Sandra Dodd

Here is a short, wonderful video called "Learning All the Time" by
and about autonomous learners:

http://sandradodd.com/learningallthetime

There are links to the blog of the mom who edited the film.

I really, really like this.

Sandra

Julie

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>
> Here is a short, wonderful video called "Learning All the Time"
by
> and about autonomous learners:
>
> http://sandradodd.com/learningallthetime
>
> There are links to the blog of the mom who edited the film.
>
> I really, really like this.
>
> Sandra


That was really lovely for us to watch especially as we are Brits
living in Florida, it was nostalgic for us in a nice way, also very
encouraging to know that unschooling is accepted in the UK; as before
we left 6 years ago, I had never even heard of homeschooling being
very acceptable, much less unschooling.

What I liked most of all in the video was to see children and
parents, being together, naturally - not children playing with
children whilst parents sat at a safe distance away talking about
whatever it is they talk about .......school? grades? plans for
summer camp? Excuse my cynicism. (Think I got that word right.)

Julie
>

m_aduhene

Hi,
Thankyou for that. It made me feel so much better to see what I feel
deep down inside is right for my family being reflected in those
children.
Blessings
Michelle

Meghan Anderson-Coates

***********
also very
encouraging to know that unschooling is accepted in the UK; as before
we left 6 years ago, I had never even heard of homeschooling being
very acceptable, much less unschooling.

************

How funny! I guess it depends where in the UK you are (were). We lived in Brighton ('97 to 2000) when I found out about homeschooling. The only homeschooler's I knew were attachment parenting unschoolers, so that's what I thought all homeschooling was like <g>. Little did I know...until I came to the US that there were all different kinds of homeschooling, and I was an unschooler.



Meghan

Everything Is Possible ~ Deepak Chopra
I can create what I can imagine. ~ Charlene Kingston
A New Era of Humanity Begins...
10MillionClicksForPeace.org



---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

ENSEMBLE S-WAYNFORTH

Yes, actually, people seem to be much more on the unschooling end of the spectrum here (Norfolk) than they are on the school-at-home end. Although when we lived near Newcastle it was definitely the reverse. My perception is that people here spend far less time researching the kind of home-education they want to do than people do in the U.S. Or maybe that is just me. I spend a lot of time reading and thinking and writing about how I want to home-educate.

Schuyler
www.waynforth.blogspot.com


----- Original Message ----
From: Meghan Anderson-Coates <meghanandco@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, 13 November, 2007 7:29:05 AM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: a great little film--please look!

***********
also very
encouraging to know that unschooling is accepted in the UK; as before
we left 6 years ago, I had never even heard of homeschooling being
very acceptable, much less unschooling.

************

How funny! I guess it depends where in the UK you are (were). We lived in Brighton ('97 to 2000) when I found out about homeschooling. The only homeschooler's I knew were attachment parenting unschoolers, so that's what I thought all homeschooling was like <g>. Little did I know...until I came to the US that there were all different kinds of homeschooling, and I was an unschooler.



Meghan

Everything Is Possible ~ Deepak Chopra
I can create what I can imagine. ~ Charlene Kingston
A New Era of Humanity Begins...
10MillionClicksForPeace.org



---------------------------------
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Yahoo! Groups Links



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-How funny! I guess it depends where in the UK you are (were). We
lived in Brighton ('97 to 2000) when I found out about homeschooling.
The only homeschooler's I knew were attachment parenting unschoolers,
so that's what I thought all homeschooling was like <g>. Little did I
know...until I came to the US that there were all different kinds of
homeschooling, and I was an unschooler.-=-

I don't know where Canada, Australia or New Zealand would fall in
this comparison. I'm only talking UK and US here.

My friend Helena was near York and then near London, for eight years
or so. Being American and knowing my family, she knew more of the
differences in the U.S. but she wasn't aware that unschooling was the
small minority method.

There, for several reasons it seems to me (from the outside, from
correspondence and comments and stories) the mainstream is more like
unschooling, although it's called autonomous education.

Because the Church of England is both state church and kind of
secular religion, they don't have the focus on "what church do you go
to" that so much of the U.S. has. Those who were unschooling in the
70's were doing it pretty quietly, and scattered out except for
contact through Growing Without Schooling, John Holt's publication
(a newsletter, more than anything). When the fundamentalists got
separatist enough to want to pull their kids out of school, a whole
industry sprang up of Christian curriculae, materials, a "legal
protection" company (HSLDA), then rival publications and conferences,
and politics, and a college or two for homeschooled Christian kids
who want to take over the government... all of that VERY loud and
threatening and in the faces of lots of people, including secular
homeschoolers.

The UK doesn't seem to have that.

Parents aren't as awful to their kids in England as American parents
became in the course of the growth of the U.S. The protestant
beliefs and prejudices that came from the colonists linger still.
There is something concerning children's safety and rights on which
the U.S. agrees only with Somalia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Convention_on_the_Rights_of_the_Child

Another American friend of mine attended school in England
(Cambridge) when she was 15, in the late 1970's. Her dad was there
on sabbatical and the family went. She felt the teaching was much
friendlier and more creative, and they weren't assuming everyone
wanted to grow up to have a PhD (although this friend was
exceptionally scholastic and her dad was a professor). In her art
class, there was a project to design a store logo and shopping bags
to go with it. I think the sign for the store, a logo, and a bag.
That's cool, and useful. Those skills are all over the internet now,
the design of sets of elements for websites.

Sandra



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Julie

--- In [email protected], Meghan Anderson-Coates
<meghanandco@...> wrote:
>
> ***********
> also very
> encouraging to know that unschooling is accepted in the UK; as
before
> we left 6 years ago, I had never even heard of homeschooling being
> very acceptable, much less unschooling.
>
> ************
>
> How funny! I guess it depends where in the UK you are (were). We
lived in Brighton ('97 to 2000) when I found out about
homeschooling. The only homeschooler's I knew were attachment
parenting unschoolers, so that's what I thought all homeschooling
was like <g>. Little did I know...until I came to the US that there
were all different kinds of homeschooling, and I was an unschooler.
>
>
>
> Meghan
>
> Everything Is Possible ~ Deepak Chopra
> I can create what I can imagine. ~ Charlene Kingston
> A New Era of Humanity Begins...
> 10MillionClicksForPeace.org


Hi Meghan,

That is funny! Maybe I had my head stuck in the sand, (not that
there is much sand near Birmingham in the Midlands, where we came
from). It just never occurred to me that there was an alternative
to the schooling production line that I was so used to. It wasn't
until they were a little older (aged 6 and 8),and we were living in
the US, that they started to really show signs of being
uncomfortable and unhappy with school; and the more I looked into
it, the more unacceptable it seemed to be to me too. Then, the very
first example of homeschooling we were exposed to appeared to be
just as controlling and offensive as being in school, so we just
stopped doing it. Then, as if by magic, my kids just started to do
interesting and worthwhile things, having fun and being natural,
without any intervention from me other than taking them places and
providing answers to questions etc. Feeling guilty, and as if I was
doing them a disservice, I did plenty of internet research and
discovered that this was unschooling - and even better, it was
perfectly legal and "allowed". I couldn't believe our luck!! I
still can't, pinch me, I must be dreaming.We haven't looked back
since.

