Amanda Horein

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Also by helping them and making the tasks they take on more pleasant.
(Animals are a biggie. Parents should assume responsibility for pets and
invite kids along to help.)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I have a question here. I am fully aware that concerning animals, it will be
my responsibility to take care of them mostly. My dd (7) wants a puppy. I
don't. I have thought a great deal about this. Puppies are cute, but I don't
want the responsibility of a puppy right now in my life. Mostly I don't want
to have to clean up after it. Not to mention we don't have the money to
devote to a veteranarian right now.

How do I go about explaining all this to my dd? I have tried telling her
these things but she still asks about getting one.

--
Amanda
http://whatmykidstaughtme.blogspot.com/
http://365daysofsparkle.blogspot.com

My "Working Toward Pro" Photographs
www.hopescreations.com
http://choose2bgr8.deviantart.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

BRIAN POLIKOWSKY

Can you find a place ( shelter/vet/ breeder} where she can go and "volunteer" once a week ( or so so she can be with dogs?
That might make her happy for a while and she can learn how to take care of dogs. I know she is only 7 but I started young too.
Alex Polikowsky

Amanda Horein <horein@...> wrote:
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Also by helping them and making the tasks they take on more pleasant.
(Animals are a biggie. Parents should assume responsibility for pets and
invite kids along to help.)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I have a question here. I am fully aware that concerning animals, it will be
my responsibility to take care of them mostly. My dd (7) wants a puppy. I
don't. I have thought a great deal about this. Puppies are cute, but I don't
want the responsibility of a puppy right now in my life. Mostly I don't want
to have to clean up after it. Not to mention we don't have the money to
devote to a veteranarian right now.

How do I go about explaining all this to my dd? I have tried telling her
these things but she still asks about getting one.

--
Amanda
http://whatmykidstaughtme.blogspot.com/
http://365daysofsparkle.blogspot.com

My "Working Toward Pro" Photographs
www.hopescreations.com
http://choose2bgr8.deviantart.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Angela Shaw

I would explain it exactly how you explained it to us. Puppies are a LOT of
work. They require more care, money, training, and attention than a 7 year
old can provide and at this time in your life you do not feel ready for a
puppy. It would not be fair to the puppy to bring them into a family where
the primary care taker felt resentment towards the work/money required to
care for it properly. Without the whole family being on board it just isn't
a good idea. A child's brain just can not foresee the problems that could
come up or the responsibility required to care for a puppy. She may not
understand it but you cannot sacrifice an animal's welfare as a learning
experiment for your daughter.



Angela Shaw - whose 11 year old really wants a dog and she isn't ready yet.

<mailto:game-enthusiast@...> game-enthusiast@...



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Amanda Horein

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Can you find a place ( shelter/vet/ breeder} where she can go and
"volunteer" once a week ( or so so she can be with dogs?
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I didn't even know that they could do this this young. Hmmm. I am getting
some ideas. Thank you.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I would explain it exactly how you explained it to us. Puppies are a LOT of
work. They require more care, money, training, and attention than a 7 year
old can provide and at this time in your life you do not feel ready for a
puppy.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I have done this. I think she understands on some level, but she still
*wants* a puppy. That *want* is very strong and sometimes I feel bad because
sometimes I feel that I am not FINDING a way for her to have a puppy.

--
Amanda
http://whatmykidstaughtme.blogspot.com/
http://365daysofsparkle.blogspot.com

My "Working Toward Pro" Photographs
www.hopescreations.com
http://choose2bgr8.deviantart.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

diana jenner

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 6:13 AM, Amanda Horein <horein@...> wrote:

> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> Also by helping them and making the tasks they take on more pleasant.
> (Animals are a biggie. Parents should assume responsibility for pets and
> invite kids along to help.)
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>
> I have a question here. I am fully aware that concerning animals, it will
> be
> my responsibility to take care of them mostly. My dd (7) wants a puppy. I
> don't. I have thought a great deal about this. Puppies are cute, but I
> don't
> want the responsibility of a puppy right now in my life. Mostly I don't
> want
> to have to clean up after it. Not to mention we don't have the money to
> devote to a veteranarian right now.
>
> How do I go about explaining all this to my dd? I have tried telling her
> these things but she still asks about getting one.
>
>

**********************************************************************************************
She still asks because she knows it's a cop out. I can say that because I
have been using it too. And because after years of that rationale, Hayden
has called me on it.

