Illness
[email protected]
Hi,
Have your children had to deal with serious illness? Buzz, I know yours
have. How did they cope? Do you think it has shaped them in any way?
My lupus is flaring right now and I just can't do all the things I normally
do. The kids are somewhat frustrated when I can't jump right up and join
them in work or play. I am forgetful (I just found the salad from last
night's dinner in a plastic bag in the drawer with the paper clips and
stuff), and my mind loses a lot of its agility. It takes me a while to find
the words I'm looking for. I can't run up and down the stairs everytime they
need help with something. Sometimes I worry that the children will think I'm
a couple of nuggets shy of a happy meal. Am I an embarrassment to them?
Will I be as they get older?
On the other hand, has my illness taught them compassion, perserverance,
endurance, and faith? Our 3 month old baby daughter was in the hospital all
week with RSV. The boys are so accustomed to my illness that they weren't
frightened for her at all. She came home yesterday and the boys help me by
giving her the breathing treatments. I don't envision that being "normal"
for most 8 and 5 year olds. Does that mean that they have been strengthened
and tempered by their experience with illness? Are they better for it?
I'd love to hear your thoughts. This has been zinging around in my mind for
the last few days and it's cathartic to write it down.
KIM
***runs with scissors***
Have your children had to deal with serious illness? Buzz, I know yours
have. How did they cope? Do you think it has shaped them in any way?
My lupus is flaring right now and I just can't do all the things I normally
do. The kids are somewhat frustrated when I can't jump right up and join
them in work or play. I am forgetful (I just found the salad from last
night's dinner in a plastic bag in the drawer with the paper clips and
stuff), and my mind loses a lot of its agility. It takes me a while to find
the words I'm looking for. I can't run up and down the stairs everytime they
need help with something. Sometimes I worry that the children will think I'm
a couple of nuggets shy of a happy meal. Am I an embarrassment to them?
Will I be as they get older?
On the other hand, has my illness taught them compassion, perserverance,
endurance, and faith? Our 3 month old baby daughter was in the hospital all
week with RSV. The boys are so accustomed to my illness that they weren't
frightened for her at all. She came home yesterday and the boys help me by
giving her the breathing treatments. I don't envision that being "normal"
for most 8 and 5 year olds. Does that mean that they have been strengthened
and tempered by their experience with illness? Are they better for it?
I'd love to hear your thoughts. This has been zinging around in my mind for
the last few days and it's cathartic to write it down.
KIM
***runs with scissors***
Lynda
I'm a walking medical mess from kidney problems to a weird hip problem
which means I don't walk too much and sometimes I fall without any warning.
All the kidlets are pretty good about it and none seem the least bit
embarassed even though one is a preteen and one is 16 (he still gives mummy
a kiss and a hug good-bye no matter where we are, even in front of all his
friends at the mall). Youngest kidlet (7) is designing me a special
wheelchair (purple, of course <g> and with lots of special pockets and sand
tires, would you believe?) so we can go and do more things. Occasionally
they forget or they get frustrated but they quickly get over it.
Lynda
----------
which means I don't walk too much and sometimes I fall without any warning.
All the kidlets are pretty good about it and none seem the least bit
embarassed even though one is a preteen and one is 16 (he still gives mummy
a kiss and a hug good-bye no matter where we are, even in front of all his
friends at the mall). Youngest kidlet (7) is designing me a special
wheelchair (purple, of course <g> and with lots of special pockets and sand
tires, would you believe?) so we can go and do more things. Occasionally
they forget or they get frustrated but they quickly get over it.
Lynda
----------
> From: Monkeycoop@...normally
>
> Hi,
> Have your children had to deal with serious illness? Buzz, I know yours
> have. How did they cope? Do you think it has shaped them in any way?
