RE:spanked or threatened or punished (long)
Krisula Moyer
ge: 1
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 10:05:06 EST
From: Genant2@...
Subject: Re: Re: anti-unschooling comments
In a message dated 10/29/03 11:50:01 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Halo5964@... writes:
but in practice don't.
I don't know *any* people I would call Friends of Christ (Quaker-eese for
Christians) who advocate beating or humiliating children in any way. Those
who advocate the use of spanking as a part of discipline usually couch these
beliefs by saying it must be done without anger or rage, in a "disciplined"
way. I.e. "if you continue to refuse to ____________ you will receive a
spanking at bed time." And a small , unscientific survey at church last
night revealed that those raised by parents who were (in this case) Quakers
, remembered being spanked once or twice their entire childhood if at all.
Not regularly, need it or not.
I'm in a funny position because I do not believe spanking is good or
necessary and I certainly would never hit my child in anger but I have
spanked from time to time (maybe 6 times in 10 years of parenting 3
children) when there was a situation I could not figure out anything else to
do. Over the years I've learned that in every case, with my children, they
were *not* accepting of this behavior. Neither the child being spanked nor
the siblings would accept this sort of punishment. They got together and
gave me a talking to! (good for them!) If I had it to do again I would not
spank. Ever.
As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people are
not going to change their views about this lightly. And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. Mom or dad is in denial or needs to feel powerful
or is not capable of showing love and affection blah blah blah because of
his or her own deficient upbringing. Peacefulness and love are things that
must be discovered and grown in the adult before one can expect to see it in
parenting behavior. It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.
As for the idea I've seen on this list that shepherds didn't beat their
sheep with a staff, well, there's also the rod. I'm afraid a deeper look is
necessary if you are going to try to argue the Bible doesn't advocate
spanking.
Consider: "the rod and rebuke give wisdom. But a child left to himself
brings shame to his mother." Prov. 29:15
"Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child: The rod of correction
will drive it far from him" Prov. 22:15
and "Do not withhold correction from a child. For if you beat him with a
rod he will not die." Prov. 23:13
You get the idea. There are not too many of these but they are there, so if
you are hoping to sweep away the old testament style "correction" with a
speech on the proper use of the shepherds's staff, you'll have to try again.
IMHO mentions of the "rod" seem to correlate with rebellion of a serious
nature in an older child not two year olds taking a tantrum in a store.
I think a better tack would be to dig up all the verses about loving
children and the consequences of bringing harm to them.
Here are a few for those of you still interested enough to continue reading
this long-winded post.
"Whoever receives one little child like this in my name receives Me (Jesus
speaking)." Q. how mad would He be if we mistreat that little one? A. "But
whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would
be better for him that a Millstone were hung around his neck, and he were
drowned in the depth of the sea." Matt18:5-6
Do you think beating and humiliating a child or mistreating him would cause
him to sin? I believe so as it causes pain, disconnect and disfunction
which tends to perpetuate more violence and mistreatment of others.
I like this one: "you fathers, do not provoke your children to wrath..."
Ephesians 6:4a
also from Ephesians " Be kind to one another , tenderhearted, forgiving one
another even as God in Christ forgave you." Does this apply to families
with children? Of course it does!
This last verse and hundreds like it are the crux (no pun intended) of what
the Bible teaches Christians to do and be. The Christian must honor the
sacred trust Christ gives us by forgiving our sins and adopting us "as dear
children". What would He say if, after receiving his tender love, we turn
around and offer a stingy, nit-picky, conditional type of love to our own
children. We are to be "imitators of God as dear children." Eph.5:1 I
gotta be honest. God doesn't take off His belt to whip me every time I make
a mistake or even when I rebelliously sin against Him. Instead He waits, He
loves, He gently prods me back into his arms by his unfailing love. I want
to be like that with my kids and I have plenty of role models of my
acquaintance to model that after.
Love and Peace to all,
Krisula
-----
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2003 10:05:06 EST
From: Genant2@...
