Noemi Hiraishi

It is too bad that there is a need for a regulations telling that parents
should not to leave children at home alone. This should have a been a
matter of good senses. Say that you baby child has just slept and you
needed to go to the drugstore across the street. You go. It will not take
more than 4 min. (It might not be a case of Cupertino in CA, where it is
unlike that you would live in a place that there is a drugstore across the
street!)

When dd was 5 yo, I would let her home alone and go for groceries one block
fm our apartment. I never left her alone while she was asleep. I would
make sure that she were awaken and that she knew that I would go for the
errands.

Now that she is 8 yo, she goes by herself to the supermarket, one block fm
our apartment. She goes on her bicycle to her piano lessons, 7 blocks fm
apartment. She tells me that she is going out to play with xx friend and do
not come back until the 6 o'clock nationwide chime. The loudspeakers tell
children that it is time to go home and ask the nearby adults to remind the
children that it time to go home. (During the winter, the loudspeakers are
turned on at 5 PM. It is nationwide and these loudspeakers are placed in
various public places. It was set to serve as messenger in case of a
emergency, like earthquake, and the system is daily tested by these calls. )

Here in Japan, parents are not allowed to take their children to elementary
school. They are grouped and march to school by themselves. And comeback
home by themselves too. If they have to cross a busy road/street, parents
take turns in the mornings to help the children cross the busy roads.

While at public daycare's centers parents are supposed to take and pick up
their children. They will only registered people at the center to pick up
the children. Though the very next day that these same children begin
attending the elementary school, parents can't be with them.

At first it was a choke to me. In Brazil many parents take their high school
children to and fm school. The city streets are to violent.

It is hard for foreigners to understand why children here are left to run
around its neighborhood at the young age of 6/7 yo. It takes time to let its
own children to do the same, even if the children were 9 or 10 yo.

This is Tokyo, capital of Japan.

kayb85

> Now that she is 8 yo, she goes by herself to the supermarket, one
block fm
> our apartment. She goes on her bicycle to her piano lessons, 7
blocks fm
> apartment. She tells me that she is going out to play with xx
friend and do
> not come back until the 6 o'clock nationwide chime. The
loudspeakers tell
> children that it is time to go home and ask the nearby adults to
remind the
> children that it time to go home. (During the winter, the
loudspeakers are
> turned on at 5 PM. It is nationwide and these loudspeakers are
placed in
> various public places. It was set to serve as messenger in case of
a
> emergency, like earthquake, and the system is daily tested by these
calls. )

What if the kids want to play flashlight tag after dark? Are they
allowed?


> Here in Japan, parents are not allowed to take their children to
elementary
> school.

And parents are comfortable being told that they're "not allowed" to
go somewhere with their child?

> It is hard for foreigners to understand why children here are left
to run
> around its neighborhood at the young age of 6/7 yo. It takes time
to let its
> own children to do the same, even if the children were 9 or 10 yo.
>
> This is Tokyo, capital of Japan.


I watched Eloise at the Plaza, a Disney movie, with my daughter last
night. I sat watching it think it is a great unschooling movie! At
the same time, I sat thinking of all the terrible things that could
happen letting a 6 year old run around a hotel like that! The people
that could grab her, drag her into their rooms or their cars, do all
kinds of horrible things to her.

I live in a small town in Pennsylvania, United States. It's not a
big city. Crime rate is considered to be low. Yet, a year or so ago
a little girl (seven?) was outside playing in the alley behind her
home and was kidnapped. She had been raped and killed and her body
found in the woods nearby. I didn't know the girl but my daughter's
friend did, and for the longest time she was afraid to play in my
yard, and transferred some of that fear to my daughter. Every time a
car drove by she came running inside or ran over to me. If a car
stopped, she asked if I knew them and why I thought they might be
stopping their car.

I am just now getting to the point where I will sometimes let my
almost ten year old go to a bathroom in Mcdonalds by herself. (I've
heard horror stories about that too!) I do let her ride her bike
around the block by herself but I don't think I'm ready to let her go
past our block. Her dad takes bike rides with her to the end of town
almost daily.

Sheila

coyote's corner

Sheila,
I agree w/ you.

Brianna can't go around the block w/o me. We live behind the library. There's maybe - 15 -20 feet where I can't see her when she goes there. She takes the cell phone & I 'walk' with her.
These are dangerous times.
Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: kayb85
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 8:06 PM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone



> Now that she is 8 yo, she goes by herself to the supermarket, one
block fm
> our apartment. She goes on her bicycle to her piano lessons, 7
blocks fm
> apartment. She tells me that she is going out to play with xx
friend and do
> not come back until the 6 o'clock nationwide chime. The
loudspeakers tell
> children that it is time to go home and ask the nearby adults to
remind the
> children that it time to go home. (During the winter, the
loudspeakers are
> turned on at 5 PM. It is nationwide and these loudspeakers are
placed in
> various public places. It was set to serve as messenger in case of
a
> emergency, like earthquake, and the system is daily tested by these
calls. )

What if the kids want to play flashlight tag after dark? Are they
allowed?


