Tara

Anytime we go to the bookstore, or library or any other store, my 9
year old always finds tons of cool stuff to check out or wants to buy
some cool game or video or project. He will get so excited about
whatever new thing he's found. But as soon as we get it home, it's
dropped and ignored. It will end up getting shelved or it is due back
at the library before he looks at it again. This happens about 90% of
the time.

Is this a common thing? An age or stage thing? How can I handle it when
our budget is getting tighter? I'd like to support his interests but
not go broke over things that get no use, kwim?

I've thought about having him "sleep on it" and if he still really
wants it after a day or so, then we can go back for it. Not sure if
that would be counter-productive or diminish an interest.(Obviously
this is not an issue with the library stuff!)

Any input or suggestions?

~Tara

halfshadow1

Do you read them to him,sit with him and talk about what he likes or
do you leave it up to him? I'm wondering if he is asking for you to be
interested if your not already? If money is tight (it is for us!) how
about going to a thrift store? I found huge tubs of legos for like 3
bucks,so you never know what cool stuff is there for cheap!Books are
like 25 cents also.--- In [email protected], "Tara"
<organicsis@...> wrote:
>
> Anytime we go to the bookstore, or library or any other store, my 9
> year old always finds tons of cool stuff to check out or wants to buy
> some cool game or video or project. He will get so excited about
> whatever new thing he's found. But as soon as we get it home, it's
> dropped and ignored. It will end up getting shelved or it is due back
> at the library before he looks at it again. This happens about 90% of
> the time.
>
> Is this a common thing? An age or stage thing? How can I handle it when
> our budget is getting tighter? I'd like to support his interests but
> not go broke over things that get no use, kwim?
>
> I've thought about having him "sleep on it" and if he still really
> wants it after a day or so, then we can go back for it. Not sure if
> that would be counter-productive or diminish an interest.(Obviously
> this is not an issue with the library stuff!)
>
> Any input or suggestions?
>
> ~Tara
>

Sandra Dodd

-=-He will get so excited about
whatever new thing he's found. But as soon as we get it home, it's
dropped and ignored. It will end up getting shelved or it is due back
at the library before he looks at it again. This happens about 90% of
the time. -=-

When he chooses a book to bring home, YOU read it. Maybe to him, but
at least yourself, if it's fairly short. Then you can talk about it
with him when or if he reads it.

If he wants a toy or some exciting new thing, put it out on the table
and you and others can play with it with him.

If it's a movie, watch it with him.

If it's a game, set him up a good place and time to play it. Bring
him some food. Make a happy deal about it.

-=-But as soon as we get it home, it's dropped and ignored.-=-



When you get home, don't drop it or ignore it.



Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

>
> -=-But as soon as we get it home, it's dropped and ignored.-=-
>

My kids at home are 21 and 17, I still sort of keep an eye on things
they buy and if something seems to be getting buried or lost in the
shuffle of our lives, I'm the one who will pull it out. If it is a
book, I might either read a bit myself and then mention it or if it is
a game or puzzle I'll put it out on the coffee table in the living
room where someone will see it and very likely start playing with it.
I JUST did this on Friday. My husband and I went out of town overnight
- before we left I was rummaging in a closet looking for something and
found a game we'd bought and never (or maybe just barely) played. I
set it out on the coffee table. When we came home the next night it
was scattered over the coffee table and had obviously been played by
the girls and a couple of friends who were here. For us, it often
happens with DVD's - one of us will buy a DVD that is on sale
somewhere (often those bins at drug stores, for example) and then
it'll sit and nobody will watch it. I'm the one who knows that it is
sitting there - invisible to everyone else <G>. So - if the time seems
right, I will suggest we put it on and my kids will say, "OH, I forgot
all about that."

This should probably go on the job description for unschooling
parents. Not sure exactly how to put it - but it is definitely an
important skill for an unschooling parent to have.

However, this afternoon I bought a new game (Bananagrams) and asked
the girls if they wanted to play it with me tonight. But, then we got
home and cooked dinner and watched a DVD ("The Importance of Being
Earnest" with Colin Firth and Rupert Everett) and totally forgot about
it. Just as she was going off to bed, Roxana said, "Sorry we didn't
play your game, Mom." "I" had forgotten, but she remembered. It'll
probably have to wait until next weekend - but I'll keep it out on the
coffee table until then.

-pam

Jenny C

He will get so excited about
> whatever new thing he's found. But as soon as we get it home, it's
> dropped and ignored. It will end up getting shelved or it is due back
> at the library before he looks at it again. This happens about 90% of
> the time.
>


I would say, go to the library more and the store less. When we go to
the book store, we spend a lot of time reading books there, and
generally buy something that I know without a doubt we will use a lot.
The last time we went to a bookstore we bought one of those skeletons
that you put in water and it grows. The time before that we bought a
Calvin and Hobbes book, that I knew Margaux would use for a long time,
for reading and for coloring in.

Many times, once we get library books home, Margaux doesn't touch them
at all. I offer to read them, but she usually would rather do other
things, so we do. The exception is reading Calvin and Hobbes, Little
Bear, Angelina Ballerina, Frog and Toad, or any puzzler look and find
type books. Occasionally something strikes her fancy, but those are the
mainstays.

