Heidi

can you answer me a question, Sandra?

Did you post that after Christina of "unschooled automan" fame, or
before?

I have spent SOME KIND OF TIME clicking through messages, and have
something of a system down, but Christina was here at the beginning
of June (Just got that far this evening) and the beginning of June
seems too late for that post. I seem to remember it coming sooner?

anyway

Sheesh. Mrs. Focus on One Thing Until Her Eyeballs Fall Out. Now I
GOTTA find that post. It's a matter of PRINCIPLE at this point. It's
that post, or BUST...

LOL

HeidiC going to bed now

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/24/03 9:42:24 PM, bunsofaluminum60@... writes:

<< Did you post that after Christina of "unschooled automan" fame, or

before? >>

I have no idea. It seems like it was a month or so ago. Sheesh.

I tried looking on my Mac by phrases I could think of that might have been
in, and checked google in case maybe it was on the bulletin board.

I've had company today and didn't expect it to last so long (Holly ended up
babysitting, and Marty spent hours online and Kirby needed karate transport,
and we cleaned up the library and... just got back online after 12 hours. Very
sorry.

Sandra

Heidi

--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 6/24/03 9:42:24 PM, bunsofaluminum60@h... writes:
>
> << Did you post that after Christina of "unschooled automan" fame,
or
>
> before? >>
>
> I have no idea. It seems like it was a month or so ago. Sheesh.
>
> I tried looking on my Mac by phrases I could think of that might
have been
> in, and checked google in case maybe it was on the bulletin board.

Thanks for checking, at any rate. I'm surprised the excellent search
engine with the website (yahoo's search) doesn't turn anything up.
I'm sure you posted it here, because I hardly ever read at the
bulletin board. Just dip in there once in awhile.

well, on with the search. I meant what I said, and I said what I
meant...

I am GOING to find this POST. grr.

HeidiC

Heidi

Okay, I just got to "A brag on Marty" about his Police academy
experience. I KNOW the one I seek was posted before that.

and I'm about burned out on this.

what did I say about "That post, or BUST"? I take it back. Maybe it's
a BUST after all. :\

sheesh

HeidiC who has run out of time entirely.

WHOOOOO was asked her opinion about reading by a panicky mother whose
seven year old isn't reading yet, and wanted to share that post with
that panicky mother, along with all the OTHER pearls of wisdom that
already fell from my lips. ;)

Fetteroll

on 6/25/03 8:05 AM, Heidi at bunsofaluminum60@... wrote:

> well, on with the search. I meant what I said, and I said what I
> meant...
>
> I am GOING to find this POST. grr.

Heidi, do you know about the Expand Messages option? It's under the green
stripe that says Messages. That will display for you 20 or 30 messages at a
time. They used to come with no ads but I think Yahoo has figured out how to
sprinkle them down the page but it's less annoying than clicking on
individual messages to find the one you want.

And, if you know which message you last checked, you can go right to it with
the "Msg #" option in the green stripe beneath "Expand Messages".

Joyce

Bill and Diane

I think the one you're looking for was regarding Holly's memorizing all
her lines in the play. That was written near the time it happened, so we
need to find out from Sandra when play rehearsals started.

:-) Diane

>Okay, I just got to "A brag on Marty" about his Police academy
>experience. I KNOW the one I seek was posted before that.
>
>and I'm about burned out on this.
>
>what did I say about "That post, or BUST"? I take it back. Maybe it's
>a BUST after all. :\
>
>sheesh
>
>HeidiC who has run out of time entirely.
>
>WHOOOOO was asked her opinion about reading by a panicky mother whose
>seven year old isn't reading yet, and wanted to share that post with
>that panicky mother, along with all the OTHER pearls of wisdom that
>already fell from my lips. ;)
>

unolist

--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 6/24/03 9:42:24 PM, bunsofaluminum60@h... writes:
>
> << Did you post that after Christina of "unschooled automan" fame,
or
>
> before? >>
>
> I have no idea. It seems like it was a month or so ago. Sheesh.
>