> Here in Japan, parents are not allowed to take their children to
elementary
> school.

And parents are comfortable being told that they're "not allowed" to
go somewhere with their child?

> It is hard for foreigners to understand why children here are left
to run
> around its neighborhood at the young age of 6/7 yo. It takes time
to let its
> own children to do the same, even if the children were 9 or 10 yo.
>
> This is Tokyo, capital of Japan.


I watched Eloise at the Plaza, a Disney movie, with my daughter last
night. I sat watching it think it is a great unschooling movie! At
the same time, I sat thinking of all the terrible things that could
happen letting a 6 year old run around a hotel like that! The people
that could grab her, drag her into their rooms or their cars, do all
kinds of horrible things to her.

I live in a small town in Pennsylvania, United States. It's not a
big city. Crime rate is considered to be low. Yet, a year or so ago
a little girl (seven?) was outside playing in the alley behind her
home and was kidnapped. She had been raped and killed and her body
found in the woods nearby. I didn't know the girl but my daughter's
friend did, and for the longest time she was afraid to play in my
yard, and transferred some of that fear to my daughter. Every time a
car drove by she came running inside or ran over to me. If a car
stopped, she asked if I knew them and why I thought they might be
stopping their car.

I am just now getting to the point where I will sometimes let my
almost ten year old go to a bathroom in Mcdonalds by herself. (I've
heard horror stories about that too!) I do let her ride her bike
around the block by herself but I don't think I'm ready to let her go
past our block. Her dad takes bike rides with her to the end of town
almost daily.

Sheila


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

BADOLBILZ

I hate having to be so scared for my children's safety. We live in a
small town in western NY and so many people think we need not worry so
much here. But I think that in the minds of these sick perverts, small
towns are perfect preying grounds because parents are more lax.
Everyday, I see very young children out on sidewalks all alone and I
pray for their safety. I know I'm paranoid but it's justified, I think.
A friend of mine was in a mall near here with her 4 and a man tried to
grab her dd and she was RIGHT THERE. So how easy would it be to grab a
defendless child off a sidewalk or out of a yard? The trick is what to
tell the children without scaring the hell out of them. What do you
tell your kids about kidnappers and molesters? HeidiC.

coyote's corner wrote:

>Sheila,
>I agree w/ you.
>
>Brianna can't go around the block w/o me. We live behind the library. There's maybe - 15 -20 feet where I can't see her when she goes there. She takes the cell phone & I 'walk' with her.
>These are dangerous times.
>Janis
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: kayb85
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 8:06 PM
> Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone
>
>
>
> > Now that she is 8 yo, she goes by herself to the supermarket, one
> block fm
> > our apartment. She goes on her bicycle to her piano lessons, 7
> blocks fm
> > apartment. She tells me that she is going out to play with xx
> friend and do
> > not come back until the 6 o'clock nationwide chime. The
> loudspeakers tell
> > children that it is time to go home and ask the nearby adults to
> remind the
> > children that it time to go home. (During the winter, the
> loudspeakers are
> > turned on at 5 PM. It is nationwide and these loudspeakers are
> placed in
> > various public places. It was set to serve as messenger in case of
> a
> > emergency, like earthquake, and the system is daily tested by these
> calls. )
>
> What if the kids want to play flashlight tag after dark? Are they
> allowed?
>
>
> > Here in Japan, parents are not allowed to take their children to
> elementary
> > school.
>
> And parents are comfortable being told that they're "not allowed" to
> go somewhere with their child?
>
> > It is hard for foreigners to understand why children here are left
> to run
> > around its neighborhood at the young age of 6/7 yo. It takes time
> to let its
> > own children to do the same, even if the children were 9 or 10 yo.
> >
> > This is Tokyo, capital of Japan.
>
>
> I watched Eloise at the Plaza, a Disney movie, with my daughter last
> night. I sat watching it think it is a great unschooling movie! At
> the same time, I sat thinking of all the terrible things that could
> happen letting a 6 year old run around a hotel like that! The people
> that could grab her, drag her into their rooms or their cars, do all
> kinds of horrible things to her.
>
> I live in a small town in Pennsylvania, United States. It's not a
> big city. Crime rate is considered to be low. Yet, a year or so ago
> a little girl (seven?) was outside playing in the alley behind her
> home and was kidnapped. She had been raped and killed and her body
> found in the woods nearby. I didn't know the girl but my daughter's
> friend did, and for the longest time she was afraid to play in my
> yard, and transferred some of that fear to my daughter. Every time a
> car drove by she came running inside or ran over to me. If a car
> stopped, she asked if I knew them and why I thought they might be
> stopping their car.
>
> I am just now getting to the point where I will sometimes let my
> almost ten year old go to a bathroom in Mcdonalds by herself. (I've
> heard horror stories about that too!) I do let her ride her bike
> around the block by herself but I don't think I'm ready to let her go
> past our block. Her dad takes bike rides with her to the end of town
> almost daily.
>
> Sheila
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>[email protected]
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>