Julie
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you with Yahoo
Mobile. Try it now.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Sandra Dodd

-=-I did plenty of internet research and
discovered that this was unschooling - and even better, it was
perfectly legal and "allowed". -=-

I don't know about "perfectly legal," but it's doable. Each parent
needs to understand it well enough to really explain it if called on
to do so, and each should keep an eye on what the law requires so
that life could be put in those terms.

I never recommend anyone saying "Screw the law; others are
unschooling so I can too." Each family should really *get it* and
not just be standing blithely in the shadow of other families who do
get it.

These can be helpful.
http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum

Sandra




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Julie

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>
> -=-I did plenty of internet research and
> discovered that this was unschooling - and even better, it was
> perfectly legal and "allowed". -=-
>
> I don't know about "perfectly legal," but it's doable. Each
parent
> needs to understand it well enough to really explain it if called
on
> to do so, and each should keep an eye on what the law requires so
> that life could be put in those terms.
>
> I never recommend anyone saying "Screw the law; others are
> unschooling so I can too." Each family should really *get it*
and
> not just be standing blithely in the shadow of other families who
do
> get it.
>
> These can be helpful.
> http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Yes, thank you Sandra, I should definitely have worded that better.

At the time that I discovered that unschooling existed, it appeared
to me from all the various websites, blogs and lists I had come
across, that as many families are living this way of life, it must
of course be something that is "perfectly legal" and "allowed". On
looking deeper into it, of course, I soon realised that we still had
to abide by our school district's requirements and laws concerning
homeschool reporting etc. I simply found the easiest way for our
family to do that, in line with Florida's laws, and subsequently,
the wonderful natural life we dreamed of did come into our reach in
a "perfectly legal" manner.

"Doable" is a much better word to have used, and I fully understand
the need to be accurate with our words on this list, so as not to
give out the wrong impression.

Forgive me for my exuberance, I just still get so excited when I
wake up most days, and remember that we don't have to go to school
to learn, and I don't have to inflict that on my children.

I assure you our family does get it, never needing to stand in any
other family's shadow, and it's mostly thanks to you, your essays
and blogs, and also writings by Joyce Fetteroll and Pam Sorooshian,
plus earlier contact with a great lady, Nance Confer who first
explained it all to me.

Having been unschooling for a short while, it just seems so natural,
and when I look at the quality of the things my girls choose to do
with their time now, I know it works.

Thank you once again.

Julie
>

Julie

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>
> -=-I did plenty of internet research and
> discovered that this was unschooling - and even better, it was
> perfectly legal and "allowed". -=-
>
> I don't know about "perfectly legal," but it's doable. Each
parent
> needs to understand it well enough to really explain it if called
on
> to do so, and each should keep an eye on what the law requires so
> that life could be put in those terms.
>
> I never recommend anyone saying "Screw the law; others are
> unschooling so I can too." Each family should really *get it*
and
> not just be standing blithely in the shadow of other families who
do
> get it.
>
> These can be helpful.
> http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I forgot to say, thank you for the link, I will definitely read it.

Julie
>

Sandra Dodd

-=Forgive me for my exuberance, -=-

I love exuberance!
I just don't want to have people say "Yeah, but you said..." if they
get in trouble.

Thanks for understanding.

-=-
Having been unschooling for a short while, it just seems so natural,
and when I look at the quality of the things my girls choose to do
with their time now, I know it works.-=-

My kids are temporarily 16, 18 and 21, and I love to see the things
they do with their time too.

It's wonderful, all 'round.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Meghan Anderson-Coates

***********
Yes, actually, people seem to be much more on the unschooling end of the spectrum here (Norfolk)

***********

We spent a lot of time in Blakney (especially in the summer) over our years in the UK ('88 to 2000). My ex's parents have a caravan there. My ex still takes dd there in the summer when she visits him. We have some really nice memories from that part of the world :-)



Meghan

Everything Is Possible ~ Deepak Chopra
I can create what I can imagine. ~ Charlene Kingston
A New Era of Humanity Begins...
10MillionClicksForPeace.org



---------------------------------
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Redomestication.com

Hi Folks!

My name is Michelle and I'm a WAHM considering unschooling my 5 year old
- he started K this year and is having a rough time. I also have a 1
year old at home, and a husband who is an artist / gardening / plant
guy. Husband spends most of his daytime with the baby, while I work. I
am the sole income provider - husband's art & plant stuff have been put
on the back burner while our little one is so tiny and needs more care.
When he's able to get back to his businesses, it'll probably only amount
for 10% of our income. So my working is entirely necessary.

To add to the story, my 5 year old is not my husband's son, he is from a
previous relationship. My husband loves him and treats him as his own,
which is wonderful, but he doesn't have the same *knowing* of my boy
that a parent-from-birth does. My husband isn't into school or
bookwork, and sees much more value in day-to-day learning by doing,
which is awesome. But I also feel like it'll be more my job (and
reasonably so) to be with the 5 year old, encouraging, strewing about
interesting things, being with him and helping him... He'd been in
preschool before K, and needs guidance to find things to do. I think
he's somewhat used to having an adult saying, "Now we're coloring. Now
we're doing worksheets." etc. and isn't as able to entertain himself.

So I will need to be there with him, for him, to keep his days
interesting and entertaining and full of life.

I also just feel like it's so not right - not sending a good message -
that my husband, myself and the littlest one stay home and the oldest
gets trucked off to school. It feels separate, icky.

I'm not sure how to do unschooling while also working at home. I
already don't get enough done with my husband and the baby needing me
throughout the day. But sometimes I feel like I'd get so much more done
if they would just LEAVE ME ALONE for a few uninterrupted hours. I feel
like if I had a few hours, no interruptions, I could get the day's work
done and I would then have the rest of the day to focus on my family,
exploring, .

I work on the computer, it's very solo work and not something I can do
*with* anyone.

So, what I'm asking for is any experience or stories from BTDT
unschooling moms who are also engaged in a home business. How do you
balance being with your kids with your work? Is it possible? I see
this as our biggest obstacle to unschooling, so I would appreciate any
thoughts you can give. I'm terrified that I'll make the leap - with a
"We'll make it work" attitude, and I'll find I'm NOT getting work done,
NOT making money, and, well, we won't be able to pay the bills.

Also, because I did work outside the home for a long time, as a single
parent, (that's why the oldest started preschool originally) I'm
honestly totally confused as to what the heck we would do all day. Most
of our weekend time is relaxed, spent decompressing from the week. We
sometimes go on a little day trip to somewhere interesting. But I'm at
a loss as to what my 5 year old would DO all day. He has games, toys,
books, TV, 5 acres to run around on. But even on a weekend - or, heck,
an evening - he gets bored. So I really don't know how I would fill his
day - or help him fill it with stuff he's interested in, for that
matter. Again, any tips/ideas would be so appreciated.