Our money is better spent on toys or thrift store items, if we want
stuff to be used ALL the time.

Sandra Dodd

-=-This should probably go on the job description for unschooling
parents. Not sure exactly how to put it - but it is definitely an
important skill for an unschooling parent to have.-=-



Strewing?

http://sandradodd.com/strewing

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

Strewing the stuff the kids themselves originally chose but are
forgetting about, as opposed to strewing things the parents think
might be cool.

It is the parental ability to keep track of stuff that I'm talking
about, though. Say Rosie buys a book and it gets put on the bookshelf
and forgotten (by her). I could be irritated that she bought a book
that she never even bothered to read, or I could remember that book is
there and pull it out for her when the time seems right (not when
she's already involved in watching tv or playing a game, but when I
sense that she'd appreciate a good book. Or I might 'strew' it in the
"leave it around" sense.

I also wanted to add that it could be the act of buying stuff that is
interesting, not the stuff itself. In that case, sometimes spending
more time at 99 cent stores and thrift stores and garage sales is
worthwhile, but also it might be fun for the child to be on the
selling side - HAVE a garage sale yourselves (or a lemonade stand or
bake sale or ???).

And to see the bigger principle in this situation - I've noticed that
whenever my kids are doing something that is irritating or concerning
me, it is very very often that I'm not picking up signals about their
interests. Usually it is because their behavior hooked into something
that I don't like about myself or about someone in my past, so I
stopped paying attention to what the behavior really means in my own
child. Perfect example would be a kid who always wants to buy lots of
stuff in stores. What does that mean? What need does the child really
have? How can we pursue this interest? If I'm not asking myself those
questions, but, instead, I'm worrying that my child is turning out to
be careless with money, materialistic, wasteful, selfish, etc., then
THAT shows that I, myself, have issues that are being poked and
disturbed by my child's behavior - behavior that probably has nothing
at all to do with greed or materialism or manipulation by Madison
Avenue or whatever/however I'm thinking of it.

There does seem to be a human urge to trade (buy and sell) - to give
something in order to get something - and to end up better off after
the trade. Pokemon and other trading card games are an example of kids
getting really into this. There is a game we've played at big Girl
Scout campouts (not official, something the girls came up with to do
in their nonscheduled time). It is called "Bigger or Better." Girls
from one troop or group will find something around their campsite to
trade. It might be a pinecone or a marble or a pretty leaf or a stick
of gum - anything. They go around to other campsites and ask, "Bigger
or Better?" The girls at that site make offers of things to trade for
the original item - the original girls keep looking until they get an
offer they accept - then both groups keep going and going. It often
ends up, at campouts, with a group getting some kind of special food
goodie, some specialty treat made over a campfire or something. When
you eat what you traded for - that pretty much ends that round <G>.
They have a blast doing this and it can go on for the entire 2 or 3
days of camping. And the things they are trading? Usually a pretty
leaf or a piece of string - never anything "valuable" at all.

-pam

On Oct 27, 2008, at 8:04 AM, Sandra Dodd wrote:

> -=-This should probably go on the job description for unschooling
> parents. Not sure exactly how to put it - but it is definitely an
> important skill for an unschooling parent to have.-=-
>
>
>
> Strewing?

Sandra Dodd

-=-Strewing the stuff the kids themselves originally chose but are
forgetting about, as opposed to strewing things the parents think
might be cool.

-=-It is the parental ability to keep track of stuff that I'm talking
about, though-=-

Right. Rearranging the coffee table, as it were (only various other
tables and places in the house) so that there's always something
interesting and new (or older to be revived, or newish and not to be
forgotten).



Librarians and teachers and store owners do it with displays and
bulletin boards and such.



-=-There does seem to be a human urge to trade (buy and sell) - to
give something in order to get something - and to end up better off
after the trade. -=-

I was just over at the Dave's Garden site looking at offers of seed-
trading. People trade their own seeds and seedlings for others, by
mail.



Sandra






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tara

Thanks for all the responses.

I do try to engage with him and the new object, but usually he's not
interested and instead goes back to his old activities or toys. We
keep a basket under our coffee table with newer things and I try to
rotate them out onto the coffee table, but they still don't get
attention.

It's almost as if he is falling back on habit when he gets home, if
that make sense. He has his things he enjoys doing at home. When we
are out he gets excited about something *new* but when back at home
he's goes back to his regular stuff. So I'm kinda perplexed as to
whether or not he's actually interested in the new thing in the first
place or if his regular stuff is just overshadowing it.

He's been out of school for almost 2 yrs so for awhile I thought this
was still a deschooling thing. Like maybe he still associates certain
things with school and that's why he drops them. But why pick them up
in the first place if that's the case? My DH pointed out that he
tends to decline *any* new experiences. He was wondering if it's a
throw-back to the timidness he picked up in school when it came to
new things (he got a LOT of criticism at school). For instance, he
told DH the other day that he likes to only do his fave things cuz
he's good at them and he's "not good at other stuff". He used to golf
with DH but quit when he thought he wasn't as good as he should be.
He refuses to touch anything art related because he "sucks at art"
(but will have fun if it's a project without a preconceived outcome).
The other day he didn't want to go to the Ren Faire but since it was
the last minute he reluctantly went anyway. Once there he had a
blast. It's like when he's out and about he's more open to new
experiences but once at home he feels caccooned in his environment
and closes up.