coyote's corner

When Brianna was six, I left her for 20 minutes w/ a "friend" - Kevin Soucy - aged 26. I had met his parents, he knew I was affiliated with the local HA group (I booked bands into their parties and set up at their events AND had a great time at their parties!). He knew that I had defended - physically - my home from a couple of drug dealers (looking for $$$ my daughter owed them)
He was setting up our first web site - in exchange for stock and we fed him when he worked at our home.
I left Brianna w/ him for 20 minutes while I ran to get pizza. I had been talked into it - "She won't be any bother" "Mom, I really want to stay and work on my puzzle."
I went.
Let me say that I was extremely uncomfortable the whole time.
Upon my return - everything was fine - it was exactly the way I had left it.

That night, Brianna was "off". For the first time - she didn't want to watch Xena.
Brianna slept badly - she was grinding her teeth in her sleep - something she hadn't done in ages.

The next morning, I rec'd a confession from Kevin Soucy.
He had molested Brianna.

It was 2nd degree - no penetration

He had told her he loved her and wanted to marry her.
She told him he was touching her in a bad way and that she was going to tell me.
He told her that I would call the police and he would go to jail and we would never have any money. He fondled her and continued to describe how he wanted to marry her.

As I said - by the time I got home - Brianna was at the table - well, everything was as I had left it.

He - the pedophile - Kevin Soucy thought about everything - and decided that since Briannawas going to tell me - he would beat her to the punch - so he confessed or rather - he explained. It's a chilling letter.

I did all the right things.
Brianna is okay.
He went to jail and is out now and on 21 year suspended sentence.

Brianna knows there's evil. She knows there are monsters.
Brianna knows there are junkies and takers, abusers and liars.

She knows because it's part of our world and we live in the world.
At work - when we set up somewhere - we have to be careful of thieves. We see how greed is rampart in our society and how it effects us - on a day to day level.

We can't make the evil go away. We can't slay all the monsters. Whether the evil is one of "My needs - as a human - are more important that the gray whales" or "My goals, as an American - are more worthy than the goals of an Iraqi" or even "Myneeds are more important than yours"
Whether the evil is a disease - alcoholism or egomania or pedophilia or whatever......

Brianna also knows that not every dragon is a monster and that sometimes, really handsome people are ugly inside.

One of the most important things Brianna knows is that her intuition can & should be heard.

And I'd rather have her safe than sorry.

I know kids that do not know anything of these matters. How then, will they recognize the monsters??

Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: BADOLBILZ
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone


I hate having to be so scared for my children's safety. We live in a
small town in western NY and so many people think we need not worry so
much here. But I think that in the minds of these sick perverts, small
towns are perfect preying grounds because parents are more lax.
Everyday, I see very young children out on sidewalks all alone and I
pray for their safety. I know I'm paranoid but it's justified, I think.
A friend of mine was in a mall near here with her 4 and a man tried to
grab her dd and she was RIGHT THERE. So how easy would it be to grab a
defendless child off a sidewalk or out of a yard? The trick is what to
tell the children without scaring the hell out of them. What do you
tell your kids about kidnappers and molesters? HeidiC.

coyote's corner wrote:

>Sheila,
>I agree w/ you.
>
>Brianna can't go around the block w/o me. We live behind the library. There's maybe - 15 -20 feet where I can't see her when she goes there. She takes the cell phone & I 'walk' with her.
>These are dangerous times.
>Janis
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: kayb85
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 8:06 PM
> Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone
>
>
>
> > Now that she is 8 yo, she goes by herself to the supermarket, one
> block fm
> > our apartment. She goes on her bicycle to her piano lessons, 7
> blocks fm
> > apartment. She tells me that she is going out to play with xx
> friend and do
> > not come back until the 6 o'clock nationwide chime. The
> loudspeakers tell
> > children that it is time to go home and ask the nearby adults to
> remind the
> > children that it time to go home. (During the winter, the
> loudspeakers are
> > turned on at 5 PM. It is nationwide and these loudspeakers are
> placed in
> > various public places. It was set to serve as messenger in case of
> a
> > emergency, like earthquake, and the system is daily tested by these
> calls. )
>
> What if the kids want to play flashlight tag after dark? Are they
> allowed?
>
>
> > Here in Japan, parents are not allowed to take their children to
> elementary
> > school.
>
> And parents are comfortable being told that they're "not allowed" to
> go somewhere with their child?
>
> > It is hard for foreigners to understand why children here are left
> to run
> > around its neighborhood at the young age of 6/7 yo. It takes time
> to let its
> > own children to do the same, even if the children were 9 or 10 yo.
> >
> > This is Tokyo, capital of Japan.
>
>
> I watched Eloise at the Plaza, a Disney movie, with my daughter last
> night. I sat watching it think it is a great unschooling movie! At
> the same time, I sat thinking of all the terrible things that could
> happen letting a 6 year old run around a hotel like that! The people
> that could grab her, drag her into their rooms or their cars, do all
> kinds of horrible things to her.
>
> I live in a small town in Pennsylvania, United States. It's not a
> big city. Crime rate is considered to be low. Yet, a year or so ago
> a little girl (seven?) was outside playing in the alley behind her
> home and was kidnapped. She had been raped and killed and her body
> found in the woods nearby. I didn't know the girl but my daughter's
> friend did, and for the longest time she was afraid to play in my
> yard, and transferred some of that fear to my daughter. Every time a
> car drove by she came running inside or ran over to me. If a car
> stopped, she asked if I knew them and why I thought they might be
> stopping their car.
>
> I am just now getting to the point where I will sometimes let my
> almost ten year old go to a bathroom in Mcdonalds by herself. (I've
> heard horror stories about that too!) I do let her ride her bike
> around the block by herself but I don't think I'm ready to let her go
> past our block. Her dad takes bike rides with her to the end of town
> almost daily.
>
> Sheila
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
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>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>[email protected]
>
>
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

