Linda Adair

Help! I have always homeschooled in an eclectic mode but still held the reigns so to speak. Lately it has become more important to me that my relationship with my last two younger boys is sweet. We were having way too much friction and I was always cross with them. Last week I had a more hands off focus and watched them. As expected they played a LOT of games, and the oldest at 14 spent a lot of time on his phone! I left it alone. This week it has begun to bug me more...so I need some encouragement to trust this is not going to always be this way! My 14 year old has been on the phone almost all day! My 11 year old stated, again, he doesn't like his life and he is bored. I remember reading that boredom is nothing to be concerned with (before I would say "no boredom allowed, if you are bored I'll find you some chore!") and that it will give them time to think what they would like to do with their time. I know I need to be more engaged with them...it is not going to be easy...as I have other interests! However, how can you be engaged with your son when he is on the phone all the time??? Thanks to all for engaging and enlightening topics. I have needed this for a looooong time!

Jenny C

>>>I know I need to be more engaged with them...it is not going to be
easy...as I have other interests!>>>

There is something really amazing about setting aside your own interests
to become thoroughly interested in whatever it is your kids are
interested in. Suddenly, you've expanded your own world with infinite
possibilities! Your own personal interests will still be there, or
actually grow with more ideas to add to it. I can't even begin to say
how wonderful it's been to be really involved in what my kids are into.
I learn so much about them, about our world, and life, just by being
interested in what they are interested in.

>>>However, how can you be engaged with your son when he is on the
phone all the time??? Thanks to all for engaging and enlightening
topics. I have needed this for a looooong time!>>>
>


Text him? Send him cool stuff to check out? That's what I would do. I
don't have an iphone, nor does my older daughter, but we do text each
other a lot, even from one end of the house to the other! It's fun!

[email protected]

In a message dated 26/05/2009 20:50:33 GMT Standard Time,
lindajane32686@... writes:

However, how can you be engaged with your son when he is on the phone all
the time???


I used to say this kind of thing about my daughter being on World of
Warcraft. Certainly, WoW is her space (perhaps the phone time is your son's
space?). It took me ages to realize that this didn't go for all her time when
she was engaged with virtual worlds.

But, since I've been trying to put into action the ideas I've read about in
this group (and finally found time to follow advice over several years
from Schuyler), I've realized that dd shares far more of her online time with
me than I'd have expected - mainly as a result of my asking occasional
non-intrusive questions about what she finds amusing ("What's new on
LOLcats?", etc), and then chatting and sharing. And realizing how sophisticated her
humour can be means I no longer see this type of screentime as trivial -
I'm noticing that the more I respect her choices, the more she'll share
these things with me. WoW remains off limits for me as she doesn't want to be
embarrassed by my terrible reaction times, but there are lots of mutual
giggles about other favourite sites.

Of course, a website's easier to share than a phone conversation - and I
suppose it's harder to ask gentle questions without getting into invasions of
private territory. All I'm suggesting from my (admittedly
limited!)experience is that a young person's intense engagement with a virtual world or a
voice on the other end of the line doesn't necessarily preclude other
engagement.

Jude x


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Su Penn

On May 26, 2009, at 2:54 PM, Linda Adair wrote:

> However, how can you be engaged with your son when he is on the
> phone all the time???

Disclaimer: my oldest child turns 8 tomorrow, so I am speaking out of
my hat when talking about older kids.

But I have a couple of ideas. One is to wonder who he's on the phone
with. Is there a friend he'd like to see in person? Can you facilitate
that? What are they talking about? Is there something they're
interested in that you could use as inspiration for an outing together
with his friend?

On the other hand, if his phone time is private for him, you might
just continue to offer non-phone activities together is a really low-
key way. Again, build on his interests: would he like to go to the
comic shop? To get some magazines about something he's interested in?
You know what he likes.

I will say, based on my own little kids, don't freak out too much
about him being on the phone so much right now. People who have de-
schooled with their kids tell stories like that all the time! My own
kids, who have always been unschooled, also sometimes go through very
focused phases. Inevitably, just as I am starting to worry ("maybe
they really ARE playing too many video games!") they switch it up and
spend a whole day building a spaceship in the living room or
something. When I find myself fretting like that, I tell myself, "I'll
give it another week before I start to worry" (or, I'll give it
another 30 days...). In every case something has happened to relieve
my worry in the time I've set. Sometimes it's a change in the kids'
habits, the end of a really focused period--and sometimes it's me!
(The end of _my_ period, for example :-) I'm more prone to worry
sometimes than others, so my own fretting passes sometimes even if the
pattern of the days doesn't switch-up.

I do sometimes check in with my older son, who is more inclined to
long periods of immersion. I'll ask something like, "Are you enjoying
watching movies, or are you wishing there was something else to do?"
If he tells me he's just enjoying himself, I might say, "OK, can I get
you a snack?" or "Let me know if you need my help finding something
new on Free On Demand."

