Sandra Dodd

-=-But yet I have learn to unschool by accepting his obsession, and not
limit it. I just let him get on with it and let it naturally exhaust
itself. -=-

Was it in this forum or on the FamilyRUNing site that someone was
talking about video game interest running its course, or him finally
losing interest?

I'd like to have that quote, if someone remembers where it was.

Is the idea that an interest will peak and then fade a school thing?
Like "the class is over" or "he'll grow out of it" or what? Or is it
a human-nature thing that existed before school? Seriously, I've
never thought much about it, but lately I've started to notice that
it seems people's goal or expectation for their kids is that they're
in a phase and will grow out of whatever it is.

Some interests and curiosities and obsessions do live and die a
natural death. Some don't.

I have a page started for hobbies and obsessions, and I'm thinking
I'd like to add commentary on this idea there.

Do you (any of you) have examples in your lives, or that you've seen
in others', of interests that came and went, and some that stayed?
And what about "finish what you start"? And what about product
people vs. process people?

http://sandradodd.com/focus

Sandra






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelli Traaseth

***Was it in this forum or on the FamilyRUNing site that someone was

talking about video game interest running its course, or him finally

losing interest?

Is the idea that an interest will peak and then fade a school thing?

Like "the class is over" or "he'll grow out of it" or what? Or is it

a human-nature thing that existed before school? Seriously, I've

never thought much about it, but lately I've started to notice that

it seems people's goal or expectation for their kids is that they're

in a phase and will grow out of whatever it is.****

This is sometimes why I don't like the thoughts around deschooling because not everyone does stop playing a lot of video games.  Or how about if someone loved painting, would we be holding our breaths until she/he stopped painting and be so happy that they are doing something else? 

I think that people will sometimes think that while deschooling a child will play lots of video games or watch lots of TV and then when they do stop doing those things it means their done deschooling.  Not necessarily so.   And in my opinion it's usually the adults who need the deschooling.

I don't mean to confuse people who are new to unschooling but for me.. getting unschooling was more about helping my kids do what they like to do.  Sometimes it meant that they'd be interested in one thing for  a long time, but other times they'd move on to other things too.  My daughters will do lots of stuff at one time but my son will often do more of a hyper focus on something.  He's very thorough in anything he does.  I'm not worried about Alec, my son, who likes to play a lot of video games because he's happy and engaged.  He's Alec.. and I'm going to help him (when he wants the help ;) to be the Alec that he feels he wants and needs to be.  :)



Kelli~
  http://ourjoyfullife.blogspot.com/%c2%a0

"There are no ordinary moments."  Dan Millman,  Peaceful Warrior





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

graberamy

> Do you (any of you) have examples in your lives, or that you've seen
> in others', of interests that came and went, and some that stayed? >>>

Well, I don't like to call them obsessions (not that you did but the
OP), I like to call them interest or passions. Obsession seems so
negative.

My daughters passion right now is cheerleading and cooking (baking,
more specifically). Both of those have been passions for years, when
she gets older she wants to coach and own a bakery. She's only 11 so
that may change but they sure do make her happy right now.

Graham (9) is really into horror movies right now. Some may say
obsessed! It's a new passion and so fun to watch. I know many
mainstream parents would be appalled but I'm just delighted watching
him so absorbed in something. The last time I saw him this into
something was with guitar hero...and now he's playing electric guitar
and saxaphone. Maybe all this horror movie watching will spark a movie
making interest, a writing path (he wrote his 1st "book"...The
Halloween kidnapper), film editing (his eye for detail amazes me...he
noticed Michael Myers fingernail length!), haunted house building
(we're doing one in our basement this week), writing theme music (he
learned the theme from Halloween on the guitar). The list could go on!

Instead of looking at passions as fleeting moments, I try to look at
them as stepping stones. It may seem like you'er done with a
hobby/interest/obsession but perhaps one will come back to it or use
what they've learned from it...

I tend to get a bit more anxious when they're not "obsessing" about
something. Like OMG, I'm not inspiring them!lol

amy g
iowa

Pamela Sorooshian

On Oct 28, 2008, at 10:01 AM, Kelli Traaseth wrote:

> Or how about if someone loved painting, would we be holding our
> breaths until she/he stopped painting and be so happy that they are
> doing something else?

I know LOTS of parents holding their breath, hoping their child will
lose interest in musical theater! It isn't a life that most parents
dream of for their kids - they feel like the kids are dooming
themselves to a lifetime of waiting tables and living in cockroach-
infested, dark, cold studio apartments in NYC or living from hotel
room to hotel room and eating at Denny's.