nellebelle

I've mentioned this book before, but I think it is worth the repeat: Protecting the Gift. He also wrote the Gift of Fear, but Protecting the Gift is written for parents.

Although child abduction by a stranger is a real risk, it is MUCH smaller than the risk of a child being abused or abducted by a family member or by a "friend" of the family.

This book gives concrete, realistic advice on protecting ourselves and our children from harm.

In his book, he says that humans are the only animal who talk ourselves out of our fear. Animals will run or hide when they feel they are in danger. Humans tend to try to convince ourselves that we aren't really in danger. Trust your gut, but also inform yourself and your children on ways to stay safe!

Mary Ellen


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/29/2003 9:15:42 AM Central Daylight Time,
ynxn96@... writes:

> So how easy would it be to grab a
> defendless child off a sidewalk or out of a yard? The trick is what to
> tell the children without scaring the hell out of them. What do you
> tell your kids about kidnappers and molesters?

<A HREF="www.escapeschool.com">www.escapeschool.com</A>

Tuck


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jon and Rue Kream

I recommend the book, "The Gift of Fear", by Gavin De Becker. It has a
lot to do with listening to our intuition, and making sure our children
are free to do the same. I think you'd feel better after reading it.
~Rue



-----Original Message-----
From: BADOLBILZ [mailto:ynxn96@...]
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 10:28 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone


I hate having to be so scared for my children's safety. Snip
What do you
tell your kids about kidnappers and molesters? HeidiC.

[email protected]

On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:52:59 -0400 "coyote's corner"
<janis@...> writes:
>
> I know kids that do not know anything of these matters. How then,
> will they recognize the monsters??
>
Oh, Janis. I'm so sorry that this happened to Brianna, and to you...

Have you ever read Gavin DeBecker's books? One is called "Protecting the
Gift", I can't remember the others and I'm not online so I can't check
amazon... but they're good. They talk about showing kids how to trust
their instincts about people, because these instincts are generally based
on some subtle signs that we may not consciously recognize. He also talks
about not letting your child go places alone until he's 9 or 10, I
think...

When Rain was 7, I read in the paper about a man being arrested for child
molestation living in "the 2600 block of Central Avenue". Well, *we*
lived on the 2600 block of Central Avenue. I checked the guy's name in
the phone book and it turned out that he lived right across the street -
he was the man we called "the Santa Claus man" because he looked like
Santa Claus... we stood out on the front porch the next day while he was
getting into his car and I pointed him out as he left his house, being
quite obvious about it. He stopped and turned and looked at us, and I'm
pretty sure he knew what was going on. I told Rain what he had done, told
her that if he came over when she was playing out in the (fenced) yard
she could come and get me... the thing is, she hasn't been taught to obey
adults, we've talked about the tricky things adults can say to get kids
to do things, and she has a pretty strong, intact sense of her own
self-efficacy and strength. She wouldn't make a good victim. I know I
can't make her invulnerable, but I do think these things help.

I was victimized repeatedly as a kid - it was like I wore a sign saying
"Abuse me", and in a way I think I did. I was emotionally needy,
unhappy...all the thngs that Rain isn't. Sometimes shit just happens -
Rain may have been abused at a preschool when she was 3, it's a confusing
story and I may never know the truth - but I do think there are things
that can help...

Sorry if this is garbled, I have two big dogs jumping all over me and I
have to go to clay class...

Dar

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tia Leschke

>
> Brianna can't go around the block w/o me. We live behind the library.
There's maybe - 15 -20 feet where I can't see her when she goes there. She
takes the cell phone & I 'walk' with her.
> These are dangerous times.

