trying not to react angrily to my 4YOs temper
Angela
I am having a tough time right now with my almost-4YO. She is a hilarious, lovable, loving, caring, full-of-life, amazingly empathetic girl ... with a temper that flares in an instant.
Way before she could speak I knew she had a sense of humor and a temper, so it's not like it's new, but the past few months have been pretty hard.
When she gets angry, I do my best to figure out why she's frustrated if I don't already know and try to help her see her options, etc. I've tried but can't track her mood to hunger or sleep, though like anyone else, her mood can be worse when she is depleted physically. I've tried to make sure she has as much control over her environment as possible. I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...
When she gets angry because she's frustrated over feeling like something's out of her control or if it's because of some squabble with one of her siblings, I feel like I'm right on it and know exactly what to do to soothe her and smooth things over for her (if I haven't managed to head it off at the pass to begin with).
But it's not her mood/anger itself that's really a problem for me. I'm the youngest of three, too, and I remember the frustration of wanting to do things I saw my older sisters doing that I either couldn't or wasn't allowed to do or of feeling bossed around. The problem I'm having is that sometimes I react angrily when it feels like all day long she's screaming *at me*, calling me stupid, being sarcastic, even pinching, etc.
Example: There are days she's thrilled to have me lift her into her car seat and latch her in, but some days my doing that would set her off. So sometimes I wait for her to ask for help and sometimes I may say, "Do you want help or do you want to do it yourself?" But sometimes just asking results in, "NO, I DON'T WANT YOU TO DO IT, STUPID!!!" She may throw in a "duh" and an eye roll for good measure.
I just have no idea how to deal with that. I guess sometimes it hurts my feelings. And sometimes I definitely get angry and I can feel my face scrunching up and hear a way-less-than-soothing tone in my voice. Or it's gotten to the point of me telling her that I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her.
I want to figure out/learn better ways to react to her.
Thoughts, suggestions?
Thanks,
Angela in NJ
with Joseph, 9; Hannah, 6; and Miriam, almost 4
Way before she could speak I knew she had a sense of humor and a temper, so it's not like it's new, but the past few months have been pretty hard.
When she gets angry, I do my best to figure out why she's frustrated if I don't already know and try to help her see her options, etc. I've tried but can't track her mood to hunger or sleep, though like anyone else, her mood can be worse when she is depleted physically. I've tried to make sure she has as much control over her environment as possible. I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...
When she gets angry because she's frustrated over feeling like something's out of her control or if it's because of some squabble with one of her siblings, I feel like I'm right on it and know exactly what to do to soothe her and smooth things over for her (if I haven't managed to head it off at the pass to begin with).
But it's not her mood/anger itself that's really a problem for me. I'm the youngest of three, too, and I remember the frustration of wanting to do things I saw my older sisters doing that I either couldn't or wasn't allowed to do or of feeling bossed around. The problem I'm having is that sometimes I react angrily when it feels like all day long she's screaming *at me*, calling me stupid, being sarcastic, even pinching, etc.
Example: There are days she's thrilled to have me lift her into her car seat and latch her in, but some days my doing that would set her off. So sometimes I wait for her to ask for help and sometimes I may say, "Do you want help or do you want to do it yourself?" But sometimes just asking results in, "NO, I DON'T WANT YOU TO DO IT, STUPID!!!" She may throw in a "duh" and an eye roll for good measure.
I just have no idea how to deal with that. I guess sometimes it hurts my feelings. And sometimes I definitely get angry and I can feel my face scrunching up and hear a way-less-than-soothing tone in my voice. Or it's gotten to the point of me telling her that I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her.
I want to figure out/learn better ways to react to her.
Thoughts, suggestions?
Thanks,
Angela in NJ
with Joseph, 9; Hannah, 6; and Miriam, almost 4
Sandra Dodd
My first thought was to consider genetics. If she's the biological child of you and your husband and if you're together, is she more like you? Like him? Does your emotional response to that fact play into your reactions? It's easy to be more easily frustrated/angry by a child with one's own flaws, because something like embarrassment can arise.