He's VERY social, loves to be with other children, but there are no
homeschooling groups in our area (although I'm sure there are
homeschoolers... I just don't know where to find them). We would have
to drive about an hour to find one. Plus, we live in a fairly remote
area, so access to zoos, "field trip" kind of places, is limited without
a long drive.

Thanks for reading this far, and I really appreciate this list. I've
been reading ya'll (at various places) since my boy was 2... So it's
been in the back of my mind for a long, long time.

-Michelle

Estella Schmelter

Wow Michelle Thanks for asking this!!!

I'm so glad you asked this question because I'm in the same situation. I'm trying to get out of the whole workbook/curriculum thing and not sure how to work in the unschooling and still have time to work my business. Obviously that is important to me too and allows me to stay home with my 3 kids (6, 4 3/4 and 1yr old). I have talked to a few people from my company and team that WAH but they do a specific schedule and curriculum.

I look forward to many ideas!
Estella

"Redomestication.com" <redomestication@...> wrote:
Hi Folks!

My name is Michelle and I'm a WAHM considering unschooling my 5 year old
- he started K this year and is having a rough time. I also have a 1
year old at home, and a husband who is an artist / gardening / plant
guy. Husband spends most of his daytime with the baby, while I work. I
am the sole income provider - husband's art & plant stuff have been put
on the back burner while our little one is so tiny and needs more care.
When he's able to get back to his businesses, it'll probably only amount
for 10% of our income. So my working is entirely necessary.

To add to the story, my 5 year old is not my husband's son, he is from a
previous relationship. My husband loves him and treats him as his own,
which is wonderful, but he doesn't have the same *knowing* of my boy
that a parent-from-birth does. My husband isn't into school or
bookwork, and sees much more value in day-to-day learning by doing,
which is awesome. But I also feel like it'll be more my job (and
reasonably so) to be with the 5 year old, encouraging, strewing about
interesting things, being with him and helping him... He'd been in
preschool before K, and needs guidance to find things to do. I think
he's somewhat used to having an adult saying, "Now we're coloring. Now
we're doing worksheets." etc. and isn't as able to entertain himself.

So I will need to be there with him, for him, to keep his days
interesting and entertaining and full of life.

I also just feel like it's so not right - not sending a good message -
that my husband, myself and the littlest one stay home and the oldest
gets trucked off to school. It feels separate, icky.

I'm not sure how to do unschooling while also working at home. I
already don't get enough done with my husband and the baby needing me
throughout the day. But sometimes I feel like I'd get so much more done
if they would just LEAVE ME ALONE for a few uninterrupted hours. I feel
like if I had a few hours, no interruptions, I could get the day's work
done and I would then have the rest of the day to focus on my family,
exploring, .

I work on the computer, it's very solo work and not something I can do
*with* anyone.

So, what I'm asking for is any experience or stories from BTDT
unschooling moms who are also engaged in a home business. How do you
balance being with your kids with your work? Is it possible? I see
this as our biggest obstacle to unschooling, so I would appreciate any
thoughts you can give. I'm terrified that I'll make the leap - with a
"We'll make it work" attitude, and I'll find I'm NOT getting work done,
NOT making money, and, well, we won't be able to pay the bills.

Also, because I did work outside the home for a long time, as a single
parent, (that's why the oldest started preschool originally) I'm
honestly totally confused as to what the heck we would do all day. Most
of our weekend time is relaxed, spent decompressing from the week. We
sometimes go on a little day trip to somewhere interesting. But I'm at
a loss as to what my 5 year old would DO all day. He has games, toys,
books, TV, 5 acres to run around on. But even on a weekend - or, heck,
an evening - he gets bored. So I really don't know how I would fill his
day - or help him fill it with stuff he's interested in, for that
matter. Again, any tips/ideas would be so appreciated.

He's VERY social, loves to be with other children, but there are no
homeschooling groups in our area (although I'm sure there are
homeschoolers... I just don't know where to find them). We would have
to drive about an hour to find one. Plus, we live in a fairly remote
area, so access to zoos, "field trip" kind of places, is limited without
a long drive.

Thanks for reading this far, and I really appreciate this list. I've
been reading ya'll (at various places) since my boy was 2... So it's
been in the back of my mind for a long, long time.

-Michelle






Work At Home United!!

Estella Schmelter
Senior Director
Mom to Junior,Hunter & Baby Jalynn
Phone: 517-748-9344
Your Life, Your Dreams,
Your Business....Find Out Today!!
www.WorkAtHomeUnitedSuccess.com


















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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Laureen

Heya!

I can't necessarily address your whole post, but bits of it... I am a
fulltime telecommuting, primary-breadwinning member of my family. My
husband is a occasionally-working-for-pay, primary-fathering, member
of the family. And my brother in law lives with us too, pitching in
here and there. We have a five year old, a two year old, and I'm
pregnant with #3. We're not officially anything-schooling, yet.

On Nov 14, 2007 1:25 PM, Redomestication.com <redomestication@...> wrote:
> guy. Husband spends most of his daytime with the baby, while I work. I
> am the sole income provider - husband's art & plant stuff have been put
> on the back burner while our little one is so tiny and needs more care.
> When he's able to get back to his businesses, it'll probably only amount
> for 10% of our income. So my working is entirely necessary.

Gotcha. Yeah, so is mine. We made the decision for me to be the
primary, because 1) I telecommute, so I have maximal flexibility, 2) I
can make more than DH, and 3) my work isn't as hard on my body as his
is (he's a general contractor by training).

> that a parent-from-birth does. My husband isn't into school or
> bookwork, and sees much more value in day-to-day learning by doing,
> which is awesome. But I also feel like it'll be more my job (and
> reasonably so) to be with the 5 year old, encouraging, strewing about
> interesting things, being with him and helping him...

It tends to be more my job to find opportunities. Free museum days,
nature walks, festivals and presentations and park days and that kind
of thing. But finding formal stuff to do, isn't nearly as important as
paying enough attention to see what sparks there are *in them*.

He'd been in
> preschool before K, and needs guidance to find things to do.

That may well be an assumption that needs questioning.

I think
> he's somewhat used to having an adult saying, "Now we're coloring. Now
> we're doing worksheets." etc. and isn't as able to entertain himself.

Have you given him that space?

> So I will need to be there with him, for him, to keep his days
> interesting and entertaining and full of life.

You might really want to step back from that. Kids learn so many
implicit lessons, just by being, and one of the things you're showing
him is that you don't necessarily trust your husband to be a competent
nurturer/role model, and that your work isn't something worthy of
focus.

> I also just feel like it's so not right - not sending a good message -
> that my husband, myself and the littlest one stay home and the oldest
> gets trucked off to school. It feels separate, icky.

I hear that. I have been snarling at people who insist I send Rowan to
preschool for over two years now.

> I'm not sure how to do unschooling while also working at home. I
> already don't get enough done with my husband and the baby needing me
> throughout the day.