(Oh yeah - and pursuing what they LOVE!!)

-pam

Pamela Sorooshian

On Oct 28, 2008, at 10:18 AM, graberamy wrote:

> Instead of looking at passions as fleeting moments, I try to look at
> them as stepping stones. It may seem like you'er done with a
> hobby/interest/obsession but perhaps one will come back to it or use
> what they've learned from it...

Right!!

I can't imagine that time spent focused on anything is ever "wasted"
time.

About 14 years ago, my husband thought homeschooling was going to be
one of MY temporary passions.

-pam

Robyn L. Coburn

<<<< I know LOTS of parents holding their breath, hoping their child will
> lose interest in musical theater! >>>>

Good heavens! Lose "interest" in theater? Don't they know it's a *calling*?

There's no business like show business, like no business I know.
Everything about is appealing, everything the traffic will allow.
Nowhere can you get that happy feeling, like when you're stealing that extra
bow.
There's no people like show people, they smile when they are low.
Even with the turkey that you know will fold,
You'll all be stranded out in the cold,
Still you wouldn't change it for a sack of gold.
Let's go on with the show.

(Annie Get Your Gun)

Just writing out the words sends me into tears.

When I first went to college after graduating valedictorian (called dux in
Australia) I made the crazy plan to study science under a perceived pressure
to "do something with my brain". Of all the elder influences in my life my
mother was shocked and disappointed. She fully expected me to go into the
family business - theater - which I had been announcing would be my life
since I was three. She was baffled, and for once she was right!

One tragic semester later, I was out of science and back to my real love.
Phew!

Here's what else I love - Aretha Franklin, who must be in her 60's, on The
View yesterday talking about how she has just started learning classical
piano and to sing opera because she is always interested in learning new
things. There's someone whose fascination with music never want away!


Robyn L. Coburn
www.Iggyjingles.etsy.com
www.iggyjingles.blogspot.com

John and Amanda Slater

--- On Tue, 10/28/08, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:











-=-But yet I have learn to unschool by accepting his obsession, and not

limit it. I just let him get on with it and let it naturally exhaust

itself. -=-



Was it in this forum or on the FamilyRUNing site that someone was

talking about video game interest running its course, or him finally

losing interest?
****It was on the RUNning site.******Do you (any of you) have examples in your lives, or that you've seen

in others', of interests that came and went, and some that stayed?

And what about "finish what you start"? And what about product

people vs. process people?*********

My boys are Samuel 5 and Eli 7.  They seem to be "obessed" with one type of toy at a time.  When Eli was 1 1/2 and Samuel 1 month.  They recieved their first Thomas the train set.  They played almost exclusively with Thomas for about 4 years.  All gifts were trains, and we had a track set up at all times.  There were short bursts where they played with other toys, but mostly just trains. 

When Eli was about 6 they switched to wanting to play Legos.  Now it is all Legos, with occasionally some other toy.  Our train room is now switched to a Lego room.  We have not yet moved the trains to storage, although it is rare they are played with. 

The great thing about Legos is they can bring in short term interests to their play.  When they watch a new movie, they often create the vehicles out of Legos.  They are now interested in Pokemon and so make Pokemon out of their legos.  They are able to take the legos and use them to explore lots of temporary interests. 

I suppose I really encourage this focus.  Both of their passions have been somewhat open ended and each boy can do it their own way.  Samuel is much more relationship centered.  He has people or trains talk to each other and normally has an elaborate story line.  Eli is a more concrete thinker ans uses the same materials to build, create, and put things in motion.  In both cases my dh and I have learned all we could about their interests and supported it to the best of our ability.  
AmandaEli 7, Samuel 5 (6 in 8 days)























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jenny C

> Was it in this forum or on the FamilyRUNing site that someone was
> talking about video game interest running its course, or him finally
> losing interest?
>
> I'd like to have that quote, if someone remembers where it was.
>

I'm pretty sure it was the FamilyRUNing site since I was directly
involved in that conversation...

Maybe this? : "In July, my then 11 year old began playing video games
for several hours a day. It bothered my husband, but I said, "This too
shall pass." In August, for his 12th birthday, he got two video games
(one he bought himself) and then our precious son became lost to the
Wii. I still said, "This too shall pass.""


> Is the idea that an interest will peak and then fade a school thing?
> Like "the class is over" or "he'll grow out of it" or what? Or is it
> a human-nature thing that existed before school? Seriously, I've
> never thought much about it, but lately I've started to notice that
> it seems people's goal or expectation for their kids is that they're
> in a phase and will grow out of whatever it is.
>

I first noticed this thinking when my oldest was 4 and really into
Pokemon. Parents all around me were dismissing their child's love of
Pokemon and looking forward to them moving on to the next big fad.