I'm putting my own dog-fears to bed & we're earnestly seeking the perfect
dog for our family
(and that same voice track is running in my head with the volume turned
waaaaay down ::bg::).

Do I want to be the mom full of excuses for why he can't have a dog -OR- do
I want to be the mom who (like most everything else) understands how
important this is and makes it happen??
--
~diana :)
xoxoxoxo
hannahbearski.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-Do I want to be the mom full of excuses for why he can't have a
dog -OR- do
I want to be the mom who (like most everything else) understands how
important this is and makes it happen??-=-



Those aren't the only two choices!!



Guilting a mom into having a dog or guilting a kid out of wanting a
dog.... there are other things and other ways.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=--=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Can you find a place ( shelter/vet/ breeder} where she can go and
"volunteer" once a week ( or so so she can be with dogs?
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I didn't even know that they could do this this young. Hmmm. I am
getting
some ideas. Thank you.-=-



Maybe mom and daughter can do that together.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

graberamy

> Can you find a place ( shelter/vet/ breeder} where she can go and
> "volunteer" once a week ( or so so she can be with dogs?
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

> Maybe mom and daughter can do that together.>>>

That's what my daughter and I did. The shelters (in our area) wouldn't
let children under 12 (or 13?) work with animals. I found a No Kill
Shelter that welcomed the help as long as an adult was there! It was
fun for both of us!

I also thought, maybe instead of a puppy (cause they are a lot of work)
you could get an older dog from a shelter?? My daughter and I just got
done reading

Sandra Dodd

Come back, Amy!

-=-I also thought, maybe instead of a puppy (cause they are a lot of
work)
you could get an older dog from a shelter?? My daughter and I just got
done reading -=-



It cut off there.



Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

graberamy

That's weird...it was all there when I sent it. I put a link in,
maybe that was the problem.

Anyway, we just got done reading A Dogs Life by Ann Martin. The story
of a stray. It might inspire her to want an older dog? They really
are a lot less work!

Also, the shelter that my daughter and I volunteer at need foster
homes. Temporary homes for pets until they are placed. Maybe a
shelter in your area is in need of something like that??

Sorry for the separate post!!
amy g
iowa

--- In [email protected], "graberamy" <graber@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Can you find a place ( shelter/vet/ breeder} where she can go and
> > "volunteer" once a week ( or so so she can be with dogs?
> > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>
> > Maybe mom and daughter can do that together.>>>
>
> That's what my daughter and I did. The shelters (in our area) wouldn't
> let children under 12 (or 13?) work with animals. I found a No Kill
> Shelter that welcomed the help as long as an adult was there! It was
> fun for both of us!
>
> I also thought, maybe instead of a puppy (cause they are a lot of work)
> you could get an older dog from a shelter?? My daughter and I just got
> done reading
>

michmdmama

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
She still asks because she knows it's a cop out. I can say that
because I have been using it too. And because after years of that
rationale, Hayden has called me on it.

I'm putting my own dog-fears to bed & we're earnestly seeking the
perfect dog for our family (and that same voice track is running in my
head with the volume turned waaaaay down ::bg::).

Do I want to be the mom full of excuses for why he can't have a dog
-OR- do I want to be the mom who (like most everything else)
understands how important this is and makes it happen??
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Your message is part right, Diana. It is a cop out, sort of. I don't
really like dogs. I was made to take care of them when I was growing
up and we lost so many animals (due to them being hit or dying or
whatever)that part of me doesn't want a dog at all.

