Feeling Controlled
seamanjane
I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I would love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her so I can get my own basic needs met in peace. For example, nearly every time I have a meal she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her instead. Same when I have my morning shower. Then while I'm eating she's hassling me all the time to hurry up or she starts jumping on me so I can't eat in peace. If we have dinner. This is all my own fault because I have allowed her too much control over my life and I feel she now believes that she can say where she wants me and what she wants me doing during the day (very much what my own mother did to me - I was highly controlled and I'm aware of this and currently working through it in therapy). As you can see the balance is wrong but I literally do not know how to peacefully and lovingly help her understand that I have rights too, the main ones being to have meals and a shower in peace. Also I spend nearly the entire day engaged with her and don't spend too much time on chores or cooking (again I'm thinking maybe I should be doing more of those things so she can see I have a life too, but as soon as I start she starts shouting at me to stop and to come play with her). I think she thinks I should be playing with her 100% of the time and do nothing else all day. I know I have created this myself and I would love some ideas for modifying this so we can live more in partnership with each other.
Pam Sorooshian
On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 3:29 PM, seamanjane <seamanjane@...> wrote:
I'm sure people will toss out lots of ideas -- I think you might be lacking
in imagination on this - so here is a start:
1. Invite friends over - usually when a child has a guest, the parent
actually gets some free time (sometimes you might need to stay nearby)
2. exchange play dates - she could spend an afternoon or two at someone
else's house and you have her friend at your house a time or two a week.
3. hire a mother's helper to entertain her for a couple of hours a couple
of times a week
4. doesn't she ever watch tv or movies? Those are good times for you to
eat, fold laundry, straighten up the room and, if she's really involve with
it, maybe even take a shower.
5. Most important - she can join you in whatever else you need to do.
Invite her to joyfully help you in cleaning the bathroom, folding laundry,
and all that kind of stuff. If you're doing it with a happy attitude, it'll
be more appealing.
6. she probably sleeps more than you do - do things while she's asleep.
7. take a deep breath - this time shall pass (and you'll miss it)
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I know I have created this myself and I would love some ideas forThere is no one answer - there are a variety of different things people do.
> modifying this so we can live more in partnership with each other.
I'm sure people will toss out lots of ideas -- I think you might be lacking
in imagination on this - so here is a start:
1. Invite friends over - usually when a child has a guest, the parent
actually gets some free time (sometimes you might need to stay nearby)
2. exchange play dates - she could spend an afternoon or two at someone
else's house and you have her friend at your house a time or two a week.
3. hire a mother's helper to entertain her for a couple of hours a couple
of times a week
4. doesn't she ever watch tv or movies? Those are good times for you to
eat, fold laundry, straighten up the room and, if she's really involve with
it, maybe even take a shower.
5. Most important - she can join you in whatever else you need to do.
Invite her to joyfully help you in cleaning the bathroom, folding laundry,
and all that kind of stuff. If you're doing it with a happy attitude, it'll
be more appealing.
6. she probably sleeps more than you do - do things while she's asleep.
7. take a deep breath - this time shall pass (and you'll miss it)
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I would love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her so I can get my own basic needs met in peace. -=-
Is there anyone in the house besides you and her?
=- For example, nearly every time I have a meal she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her instead. -=-
Why are you having meals without her?
Having a meal COULD be doing something with her. Or you could eat while you watch a movie with her, or watch her do something.
-=- I feel she now believes that she can say where she wants me and what she wants me doing during the day -=-
What's different at night?
We can help you with this situation, but the help is going to be pretty direct, so don't get cranky and go away. :-) We know lots of ways to help you love her enough to be calm.
For starters, before you even read more here, maybe read these:
http://sandradodd.com/gratitude
http:/sandradodd.com/abundance
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Is there anyone in the house besides you and her?
=- For example, nearly every time I have a meal she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her instead. -=-
Why are you having meals without her?
Having a meal COULD be doing something with her. Or you could eat while you watch a movie with her, or watch her do something.