I didn't like it then and I still don't like that thinking. I loved my
daughter's interest in Pokemon. It evolved into other things
eventually, but it is in part what makes her the person she is today.
Out of ALL of her toys that she had when she was younger, it is the one
things she won't get rid of at all. She's kept most of her stuffed
animals, but even some of those she's let go, but the Pokemon stuff is
in a special box up in her closet. She won't even get rid of the old
game boy and game boy games that are Pokemon.

I also greatly object to calling my children's interests "phases". I've
thought about that a lot because I have a hard time puting my finger on
why it bothers me so much. I don't like it in reference to things my
kids are interested in or in how they behave.

Chamille's interest in Pokemon led to everything else that she's ever
been interested in, anime, manga, magical adventures, pet care, love of
animals, video games, computer stuff, costumes, make-up, literally
everything can be traced back to Pokemon!


> Some interests and curiosities and obsessions do live and die a
> natural death. Some don't.
>


EXACTLY!

Sandra Dodd

-=-I still said, "This too shall pass."-=-

That was it! Thank you very much for finding it.

In the longer view, everything passes away, and we'll all be dead
someday, but that's kind of extreme "this too shall pass."

Assuming I'm going to live for a week or a year or a decade, I'd like
to do it with some joy and acceptance of what my kids and husband and
I are finding amusing or fascinating.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kim H

<<This is sometimes why I don't like the thoughts around deschooling because not everyone does stop playing a lot of video games. Or how about if someone loved painting, would we be holding our breaths until she/he stopped painting and be so happy that they are doing something else?>>

I've also had the same concerns and it does seem to come from people's fear of TV, video games and computers.

My son has interests that he's had since he was 3 or 4 (he's now almost 9). His biggest one is marine life. It started with sharks (they are still one of his favourite things in life) and then grew and grew to an interest in all sea life. He is at his most content when his face is down looking into a rockpool, bucket and net close by, searching for sea creatures. He just loves it. He talks about wanting to be a marine biologist and also owning a salt water aquarium when he's older. Other interests have come and gone. Others still are put on the shelf for awhile and then brought back when his interest is renewed by seeing it somewhere else (TV, shops etc) or talking about it with someone. I know this is what many unschoolers find in their children and themselves.

I feel like my son's interests have the potential to be life long because he has the freedom to go with them or drop them like a hot potato which ever he chooses to do. When our kids get the freedom to have unlimited stimulation/exposure to an interest they can take it to a level that others, unfortunately can't due to time restrictions and schedules. Whether they take their interests right through life or not doesn't really matter though of course, my point is that they can if they want to and noone's going to be pushing them to try something else or balance themselves with other things or whatever it is many parents seem to feel they need to do to 'make' their kids be the people they want them to become.

The other thing I feel is that when we stop looking at our kids and what they do through schooly glasses, we're no longer concerned about how long they've been interested in something, or how much time they've spent doing something but rather we're in there with them, their passion leaking onto us and giving us abit of that passion too. It just becomes life and living not some thing they're doing to because it's good for them or because they'll need it when they're an adult or whatever other reason school says kids should do things.

I love this about unschooling - the boxing in of learning gradually dissapates to nothingness and life is just what it is, free of subjects and rigid boxes of controlled learning. Interests can be seen as school subjects - something we do when we've got the time to do them or when someones else says we've got time because we've done all the other really important things we had to do during the day.Or, for unschoolers, interests become part of the fabric of each day, blending in and out, weaving their magic throughout our day as equal to living us as breathing and eating are. No need then to think about the 'role interests play' or where might our kids take the interests or when will they have enough of this and move onto something else. This kind of thinking doesn't enter the equation anymore.

Kim H




----- Original Message -----
From: Kelli Traaseth
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 4:01 AM
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] obsessions dying off?


***Was it in this forum or on the FamilyRUNing site that someone was

talking about video game interest running its course, or him finally

losing interest?

Is the idea that an interest will peak and then fade a school thing?

Like "the class is over" or "he'll grow out of it" or what? Or is it

a human-nature thing that existed before school? Seriously, I've

never thought much about it, but lately I've started to notice that

it seems people's goal or expectation for their kids is that they're

in a phase and will grow out of whatever it is.****

This is sometimes why I don't like the thoughts around deschooling because not everyone does stop playing a lot of video games. Or how about if someone loved painting, would we be holding our breaths until she/he stopped painting and be so happy that they are doing something else?

