Sarah

I have three little boys; 5, 3 and 2 months. 5 and 3, until recently liked a quite traditional routine, going to bed between about six and eight, leaving me with a quiet evening to tidy, do life's admin and relax.

More recently they are staying up later and later and I'm finding it stressful. They don't usually need that much input from me in the evenings, they're tired and just want to curl up with a film or an ipad. I'm not looking for advice to get them off to bed, but to help me adjust.

Whenever they are up I feel like I'm still 'on duty' even if I'm not doing anything, in a way that I don't if they're asleep (though I know I'm never really off duty!).

I don't really know how to relax/unwind with them around, and so I'm ending the day with te feeling that I haven't had any time to wind down.

I think it might be easier if I didn't have a small baby (who mostly needs to be walked up and down in the sling all evening), I could read for example, or play cards or scrabble with my husband, but I'm limited in my entertainments and the props I used to used to tell me I'm having 'adult time'- like watching Dexter or The Wire on TV, all of which would certainly frighten my 5 year old.

I can't really get up earlier or go to bed later to get that time because my opportunities for lying down are limited and dictated largely by my 2 month old. I have some help during the week (my wonderful in-laws) but I still miss the evenings.

I'm sure I'm not the first to have needed a little help with this so I'm hoping someone will have some good tips for me.

Sarah

Sandra Dodd

-=-I have three little boys; 5, 3 and 2 months. 5 and 3, until recently liked a quite traditional routine, going to bed between about six and eight, leaving me with a quiet evening to tidy, do life's admin and relax.

-=-More recently they are staying up later and later and I'm finding it stressful. They don't usually need that much input from me in the evenings, they're tired and just want to curl up with a film or an ipad. I'm not looking for advice to get them off to bed, but to help me adjust.-=-

If they liked the traditional routine, why change it?

-=-I'm sure I'm not the first to have needed a little help with this so I'm hoping someone will have some good tips for me.-=-

I hope the "with this" you're talking about isn't an idea that unschoolers should follow a three and five year old into an odd unschooling crazy-land. I don't think so, because of the way you described it, but I think some people want to "act like unschoolers" rather than gradually gain a personal understanding of why unschoolers avoid arbitrary bedtimes. Not every bedtime is arbitrary. Putting a child to bed at 7:00 because a book said five year olds should be in bed at 7:00 has nothing to do with that particular child, or with learning, or with peace in the home. But letting a child stay up as long as he can possibly manage to has little to do with learning or with peace in the home either.

http://sandradodd.com/gradualchange

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sarah

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> -=-I have three little boys; 5, 3 and 2 months. 5 and 3, until recently liked a quite traditional routine, going to bed between about six and eight, leaving me with a quiet evening to tidy, do life's admin and relax.
>
> -=-More recently they are staying up later and later and I'm finding it stressful. They don't usually need that much input from me in the evenings, they're tired and just want to curl up with a film or an ipad. I'm not looking for advice to get them off to bed, but to help me adjust.-=-
>
> If they liked the traditional routine, why change it?
>

They did like it, but they've slowly gone off the idea, what they like to do at the moment is to go up to bed around the same time as they used to... and have cuddles and stories... And then come down to watch a bit of telly/play quiet games. Later on they like to be carried up to bed when they're on the point of falling asleep, or when they are asleep.

It really isn't at all chaotic and their bedtime routine has always been flexible- even when they always went to bed at six it was because they were ready. We never had an arbitrary bedtime... So we haven't changed anything or abandoned any rules, just that these things change and develop and where before they were early to bed (and to rise!) they now prefer a later routine..

It's only that I'm missing my evenings and I think I need to work out how to relax without getting bedtime 'done'. I've never been good at winding down until I've finished my mental to-do list.

Sarah

Sandra Dodd

-=-It's only that I'm missing my evenings and I think I need to work out how to relax without getting bedtime 'done'. I've never been good at winding down until I've finished my mental to-do list.-=-

AH.
That's different. That's not so bad.
I think missing one's evenings is just the way it is with kids the age of yours. And it might get worse before it gets better, for a while, when the baby is older.

I'm glad it's not the unschooling. :-)


Sandra

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Sarah

I think you're right, and it may well get worse first! Actually this evening I'm feeling much less bothered than I did last night... More sanguine. Still any cunning plans on how to adjust and adapt would be welcome.

Sarah

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> -=-It's only that I'm missing my evenings and I think I need to work out how to relax without getting bedtime 'done'. I've never been good at winding down until I've finished my mental to-do list.-=-
>
> AH.
> That's different. That's not so bad.
> I think missing one's evenings is just the way it is with kids the age of yours. And it might get worse before it gets better, for a while, when the baby is older.
>
> I'm glad it's not the unschooling. :-)
>
>
> Sandra
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

NCMama

I understand this, I think.

I am an introvert, according to the Myers-Briggs model, which means I get my energy by being alone. It doesn't have to do with shyness, or *liking* being around people; it's about where you feel energized and where you feel drained. It used to be, even when I'm around people I love dearly, I was drained by that! I needed alone time - especially alone time with no agenda - to get replenished.