-=- I feel she now believes that she can say where she wants me and what she wants me doing during the day -=-
What's different at night?
We can help you with this situation, but the help is going to be pretty direct, so don't get cranky and go away. :-) We know lots of ways to help you love her enough to be calm.
For starters, before you even read more here, maybe read these:
http://sandradodd.com/gratitude
http:/sandradodd.com/abundance
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-I literally do not know how to peacefully and lovingly help her understand that I have rights too, the main ones being to have meals and a shower in peace. -=-
Who gave you those rights? Not the government. Not God, once you had a baby.
If you think of it as "your right," of COURSE you're frustrated at her VIOLATING your rights. That was my word, not yours, but it's the word most often used when one feels her rights have been illegally or immorally curtailed.
Words have power. You used these:
a tantrum
hassling me all the time
I can't eat in peace
control over my life
http://sandradodd.com/mindfulofwords
http://sandradodd.com/words/words.html
-=-Same when I have my morning shower. -=-
Can she take a shower with you? Can she play in the bathroom while you're in the shower?
I think you're expecting too much for yourself, and expecting too much of her.
There's a graph here you might want to look at:
http://sandradodd.com/howto/precisely
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Who gave you those rights? Not the government. Not God, once you had a baby.
If you think of it as "your right," of COURSE you're frustrated at her VIOLATING your rights. That was my word, not yours, but it's the word most often used when one feels her rights have been illegally or immorally curtailed.
Words have power. You used these:
a tantrum
hassling me all the time
I can't eat in peace
control over my life
http://sandradodd.com/mindfulofwords
http://sandradodd.com/words/words.html
-=-Same when I have my morning shower. -=-
Can she take a shower with you? Can she play in the bathroom while you're in the shower?
I think you're expecting too much for yourself, and expecting too much of her.
There's a graph here you might want to look at:
http://sandradodd.com/howto/precisely
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Lillie M
Can you tell me if anything about your daughter's earlier years, including
your pregnancy and her birth, was traumatic? Her behavior sounds like a
child with a trauma history, which means she would feel like she is in
survival mode day and night and desperately needs to control you to survive.
I know my question may sound strange, but there are specific things you can
do to help the situation if your daughter has a history of trauma of any
kind.
Tress
your pregnancy and her birth, was traumatic? Her behavior sounds like a
child with a trauma history, which means she would feel like she is in
survival mode day and night and desperately needs to control you to survive.
I know my question may sound strange, but there are specific things you can
do to help the situation if your daughter has a history of trauma of any
kind.
Tress
On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 6:29 PM, seamanjane <seamanjane@...> wrote:
> **
>
>
> I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I would
> love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her so I can get my
> own basic needs met in peace. For example, nearly every time I have a meal
> she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her
> instead. Same when I have my morning shower. Then while I'm eating she's
> hassling me all the time to hurry up or she starts jumping on me so I can't
> eat in peace. If we have dinner. This is all my own fault because I have
> allowed her too much control over my life and I feel she now believes that
> she can say where she wants me and what she wants me doing during the day
> (very much what my own mother did to me - I was highly controlled and I'm
> aware of this and currently working through it in therapy). As you can see
> the balance is wrong but I literally do not know how to peacefully and
> lovingly help her understand that I have rights too, the main ones being to
> have meals and a shower in peace. Also I spend nearly the entire day
> engaged with her and don't spend too much time on chores or cooking (again
> I'm thinking maybe I should be doing more of those things so she can see I
> have a life too, but as soon as I start she starts shouting at me to stop
> and to come play with her). I think she thinks I should be playing with her
> 100% of the time and do nothing else all day. I know I have created this
> myself and I would love some ideas for modifying this so we can live more
> in partnership with each other.
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=- there are specific things you can
do to help the situation if your daughter has a history of trauma of any
kind.-=-
Are they things that would help any family? It's good to keep the discussion on unschooling, but if there are things that could help a traumatized child, wouldn't they help any child who seemed needy, for any reason?