Does that make sense? Do you think these two things (disinterest in
new items and timidness for new experiences) seem like they could be
related? And if so, should I just continue supporting, strewing, etc
or should I be trying something new at this point?

Thanks,
Tara

unschoolme2

Bigger and Better is an OLD old game; one guy in Canada traded one red
paperclip up to a house (the book, incidentally, is titled One Red
Paperclip-my kids and I read that one together). Anywho, I'm
relatively new to posting here, but my family and I have been
experimenting with homeschooling (eclectically) for over 4 years or
so. I have three girls, 15 year old twins and an 8 yo. My 8 yo
often-like many 8 (38) year olds- wants what she sees. I don't think
it is unreasonable to say "let's sleep on that purchase". Money is
tight at our house but I'm frugal by choice as well. My 8yo can go to
the library and check out an entire section if she chooses. If things
aren't so interesting once she's home, so what? Sometimes the "cover"
is more interesting than the concept, and often we get caught up in
the moment. But if I'm paying for it, and she has a habit of wanting
things that are new and (seemingly) exciting, then I would table it:
maybe just as long as it takes to run another errand. I suggest trying
the tactic of putting some time and space between a desire and a
possible acquisition.

Case in point: my daughters loved the science experiments we did a few
months ago (making a volcano, blowing up a ziplock bag with baking
soda and vinegar, making pepper dance, etc.). We liked it so much that
I went to the library and grabbed tons of books on science experiments
you can do at home. Well, September came around and my 8 yo joined
cheerleading, art classes resumed, she started musical theatre dance
and violin. We have not resumed our reading of the Narnia series and
we're both OK with that. We've found other interests. The twins are
taking a formal biology course now, complete with labs, so they are
not interested in our "homey" science experiments. We haven't done a
science experiment since August.

I struggle with the delicate balance of guiding and infringing. I
don't necessarily think that because your son drops a game after the
thrill of receiving it has past that it's your clue to pick up the
activity (unless it's an activity that you want to pick up and YOU are
interested in). However, if your son drops his new interests then
claims he's bored, maybe that is a call for assistance and that would
be a great time to bring out a new game, book, or conduct an at-home
science experiment. -

Africa

-- In [email protected], Pamela Sorooshian
<pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>
> Strewing the stuff the kids themselves originally chose but are
> forgetting about, as opposed to strewing things the parents think
> might be cool.
>
> It is the parental ability to keep track of stuff that I'm talking
> about, though. Say Rosie buys a book and it gets put on the bookshelf
> and forgotten (by her). I could be irritated that she bought a book
> that she never even bothered to read, or I could remember that book is
> there and pull it out for her when the time seems right (not when
> she's already involved in watching tv or playing a game, but when I
> sense that she'd appreciate a good book. Or I might 'strew' it in the
> "leave it around" sense.
>
> I also wanted to add that it could be the act of buying stuff that is
> interesting, not the stuff itself. In that case, sometimes spending
> more time at 99 cent stores and thrift stores and garage sales is
> worthwhile, but also it might be fun for the child to be on the
> selling side - HAVE a garage sale yourselves (or a lemonade stand or
> bake sale or ???).
>
> And to see the bigger principle in this situation - I've noticed that
> whenever my kids are doing something that is irritating or concerning
> me, it is very very often that I'm not picking up signals about their
> interests. Usually it is because their behavior hooked into something
> that I don't like about myself or about someone in my past, so I
> stopped paying attention to what the behavior really means in my own
> child. Perfect example would be a kid who always wants to buy lots of
> stuff in stores. What does that mean? What need does the child really
> have? How can we pursue this interest? If I'm not asking myself those
> questions, but, instead, I'm worrying that my child is turning out to
> be careless with money, materialistic, wasteful, selfish, etc., then
> THAT shows that I, myself, have issues that are being poked and
> disturbed by my child's behavior - behavior that probably has nothing
> at all to do with greed or materialism or manipulation by Madison
> Avenue or whatever/however I'm thinking of it.
>
> There does seem to be a human urge to trade (buy and sell) - to give
> something in order to get something - and to end up better off after
> the trade. Pokemon and other trading card games are an example of kids
> getting really into this. There is a game we've played at big Girl
> Scout campouts (not official, something the girls came up with to do
> in their nonscheduled time). It is called "Bigger or Better." Girls
> from one troop or group will find something around their campsite to
> trade. It might be a pinecone or a marble or a pretty leaf or a stick
> of gum - anything. They go around to other campsites and ask, "Bigger
> or Better?" The girls at that site make offers of things to trade for
> the original item - the original girls keep looking until they get an
> offer they accept - then both groups keep going and going. It often
> ends up, at campouts, with a group getting some kind of special food
> goodie, some specialty treat made over a campfire or something. When
> you eat what you traded for - that pretty much ends that round <G>.
> They have a blast doing this and it can go on for the entire 2 or 3
> days of camping. And the things they are trading? Usually a pretty
> leaf or a piece of string - never anything "valuable" at all.
>
> -pam
>
> On Oct 27, 2008, at 8:04 AM, Sandra Dodd wrote:
>
> > -=-This should probably go on the job description for unschooling
> > parents. Not sure exactly how to put it - but it is definitely an
> > important skill for an unschooling parent to have.-=-
> >
> >
> >
> > Strewing?
>