Subject: Re: Re: anti-unschooling comments
In a message dated 10/29/03 11:50:01 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Halo5964@... writes:
> So, I'm wondering, anyone in the same boat?-----------------------------------
>
> Carol
>
>
>
>Hi Carol,know
>I have never spanked or threatened or punished my boys and I am a Christian
>but I do know some Christians who do not spank. I know some that do. I
>some non-Christians who spank and some who do not.I know many Christians who believe parents should have the option to spank
>Pam G
but in practice don't.
I don't know *any* people I would call Friends of Christ (Quaker-eese for
Christians) who advocate beating or humiliating children in any way. Those
who advocate the use of spanking as a part of discipline usually couch these
beliefs by saying it must be done without anger or rage, in a "disciplined"
way. I.e. "if you continue to refuse to ____________ you will receive a
spanking at bed time." And a small , unscientific survey at church last
night revealed that those raised by parents who were (in this case) Quakers
, remembered being spanked once or twice their entire childhood if at all.
Not regularly, need it or not.
I'm in a funny position because I do not believe spanking is good or
necessary and I certainly would never hit my child in anger but I have
spanked from time to time (maybe 6 times in 10 years of parenting 3
children) when there was a situation I could not figure out anything else to
do. Over the years I've learned that in every case, with my children, they
were *not* accepting of this behavior. Neither the child being spanked nor
the siblings would accept this sort of punishment. They got together and
gave me a talking to! (good for them!) If I had it to do again I would not
spank. Ever.
As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people are
not going to change their views about this lightly. And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. Mom or dad is in denial or needs to feel powerful
or is not capable of showing love and affection blah blah blah because of
his or her own deficient upbringing. Peacefulness and love are things that
must be discovered and grown in the adult before one can expect to see it in
parenting behavior. It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.
As for the idea I've seen on this list that shepherds didn't beat their
sheep with a staff, well, there's also the rod. I'm afraid a deeper look is
necessary if you are going to try to argue the Bible doesn't advocate
spanking.
Consider: "the rod and rebuke give wisdom. But a child left to himself
brings shame to his mother." Prov. 29:15
"Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child: The rod of correction
will drive it far from him" Prov. 22:15
and "Do not withhold correction from a child. For if you beat him with a
rod he will not die." Prov. 23:13
You get the idea. There are not too many of these but they are there, so if
you are hoping to sweep away the old testament style "correction" with a
speech on the proper use of the shepherds's staff, you'll have to try again.
IMHO mentions of the "rod" seem to correlate with rebellion of a serious
nature in an older child not two year olds taking a tantrum in a store.
I think a better tack would be to dig up all the verses about loving
children and the consequences of bringing harm to them.
Here are a few for those of you still interested enough to continue reading
this long-winded post.
"Whoever receives one little child like this in my name receives Me (Jesus
speaking)." Q. how mad would He be if we mistreat that little one? A. "But
whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would
be better for him that a Millstone were hung around his neck, and he were
drowned in the depth of the sea." Matt18:5-6
Do you think beating and humiliating a child or mistreating him would cause
him to sin? I believe so as it causes pain, disconnect and disfunction
which tends to perpetuate more violence and mistreatment of others.
I like this one: "you fathers, do not provoke your children to wrath..."
Ephesians 6:4a
also from Ephesians " Be kind to one another , tenderhearted, forgiving one
another even as God in Christ forgave you." Does this apply to families
with children? Of course it does!
This last verse and hundreds like it are the crux (no pun intended) of what
the Bible teaches Christians to do and be. The Christian must honor the
sacred trust Christ gives us by forgiving our sins and adopting us "as dear
children". What would He say if, after receiving his tender love, we turn
around and offer a stingy, nit-picky, conditional type of love to our own
children. We are to be "imitators of God as dear children." Eph.5:1 I
gotta be honest. God doesn't take off His belt to whip me every time I make
a mistake or even when I rebelliously sin against Him. Instead He waits, He
loves, He gently prods me back into his arms by his unfailing love. I want
to be like that with my kids and I have plenty of role models of my
acquaintance to model that after.