Could you put some of the suggestions out here?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
do to help the situation if your daughter has a history of trauma of any
kind.-=-
Are they things that would help any family? It's good to keep the discussion on unschooling, but if there are things that could help a traumatized child, wouldn't they help any child who seemed needy, for any reason?
Could you put some of the suggestions out here?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
Another direction to pursue:
-=-I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth-=-
She's four.
She's not school-age yet.
Does she want to go to school?
Unschooling isn't for everyone. And if she doesn't have a choice to be at home or not, then the problems that come up in school beacuse the children' don't have the option to be there or not can also surface at home, if the child feels powerless.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-=-I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth-=-
She's four.
She's not school-age yet.
Does she want to go to school?
Unschooling isn't for everyone. And if she doesn't have a choice to be at home or not, then the problems that come up in school beacuse the children' don't have the option to be there or not can also surface at home, if the child feels powerless.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Rachel
I'm not sure that is really relevant. As far as I know, my daughter did not suffer any early years trauma and she is pretty similar.
I spend most of every day with her and she would be quite happy if it was all of every day. She is almost seven now, but when she was a lot younger and I hadn't read on this list quite so much, she would get very upset when I ate, cooked, cleaned or showered. Pretty much any situation when I wasn't giving her full attention. I, in return would feel stressed and often resentful.
Reading on here helped me to be grateful that she wanted to spend her time with me and to realize I could nurture that feeling or just the opposite by carrying on being as I was. Now, I'm grateful that she wants to spend so much time with me and realize it wont be long before that changes. I tell her often how happy I am she wants me to do so much stuff with me.
I also found practical solutions. I almost never showered when it was just the two of us. I would wait for my husband to come home or I would get in the bath with her.
When I cook, I do most of the prep sitting down with her or we play imaginary games which she loves and are easy to do in the Kitchen. She has her own play kitchen too or sometimes brings a small mattress in there and puts her toys on and plays. More recently she cooks with me. I do one or teo big cooks a week too so I don't spend too much time on that.
With eating, can she sit and snuggle you as you eat? Does she eat at the same time as you? Are you sitting away from what she's doing as you eat? If so, can't you sit with her?
Things have changed pretty dramatically in the past two years too. Now she spends a lot more time with my husband. I get whole mornings on my own on the weekends when they go out and I can have a bath or catch up with housework. It's true she also sleeps longer than I do, so I have at least an hour to myself in the morning.
I think the practical solutions though, are not going to work unless you make that switch in your brain and see what your daughter sees and feels and you try to think about this in a different way.
Rachel
I spend most of every day with her and she would be quite happy if it was all of every day. She is almost seven now, but when she was a lot younger and I hadn't read on this list quite so much, she would get very upset when I ate, cooked, cleaned or showered. Pretty much any situation when I wasn't giving her full attention. I, in return would feel stressed and often resentful.
Reading on here helped me to be grateful that she wanted to spend her time with me and to realize I could nurture that feeling or just the opposite by carrying on being as I was. Now, I'm grateful that she wants to spend so much time with me and realize it wont be long before that changes. I tell her often how happy I am she wants me to do so much stuff with me.
I also found practical solutions. I almost never showered when it was just the two of us. I would wait for my husband to come home or I would get in the bath with her.
When I cook, I do most of the prep sitting down with her or we play imaginary games which she loves and are easy to do in the Kitchen. She has her own play kitchen too or sometimes brings a small mattress in there and puts her toys on and plays. More recently she cooks with me. I do one or teo big cooks a week too so I don't spend too much time on that.
With eating, can she sit and snuggle you as you eat? Does she eat at the same time as you? Are you sitting away from what she's doing as you eat? If so, can't you sit with her?
Things have changed pretty dramatically in the past two years too. Now she spends a lot more time with my husband. I get whole mornings on my own on the weekends when they go out and I can have a bath or catch up with housework. It's true she also sleeps longer than I do, so I have at least an hour to myself in the morning.
I think the practical solutions though, are not going to work unless you make that switch in your brain and see what your daughter sees and feels and you try to think about this in a different way.