Jenny C

> He's been out of school for almost 2 yrs so for awhile I thought this
> was still a deschooling thing. Like maybe he still associates certain
> things with school and that's why he drops them. But why pick them up
> in the first place if that's the case? My DH pointed out that he
> tends to decline *any* new experiences.

It's like when he's out and about he's more open to new
> experiences but once at home he feels caccooned in his environment
> and closes up.


If he's happy being at home doing what he's doing, even though he does
the same things over and over, I would let him be. Let's say, for
example, he really likes a particular video game and plays it a lot.
Instead of taking him to a bookstore, take him to a game store and get
him a new game. Whatever it is that he IS doing at home, at to that.

If he balks at new experiences, yet has fun when he does end up going,
you are lucky! I have one child who did that for years and one who will
refuse to go, even if everyone else wants to. So he's good at going
with the flow, that's a blessing, really really!

So make outings about him. Whatever he's doing at home comes from
somewhere out there in the wider world. Go to lego stores, go on thrift
store hunts to find those collectible "whatevers".

He used to enjoy golfing with his dad, set up a minature golf course in
your house or yard. My grandpa golfed, it was his passion. When I was
a kid I was mildly interested simply because he was my grandpa. When he
came to visit us, he'd set up a little golf course or driving range in
our back yard and he let me play with him, it was awesome! I've never
played on a real golf course, nor do I have the desire to, but I can
appreciate the game because of my experience.

Sandra Dodd

-=-It's almost as if he is falling back on habit when he gets home, if
that make sense. He has his things he enjoys doing at home. When we
are out he gets excited about something *new* but when back at home
he's goes back to his regular stuff.-=-

Maybe museums and playgrounds would be good things to do when you're
out then. Or at a mall or shopping center, just take your time and
let him explore ramps and such instead of rushing him along.

People who are happy with their old stuff at home... that's good!

Someone on this list, I think, keeps a notebook in her purse with the
lists of things people have said they might want, and the thing to do
is to write it in the book. Then later, some things aren't as
desired, or if they are, the mom has a chance to find it on sale or
used, maybe. But action was taking. The mom wrote it down, she
didn't say no. And she can ask later (if it's not nearly a gift-
giving day) if the kid's still interested.



Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

I had another couple of shopping-related thoughts.

If he really likes to buy things, get him to help you with birthday
shopping and Christmas gifts for other relatives outside the
immediate family, maybe (it's too hard sometimes for kids to keep
those kinds of secrets, so don't do it for siblings).

It's "Toys for Tots" season in the U.S. (maybe other places, I don't
know how widespread it is), when people donate toys for gifts for
poorer children. I think there's a $5 minimum and the gifts should
be new and still in the packaging, if any. Maybe he would get as
much joy out of buying for someone else as for himself.

Thrift stores were mentioned.

Sandra

lyeping2008

Hi Tara,

I think I recognise what you're saying.

My son do play with the same toy or activity for a long period of
time. It just seems to me, his interest is deep and long and
always "on-going". Even tho he might have stop doing something, say
stop playing the Lego star wars game, it doesn't mean he's finsihed
with it. On contrary, he is just taking a break from it, recharge by
playing with something else, then get back to it eventually.

So, it is common to see him amusing hismefl with the same old toys
or games on a regular basis. It's his way of making sense of that
toy or testing out that idea he's got in his mind. He's playing, and
that's what is most important.

So I'll say to you, when he's had enough, he'll be ready for new
things. Till then, he'll just be as happy and content and
comfortable with what he has and wants to do.

My son is 8, and even tho is open to trying alot of different
activities, is still not keen to pick up any new activities, and is
very much happy and stuck with what he's is doing. Which is playing
with his Lego, ps2, psp, watching tv, and burning stuff.


My kid will always never fails to want something when we're in the
mall or library. Well, afterall, when we're in the mall, he sees me
buying stuff (even tho it's household stuff LOL!), so he's only
mirroring what I am doing.

So, I make it the point to take him window shopping too, allowing
him to touch and play to his heart's content, and SHOULD a toy
really sticks with him (this means he is definetely sure about that
toy), he's allowed to buy it with his pocket money.

If he hasn't got enough, and if the toy is nothing more than a
fiver, I'll either top it up or I'll buy it for him. Anything more
than that will require us to "save up for it" which means we'll be
able to get it next week. So he'll have to pick a cheaper option or
wait for it next week.

But there are times I'm aware he's tired, he's confused and he is
whiny, and need to buy something, just for the sake of buying
something- an immediate "happy fix". Well he need a fix, what can I
say.

