Wanting to be one of the guys...long
[email protected]
The other night we had two of our sons friends sleep over. The two boys both
attend school and one is two years older and has some family stresses. Im not
fond of him bc he leaves a trail of trouble but I feel bad bc his parents have
been fighting and his mom has a drinking problem (Got a DWI last week). I
took the boys to Walmart with me bc they wanted to go. I found when I got there
that they only wanted to go so they could take their skateboards which I have
safety concerns with (at Walmart) and my son knows this. He didn't speak up to
them and say no until they listened. I listened to them interact and its just
sad. My son is soo different with this kid.
Later in the night the boys came in about 10:30 from jumping on the
trampoline. We had some nice conversations about unschooling. We talked about me as a
parent and how "cool" they think I am. Well, I had said to them "you know im
not a strict parent all I ask is to know where my son is going and that he is
making good choices.
My son popped his head in my room around 11ish and said "were going to bed
now Mom." I KNEW something was up he never does that. I thought for a sec and
then said to my self no, Laura your going to trust his judgement..........<sigh>
Well,.... Some time after 11:30 ish one of the boys (the one with the
troubled family) pretty much nagged my son and the other boy to go egging. At some
point walking down the street my son began to cry and ran home. He told the kid
you know I cant do this my mom will be so upset. More pressure from the boy
and they ended up going. They egged two houses and one is a family that dislikes
us bc we HS. Its my understanding that my son didn't throw one at this house
but rather the older boy did. We told him that just bc he didn't throw it he
still was there. The family knows we are not too impressed with them and they
the same. They have been looking for a reason to be irritated with us.
Tonight the daughter of the family said to the older boy in IM that her
parents think it was my son. My thoughts on this are why do they think it was my
kid? He has never done anything the hurt anyone or break the law why my kid?
I am very upset inside that he caves into peer pressure. Im sad that he
didn't stand up to the boy. I didn't yell, I didn't punish but I did speak with
him. The last couple days he has been pretty close to my side and has apologized
a few times. Because the situation with the family and us isn't good and they
wouldn't believe he didn't throw the egg we all (three families) choose to say
nothing. I feel guilt, I feel dishonest and I know they are going to find out.
I have been not wanting to say he cannot play with this boy but in light of
this situation I dont think anything good is going to come from this
relationship.
Any thoughts? Has anyone experienced this? What unschooly~parental step did I
miss?
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
attend school and one is two years older and has some family stresses. Im not
fond of him bc he leaves a trail of trouble but I feel bad bc his parents have
been fighting and his mom has a drinking problem (Got a DWI last week). I
took the boys to Walmart with me bc they wanted to go. I found when I got there
that they only wanted to go so they could take their skateboards which I have
safety concerns with (at Walmart) and my son knows this. He didn't speak up to
them and say no until they listened. I listened to them interact and its just
sad. My son is soo different with this kid.
Later in the night the boys came in about 10:30 from jumping on the
trampoline. We had some nice conversations about unschooling. We talked about me as a
parent and how "cool" they think I am. Well, I had said to them "you know im
not a strict parent all I ask is to know where my son is going and that he is
making good choices.
My son popped his head in my room around 11ish and said "were going to bed
now Mom." I KNEW something was up he never does that. I thought for a sec and
then said to my self no, Laura your going to trust his judgement..........<sigh>
Well,.... Some time after 11:30 ish one of the boys (the one with the
troubled family) pretty much nagged my son and the other boy to go egging. At some
point walking down the street my son began to cry and ran home. He told the kid
you know I cant do this my mom will be so upset. More pressure from the boy
and they ended up going. They egged two houses and one is a family that dislikes
us bc we HS. Its my understanding that my son didn't throw one at this house
but rather the older boy did. We told him that just bc he didn't throw it he
still was there. The family knows we are not too impressed with them and they
the same. They have been looking for a reason to be irritated with us.