Rachel
On 15 Apr 2013, at 05:42, Lillie M <milesdt@...> wrote:
> Can you tell me if anything about your daughter's earlier years, including
> your pregnancy and her birth, was traumatic? Her behavior sounds like a
> child with a trauma history, which means she would feel like she is in
> survival mode day and night and desperately needs to control you to survive.
>
> I know my question may sound strange, but there are specific things you can
> do to help the situation if your daughter has a history of trauma of any
> kind.
> Tress
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 6:29 PM, seamanjane <seamanjane@...> wrote:
>
>> **
>>
>>
>> I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I would
>> love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her so I can get my
>> own basic needs met in peace. For example, nearly every time I have a meal
>> she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her
>> instead. Same when I have my morning shower. Then while I'm eating she's
>> hassling me all the time to hurry up or she starts jumping on me so I can't
>> eat in peace. If we have dinner. This is all my own fault because I have
>> allowed her too much control over my life and I feel she now believes that
>> she can say where she wants me and what she wants me doing during the day
>> (very much what my own mother did to me - I was highly controlled and I'm
>> aware of this and currently working through it in therapy). As you can see
>> the balance is wrong but I literally do not know how to peacefully and
>> lovingly help her understand that I have rights too, the main ones being to
>> have meals and a shower in peace. Also I spend nearly the entire day
>> engaged with her and don't spend too much time on chores or cooking (again
>> I'm thinking maybe I should be doing more of those things so she can see I
>> have a life too, but as soon as I start she starts shouting at me to stop
>> and to come play with her). I think she thinks I should be playing with her
>> 100% of the time and do nothing else all day. I know I have created this
>> myself and I would love some ideas for modifying this so we can live more
>> in partnership with each other.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
seamanjane
Thank you everyone for the comments. There's definitely lots of food for thought here. Sandra - thank you and no I won't get grumpy and leave. I'm going to read the links you've posted Sandra, and also sit with what has been said here for a day or so, and then I'll come back to it. Thanks again.
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> Another direction to pursue:
>
> -=-I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth-=-
>
> She's four.
> She's not school-age yet.
>
> Does she want to go to school?
>
> Unschooling isn't for everyone. And if she doesn't have a choice to be at home or not, then the problems that come up in school beacuse the children' don't have the option to be there or not can also surface at home, if the child feels powerless.
>
> Sandra
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
mitrisue
--- In [email protected], "seamanjane" <seamanjane@...> wrote:
This morning I was able to take a shower because I suggested that my daughter come upstairs and get dressed while I was in the bathroom. She liked the idea of getting ready together. This is a recent development. Before that, I only showered when my husband was at home.
Sometimes I get more recharge time with Sue in my lap. When I feel fairly desperate to sit down and eat, Sue will sit in my lap and share my food. This was a recent rediscovery for me because she's been eating on her own for a while, but now plate-sharing is a go-to move (temporarily, as always) when I need a moment. When sharing a meal like this, I can even drift into Kindle-land for a little while and read a chapter or two. That's important recharge time. I try to appreciate it without counting on it--the trickiest part for me.
Julie
> I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and IMy daughter is 4, and I need to find creative ways to be together with her, too. It helps if I emphasize togetherness, and I always try to keep "sometimes, not always" in mind when I think I've found a solution. If I remind myself that it's all moment to moment, and that new ideas will come to me when I need them, my mood is more stable and I'm better able to respond.
> would love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her
This morning I was able to take a shower because I suggested that my daughter come upstairs and get dressed while I was in the bathroom. She liked the idea of getting ready together. This is a recent development. Before that, I only showered when my husband was at home.
Sometimes I get more recharge time with Sue in my lap. When I feel fairly desperate to sit down and eat, Sue will sit in my lap and share my food. This was a recent rediscovery for me because she's been eating on her own for a while, but now plate-sharing is a go-to move (temporarily, as always) when I need a moment. When sharing a meal like this, I can even drift into Kindle-land for a little while and read a chapter or two. That's important recharge time. I try to appreciate it without counting on it--the trickiest part for me.