Something has shifted since we started radically unschooling - and I no longer feel that way around my sons. I GET a lot when I GIVE to them, when I'm really present for them, and being generous.

I honestly didn't expect that (the need for alone time) would ever change, but it did, as my thoughts and attitude changed. Once I really stepped into being a mom, and stopped being the needy child of MY mom, something got filled up in me. I'm not saying that's what's going on with you - I'm sharing the process I went through.

I'm thinking of a time that Seth, my youngest, was quite small. I think it was before he was walking a lot, so right at a year, maybe? I used to get up very early in the mornings, and that was MY time. I could have peace, and not worry about anyone else. Seth's sleep schedule changed, and suddenly, he was waking up around 5 in the morning - fully awake, not able to be peaced down to sleep again. At first, I was grumpy: this was MY time! Then, I shifted my attitude to acceptance, and appreciation followed. We'd hang out together on the couch, and watch the birds come to the bird feeder. We'd read, or play with Duplo blocks. It became a very special time in my day, and I still remember those early mornings fondly.

They are young for such a short time. I have more than enough time for me time, now, my sons are 18 and 11. The things I wanted to get done in those early-morning alone times are still things I want to get done, nearly every day, but the time we had to create the relationship we have is fleeting. The dishes will always be there, my one-year-old son is now 11. You know when people say, "You can't get that time back"? You really can't.

peace,
Caren

plaidpanties666

"Sarah" <yahoo@...> wrote:
>what they like to do at the moment is to go up to bed around the same time as they used to... and have cuddles and stories... And then come down to watch a bit of telly/play quiet games. Later on they like to be carried up to bed
******************

What about moving the tv or adding a tv in the bedroom so there isn't the double transition thing going on? Alternately, what about making up beds wherever the tv is?

As kids get older they will sleep less and the specific times will shift around a bit, so to some extent what you're dealing with is just part of living with children - they change more than adults do, and with three you'll be juggling three different levels of development plus whatever social effects between their personalities. So getting used to what they're doing *right now* is maybe less important that getting used to the idea that things will keep on changing.

> It's only that I'm missing my evenings and I think I need to work out how to relax without getting bedtime 'done'. I've never been good at winding down until I've finished my mental to-do list.
*************

Something I did when my kids were younger was to "get things done" earlier in the day. I'm not a night person, so it was less stressful to me to know that after dinner all I really needed to do was be good company.

Is there another time of day when you can relax? Washing dishes is one of my times to relax, as odd as that may sound. I get to have some time to myself and this time of year I get to put my hands in warm water for awhile, which is also nice. Once I realized that washing the dishes was something I could benefit from on a personal level I started adding to the experience - I buy dishwashing soaps that I like to smell, I have nice little rugs in front of the sink, some of which I've made, I make myself tea and eat cookies and sometimes play nice music. Its not the sit-down-and-put-my-feet-up type of relaxation I used to expect, but it has become one of the ways I take care of myself with the added benefit of doing something for the rest of the family, too.

---Meredith

k

I had one child at 38. I knew from the beginning that it would be unlikely
I'd have more, for several reasons.

I still very much love having time for myself. Over the years (Karl is now
7) I realized I don't want to miss time with my child. He is growing and he
is going. Soon. "He's already half-way to 14." I remind me and Brian of that
from time to time.

At first I didn't know what to do. I had forgotten how to play. I re-learned
some things about that. I read on this list and other unschooling lists
about mothers really looking at their child/ren. I learned some things about
that and started doing it. I noticed the things Karl was exploring and
learning. That kind of looking at --and really noticing-- my child has built
our relationship so that I have developed a NEED inside of me to look at him
and really see him. Some parents don't do that. Instead they remain
preoccupied with things like adult time, and beyond the super-saturated
demand of infancy and toddlerhood, many parents don't develop their
relationship muscles very much.

Here's a humorous graph that Sandra drew for people who seemed doubtful
about parent/child relationships and adult time.
http://sandradodd.com/howto/precisely

~Katherine





On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Sarah <yahoo@...> wrote:

> I think you're right, and it may well get worse first! Actually this
> evening I'm feeling much less bothered than I did last night... More
> sanguine. Still any cunning plans on how to adjust and adapt would be
> welcome.
>
> Sarah
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

k

>>>Is there another time of day when you can relax? Washing dishes is one of
my times to relax, as odd as that may sound. I get to have some time to
myself and this time of year I get to put my hands in warm water for awhile,
which is also nice. Once I realized that washing the dishes was something I
could benefit from on a personal level I started adding to the experience -
I buy dishwashing soaps that I like to smell, I have nice little rugs in
front of the sink, some of which I've made, I make myself tea and eat
cookies and sometimes play nice music. Its not the
sit-down-and-put-my-feet-up type of relaxation I used to expect, but it has
become one of the ways I take care of myself with the added benefit of doing
something for the rest of the family, too.<<<

When Karl was born I could have convinced myself to skip my Calgon time.
Instead I just took Karl with me to the bath. When he got older and way too
big for both of us in our little old-fashioned tub, I missed our bath time
but he took to baths playing with about a bazillion toys. Sometimes he
wanted a bath several times a day. We don't have a pool and eventually Karl
got the idea to wear swim trunks in the bath. I added beach toys. That was a
funny time and didn't last long and it was back to trunkless bathing once
again. Then the tub drain broke and we moved on to showers. Hopefully we'll
get the tub functional soon.