-=- I've tried to make sure she has as much control over her environment as possible. I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...-=-
The word "control" is a flag for me. It's just a word, but it's also a telling word. She's the youngest of three? Ina family of five (or more?). Why should she be "controlling" her environment?
When I was in England last summer, I heard the phrase "gone pear-shaped," and I've heard it twice (from Brits, but in mixed/international company) since I got back. It kind of means that things "started to head south." Using either phrase, or any phrase, puts a little wall between you and the reality of what's happening in your home with your own children. Maybe notice when you use a phrase that's not your own combination of words. That probably seems petty in this moment, but it's a way to move one step closer to seeing what is really happening in the moment with your daughter.
http://sandradodd.com/phrases
-=-But it's not her mood/anger itself that's really a problem for me. I'm the youngest of three, too, and I remember the frustration of wanting to do things I saw my older sisters doing that I either couldn't or wasn't allowed to do or of feeling bossed around. The problem I'm having is that sometimes I react angrily when it feels like all day long she's screaming *at me*, calling me stupid, being sarcastic, even pinching, etc.-=-
When you were her age and the youngest of three, I'm guessing you didn't scream at your mom or call her stupid or pinch her. I hope you say plainly "Don't scream." Other ideas:
Say it quietly.
I'll listen, but stop screaming.
Screaming is not okay.
STOP.
(not to be used all at once, or screamingly; one or two)
If she says stupid, where is she hearing it? Are her sisters calling her stupid? Do you or her dad call ANYthing "stupid"? Movies? Neighbors? People on the news? In a family where things are stupid (any things), the dichotomy is created in life that negative reaction is smart, and those negatively reacted to are stupid.
http://sandradodd.com/negativity
-=-sometimes I may say, "Do you want help or do you want to do it yourself?" But sometimes just asking results in, "NO, I DON'T WANT YOU TO DO IT, STUPID!!!" She may throw in a "duh" and an eye roll for good measure.-=-
Then stop asking her if she wants help. It's possible you're talking too much. I don't like the "duh" and the eye roll, but people aren't born with those behaviors. They learn them from others. I would say to a child of mine acting that way that it wasn't nice, and I didn't like it. Say it in three words, or five. Not ten or twenty. Or walk away calmly. Ask later that she not roll her eyes at you. Don't ask her to agree to it, just say you'd like for her not to do that. Or that it's not the way to get help, or to create peace. But peace-creation is much more your job than hers.
So if she's getting into a car seat and knows how to do it and either you or she is frazzled even a little, let her do it unless she asks for help. Or maybe say (in as few words as possible, without eye contact maybe) "I can help if you need me to."
Too much eye contact and talking can be exhausting, threatening, crowding and infuriating. Too much demand for a response to inane, repeated, sing-songy questions can make the most peaceful kid blow. This isn't an accusation, it's a guess. And I'm not writing for the original poster alone, I'm writing for anyone and everyone on the list who might have a similar problem or who might have a friend who has a similar problem. Sometimes the child is blamed for reacting normally to a flood of cutie-poo mom noise.
-=-Or it's gotten to the point of me telling her that I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her.-=-
That many words? "I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her." 35 words, says "Word Count" when I put it in a word file. What if you just walk away without stating the obvious? And calmly walk, and not stomp away furiously? What if you just say "I'll be back in a minute," or "I'm going to go feed the cat" or I'm going to check the mailbox"?
About "stupid," if she says "stupid" when you've offered to help her, maybe you could say "I didn't think it was stupid to offer to help." Calmly. Informationally. Help her hear what she said and think about it, without droning on telling her what she said, and what she should have said instead, and what you think about it.
Fewer words.
Sandra
-=- I've tried to make sure she has as much control over her environment as possible. I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...-=-
The word "control" is a flag for me. It's just a word, but it's also a telling word. She's the youngest of three? Ina family of five (or more?). Why should she be "controlling" her environment?