Julie
Meredith
"seamanjane" <seamanjane@...> wrote:
It may be unrealistic to expect to get your own needs met "in peace" for a few more years. She's only 4, and maybe she's more needy than average, more high-intensity. Both my kids were a lot more intense when they were younger, and one was hugely social and needed a ton of attention. It helped me to step back from the idea that I was going to have some kind of picture-perfect family life with regular showers, lovely meals, and adult conversations for a few years.
It's entirely possible that your daughter's need for attention has a genetic component - and that you mom also had a big need for attention which wasn't met as a child. So she was controlling in part as a way to make up for her own childhood lacks. You can't go back in time and help your mom or your child-self, but you Can give your daughter lots of love and care and attention now.
It will help to step back from the idea that your daughter is trying to control you and instead see a little girl with big needs. She needs lots of attention. Accept that as a Need and look for ways to meet it proactively - it's sooooooooooo much more effective with kids who need lots of attention to love them up Before they're clamoring for you. They get their needs met better And you get to feel more in control - you're choosing to give attention rather than putting out fires. It's less stressful all around.
Maybe she needs ways to feel secure and/or in control, too - so look for ways to help her in that way. Play games which let her be in control of something specific. Let her make choices which are important to her whenever possible. Sometimes kids seem controlling when what they want is to do things for themselves, so look for that possibility. Conversely, sometimes kids seem controlling when what they want is to be helped with things they can, technically, do themselves - so look for that possibility, too - if she asks for help with things, do them without arguing.
---Meredith
>**************
> I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I would love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her so I can get my own basic needs met in peace.
It may be unrealistic to expect to get your own needs met "in peace" for a few more years. She's only 4, and maybe she's more needy than average, more high-intensity. Both my kids were a lot more intense when they were younger, and one was hugely social and needed a ton of attention. It helped me to step back from the idea that I was going to have some kind of picture-perfect family life with regular showers, lovely meals, and adult conversations for a few years.
>>(very much what my own mother did to me - I was highly controlled and I'm aware of this and currently working through it in therapy)*************
It's entirely possible that your daughter's need for attention has a genetic component - and that you mom also had a big need for attention which wasn't met as a child. So she was controlling in part as a way to make up for her own childhood lacks. You can't go back in time and help your mom or your child-self, but you Can give your daughter lots of love and care and attention now.
It will help to step back from the idea that your daughter is trying to control you and instead see a little girl with big needs. She needs lots of attention. Accept that as a Need and look for ways to meet it proactively - it's sooooooooooo much more effective with kids who need lots of attention to love them up Before they're clamoring for you. They get their needs met better And you get to feel more in control - you're choosing to give attention rather than putting out fires. It's less stressful all around.
Maybe she needs ways to feel secure and/or in control, too - so look for ways to help her in that way. Play games which let her be in control of something specific. Let her make choices which are important to her whenever possible. Sometimes kids seem controlling when what they want is to do things for themselves, so look for that possibility. Conversely, sometimes kids seem controlling when what they want is to be helped with things they can, technically, do themselves - so look for that possibility, too - if she asks for help with things, do them without arguing.
---Meredith
seamanjane
I want to thank you all for taking the time to comment and also for the wonderful suggestions. I pondered on them today and I had a wonderful day with my daughter. All the things suggested I actually already do with my daughter - for example, I do special play time with her where she has my undivided attention, I attend to her needs all the time, I always eat where she wants me to (the problem with that one is if I ask occasionally to be at the table (if I have soup and I don't want to sit on the floor with it spilling everywhere) and she gets bored with me at the table because she wants to be in another room, or upstairs, and even if I give her something to play with or a video to watch she still gets fed up - she herself doesn't eat regular meals, so I realised today she just gets fed up waiting for me, and that's ok now - I really was expecting too much from her for her age). Also she does play in the bathroom when I shower etc. So on the face of it, it "looks" like I give everything that she needs.