When my boys were tiny, I had office space away from the main room of
the house, and I was offlimits for 45 minutes of the hour. I'd come
check in every 45, nurse, potty, etc. Then back to the grind. If
you're the breadwinner, you have to focus.

> But sometimes I feel like I'd get so much more done
> if they would just LEAVE ME ALONE for a few uninterrupted hours.

Grin. I hear that one. At this stage, Rowan and Kestrel both recognize
that if I have a headset on, it means I'm in a meeting and they need
to be quiet. I know another telecommuting mama who wears her badge,
and that's her children's signal that Mama is working, and to be
interrupted only in direst emergency.

All of this presupposes total trust in the child's caregiver, though.

> I feel
> like if I had a few hours, no interruptions, I could get the day's work
> done and I would then have the rest of the day to focus on my family,
> exploring, .

So why can't you? Is your baby still nursing?

> I work on the computer, it's very solo work and not something I can do
> *with* anyone.

I hear that. I'm a technical editor, and that's work that doesn't
share well. On the other hand, I've had great success in setting up
another laptop right next to mine, and putting games, youtube, and
DVDs on it. Sometimes, what they want is to do what you're doing. So
you enable that. Rowan's learned most of what he knows about typing by
sitting next to me with a blank word processing document in front of
him, trying to do what I do.

> So, what I'm asking for is any experience or stories from BTDT
> unschooling moms who are also engaged in a home business. How do you
> balance being with your kids with your work? Is it possible?

Here's something I wrote on this:
http://lifewithoutschool.typepad.com/lifewithoutschool/2007/07/day-of-a-thousa.html

I see
> this as our biggest obstacle to unschooling, so I would appreciate any
> thoughts you can give. I'm terrified that I'll make the leap - with a
> "We'll make it work" attitude, and I'll find I'm NOT getting work done,
> NOT making money, and, well, we won't be able to pay the bills.

You totally need spousal support and communication, and it helps if
you guys are wired in parallel with regards to your priorities. Mutual
respect is absolutely critical. And here's something I wrote on that:
http://lifewithoutschool.typepad.com/lifewithoutschool/2007/02/the_crooked_law.html

> Also, because I did work outside the home for a long time, as a single
> parent, (that's why the oldest started preschool originally) I'm
> honestly totally confused as to what the heck we would do all day.

Oh my gosh. Calvin (and Hobbes) was right... the days are just packed.
Follow an interest, see where it takes you.


Most
> of our weekend time is relaxed, spent decompressing from the week. We
> sometimes go on a little day trip to somewhere interesting. But I'm at
> a loss as to what my 5 year old would DO all day. He has games, toys,
> books, TV, 5 acres to run around on. But even on a weekend - or, heck,
> an evening - he gets bored. So I really don't know how I would fill his
> day - or help him fill it with stuff he's interested in, for that
> matter. Again, any tips/ideas would be so appreciated.

What exactly is your husband doing with them? Does he understand strewing?

The other thing that might be helpful, at least from where I sit, is
that our culture is very into the idea that every moment must be spent
in doing, rather than just in being. Sometimes, Rowan wants to be left
alone, to sit on his bunk and stare at the ceiling. He's not
interested in toys, games, movies, walks, anything. He needs time to
decompress, to think, to integrate. It's easy for a schoolish brain to
panic at that point. But inevitably, he's processing big stuff, and
comes out wanting to talk about whatever he's been pondering. It's
critical time for him, that looks very much like "nothing" but is in
fact everything.

> He's VERY social, loves to be with other children, but there are no
> homeschooling groups in our area (although I'm sure there are
> homeschoolers... I just don't know where to find them). We would have
> to drive about an hour to find one. Plus, we live in a fairly remote
> area, so access to zoos, "field trip" kind of places, is limited without
> a long drive.

There are tons of resources out there to help you find homeschooling groups.

I'm finding that formal "field trip" stuff is not where it's at, with
my kids. There's a place out behind the local racetrack where a bunch
of folks have made found-material sculpture. You'd never know it was
there unless you stumbled into it, which is what my brother in law
did, while looking for a good place to let the dog run free. He took
the kids there yesterday, and they spent probably six straight hours
exploring sculpture, how it was put together, which ones were stable,
which fell down and why, how people picked what they were going to
make, what kinds of stuff the boys wanted to make, what materials were
around, where they might scrounge other materials, why people made
stuff like that (what motivates art), why there's driftwood and
flotsam and jetsam right there on that beach anyway (which apparently
led to a discussion of Bay currents)... on and on and on.

It's totally doable. You just need the right infrastructure. =)


--
~~L!

~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~
Writing here:
http://www.theexcellentadventure.com/
http://lifewithoutschool.typepad.com/

Publishing here:
http://huntpress.com/
~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~

Ed Wendell

I work out of the home full time - dad/hubby is the stay at home person but we all live life as it is together as a family every day. Dad and son - Zachariah age 13 - have been home together for almost 5 years.

I must say that there have been times I was envious of dear dad for being the one to stay home but when I come home (as in yesterday) and my son tells me about a hole they dug, poured in a bit of gasoline and lit it to make it burn and how they were digging the hole deeper while it burned, and it kept poofing, but they had a really long handled shovel, etc. I knew it was right that dear ol' dad was at home and not I ;) Zac just kept going on and on about how "COOL" it was and then went off on various tangents about what else they could do. He was sooooooo excited and I know I would not have facilitated such an experiment - I would have said wait for your dad ;)

They have had many great adventures together - they have even gone on trips without me. They went crystal digging in Arkansas and brought back huge crystals, trips with other homeschoolers, etc. I come home to dear skulls in my family room, bird nest (full of bugs) on my kitchen counter, "treasures" they found in the creek on our property, science experiment in the bathroom (one lasted a couple of years - he took a bottle of water and filled it with various objects, sealed it and then observed for changes - he kept it in the hall bath)

This is not to say I am not involved - we do most things as a family but I don't expect them to wait for me. Often they will return with some found treasure or experience and they joyfully share with me. I still help strew, we go on family outings, vacations, watch movies/shows together, have discussions, etc. This is a family adventure living life the fullest we can as a family and as individuals at times as he gets older. I don't feel that it is my job to do this or that or my husband's - we do it together - team work. What one does not think of the other tends to think of so it just all flows and happens.

I know this does not actually help you figure out how to work from home - but if dad is there maybe you could have a few hours of privacy to get the work done so you'd have more time in the long run? Some people cannot be interrupted and get anything done - others can be. If you had to have the few hours off by yourself - is there a way you could shut yourself away as if you had left the house to go to work?


Lisa W.







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-What exactly is your husband doing with them? Does he understand
strewing?-=-



http://sandradodd.com/strewing
The idea is to find interesting things and leave them where they can
be discovered and experimented with, examined, played with, or
not. If you leave shells out the kids might get really excited,
might make up a game with them, might want to know where they came
from, or might not much care. Leave other things out, put things in
the sunshine that are sparkly or reflective. Find pretty rocks and
put them in a bowl of water to see how different they look.
Rearrange the world a little.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Redomestication.com

Thanks so much Laureen!