When I was in England last summer, I heard the phrase "gone pear-shaped," and I've heard it twice (from Brits, but in mixed/international company) since I got back. It kind of means that things "started to head south." Using either phrase, or any phrase, puts a little wall between you and the reality of what's happening in your home with your own children. Maybe notice when you use a phrase that's not your own combination of words. That probably seems petty in this moment, but it's a way to move one step closer to seeing what is really happening in the moment with your daughter.
http://sandradodd.com/phrases
-=-But it's not her mood/anger itself that's really a problem for me. I'm the youngest of three, too, and I remember the frustration of wanting to do things I saw my older sisters doing that I either couldn't or wasn't allowed to do or of feeling bossed around. The problem I'm having is that sometimes I react angrily when it feels like all day long she's screaming *at me*, calling me stupid, being sarcastic, even pinching, etc.-=-
When you were her age and the youngest of three, I'm guessing you didn't scream at your mom or call her stupid or pinch her. I hope you say plainly "Don't scream." Other ideas:
Say it quietly.
I'll listen, but stop screaming.
Screaming is not okay.
STOP.
(not to be used all at once, or screamingly; one or two)
If she says stupid, where is she hearing it? Are her sisters calling her stupid? Do you or her dad call ANYthing "stupid"? Movies? Neighbors? People on the news? In a family where things are stupid (any things), the dichotomy is created in life that negative reaction is smart, and those negatively reacted to are stupid.
http://sandradodd.com/negativity
-=-sometimes I may say, "Do you want help or do you want to do it yourself?" But sometimes just asking results in, "NO, I DON'T WANT YOU TO DO IT, STUPID!!!" She may throw in a "duh" and an eye roll for good measure.-=-
Then stop asking her if she wants help. It's possible you're talking too much. I don't like the "duh" and the eye roll, but people aren't born with those behaviors. They learn them from others. I would say to a child of mine acting that way that it wasn't nice, and I didn't like it. Say it in three words, or five. Not ten or twenty. Or walk away calmly. Ask later that she not roll her eyes at you. Don't ask her to agree to it, just say you'd like for her not to do that. Or that it's not the way to get help, or to create peace. But peace-creation is much more your job than hers.
So if she's getting into a car seat and knows how to do it and either you or she is frazzled even a little, let her do it unless she asks for help. Or maybe say (in as few words as possible, without eye contact maybe) "I can help if you need me to."
Too much eye contact and talking can be exhausting, threatening, crowding and infuriating. Too much demand for a response to inane, repeated, sing-songy questions can make the most peaceful kid blow. This isn't an accusation, it's a guess. And I'm not writing for the original poster alone, I'm writing for anyone and everyone on the list who might have a similar problem or who might have a friend who has a similar problem. Sometimes the child is blamed for reacting normally to a flood of cutie-poo mom noise.
-=-Or it's gotten to the point of me telling her that I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her.-=-
That many words? "I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her." 35 words, says "Word Count" when I put it in a word file. What if you just walk away without stating the obvious? And calmly walk, and not stomp away furiously? What if you just say "I'll be back in a minute," or "I'm going to go feed the cat" or I'm going to check the mailbox"?
About "stupid," if she says "stupid" when you've offered to help her, maybe you could say "I didn't think it was stupid to offer to help." Calmly. Informationally. Help her hear what she said and think about it, without droning on telling her what she said, and what she should have said instead, and what you think about it.
Fewer words.
Sandra
Joyce Fetteroll
On Sep 15, 2011, at 5:34 AM, Sandra Dodd wrote:
And it's a big limitation of this medium. Some of the wording offered
may trigger old sound tracks.
"That hurt my feelings," can be said angrily. It can be said in a
pitying whiny voice. It can be said in a shaming way. It can be said
like "I'm so frustrated with you!" It can be said in all sorts of ways
to manipulate someone's emotions to *make* them feel bad.
But the goal should be helping kids make thoughtful choices, not
making them feel bad about the choices they've made. If they're given
information -- which may be direct words, may be the suggestion of a
better way, may be walking away, may be something else especially with
sensitive kids -- and allowed to be thoughtful about their actions,
when they're developmentally able, they *will* feel bad. Bad is a good
sign. Bad is helpful. People won't put in the hard work of changing if
they feel good and fine.
Calmly. Informationally. Give them feedback.