I found it under a search for Holly and lines:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom/message/65630

it was back in april

Ang

Heidi

I hadn't thought of expanding the messages, but I was using
the "message number" and also, picking only Sandra Dodd's posts, and
also, whenever I saw her name, I looked to see how many KB the post
was. Didn't look at anything under about 4KB, because it was a bit
longer of a post...maybe that was my mistake. Started my search at
the end of April (when I started lurking here/posting here regularly)
and pretty much clicked on anything that looked promising.

still...lots of time spent. I'll try the expanded messages...maybe.
thanks for the tip, Joyce.
HeidiC

--- In [email protected], Fetteroll <fetteroll@e...>
wrote:
> on 6/25/03 8:05 AM, Heidi at bunsofaluminum60@h... wrote:
>
> > well, on with the search. I meant what I said, and I said what I
> > meant...
> >
> > I am GOING to find this POST. grr.
>
> Heidi, do you know about the Expand Messages option? It's under the
green
> stripe that says Messages. That will display for you 20 or 30
messages at a
> time. They used to come with no ads but I think Yahoo has figured
out how to
> sprinkle them down the page but it's less annoying than clicking on
> individual messages to find the one you want.
>
> And, if you know which message you last checked, you can go right
to it with
> the "Msg #" option in the green stripe beneath "Expand Messages".
>
> Joyce

Heidi

thank you thank you thank you

No wonder I never found it. It was posted while I was still in lurk
mode, BEFORE my first post! and that's where I started actually
looking in the posts.

:D thanks, Ang!


> I found it under a search for Holly and lines:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom/message/65630
>
> it was back in april
>
> Ang

unolist

--- In [email protected], "Heidi"
<bunsofaluminum60@h...> wrote:
> thank you thank you thank you
>
> No wonder I never found it. It was posted while I was still in lurk
> mode, BEFORE my first post! and that's where I started actually
> looking in the posts.
>
> :D thanks, Ang!
>

You're welcome! Did you use the search box, or were you scanning
posts in the date range you suspected? The search feature is pretty
good, except on this list because of its volume. It searches in
blocks of posts, and you have to keep going back further and further.
I tried searching for Holly memorized, but turns out memorizing was
the keyword. This didn't take too long, but other times you can
search and search and get really frustrated....i always put a limit,
if i don't find it in 10 minutes or so, tough luck> LOL

ang

Heidi

> >
> > :D thanks, Ang!
> >
>
> You're welcome! Did you use the search box, or were you scanning
> posts in the date range you suspected? The search feature is pretty
> good, except on this list because of its volume. It searches in
> blocks of posts, and you have to keep going back further and
further.
> I tried searching for Holly memorized, but turns out memorizing was
> the keyword. This didn't take too long, but other times you can
> search and search and get really frustrated....i always put a
limit,
> if i don't find it in 10 minutes or so, tough luck> LOL
>
> ang

I started with search: Holly play memorize and then Sandra Dodd Holly
play and got those blocks of posts and had to keep clicking "next"
whew! tedious...It really is one of the better search engines i've
seen for discussion sites.

anyways. I hope Sandra's little anecdote helps my friend.

HeidiC

Fetteroll

Hey guys ...

Helen Hegener would like Unschooling.com to offer more email lists. It will
give us more variety and so this list doesn't bear the burden of expectation
that it should be everything unschoolers need in an unschooling list.

Any ideas? Names for lists? Concepts?

What are *you* looking for in an unschooling list?

Joyce
Unschooling-dotcom moderator

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/25/03 7:40:56 AM, cen46624@... writes:

<< That was written near the time it happened, so we
need to find out from Sandra when play rehearsals started. >>

It was written again lately, I think in a same post/rant/report as a review
of the girl scout presentation, which was also reported/ranted earlier. (I was
reviewing for newer readers <g>.)