Which reminds me--one way to stay connected with your son is to do
small thoughtful, non-intrusive things. Bring him a snack, wash and
fold his laundry for him and give him a big smile as you pass him on
the way to his dresser, buy his favorite food for the freezer.
"Connection" doesn't have to mean "doing the same thing with him," it
can mean, "reminding him he's valued and you like him." You might find
several opportunities throughout the day for a quick, pleasant moment.

Su

mom of Eric, 8; Carl, 5; Yehva, almost 2

Sandra Dodd

-=-I have always homeschooled in an eclectic mode but still held the
reigns so to speak.-=-

I want to note this word not to correct or embarrass you, but because
this is the third use of "reigns" instead of "reins" in just a couple
of weeks.

"Rein" as in the straps to a horse's bridle is the rein you hold, or
give freely. Reign is the period of time someone is king. Perhaps
the confusion comes, regarding control or freedom, in the idea of
someone commanding someone else.

In this and all other things, in a discussion, if someone is unsure
about what he or she is writing, and confused about words, or using
words without being careful, then that will mean the thinking is also
not as careful or as clear as it could be otherwise. So it's okay to
use the wrong word, but it's also okay for someone else to point it out.

Really, the goal is for people to be able to sort through their own
habits and reactions and fears to come to a clearing where the
children can live freely.

-=As expected they played a LOT of games, and the oldest at 14 spent a
lot of time on his phone! I left it alone. This week it has begun to
bug me more...so I need some encouragement to trust this is not going
to always be this way! My 14 year old has been on the phone almost all
day!-=-

Was the phone limited before? Is he talking to someone you could
invite over, instead?

(Doh! This sat here a long time and someone already asked that.

As to withdrawal from control itself, one thing some moms have found
helpful is to find other things to control: clean the store room,
schedule up a bunch of meals and make a gloriously organized shopping
list, reorganize your bathroom, start a hobby... control yourself
instead of your kids.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robyn L. Coburn

<<<< My 11 year old stated, again, he doesn't like his life and he is bored.
I remember reading that boredom is nothing to be concerned with (before I
would say "no boredom allowed, if you are bored I'll find you some chore!")
and that it will give them time to think what they would like to do with
their time. I know I need to be more engaged with them>>>>

I take it when your say "nothing to be concerned about" you really mean
nothing to be "worried" about, that sometimes it is a momentary or short
term thing. However here you are saying that your son has stated this more
than once.

I think it depends on what "bored" is code for, and I am pretty much always
concerned with, as in deeply interested in, Jayn's emotional state.
When Jayn says that she is bored, usually that is very simply translated to
"I want more of your focussed attention", even if it just watching a tv show
with her on the sofa.

Since your older boy is so happy with the phone right now, that sounds like
an ideal opportunity to do something with your 11 yo. Sometimes when
children have had their time and activities dictated, they lose track of
their own passions. I hope you can both discover what your 11 yo's passions
are.

<<<<<My 14
> year old has been on the phone almost all day! ......I need some
> encouragement to trust this is not going to always be this way >>>>>

Sometimes it helps to think about a "what if". What if your older son
remains on the phone most every day for a month, a season, a year, for
years? Maybe he is a great verbal communicator, and has the ability to
organize his thoughts and speak extemporaneously with clarity. I admire
that - it takes me writing and rewriting to achieve clarity. Maybe he will
end up being one of those people that earn their living talking to people on
the phone, like a counsellor (hopefully not a phone psychic). Maybe he is a
great listener - his future spouse will love that quality about him. It
probably won't be all day every day for years.

<<<<<As expected they played a LOT of
> games, and the oldest at 14 spent a lot of time on his phone! I left it
> alone. >>>>>

Leaving "it" alone is not the same as leaving "them" alone.


Robyn L. Coburn
www.Iggyjingles.etsy.com
www.iggyjingles.blogspot.com
www.allthingsdoll.blogspot.com

Sandra Dodd

-=My 11 year old stated, again, he doesn't like his life and he is
bored.
I remember reading that boredom is nothing to be concerned with
(before I
would say "no boredom allowed, if you are bored I'll find you some
chore!")
and that it will give them time to think what they would like to do with
their time. I know I need to be more engaged with them-=-

Robyn gave a good answer, but think of what kind of mom you want to
be. Rather than figuring how little you "have to" do to be a good
mom, look at how much you COULD do. How good a mom could you be? How
attentive? How aware? Barely getting by is too schoolish. Don't
think of it as whether you've done enough for the day. Think of
whether there's one more thing you could do. And then, whether
there's one MORE. Even if my child is asleep, there still might be
one more thing I can do to make his life better when he wakes up, or
while he's sleeping.