Trust they want to be good people who don't want to hurt. Understand
that they're struggling with a problem or multiple problems with a big
glob of emotions that's got them tied into a confusing knot. But don't
cut off (simple, informational) feedback when they're hurting someone.
(As well as some form of "No!" because your goal is that everyone be
safe.)
There's something satisfying about passing anger onto someone else.
Maybe part of it is the powerful feeling of pushing a button and being
able to control someone else's behavior. It's the satisfaction of
dropping a watermelon and having it explode in a big way.
No one can push your buttons if you disconnect them.
But kids need feedback to figure out that pushing those buttons may
feel good but won't make them good people.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> "I didn't think it was stupid to offer to help." Calmly.Calmly. Informationally. That's key!
> Informationally.
And it's a big limitation of this medium. Some of the wording offered
may trigger old sound tracks.
"That hurt my feelings," can be said angrily. It can be said in a
pitying whiny voice. It can be said in a shaming way. It can be said
like "I'm so frustrated with you!" It can be said in all sorts of ways
to manipulate someone's emotions to *make* them feel bad.
But the goal should be helping kids make thoughtful choices, not
making them feel bad about the choices they've made. If they're given
information -- which may be direct words, may be the suggestion of a
better way, may be walking away, may be something else especially with
sensitive kids -- and allowed to be thoughtful about their actions,
when they're developmentally able, they *will* feel bad. Bad is a good
sign. Bad is helpful. People won't put in the hard work of changing if
they feel good and fine.
Calmly. Informationally. Give them feedback.
Trust they want to be good people who don't want to hurt. Understand
that they're struggling with a problem or multiple problems with a big
glob of emotions that's got them tied into a confusing knot. But don't
cut off (simple, informational) feedback when they're hurting someone.
(As well as some form of "No!" because your goal is that everyone be
safe.)
There's something satisfying about passing anger onto someone else.
Maybe part of it is the powerful feeling of pushing a button and being
able to control someone else's behavior. It's the satisfaction of
dropping a watermelon and having it explode in a big way.
No one can push your buttons if you disconnect them.
But kids need feedback to figure out that pushing those buttons may
feel good but won't make them good people.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-But kids need feedback to figure out that pushing those buttons may
feel good but won't make them good people.-=-
Yes.
Some unschoolers get confused about priorities and principles.
The purpose of unschooling shouldn't be to make each individual feel good, and then as an excuse to ignore the resulting mass of confusing and frustration when they're all trying to feel good at the same time without regard to collateral damage.
That is, in its own odd way, adversarial living.
Each child should be helped to see his or her own role in the happiness of others--gradually, as they get older. This happens from sharing (briefly) why we're doing what we're doing. Sometimes (not always) talking through why we're deciding what to do, where kids can hear. Or sometimes (not always) discussing with them what the options are and letting them contribute factors and suggestions.
But the goal in the long run is to help each child be a good person.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
feel good but won't make them good people.-=-
Yes.
Some unschoolers get confused about priorities and principles.
The purpose of unschooling shouldn't be to make each individual feel good, and then as an excuse to ignore the resulting mass of confusing and frustration when they're all trying to feel good at the same time without regard to collateral damage.
That is, in its own odd way, adversarial living.
Each child should be helped to see his or her own role in the happiness of others--gradually, as they get older. This happens from sharing (briefly) why we're doing what we're doing. Sometimes (not always) talking through why we're deciding what to do, where kids can hear. Or sometimes (not always) discussing with them what the options are and letting them contribute factors and suggestions.
But the goal in the long run is to help each child be a good person.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Angela
"Too many words" is one of the first things that jumped out at me. She is sooooooo very verbal for her age -- and has been fully conversational for about 2 years -- and we are BOTH extroverts, so talk-talk-talking happens all the time, but when she is frustrated is probably time for me to talk less.