Tonight the daughter of the family said to the older boy in IM that her
parents think it was my son. My thoughts on this are why do they think it was my
kid? He has never done anything the hurt anyone or break the law why my kid?
I am very upset inside that he caves into peer pressure. Im sad that he
didn't stand up to the boy. I didn't yell, I didn't punish but I did speak with
him. The last couple days he has been pretty close to my side and has apologized
a few times. Because the situation with the family and us isn't good and they
wouldn't believe he didn't throw the egg we all (three families) choose to say
nothing. I feel guilt, I feel dishonest and I know they are going to find out.
I have been not wanting to say he cannot play with this boy but in light of
this situation I dont think anything good is going to come from this
relationship.
Any thoughts? Has anyone experienced this? What unschooly~parental step did I
miss?
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/5/04 10:07:55 PM, HMSL2@... writes:
<< I am very upset inside that he caves into peer pressure. Im sad that he
didn't stand up to the boy. I didn't yell, I didn't punish but I did speak
with
him >>
Did you talk to the older boy? Did you TELL him that you're unwilling to
risk your peaceful homeschooling life for his reckless behavior? Did you
consider telling the neighbors who did throw the eggs, or threatening the boy with
telling? Did you consider taking the two boys over there to apologize and clean
up the mess?
Treating children like people sometimes involves treating them as you would
treat adult friends, and just saying "NO, don't even think of pissing off my
neighbors." I wouldn't cover for adult friends who threw eggs.
I wouldn't want an adult roommate to say "I'm going to bed" and then sneak
out. It's SO not okay on many, many levels.
-=-Well, I had said to them "you know im
not a strict parent all I ask is to know where my son is going and that he is
making good choices.-=-
If it were me, I would have gotten my husband to help me verbally intimidate
the other boy BIGTIME. He probably has no clue how much risk he's put you
at, but you could let him know. If an adult friend or roommate were using your
house to sell drugs, or provide liquor to minors, or whatever other illegal
thing, would you cower and lie? I doubt it. Don't let a child use your eggs
and your house to hide in and just hide.
If you don't have it in you to pressure the kids to apologize and clean,
maybe write a letter to the family saying you know which boys were involved, and
that you have spoken with them (IF you speak to them). It might keep them from
assuming your son is guilty for years to come.
I've told my kids that they are not to be out late on school nights because I
don't want any trouble with social services at ALL, and being homeschoolers
makes us more conspicuous. I remind them when they forget. One friend of
Marty's is a bad influence, but I look him right in the face and say "No." And
"no" means you can go home or you can stay here and stop posturing and
monkeying.
Sandra
<< I am very upset inside that he caves into peer pressure. Im sad that he
didn't stand up to the boy. I didn't yell, I didn't punish but I did speak
with
him >>
Did you talk to the older boy? Did you TELL him that you're unwilling to
risk your peaceful homeschooling life for his reckless behavior? Did you
consider telling the neighbors who did throw the eggs, or threatening the boy with
telling? Did you consider taking the two boys over there to apologize and clean
up the mess?
Treating children like people sometimes involves treating them as you would
treat adult friends, and just saying "NO, don't even think of pissing off my
neighbors." I wouldn't cover for adult friends who threw eggs.
I wouldn't want an adult roommate to say "I'm going to bed" and then sneak
out. It's SO not okay on many, many levels.
-=-Well, I had said to them "you know im
not a strict parent all I ask is to know where my son is going and that he is
making good choices.-=-
If it were me, I would have gotten my husband to help me verbally intimidate
the other boy BIGTIME. He probably has no clue how much risk he's put you
at, but you could let him know. If an adult friend or roommate were using your
house to sell drugs, or provide liquor to minors, or whatever other illegal
thing, would you cower and lie? I doubt it. Don't let a child use your eggs
and your house to hide in and just hide.
If you don't have it in you to pressure the kids to apologize and clean,
maybe write a letter to the family saying you know which boys were involved, and
that you have spoken with them (IF you speak to them). It might keep them from
assuming your son is guilty for years to come.