Sandra

[email protected]

I don't think this is the one I was thinking about, but if it's the one the
original searcher was looking for, GOOD!

I thought there had been a response to advantages to late reading, and I
wrote that Holly learned her lines better because she couldn't read. Other were
depending on the script, but Holly couldn't, so she learned it by having it
read to her, and by paying extra sharp attention during rehearsals because she
was afraid her non-reading would put her behind. What I discovered was that
most of the reading kids were behind because they went through so many rehearsals
with a script in hand.

-----------------------------------

<< If the
homeschooler's theater has it's performance set for May 10, and first
rehearsal is April 1, an unschooler can see that it would be best to know
their lines by then. >>

Oh right! That's an example I forgot to give. Holly was in a play, put on
by the city's theatre, but an all-homeschoolers' session with daytime
rehearsals.

Holly learned all her lines early, since she couldn't read and needed help.
As rehearsals went on, she learned everyone else's lines too. Since they
were leaning on being able to read from scripts during rehearsals, they
weren't memorizing their lines.

When the performance came two of the three main characters were Holly and her
best friend, who knew their lines. The third didn't know his. A couple of
times when it didn't matter, one of them said his line, and left the response
to him. If he didn't catch it, the other of the girls would say the
response. (Most of what they were doing was exposition or dialog that wasn't
at all character specific.) If it made him mad, he didn't dare say so,
because he didn't know his part.

But Holly was so disgusted with the others, she had no interest in the next
play they offered.

That's too bad. Somehow she met deadlines TOO well?

Sandra

 

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/25/03 6:31:34 AM, bunsofaluminum60@... writes:

<< WHOOOOO was asked her opinion about reading by a panicky mother whose

seven year old isn't reading yet, and wanted to share that post with

that panicky mother, along with all the OTHER pearls of wisdom that

already fell from my lips. ;) >>

Heidi, did you give her the URL to the reading collection?

http://sandradodd.com/reading

[email protected]

fetteroll@... writes:

<< Any ideas? Names for lists? Concepts?

What are *you* looking for in an unschooling list?

Joyce
Unschooling-dotcom moderator
>>

Resources....Like web links, books, tv, videos. Info about whatever
resources our kids are playing with and using, what they really like and why. If we
were to share all the stuff on a mailing list, I could forward links to my son,
and find more varied resources, more easily. It's my biggest unschooling
problem, not having enough stuff around that he likes doing.

We do that a little bit here, but I would love more.
~Aimee

unolist

--- In [email protected], Fetteroll <fetteroll@e...>
wrote:
> Hey guys ...
>
> Helen Hegener would like Unschooling.com to offer more email lists.
It will
> give us more variety and so this list doesn't bear the burden of
expectation
> that it should be everything unschoolers need in an unschooling
list.
>
> Any ideas? Names for lists? Concepts?
>
> What are *you* looking for in an unschooling list?
>
> Joyce
> Unschooling-dotcom moderator

I'd say use some of the more popular unschooling.com message boards
to model after, not familiar with most of them, so other than that, I
would say:

Searching for local unschoolers/groups

Newbies/getting started

Alternative parenting discussions(for things that are child-led like
unschooling, but not about unschooling, like freedom of tv, eating
and food, discipline/spanking, attachment parenting)

Problem and doubts, a help board

Christian unschooling(for those who are sensitive and not easily
assured by the the disclaimers that this list is not referring to
them, who unschool in the freedom of christ and not for some
political agenda)

Political issues

Homeschooling in the media

Documentation and assessment for those who need help reporting what
they do as educational

even a debate list would be great, so i can refer people who know
nothing about unschooling but love telling me why it doesn't work and
can't work for most kids


Ang

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/25/03 10:08:26 AM, AimeeL73@... writes:

<< Resources....Like web links, books, tv, videos. Info about whatever
resources our kids are playing with and using, what they really like and why.
If we
were to share all the stuff on a mailing list, I could forward links to my
son,
and find more varied resources, more easily. It's my biggest unschooling
problem, not having enough stuff around that he likes doing. >>

There are folders for that at www.unschooling.com, but I don't think they're
used much.