> He'd been in
> > preschool before K, and needs guidance to find things to do.
>
> That may well be an assumption that needs questioning.
>
> I think
> > he's somewhat used to having an adult saying, "Now we're coloring. Now
> > we're doing worksheets." etc. and isn't as able to entertain himself.
>
> Have you given him that space?
>

He tells me he's bored a lot. Boredom is ok. I just read the page on
Sandra's site about it (again). But I want to be available for him when
he's bored and asks for a little inspiration.

I feel like if I have an open-door policy while I'm working, then I'm
never going to get any work done because I'll be interrupted every 10
minutes. If I have a closed door policy for, say, 5 hours a day, then
I'm not being available to him, not partnering, and that doesn't seem
very unschooling, from my understanding.

> > I feel
> > like if I had a few hours, no interruptions, I could get the day's
work
> > done and I would then have the rest of the day to focus on my family,
> > exploring, .
>
> So why can't you? Is your baby still nursing?

Yes, baby is still nursing on demand. Husband is bored to death,
watches TV all day while baby crawls about and explores, comes upstairs
and wants to talk to me to get some adult interaction. Or baby gets a
bit cranky and husband brings him up to nurse even though he's not
really hungry, DH just wants a few minutes to himself to regroup or
whatever.

> When my boys were tiny, I had office space away from the main room of
> the house, and I was offlimits for 45 minutes of the hour.

This is good - I like this!

I don't want to come up with this great "idea" of unschooling, convince
my husband it's the thing to do, and then leave him to it all while I'm
working. Particurally since my 5 y/o isn't his son. It's like, "Here,
this is cool - you do it, I have other things to do." That's not nice.
I want to find a way - schedule-wise - that we're partners.

Besides, part of the goal, to me, is being with my boy more. I missed a
lot of him when he was younger because I had no choice but to go the
daycare/preschool route.

I think the biggest thing is that I need to get DH on board giving me
uninterrupted work time each day.

If I accomplish just a bit, I'd feel much more comfortable leaving for
the day and being really *with* them. I often find myself trying to
enjoy a book, movie, whatever as a family and instead thinking of all
the stuff left undone that day. So I'm not really as present as I'd
like to be.

I think my 5 y/o (and husband) sense that.

I should add my 5 y/o has an in-and-out biological dad who comes and
goes, like the wind... DS is going through a tough emotional time about
that right now, he's recently developed a much keener sense of time and
realizes when Dad doesn't call, or that's it's been months since he's
seen him. It's making him a lot more needy of me, the security he gets
from mom, so what I'm experiencing with him RIGHT NOW - the every 10
minutes needing me thing, isn't the norm that I will have to deal with
in terms of working forever...

Laureen, I really appreciate your input - sounds like we're in similar
situations. My DH just can't make as much as I do, and now that we've
moved rural, can't make much at all (until we get his independent
business going more). And that's fine - I've no problem with the
role-reversal, I like my job, that's why I picked it.

You have my highest respect for doing all that you do! I'll get there
too, soon enough!

-Michelle

Redomestication.com

Today he did kitchen cleanup in the morning, once DS was at school.
Then he watched TV until it was time to pick up DS from school.

Sometimes I feel like my husband needs strewing as much as DS does. :-)

He's in a rut.

But in all seriousness, I think he understands the concept in a very
vague way, and I think if he were to see it in action, see me do it,
he'd catch on.

-Michelle

Sandra Dodd wrote:
>
>
> -=-What exactly is your husband doing with them? Does he understand
> strewing?-=-
>
> http://sandradodd.com/strewing <http://sandradodd.com/strewing>
> The idea is to find interesting things and leave them where they can
> be discovered and experimented with, examined, played with, or
> not. If you leave shells out the kids might get really excited,
> might make up a game with them, might want to know where they came
> from, or might not much care. Leave other things out, put things in
> the sunshine that are sparkly or reflective. Find pretty rocks and
> put them in a bowl of water to see how different they look.
> Rearrange the world a little.
>
> Sandra
>
>

Redomestication.com

Oh yes! I so agree! Having met my husband has been one of the best
things for DS, as I wasn't really keen on all the cool boy things. :-)

They go out on weekends hunting for gold (we live in California Gold
Country) or looking for cool streams and waterfalls. Dh really like
rocks, mining history, geology, so they explore like that a lot. We go
on trips to historical mines and the like.

Now - digging a hole to put gas in it - that sounds fun!!! I want to see!

DH also really like keeping out 5 acres from growing right up into the
house, so he's walways got burn piles going during burn season, hauling
branches and cutting down sick trees, and DS loves that stuff. Even
stacking wood, he loves it. He's a very outdoorsy, active boy, and I
like to sit and read, LOL. So I am so grateful to have such an amazing
man to help my boy grow into a man in a way I never could.

DH often talks about how he can't wait for our 1 y/o DS to get just a
bit bigger so he can come on their outing more often, and they can do
more things together.

I think I just need to sit down with DH and draw up a schedule. We've
talked about, "I need more uninterrupted work time," but I think his
idea of that and mine are vastly different. Or, sometimes, he'll go
overboard and leave me be for 10 hours of the day, and then next day
really need my support/help parenting. I don't need all that. Just a
few hours each day.

Thanks Lisa - this did help remind me a lot of the cool stuff they
already do together, and how important that is for them.

-Michelle

Ed Wendell wrote:
>
>
> I work out of the home full time - dad/hubby is the stay at home person
> but we all live life as it is together as a family every day. Dad and
> son - Zachariah age 13 - have been home together for almost 5 years.
>
> I must say that there have been times I was envious of dear dad for
> being the one to stay home but when I come home (as in yesterday) and my
> son tells me about a hole they dug, poured in a bit of gasoline and lit
> it to make it burn and how they were digging the hole deeper while it
> burned, and it kept poofing, but they had a really long handled shovel,
> etc. I knew it was right that dear ol' dad was at home and not I ;) Zac
> just kept going on and on about how "COOL" it was and then went off on
> various tangents about what else they could do. He was sooooooo excited
> and I know I would not have facilitated such an experiment - I would
> have said wait for your dad ;)
>
> They have had many great adventures together - they have even gone on
> trips without me. They went crystal digging in Arkansas and brought back
> huge crystals, trips with other homeschoolers, etc. I come home to dear
> skulls in my family room, bird nest (full of bugs) on my kitchen
> counter, "treasures" they found in the creek on our property, science
> experiment in the bathroom (one lasted a couple of years - he took a
> bottle of water and filled it with various objects, sealed it and then
> observed for changes - he kept it in the hall bath)
>
> This is not to say I am not involved - we do most things as a family but
> I don't expect them to wait for me. Often they will return with some
> found treasure or experience and they joyfully share with me. I still
> help strew, we go on family outings, vacations, watch movies/shows
> together, have discussions, etc. This is a family adventure living life
> the fullest we can as a family and as individuals at times as he gets
> older. I don't feel that it is my job to do this or that or my husband's
> - we do it together - team work. What one does not think of the other
> tends to think of so it just all flows and happens.
>
> I know this does not actually help you figure out how to work from home
> - but if dad is there maybe you could have a few hours of privacy to get
> the work done so you'd have more time in the long run? Some people
> cannot be interrupted and get anything done - others can be. If you had
> to have the few hours off by yourself - is there a way you could shut
> yourself away as if you had left the house to go to work?
>
> Lisa W.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

Redomestication.com

So Estella - I must ask! How on earth did/do you do structured
schooling with your work? Did you do "school" in the morning and
afternoon work time, or? How do you keep the kids from interrupting
when you are working?

