[email protected]

>>Now about the not enforcing a bedtime - WHY??? Your kids do not
need you to help them sleep and you being there probably actually
keeps them from sleeping well.<<

I believe that some children do need help to sleep. I know we have a
cosleeping arrangement. My boys would find it difficult alone as would I. When we
are together we sleep peacefully.

>> It is not against the unschooling train of thought to insist that your
children be in their rooms by a certain time each night.<<

Not sure about the "unschooling train of thought" but I never insist on
anything. My mother was like that. It was "because I said so". We never had any
dialogue, my thoughts and feelings were not respected. That is something I
want for my children. I respect their thoughts and opinions.

>> We remind him about 7 everynight that it is about time for bed, he knows
the routine that he needs to get his pjs on and clean up whatever he's working
on (he doesn't have to put away stuff he wants to work on the next day but he
can't have toys everywhere) then he picks out a story for me himself and dad,
goes potty, brushes teeth etc. If he is not ready by 7:30 then no stories and
he has to put himself to bed and we do only hugs and kisses,<<

In our house we don't withhold things to "get someone to do what we want".
Punishment isn't our way. I would rather that my children get ready for bed
because they are tired.

>> I can see how your dh
could easily be stressed by the situation - I think I would be
also!!! Why not have a family meeting and come to a good agreement
on a bedtime, a time for the children to remain in their rooms and
get ready for sleep in their own way.<<

A family meeting is only good if everyone has equal say and everyone's voice
is respected and there is a win-win situation. Where everyone's needs are at
least partially met. Sometimes a family meeting can lead to "this is the way we
are doing things".

>> Perhaps letting them understand how to put themselves to sleep is a gift
you could give them now, and the gift to your family would be a stronger
relationship between you and your dh. Remember that freedom is no
longer freedom when it infringes on the rights of others. Good luck! <<

and perhaps not. It doesn't take a bedtime and adult alone time every night
at 7:30 to build a strong relationship. We have always attachment parented
and coslept. (Was it Heidi in the original post) It sounds like you have worked
out a good compromise that is working for everyone. You get your sleep and
the children and dad get theirs. Conversation time with dad can happen
anytime. The children don't have to be asleep for that. I know that my boys often
play int eh living room while we are eating dinner. Or will be watching a TV
show in another room etc. And "private" time with your dh can also happen
anywhere. Sometimes when you do cosleep I think you have to be more flexible.
But I do agree with you. I feel I brought these children into the world it is
my responsibility to meet their needs. Right now they need to security and
comfort of sleeping with me.

Just a couple of thoughts,
Pam G



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Stephanie Elms

I think that one thing to remember too is that not all kids do fall
asleep easily
on their own. With my oldest, now 7, we have gone through SO many
different types
of sleep...and only now is he comfortable with falling asleep by
himself. He was
*able* to do it, if he had to, but he did not like too and I did not see
any
reason to force the issue. The funny thing is, that it was not until I
gave up
trying to get him to bed at a certain time that I was able to find what
would
work well for us.

When I first "gave up bedtimes", he would stay up until I
was ready for bed, sometimes around 12 or 1. But then he was exhausted
the next
day. What I found after a little while of this was that he seemed to
honestly
get tired around 10 pm, but his desire to stay up with me caused him to
stay
awake as long as he could. So I just gradually adjusted our nighttime
routine.
Instead of reading for a little while at 8 and then letting him stay up
until
he was tired, I now read to both boys starting around 8:30ish, Kyle
usually
crashes around 9 and Jason and I keep reading until around 10ish. We
then
go upstairs and I lie down with him a bit (and we have some of the best
conversations! Last night we talked all about the solstices and
equinoxes) and
now he is perfectly fine with me going downstairs (in the past anytime I
tried
to leave before he was asleep, he would be up and after me within
minutes).

Over the years we tried so long to get him onto a schedule..sometimes
with
success, but for the most part not. For us it was not for lack of
trying!
He just tends to be a very high energy kid who does not tire easily. He
also has a very strong need to be with people. It has only been in the
last
year that I have truly begun to see this as how he is and begun to be
able
to accept it. Luckily we discovered the family bed when he was 1 and we
worked on all sorts of gentle ways to help him sleep..relaxation
exercises,
lavender on his pillow etc. But underlying it was that we were trying to

change him...now I feel more like we are accepting him and his sleep
needs
and trying to work out something that works for everyone. I do wake
everyone at around 8am, but we cuddle on the couch together watching
dora
or save-ums while we wake up. Actually a very nice way to wake up.

Funny thing is, Kyle (almost 4), who was nursed to sleep and shared a
bed with us from
day 1 has always fallen asleep between 8 and 9. He used to tell me when
he
needed a nap also. Kyle's sleep from day one was very unstructured...he
slept
when he was sleepy in a sling and we did little to no scheduling.
Different kids,
different needs. Sometimes I am glad that we had Jason first, as we
might never have
discovered the joys of co-sleeping.

DH has not always been overly happy with our sleep arrangements...we
have had to
be very creative sometimes to get time together. I kept telling him that
it would
not last forever and it seems like we have finally hit that time...we
have a couple
of hours each evening and have just now started going away overnight
(the kids
adore my ILs). Kyle has just now started sleeping with his brother,
before that
he would fall asleep in the living room and I would move him into bed
with us
when I went to sleep...leaving the bedroom free for when we needed it.
;o)

Good luck Heidi! Just keep trying to think of ways to work so that
everyone's needs
are met. They may not be met today, but if you keep thinking about it
you may
surprise yourself and come up with some creative solutions.

Stephanie E.