I think that people will sometimes think that while deschooling a child will play lots of video games or watch lots of TV and then when they do stop doing those things it means their done deschooling. Not necessarily so. And in my opinion it's usually the adults who need the deschooling.

I don't mean to confuse people who are new to unschooling but for me.. getting unschooling was more about helping my kids do what they like to do. Sometimes it meant that they'd be interested in one thing for a long time, but other times they'd move on to other things too. My daughters will do lots of stuff at one time but my son will often do more of a hyper focus on something. He's very thorough in anything he does. I'm not worried about Alec, my son, who likes to play a lot of video games because he's happy and engaged. He's Alec.. and I'm going to help him (when he wants the help ;) to be the Alec that he feels he wants and needs to be. :)

Kelli~
http://ourjoyfullife.blogspot.com/

"There are no ordinary moments." Dan Millman, Peaceful Warrior

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

DaBreeze21

--=Some interests and curiosities and obsessions do live and die a
natural death. Some don't.

I have a page started for hobbies and obsessions, and I'm thinking
I'd like to add commentary on this idea there.

Do you (any of you) have examples in your lives, or that you've seen
in others', of interests that came and went, and some that stayed?==-

When I started reading about unschooling 9 months ago or so, I was
definitely completely and totally obsessed. I was consumed! The amount
of time that I spend now each day (and night!) reading has diminished,
but it cycles and I believe that this is one interest that I will
never lose now!

Other obsessions of mine, birth (giving birth, birth in the US, the
process, the controversy etc. etc.) and I am definitely obsessed with
my daughter! :-)

I guess that people think that when something "consumes" you or your
energy and you seem unable to do other things that it is not
"healthy". I don't know if it is personality or what, but I know that
I can get deeply into something -- especially reading about things
that interest me. Or maybe it is just a style difference, maybe some
people binge and then take breaks, while others take in small amounts
at a time? I don't know, I'm kind of "thinking out loud". It does seem
to me that it is another example of how we are all different though.
And it reminds me of the discussion of TV and how someone pointed out
that people often say that TV "mesmerizes" children (people?), but if
it were a book or another "worthy" activity the description would be
different, like immersed or focused...

Susan

Ren Allen

~~< I know LOTS of parents holding their breath, hoping their child will
> lose interest in musical theater! >>>>

Good heavens! Lose "interest" in theater? Don't they know it's a
*calling*?~~


Gawd yes.
Kinda like my parents wishing I weren't fascinated with fashion and
makeup. They probably prayed I would stop having "wordly" interests.
Here I am at almost 40, still trying to build my makeup artistry
portfolio and get into films! If I'd had the trust and support I
needed....well heck, I can't even go there.

Anyhoo, I love fashion and film and makeup and all of it. It IS a calling.

Ren

Sandra Dodd

-=-Or maybe it is just a style difference, maybe some
people binge and then take breaks, while others take in small amounts
at a time? I don't know, I'm kind of "thinking out loud".-=-

I binge. But I also "putz." Some of my best days, I pick something
up to put it where it goes, and when I get there I remember I wanted
to turn the water on in the back yard, and when I turn it on I see
some trash near the back, and when I take it to put it in the hot tub
stove, I remember the towels are still in the dryer and Marty will
need them, and when I'm at the dryer I notice it's time to change the
kitty litter box, and that might go on for hours and hours. It
doesn't bother me. I like it. And though I'm unlikely to remember
to turn the sprinkler off, Keith will turn it off and not get mad at
me, and also nobody will be surprised if instead of wandering from
task to task like a crazed pollinating bee, I hunker down and do one
thing for hours and hours--sewing, or working on web pages, or
cleaning a room I didn't even plan to clean. <g>



Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Verna

--- In [email protected], "Kim H" <kimlewismark@...> wrote:
>
> <<This is sometimes why I don't like the thoughts around deschooling
because not everyone does stop playing a lot of video games. Or how
about if someone loved painting, would we be holding our breaths until
she/he stopped painting and be so happy that they are doing something
else?>>
>
> I've also had the same concerns and it does seem to come from
people's fear of TV, video games and computers.
>
Several months back my 6 year old asked me to get him somemore
geomags. He wanted to build an eifle tower. I found some on clearence
and bought alot. He played around with it a little. and put it aside.
A week or two later I asked him if he had been playing with them. He
said a little but he was into such and such now. I said ok and started
to go do something else. and he said, "you know, sometimes I get really
into things and that is all I do and then I am not into so much any
more and I do something else for awhile. Most of the time I come back
to the other thing later but usually not for as long".