For me too, it's my working at home that allows me to stay home (I could
never make what I make at home at a traditional job), and even with DS
in school, I'm much more available for him then I would be if I was away
9 hours of the day.

But I still want more for him, which is what brings me here.

What made you decide to get out of the curriculum thing? I've never
wanted to go that route, but I'm curious what's not working for you.

-Michelle

Estella Schmelter wrote:
>
>
> Wow Michelle Thanks for asking this!!!
>
> I'm so glad you asked this question because I'm in the same situation.
> I'm trying to get out of the whole workbook/curriculum thing and not
> sure how to work in the unschooling and still have time to work my
> business. Obviously that is important to me too and allows me to stay
> home with my 3 kids (6, 4 3/4 and 1yr old). I have talked to a few
> people from my company and team that WAH but they do a specific schedule
> and curriculum.
>
> I look forward to many ideas!
> Estella
>

Sandra Dodd

Instead of one-on-one conversations, this group is for general
discussion...

--=-What made you decide to get out of the curriculum thing? I've never
wanted to go that route, but I'm curious what's not working for you.-=-

...only not for discussion of curriculum.



Let's talk about unschooling.



Sandra






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Laureen

Heya!

On Nov 14, 2007 10:22 PM, Redomestication.com <redomestication@...> wrote:
> DH often talks about how he can't wait for our 1 y/o DS to get just a
> bit bigger so he can come on their outing more often, and they can do
> more things together.

Get him a back-carry sling, pronto. We have Ergos, but due to some
uncool business practices, we're recommending other variations on that
theme these days. Anyway... Jason was taking Rowan and Kestrel out to
jobsites, on hikes, just generally doing whatever he normally does,
from the time they had head control. When a little one is in a sling
like that, their head is right by whoever's wearing them, and they
have a birds' eye view of the goings on, with the safety of being all
bundled up next to an adult body.

I think that especially for male caregivers, who are more used to an
active model of "doing stuff", it's critical. It nicely sets the stage
for "just involve them in what is naturally going on around them, and
let them see what passion and enthusiasm look like in their native
environment".

--
~~L!

~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~
Writing here:
http://www.theexcellentadventure.com/
http://lifewithoutschool.typepad.com/

Publishing here:
http://huntpress.com/
~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~

Laureen

Heya!

On Nov 14, 2007 10:09 PM, Redomestication.com <redomestication@...> wrote:
> He tells me he's bored a lot. Boredom is ok. I just read the page on
> Sandra's site about it (again). But I want to be available for him when
> he's bored and asks for a little inspiration.

FWIW, "I'm bored" is a really fashionable thing to say in the
conventionally-schooled set. After one play session with their
preschooled/daycared cousin, both my boys were doing the full on "I'm
booooooooooooored!", complete with flounce to indicate the depth of
the feeling. Totally ruined the effect when they then charged off to
have a pillow fight. =) Rowan and I discussed what "bored" actually
means, and he was surprised. He was using the term because he liked
the feeling, the word sound, but didn't understand the implications.

> I feel like if I have an open-door policy while I'm working, then I'm
> never going to get any work done because I'll be interrupted every 10
> minutes. If I have a closed door policy for, say, 5 hours a day, then
> I'm not being available to him, not partnering, and that doesn't seem
> very unschooling, from my understanding.

With age and practice, there gets to be a rhythm. But if your spouse
respects your space, the kids will pick up on it, and model it.

> Yes, baby is still nursing on demand. Husband is bored to death,

So the husband is the problem.

> watches TV all day while baby crawls about and explores,

So the husband isn't actually interacting with the kids?

comes upstairs
> and wants to talk to me to get some adult interaction.

Oh. Yeah, I see where you're having issues. He needs to do what SAHMs
have done since time immemorial; reach out, go to parks and
playgroups, and not lay *everything* on your shoulders. It's a gift
that you're able to be there at all, and when everyone sees that, it
changes the tone and flavor of the whole thing to be a more mutually
assistive kind of thing.

Or baby gets a
> bit cranky and husband brings him up to nurse even though he's not
> really hungry, DH just wants a few minutes to himself to regroup or
> whatever.

Does he understand that he's putting you in the position of having to
do everything? That's not real respectful.

> I don't want to come up with this great "idea" of unschooling, convince
> my husband it's the thing to do, and then leave him to it all while I'm
> working. Particurally since my 5 y/o isn't his son. It's like, "Here,
> this is cool - you do it, I have other things to do." That's not nice.
> I want to find a way - schedule-wise - that we're partners.

I am really really confused here. I could be totally wrong, since the
whole unschooling mindset is pretty new for me, but it seems to me
that either you're a family all pulling together, or you are not, and
if you aren't, there are a number of things that won't work optimally.

Someone's got to make money. Implicit in the decision for that someone
to be you is the decision that someone needs to be primary caregiver
to the children, and that someone is him. If he isn't stepping up to
the plate, that's a huge problem.

> Besides, part of the goal, to me, is being with my boy more. I missed a
> lot of him when he was younger because I had no choice but to go the
> daycare/preschool route.

Gotcha.

> I think the biggest thing is that I need to get DH on board giving me
> uninterrupted work time each day.

The 45 minute thing worked well for us when Kestrel was nursing (his
natural interval was longer than that, so I was offering before
hunger), and then it gradually increased over time.

> If I accomplish just a bit, I'd feel much more comfortable leaving for
> the day and being really *with* them. I often find myself trying to
> enjoy a book, movie, whatever as a family and instead thinking of all
> the stuff left undone that day. So I'm not really as present as I'd
> like to be.

::nodding:: Of course. I find it to be an excellent exercise in
mindfulness. Be here now... whether here is with my work when I'm
working, or with my kids when I'm not.

> I think my 5 y/o (and husband) sense that.

how could they not? most likely the baby does too.

> I should add my 5 y/o has an in-and-out biological dad who comes and
> goes, like the wind... DS is going through a tough emotional time about
> that right now, he's recently developed a much keener sense of time and
> realizes when Dad doesn't call, or that's it's been months since he's
> seen him. It's making him a lot more needy of me, the security he gets
> from mom, so what I'm experiencing with him RIGHT NOW - the every 10
> minutes needing me thing, isn't the norm that I will have to deal with
> in terms of working forever...

Try for mental isolation rather than physical, then. Try setting up a
"workstation" right next to you, or in your office space, where
there's a laptop, or pens, pencils, crayons, paper, a stapler, paper
clips, other cool office supply things. Let him know that you need to
focus on work but you'd love having him with you. I got interrupted a
ton in the beginning, but now, the boys totally get the difference
between "head down" and "available for stuff".

