the group on my behalf if you don't have the time to answer personally.

My 9yo daughter was diagnosed with 2 rare and chronic liver diseases in June this year.  It's been an horrendous time for us all but we are finally settling down into our "new normal" which seems some days to consist of just giving medication (as she resists taking it).  She seems to have accepted that she has no choice really - the alternative is eventual liver failure.  She also has to have fortnightly bloods taken and we see the consultant fortnightly.  She doesn't particularly like going to either but we try to make it bearable for her by going to a few other places she likes on the way and she goes into the hospital cafe and has her favourite jelly and biscuits which has become a bit of a routine.  So all in all it's a pretty rough time for all of us but mainly Chayton who doesn't really like the diseases or the side affects of the medication (one being she has put a lot of weight on).

Really the thing I am struggling with is she has started taking an interest in make-up and beauty products.  She loves watching all the youtube videos of girls' room tours and closet tours and vanity tours.  I'm beginning to wonder if is interested in beauty due to her being unhappy with her weight and make up help make her feel prettier.  Although I'm not sure - maybe she just likes beauty and it's nothing to do with her weight gain.  

Anyway she loves makeup and wants to start up a make up collection. The issue is, I don't want her wearing all the cheap products which are full of chemicals.  She isn't in remission yet and I don't want anything to comprise her health.  

The products I gave her were organic products and I bought her a few really nice (and expensive) natural products for Christmas. But she wants more for her collection - she currently has 2 lipsticks, one small eyeshadow pallette, mascara and a blush and some make up brushes.  I understand from the youtube videos we have watched together than this amount isn't anywhere near what she wants to have. She wants lots of pallettes - which I could pick up really cheap but there is no way I can afford to buy her the pallettes she wants in the organic/natural range.  But neither do I want to get her the cheap stuff either.

I have bought her other beauty items such as make up storage but I know it's not what she wants. She is really upset and angry with me right now. 
__________________________end of that post__________________________

Here's blog post by the daughter, so you'll have some of her side, too; she's pretty upset.

The mom wrote:  I just don't know how to deal with a situation like this.

Thanks for any ideas!  

Sandra


lucy.web

I really don't know much about make-up so this is just a wonder: I wonder if there's any kind of natural organic 'base' she could apply which would mean that the actual make-up itself isn't absorbed by her skin?

Lucy

BRIAN POLIKOWSKY

Having worked for Chanel cosmetics and having had training with some of their amazing make up artists that do all the Runway shows in Europe and all over the world I completely agree with your daughter. Organic make up  has a long ways to go!!!!
Heck many other make up companies have a long way to go to get to the level of amazing make up some companies have.

The difference in products is amazing! The colors in good make up are amazing. It is a huge huge huge difference!

 Listen, it does not matter why your daughter likes makeup really. SHe likes it. She wants to explore it. It is what makes her happy in a very hard time like now.
I cannot imagine being a child and finding out you have something as serious as a chronic liver disease that has completely changed her life and she will always have to deal with it. ALWAYS.

If there is something that makes her happy, engaged and takes her mind off the disease I would completely support her.  Heck I would support her anyway even if she was healthy ! I would be a great partner to her and help her get what she wants.

 You can try to keep her from using regular make up and only eating foods you decided are healthy and all but you don;t know really what the future will bring. She hits 18 and she is moving out so she can decide for herself. If things get worse she may leave even sooner and she is not going to come to you for help.

What if she wears regular make up? You say there are chemicals but organic makeup is also made of chemicals.!!!!! Nothing is so black and white. You need water to live but too much water will kill you. Your body is full of chemicals and even produces its own chemicals. This is too much fear. Water is a chemical! H2O!

She is not asking to drink alcohol ( I am sure that would have a direct effect on the liver) all she wants is good make up she can use and explore.
I would go out with her and explore make up with her. Here in the US you can get done up at makeup counters for free. You can try out their makeup and see what interests her. Make a list of the things she wants to buy and buy it for her when you can.