However, what I realised was what Sandra pointed out - I was using negative language and negative thoughts especially during the shower and the meals, because in my head I wanted that time to myself, even though I wasn't having it. And it's interesting Sandra that you thought I was eating my meals alone, because even though I'm not, in my head I actually would have liked to have been, and that's where the conflict was coming in. So today I changed it all. I read the links you sent me, and decided to be grateful for the time I have with her, and expect less from her, and I really just connected in much more. And we had a dream day. We were connected. I even got to eat my meal "in peace" but the thing was it didn't matter if I didn't, and that's where the change came in.
So thank you all again. It has been very insightful posting here.
However, what I realised was what Sandra pointed out - I was using negative language and negative thoughts especially during the shower and the meals, because in my head I wanted that time to myself, even though I wasn't having it. And it's interesting Sandra that you thought I was eating my meals alone, because even though I'm not, in my head I actually would have liked to have been, and that's where the conflict was coming in. So today I changed it all. I read the links you sent me, and decided to be grateful for the time I have with her, and expect less from her, and I really just connected in much more. And we had a dream day. We were connected. I even got to eat my meal "in peace" but the thing was it didn't matter if I didn't, and that's where the change came in.
So thank you all again. It has been very insightful posting here.
--- In [email protected], "mitrisue" <julesmiel@...> wrote:
>
> --- In [email protected], "seamanjane" <seamanjane@> wrote:
> > I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I
> > would love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her
>
> My daughter is 4, and I need to find creative ways to be together with her, too. It helps if I emphasize togetherness, and I always try to keep "sometimes, not always" in mind when I think I've found a solution. If I remind myself that it's all moment to moment, and that new ideas will come to me when I need them, my mood is more stable and I'm better able to respond.
>
> This morning I was able to take a shower because I suggested that my daughter come upstairs and get dressed while I was in the bathroom. She liked the idea of getting ready together. This is a recent development. Before that, I only showered when my husband was at home.
>
> Sometimes I get more recharge time with Sue in my lap. When I feel fairly desperate to sit down and eat, Sue will sit in my lap and share my food. This was a recent rediscovery for me because she's been eating on her own for a while, but now plate-sharing is a go-to move (temporarily, as always) when I need a moment. When sharing a meal like this, I can even drift into Kindle-land for a little while and read a chapter or two. That's important recharge time. I try to appreciate it without counting on it--the trickiest part for me.
>
> Julie
>
chris ester
On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 10:39 PM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
I think that it was the first 6 or 7 years that I was a mom that I almost
never had a shower in private. My children were almost always in the
bathroom (which was very tiny) with me. We usually had what amounted to a
family bath time. I would wash me first and make sure that things were all
rinsed off and then I would wash the kids one at a time or together.
Every now and then, my husband or mother would be playing with them and I
would get a quick shower. But I didn't expect that I had a right to a
shower. Eventually, they would want to play in their room together and
then I would leave the door open. Frankly, I would have rather had them in
a nice warm steamy bathroom than leave the door open with the accompanying
draft.
chris
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> **Sandra<<<<<
>
>
> >>-=-Same when I have my morning shower. -=-
>
> Can she take a shower with you? Can she play in the bathroom while you're
> in the shower?
>
> I think you're expecting too much for yourself, and expecting too much of
> her.
>
I think that it was the first 6 or 7 years that I was a mom that I almost
never had a shower in private. My children were almost always in the
bathroom (which was very tiny) with me. We usually had what amounted to a
family bath time. I would wash me first and make sure that things were all
rinsed off and then I would wash the kids one at a time or together.
Every now and then, my husband or mother would be playing with them and I
would get a quick shower. But I didn't expect that I had a right to a
shower. Eventually, they would want to play in their room together and
then I would leave the door open. Frankly, I would have rather had them in
a nice warm steamy bathroom than leave the door open with the accompanying
draft.
chris
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sandralynndodd
Because you chose "feeling controlled" for your subject line, this page will probably help too, but don't read too much at once. Read a little, try a little, wait a while, watch.
http://sandradodd.com/control
http://sandradodd.com/control
supermomblues
I'm a little late in this conversation, but I wanted to speak from personal experience: I know exactly what you're going through. With our five year old son, the same behaviors started happening when we started saying "yes" more. My best theory to this is that he wants to see just how far it can go:
"can I have a cookie?"
