Sandra Dodd

This page might be a good one to save for any parent experiencing anger or fear or frustration.

http://sandradodd.com/being/healing

Today the Just Add Light and Stir post links to the "being" page, but the link above isn't there. It has a different tone, and I chose not to work it in, but looking at it just now reminded me it might be a good touchstone for a holiday/vacation season when some people are in unusual circumstances. Even really happy times can be stressful for families, because of the unexpected emotions and interactions.

http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/2011/12/ahead-of-what.html

A week or so back, someone left this discussion in a defensive huff, assuring me on the way out that I clearly knew NOTHING about Buddhism. Buddhism isn't going to be on the test. It's trivia. What I know is that being where you are, in a mindful way, with the potential and the tools to be still and know it, is the portal to a better life. Call it what you want to, finding yourself with your children will put you in a good place. :-)

Finding
yourself
with.

Sandra

chris ester

I have seen many religious seekers over the years in my life. It seems
that sometimes when a person finds what he/she believes will provide "The
Answer" or "Inner Peace" or whatever it is that she thinks she will find
when a religious or spiritual path is right for her/him, then they often
want rules and scripts for how they should "Be".

Oftentimes a new convert will work really hard to follow all of the rules
to prove to themselves, and maybe others as well, that they really are on
the right path and have found the right answer.... to whatever the
questions might be, even if they aren't really sure of the question. When
someone seems to question their choices or to just point out that there are
other possible choices, this new believer often becomes angry and
defensive.

I think that in an unschooling context, one of things that I learned
slowly, sometimes painfully slowly, is to be comfortable with a lack of
"Knowing" and rather to work cultivating my faith and trust in the
indomitable will of my children to explore and learn and grow (in all
senses of the word), sometimes in spite of myself and my fears. As an
unschooler, I learned to be comfortable with the fact that I may not have a
lot of answers when I want them. I learned to ask different questions,
such as:
Are my children happy?
Are the individuals in our family connected and engaged with each other,
with the world?
Do my children still have that innate curiosity that drove them to pull
themselves up off of the floor and walk so that they could climb up on the
chair and see what was in the top of the cabinet in the kitchen?
How can I help maintain that curiosity and cultivate it in myself?
When I sit back and look at where we have been and where we are, do my
children have a wealth of experiences that add up to a knowledge of
themselves and the world around them?

Do my children feel that they are capable of anything that they put their
mind to?
When my daughter wanted to make a vegetarian bacon substitute she looked up
some things on the internet and proceeded to practice alchemy in my
kitchen. She then took some tofu out of the fridge and marinated it in her
concoction. The next morning, she cooked it and it actually tasted like
bacon! The best part is that she has never eaten real bacon, but still
managed to make tofu taste like bacon!!! Oh, she also wrote down her
recipe so that she could repeat her success, and we have done so several
times.

I find it hard to remember when she couldn't write, it was something that
she took to, we always had pens, pencils, crayons, paints, markers and lots
of paper around and I had some 'copy books' laying around (something that I
bought before I had a better clue). One day, I saw her playing and writing
in the copy books. I watched with fascination because she was actually
tracing the letters. I thought that she would be drawing in the pages
(equally as good) like she had in the past with coloring books, but this
time she was tracing letters. She asked what the letters were and I
recited for her what they were. I think that she was three. I have
spelled hundreds of words for her and was a little sad once she learned how
to use spell check. I have always spelled words for my children without
trying to make them 'sound it out'. I have explained why the words are
spelled the way they are, when I knew the information.

I guess the other question that I asked often, once I realized how
important a question it was, is, "Am I being helpful and facilitative of my
children's learning and not an obstacle with what I think are good ideas?"
I am still de-schooling and I have been doing this for 10 years. It has
gotten easier, but I am stubborn and perhaps think a little too much of my
own ideas. Now though, my kids tell me when I am being too schoolish,
usually with a look like I have hit my head a little too hard. :) Though
sometimes, my ideas are good ones and we go off on an adventure that I
actually dreamed up, usually this is a trip to some nifty place that we all
find interesting or some cooking project. I am happy that my children feel
that they are free to express their opinions to me about my ideas.

When my son was not reading by himself at the age of ten, I took a lot of
deep breaths and read other people's stories about their sons and daughters
and how one day they just started reading; all without pain and bad
feelings because they were 'late' to read. And one day, my son did read
and now he reads everything he wants to and then often he will tell me all
about some subject that I would have never read about myself, and I feel
enriched and blessed.