Not to say that you are wrong in your assessment of your *local* picture,
but . . .
I read an article today about crime and the media. There was a study done
in the last few years that found that crime *news* on network TV had
increased 83 per cent from 1990 to 1998, even while the *incidence* of crime
dropped 20 per cent. Homicides fell by a third in that time period, but
coverage increased almost 5-fold. Interesting.
Tia

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...

coyote's corner

Dar, Thank you so much for your post.
I read something called - "Raising Street Smart Kids" or something like that.....
and of course, there's common sense.
One of the most important aspects of this crime was that Brianna told me. She told me after Kevin Soucy used her dreams against her.
"If I go to jail, then you'll never have a web site and that means you'll never have any money to buy a horse. You'll always be poor."

Still, she told me.
She trusted me. She knew that I would defend her. She has compared me to a mother wolf, a mother bear and of course, Mother Coyote.

They trust us. We must teach them self defense - be it ; emotional, spiritual, physical and intellectual.

Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: freeform@...
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 1:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone



On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:52:59 -0400 "coyote's corner"
<janis@...> writes:
>
> I know kids that do not know anything of these matters. How then,
> will they recognize the monsters??
>
Oh, Janis. I'm so sorry that this happened to Brianna, and to you...

Have you ever read Gavin DeBecker's books? One is called "Protecting the
Gift", I can't remember the others and I'm not online so I can't check
amazon... but they're good. They talk about showing kids how to trust
their instincts about people, because these instincts are generally based
on some subtle signs that we may not consciously recognize. He also talks
about not letting your child go places alone until he's 9 or 10, I
think...

When Rain was 7, I read in the paper about a man being arrested for child
molestation living in "the 2600 block of Central Avenue". Well, *we*
lived on the 2600 block of Central Avenue. I checked the guy's name in
the phone book and it turned out that he lived right across the street -
he was the man we called "the Santa Claus man" because he looked like
Santa Claus... we stood out on the front porch the next day while he was
getting into his car and I pointed him out as he left his house, being
quite obvious about it. He stopped and turned and looked at us, and I'm
pretty sure he knew what was going on. I told Rain what he had done, told
her that if he came over when she was playing out in the (fenced) yard
she could come and get me... the thing is, she hasn't been taught to obey
adults, we've talked about the tricky things adults can say to get kids
to do things, and she has a pretty strong, intact sense of her own
self-efficacy and strength. She wouldn't make a good victim. I know I
can't make her invulnerable, but I do think these things help.

I was victimized repeatedly as a kid - it was like I wore a sign saying
"Abuse me", and in a way I think I did. I was emotionally needy,
unhappy...all the thngs that Rain isn't. Sometimes shit just happens -
Rain may have been abused at a preschool when she was 3, it's a confusing
story and I may never know the truth - but I do think there are things
that can help...

Sorry if this is garbled, I have two big dogs jumping all over me and I
have to go to clay class...

Dar

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

marji

Janis, What a powerful thing you have to tell. The pain that must come
with the retelling must be terrific. Thank you for telling it.

At 18:05 4/29/03 -0400, Janis wrote:
>One of the most important aspects of this crime was that Brianna told me.

Yeah!!!

Marji



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelly Dollinger

>>From: coyote's corner [mailto:janis@...]
>>Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 7:53 AM

>>I left Brianna w/ him for 20 minutes while I ran to get pizza. I had
been
>>talked into it - "She won't be any bother" "Mom, I really want to stay
and
>>work on my puzzle."
>>I went.
>>Let me say that I was extremely uncomfortable the whole time.
>>Upon my return - everything was fine - it was exactly the way I had
left
>>it.
>>
>>That night, Brianna was "off". For the first time - she didn't want to
>>watch Xena.
>>Brianna slept badly - she was grinding her teeth in her sleep -
something
>>she hadn't done in ages.
>>
>>The next morning, I rec'd a confession from Kevin Soucy.
>>He had molested Brianna.

>>One of the most important things Brianna knows is that her intuition
can &
>>should be heard.
>>
>>And I'd rather have her safe than sorry.
>>
>>I know kids that do not know anything of these matters. How then, will
>>they recognize the monsters??
>>
>>Janis

Words cannot express what I felt for you and your daughter when I read
this.
A book I recommend regarding these issues is Protecting the Gift:
Keeping Children and Teenagers Safe (And Parents Sane) by Gavin De
Becker.
He is a safety expert in the true sense, having been professional in the
field for many years. He emphasizes listening to and responding to your
intuition regarding your safety and that of your children. I recommend
this book for any parent but especially for mothers.

Kelly D.

Kelly Dollinger

From: Jon and Rue Kream [mailto:skreams@...]
>>Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 9:15 AM

>>I recommend the book, "The Gift of Fear", by Gavin De Becker. It has
a
>>lot to do with listening to our intuition, and making sure our
children
>>are free to do the same. I think you'd feel better after reading it.
>>~Rue

Sorry, didn't read ahead before I posted about the same author. I was
all caught up in the Emotion! :-

Kelly D.