> You have my highest respect for doing all that you do! I'll get there
> too, soon enough!

It can be a little hard to start. Also, don't overlook the fact that
society at large makes it tough for men to be primaries. My DH is very
comfortable in his role, and was pretty much born to be a father, but
the unconscious and pretty unbelievable comments people have made to
him sometimes knock him pretty hard. I like to think that some day,
equality and respect will be givens. But right now, like it or not,
men as primaries are really unusual, and are going to take some knocks
for it.

--
~~L!

~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~
Writing here:
http://www.theexcellentadventure.com/
http://lifewithoutschool.typepad.com/

Publishing here:
http://huntpress.com/
~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~

Redomestication.com

> Get him a back-carry sling, pronto.

We've actually got an Ergo from when Rory (my 5 y/o) was a bay, as well
as a Graco (or whatever brand) carrier. DH uses these for shorter trips
out and about, but the baby gets HEAVY after a while - he's already 27
lbs, LOL.

I think he's just looking forward to having the option of setting him
down - but he does take them on shorter outings most weekends.

And I totally agree - "doing stuff" - like real, concrete things - "We
built a fort" or "We raked leaves" or "We dug up quartz crystals" is
where my husband shines most, and where his enthusiasm spreads easily to
Rory.

I would love to hear from others as well how dads involve themselves -
of course, the "everyday" stuff. But what kind of fun do your kids have
with Dad that's more of a "dad and me" thing?

I'm making mental notes for DH on all the cool stuff they already do
that's totally a part of unschooling life - living life, learning from
it... I think he's unclear on clear on how that "works" so taking
examples from our own life, as well as others, will be helpful for him -
or, should I say, for me clarifying to him.

-Michelle

Redomestication.com

> > Yes, baby is still nursing on demand. Husband is bored to death,
>
> So the husband is the problem.
>
> > watches TV all day while baby crawls about and explores,
>
> So the husband isn't actually interacting with the kids?
>
> comes upstairs
> > and wants to talk to me to get some adult interaction.
>
> Oh. Yeah, I see where you're having issues. He needs to do what SAHMs
> have done since time immemorial; reach out, go to parks and
> playgroups, and not lay *everything* on your shoulders. It's a gift
> that you're able to be there at all, and when everyone sees that, it
> changes the tone and flavor of the whole thing to be a more mutually
> assistive kind of thing.

Yes. He's the problem in that, while Rory is at school, he interrupts
me, is needy, etc. The baby really only needs me, on most days, once
before school is out for a snack.

I think he's having a tough time adjusting to being a SAH dad, to losing
a certain amount of freedom, to not having as much time as he'd like for
his interests. I think he's also suffering from a case of "I can't" - I
can't do x because the baby.

We need a better rhythm to our days to free us *both* up to have
individual time to work on our stuff, as well as be with the kids.

He does interact with Colum (the 1 year old) and I'm sorry I didn't make
it sound so. They talk and play and eat and laugh and all those
wonderful things babies need. They do do it in front of the TV about
85% of the time. Colum is getting what he needs - adult attention and
play - but I think DH is not, and I think he doesn't see other options.

To be honest, I don't see many others either. We are somewhat new to
where we live so don't have friends around, it's a very small community
and the one "moms" group that used to meet up is now defunct. I don't
think he'd be comfortable going to a moms group anyway.

DH goes out to the store with Colum and runs errands a couple mornings a
week, does general housework. When Rory gets home from school the TV
usually goes off for a bit and DH goes outside with Rory and they do
some property maintenance things; they both enjoy that. After that I do
homework with Rory, DH has baby, and then we settle in for dinner time,
evening plans, etc.

So that's my dilemma, I guess. I feel like, for unscholing to work, DH
needs to do something other then watch TV in the morning hours while I
work, so that Rory has a better... example? model? more stimulating
environment?

I think he looks at things - we'll, he's said this, - that it's nice for
me because I get to work and have "me" or "alone" time, and he doesn't.
But I can't help that. Someone has to work, it's clearly going to be
me, and that leaves, as you said, the other parent as a caregiver during
that time.

> I am really really confused here. I could be totally wrong, since the
> whole unschooling mindset is pretty new for me, but it seems to me
> that either you're a family all pulling together, or you are not, and
> if you aren't, there are a number of things that won't work optimally.

Yes... I feel like we're not working together as well as we could -
although I know we're trying! And it's all on the "he's with the baby
all morning and I'm off working" thing. I feel guilty, he feels lonely,
there's an amount of resentment on both sides, rinse, repeat.

Maybe it would be helpful for DH to have an afternoon each week, or
whatever amount of time, where he had all the time to himself to do
whatever he wanted all on his own. I know there are SAHM's who do that
and come back a bit more refreshed.

You know what I want?

JOY

I want DH to be joyous, to see possibility each day. From his time with
the boys, that will spread to them.

Maybe that's me putting expectations on DH that aren't appropriate -
maybe the way he is with them is exactly what they all need at that
time. He is a good man, he listens to them, he does do things with them
and shares his own interests and passions with them. It's just the darn
TV seems to take precedence on most days.

When I think of us unschooling, I don't see the way our days are now as
being at all enriching and fun and interesting.

And maybe that's my perception, maybe that's MY being school-y (or, uh,
controlling). I.E. "I would do a craft and read books and bake bread"
or whatever if I was with them in the morning, and DH doesn't, so I'm
thinking DH's way is "wrong." In reality, Rory may have no interest on
doing those things with me on any particular day... And in reality, I'd
probably never get as much done as I think or fantasize that I could, LOL.

They watch movies and talk about them. They play video games sometimes.

Maybe I should relax a bit on the whole, "What's DH going to *do* with
Rory all day if we unschooled?" and focus on getting a decent workflow
scheduled with DH so he and I are working together well in that
department... and perhaps once that's where it should be, the rest will
fall into place.

I worry that Rory won't be "doing" enough during his time with DH if we
were unschooling. But in writing this, I see that they do... It just
isn't necessarily the stuff *I* would pick.

Am I headed in a reasonable direction here, or am I getting off course?

Also, don't overlook the fact that
> society at large makes it tough for men to be primaries. My DH is very
> comfortable in his role, and was pretty much born to be a father, but
> the unconscious and pretty unbelievable comments people have made to
> him sometimes knock him pretty hard.

Yes... everytime they go out there are rude comments - "Where's mom? Is
it's mom's day off? I think the baby is hungry." As if he's not capable
of telling when his own child is hungry/needs changing/needs love etc.
it's very disheartening, and I know it gets to him, especially when he
hears similar things from his own family.

SAHM's - how does your husband, if he's working, make you feel
appreciated for all you do in the home and with the kids? I know DH
could use more appreciation from me, but I'm not sure how to give it.

Much food for thought here.

I appreciate your insights!