I used to have tons tons tons of Chanel make up . It was the best! The colors were amazing. IT is a very expensive make up. There are others not so expensive but also great and maybe someone will come and give you some tips on more affordable make up as it has been over 15 years since I was in the makeup scene.

 Right now I think your daughter's blog posts says a lot. She is unhappy, feeling she has no control over her life, the disease has taken control and she cannot wait to leave home so she can have that back and do what she loves. Is that what you really want?
 Be her partner. Get her all kinds of make up. She may even prefer the organic one for some things ! Be her partner and support her.\

I also feel and read between the lines that you do not value makeup. Be open to what your child loves. 11 years ago I could never imagine myself liking or playing video games. Guess what? I love video games now! I am still just a casual player but I fell in love with games because my son loves games! I kept and open mind and heart. It can be amazing and 

It is not a little make up that is going to damage her liver but not being her partner and not supporting her will definitely damage your relationship and hinder unschooling,
 
Alex Polikowsky
 
 
 

<plaidpanties666@...>

Here's a link to a bunch of links - the page is actually for a local buying club, their "natural cosmetics" listing, but as you scroll down you'll see links to the suppliers websites. 

http://www.morningsidefarm.com/cgi-bin/catalog/catalog.cgi?page=89&m=y&SID=


If for some reason that link doesn't work, I'd be happy to list all the links separately, but there are something like two dozen of them.

My partner also suggests a company called "Fyrinnae" - I don't know anything about the ingredients other than that they're vegan (which could mean all petrochemicals for all I know). Gwen likes them because you can buy "samples" which are smaller and less costly - perfect for someone who isn't sure what colors she favors yet. 


http://www.fyrinnae.com/index.php

I'd also recommend checking out the "Faces by Ren" page on facebook and maybe contacting the owner - Ren Allen is a longtime radical unschooler, professional make-up artist, and body painter (among her many talents). 


https://www.facebook.com/Facesbyren


Sandra Dodd

-=-Although the fact that organic make up does lack in pigmentation is true, -=-

Why would that be, since natural pigments exist?



BRIAN POLIKOWSKY




 
<<<<<<<<<<<<I really don't know much about make-up so this is just a wonder: I wonder if there's any kind of natural organic 'base' she could apply which would mean that the actual make-up itself isn't absorbed by her skin?>>>>>>>

That is a really good point Lucy. You can use as a makeup base something organic and apply the conventional on top. It would mean less contact with the skin.

 Use a good organic moisturizer then a makeup up base. It  can be some bare minerals even some neutral organic eye shadow and apply conventional on top!

Alex Polikowsky


Anna-Marie

While it is true that organic cosmetics and mineral makeup do not
produce the super saturated color that many of the large cosmetics
companies do, there are some companies that are producing quality
products without many of the chemicals which can be detrimental to
health.
A few years ago, I was having serious health issues, and ended up
clearing our house of many chemicals and replacing with alternatives.
That included my makeup stash, and I've been using a line called
Gabriel:
http://www.gabrielcosmeticsinc.com/index.cfm/category/1/gabriel-color.cfm

It's not like wearing Chanel makeup, but it is definitely makeup, and
it's free of parabens, talc, pthalates, formaldehyde, gluten, etc.
I hope you find something that works for your daughter without further
compromising her health.

Anna-Marie

BRIAN POLIKOWSKY

So I asked a wonderful Makeup artist that is also an unschooling mom

<<<<<<<<<<<< there are a few brands that I don't care for because natural sometimes means no pigment. I use a brand called Serenity and Scott... have her check them out. No gluten, no parabens etc... serenityscottbeauty.com.>>>>>>


<<<<<
Serenity and scott brand should put her at ease. Heres the thing... nothing, and I mean NOTHING that is sold over the counter should penetrate past the epidermis. It isn't legal otherwise so I seriously doubt any makeup could get into your blood stream.>>>>>>


You can show you daughter the amazing work this Makeup artist does here:

https://www.facebook.com/Facesbyren

She also does body painting!