So if he cannot make up his mind, I'll suggest a few options and
shops to visit, which is usually somewhere nice and cheap, like a
bookshop for a book, or newsstand for a magazine that he'll read
someday, or something that will come handy to him later on - like
additional tracks to add onto his model train set. But it is always
with a fixed budget of nothing more than GBP3.

We have gone into Lush to buy him a bathbomb for his bath later, and
he had a lovely and happy time touching and sniffing evry thing in
that shop. We have also bought something for someone else instead,
like he bought a little toy for his little cousin, happy knowing
that she'll be happy receiving it (despite the fact that we won't be
seeing her soon, not in the next 9 months LOL!)

I have suggested driving by the library to rent a movie or a game
disc which is cheaper. Sometimes he sometimes think is a great idea,
and gets him happy again, just deciding which movie or game to get.

So maybe the next time your kid needs "a happy fix" by buy
something, perhaps you can help him by suggesting more options.

Best Wishes
SharonBugs

Joyce Fetteroll

On Oct 26, 2008, at 10:21 PM, Tara wrote:

> But as soon as we get it home, it's
> dropped and ignored. It will end up getting shelved or it is due back
> at the library before he looks at it again.

I do that a lot too. At the library there's a specific time set aside
for doing something. At home, there can be a huge number of
interesting things calling for attention. I'm sure there are still
wrapped things that ended up on shelves that looked like fun in the
store but there's a hump to get over at home.

As others suggested, you be the one to get over the hump.

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

lyeping2008

--- In [email protected], "Tara" <organicsis@...> wrote:
<For instance, he told DH the other day that he likes to only do his
<fave things cuz he's good at them and he's "not good at other
<stuff". He used to golf with DH but quit when he thought he wasn't
<as good as he should be.


Tara, you need to give him more time. It is possible it's something
to do with school, whereby he thinks nothing he does is good enough.
My son was feeling this way when we first took him out of school. He
would only do things that he knows he will be able to ace it.

<He refuses to touch anything art related because he "sucks at art"
<(but will have fun if it's a project without a preconceived
<outcome).

My son hates Maths, art and writing and the whole lot. He hates art
because he doesn't like the feeling of glue on his fingers. He hates
painting because it's a "girl thing". But he'll cut and cellotape
and draw and colour with marker pen and make things (it's NOT art,
so he claims).

My son hates anything that's got a timer on it, still do. He hates
games with timer on it. He still thinks that he'll fail if he is
being time on anything. This is definetely to do with his thinking
of "in-ability to match up to the expectation". Which is why I do
not place any expectation upon him.

I praise by sharing his happiness and sense of achievement with him
on whatever good work he feels worthy enough to share with us. A
treat or a smother him with kisses session of which he can actually
tell me "Stop!! it is only a SMALL thing that didn't warrant so many
sloberring kisses !!

In the beginning, I spend alot of time sitting next to him, being
involve with his daily activities, which is often open-ended. And
we're cool with it because it just seems like with DS's nature to
have ongoing and never-ending projects. To him, it is, but of
course to us parents, we can see how it metamorphed from one mini
project to another.

By me spending lots of time next to him, it's helping to give him
the message that I am enjoying whatever he is doing so much, that I
am happy to let him lead us into any activities. "Little sense of
achivements building up into mountains " i used to tell hubby.

Nowadays, he's quite happy plodding along on his own.

> The other day he didn't want to go to the Ren Faire but since it
was the last minute he reluctantly went anyway. Once there he had a
> blast. It's like when he's out and about he's more open to new
> experiences but once at home he feels caccooned in his environment
> and closes up.

My kid used to have pre-concieved idea to any events, that he'll not
enjoy himself, but once there, can have a fabulous time. But he can
actually convinced himself into a twist, that he'll have a horirble
time and still insist on going home when we arrive.

So I always gives him an option. That we'll go and check it out, and
should he still thinks he'll not want to stay for the party or
event, then it's fine, we'll leave immediately. I alway tells him
that everybody is entitled to feeling horrible for the day. And
nobody has to do what they don't want to.

Over time he has learned that sometimes even tho his brain "plays
trick on him by making him not want to go", he can actually change
his mind and decide to stay on for some fun.

Tara, my kid's diagnosed as asperger, even tho alot of his
limitation is no longer in existing or relevant in our happy and
carefree unschooling life. But what I've mentioned above, was and
still is my support towards his emotional issues, asperger or not.
It ws just naturally him.

My kid is a perfectionist, and need constant help to make him
understand that "it's ok to make mistake", and that we're human, and
all human makes mistakes. Now that we're unschooling, we had all the
time, freedom and space to help him understand that he is allowed to
make all the mistakes without being label as stupid or incompetent.

He understands now that making mistake is not a crime, and it
doesn't mean he is "not good enough". It's natural, and is what
helps makes him a cleverer boy, day by day. I told him the story of
Thomas Edison.

It's coming to nearly 2 years of unschooling now, we're still having
alot of inpromtu discussion about all his previous heartaches and
troubles in school. It's just him needing to make sense of it.

He still goes back into his comfort zone of predictability and
familiarity, when the going gets too much, especially if he has
extend himself into something new like friends and homeschooling
groups.