However, there are breeds that I am more "warm" towards (my step dad's
parents had a miniature Doberman, who has since passed on, that I fell
in love with) and could definitely see myself getting, someday. I know
that now is not that time though. We make *very* little money and are
barely keeping ourselves afloat. It would be unfair to bring another
mouth to feed into that mix I think.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Maybe mom and daughter can do that together.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I will think on this. I am not a big fan of this idea because I am
really not that fond of dogs and her dad *really* doesn't like them so
it would have to be me (or will it? I guess that isn't the *only*
option). I will see what I can come up with though.

I asked her if instead of getting a dog (for now) if we could maybe
talk to people about "borrowing" their animals to walk/play
with/perhaps bathe or whatever. She was so excited and even called me
"the best mom ever" (gotta love these moments, right?). I am on a
couple local lists and asked around and there is a family willing to
let us play/walk their dog (not a puppy, but a start) so I will see
what she says to this idea.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Anyway, we just got done reading A Dogs Life by Ann Martin. The story
of a stray. It might inspire her to want an older dog? They really
are a lot less work!

Also, the shelter that my daughter and I volunteer at need foster
homes. Temporary homes for pets until they are placed. Maybe a
shelter in your area is in need of something like that??
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
These are great ideas that I will keep in mind for when the time comes
to get a dog. We did consider Paws For A Cause, but again, the expense
right now is too much.

Thank you all for your ideas and helping me get "unstuck".

--
Amanda
http://whatmykidstaughtme.blogspot.com/
http://365daysofsparkle.blogspot.com

My "Working Toward Pro" Photographs
www.hopescreations.com
http://choose2bgr8.deviantart.com

Sandra Dodd

-=-I am not a big fan of this idea because I am
really not that fond of dogs and her dad *really* doesn't like them so
it would have to be me (or will it? I guess that isn't the *only*
option).-=-

You can say no, about a dog.

If you wanted a dog but your daughter really was afraid of them or
just thought they were creepy or something, you probably wouldn't get
one.



-=-I asked her if instead of getting a dog (for now) if we could maybe

talk to people about "borrowing" their animals to walk/play
with/perhaps bathe or whatever. She was so excited and even called me
"the best mom ever" (gotta love these moments, right?). I am on a
couple local lists and asked around and there is a family willing to
let us play/walk their dog (not a puppy, but a start) so I will see
what she says to this idea.-=-

It sounds good except for the "I asked her if instead of..." because
neither the parents nor the children should be dictating what has to
happen in the family about things like that.

Maybe you could get her books about dogs and breeds and posters and
dog-up her room, without getting a dog. How many young girls have
model horses and horse posters and no horse? Don't let your life be
ruined over disagreement about a dog. Don't let her bring a dog
into a situation where the dad has negative-points interest in a dog
and the mom has bad associations and memories. Too expensive, in
human terms. (And then financial.)

Maybe you could visit a veterinarian that handles lots of dogs. Sit
in the waiting room. See some of the people come in and out. Most
of the dogs will be healthy, and in to be spayed or neutered or get
shots or whatever. When there's a lull at the desk, maybe you could
ask for literature--handouts about heartworms or how to keep a dog
healthy, or post-operative instructions, or whatever would be
interesting to her (and remind her that problems happen).

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Angela Shaw

<<She still asks because she knows it's a cop out. I can say that because I
have been using it too. And because after years of that rationale, Hayden
has called me on it.>>




Diana,



I think it's great that you are willing and able at this point in your life
to get Hayden the dog he wants. I'd love to see more parents go out of
their way to help their children make their dreams come true. I just want
to point out that lack of money, time, and willingness are not always a cop
out. Getting a dog IS a big responsibility and it has to be the right
decision for your whole family.