-Michelle

Sandra Dodd

-=-So that's my dilemma, I guess. I feel like, for unscholing to
work, DH
needs to do something other then watch TV in the morning hours while I
work, so that Rory has a better... example? model? more stimulating
environment?-=-

Here is mom-homework. Calculate the number of hours in a week.
Choose 40 for you to work. See how many are left. Unschooling
doesn't need to be your husband's responsibility.



But until a child is schoolage, how would unschooling be different
from any fun home environment? Consider unschooling as involving the
one who's in school. That will help.

You keep telling us about homework, but that won't exist if you're
unschooling, so it's not good for a discussion here.



-=-it's nice for

me because I get to work and have "me" or "alone" time, and he doesn't.
But I can't help that. Someone has to work, it's clearly going to be
me, and that leaves, as you said, the other parent as a caregiver during
that time.-=-



So why can't he have "me" and "alone time" while you're not working?



-=-JOY

-=-I want DH to be joyous, to see possibility each day. From his time
with

the boys, that will spread to them.-=-



If you're thinking you won't be happy until the boys are happy and
they won't be happy until he's happy, that's a trap for everyone.
How about YOU be first to live with joy?

If the boys' lives become more joyful, it will be easy for you and
your husband to relax and share in that joy.

-=-When I think of us unschooling, I don't see the way our days are
now as being at all enriching and fun and interesting.-=-

http://sandradodd.com/checklists



Sandra













http://sandradodd.com/joy




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Redomestication.com

> Here is mom-homework. Calculate the number of hours in a week.
> Choose 40 for you to work. See how many are left. Unschooling
> doesn't need to be your husband's responsibility.

I agree. He and I need to have a sit-down and get him to really respect
and allow me to get those hours in (although I probably don't even need
40) without interruption. That's the biggest obstacle, as I see it.

> But until a child is schoolage, how would unschooling be different
> from any fun home environment? Consider unschooling as involving the
> one who's in school. That will help.

I'm confused about what you mean here. Are you talking about with my 1
year old? If so, I'm not worried about him, he's a happy little man. I
think all my worry about DH being with Rory, the one who is currently in
K, while I work, is that DH doesn't, at times, seem to *do* much. He
watches a lot of TV these days. I don't want Rory to be bored to death
at home because mom is working for, say, 5 hours a day and DH is
watching TV during that time. That was my initial fear.

And maybe it's unfounded??? Maybe the "I'm bored" will disappear with
unschooling. Maybe DH will get out of his funk and do more stuff.
Maybe Rory will just really need to veg out too.

> You keep telling us about homework, but that won't exist if you're
> unschooling, so it's not good for a discussion here.

Sandra, I have the utmost respect for you and your list and your
experience and wisdom, and I mean that 100% - but perhaps you misread
this one. I mentioned it once in paragraph about how we spend our day,
how DH and I get things done together with the boys. It went, "...After
that I do homework with Rory, DH has baby, and then we settle in for
dinner time, evening plans, etc." I wasn't discussing homework at all,
I was discussing who does what with the kids, how our days flow, and
finding a *NEW* rhythm to our day that works for *everyone*.

> So why can't he have "me" and "alone time" while you're not working?

He mostly chooses not to. Maybe he feels like he can't, which is why I
thought maybe having it be a bit more formal would help him feel ok
leaving us. Maybe I should just start saying, "If you want some free
time to work on your art this afternoon, I've got you covered."

> If you're thinking you won't be happy until the boys are happy and
> they won't be happy until he's happy, that's a trap for everyone.
> How about YOU be first to live with joy?

Yes! So true! They do, in most ways, take their cues from me.

Thank you so much! I'm getting clearer.... (I think, LOL).

-Michelle

Julie

--- In [email protected], "Redomestication.com"
<redomestication@...> wrote:
>
>
> I would love to hear from others as well how dads involve
themselves -
> of course, the "everyday" stuff. But what kind of fun do your
kids have
> with Dad that's more of a "dad and me" thing?
>
Hi Michelle,

Here is a short list of the things my DH does with our girls
when he gets chance, (he works from home sometimes, works on-site
sometimes and so our routine is never quite the same):

Plays video games,
Takes them to the park for rc helicopter flying,
Walks the dog, and talks with them,
Builds computers and downloads software,
Surprises them with K'nex motorised kits, then helps them
build them,
Cleans the swimming pool and the back yard,
Most important of all is that when they ask him questions he
just has this amazing wealth of knowledge and takes a long
time giving them really thorough answers.

None of the above takes a long time out of his day, but it means a
lot to them and encourages enriching experiences and questions that
lead to learning naturally.



"So that's my dilemma, I guess. I feel like, for unscholing to work,
DH
needs to do something other then watch TV in the morning hours while
I
work, so that Rory has a better... example? model? more stimulating
environment?


I would also suggest not to worry about how much TV is watched, TV
itself can be really stimulating and lead to lots of conversations
and other activities. With Rory being only 5, that seems very young
to be worrying so much about what he fills his time with, as long as
he is happy. Have you read Sandra's pages regarding "strewing". I
strongly suggest you do that; you see you could "strew" lots of
interesting things around the room where your DH is watching
TV and if Rory takes interest in them, surely your DH will then
notice that spark of interest and build conversation around that,
answering his questions and you may be surprised just where this
could lead them.
After all, the important thing to note here is that unschooling is
all about what Rory chooses to do with his time and, like you said,
he may not want to bake bread, do crafts or read at this stage -
then again, he might and are you sure your DH wouldn't want to do
these things with him? Have you asked him?

How does Rory spend his time during school holidays and weekends?
That is good clue to what interests him.

Maybe you could change your working hours so that you got up early
and worked for a few hours, then had a large portion of time during
the middle of the day where you could take Rory out places, and then
finish your work in the evening when it usually seems quite
the "norm" for Dads and kids to be watching TV. That all depends of
course on how much work you have to do.

Just a thought, hope something helps.

Julie

Julie

Michelle,

I just thought of one other thing which may help as the main
issue here seems to be time to spend with Rory.

When my girls were at school it would take on average 45 minutes to
find school uniform, get dressed, prepare packed lunch, get things
together in backpack, brush hair, remember to take all the things
you mustn't forget and get into the car. Then it would take another
30 minutes to drive to school, through school traffic and join car
line.
Another 30 minutes to drop off children, get out of school zone and
drive home. That's another hour at the end of the school day to
drive there, collect them and bring them home, plus at least an hour
and a half for discussing the days activities, reading all the blurb
sent home by the teacher and getting homework done. We lost a
couple of hours at the end of each day because they had to go to bed
early, to be able to get up so early the next morning to do it all
again, and none of that includes washing and ironing the school
uniforms at the weekiend so they were ready on a Monday.

Obviously, everyone's routine is different, and maybe Rory catches
the school bus, but I'll bet if you sat and calculated how much time
you were already giving between you and DH in just getting Rory to
school and back each day with everything he needs to have with him;
it would be lovely to think you would be gaining that amount of time
each day just to spend with him, if he no longer went to school.

My calculations come to approx. 4 hours and 15 minutes!!

Try it, just a thought.

Julie