So Tara, my advice will be just accept him for what he is. All kids
will eventually find the right balance and the right medium for
thier own development. And most of the time, it is not something
we'll recognised. Perhaps, he is already blossoming in his mind now,
and is yet to manifest it physically, which is why you do not
recognised it.

Hope this helps

Best Wishes
SharonBugs

Verna

my kids do that alot at the library. not so much at stores cause we
honestly, typically, cant afford to buy things that are not preplanned.

with the library books. i get an idea of some things they find
interesting and even if we dont look at them again, i might find a
video on netflix or look online for cool stuff that is related to it.
my oldest is interested in WWII for example. we listened to a book on
tape about a boy and what life was like living in the U.S. during the
war. I then got the movie Empire of the Sun. When they mentioned
Pearl Harbor in the movie, my son recognized it from the book and asked
me about it. This all came from his looking at a library book about
WWII for a few minutes. He plays on Roblox alot and is creating a
world that has american and german soldiers. He pulls in information
from these other sources to feed his immagination in Roblox. Honestly,
if someone fromt he outside to spend a day in our house lately, they
would think all he does is play Roblox. But, if you watch more closely
you see how he incorporates things he experiences and learns into his
play.

Sandra Dodd

-=-Case in point: my daughters loved the science experiments we did a
few
months ago (making a volcano, blowing up a ziplock bag with baking
soda and vinegar, making pepper dance, etc.). We liked it so much that
I went to the library and grabbed tons of books on science experiments
you can do at home. Well, September came around and my 8 yo joined
cheerleading, art classes resumed, she started musical theatre dance
and violin. We have not resumed our reading of the Narnia series and
we're both OK with that. We've found other interests. The twins are
taking a formal biology course now, complete with labs, so they are
not interested in our "homey" science experiments. We haven't done a
science experiment since August.-=-



It's not really "an experiment" if the outcome is known. Then it's
reproducible results. But that's fun! If you think of it as
"playing with backing soda" or messing around with pepper, then it's
playing. It's still learning, because it's new to each kid, or
entertainment, because they've done it before but they have an even
better idea for it this time, but it's part of deschooling to
discover that what school called "experiments" were really
demonstrations of known reactions

Reactions are fun, though--all kinds of balloon play, like flinking
helium balloons--weighting them just enough that they stay halfway
between the floor and the ceiling; putting little super balls into
balloons before adding Helium and bouncing them around the room
(Holly's idea on Kirby's birthday, when we had rented a helium tank).

Pam Sorooshian has some good projects:

http://sandradodd.com/strew/tadaa.html

Instead of seeing "science experiments," try to see the physics and
chemistry and anatomy and other aspects (without using those words)
in art, music, history, automechanics, gardening, sports, toys...

Sandra




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=We have gone into Lush to buy him a bathbomb for his bath later-=-

What's a bathbomb? I think I want one!
My best guesses are bath oil in a little dissolvable ball, or a block
of bath salts that dissolves and might have scent and color. Those
were common when I was a kid.

I hope it's better than those, though those were nice to play with.
My grandmother (Mamaw, my dad's mom, in Rotan, Texas) always had some
of those things.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_bomb
I went to google uk and it's FULL of bath bombs. Do they have these
in the U.S.?

Oh. Maybe my kids are just too old or I don't hang around artsy
shops enough.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOY7QFOVv6A
Directions (from California)
And at the end they show it flooding... so that might be a factor, in
how full to have the bathtub!


and on the side of that youtube video they're suggesting
How to make a LOUD paper bomb
How to make a Condom-bomb
How to make a smoke bomb
How to make a water bottle bomb

and more bath bombs

http://www.stylefeeder.com/i/n56d797j/Fizzy-Baker-Cupcake-Trio-Bath-
Bomb-Gift-Box
This company makes them to look like cupcakes.

Well... I don't know if I *needed* to know this, but it's
interesting and I'm glad I do!

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-with the library books. i get an idea of some things they find
interesting and even if we dont look at them again, i might find a
video on netflix or look online for cool stuff that is related to it.
-=-

We follow trails, in a connect-the-dots kind of way. It makes all of
life kinda like a board game. One thing leads to another down all
these little trails, and there's strategy and there's chance. It's a
big world-sized cooperative board game.

Last night Holly and I watched The Flight of the Navigator. It would
take me as long to list the comments and connections as it did for us
to watch the movie. In some ways it's a good movie. The ship is
great! The logic of the story and the continuity are pretty lame.
So great special effects, kinda-cool idea, weird details. Paul
Rubens (as Paul Mall) did the voice of the ship, and Holly's a big
fan of PeeWee's Big Adventure, which she referenced the other day
when we learned that Diana Jenner's bike was stolen. I didn't
recognize the teenaged girl (or young woman) in the story but when I
read it in the credits, Holly said sure, she had recognized her right
away. Sarah Jessica Parker.