-=-The word "control" is a flag for me. It's just a word, but it's also a telling word. She's the youngest of three? Ina family of five (or more?). Why should she be "controlling" her environment?-=-
I like the way wording and phrases are broken down and examined on this list. When I said it, what I was thinking was that she is very independent, likes to help a lot, likes to get her own dishes, pick out her own clothes (not just have choices over them, but physically go in her own drawers), etc. so we make sure she can get to what she needs (easy-to-open drawers, light-weight plastic stool so she can reach the counters, etc.). BUT I think to some extent I might be over compensating for NOT wanting to be screamed at. I need to think about that a little more.
-=-If she says stupid, where is she hearing it? Are her sisters calling her stupid? Do you or her dad call ANYthing "stupid"? Movies? Neighbors? People on the news? In a family where things are stupid (any things), the dichotomy is created in life that negative reaction is smart, and those negatively reacted to are stupid.-=-
Her brother and sister definitely call her/each other "stupid" or "idiot" from time-to-time in anger. They didn't used to, but it's happening more and more. It's not language my husband or I use, but it is common with our extended family. Even the adults, unfortunately. My husband comes from a long line of negative thinkers, and I think has made pretty drastic shifts in his thinking in the 16 years we've been together, but it definitely still bubbles up. I also hear "stupid" and "idiot" in the TV programs they watch (just this morning on Fairly Odd Parents, for example).
Re the point about genetics ... I need to think about this some. My son (oldest) has all my "flaws" -- or rather, what I was told were my flaws when I was growing up -- and while, sure, there has been some angst (and yes, even embarrassment, if I'm completely honest) about them from time to time, I actually get great satisfaction from helping him navigate in ways that I wish someone had helped me. My youngest daughter, on the other hand, has all of what was held up as my positives. I'm not sure what that means, but I definitely get more frustrated with her. I _think_ it's the sheer volume of screaming she throws at me on a daily basis, but maybe it's something else?
In reading Sandra's and Joyce's responses (some sent after I started this reply) I think I do a good job of "calmly and informationally" giving her feedback in the morning, but that as the day wears on maybe not so much with the "calmly" as I should. So I definitely have a couple things to work on and a couple more to think about.
Thanks,
Angela
-=-The word "control" is a flag for me. It's just a word, but it's also a telling word. She's the youngest of three? Ina family of five (or more?). Why should she be "controlling" her environment?-=-
I like the way wording and phrases are broken down and examined on this list. When I said it, what I was thinking was that she is very independent, likes to help a lot, likes to get her own dishes, pick out her own clothes (not just have choices over them, but physically go in her own drawers), etc. so we make sure she can get to what she needs (easy-to-open drawers, light-weight plastic stool so she can reach the counters, etc.). BUT I think to some extent I might be over compensating for NOT wanting to be screamed at. I need to think about that a little more.
-=-If she says stupid, where is she hearing it? Are her sisters calling her stupid? Do you or her dad call ANYthing "stupid"? Movies? Neighbors? People on the news? In a family where things are stupid (any things), the dichotomy is created in life that negative reaction is smart, and those negatively reacted to are stupid.-=-
Her brother and sister definitely call her/each other "stupid" or "idiot" from time-to-time in anger. They didn't used to, but it's happening more and more. It's not language my husband or I use, but it is common with our extended family. Even the adults, unfortunately. My husband comes from a long line of negative thinkers, and I think has made pretty drastic shifts in his thinking in the 16 years we've been together, but it definitely still bubbles up. I also hear "stupid" and "idiot" in the TV programs they watch (just this morning on Fairly Odd Parents, for example).
Re the point about genetics ... I need to think about this some. My son (oldest) has all my "flaws" -- or rather, what I was told were my flaws when I was growing up -- and while, sure, there has been some angst (and yes, even embarrassment, if I'm completely honest) about them from time to time, I actually get great satisfaction from helping him navigate in ways that I wish someone had helped me. My youngest daughter, on the other hand, has all of what was held up as my positives. I'm not sure what that means, but I definitely get more frustrated with her. I _think_ it's the sheer volume of screaming she throws at me on a daily basis, but maybe it's something else?
In reading Sandra's and Joyce's responses (some sent after I started this reply) I think I do a good job of "calmly and informationally" giving her feedback in the morning, but that as the day wears on maybe not so much with the "calmly" as I should. So I definitely have a couple things to work on and a couple more to think about.