I wish people would just use the message boards at the forum LOTS lots more
instead of us breaking off into a bunch of e-mail lists where the wheel will be
reinvented over and over and sometimes very lumpily. and if people want to
FIND one of those resources posted last April (:-/) it will be very difficult.

Sandra

moonstarshooter by way of Helen Hegener

> What are *you* looking for in an unschooling list?
>

Another list I am on is actually broken down into two lists, one for
discussion of strictly homeschooling topics, and the other for
general discussion. It works, but the strictly homeschooling one is
very dry.

I don't know if this list could be separated like that. It seems one
minute the thread IS about unschooling, then the next minute it is
off on a tangent that has very little to do with unschooling, but is
none-the-less an intriguing conversation. And since unschooling
incorporates parenting issues, not just schooling issues, it would be
hard to make the distinction between what is and what isn't. (Okay,
the whole doable thread may have been pretty obvious... ;)

I enjoy the general conversational threads, but I recognize they
clutter up the list for people who are new to the group, or people
who just don't have the time to spend reading all the conversation to
get a little about unschooling. But maybe somehow (?) they could be
separated without losing the momentum?

I am looking forward to hearing other ideas!
Tory

liza sabater

On Wednesday, June 25, 2003, at 12:55 PM, SandraDodd@... wrote:
> I wish people would just use the message boards at the forum LOTS lots
> more
> instead of us breaking off into a bunch of e-mail lists where the
> wheel will be
> reinvented over and over and sometimes very lumpily. and if people
> want to
> FIND one of those resources posted last April (:-/) it will be very
> difficult.
>
> Sandra
>

How about sending an email with links to those 'folders' on the forum
on a monthly basis?

Liza

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tia Leschke

> I enjoy the general conversational threads, but I recognize they
> clutter up the list for people who are new to the group, or people
> who just don't have the time to spend reading all the conversation to
> get a little about unschooling. But maybe somehow (?) they could be
> separated without losing the momentum?

Accurate subject lines would do the same job. Then people can easily delete
whatever doesn't interest them. For instance, right now there's an algebra
thread on the Canadian list. It's obviously right on topic, but it doesn't
interest me. So I delete it.
Tia

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...

dtillitzferguson

As a new person here and to unschooling (although not new to
homeschooling) I like the jumble of thoughts and topics in this one
list. I wouldn't want to have to choose from a dozen lists. However,
since I'm trying to understand what unschoolers (moms and kids) do
all day, (It seems like you're saying, "Just live." It can't be that
simple, can it?) I'd love to see more "this is what we did today"
posts. I'd subscribe to a list like that, but can't imagine veterans
involved here posting there.

My two cents.

Deborah in Oregon
Married to Bill for 15 years, beginning our 5th year homeschooling
Wills, almost 13, and Naomi, 11 and very, very interested in
unschooling.

kayb85

"I like the jumble of thoughts and topics in this one
> list. "

Me too!

" (It seems like you're saying, "Just live." It can't be that
> simple, can it?)"

Yes and no! Just live, but mindfully live with things like love,
joy, peace, patience, and curiousity. And live without things like
arbitrary rules and punishments.

I'd love to see more "this is what we did today"
> posts. I'd subscribe to a list like that, but can't imagine
veterans
> involved here posting there.

I LOVE this is what we did today posts. :) I would subscribe to a
list like that too.

Here's what we did today.