I guess, the upshot is that having faith in my children's drive and desire
to learn and re-kindling my own love of learning and interest in things has
been a work in progress. Realizing that learning is process and not
product (or papers or dioramas or some other schoolish thing) came to me
one day when I was discussing my own school experience with a friend. She
was going on about 'demonstration of skills and knowledge' and the
importance of homework. I realized that one the things that made me hate
most of my school days was this inane 'demonstration' business and the busy
work. I loved learning about things and I loved creating real
things--clothes, crochet projects, dances, singing in chorus, performing in
plays, fixing a flat tire, things that were real in the world and useful or
somehow brought joy (or maybe some relief in the case of the flat tire),
not some stupid canned 'lesson' that had some pre-determined product in
mind, or just discussing what I had learned and how it fit with other
things that I already knew or how it challenged what I thought that I
knew.

Homework made me hate math until I was in college. Hundreds of problems to
complete, even after I got the concept and was able to do whatever
operation that we were studying, all just to be able to show that we were
'productive'....

Both of my kids are learning algebra, because they find it interesting. I
bought some curriculum and books about algebra and manipulatives and
calculators and they are there when they are interested. I am here to
answer questions or discuss things as they wish to engage. We have gone
through curriculum a couple of days in a row and then haven't touched it
for weeks and then one of the kids says 'lets do some math' and we get the
books out and read and 'do math'. The funny thing is that they always seem
to remember the concepts and how to do whatever we learned the last time
and pick up where we left off.

A friend who is a teacher in public schools insists that my children can't
actually be remembering the concepts and operations weeks later. I
explained that they remember because they have actually learned because we
study the stuff as long as they want and discuss and pull apart each
concept until we are satisfied that we know as much as we want to know
before we move on (I say 'we' because I really am learning this stuff all
over again). I used the term "Socratic method" to try to explain what we
do when we 'do math'. She insisted that the Socratic method could only
apply to philosophy.... I smiled and told her that we must do something
different then and we all were happy with our learning, so it really didn't
matter what it was called. I didn't even bother to tell her that we only
did a few of the problems from each unit, if we do any for a particular
lesson from the books that we use. I didn't want to shake her view of
reality too badly, mostly because I no longer have a desire to prove that I
am providing my children with a good education and because she didn't seem
ready to hear that there are other options out there.
Chris

On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 10:28 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> This page might be a good one to save for any parent experiencing anger or
> fear or frustration.
>
> http://sandradodd.com/being/healing
>
> Today the Just Add Light and Stir post links to the "being" page, but the
> link above isn't there. It has a different tone, and I chose not to work it
> in, but looking at it just now reminded me it might be a good touchstone
> for a holiday/vacation season when some people are in unusual
> circumstances. Even really happy times can be stressful for families,
> because of the unexpected emotions and interactions.
>
> http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/2011/12/ahead-of-what.html
>
> A week or so back, someone left this discussion in a defensive huff,
> assuring me on the way out that I clearly knew NOTHING about Buddhism.
> Buddhism isn't going to be on the test. It's trivia. What I know is that
> being where you are, in a mindful way, with the potential and the tools to
> be still and know it, is the portal to a better life. Call it what you want
> to, finding yourself with your children will put you in a good place. :-)
>
> Finding
> yourself
> with.
>
> Sandra
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-I find it hard to remember when she couldn't write, it was something that
she took to, we always had pens, pencils, crayons, paints, markers and lots
of paper around and I had some 'copy books' laying around (something that I
bought before I had a better clue). One day, I saw her playing and writing
in the copy books.-=-

I don't think having copy books or workbooks around is a clueless thing, as long as the mom isn't looking at what's been done in the book instead of looking at her child. And clearly, from your REALLY great list of questions, you were looking at your child!

-=-We have gone
through curriculum a couple of days in a row and then haven't touched it
for weeks and then one of the kids says 'lets do some math' and we get the
books out and read and 'do math'. The funny thing is that they always seem
to remember the concepts and how to do whatever we learned the last time
and pick up where we left off.-=-

I hope they really do know, and you really know, that there is a world of math that doesn't look like algebraic notation.

-=- I used the term "Socratic method" to try to explain what we
do when we 'do math'. She insisted that the Socratic method could only
apply to philosophy....-=-

OH!
From the beginning of your post I was thinking about philosophy. People "study philosophy" or "read philosophy" without ever gaining the least benefit from it. All the time I see people "studying philosophy" or talking about it, and not applying one iota of an idea to their own decisionmaking real lives.

I bet your kids are learning to ask their own questions, gradually but solidly, in ways they won't forget, about whether they're learning, and how, and what.

School operates on the idea that kids forget what they've "learned" each summer vacation, and winter break. Partly it's because the kids weren't learning at all, and mostly because kids pretend not to know because they're prefer a repeat to new information. The better to zone out, and the easier to get good grades. School has taught them that it's the grades and test scores that really matter, so if the kids can do easy, reviewed things instead of new information, that's where they head.