Thanks,
Angela
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> My first thought was to consider genetics. If she's the biological child of you and your husband and if you're together, is she more like you? Like him? Does your emotional response to that fact play into your reactions? It's easy to be more easily frustrated/angry by a child with one's own flaws, because something like embarrassment can arise.
>
> -=- I've tried to make sure she has as much control over her environment as possible. I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...-=-
>
> The word "control" is a flag for me. It's just a word, but it's also a telling word. She's the youngest of three? Ina family of five (or more?). Why should she be "controlling" her environment?
>
> When I was in England last summer, I heard the phrase "gone pear-shaped," and I've heard it twice (from Brits, but in mixed/international company) since I got back. It kind of means that things "started to head south." Using either phrase, or any phrase, puts a little wall between you and the reality of what's happening in your home with your own children. Maybe notice when you use a phrase that's not your own combination of words. That probably seems petty in this moment, but it's a way to move one step closer to seeing what is really happening in the moment with your daughter.
>
> http://sandradodd.com/phrases
>
> -=-But it's not her mood/anger itself that's really a problem for me. I'm the youngest of three, too, and I remember the frustration of wanting to do things I saw my older sisters doing that I either couldn't or wasn't allowed to do or of feeling bossed around. The problem I'm having is that sometimes I react angrily when it feels like all day long she's screaming *at me*, calling me stupid, being sarcastic, even pinching, etc.-=-
>
> When you were her age and the youngest of three, I'm guessing you didn't scream at your mom or call her stupid or pinch her. I hope you say plainly "Don't scream." Other ideas:
> Say it quietly.
> I'll listen, but stop screaming.
> Screaming is not okay.
> STOP.
> (not to be used all at once, or screamingly; one or two)
>
> If she says stupid, where is she hearing it? Are her sisters calling her stupid? Do you or her dad call ANYthing "stupid"? Movies? Neighbors? People on the news? In a family where things are stupid (any things), the dichotomy is created in life that negative reaction is smart, and those negatively reacted to are stupid.
>
> http://sandradodd.com/negativity
>
> -=-sometimes I may say, "Do you want help or do you want to do it yourself?" But sometimes just asking results in, "NO, I DON'T WANT YOU TO DO IT, STUPID!!!" She may throw in a "duh" and an eye roll for good measure.-=-
>
> Then stop asking her if she wants help. It's possible you're talking too much. I don't like the "duh" and the eye roll, but people aren't born with those behaviors. They learn them from others. I would say to a child of mine acting that way that it wasn't nice, and I didn't like it. Say it in three words, or five. Not ten or twenty. Or walk away calmly. Ask later that she not roll her eyes at you. Don't ask her to agree to it, just say you'd like for her not to do that. Or that it's not the way to get help, or to create peace. But peace-creation is much more your job than hers.
>
> So if she's getting into a car seat and knows how to do it and either you or she is frazzled even a little, let her do it unless she asks for help. Or maybe say (in as few words as possible, without eye contact maybe) "I can help if you need me to."
>
> Too much eye contact and talking can be exhausting, threatening, crowding and infuriating. Too much demand for a response to inane, repeated, sing-songy questions can make the most peaceful kid blow. This isn't an accusation, it's a guess. And I'm not writing for the original poster alone, I'm writing for anyone and everyone on the list who might have a similar problem or who might have a friend who has a similar problem. Sometimes the child is blamed for reacting normally to a flood of cutie-poo mom noise.
>
> -=-Or it's gotten to the point of me telling her that I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her.-=-
>
> That many words? "I need to take a few minutes away from her because I'm not happy with the way she's speaking to me and I need to relax a little bit before I can be with her." 35 words, says "Word Count" when I put it in a word file. What if you just walk away without stating the obvious? And calmly walk, and not stomp away furiously? What if you just say "I'll be back in a minute," or "I'm going to go feed the cat" or I'm going to check the mailbox"?
>
> About "stupid," if she says "stupid" when you've offered to help her, maybe you could say "I didn't think it was stupid to offer to help." Calmly. Informationally. Help her hear what she said and think about it, without droning on telling her what she said, and what she should have said instead, and what you think about it.