This was a special day for my daughter. She had been looking forward
to this day for awhile--a day where she and I go to the mall together
for a shopping spree with her birthday money. We stopped at burger
king on the way and got an odor-rama card (scratch and sniff card to
use during the movie where the rugrats meet the wild thornberries).
Then we went to the 11:15 movie, spent all afternoon shopping, went
to the 4:45 Bruce Almighty movie, stopped at taco bell and then came
home. Right before the 4:45 movie we put all our shopping bags in
the HOT car. When we got back in the car after taco bell, the bath
and body works bag was overflowing with PURPLE BUBBLES! The heat had
caused the lid of the grape foam soap to pop off. We went back into
the mall with our bubbly bag (dropping purple bubbles along the way),
showed them our bag, and they gave us a new purple foam soap. :)

Throughout our day we talked about materialism, calculated percents-
off, talked about saving money for good sales, and talked about
chemcial reactions.

Meanwhile, back at home, my husband spent much of his day in the
swimming pool with the boys. He was so excited when we got home to
report that our 4 year old is jumping in on his own and swimming
underwater to him and that our 6 year old is going down the slide and
swimming to the ladder himself. They had a blast today.

On the way to and from the mall (45 minute drive) dd and I listened
to Harry Potter on audio tape.

When we got home, I talked to the boys about their day, took a
shower, rested on my bed and read a little bit of a book that I'm
reading, and got on the computer for a few minutes. My six year old,
who isn't reading yet and is very into Thomas the tank engine and
computer games, brought me some pieces of paper. He said that they
were tickets and wanted to know if I would like to "buy" one. He had
written Thomas on each one of them. I bought a ticket from him with
pretend money. :) Then I took him up to bed and read a Rokenbok flyer
to him. He has decided that he wants to start buying Rokenbok stuff
and is very excited about his birthday so that he can get money to
buy the stuff with. He has talked his little brother into combining
their birthday money so that they can buy it quicker. After I read
the flyer to him (descriptions, testimonials, prices, etc.), he fell
asleep with his rokenbok flyer as he has done every night for the
last week. :) I tucked my 4 year old in, and then went into my
daugher's room for a Yu-gi-oh match. We have recently started
playing the game and to our delight, found a card store only 1/2 an
hour from us that is having a tournament on Saturday! She wants to
enter the tournament and we want to practice and try to learn all the
rules we need to know by then. (She's trying to talk me into
entering too!) There are still some things we haven't done yet, like
learn how to do polymerization and the 15-card side decks. We were
up playing yu-gi-oh until almost 1:00! I think we'll sleep in
tomorrow.

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/25/03 11:32:00 PM, dtillitzferguson@... writes:

<< I'm trying to understand what unschoolers (moms and kids) do

all day, (It seems like you're saying, "Just live." It can't be that

simple, can it?) >>

At first it's not that simple and later it is.

If you think of something you can do really well, without thinking about it,
that others can't manage to fumble through, maybe it's like that. Maybe
you're a diver? Maybe you knit? Maybe you can decorate cakes? (I can do none of
that, not even a little.)

Kirby can use a Nintendo remote control like I can play recorder--just think
what you want to do, and its happening without conscious thought about which
fingers are where at all.

So first unschooling is a little awkward and seems wrong and unnatural. And
what makes the transition happen, I think, is the mom changing her perspective
and the filter through which she's seeing "just living." One day you'll see
something glorious that you wouldn't have noticed before. And once you see
it, you'll be eagerly hoping to see another wonderful sparkly thing like that,
and you will. I can't tell you what the thing will be. Then you would be
looking for that, instead of being open to whatever magic your kids will show
you.

I don't know how new you are to the list. If not TOO new, some or all of
this might be repetitive, but here are some collections of ideas, and various
people's accounts of "typical days"--


http://sandradodd.com/typical

http://sandradodd.com/deschooling

http://www.unschooling.com/library/essays/essay01.shtml

Sandra

<A HREF="http://www.unschooling.com/library/essays/essay01.shtml">Moving a
Puddle</A>

<A HREF="http://sandradodd.com/deschooling">Deschooling for Parents, by
Sandra Dodd</A>

<A HREF="http://sandradodd.com/typical">Typical Unschooling Days</A>

Mary

From: "dtillitzferguson" <dtillitzferguson@...>

<<However, since I'm trying to understand what unschoolers (moms and kids)
do
all day, (It seems like you're saying, "Just live." It can't be that
simple, can it?) I'd love to see more "this is what we did today"
posts.>.