I've told my kids that they are not to be out late on school nights because I
don't want any trouble with social services at ALL, and being homeschoolers
makes us more conspicuous. I remind them when they forget. One friend of
Marty's is a bad influence, but I look him right in the face and say "No." And
"no" means you can go home or you can stay here and stop posturing and
monkeying.
Sandra
pam sorooshian
On Sep 5, 2004, at 9:07 PM, HMSL2@... wrote:
Aren't you glad? Sounds like a pretty good experience for him to have.
I wouldn't be too upset - learning happens the hard way sometimes.
He'll get stronger and will have experience for when more dangerous
pressures hit him.
I'd think you'd want to 'fess up and clean up or make amends to the
families whose houses got egged though. You could do the talking for
him - say, "We're really sorry this happened and want to make it up to
you somehow." Or maybe he could write them a note? Or he could help you
bake a cake and give it to them with a card on which he can say, "This
is how I'll be using eggs from now on." I think you'd both feel much
better if you did find a way for him to make amends.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> I am very upset inside that he caves into peer pressure.He's learning not to, though. He learned that it didn't feel good.
Aren't you glad? Sounds like a pretty good experience for him to have.
I wouldn't be too upset - learning happens the hard way sometimes.
He'll get stronger and will have experience for when more dangerous
pressures hit him.
I'd think you'd want to 'fess up and clean up or make amends to the
families whose houses got egged though. You could do the talking for
him - say, "We're really sorry this happened and want to make it up to
you somehow." Or maybe he could write them a note? Or he could help you
bake a cake and give it to them with a card on which he can say, "This
is how I'll be using eggs from now on." I think you'd both feel much
better if you did find a way for him to make amends.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/6/2004 1:07:51 AM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
consider telling the neighbors who did throw the eggs, or threatening the boy
with
telling? Did you consider taking the two boys over there to apologize and
clean
up the mess?>>
Yes, I did speak to them but I have not spoken to the boy about his
friendship with my son that will be ending. He is not allowed to leave his house but
has been ringing my phone off the hook.
IN the am I did speak to the boys and this is what was said: My son was in
his room and the two other boys were in the tv room. I spoke to my son first
while they slept. I asked him who got egged and who did what house and WHY. He
told me the older boy came in to his room and ripped his blankets off and said
"lets go!" I know he did say no several times and it was a big step for him.
(thank you Sandra for reminding me of that)
I then went to the tv room with my husband. I asked them both what happened.
At first the older boy told me he didn't know what I was talking about. I
cleared that up for him...They said what my son said except the part about him
running back home in tears. I asked about that and they said yes he did.
I told them that I was sorry but I would need to call their parents. I asked
if either one would be hit by their parents (I suspected the older one but
after some delay he finally answered a no and said I talk to my parents). The
other boy and I spoke before went home. He began to cry. I wanted to cry with
him, I kinda did just less tears.
I told him I was sorry this happened. I told him how important it is not to
cave to pressure when you know its not kind. I told him soon this will pass but
for now 5 minutes of fun has now turned into prob a few months of no play (I
knew his dad would ground him for months and he did). My husband and I spoke
to the dad and he has had many issues with the older boy and the boy was
actually banned from their home. I think my son and his will continue to play in a
few days but the older boy will need to go back to his old friends.
As far as going to apologize considering the people its not a good idea. We
talked about it (all three families) and they are not people who physically
treat children any different than adults.
Ive spoken to my son and he knows to say no next time anyone pressures him.
We have spoken about this several times this weekend and its clear.
This was tuff to post but I am an all or nothing person. Just a few days ago
I am an unschooling mom of four unschooling successfully and now my son eggs
someone's house, gesh....