>
> Fewer words.
>
> Sandra
>
NCMama
~~~I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...
When she gets angry because she's frustrated over feeling like something's out of her control or if it's because of some squabble with one of her siblings, I feel like I'm right on it and know exactly what to do to soothe her and smooth things over for her (if I haven't managed to head it off at the pass to begin with).~~~
There's something about the wording above that makes me think that you're not usually right there with her. Even though she has older siblings who are with her, she may really want more connection with YOU. How often are you with her, at her level, doing things together? You don't need to answer that here, it's something to think about.
If you're taking care of things all day, and you're not really with her (engaged, present, connected, full attention, eye contact) a lot, she may feel screaming is one way she's guaranteed to get attention from you. She may have a really big need for YOU, that's not as evident since she has siblings.
Caren
When she gets angry because she's frustrated over feeling like something's out of her control or if it's because of some squabble with one of her siblings, I feel like I'm right on it and know exactly what to do to soothe her and smooth things over for her (if I haven't managed to head it off at the pass to begin with).~~~
There's something about the wording above that makes me think that you're not usually right there with her. Even though she has older siblings who are with her, she may really want more connection with YOU. How often are you with her, at her level, doing things together? You don't need to answer that here, it's something to think about.
If you're taking care of things all day, and you're not really with her (engaged, present, connected, full attention, eye contact) a lot, she may feel screaming is one way she's guaranteed to get attention from you. She may have a really big need for YOU, that's not as evident since she has siblings.
Caren
Sandra Dodd
-=-Her brother and sister definitely call her/each other "stupid" or "idiot" from time-to-time in anger. They didn't used to, but it's happening more and more. It's not language my husband or I use, but it is common with our extended family. Even the adults, unfortunately. My husband comes from a long line of negative thinkers, and I think has made pretty drastic shifts in his thinking in the 16 years we've been together, but it definitely still bubbles up. I also hear "stupid" and "idiot" in the TV programs they watch (just this morning on Fairly Odd Parents, for example).-=-
I would try to extinguish those behaviors, not just in the house, and not just when you can hear, but tell them it's harmful in the way hitting is harmful. People start to believe it, and it makes them smaller inside.
Someone just yesterday in the chat said her son hated a certain museum. The conversation flowed on, but if it had been in this discussion, I would have stopped and said "Could you ask him to rephrase that?" To say, "That museum is too quiet for me," or "I've seen everything, and it's not the sort of thing I'm interested in anyway" is information. "I hate it" is negativity. It's emotion, disdain, rejection. It's information about the hater, not about the museum at all.
If a child calls another child an idiot, it doesn't make the statement true. What IS true, though, is that you have a child who will call another child "idiot." That's not going to get better by itself.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I would try to extinguish those behaviors, not just in the house, and not just when you can hear, but tell them it's harmful in the way hitting is harmful. People start to believe it, and it makes them smaller inside.
Someone just yesterday in the chat said her son hated a certain museum. The conversation flowed on, but if it had been in this discussion, I would have stopped and said "Could you ask him to rephrase that?" To say, "That museum is too quiet for me," or "I've seen everything, and it's not the sort of thing I'm interested in anyway" is information. "I hate it" is negativity. It's emotion, disdain, rejection. It's information about the hater, not about the museum at all.
If a child calls another child an idiot, it doesn't make the statement true. What IS true, though, is that you have a child who will call another child "idiot." That's not going to get better by itself.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Angela
Caren, you may have hit on it. Or at least part of it.
*I* feel like I'm with her, connected, eye contact, playing, talking, listening, reading, singing, snuggling a lot, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's *enough* for *her*.
When you said that, it reminded me of a story a friend told me recently where her six YO said to her, "Mommy, nobody in the family *invites* me to do things." She said she and her husband talked about it later and realized that she was right. That they had sort of taken a "don't disturb the porcupine" approach, and that if she seemed to be happily playing they didn't want to risk upsetting her by interrupting.