I think the traditional attitudes about boredom are harmful. This
might give you some more ideas:


http://sandradodd.com/BoredNoMore

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pam Sorooshian

On 5/26/2009 2:03 PM, Jenny C wrote:
> >>>However, how can you be engaged with your son when he is on the
> phone all the time??? Thanks to all for engaging and enlightening
> topics. I have needed this for a looooong time!>>>
>
>> >
>>
>
>
> Text him? Send him cool stuff to check out? That's what I would do. I
> don't have an iphone, nor does my older daughter, but we do text each
> other a lot, even from one end of the house to the other! It's fun!
>

Me too. Also, when he hangs up, you can say, "How's so-and-so?" Show an
interest. (But be careful it doesn't sound like you're haranguing him
for being on the phone, if you've done that a lot before.)


I wanted to mention that it is super super common for kids to spend a
lot of time socializing at that age - just talking talking talking
talking. If you listen in, it can sound inane, but it is research and
experimentation - figuring out relationships and human nature and all
that. So - if that's what he is really doing - good for him. Or is it
something else? I mean, think more about why he's on the phone all the
time - let us know what you think.

And - why not invite over the people he's on the phone with?

-pam

Maria

If it makes you feel better, I'm experiencing control withdrawals too. The first few days of no bedtimes for Seth were great, but now I'm feeling like the dieter who does really well for the first three days and then feels the cravings hit really hard. Last night was particularly difficult - for me! But I managed. I was taking a lot of breaths and reminding myself of the "whys".

If your son is bored you might suggest that he join you in doing what you're doing. So long as it isn't chores! You might also ask him what kind of life he would like to have and how he might attain it.

Really, though, I shouldn't be dispensing advice, particularly when it comes to teens, because I don't have one, and they seem to inhabit a very different world (even when I was teen I felt this way).

It's helped me to take a deep breath and say to myself, "This too, shall pass" and realizing that, try to make the best moment out of it (easier said than done, of course).

You came to the right place. Just try on for size. You'll find what fits.

Maria


--- In [email protected], "Linda Adair" <lindajane32686@...> wrote:
>
> Help! I have always homeschooled in an eclectic mode but still held the reigns so to speak. Lately it has become more important to me that my relationship with my last two younger boys is sweet. We were having way too much friction and I was always cross with them. Last week I had a more hands off focus and watched them. As expected they played a LOT of games, and the oldest at 14 spent a lot of time on his phone! I left it alone. This week it has begun to bug me more...so I need some encouragement to trust this is not going to always be this way! My 14 year old has been on the phone almost all day! My 11 year old stated, again, he doesn't like his life and he is bored. I remember reading that boredom is nothing to be concerned with (before I would say "no boredom allowed, if you are bored I'll find you some chore!") and that it will give them time to think what they would like to do with their time. I know I need to be more engaged with them...it is not going to be easy...as I have other interests! However, how can you be engaged with your son when he is on the phone all the time??? Thanks to all for engaging and enlightening topics. I have needed this for a looooong time!
>

Jenny C

>
> Really, though, I shouldn't be dispensing advice, particularly when it
comes to teens, because I don't have one, and they seem to inhabit a
very different world (even when I was teen I felt this way).
>


I don't think teens inhabit a different world. They definitely like to
hang with other teens. Here's what I see... Unschooled teens will
readily accept friendship and company of many ages and types of people,
while schooled teens, will begrudgingly do so. It doesn't mean they
won't, it means that their natural instinct to learn from the whole
world around them, including many ages and people, has been squashed by
the school system. You have to be persistent in interactions with teens
that have been in school for a long time.

I've been relatively successful in befriending teens of all kinds,
including schooled ones. You've got to be totally open and accepting of
whatever they are into, even if it's sex talk and nasty jokes. Open
your house up, let them play their music, feed them, and just talk about
random stuff that comes up. Every time Chamille brings a new friend
over, I introduce myself and ask questions of the person, like "do you
live around here?", "do you have any siblings, and if yes how many and
what ages?", "how old are you, when's your b-day?", "what's your
favorite musician and why?", etc. It's not done interogation style,
more in a "I'm interested to get to know you" way.

Sometimes, for kids who are in school and have really yucky parents,
this can take a long time of multiple interactions before they feel
comfortable with talking to you, the adult. Teens naturally like
adults, they are learning to become one, just like little kids naturally
like slightly older kids, because it's the next step in their lives.
Schools have an insideous way of squashing this natural leaning to
befriend the next step, and discourage the older kids from wanting to be
around the younger kids, which is also natural. It's natural for older
kids to still associate with slightly younger kids, because it's where
they just came from, and still a part of who they are as they are
becoming older.

All that to say, don't be intimidated by talking to teens. They are
people too and kids soon to be adults. I really dislike the way our
culture seperates them out as other than, instead of embracing them and
enjoying them!