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/29/03 11:02:12 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
janis@... writes:

> One of the most important things Brianna knows is that her intuition can &
> should be heard.
>
> And I'd rather have her safe than sorry.
>
> I know kids that do not know anything of these matters. How then, will they
> recognize the monsters??
>
>

They don't until it is too late. That is such a moving story. Brianna is
lucky to have you. Someone who she knows respects her and will be in her
corner, someone she can tell anything too.

I was molested by my school music teacher. A respected man, who was evil on
the inside. Never told my parents. I always though my intuition was wrong
and it was my fault. Etc etc.

She is lucky.
Pam G.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

coyote's corner

Your welcome.

Brianna & I learned much from this.

We learned our strength.

We were both able to forgive him by the time of his sentencing.

That was major.
We were truly finished with him by the time he was in court to be sentenced.

Both of us.

It is behind us.
It is over.

It has no power in our lives anymore. :)
Janis





----- Original Message -----
From: marji
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone


Janis, What a powerful thing you have to tell. The pain that must come
with the retelling must be terrific. Thank you for telling it.

At 18:05 4/29/03 -0400, Janis wrote:
>One of the most important aspects of this crime was that Brianna told me.

Yeah!!!

Marji



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

BADOLBILZ

Janis, putting it really truly behind you is the most important thing.
My mother was sexually abused by her father, uncle, and grandfather.
The fact that it happened is sickening but it has had such severe
consequences her whole life. To this day, she's still buying Forgive
and Forget type books and then not reading them. She's never been able
to let it go and because of it, those men, all long dead, still continue
to manipulate and control her. I believe she will carry her pain to her
own death and it breaks my heart that she's never been able to get past
it. I'm so glad Brianna has your strength and wisdom to deal with this
now, in her youth, so she can get on and live her life free of the pain.
She'll always have it in her memories, unfortunately, but she can be
free of the pain.

The fact that abuse often is from someone the child knows is a very hard
thing to teach children to be wary of. I'm definitely going to buy that
book everyone recommended. So far all I've done on this topic with the
girls is always made them aware that they own their bodies and if ANYONE
makes them feel uncomforable, they can always tell me without me being
upset with them. I've also encouraged them to trust their own feelings
about others. But they are so little. So I will continue to arm them
and myself with whatever weapons I can find. Better safe then sorry.
HeidiC.

coyote's corner wrote:

>Your welcome.
>
>Brianna & I learned much from this.
>
>We learned our strength.
>
>We were both able to forgive him by the time of his sentencing.
>
>That was major.
>We were truly finished with him by the time he was in court to be sentenced.
>
>Both of us.
>
>It is behind us.
>It is over.
>
>It has no power in our lives anymore. :)
>Janis
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: marji
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 7:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone
>
>
> Janis, What a powerful thing you have to tell. The pain that must come
> with the retelling must be terrific. Thank you for telling it.
>
> At 18:05 4/29/03 -0400, Janis wrote:
> >One of the most important aspects of this crime was that Brianna told me.
>
> Yeah!!!
>
> Marji
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
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>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
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>
>
>
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>

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/29/2003 7:53:38 PM Central Daylight Time,
genant2@... writes:

> I was molested by my school music teacher. A respected man, who was evil on
>
> the inside. Never told my parents. I always though my intuition was wrong
>
> and it was my fault. Etc etc.
>

What would you do if you just recently began to suspect your adult child may
have been molested as a child?

Tuck


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/29/03 9:25:25 PM, ynxn96@... writes:

<< My mother was sexually abused by her father, uncle, and grandfather. >>

This is so horribly sad.

My mom was raped by her brother. Then he died not long after of scarlet
fever, so he was martyred and idealized by the mom and other siblings. That
was rough for her and she didn't tell me until I was 33 years old. I would
rather have known that as a kid than to wonder why on earth she had such
weird rules and phobias.

One reason she didn't tell me is that she and my dad maintained that she had
been a virgin when she got married. I'm not even sure if she had told my
dad, then.

Marty was badmouthing a girl he knows who has had sex with four guys he knows
of. One was likely Kirby, and so Marty said the "slut" word. I said maybe
Marty should try to learn some compassion, because my sister went to bed with
60 guys in two years after my parents divorced, and my sister had been raped
at 14 by two older guys, at knifepoint, in an arroyo.

It was a lot to spring on Marty all at once, but I told him lots of girls who
are promiscuous have been sexually abused by a male relative and they tend to
use it as a means of relationship building or communication, so that "slut"
was a harsh word to use about someone who was probably herself a victim.

He was sobered by the whole conversation and honestly seems to have become a
little more aware (not thinking of a word other than "sober," quiet,
thoughtful). The girl broke up with Kirby which saved him a tux rental AND
further high-school-style machinations. But I didn't mind that it was a
life lesson for Marty.