I'm up and it's late and I'm not sleepy so I'll see if I can help.

Frst thing this morning we discovered that Sierra lost her tooth during the
night so I sent her off to find it while I got out of bed. She found the
tooth and I greeted the rest of the household. Let the dog outside and hosed
poop and cleaned up fallen mangoes while Sierra and Alyssa watched tv and
Joseph played in his room. Then Sierra hit the computer and Joseph joined
her to watch. I was getting ready to go out and have no idea what they
played but it sounded like fun. Alyssa played in her room, watched tv,
visited with my mom and visited with me. Then one by one they decided to eat
so I fixed breakfast and that went on for about 30 minutes. Then I cleaned
up all the while talking to the kids while they ate and we had on tv also.
It was Blues Clues and Scooby. Joseph and Sierra played YuGiOh cards in the
playroom with a twist. They set up a huge gameboard with the foam play
squares we have complete with barricades and such that they incorporated
into the game. It was too complicated for me to follow but they played that
for about an hour. All the while Alyssa was all over the house playing with
the dog, her toys and me. When Joseph and Sierra had enough, they cleaned up
and Alyssa came out to help as she wanted the tent up in the playroom.
Joseph went back in his room on the computer and I set up the tent for
Alyssa. Sierra asked her if she could play in there so they both took in
their Polly Pocket dolls, some stuffed animals and plastic links. (the links
were rain) About 20 minutes later Joseph came out and asked if he could play
too. Good thing it's a big tent.

They played in there for quite awhile. When they were done we all helped to
clean it up. I left the house to take Tara's car for window tinting and came
home with my husband. Joe played with all three of them for awhile, ate
something and left again. They watched some tv and ran around the house
playing hide and seek. It's Alyssa's new favorite game and Joseph and Sierra
have been very obliging. Then they played something where Alyssa was a leach
and she chased them and would stick to them and suck out all their blood!!!!
That was Joseph's idea. Joseph ate and of course Alyssa is snacking the
whole day anyway. Joseph and Sierra went through all their coloring and
puzzle books and were working in them. Alyssa joined in. Then they all found
tattoos that I put on them. Then they played with Furbies. Joe came home, I
left with him and Tara to go and get her car. Tara and I went grocery
shopping. She drove me around. How nice. I almost got carded at the grocery
store for beer. How nice again!!!

Came home and fed the kids again. Joseph and Sierra went swimming. Alyssa
went to my moms and played with dolls, ate and colored. When the kids came
in from the pool, they went back outside after they dried off. Then all 3
kids ended up in Sierra's room playing I'm not sure what. They eventually
ended up at the dining room table all drawing and playing with their people.
Alyssa started about 3 movies during the course of the day and never made it
through more than 10 minutes. Joseph and Sierra cleared off the dining room
as I asked them too because we have friends coming over tomorrow. Next thing
I knew it was about 11:30 where I suggested bed. Sierra and Alyssa were at
my moms and Joseph was drawing. The two girls went to bed and Joseph cleaned
his room and then started drawing again. He went to bed around midnight.

Today was a day where the 3 little ones were very busy both alone and with
each other more so than usual. It was also a day where they were on their
own more than usual too. Most days have some reading or tv watching with me.
Or game playing or puzzles. I wasn't needed today but to just be around.
That and to put up the tent. The activities vary but our at home days
without friends are pretty much like this. It IS just living.

Mary B (who's actually kind of sleepy now but has to play tooth fairy
first.)

kayb85

> There are folders for that at www.unschooling.com, but I don't
think they're
> used much.