graberamy

> I binge. But I also "putz." Some of my best days, I pick something
> up to put it where it goes, and when I get there I remember I wanted
> to turn the water on in the back yard, and when I turn it on I see
> some trash near the back, and when I take it to put it in the hot tub
> stove, I remember the towels are still in the dryer and Marty will
> need them, and when I'm at the dryer I notice it's time to change the
> kitty litter box, and that might go on for hours and hours. It
> doesn't bother me. I like it. And though I'm unlikely to remember
> to turn the sprinkler off, Keith will turn it off and not get mad at
> me, and also nobody will be surprised if instead of wandering from
> task to task like a crazed pollinating bee, I hunker down and do one
> thing for hours and hours--sewing, or working on web pages, or
> cleaning a room I didn't even plan to clean. <g>>>>

It reminds me of, If you give a mouse a cookie...

I find myself doing the same type of thing. An hour or so later I
remember what I originally set out to do!! bwg

Right now, we're sewing costumes, designing a haunted house, and
planning a Halloween party...! My mom (navy wife who needs everything
orderly) told me I need to write a book, How to be comfortable in
chaos! Cause I am!

amy g
iowa
>

Sandra Dodd

-=-My mom (navy wife who needs everything
orderly) told me I need to write a book, How to be comfortable in
chaos! Cause I am!-=-

Let's talk about that!

I think "flexible and open" and others say "chaos."

Last night Keith and I were working on jigsaw puzzles and watching
the McNeill Lehrer report (political commentary on the public
broadcast system) and BBC world news in the background. And we were
talking some. Then there was a PBS show about someone with some
connective tissue missing from his brain, from birth, and his
interpersonal problems, and about several psychological studies about
how people perceive (or fail to perceive) facial cues, and all. I
never knew exactly what the show was, but I didn't care. Then Keith
went to do something else, and a show in Mendelbrat and fractal
geometry came on, and I finished the puzzles by myself (we had three
matching mixed-up ones we were doing at the same time).

When the puzzles were done, I moved over closer to the TV and really
listened to the rest of that show, wishing it would get boring. It
got more and more interesting. It was about patterns that had seemed
to be chaotic or ungraphable and inexplicable, but there were artists
who had seen and reproduced them before, just hadn't "named" them
(and hadn't been scientists, so what they did was discounted anyway,
until Mandelbrot started figuring out the patterns. And from the
1970s to recently, he was reviled by other mathematicians, too.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/fractals/

There's that. I LOVED that show.

I didn't mean to watch it. It just was one of the things that
happened into my path without planning, but now I have more dots to
connect, and now I know more about how cellphones work, and computer
graphics, and 19th century Japanese art showing waves of water, and
clouds, and what they never mentioned but they didn't need to was
mandala art and paisley weaving and other patterns-within-patterns
things in my own memory and experience.

Is "chaos" sometimes a dismissive term for "flow"? If it can't be
graphed onto a by-the-hour schedule, then is it "chaos"?

Last night I DID have an hour-by-hour schedule (looking back, since I
watched TV from 6:00 to 10:00--very unusual for me), but I was also
working puzzles and talking to Keith (part of the time, and during
the commercials of Eli Stone, which is also, in a way, about finding
patterns, and about interpersonals).



Ah. The other show was this:

7:00PM - 8:00PM, KNME (5)
Curious : "Mind Brain Machine"
Conclusion. A look at the world of scientific research, including
scientists exploring brain functions, and a group studying flies in
hopes of improvi…
http://www.thirteen.org/curious/episodes/watch-the-full-episode-mind-
brain-machine/

For those who might wonder where my kids were, Marty was at work (but
I had talked to him before he left, and later on the phone), I had
spoken with Kirby twice earlier in the day, and Holly was in the next
room watching a movie with her boyfriend, Brett. Holly and I had
made food and we all had plates where we were--Keith and I at the
puzzle table, and she and Brett at another table in the front room.
"Chaos" didn't extend to our social lives, just to our learning lives
(maybe).

Sandra

John and Amanda Slater

--- On Tue, 10/28/08, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:











-=-But yet I have learn to unschool by accepting his obsession, and not

limit it. I just let him get on with it and let it naturally exhaust

itself. -=-



*****I have experienced my boys obession with TV turn into something they like to do.  For the first several years I heavily controlled the amount of TV the boys watched.  When we learned about whole life unschooling I realized that I was only making the TV more exciting by limiting it so much.  About the same time I got sick (not terribly sick, but a lingering cold/sinus infection) and spent 3 weeks on the couch.  My boys watched PBS from 6:00 am to 6:00 pm for all three weeks.  They hardly even ate or moved.  I would say they spent most of the summer watching no matter what other things were going on in the house. 