Right now my daughter wants a dog. We have 2 horses, 2 cats, and 2 rabbits.
We love and take good care of all of our pets and it can be expensive. Last
fall one of our horses got Lyme disease and we are now suffering the fallout
from that as she has now developed arthritis from having Lyme. Proper vet
care is expensive. Had the vet out the other day for her and it was $450
and we still don't know if what they did helped her. For my family, adding
a dog to our expenses right now would, imo, be irresponsible because we're
already on a tight budget and the pets we have already are not inexpensive
to keep. A dog is a whole different level than a gerbil or hamster. They
are pack animals that want to be part of your family and vet care can be
expensive.



The reason I am writing all this is because I don't think other mom's out
there should feel like being responsible is a cop out if the time is not
right for them to add a dog to the family. I hate seeing all the unwanted
dogs in shelters when their families give them up because they did not
consider all the responsibilities connected with bringing home a puppy.







Angela Shaw

game-enthusiast@...



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Julie

Hi, Amanda - just wanted to add some more "food for thought" here. I
happend to love dogs and have always had dogs. And I am always kind of
surprised when I meet people who don't. That said, my 10 yr old son did
not inherit the dog gene -- he likes fish and that's it, nothing with
fur or feathers. One of his friends, though, started wanting a dog and
wanting to spend time with our dog (Great Pyrenees). He worked and
worked on his mother, who also did not inherit the dog gene, until
finally, after I think three years, he talked her into a puppy for
Christmas. She never, ever owned a dog before. She was in for some
changes, that's for sure.

This little boy is in school, so he's not home during the day to take
care of the puppy. His mom has to do it, and I think she resents it.
Puppy is now six months old and recently ate part of their grill and
part of something on their air conditioner. This tells me Puppy is not
being watched as well as needed and places aren't puppyproof. Mom's
response is to put the pup in her carrier -- time out, I guess. She
calls me often upset and angry about whatever is going on. I try to
tell her about phases and training, etc. She really does resent the
puppy, though, and I seriously doubt they have her much longer. BTW,
they paid $600 for this pup who is just being a pup.

I don't know if that helps you any. My friend is still trying to adjust
to the extra cost of just one little puppy -- monthly flea/tick
treatment, heartworm, food plus any vet visits, grooming, toys,
bedding... My dog, who is big, costs about 40 a month for those
preventative treatments, probably another 50 in food and her upcoming
checkup is going to be about $130. I TRY to groom her -- not fun, even
to me -- because taking her to be done would be upwards of $200.

If you think your daughter is responsible/capable of all the home needs
- feeding, watering daily, training, cleaning up potty messes/yard,
exercising, etc., then no problem (I did do all that stuff, except for
the yard cleanup, when I was that age). But if not, maybe you two could
pick a breed (www.dogbreedinfo.com <http://www.dogbreedinfo.com>
http://animal.discovery.com/breedselector/dogselectorindex.do
<http://animal.discovery.com/breedselector/dogselectorindex.do>
http://www.dogbreed.com/ <http://www.dogbreed.com/> ) and get some
books on that breed, some dog training books, maybe observe a training
class somewhere - Petsmart has them - and let her learn all about it
before she gets her dog.

While I think older dogs are great, many are not the best option for a
beginner. Some are really set in their ways, have health issues, may
not like kids (you won't always get a history on an oder dog). I like
that my son, even though he doesn't care about dogs, has been around our
dog since he was three years old and she was 9 weeks. She adores him
and loves my toddler, too. Growing up together, to me, is ideal for
kids and their dogs. It creates such a special bond between them
(remembering my own childhood dogs here) that lasts forever.

Good luck either way!