I'm not recommending this movie to others, just recommending being
open to all sorts and directions of connections in whatever you do.

http://sandradodd.com/connections/

http://sandradodd.com/dot/

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Margaret

Yes, they have them in the US and yes they are more fun than the
little scented blocks that you remember. As for where to get them in
the US, I found them at amazon but I know retail shops sell them as my
sister bought some for me once. Can't remember which one. I found
this site with directions for making them yourself. I think I might
have to give that a try :)

http://www.teachsoap.com/bombs.html

Searching for 'bath fizzy' got a lot of results. Garden Botanika
calls them bath fizzies/fizzy as does the Body Shop.

On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 7:00 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
> -=We have gone into Lush to buy him a bathbomb for his bath later-=-
>
> What's a bathbomb? I think I want one!
> My best guesses are bath oil in a little dissolvable ball, or a block
> of bath salts that dissolves and might have scent and color. Those
> were common when I was a kid.
>
> I hope it's better than those, though those were nice to play with.
> My grandmother (Mamaw, my dad's mom, in Rotan, Texas) always had some
> of those things.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_bomb
> I went to google uk and it's FULL of bath bombs. Do they have these
> in the U.S.?
>
> Oh. Maybe my kids are just too old or I don't hang around artsy
> shops enough.

lyeping2008

We have a natural soap shop here called Lush, and they sell soap by
weight. They have loads of lovely things like jelly soap, and
colourful bubble bath bars and they all have lovely names and smells.

They fizzle and swizzle around the bath water, creating lovely scent
and colour. One of DS's favourite is Blackberry bombs, which had him
smelling like blackerry from head to toe!! Hmmmm...yummy!! We had the
one that turned the water into aqua blue.

Infact, DS uses them to do his water experiments in the bath. I cut
them into little chunks, so he'll have little jars with different
smells and different colours, mixing them up into different scents and
colours LOL!!

My current favourite is their shampoo bar.

Hugs
Sharon

crittercohorts

Each of our kids have a wish list on amazon.com and if they see
something that they want but I can't buy than we'll add it to their
wishlist when we get home. It seems to help take care of that need
right there. I've seen numerous glances at us when my daughter gets
loud trying to tell me that she wants something put on her wishlist.
At this point they each have 5-7 pages of stuff they want on
amazon...

-Brandi

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> -=-It's almost as if he is falling back on habit when he gets home,
if
> that make sense. He has his things he enjoys doing at home. When we
> are out he gets excited about something *new* but when back at home
> he's goes back to his regular stuff.-=-
>
> Maybe museums and playgrounds would be good things to do when
you're
> out then. Or at a mall or shopping center, just take your time
and
> let him explore ramps and such instead of rushing him along.
>
> People who are happy with their old stuff at home... that's good!
>
> Someone on this list, I think, keeps a notebook in her purse with
the
> lists of things people have said they might want, and the thing to
do
> is to write it in the book. Then later, some things aren't as
> desired, or if they are, the mom has a chance to find it on sale
or
> used, maybe. But action was taking. The mom wrote it down, she
> didn't say no. And she can ask later (if it's not nearly a gift-
> giving day) if the kid's still interested.
>
>
>
> Sandra
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Pamela Sorooshian

That would be very helpful for aunts and uncles and others who want to
buy them gifts!

I hope they go through their wish list once in a while and take things
off that they're no longer interested in.

-pam

On Oct 28, 2008, at 9:56 AM, crittercohorts wrote:

> Each of our kids have a wish list on amazon.com and if they see
> something that they want but I can't buy than we'll add it to their
> wishlist when we get home. It seems to help take care of that need
> right there. I've seen numerous glances at us when my daughter gets
> loud trying to tell me that she wants something put on her wishlist.
> At this point they each have 5-7 pages of stuff they want on
> amazon...

Robin Bentley

Here's the Lush site (Lush stores started in the UK). Their bath bombs
are very nice <g>:

http://www.lushusa.com/shop/products/bath-shower/bath-bombs


On Oct 28, 2008, at 7:00 AM, Sandra Dodd wrote:

> -=We have gone into Lush to buy him a bathbomb for his bath later-=-
>
> What's a bathbomb? I think I want one!

Sandra Dodd

Thank you for that Lush-North-America link!

I went to the mall this morning, just to go to a bath shop, just to
ask if they had a bath bomb. No, and she hadn't heard of them, but
when I described what I had learned this morning, she showed me a
peppermint fizzy-bath tablet, which looked like and smelled like a
little flattened peppermint (only an inch high and three inches
across), wrapped in cellophane like a little candy. It was on the
"smell like Christmas" table. I didn't buy one.

It's fun to see what the range of stuff is on those, though!

I'm thinking of getting some for the hot tub. I'm the one who cleans
it anyway, and it doesn't have jets or moving parts.

Sandra

Flo Gascon

I know an unschooler who has a an online soap store:
http://www.wildlyluckysoap.com/bath_bomb.htm

She has bath bombs!