Now we are about two years past that point.  The boys still really enjoy watching movies.  They still have the TV on several times a day.  But now they tend to have it on in the background as they play.  They might watch most of something the first time, and after that only glance at the TV when they know they like the scene.  If a TV is on in a public place or friend's house, they might watch it and might not.  If it is not a good time to watch, I can offer to find the show or movie on Netflix and they can normally move on. 

I feel that when I had limited their TV watching they just wanted to watch all they could.  It was as if they could not control themselves.  It was almost impossible to get their attention when it was on, even if it was not something they were very interested in.  Since removing the controls and them being able to watch as much as they wanted, they are now much more in control of their viewing.  It has because a choice among many, not the be all, end all of entertainment.  
AmandaEli 7, Samuel 6 in 7 days





















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

I don't know if this is important or not, but it might be helpful to
some people:

The author of the lines below went on to write "It has because a
choice among many, not the be all, end all of entertainment." So I
know it's not seen as a "control" thing anymore, but a choice, but
before that, two phrases seemed to match too closely:


-=-For the first several years I heavily controlled the amount of TV
the boys watched. -=-

-=-Since removing the controls and them being able to watch as much
as they wanted, they are now much more in control of their viewing.-=-



Maybe "control" is a word to consider avoiding, now that it's choices
and not controls. Are they "in control" of their viewing? Does it
need to be controlled?



Sandra







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-Or how about if someone loved painting, would we be holding our
breaths until she/he stopped painting and be so happy that they are
doing something else? -=-

Or reading. Or sewing. Or taking care of their own cars.

-=-I think that people will sometimes think that while deschooling a
child will play lots of video games or watch lots of TV and then when
they do stop doing those things it means their done deschooling.-=-

Because my kids were never restrained around TV and games, they play
when they really want to, and when they don't want to, they don't.
Marty is buying a new game today (something coming out new, but I
forget what) so he was antsy about working two shifts. He's going
out between them to buy the game. He works again tomorrow morning,
so I'm sure he'll play the game for a couple of hours when he gets
home and then turn it off and go to sleep. But as soon as he has 24
hours or more without a work shift coming up, I'm sure he'll lose
himself in the game for many hours. I'll take him food.

Brett's team of 25 "beat the game" last night on WoW. I bet that
doesn't mean they'll stop playing WoW.

I've gone through phases of playing my guitar a lot, but in the past
few years I haven't much. It's not that I'm through with guitar
forever, it's that other things have earned my attention, and it
wasn't as easy to do when I had little kids. I did a lot of
calligraphy for a while. Now I find empty bottles of ink dried up
here and there. So it's been a while, but still when I need to do
some lettering, I have the supplies and the knowledge.

I have no doubt at all that all the little tricks, tools and trivia
Holly and Marty are picking up will continue to make them more
creative and resourceful their whole lives.

Marty used to like Bionicles and transformers. When he got a jeep it
was simple for him to take the hard top off when he needed to, and
the zipper was broken on the canvas top, and he figured out how to
take that off too, with very little effort.

When Holly first played with Shrinky Dinks (recently) she was
bringing in all kinds of things she knew from other kinds of projects.

Perhaps the obsession to appreciate and encourage would be an
obsession with learning all the time, and with living happily.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

John and Amanda Slater

--- On Wed, 10/29/08, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:











I don't know if this is important or not, but it might be helpful to

some people:



The author of the lines below went on to write "It has because a

choice among many, not the be all, end all of entertainment. " So I

know it's not seen as a "control" thing anymore, but a choice, but

before that, two phrases seemed to match too closely:



-=-For the first several years I heavily controlled the amount of TV

the boys watched. -=-



-=-Since removing the controls and them being able to watch as much

as they wanted, they are now much more in control of their viewing.-=-



Maybe "control" is a word to consider avoiding, now that it's choices

and not controls. Are they "in control" of their viewing? Does it

need to be controlled?


****Since I wrote it I will respond here.  Maybe a better choice of words would have been "exercise restraint" rather than control.  For example, we have a neighbor that Samuel likes to play with.  Tyler (our neighbor) does not like to watch TV, or at least not what my boys watch.  He gets very destructive when he is in the room when the boys are watching.  So we have talked to Samuel about not watching when Tyler is here.  Previously this would have been a problem.  Now Samuel knows that Tyler can only play on Saturdays and chooses to leave the TV and play with him.  Otherwise Tyler has to leave.  Complicating the problem, Eli does not like Tyler at all, mostly because he is destructive.  So we have worked out that one adult sits with Eli and watches and plays, so he is not left alone.  And one adult sits with Tyler and Sam and tries to keep everyone and everything safe.  (And we are all happy Tyler can only play on Saturdays.)  But the key
to this solution is that Samuel needs to be okay that the TV is on and he is not watching. 