(Sandra)I listened to the three tapes today (to see what one would be good
for my friend) on Peaceful parenting, Unschooling gracefully and unschooling
explained (I think that the name) and I feel way better. Turns out there were
some messages for me on there also. Before I was feeling like a failure and
bummed my son made a bad decision. Now I feel we can get passed it. A living and
learning experience that taught us all that we are human and do make mistakes.
Laura~Who threw a fire cracker on a porch with a gas grill at 13 years old :
) whooppzie!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... writes:
>>Did you talk to the older boy? Did you TELL him that you're unwilling torisk your peaceful homeschooling life for his reckless behavior? Did you
consider telling the neighbors who did throw the eggs, or threatening the boy
with
telling? Did you consider taking the two boys over there to apologize and
clean
up the mess?>>
Yes, I did speak to them but I have not spoken to the boy about his
friendship with my son that will be ending. He is not allowed to leave his house but
has been ringing my phone off the hook.
IN the am I did speak to the boys and this is what was said: My son was in
his room and the two other boys were in the tv room. I spoke to my son first
while they slept. I asked him who got egged and who did what house and WHY. He
told me the older boy came in to his room and ripped his blankets off and said
"lets go!" I know he did say no several times and it was a big step for him.
(thank you Sandra for reminding me of that)
I then went to the tv room with my husband. I asked them both what happened.
At first the older boy told me he didn't know what I was talking about. I
cleared that up for him...They said what my son said except the part about him
running back home in tears. I asked about that and they said yes he did.
I told them that I was sorry but I would need to call their parents. I asked
if either one would be hit by their parents (I suspected the older one but
after some delay he finally answered a no and said I talk to my parents). The
other boy and I spoke before went home. He began to cry. I wanted to cry with
him, I kinda did just less tears.
I told him I was sorry this happened. I told him how important it is not to
cave to pressure when you know its not kind. I told him soon this will pass but
for now 5 minutes of fun has now turned into prob a few months of no play (I
knew his dad would ground him for months and he did). My husband and I spoke
to the dad and he has had many issues with the older boy and the boy was
actually banned from their home. I think my son and his will continue to play in a
few days but the older boy will need to go back to his old friends.
As far as going to apologize considering the people its not a good idea. We
talked about it (all three families) and they are not people who physically
treat children any different than adults.
Ive spoken to my son and he knows to say no next time anyone pressures him.
We have spoken about this several times this weekend and its clear.
This was tuff to post but I am an all or nothing person. Just a few days ago
I am an unschooling mom of four unschooling successfully and now my son eggs
someone's house, gesh....
(Sandra)I listened to the three tapes today (to see what one would be good
for my friend) on Peaceful parenting, Unschooling gracefully and unschooling
explained (I think that the name) and I feel way better. Turns out there were
some messages for me on there also. Before I was feeling like a failure and
bummed my son made a bad decision. Now I feel we can get passed it. A living and
learning experience that taught us all that we are human and do make mistakes.
Laura~Who threw a fire cracker on a porch with a gas grill at 13 years old :
) whooppzie!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Have a Nice Day!
>>Did you talk to the older boy? Did you TELL him that you're unwilling torisk your peaceful homeschooling life for his reckless behavior?
***************
We had an incident here involving a neighbor boy tonight. I won't go into the details, but suffice it to say that somehow we have a lot of losers for neighbors. He is 15 I think.
I called him tonight on the phone and told him if he ever did anything like that again, I was coming after him.
I have never done that before. I've always been diplomatic, but I'm sick of being diplomatic with jerks disguised as people. It felt good to truly hold him accountable, even if he's not my kid.
Kristen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
pam sorooshian
On Sep 6, 2004, at 9:17 PM, HMSL2@... wrote:
with HUGE big learning potential that could really pay off in the
future.
I do feel a need for a person who has done something like this to make
amends somehow though - no matter what the family is like, unless you
think they'd actually hit your or pull out a gun and shoot him or
something. Being nasty to him, verbally, is part of what he might just
have to face, because he DID egg their house (whether he threw the
actual egg at that house or not is irrelevant.) Even leaving a small
gift and an apologetic note on their porch, anonymously, would be good
for your son.