Sandra

Dana

> It was a lot to spring on Marty all at once, but I told him lots of girls
who
> are promiscuous have been sexually abused by a male relative and they tend
to
> use it as a means of relationship building or communication, so that
"slut"
> was a harsh word to use about someone who was probably herself a victim.

Or maybe she just likes sex. There's no harm in that, either......
Dana

BADOLBILZ

My mother was, I guess you could say, promiscuous after all the crap she
went through with her family. She got pregnant when she was 15 with her
boyfriend and gave the baby up for adoption. She never had the support
of her mother, who prefered to act as none of it ever happened. And to
this day the one person my mom blames more then anyone is her mother,
because she could have stopped it but she never even tried.

Interestingly, when my mom told my sister and I about her getting
pregnant as a teenager she told us she'd been raped. Years later, when
my half-sister found my mom and contacted her, then we found out that
the whole rape thing was made up for our benefit. We were teenagers and
I guess my mom didn't want us to know she's been having consentual (I
think that's the right word) sex. And she NEVER talked to us about sex
beyond telling us we had to wait until we were married. The whole thing
really scewed her up. Well, of course it did. It's sickening!

Anyway, I've always maintained that my girls do not have trust family
members just because they are family. Trust is earned and if the girls
say they don't want to sit on someone's lap or go visit their house the
answer is ALWAYS okay.

I don't have sons, but I think you did right by talking to Marty about
it. Men need to understand what can shape a woman's decisions about sex
and that those decisions often are based on her self-esteem. And girls
need to learn how not to become a victim through rape or the mental
manipulations that can be used on them when they are most succeptable,
escpecially during the preteen and teen years when what their peers
think becomes so important. HeidiC.


SandraDodd@... wrote:

>In a message dated 4/29/03 9:25:25 PM, ynxn96@... writes:
>
><< My mother was sexually abused by her father, uncle, and grandfather. >>
>
>This is so horribly sad.
>
>My mom was raped by her brother. Then he died not long after of scarlet
>fever, so he was martyred and idealized by the mom and other siblings. That
>was rough for her and she didn't tell me until I was 33 years old. I would
>rather have known that as a kid than to wonder why on earth she had such
>weird rules and phobias.
>
>One reason she didn't tell me is that she and my dad maintained that she had
>been a virgin when she got married. I'm not even sure if she had told my
>dad, then.
>
>Marty was badmouthing a girl he knows who has had sex with four guys he knows
>of. One was likely Kirby, and so Marty said the "slut" word. I said maybe
>Marty should try to learn some compassion, because my sister went to bed with
>60 guys in two years after my parents divorced, and my sister had been raped
>at 14 by two older guys, at knifepoint, in an arroyo.
>
>It was a lot to spring on Marty all at once, but I told him lots of girls who
>are promiscuous have been sexually abused by a male relative and they tend to
>use it as a means of relationship building or communication, so that "slut"
>was a harsh word to use about someone who was probably herself a victim.
>
>He was sobered by the whole conversation and honestly seems to have become a
>little more aware (not thinking of a word other than "sober," quiet,
>thoughtful). The girl broke up with Kirby which saved him a tux rental AND
>further high-school-style machinations. But I didn't mind that it was a
>life lesson for Marty.
>
>Sandra
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>[email protected]
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
>

coyote's corner

Thanks for your words......
I appreciate it.

Please, consider self defense lessons.

Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: BADOLBILZ
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:13 PM
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone


Janis, putting it really truly behind you is the most important thing.
My mother was sexually abused by her father, uncle, and grandfather.
The fact that it happened is sickening but it has had such severe
consequences her whole life. To this day, she's still buying Forgive
and Forget type books and then not reading them. She's never been able
to let it go and because of it, those men, all long dead, still continue
to manipulate and control her. I believe she will carry her pain to her
own death and it breaks my heart that she's never been able to get past
it. I'm so glad Brianna has your strength and wisdom to deal with this
now, in her youth, so she can get on and live her life free of the pain.
She'll always have it in her memories, unfortunately, but she can be
free of the pain.

The fact that abuse often is from someone the child knows is a very hard
thing to teach children to be wary of. I'm definitely going to buy that
book everyone recommended. So far all I've done on this topic with the
girls is always made them aware that they own their bodies and if ANYONE
makes them feel uncomforable, they can always tell me without me being
upset with them. I've also encouraged them to trust their own feelings
about others. But they are so little. So I will continue to arm them
and myself with whatever weapons I can find. Better safe then sorry.
HeidiC.

coyote's corner wrote:

>Your welcome.
>
>Brianna & I learned much from this.
>
>We learned our strength.
>
>We were both able to forgive him by the time of his sentencing.
>
>That was major.
>We were truly finished with him by the time he was in court to be sentenced.
>
>Both of us.
>
>It is behind us.
>It is over.
>
>It has no power in our lives anymore. :)
>Janis
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: marji
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 7:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Leaving Children Alone
>
>
> Janis, What a powerful thing you have to tell. The pain that must come
> with the retelling must be terrific. Thank you for telling it.
>
> At 18:05 4/29/03 -0400, Janis wrote:
> >One of the most important aspects of this crime was that Brianna told me.
>
> Yeah!!!
>
> Marji
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
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>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Deborah Lewis

***Or maybe she just likes sex. There's no harm in that, either...***

Oh, we're on to you, Miss garden in the nude, you sex pot! <g>

Deb, sneaking away...