Julie




--- In [email protected], "Amanda Horein" <horein@...>
wrote:
>
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> Also by helping them and making the tasks they take on more pleasant.
> (Animals are a biggie. Parents should assume responsibility for pets
and
> invite kids along to help.)
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>
> I have a question here. I am fully aware that concerning animals, it
will be
> my responsibility to take care of them mostly. My dd (7) wants a
puppy. I
> don't. I have thought a great deal about this. Puppies are cute, but I
don't
> want the responsibility of a puppy right now in my life. Mostly I
don't want
> to have to clean up after it. Not to mention we don't have the money
to
> devote to a veteranarian right now.
>
> How do I go about explaining all this to my dd? I have tried telling
her
> these things but she still asks about getting one.
>
> --
> Amanda
> http://whatmykidstaughtme.blogspot.com/
> http://365daysofsparkle.blogspot.com
>
> My "Working Toward Pro" Photographs
> www.hopescreations.com
> http://choose2bgr8.deviantart.com
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

diana jenner

On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 12:09 AM, michmdmama <horein@...> wrote:

> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> She still asks because she knows it's a cop out. I can say that
> because I have been using it too. And because after years of that
> rationale, Hayden has called me on it.
>
> I'm putting my own dog-fears to bed & we're earnestly seeking the
> perfect dog for our family (and that same voice track is running in my
> head with the volume turned waaaaay down ::bg::).
>
> Do I want to be the mom full of excuses for why he can't have a dog
> -OR- do I want to be the mom who (like most everything else)
> understands how important this is and makes it happen??
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> Your message is part right, Diana. It is a cop out, sort of. I don't
> really like dogs. I was made to take care of them when I was growing
> up and we lost so many animals (due to them being hit or dying or
> whatever)that part of me doesn't want a dog at all.
>
> However, there are breeds that I am more "warm" towards (my step dad's
> parents had a miniature Doberman, who has since passed on, that I fell
> in love with) and could definitely see myself getting, someday. I know
> that now is not that time though. We make *very* little money and are
> barely keeping ourselves afloat. It would be unfair to bring another
> mouth to feed into that mix I think.
>


























***Oh I gotcha there :) This process for me has been a really long one....
with my intent focus only for the last 6 months or so. I've only owned dogs
with my parents (NOT good examples) and one neurotic puppy as an adult that
we had to get rid of (no experience + no examples = bad sitch for us all!).
So I carried all this fear about being a good dog owner. There's not much
that'll get my attention like fear - bravely, I dug deep, to see where/why
it exists. I'm mostly a "glass half-full" kinda gal, I was surprised to find
a part of me that felt "there is no glass" and held such awful opinions of
myself. *That* process has been the most beneficial (and not just related to
the dog issue)!
And here we are, treading water financially... the temptation arises often
to say "We can't afford it" though my own experience has shown that when
it's important the money comes... I've shifted that thinking to "HOW can we
afford it?" We've looked into preparing homemade food for the dog
(incredibly labor intensive AND incredibly inexpensive) and joining 4-H as a
way to expand dog-training. And out of our watching of "The Dog Whisperer"
Hayden thinks he'd like to walk other dogs with his; for some extra cash and
because it's easier to walk dogs as a "pack."

>
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> Maybe mom and daughter can do that together.
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> I will think on this. I am not a big fan of this idea because I am
> really not that fond of dogs and her dad *really* doesn't like them so
> it would have to be me (or will it? I guess that isn't the *only*
> option). I will see what I can come up with though.
>
> I asked her if instead of getting a dog (for now) if we could maybe
> talk to people about "borrowing" their animals to walk/play
> with/perhaps bathe or whatever. She was so excited and even called me
> "the best mom ever" (gotta love these moments, right?). I am on a
> couple local lists and asked around and there is a family willing to
> let us play/walk their dog (not a puppy, but a start) so I will see
> what she says to this idea.
>
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>




