Doing the right thing when it is hard is a real test of character and
it is in these kinds of situations that we build up our strength of
character to do the right thing when it is even harder.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> This was tuff to post but I am an all or nothing person. Just a fewWelcome to the real world - don't be upset. This seems a small incident
> days ago
> I am an unschooling mom of four unschooling successfully and now my
> son eggs
> someone's house, gesh....
with HUGE big learning potential that could really pay off in the
future.
I do feel a need for a person who has done something like this to make
amends somehow though - no matter what the family is like, unless you
think they'd actually hit your or pull out a gun and shoot him or
something. Being nasty to him, verbally, is part of what he might just
have to face, because he DID egg their house (whether he threw the
actual egg at that house or not is irrelevant.) Even leaving a small
gift and an apologetic note on their porch, anonymously, would be good
for your son.
Doing the right thing when it is hard is a real test of character and
it is in these kinds of situations that we build up our strength of
character to do the right thing when it is even harder.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
kayb85
"I do feel a need for a person who has done something like this to
make
amends somehow though - no matter what the family is like, unless you
think they'd actually hit your or pull out a gun and shoot him or
something."
Could they have him arrested for egging their house? That would be a
concern of mine in having him make ammends.
Sheila
make
amends somehow though - no matter what the family is like, unless you
think they'd actually hit your or pull out a gun and shoot him or
something."
Could they have him arrested for egging their house? That would be a
concern of mine in having him make ammends.
Sheila
[email protected]
In a message dated 9/7/2004 2:37:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, sheran@...
writes:
<<Could they have him arrested for egging their house? That would be a
concern of mine in having him make ammends.
Sheila>>>
Yes, and they would even if he didn't do it (someone in the family works at
the PD and the entire street is related). I do feel like a bit of a wimp but im
not going to put my son out to the wolves for being in the wrong place at the
wrong time (he didn't throw an egg at this house the older boy did). I guess
I feel like if you treat a kid like a criminal they will find a way to prove
you right.
However I do think that maybe it would be a good idea to visit the house he
actually tossed at (im being told he missed on purpose). This isn't the violent
people but close. I know in my heart the guilt of not coming forward is going
to get the best of me and that's good I guess....
We will do something I just dont know what yet? Knowing these people and how
much they dislike us (not from anything we did that's for sure) no one I know
is suggesting that we speak up at all.....
Someone asked yesterday if any of us unschool due to our own childhood's or
something like that. I do. In this case I know first hand that being accused of
doing something or being a bad kid can make a good kid go in the wrong
direction. I did things just because I was already accused of them so I had to try
them. However stupid or silly it sounds it was real to me. The difference may
be that my son has a good home, I didn't.
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
writes:
<<Could they have him arrested for egging their house? That would be a
concern of mine in having him make ammends.
Sheila>>>
Yes, and they would even if he didn't do it (someone in the family works at
the PD and the entire street is related). I do feel like a bit of a wimp but im
not going to put my son out to the wolves for being in the wrong place at the
wrong time (he didn't throw an egg at this house the older boy did). I guess
I feel like if you treat a kid like a criminal they will find a way to prove
you right.
However I do think that maybe it would be a good idea to visit the house he
actually tossed at (im being told he missed on purpose). This isn't the violent
people but close. I know in my heart the guilt of not coming forward is going
to get the best of me and that's good I guess....
We will do something I just dont know what yet? Knowing these people and how
much they dislike us (not from anything we did that's for sure) no one I know
is suggesting that we speak up at all.....
Someone asked yesterday if any of us unschool due to our own childhood's or
something like that. I do. In this case I know first hand that being accused of
doing something or being a bad kid can make a good kid go in the wrong
direction. I did things just because I was already accused of them so I had to try
them. However stupid or silly it sounds it was real to me. The difference may
be that my son has a good home, I didn't.
Laura
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]