"yes"
"can I play on your phone?"
"yes"
"can I jump off the roof?"
" . . ???"
Or something along those lines.
But let me assure you that it IS a phase and it DOES end.
My best advice is to give her the attention she desires. When children don't get enough positive attention, they resort to doing things to get NEGATIVE attention (because attention is attention, right?). With our son, we just keep saying yes, and when he becomes demanding or hateful about it I get on his level and explain to him that "I don't like being talked to like that, it hurts my feelings and makes me sad." Between my showing him respect and kindness and expressing my feelings to him, he is becoming less demanding and controlling.
So, in a nutshell, continue to show kindness and don't be afraid to tell your child how you feel about a situation - they can process a lot more that we give them credit for sometimes :-)
"can I have a cookie?"
"yes"
"can I play on your phone?"
"yes"
"can I jump off the roof?"
" . . ???"
Or something along those lines.
But let me assure you that it IS a phase and it DOES end.
My best advice is to give her the attention she desires. When children don't get enough positive attention, they resort to doing things to get NEGATIVE attention (because attention is attention, right?). With our son, we just keep saying yes, and when he becomes demanding or hateful about it I get on his level and explain to him that "I don't like being talked to like that, it hurts my feelings and makes me sad." Between my showing him respect and kindness and expressing my feelings to him, he is becoming less demanding and controlling.
>>> For example, nearly every time I have a meal she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her instead.<<<Try having your meals together. Try scheduling your day so that you get the most out of your time together. Need to do some chores? Invite her to help or to talk to you while you do it (my children love to help do laundry!). Try spending some time out of the house together - go for a walk around the neighborhood, go play in the park, go to a museum or zoo, that kind of thing. Let her know that you value her as a PERSON, not just as a child.
So, in a nutshell, continue to show kindness and don't be afraid to tell your child how you feel about a situation - they can process a lot more that we give them credit for sometimes :-)
--- In [email protected], "seamanjane" <seamanjane@...> wrote:
>
> I've been unschooling my almost 5 year old daughter from birth and I would love some ideas on how to work more in partnership with her so I can get my own basic needs met in peace. For example, nearly every time I have a meal she starts having a tantrum because she wants me doing something with her instead. Same when I have my morning shower. Then while I'm eating she's hassling me all the time to hurry up or she starts jumping on me so I can't eat in peace. If we have dinner. This is all my own fault because I have allowed her too much control over my life and I feel she now believes that she can say where she wants me and what she wants me doing during the day (very much what my own mother did to me - I was highly controlled and I'm aware of this and currently working through it in therapy). As you can see the balance is wrong but I literally do not know how to peacefully and lovingly help her understand that I have rights too, the main ones being to have meals and a shower in peace. Also I spend nearly the entire day engaged with her and don't spend too much time on chores or cooking (again I'm thinking maybe I should be doing more of those things so she can see I have a life too, but as soon as I start she starts shouting at me to stop and to come play with her). I think she thinks I should be playing with her 100% of the time and do nothing else all day. I know I have created this myself and I would love some ideas for modifying this so we can live more in partnership with each other.
>
Sandra Dodd
-=- When children don't get enough positive attention, they resort to doing things to get NEGATIVE attention (because attention is attention, right?). -=-
That seems to be the case in school, and that assertion has been made for many years.
It shouldn't be true, though, in a home environment where children aren't being ignored and aren't having to compete for very limited attention.
-=-With our five year old son, the same behaviors started happening when we started saying "yes" more. My best theory to this is that he wants to see just how far it can go. . .
But let me assure you that it IS a phase and it DOES end. -=-
It happened not because you started saying yes, though. It happened because you had been saying "no" so much.
That's a subtle but important difference. In a family in which there wasn't so much limitation and rules, the phase you're talking about isn't there.