~Flo


--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> Thank you for that Lush-North-America link!
>
> I went to the mall this morning, just to go to a bath shop, just
to
> ask if they had a bath bomb. No, and she hadn't heard of them,
but
> when I described what I had learned this morning, she showed me a
> peppermint fizzy-bath tablet, which looked like and smelled like a
> little flattened peppermint (only an inch high and three inches
> across), wrapped in cellophane like a little candy. It was on the
> "smell like Christmas" table. I didn't buy one.
>
> It's fun to see what the range of stuff is on those, though!
>
> I'm thinking of getting some for the hot tub. I'm the one who
cleans
> it anyway, and it doesn't have jets or moving parts.
>
> Sandra
>

Sandra Dodd

-=-I know an unschooler who has a an online soap store:
http://www.wildlyluckysoap.com/bath_bomb.htm

She has bath bombs!-=-



Thanks, Flo! I ordered some of hers, and I plan to order some of the
Lush ones for Christmas gifts, too.

Kirby has decided to stay in Austin and work all the holidays again
this year (Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's) because he'll make
double time, and then come here for ten days in January. Last year
his Christmas box didn't get there for a MONTH. He had nothing for
Christmas. I felt deeply terrible. I mailed it priority mail, but
somehow it got in with "just whenever" mail and then lost or something.

This year I've already started collecting little items to mail in a
couple or three different boxes, with "open on the 23rd, open the
24th, put this in the freezer and open tomorrow after work..." stuff
like that, so he'll be entertained and have things to do while his
roommate is gone. One of those gifts is definitely going to be a
bath bomb.

I'm glad for the sparkly knowledge of people on this list, and I'm
glad that I'm easily amused and so are my kids!

Sandra

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Schuyler

I'm glad for the sparkly knowledge of people on this list, and I'm
glad that I'm easily amused and so are my kids!

----------------snip----------

I've really been enjoying Kenny Shopsin the last week or two. He's a cook in New York who just co-authored a cookbook/autobiography called Eat Me the Food and Philosophy of Kenny Shopsin. The food is fantastic, David fixed the most wonderful corn chowder last night. And the mac and cheese pancakes are amazing. He's written a couple of things that feel like the same thing as being easily amused. And I keep thinking about his words:


I often compare my ideas about cooking to the children's book Goodnight Moon, by Margaret Wise Brown, where the little boy discoveres that everything he needs in life is in his life already, right in his own room. In a Goodnight Moon world, it's pretty easy to be a good home cook. It's really not about having some terrific skills or exotic ingredients or expensive high_tech equipment. It's not even about having the right secret recipe. To be a good cook, to turn out good, honest food that satisfies your individual tastes, it is all about having the kind of confidence ans self-awareness that comes from Goodnight Moon living, in which you are happy with what is already in your life.
and


I cook about ninety dozen eggs every Saturday and every Sunday, and I enjoy cooking them each time I do it. I like cracking the eggs into a bowl. I like breaking the yolks and whisking them with cream for scrambled eggs. I like watching the ripples form as they cook, and I like the process of gently running my fork through cooked eggs to create space for the raw egg to hit the pan. When I'm making fried eggs and sunnies, I like heating the butter in the pan; I like sliding the eggs in to the butter; and I like sliding the finished eggs from the pan onto a plate. I like everything there is about making eggs, and no matter how many times I do it, I still like doing it. There's nothing else I'd rather be doing. I don't come to the task from a place of drudgery or boredom. I come to it from a place of curiosity and love. To be a good cook you have to.

Maybe those kinds of ideas, the being happy with what you already have in your life opens up access to being easily engaged and amused.

Schuyler
http://www.waynforth.blogspot.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-I cook about ninety dozen eggs every Saturday and every Sunday,
and I enjoy cooking them each time I do it. I like cracking the eggs
into a bowl.-=-

That whole quote was beautiful, but I wanted to say that this reminds
me of how I feel most of the time about my dishes. I like my dishes,
so I LIKE to wash them and put them back in their own little patterns
and piles, and then I like to use them again and to put food in or on
just the right one.

Most of my dishes are from thrift stores. A few were gifts, some are
"SCA dishes" (blown glass or pottery that can be used for
medievalesque purposes), a few are things the kids and I did when
they were little at paint your own pottery places. When something
has a negative memory or is irritating, I either give it away or
stuff it up or back where it's not in daily rotation.

Thinking of a "'Goodnight Moon' world," as he said, that world
(though contained) still had the moon and animals and things that
aren't usually inside. So that reminds me of patterns within
patterns, which goes back to the show about fractals. If Kenny
Shopsin is commending a life of accepting and appreciating what is at
hand, then a pattern within that is appreciating the swirls in the
pan when scrambled eggs are cooking.

Unschooling can ideally be about rearranging the interesting little
things you already have in your life, in your house, in your mind--
sharing ideas, and songs, and clothes, and food. Puzzles. Movies.

You quoted Kenny Shopsin: "I cook about ninety dozen eggs every
Saturday and every Sunday..."

He's a professional, so that's a business expense, the 90 dozen
eggs. But it reminds me of unschoolers who keep a wall of "we can't
do it, we can't afford it, that costs money" between them and
enriching their lives, when they might just need to see things
differently (including how money should be spent) or get over the
idea that educational materials come from "Gifts for the Gifted"
kinds of catalogs, and not from yard sales or dumpsters.

So two videos for those who want some visuals. Kenny Shopsin making
macaroni and cheese pancakes, and an Animaniacs version of Goodnight
Moon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayZYfRXS6Do
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncOgMk1xEzc

Sandra

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