Sandra

chris ester

On Wed, Dec 21, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> *******I don't think having copy books or workbooks around is a clueless
> thing, as long as the mom isn't looking at what's been done in the book
> instead of looking at her child. And clearly, from your REALLY great list
> of questions, you were looking at your child!********
>
I said that because I originally bought the books so that I could 'teach'
my kids to read and write. I just really didn't have the heart to 'make'
them sit through my efforts to 'teach' when we had such a great time just
doing and being together. I realized that my kids had been learning when
we took a homemade pizza kit (risen dough and toppings) over to a friend's
house so that our kids could make pizza together. My kids taught her (same
age) kids how to spread the dough and put the toppings on. The other mom
and I just got to sit and marvel at how well kids can get along without
interference.

>
>
> *******I hope they really do know, and you really know, that there is a
> world of math that doesn't look like algebraic notation.**********
>
Yes!! We actually enjoy math theory (hubby and I were math geeks) and I
found a curriculum that talks about how algebraic equations can be found in
real life. My daughter (and husband) actually enjoys what I call plug and
chug math--lots of equations. They both get some sort of satisfaction from
completing a bunch of math equations. I think it is sort of like
meditation to them. This is not how my son and I relate to numbers. We
also have a bunch of books that talk about math and how it applies to life,
and art, not to mention all of the websites that show nifty math in
action. We are very booky people that love running to the internet or
books for whatever question pops into our heads.

My husband is a computer guy for a living and almost majored in math in
college. When I discovered math theory and geometry, I discovered that I
am actually very good at thinking mathematically, but find plug numbers
into equations very tedious. I like math that you can build with...

We didn't touch any kind of math curriculum until I hit a road block when
trying to answer my kid's questions about math. We have a bunch of
textbooks (mostly college level) and some curriculum that we use as
reference material.

>
> ^^^^^OH!
> From the beginning of your post I was thinking about philosophy. People
> "study philosophy" or "read philosophy" without ever gaining the least
> benefit from it. All the time I see people "studying philosophy" or talking
> about it, and not applying one iota of an idea to their own decisionmaking
> real lives.^^^^^^^^^
>

This is so true. I only took one class in college that I would not have
taken if I weren't required to do so to complete my degree. It was my only
'c' on my transcript. I loved essay tests and discussion. Friends of mine
took only classes that they knew they could get an 'a' in and tried to
avoid writing any papers as well. I had placed myself in true poverty to
pursue my college education, so I wanted to get my money's worth. My GPA
probably suffered a bit because I didn't just take easy classes, but I
enjoyed every class I took except for that one. :)

>
> ******I bet your kids are learning to ask their own questions, gradually
> but solidly, in ways they won't forget, about whether they're learning, and
> how, and what.***********
>

Now that they are teenagers they often challenge me intellectually. They
ask questions and we have some amazing discussions. Anything that they
learn, they really learn and rarely forget.

>
> ********School operates on the idea that kids forget what they've
> "learned" each summer vacation, and winter break. Partly it's because the
> kids weren't learning at all, and mostly because kids pretend not to know
> because they're prefer a repeat to new information. The better to zone out,
> and the easier to get good grades. School has taught them that it's the
> grades and test scores that really matter, so if the kids can do easy,
> reviewed things instead of new information, that's where they head.
>
> Sandra*********
>

This, in my opinion is one really good reason to homeschool, even if you
don't unschool. What really flabbergasts me is when a homeschooled child
is forced to adhere to some kind of schedule and testing, instead of being
given the freedom to learn a subject (even if it is one that they are
assigned) and go through the material until they actually know it. Why
homeschool if you aren't actually allowing your child to learn in a genuine
way?

I also wanted to say that I feel that unschooling can lead to a person who
is a better citizen because most of the unschooled kids that I have met
actually know how to absorb information and assess that information better
than many other young people their same age. This is my opinion, but my
observations support the supposition.

Chris

>
>
>


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Tamara

Hi,

<<We also have a bunch of books that talk about math and how it applies to life,
and art, not to mention all of the websites that show nifty math in
action.>>

Would you share the names of some of those books? I am a very booky person and my daughter is just starting to get interested in numbers so would love some ideas on fun number things we could try.

Many thanks,

Tamara

Rippy and Graham Dusseldorp

<<Would you share the names of some of those books? I am a very booky person and my daughter is just starting to get interested in numbers so would love some ideas on fun number things we could try.>>

My children have really enjoyed some of the games and activities from the following books:

Family Math for Young Children (http://www.amazon.com/Family-Math-Young-Children-Comparing/dp/0912511273/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1325103057&sr=8-1)

Family Math (http://www.amazon.com/Family-Math-Jean-Kerr-Stenmark/dp/0912511060/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1325103087&sr=8-2)

Games for Math (http://www.amazon.com/Games-Math-Peggy-Kaye/dp/0394755103/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1325103122&sr=8-1)

Rippy
Gianluca 7, Gisele 5




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