He was probably seeing how much he could get before you brought back the limitations. That's different from seeing how far it can go. Subtle but real.
Sandra
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That seems to be the case in school, and that assertion has been made for many years.
It shouldn't be true, though, in a home environment where children aren't being ignored and aren't having to compete for very limited attention.
-=-With our five year old son, the same behaviors started happening when we started saying "yes" more. My best theory to this is that he wants to see just how far it can go. . .
But let me assure you that it IS a phase and it DOES end. -=-
It happened not because you started saying yes, though. It happened because you had been saying "no" so much.
That's a subtle but important difference. In a family in which there wasn't so much limitation and rules, the phase you're talking about isn't there.
He was probably seeing how much he could get before you brought back the limitations. That's different from seeing how far it can go. Subtle but real.
Sandra
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Meredith
> -=- When children don't get enough positive attention, they resort to doing things to get NEGATIVE attention (because attention is attention, right?). -=-*************
>
> That seems to be the case in school, and that assertion has been made for many years.
> It shouldn't be true, though, in a home environment where children aren't being ignored and aren't having to compete for very limited attention.
It can be the case between siblings, especially young children who still need a lot of help communicating. Parents don't always realize siblings can want attention from each other.
It can happen in a home where one child is an "odd man out", where "the family" has a particular love - hiking or role playing games or whatever - but one child has different interests. That would fall under "being ignored" or "competing for attention" I suppose.
---Meredith
Pam Sorooshian
And it can happen when one kid has much greater need for
attention/connection/interaction than siblings. Parents can feel like
they're doing more than enough for that kid, compared to the others, while
that kid can still feel ignored.
-pam
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attention/connection/interaction than siblings. Parents can feel like
they're doing more than enough for that kid, compared to the others, while
that kid can still feel ignored.
-pam
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Rach
--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>Has anyone written on this? This is something I could use some ideas about.
> And it can happen when one kid has much greater need for
> attention/connection/interaction than siblings. Parents can feel like
> they're doing more than enough for that kid, compared to the others, while
> that kid can still feel ignored.
>
> -pam
>
Sandra Dodd
-=-Has anyone written on this? This is something I could use some ideas about.-=-
Don't measure the attention or time you're giving children. If you're "fair," it might end up being unfair, if one was needier, and you withheld because he had already had "more than his share" (of time or attention).
All of unschooling is that idea. Be directly with your child.
Sandra
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Don't measure the attention or time you're giving children. If you're "fair," it might end up being unfair, if one was needier, and you withheld because he had already had "more than his share" (of time or attention).
All of unschooling is that idea. Be directly with your child.
Sandra
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Sandra Dodd
-=-It can happen in a home where one child is an "odd man out", where "the family" has a particular love - hiking or role playing games or whatever - but one child has different interests. That would fall under "being ignored" or "competing for attention" I suppose. -=-
This is a very good point.
Each child needs his own kind of attention. Parents should go as far as they need to to figure out what kinds of things the child likes and is helped by and comforted by.
Sandra
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This is a very good point.
Each child needs his own kind of attention. Parents should go as far as they need to to figure out what kinds of things the child likes and is helped by and comforted by.
Sandra
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Joyce Fetteroll
On Apr 16, 2013, at 9:45 PM, Rach wrote:
Be more present. Especially to head off and redirect negative expression of needs so you can help them find better ways to express and to meet their needs. Look beyond the expression to the underlying need. *Why* are they doing something hurtful or annoying? What need is behind it? What need could be met before it reached that level of frustration?
Joyce
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> Has anyone written on this? This is something I could use some ideas about.It will help members tailor the answers if you describe your situation and what isn't working. Otherwise the answer is to trust the needs your kids express. Don't look at your kids through a veil of expert advice on what kids need. Look directly at them.
Be more present. Especially to head off and redirect negative expression of needs so you can help them find better ways to express and to meet their needs. Look beyond the expression to the underlying need. *Why* are they doing something hurtful or annoying? What need is behind it? What need could be met before it reached that level of frustration?
Joyce
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