I heard this story, and it made so much sense to me at the time, but I didn't associate it with how I'm interacting with Miriam. Maybe because -- yelling at me aside -- I really don't think of her as a porcupine. I don't in general worry that if I approach her while she's playing that it will upset her. And maybe because her older sister really NEEDS a lot of time to herself and we're still trying to figure Miriam out. BUT, whatever the reason, I think I sort of fall into the "oh look, she's playing so happily, I'll just sit back and watch" or "She's ok, so let me check on Joe/do that thing Hannah's been asking about/take this opportunity to get lunch going/whatever"
Today I made an extra point of *not* just letting her be, even if she seemed happy. She was playing with the blocks and legos, and before where I might have just stood back and observed -- because she WAS totally engaged and NOT looking for my attention at the moment -- I went and plopped down on the floor in front of her and then she invited me to play, she told me all about the elaborate scenario she was creating, she asked me to help her reset the blocks after she knocked them over ...
There were several other moments like this in the day, but what there wasn't was screaming things *at me*. She screamed when her water gun broke, but it wasn't at me. She screamed once or twice over other frustrations, but it wasn't at me, it was at the situation.
I don't know that this will solve the problem -- and I definitely still need to use fewer words in the frustrated moments and watch the negativity coming from her siblings, etc. -- but it was definitely a good reminder that just because the kids seem content doesn't nec. mean that they wouldn't also like more of me.
Thanks!
*I* feel like I'm with her, connected, eye contact, playing, talking, listening, reading, singing, snuggling a lot, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's *enough* for *her*.
When you said that, it reminded me of a story a friend told me recently where her six YO said to her, "Mommy, nobody in the family *invites* me to do things." She said she and her husband talked about it later and realized that she was right. That they had sort of taken a "don't disturb the porcupine" approach, and that if she seemed to be happily playing they didn't want to risk upsetting her by interrupting.
I heard this story, and it made so much sense to me at the time, but I didn't associate it with how I'm interacting with Miriam. Maybe because -- yelling at me aside -- I really don't think of her as a porcupine. I don't in general worry that if I approach her while she's playing that it will upset her. And maybe because her older sister really NEEDS a lot of time to herself and we're still trying to figure Miriam out. BUT, whatever the reason, I think I sort of fall into the "oh look, she's playing so happily, I'll just sit back and watch" or "She's ok, so let me check on Joe/do that thing Hannah's been asking about/take this opportunity to get lunch going/whatever"
Today I made an extra point of *not* just letting her be, even if she seemed happy. She was playing with the blocks and legos, and before where I might have just stood back and observed -- because she WAS totally engaged and NOT looking for my attention at the moment -- I went and plopped down on the floor in front of her and then she invited me to play, she told me all about the elaborate scenario she was creating, she asked me to help her reset the blocks after she knocked them over ...
There were several other moments like this in the day, but what there wasn't was screaming things *at me*. She screamed when her water gun broke, but it wasn't at me. She screamed once or twice over other frustrations, but it wasn't at me, it was at the situation.
I don't know that this will solve the problem -- and I definitely still need to use fewer words in the frustrated moments and watch the negativity coming from her siblings, etc. -- but it was definitely a good reminder that just because the kids seem content doesn't nec. mean that they wouldn't also like more of me.
Thanks!
--- In [email protected], "NCMama" <dharmamama1@...> wrote:
>
> ~~~I try to be nearby when she's playing with her older siblings so that I can see and/or hear if things are starting to head south ...
>
> When she gets angry because she's frustrated over feeling like something's out of her control or if it's because of some squabble with one of her siblings, I feel like I'm right on it and know exactly what to do to soothe her and smooth things over for her (if I haven't managed to head it off at the pass to begin with).~~~
>
>
>
> There's something about the wording above that makes me think that you're not usually right there with her. Even though she has older siblings who are with her, she may really want more connection with YOU. How often are you with her, at her level, doing things together? You don't need to answer that here, it's something to think about.
>
> If you're taking care of things all day, and you're not really with her (engaged, present, connected, full attention, eye contact) a lot, she may feel screaming is one way she's guaranteed to get attention from you. She may have a really big need for YOU, that's not as evident since she has siblings.
>
> Caren
>