Love and Peace to all,
Krisula
-----
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/31/03 10:12:17 AM, krisulam@... writes:
<< As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people are
not going to change their views about this lightly. >>
Each time I've been in a conversation like this online, though, at least one
family stops spanking. Sometimes more than one. Those are just the people
who'll admit it. How many lurkers have their minds changed? And if their minds
are changed while they're here, they might think again (I'd like to see them
try NOT to) the next time they see that betrayed look in a child's eyes.
<<And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. >>
Whatever, for parents. If a parent is damaged and the kid can end up at
least somewhat less put-upon and wounded, good for the kid. I learned pretty
early to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
<< It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.>>
Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that side
of the fence.
Sandra
<< As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people are
not going to change their views about this lightly. >>
Each time I've been in a conversation like this online, though, at least one
family stops spanking. Sometimes more than one. Those are just the people
who'll admit it. How many lurkers have their minds changed? And if their minds
are changed while they're here, they might think again (I'd like to see them
try NOT to) the next time they see that betrayed look in a child's eyes.
<<And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. >>
Whatever, for parents. If a parent is damaged and the kid can end up at
least somewhat less put-upon and wounded, good for the kid. I learned pretty
early to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
<< It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.>>
Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that side
of the fence.
Sandra
pam sorooshian
On Oct 31, 2003, at 8:32 AM, Krisula Moyer wrote:
advocate using fishing line to whip babies to train them to stay on a
blanket, right? And - to train them not to wiggle when having a diaper
change? And you've seen the ads for the various-sized "rods" for
hitting children?
Nobody "calls" what they are advocating "beating" or "humiliating" --
but that IS still what they are advocating, no matter what euphemisms
they use.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
> I don't know *any* people I would call Friends of Christ (Quaker-eeseKrisula --- you may not know them - but you know there are those who
> for
> Christians) who advocate beating or humiliating children in any way.
advocate using fishing line to whip babies to train them to stay on a
blanket, right? And - to train them not to wiggle when having a diaper
change? And you've seen the ads for the various-sized "rods" for
hitting children?
Nobody "calls" what they are advocating "beating" or "humiliating" --
but that IS still what they are advocating, no matter what euphemisms
they use.
-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/31/03 11:13:20 AM, pamsoroosh@... writes:
<< Krisula --- you may not know them - but you know there are those who
advocate using fishing line to whip babies to train them to stay on a
blanket, right? And - to train them not to wiggle when having a diaper
change? And you've seen the ads for the various-sized "rods" for
hitting children?
Quakers or all Christians.
Sandra
<< Krisula --- you may not know them - but you know there are those who
advocate using fishing line to whip babies to train them to stay on a
blanket, right? And - to train them not to wiggle when having a diaper
change? And you've seen the ads for the various-sized "rods" for
hitting children?
>>But they're probably not Quakers. The claim was ambiguous, whether it meant
Quakers or all Christians.
Sandra
Kris
<<Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that
side
of the fence.
Sandra>>
I've seen the same thing many times, even been told a year or two later that
the person stopped spanking after reading debates on the issue. Logic
dictates that there are even more whom we never know about.
Kris
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that
side
of the fence.
Sandra>>
I've seen the same thing many times, even been told a year or two later that
the person stopped spanking after reading debates on the issue. Logic
dictates that there are even more whom we never know about.
Kris
Krisula Moyer
>Krisula --- you may not know them - but you know there are those who------------------------------------------------------------------
>advocate using fishing line to whip babies to train them to stay on a
>blanket, right? And - to train them not to wiggle when having a diaper
>change? And you've seen the ads for the various-sized "rods" for
>hitting children?
>Nobody "calls" what they are advocating "beating" or "humiliating" --
>but that IS still what they are advocating, no matter what euphemisms
>they use.
>-.pam
Yes, Pam -- I know these people are out there but what I am saying (perhaps
too subtly) is that the biggest euphemism they use is to call themselves
*Christians*.
I detest these things and I believe (whoa I'm going out on a limb here) I
believe God does too. I would definitely take someone to the mat over
"training" a baby in the way you describe. I do not associate with people
like this because it would sap all of my energy and focus to deal with them.