Thanks for pointing out my word choice.  I am still working on having my actions and thoughts reflect my ideals.
AmandaEli 7, Samuel 6 in 7 days

























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Margaret

That's something I've heard people say a lot when talking about a
behavior that they are having a hard time enduring... remembering that
your child won't always be waking up to nurse every few hours, for
example, can make it easier to handle. I can see it being helpful in
that context, but using it for a child's interest does seem very
negative.

As for interests, I do think it is likely that many will fade away but
I don't think this is negative. My daughter's most recent interest is
in tiny people which started with her wondering what would happen if
she shrunk. We've been having fun watching some neat TV shows and
movies and reading some books as well as chatting about it from time
to time. I was looking online and found a list on amazon of books
about tiny people. I showed it to my husband and he asked if I was
going to buy some of those for Christmas for her. I said that no, I
had been planning to get them from the library now as I didn't know if
she would still be interested in them at Christmas.... so I think that
it can be good to recognize that an interest may be temporary so that
you can do what you can NOW to support it.

My son has an interest in music that I don't think will fade because
of the strength of his interest and that it keeps popping up in
different forms. That one is easier for me to recognize and it makes
it easier to think of new things that might interest him. My
daughter's interest in little people is harder to fit with past
interests. Perhaps it does fit in and I just don't see it yet.
Perhaps it is the beginning of a long interest in little people.
Perhaps it will be a springboard to other interests. Perhaps she will
be interested in them for a short time and then never again. Any of
these things are fine and no matter which one it is, I should do what
I can to support her interest right now.


On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 2:08 PM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
> -=-I still said, "This too shall pass."-=-
>
> That was it! Thank you very much for finding it.
>
> In the longer view, everything passes away, and we'll all be dead
> someday, but that's kind of extreme "this too shall pass."
>
> Assuming I'm going to live for a week or a year or a decade, I'd like
> to do it with some joy and acceptance of what my kids and husband and
> I are finding amusing or fascinating.
>
> Sandra

Sandra Dodd

-=-Maybe a better choice of words would have been "exercise
restraint" rather than control. -=-

It still sounds like making choices to me.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

guideforthree

=====Some of my best days, I pick something up to put it where it goes,
and when I get there I remember I wanted to turn the water on in the
back yard, and when I turn it on I see some trash near the back, and
when I take it to put it in the hot tub stove, I remember the towels
are still in the dryer.....====

If You Give a Mouse a Cookie....

There is a reason I love that book. At least one portion of every day
goes like this for me.

Tina

John and Amanda Slater

--- On Wed, 10/29/08, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:











-=-Maybe a better choice of words would have been "exercise

restraint" rather than control. -=-



It still sounds like making choices to me.



***
Thinking about it, you are right.  It just feels so much BIGGER than that.  It has taken us so long to get to this point, and I spent so many years denying it even existed. 

AmandaEli 7, Samuel 6 in 7 days





















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Joyce Fetteroll

On Oct 29, 2008, at 12:04 PM, Sandra Dodd wrote:

> -=-Maybe a better choice of words would have been "exercise
> restraint" rather than control. -=-
>
> It still sounds like making choices to me.

Both "in control" and "exercise restraint" suggest power over
something that has power, or some pull they have the power to fight
against.

Kat turned off the TV when she was done watching, not because there
was an emotional pull to continue that her head overcame. Same with me.

Same with Carl. Sometimes, just with anything like a book, the
computer, trimming bushes, sometimes there's something else you want
to do and there is a pull to continue doing what you're doing. But we
shouldn't see overcoming a desire for more as the goal for kids
handling TV (and candy and video games and books) in general. The
goal is for kids to feel they don't need to grasp as much as they can
in the moment for fear that it won't be available later. The goal is
for them to feel as comfortable turning the TV off when they're done
as they do setting down a book they've finished.

Joyce




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

lyeping2008

--- In [email protected], "graberamy" <graber@...> wrote:
> Well, I don't like to call them obsessions (not that you did but the
OP), I like to call them interest or passions. Obsession seems so
negative.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Many thanks and a great big hug to you Amy.

I like that word "Passion". Yeah, you're so right, obsession do sound
very negative. Infact it was negative in my mind, because it is still
something I've learnt to accomodate, no matter how happily I'm doing
it.

But now, you've managed to turn my view point into something more
positive.

Passion, is what obsession will matures into. Passion can only be
derived from Obsessions, if this makes sense.