Noemi Hiraishi

What I meant in my last posting was that there were, neither here in Japan
nor there in Brazil laws/regulations that stated that parents can't leave
their children alone at home.

As for parents not being allowed to take their children to and from school
here in Japan, it is a "school request"; aprents have gone to school in
groups and so does their child as did the children's granparents. Parents
that haven chosen to send their child to a school that were not assigned by
the city office take the child to and from the school, though. I meant
that, as a rule here, children are to learn to be on its own in a young age
of 6.

As for after school schooling or classes such as piano, Japanese language,
English, Math ...etc. many mothers go with their children. That is the same
for shopping.

I hardly ever saw 1st, 2nd, 3rd graders on its own at supermarket or
bakeries.

Last year I got one call fm the school district allerting parents of child
molesters in the neighborhood. Dd said she knows him and that everytime she
sees him, all the children run. I have not yet heard of kidnapping and or
child abuse in our area or nearby area. But there are many cases of both
here too. It is not as frequent and you see in the news of US or Brazil.
But there are cases and day by day child's abuse cases have been
disclosured.

As many big metropolitan, Tokyo is full of danger. If I lived in Cupertino,
Ca where I lived 17 years ago, I would not allow dd to friends house on her
own. When I am in my mother home in Sao Paulo, Br. I do not let dd go to
the bakery acroos the street on her own. I let dd run aroung the neiborhood
for 3, 4 hrs here in Tokyo, because I feel the safety.

I have told her that nobody are allowed to make her do anything that she
feels uncomfortable even her father. Nobody are to touch her in parts of
her body that she does not feel comfortable. Even hugging on hand shaking.
She can always refuse and she should run home or scream.

One big factor that makes me feel comfortable here in my neighborhood is
that there are many elderly in the area fm early morning to sun set.
Because apartments are small, they tend to go out. Or if living in big
houses, but with daughter's in law, many tend to stick in the parks for
talks. Even if we do have not talked to many of them, dd and I know them
and they know dd. We had spent most of the last 8 years outdoors.

love and peace

coyote's corner

This is such a nice post!
What a wonderful opportunity - traveling like you do.
My Brianna was born loving Japan.
She has plans for us to go there - "someday"

Thanks for posting,
Janis
----- Original Message -----
From: Noemi Hiraishi
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 2:58 AM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Leaving Children Alone


What I meant in my last posting was that there were, neither here in Japan
nor there in Brazil laws/regulations that stated that parents can't leave
their children alone at home.

As for parents not being allowed to take their children to and from school
here in Japan, it is a "school request"; aprents have gone to school in
groups and so does their child as did the children's granparents. Parents
that haven chosen to send their child to a school that were not assigned by
the city office take the child to and from the school, though. I meant
that, as a rule here, children are to learn to be on its own in a young age
of 6.

As for after school schooling or classes such as piano, Japanese language,
English, Math ...etc. many mothers go with their children. That is the same
for shopping.

I hardly ever saw 1st, 2nd, 3rd graders on its own at supermarket or
bakeries.

Last year I got one call fm the school district allerting parents of child
molesters in the neighborhood. Dd said she knows him and that everytime she
sees him, all the children run. I have not yet heard of kidnapping and or
child abuse in our area or nearby area. But there are many cases of both
here too. It is not as frequent and you see in the news of US or Brazil.
But there are cases and day by day child's abuse cases have been
disclosured.

As many big metropolitan, Tokyo is full of danger. If I lived in Cupertino,
Ca where I lived 17 years ago, I would not allow dd to friends house on her
own. When I am in my mother home in Sao Paulo, Br. I do not let dd go to
the bakery acroos the street on her own. I let dd run aroung the neiborhood
for 3, 4 hrs here in Tokyo, because I feel the safety.

I have told her that nobody are allowed to make her do anything that she
feels uncomfortable even her father. Nobody are to touch her in parts of
her body that she does not feel comfortable. Even hugging on hand shaking.
She can always refuse and she should run home or scream.

One big factor that makes me feel comfortable here in my neighborhood is
that there are many elderly in the area fm early morning to sun set.
Because apartments are small, they tend to go out. Or if living in big
houses, but with daughter's in law, many tend to stick in the parks for
talks. Even if we do have not talked to many of them, dd and I know them
and they know dd. We had spent most of the last 8 years outdoors.

love and peace


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