Neither am I inclined to be polite about it. My own small congregation of
worshipers has never given me a reason to believe they would fall for these
unloving techniques. If you are speaking with someone who thinks baby
training is a good idea you might ask: "Can you imagine Mary strapping Jesus
to a changing table or beating him with a paddle because he wet his tunic?"
I know there is a huge number of people being duped in this way and the ones
leading them astray have much to answer for. Watch out for those
millstones!
I know anyone can use the name Christian to mean whatever they want it to
and for whatever purposes they decide but the Bible gives me some clues to
look for to decide for myself the authenticity of their commitment to God.
Here's one I use " But the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace,
longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control.
Against such there is no law." Gal.5:22 You could say I don't consider
them Christians but the truth is I just don't consider them much at all.
Maybe that has left me a little naïve.
P.S. I am in fact also saying that my Christian friends parent pretty
peacefully. I do know one who thinks a paddle is a good idea (she is
someone I met at hsing circles, not at church BTW) but I 'm working on her
:).
Thanks for broadening the scope and usefulness of this thread Pam,
Peace,
Krisula
Krisula Moyer
Sandra, I think you are absolutely right, lists like this one are probably
as ideal a place to change someone's mind as any. People who are here and
reading a list like this might just be the ones who are open minded enough
to be swayed. I guess my comment was too fatalistic. In fact, I am very
glad to hear everyone's experiences here and on other peaceful parenting
sites, b/c it's not enough to say no more spanking you also need the do's if
that makes sense.
I don't want any child to be slapped but I think being told "you're lazy"
"you'll never amount to anything" "You never do anything right" "why do you
always have to bug me" can and does do just as much damage to a child. And
I hear these kinds of things in public all the time.
I would like you to know that I think you and others on this list do a
wonderful job supporting good parenting and If I'm out of line, send me a
note off list and I'll shut up but I think since the climate among
Homeschoolers is so Christians are this way - unschoolers are that way,
other Christian parents might like to hear that it doesn't have to be like
that. It shouldn't be like that.
_Krisula (who by now figures you all must think I have no sense of humor)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Re: RE:spanked or threatened or punished (long)
In a message dated 10/31/03 10:12:17 AM, krisulam@... writes:
<< As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people
are
not going to change their views about this lightly. >>
Each time I've been in a conversation like this online, though, at least one
family stops spanking. Sometimes more than one. Those are just the people
who'll admit it. How many lurkers have their minds changed? And if their
minds
are changed while they're here, they might think again (I'd like to see them
try NOT to) the next time they see that betrayed look in a child's eyes.
<<And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. >>
Whatever, for parents. If a parent is damaged and the kid can end up at
least somewhat less put-upon and wounded, good for the kid. I learned
pretty
early to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
<< It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.>>
Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that
side
of the fence.
Sandra
as ideal a place to change someone's mind as any. People who are here and
reading a list like this might just be the ones who are open minded enough
to be swayed. I guess my comment was too fatalistic. In fact, I am very
glad to hear everyone's experiences here and on other peaceful parenting
sites, b/c it's not enough to say no more spanking you also need the do's if
that makes sense.
>> I learned prettyearly to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
I don't want any child to be slapped but I think being told "you're lazy"
"you'll never amount to anything" "You never do anything right" "why do you
always have to bug me" can and does do just as much damage to a child. And
I hear these kinds of things in public all the time.
I would like you to know that I think you and others on this list do a
wonderful job supporting good parenting and If I'm out of line, send me a
note off list and I'll shut up but I think since the climate among
Homeschoolers is so Christians are this way - unschoolers are that way,
other Christian parents might like to hear that it doesn't have to be like
that. It shouldn't be like that.
_Krisula (who by now figures you all must think I have no sense of humor)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Re: RE:spanked or threatened or punished (long)
In a message dated 10/31/03 10:12:17 AM, krisulam@... writes:
<< As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people
are
not going to change their views about this lightly. >>
Each time I've been in a conversation like this online, though, at least one
family stops spanking. Sometimes more than one. Those are just the people
who'll admit it. How many lurkers have their minds changed? And if their
minds
are changed while they're here, they might think again (I'd like to see them
try NOT to) the next time they see that betrayed look in a child's eyes.