I think that the message boards at www.unschooling.com could be a
little bit more user-friendly. I'll be reading through messages
there and consider responding to something and then realize that I'm
about to respond to something that is a year or two old. I know I
could mess around with them more and figure them out better, but I
think that the message boards would be used more often if they were
easier to navigate.
Sheila

Fetteroll

on 6/25/03 12:55 PM, SandraDodd@... at SandraDodd@... wrote:

> I wish people would just use the message boards at the forum LOTS lots more
> instead of us breaking off into a bunch of e-mail lists where the wheel will
> be
> reinvented over and over and sometimes very lumpily. and if people want to
> FIND one of those resources posted last April (:-/) it will be very difficult.

I agree. I find the message boards much more information friendly. All the
posts are separated by thread instead of a big crazy lump. The threads are
archived there so new people can go back and read entire threads. I think
it's great :-)

And Anne Ohman's writing is exclusive to the message boards. That should be
reason enough for anyone! :-)

But some people like lists better. Like Helen :-)

And some people don't like message boards.

So perhaps another question is, if you do like message boards and would use
them if x, y and z were changed, what are your x's, y's and z's? What is it
about the Unschooling.com message boards that makes them more trouble than
they're worth?

NOW, FIRST, BEFORE YOU ANSWER! Be aware that there are more ways to navigate
the boards than the default one which, I believe, displays a list of topics
and the subtopics. To me, that's a very confusing way to use the boards.

There's last day. There's new messages. There's tree view. New messages in
tree view displays posts similar to email on threaded view, except better.
The threading on the message baord is accurate and you get a little snippet
from each post to give you an idea of whether it's worth checking or not.

So, knowing that, is one of the things holding you back a lack of clear
directions on how to use the message boards?

Joyce

Fetteroll

on 6/26/03 2:16 AM, SandraDodd@... at SandraDodd@... wrote:

> And
> what makes the transition happen, I think, is the mom changing her perspective
> and the filter through which she's seeing "just living." One day you'll see
> something glorious that you wouldn't have noticed before.

Which ties in with the post I had on seeing differences within similarities.
(Darn, that was on the message boards. ;-)

It's natural to divide thing up and categorize them. This is learning. This
is playing. Our brains want to do that so we don't have to think so hard
about what something means. We can mentally put it in it's category and
immediately know a lot about it. That's a good thing. We don't need to
relearn what we know about an animal every time we meet a new cat. We
already know lots about cats and just fill in what's unique about this cat.

But sometimes categories blind us to differences within a category and the
similarities between categories.

So when we discuss unschooling, we try to help people reexamine their
concepts (categories) of learning and play, usually by telling people to
eliminate the categories themselves so they can start fresh. Just call
everything living and you'll start to reorganize your categories without the
divisions imposed by school.

Joyce

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/26/03 5:55:15 AM, fetteroll@... writes:

<< There's last day. There's new messages. There's tree view. >>

I use "new messages" without tree view. It's fast. And I put in however
many hours it's been since I was in.

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/26/03 8:42:03 AM, fetteroll@... writes:

<< So when we discuss unschooling, we try to help people reexamine their
concepts (categories) of learning and play, usually by telling people to
eliminate the categories themselves so they can start fresh. Just call
everything living and you'll start to reorganize your categories without the
divisions imposed by school.
>>

And that is philosophy.
And some people don't WANT philosophy. It scares them. It's too much
personal reflection and personal change.

They want us to tell them what they need to do so that their children will be
happy unschoolers.
But they want the advice to take the form of "Buy these ten games, these five
movie, these fifteen books, and at 9:00 every morning..."

But the first and best piece of unschooling advice is to ignore any advice
that looks just like that.

So WHICH games does a family new to unschooling buy? We can't tell them. We
can talk about what games we liked and why, but if another family bought
everything we had, duplicated our entire stash of stuff (or just inherited our
whole house, dust, stash of stuff and all) it would probably NOT be what was
useful or interesting to their kids.

If we're asked whether unschooling is easy or hard, it's both. It's
simplicity, AFTER the one hard change from a lifetime of expectations and assumptions
to seeing children and learning a whole new way.

Sandra