Alex Polikowsky
 
 
 



<heatherpie@...>

My son, Austin, had a kidney transplant at age three. At this point we go in for blood draws every three months, but there was a time when it was weekly.  Is she using Emla cream before blood draws? It's a lidocaine cream that numbs the area it's applied to. I know about it because we spent a lot of time in a dialysis center when Austin was young and that's what they use before hooking someone up for hemo dialysis.  Not all doctors will tell their patients who go in for frequent blood draws about it. So, if you aren't using it, it may help if there is any anxiety about the pain associated with having blood drawn.


Are you sure that using non organic makeup would actually be a problem? Can you talk to her doctor and find out? Maybe there are only certain ingredients that are processed through the liver and you can avoid those instead of all non organic makeup.

Heather 



---In [email protected], <Sandra@...> wrote:

This is from e-mail.  There are people here who know about makeup and might be able to help.  The family is in Australia.

_____________
I don't mind you asking in either of the group on my behalf if you don't have the time to answer personally.

My 9yo daughter was diagnosed with 2 rare and chronic liver diseases in June this year.  It's been an horrendous time for us all but we are finally settling down into our "new normal" which seems some days to consist of just giving medication (as she resists taking it).  She seems to have accepted that she has no choice really - the alternative is eventual liver failure.  She also has to have fortnightly bloods taken and we see the consultant fortnightly.  She doesn't particularly like going to either but we try to make it bearable for her by going to a few other places she likes on the way and she goes into the hospital cafe and has her favourite jelly and biscuits which has become a bit of a routine.  So all in all it's a pretty rough time for all of us but mainly Chayton who doesn't really like the diseases or the side affects of the medication (one being she has put a lot of weight on).

Really the thing I am struggling with is she has started taking an interest in make-up and beauty products.  She loves watching all the youtube videos of girls' room tours and closet tours and vanity tours.  I'm beginning to wonder if is interested in beauty due to her being unhappy with her weight and make up help make her feel prettier.  Although I'm not sure - maybe she just likes beauty and it's nothing to do with her weight gain.  

Anyway she loves makeup and wants to start up a make up collection. The issue is, I don't want her wearing all the cheap products which are full of chemicals.  She isn't in remission yet and I don't want anything to comprise her health.  

The products I gave her were organic products and I bought her a few really nice (and expensive) natural products for Christmas. But she wants more for her collection - she currently has 2 lipsticks, one small eyeshadow pallette, mascara and a blush and some make up brushes.  I understand from the youtube videos we have watched together than this amount isn't anywhere near what she wants to have. She wants lots of pallettes - which I could pick up really cheap but there is no way I can afford to buy her the pallettes she wants in the organic/natural range.  But neither do I want to get her the cheap stuff either.

I have bought her other beauty items such as make up storage but I know it's not what she wants. She is really upset and angry with me right now. 
__________________________end of that post__________________________

Here's blog post by the daughter, so you'll have some of her side, too; she's pretty upset.

The mom wrote:  I just don't know how to deal with a situation like this.

Thanks for any ideas!  

Sandra


<brmino@...>

Buy her the makeup she wants. 


As the mother of a child with a chronic illness, one of my primary goals is to help her grow up with as little resentment of her diagnosis as possible. Resentment is dangerous.


In raising children with chronic illnesses, resentment is responsible for the worst possible outcomes - for non-compliance, for lying and sneaking and pretending that one doesn't have X condition and doesn't need to do Y to survive, which sadly leads to detrimental, sometimes deadly choices. Empowerment to live with disease comes from feeling like you still have choice. If your daughter's condition is expected to be life-long, like mine's is, I urge you to remember that this is a marathon, not a sprint. Keeping her mentally/emotionally healthy is critical too.


Buy her the makeup she wants, the makeup that makes her happy, the makeup that doesn't remind her EVERY time she looks at it how not-normal she is.