<<And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. >>
Whatever, for parents. If a parent is damaged and the kid can end up at
least somewhat less put-upon and wounded, good for the kid. I learned
pretty
early to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
<< It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.>>
Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that
side
of the fence.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/31/2003 4:08:50 PM Mountain Standard Time,
krisulam@... writes:
<<I don't want any child to be slapped but I think being told "you're lazy"
"you'll never amount to anything" "You never do anything right" "why do you
always have to bug me" can and does do just as much damage to a child. ..
Less damage. Different damage. I have a friend whose dad broke his jaw with
a 2x4. They were Ozark hillbillies. His dad was a drunk. Stereotype? Not
MY idea.
My husband heard negative stuff. He eats for comfort. his mom wouldn't let
him eat much, so eating is a way to get back at her. It's not healthy. But
it wasn't the same kind of belittling humiliation as getting hit.
I heard negative stuff. At some point
it just made it easier for me to ignore my mom earlier in my life. I found
other adults to talk to.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
krisulam@... writes:
<<I don't want any child to be slapped but I think being told "you're lazy"
"you'll never amount to anything" "You never do anything right" "why do you
always have to bug me" can and does do just as much damage to a child. ..
Less damage. Different damage. I have a friend whose dad broke his jaw with
a 2x4. They were Ozark hillbillies. His dad was a drunk. Stereotype? Not
MY idea.
My husband heard negative stuff. He eats for comfort. his mom wouldn't let
him eat much, so eating is a way to get back at her. It's not healthy. But
it wasn't the same kind of belittling humiliation as getting hit.
I heard negative stuff. At some point
it just made it easier for me to ignore my mom earlier in my life. I found
other adults to talk to.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Stepheny Cappel
Agreed, I am a reformed spanker, and reformed expecting imediate obedience from the children. Heck I don't even spank the dog! Since the very first when I started this list and reading, we have no more spanking, although a few times I threatened but I didn't carry it out because I knew I didn't want to spank them. Don''t like it never did. Just didn't know another way. Now I do. Cool. Stepheny
In a message dated 10/31/03 10:12:17 AM, krisulam@... writes:
<< As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people are
not going to change their views about this lightly. >>
Each time I've been in a conversation like this online, though, at least one
family stops spanking. Sometimes more than one. Those are just the people
who'll admit it. How many lurkers have their minds changed? And if their minds
are changed while they're here, they might think again (I'd like to see them
try NOT to) the next time they see that betrayed look in a child's eyes.
<<And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. >>
Whatever, for parents. If a parent is damaged and the kid can end up at
least somewhat less put-upon and wounded, good for the kid. I learned pretty
early to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
<< It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.>>
Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that side
of the fence.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
In a message dated 10/31/03 10:12:17 AM, krisulam@... writes:
<< As for convincing people not to spank, that's a hard sell. Most people are
not going to change their views about this lightly. >>
Each time I've been in a conversation like this online, though, at least one
family stops spanking. Sometimes more than one. Those are just the people
who'll admit it. How many lurkers have their minds changed? And if their minds
are changed while they're here, they might think again (I'd like to see them
try NOT to) the next time they see that betrayed look in a child's eyes.
<<And unfortunately, the
worst offenders will merely change to another abusive practice because it's
not about disciplining the child. Abuse is usually about dysfunctional
feelings of the parent. >>
Whatever, for parents. If a parent is damaged and the kid can end up at
least somewhat less put-upon and wounded, good for the kid. I learned pretty
early to ignore what my mom said. It was harder to ignore getting slapped.