Because when one is passionate about something, one will eat, read,
dream, talk and think about that one thing. Learning as much as we can
about it. Some people's passion just seems to have a longer life span
than others.

<<<Yippee>>>>Another milesstone to my unschooling.

Big Hugs,
SharonBugs.

Sandra Dodd

-=-Passion, is what obsession will matures into. Passion can only be
derived from Obsessions, if this makes sense.-=-



I don't think so. Someone can be passionate about something they're
not obsessed with, and obsessed with something they hate or fear.



Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robin Bentley

>
> --=Some interests and curiosities and obsessions do live and die a
> natural death. Some don't.
>
> I have a page started for hobbies and obsessions, and I'm thinking
> I'd like to add commentary on this idea there.
>
> Do you (any of you) have examples in your lives, or that you've seen
> in others', of interests that came and went, and some that stayed?==-
>

My husband saw his first sports car race when he was 4. He became
enamoured of road racing (vs. NASCAR-type racing) and made it his
hobby first, when he was old enough to drive (an obsession), and then
made it his profession. Pretty much everything he's done since has had
something to do with racing or driving.

He also loved wood working (making furniture) and pen & ink drawing
when I met him, but those interests have diminished over the years.

When I was a child, I wanted to play the harp. My parents couldn't
afford a harp (not many lap harps available then), so they bought me a
guitar. I loved it, took lessons, performed classical and pop music,
but by the end of high school, I was pretty much done. I have talked
through the years about my childhood wish for a harp and my dh granted
me that wish for my 50th birthday. I now have a beautiful, hand-made-
from-cherry-wood, Celtic harp which I rarely play - to my dh's
disappointment :-(. I think it's because the harp was a dream, and
perhaps a story of longing for something. That something, once
realized, lost its power.

I feel sad and guilty about it, but my passion for stringed
instruments seems to have waned.

Oh. I took a break from writing and remembered something. Once I got
over the shock of getting a harp <g>, I did begin to play it and it
sounded beautiful. I took the harp over to my parents' home to show it
off, and I plinked away on it, in the beginning stages of learning a
song. My dad dismissed my novice efforts with "Can't you play it yet?
That doesn't sound like a song." I realize now, today, that I put it
away after that and have barely touched it since (about 2 years ago).

It doesn't help knowing that my dad was diagnosed with dementia not
long after that. That comment from him stopped me from pursuing a life-
long dream and I wonder how many other things I didn't do because of
wanting to be approved of by him. He died this July (after my beloved
and supportive mother died last December), so perhaps my life will
open up in a new way. Freedom from his judgement doesn't guarantee it,
but it's worth examining the possibilities.

Wow. I had no idea where this would go when I started writing about my
husband's passions....

Robin B.

Jenny C

> I have no doubt at all that all the little tricks, tools and trivia
> Holly and Marty are picking up will continue to make them more
> creative and resourceful their whole lives.


Sandra's written something about trivia before, about how all those
facts and bits come in handy to get jokes or movies or make
conversation. Little tricks, tools and trivia come in handy in every
aspect of life...

Yesterday, Chamille commented on the fact that nobody seems to be able
to make their own Halloween costumes, and if they do, it's something
that everyone does like a cat or hippy or the popular theme this year
would be 80's girl.

We went to the thrift store last night to get some add on items for our
costumes. Chamille designed hers from conception to finish. I helped
only a little with some sewing that she wasn't comfortable with. At the
same time, she made a costume for a friend, who Chamille says is being
picky and weird about it but at the same time doesn't have any of her
own ideas!

When we were at the thrift store 2 other teen girls came up to Chamille
and her friend wanting to know more about how they did the skirts for
their costumes. Chamille told them. They kept coming back to pick her
brain some more. Chamille is brilliant with her ideas! She rattled off
a dozen costume ideas right then and there that they could easily make
with items from the thrift store with maybe a stop at another store for
a specialty item, but cheap, quick and easy, and something that would
garauntee that they'd be original.

Jenny C

>
> As for interests, I do think it is likely that many will fade away but
> I don't think this is negative. My daughter's most recent interest is
> in tiny people which started with her wondering what would happen if
> she shrunk. We've been having fun watching some neat TV shows and
> movies and reading some books as well as chatting about it from time
> to time. I was looking online and found a list on amazon of books
> about tiny people.

If you can find it anywhere, there is a book called The Littles and
their Friends. It is one of the best book on the littles. It's out of
print and I have a copy from when I was a kid. The picture details are
amazing, that's why I suggest it. My copy is falling apart because it's
been used so much! If you run across it in any of your searches, snatch
it up quick! It's more of a children's picture book, but brilliant!