And buy her some nice face wash/cleanser and soft wash cloths and perhaps an agreement that she washes her face really well before bed?


-Brie


<annmariehorsley1@...>

You might want to try reading here... personalcaretruth.com


They are an independent group of scientists from different areas of the cosmetics industry and provide up-to-date scientific research and information on ingredients in personal care products & cosmetics. The make-up you're worried about might not be as bad as you think. I used to have some pretty fear-based thinking about non-natural/non-organic products including skincare which has changed recently due in part to reading here and reading a balance of research on the subject.


Also, there is a world of make-up in between organic only and cheap make-up. It doesn't have to be one or the other. There are a range of make-up brands to fit any budget and there are plenty of very expensive non-organic make-up brands.


Ann-Marie


<brmino@...>

And, YES--please see if she can use EMLA, or something similar! It makes a world of difference for blood draws.


-Brie


Jo Isaac

I know the family, and we have talked about this quite a bit already...but I thought i'd post my responses here for others to read too.

I think making some eye-shadows with mica is a great idea. and sent a link to Chayton a while ago about doing so - it sounds super fun and would be a great thing for you and Chayton (and Llogan!) to do together and get into make-up...

There are a number of types of make-up where it doesn't matter what's in them - nail polish, for example - can you buy loads of different colours of cheap stuff, if she's into nail varnish too? Go together for a pedicure/manicure?

Burt's Bee's do relatively inexpensive and quite bright lip colours (they sell it at Myer).

But, like I said in a personal message, I tend toward agreeing with Brie and Alex and others who have said just let her have the make-up she wants - Her blog post shows she's very upset about it. She 'hates' natural make-up, and pretty soon she'll be old enough to go shopping on her own and she'll just buy the make-up she wants anyway.

Cheap make-up can't be the worst thing for her liver disease, surely? Resentment and anger must be worse for her overall health? 

I'd love to come over and make some make-up anyway, if we can find mica somewhere, sometime soon!

Jo
 


BRIAN POLIKOWSKY



<<<<<<<<<<<<<I think making some eye-shadows with mica is a great idea. >>>>>>>>>>

Do you know that mica does have health hazards? Do you know that it is probably safer to use a lot of petroleum gel ( or is it jelly) than to use mica  next to you face in powder form because of the hazard of breathing in the mica dust?

Sometimes people get so caught up in the organics and natural and no chemicals and they forget that chemicals are everywhere! We make them in our body!
They make the world, yes the natural organic world around us. Things that are good to us can be also not good  depending on so many things.

You cannot lock her in a room and make sure she will not be in contact with chemicals. Makeup is important to her. That is the reason I asked Ren Allen who is not only a fabulous makeup artist and unschooling mom but someone that would be conscientious of health hazards.

 There are some great ideas in this thread. Some good links and names of makeup products she maybe happy with.  In the end it is how she feels about it that matters and she is feeling pretty controlled and angry. I would make her life happy. If makeup can take her mind away from what she is facing now  that is what I would do.
 
I would go out with her and or find online some beautiful makeup colors she has been yearning to have and I would get them those. I would explore with her some of the ones shared here. I would do a lot of research to find make up that has the colors she likes and that does not have whatever ingredient you are afraid of.

Was there an ingredient that the doctors said she cannot come in contact with? or is that just you being afraid of anything that is not natural or organic?

 
Alex Polikowsky

<zurrolaur@...>

I worked as a makeup artist for nearly ten years (Ren and I have both worked for MAC cosmetics which produces fabulously rich and pigmented colors). Unfortunately there aren't that many companies that make "natural" versions of the kind of makeup that I"m betting she's seeing on people's videos, but there are some possibilities. I'll give you some ideas/links. However, I agree with Alex, Brie, if there is the possibility to let her have some of the makeup that she's looking at, for the sake of her happiness, the tradeoff could be worth it. And you may find some happy middle of the ground products as well. Thinking of your daughter, her world has been turned upside down and some semblance of feeling like being able to do what she really wants to do could make such a difference.