<< It takes lots of honest to goodness work to change
habits that are grown into a person. And of course the person must want to
change.>>
Sure, but some are on the fence, and if they see examples of families who
really are working without hitting or shaming their kids, they move to that side
of the fence.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/31/03 11:50:31 PM, stephc62@... writes:
<< I am a reformed spanker, and reformed expecting imediate obedience from
the children. Heck I don't even spank the dog! Since the very first when I
started this list and reading, we have no more spanking, although a few times I
threatened but I didn't carry it out because I knew I didn't want to spank
them. Don''t like it never did. Just didn't know another way. Now I do. Cool.
the spanking page:
http://sandradodd.com/spanking
Ugly name for that page, but you catch more future peaceful moms with seeming
agreement sometimes than... (that can't be turned around very well, but not
too many spankers will go to a page that's clearly marked "spanking is just
stupid")
Sandra
<< I am a reformed spanker, and reformed expecting imediate obedience from
the children. Heck I don't even spank the dog! Since the very first when I
started this list and reading, we have no more spanking, although a few times I
threatened but I didn't carry it out because I knew I didn't want to spank
them. Don''t like it never did. Just didn't know another way. Now I do. Cool.
>>Stepheny, I have put your name in lights (electronically and miniaturely) on
the spanking page:
http://sandradodd.com/spanking
Ugly name for that page, but you catch more future peaceful moms with seeming
agreement sometimes than... (that can't be turned around very well, but not
too many spankers will go to a page that's clearly marked "spanking is just
stupid")
Sandra
Stepheny Cappel
I don't mind at all that this is at this page. I am happy with myself and my behavior with the kids now. The thing I did this morning waiting for everyone to get ready to go with me just because they wanted to, not because they had to was just say I'm getting frustrated. And I went to the van and everyone that was sitting there staring at the tv came to the van and we went to the store. Spent a nice couple of hours just browsing and replacing pillows the dog loves to tear up LOL. The point is, I thought of shutting off the tv to get everyones attention. That is old. I did raise my voice just a little because I was frustrated, but that was it. And that will teach them to use good words instead of screaming mean things and hitting themselves. If you could fix the way I spelled immediate I would appreciate it LOL, if you can't then thats fine. I'll live with it. Stepheny
In a message dated 10/31/03 11:50:31 PM, stephc62@... writes:
<< I am a reformed spanker, and reformed expecting imediate obedience from
the children. Heck I don't even spank the dog! Since the very first when I
started this list and reading, we have no more spanking, although a few times I
threatened but I didn't carry it out because I knew I didn't want to spank
them. Don''t like it never did. Just didn't know another way. Now I do. Cool.
the spanking page:
http://sandradodd.com/spanking
Ugly name for that page, but you catch more future peaceful moms with seeming
agreement sometimes than... (that can't be turned around very well, but not
too many spankers will go to a page that's clearly marked "spanking is just
stupid")
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
In a message dated 10/31/03 11:50:31 PM, stephc62@... writes:
<< I am a reformed spanker, and reformed expecting imediate obedience from
the children. Heck I don't even spank the dog! Since the very first when I
started this list and reading, we have no more spanking, although a few times I
threatened but I didn't carry it out because I knew I didn't want to spank
them. Don''t like it never did. Just didn't know another way. Now I do. Cool.
>>Stepheny, I have put your name in lights (electronically and miniaturely) on
the spanking page:
http://sandradodd.com/spanking
Ugly name for that page, but you catch more future peaceful moms with seeming
agreement sometimes than... (that can't be turned around very well, but not
too many spankers will go to a page that's clearly marked "spanking is just
stupid")
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/1/03 1:24:28 PM, stephc62@... writes:
<< If you could fix the way I spelled immediate I would appreciate it LOL,
if you can't then thats fine. I'll live with it. Stepheny >>
Fixed.
Didn't even notice it before.
Sandra
<< If you could fix the way I spelled immediate I would appreciate it LOL,
if you can't then thats fine. I'll live with it. Stepheny >>
Fixed.
Didn't even notice it before.
Sandra
Stepheny Cappel
Sure was glaring to me after I went to the site. Thanks. Stepheny
In a message dated 11/1/03 1:24:28 PM, stephc62@... writes:
<< If you could fix the way I spelled immediate I would appreciate it LOL,
if you can't then thats fine. I'll live with it. Stepheny >>
Fixed.
Didn't even notice it before.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
In a message dated 11/1/03 1:24:28 PM, stephc62@... writes:
<< If you could fix the way I spelled immediate I would appreciate it LOL,
if you can't then thats fine. I'll live with it. Stepheny >>
Fixed.
Didn't even notice it before.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]