***Our local pound allows children to volunteer, even as dog trainers, if
their parent is willing to volunteer with them. There's a monthly training
meeting available. Ah, maybe there's another adult willing to do this with
her?? Maybe check with local 4-H and see if they have a dog program she can
help with (usually obstacle course kinda stuff).
When I talked to Hayden about the pound, he was interested though not yet
enough to follow through. He feels it would be hard to fall in love with
those dogs and not be able to bring them home, then come home to an empty
house. So, for that we wait.
In the meantime, we've dogsat for a weekend and now my friend brings her dog
each time she visits so Hayden can spend time with her.
And we're in communication with a family in Portland who needs to get rid of
their Shepherd mix dog named Ohana (how perfect is that?!?!?!) who may come
live with us :) (And I still don't know how.... those voices will just have
to chill out for a while and let me *be* :::vbg:::)
--
~diana :)
xoxoxoxo
hannahbearski.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-The reason I am writing all this is because I don't think other
mom's out
there should feel like being responsible is a cop out if the time is not
right for them to add a dog to the family.-=-

I agree.

Holly has a boyfriend who's over here a lot and he's allergic to cats
and dogs. If our dog died, I wouldn't rush out and buy another one,
out of consideration of Brett (other Brett, not Brett Henry, for
those who know our original Brett).

Holly wanted tortoises. She wanted to get a couple of the small ones
from her grandmother's yard on the way back from Texas the other
day. The message passed through a couple of people, and they saved,
in a box for her, two BIG tortoises. Holly wanted babyish ones, to
keep inside in a dry tank for a few months, and then take them back
to the grandparents' back yard before hybernation seasons. (There
will be a video of the two she let loose again on my blog in a day or
two.)

We both read on the internet and thought about what and where and
how. I was willing to help her make it happen, but she decided
against it for the comfort of the tortoises, who needed more room,
and are way grown and big. We have cats, and our yard isn't tortoise-
secure, and we have streets on two sides.

She might still get some smaller ones later in the year. Those were
the only two out.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-If you think your daughter is responsible/capable of all the home
needs
- feeding, watering daily, training, cleaning up potty messes/yard,
exercising, etc., then no problem (I did do all that stuff, except for
the yard cleanup, when I was that age).-=-

Did you do it without threats and shame and arguments?

Lots of parents THINK their children are capable of this or that
before the children really are. And just because someone does
something enthusiastically for the first week doesn't mean they can
keep it up on week 20 of year 6.

Sandra




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Angela Shaw

We visited my parents the other day and we played the board game "Are You
Smarter Than a 5th Grader," which we all enjoy. (my girls are 11 and 14 now
and always unschooled) The question "who invented the cotton gin?" came up.
It was my mom or dad's question, I think. After we discussed what a cotton
gin was and who invented it, my dad asked me how I teach the kids stiff like
that. (I've explained to him several times over the years about unschooling
but apparently it hasn't made much of an impact, LOL) I laughed and said,
"by playing "Are You Smarter Than a 5th Grader." He then went on to tell me
that he still knows all the prepositions (I think it was prepositions) that
he had to learn in grade school. Then he recited them. Then he laughed and
said he wished he could delete those memories and replace them with
something WORTH remembering, like when his next dr. appointment was. It
just cracked me up that in one breath he was expressing some worry about my
kids learning arbitrary facts and in the next breath he wished he could
delete the arbitrary things he memorized as a kid. I would say point made,
but I'm not sure he saw the irony of the whole thing.



Angela Shaw

game-enthusiast@...







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Julie

>
> Did you do it without threats and shame and arguments?
>
> Lots of parents THINK their children are capable of this or that
> before the children really are. And just because someone does
> something enthusiastically for the first week doesn't mean they can
> keep it up on week 20 of year 6.
>
> Sandra
>
>
>I did, actually. I cannot recall a time my parents ever shamed me or
threatened me, and no arguing with them until my teen years. I adored
my dog and we were always together . The only time we were apart was
when I was in school or sleeping -- couldn't get my mom to let me go
that far. I am not suggesting that every child can or will do what I
did or what I said, just that some kids truly are willing and able to
care for their animals. I believe it to be a case by case basis. My
son, at 10, wants a fish tank. I do not. If I believed he'd take care
of the fish and clean the tank, I could be persuaded, but I know without
doubt it would fall to me within days.

Julie


>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]