When Karl was little, we were given a sling which fit over the shoulder
(Over the Shoulder Boulder Holder was our nickname for it). I couldn't wear
it comfortably. We eventually got a backpack baby carrier and later on a
HugaBub wrap carrier. These carriers were to accommodate my desire for twice
daily walks around our huge field which I at first took early in the morning
as Karl continued sleeping and during Karl's mid day naps. Karl stayed
asleep while I took a turn in the field, checking on him between laps. Once
I got comfortable carriers, I walked later in the day after Karl wakened and
took him with me. Eventually he wanted to walk too and alternated that with
being carried. And now the carriers are out of the picture, the field seems
too small and we started walking to town.

I love drinking herbal teas. When I had Karl I made many a cuppa to keep up
my fluids while breastfeeding because I don't love water drinking very much.
It became a way that I could relax too. I drank cooled down herbal teas in
the summer. Karl likes teas but nothing like I do and this may never change
or it might become something he enjoys too. He loves coffee-milk (latte). My
latest thing is spicy Chais.

Notice the things you like and, if your child/ren enjoy them too. If they
do, find ways to include them and make changes as needed.

~Katherine


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sarah

Thanks for all this. I think I've been relying more than I knew on the time I had in the evening to refresh me for a new day. I don't necessarily need time alone, or time away from my children, but I do need something to do that for me- washing up isn't actually such a bad idea ;) I quite enjoy the warm water.

I never smoked, but a friend who gave up said that she did it by working out what each cigarette of the day meant to her, and replacing it with something else. Like a grapefruit for breakfast to wake her up, instead of the wake-up cigarette.

I think I need to replace my quiet alone-ish time with something else that can represent the end of a busy day. Time alone, or doing grown-up things like watching TV with scary bits, is a short cut but there will be something else that will do the job. I might try something like taking an evening walk, if the snow holds off, or... Well, I'll have a think.

Sarah

--- In [email protected], k <katherand@...> wrote:
>
> >>>Is there another time of day when you can relax? Washing dishes is one of
> my times to relax, as odd as that may sound. I get to have some time to
> myself and this time of year I get to put my hands in warm water for awhile,
> which is also nice. Once I realized that washing the dishes was something I
> could benefit from on a personal level I started adding to the experience -
> I buy dishwashing soaps that I like to smell, I have nice little rugs in
> front of the sink, some of which I've made, I make myself tea and eat
> cookies and sometimes play nice music. Its not the
> sit-down-and-put-my-feet-up type of relaxation I used to expect, but it has
> become one of the ways I take care of myself with the added benefit of doing
> something for the rest of the family, too.<<<
>
> When Karl was born I could have convinced myself to skip my Calgon time.
> Instead I just took Karl with me to the bath. When he got older and way too
> big for both of us in our little old-fashioned tub, I missed our bath time
> but he took to baths playing with about a bazillion toys. Sometimes he
> wanted a bath several times a day. We don't have a pool and eventually Karl
> got the idea to wear swim trunks in the bath. I added beach toys. That was a
> funny time and didn't last long and it was back to trunkless bathing once
> again. Then the tub drain broke and we moved on to showers. Hopefully we'll
> get the tub functional soon.
>

diana jenner

don't forget audio books! You can have an earbud in while you're walking
the baby, still get Dexter (the novels are delish!), and still feel like
you're available if your snoozy boys need you <3 Both earbuds could give
you the escape you need during your off-duty moments ;)
~diana :)
xoxoxoxo
hannahbearski.wordpress.com
hannahsashes.blogspot.com


On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 3:03 PM, Sarah <yahoo@...> wrote:

>
>
> Thanks for all this. I think I've been relying more than I knew on the time
> I had in the evening to refresh me for a new day. I don't necessarily need
> time alone, or time away from my children, but I do need something to do
> that for me- washing up isn't actually such a bad idea ;) I quite enjoy the
> warm water.
>
> I never smoked, but a friend who gave up said that she did it by working
> out what each cigarette of the day meant to her, and replacing it with
> something else. Like a grapefruit for breakfast to wake her up, instead of
> the wake-up cigarette.
>
> I think I need to replace my quiet alone-ish time with something else that
> can represent the end of a busy day. Time alone, or doing grown-up things
> like watching TV with scary bits, is a short cut but there will be something
> else that will do the job. I might try something like taking an evening
> walk, if the snow holds off, or... Well, I'll have a think.
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]