Have you watched any of the videos with her to see what it is that she's drawn to? Is it colors, is it application, is it specific brands? That might help you to then research how to get what she wants. I would also suggest you consider buying her some nice brushes. That can already make all the difference in the world. I don't know where you are in Australia, but MAC has an Australian website http://www.maccosmetics.com.au/  I know Ren also loves the brushes from Serenity and Scott but the shipping vs buying more expensive brushes (that are great quality) in Australia might balance out.



There's a great website called Makeupalley.com where people do swaps, and makeup reviews, and has forums. One of those forums is devoted to green products. The girls who post in there often do reviews of makeup, fragrances, fragrance oils etc. You might sit with your daughter and read through the posts and also post some questions for ideas. The website is full of beauty loving posters and could be a really great resource :)

Find some makeup artists who are successfully using "green" products like Katey Denno http://www.thebeautyofitis.com/about/  http://www.thewallgroup.com/artist.php?artist_id=94 Show her that fabulous makeup can exist with both traditional and "green" makeup. You could also research various makeup artists kits so she sees that makeup artists use a variety of makeups and even make their own. The original founder of MAC started out creating makeup in his bathtub because he couldn't get the right pigments and textures. Quite a few of the other makeup brands out there were also created by makeup artists.


Embrace her interest in makeup and beauty products. Hopefully this will give you a few more ideas.


Laura Z


<zurrolaur@...>

sorry I forgot to post the link for the makeupalley green board http://www.makeupalley.com/board/j.asp?bid=19


Laura Z


Bernadette Lynn

My second daughter loves makeup. I was brought up to believe that only vain people wear makeup so it was hard to embrace that but it was so worth the effort.

She reacts to some makeups so it's taken some creativity to prevent her feeling restricted. It was tempting to buy her only a few powder eyeshadows and tell her that she was allergic to everything else but that wouldn't have been fair or kind. Instead we've bought her what she's wanted and tried to find ways for her to use it. We've found if she's just playing around and trying things out she can usually wash it off before it affects her so she gets to try out things she otherwise couldn't wear. Actually if it does affect her the reaction dies down fairly quickly if she washes it off properly. So a supply of cotton balls and babywipes is an essential for her (she reacts to cold creams as well). Probably an anti-histamine would help if she wanted to wear makeup to a party.  She can use me or her siblings as models, too. She plays on www.stardoll.com quite often and has built up a collection of virtual makeup there. She loves to try out colour combinations and patterns that way. She also has a Depesche Top Model makeup book and a makeup doll head which she practises on.

She's also enjoyed experimenting with nail varnish, false nails and hair colours, although as she doesn't want to bleach her dark hair colour she's restricted to hair chalks and extensions for that.

She's had so much pleasure from makeup and fashion over the last few years and rather than becoming vain and shallow and self-obsessed as I was assured she would, she has become discerning, analytical and artistic with a good sense of colour and style. And she almost never wears makeup! It's a hobby, really. Any worry about the effect it having on her skin would have been misplaced; she's not putting it on in the morning and taking it off at night, she's trying out looks and effects and washing it off when she's done.

By the time she's interested in wearing makeup full time, if she ever does, she'll already know how to put it on, what looks good on her and what products she can safely use.

Bernadette.


<plaidpanties666@...>

>>Buy her the makeup she wants.<<


It might help to think about what you'd do if she was interested in oil painting, or old-school photography, or ice hockey. All of those have toxic or dangerous elements - regardless of whether you're chronically ill. But you might not hesitate the same way you would about makeup because, health issues aside, there's a lot of deep cultural baggage tied up in ideas about beauty and the trappings of beauty on one hand, and the value of learning traditionally  "male" arts versus "feminine" arts on the other.


<joanne6669@...>

I just wanted to thank everyone for taking the time to reply. I really appreciate it. I also appreciate the websites that were shared. Chayton and I have been looking through some of them, although we haven't managed to get to them all yet. Thank you once again. Jo