>
> My lupus is flaring right now and I just can't do all the things I
> do. The kids are somewhat frustrated when I can't jump right up and joinfind
> them in work or play. I am forgetful (I just found the salad from last
> night's dinner in a plastic bag in the drawer with the paper clips and
> stuff), and my mind loses a lot of its agility. It takes me a while to
> the words I'm looking for. I can't run up and down the stairs everytimethey
> need help with something. Sometimes I worry that the children will thinkI'm
> a couple of nuggets shy of a happy meal. Am I an embarrassment to them?all
> Will I be as they get older?
>
> On the other hand, has my illness taught them compassion, perserverance,
> endurance, and faith? Our 3 month old baby daughter was in the hospital
> week with RSV. The boys are so accustomed to my illness that theyweren't
> frightened for her at all. She came home yesterday and the boys help meby
> giving her the breathing treatments. I don't envision that being"normal"
> for most 8 and 5 year olds. Does that mean that they have beenstrengthened
> and tempered by their experience with illness? Are they better for it?for
>
> I'd love to hear your thoughts. This has been zinging around in my mind
> the last few days and it's cathartic to write it down.Here</a>
>
> KIM
> ***runs with scissors***
>
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[email protected]
Dear Friends,
When I fought my battle with breast cancer 2 1/2 years ago, my son had
just turned seven. I went through two surgeries and six months of weekly
chemotherapy, which wasn't fun to say the least. My son was incredible. We
gently led him along the path with us, and he knew everything that was going
on. He called me "the droid" when I had three drainage tubes coming out of
my body. Those tubes had to be drained and the liquid measured twice a day,
and my son watched my husband handled that disgusting process with such love
and tenderness. It was an invaluable experience for him.
I was pretty sick from the chemo, but we kept homeschooling. Sometimes
all we could manage was snuggling together in bed and reading wonderful
"living" books, but it was enough. I remember one night when we prayed
before dinner. We have a standard prayer that we say every night, but on
this night Colton wanted to pray something different. He prayed that I
wouldn't become extinct like the dinosaurs, and I was very touched by that.
It opened the door for a wonderful conversation where we talked about
fighting cancer and the beauty of appreciating each moment.
My cancer was a gift, because we all have a heightened appreciation of
what is truly important. This life is indeed fleeting and fragile, and I
have resolved to live and love recklessly because I don't know how long I
have. It's a lesson that I have taught my son, and we are all the better for
it.
Blessings,
Carol
When I fought my battle with breast cancer 2 1/2 years ago, my son had
just turned seven. I went through two surgeries and six months of weekly
chemotherapy, which wasn't fun to say the least. My son was incredible. We
gently led him along the path with us, and he knew everything that was going
on. He called me "the droid" when I had three drainage tubes coming out of
my body. Those tubes had to be drained and the liquid measured twice a day,
and my son watched my husband handled that disgusting process with such love
and tenderness. It was an invaluable experience for him.
I was pretty sick from the chemo, but we kept homeschooling. Sometimes
all we could manage was snuggling together in bed and reading wonderful
"living" books, but it was enough. I remember one night when we prayed
before dinner. We have a standard prayer that we say every night, but on
this night Colton wanted to pray something different. He prayed that I
wouldn't become extinct like the dinosaurs, and I was very touched by that.
It opened the door for a wonderful conversation where we talked about
fighting cancer and the beauty of appreciating each moment.
My cancer was a gift, because we all have a heightened appreciation of
what is truly important. This life is indeed fleeting and fragile, and I
have resolved to live and love recklessly because I don't know how long I
have. It's a lesson that I have taught my son, and we are all the better for
it.
Blessings,
Carol
michele clausen
Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis) which I firmly
believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.
My kids are wonderful about it. They will often ask to help, and they take very
good care of me!!!!
They would rather not go somewhere exciting if they thought the driving there
would make me sore, in fact Anna was in tears one time with worry for me!
Sometimes I wonder though if that is just too much for a six year old and I
really worry sometimes if that will cause some sort of negative outcome in my
daughters lives. On the other hand the girls are filled with compassion for
everyone that is hurting and they seem to have developed without the typical
egocentric behaviour I see in kids their own age. (mostly <g>)
I also worry about how this affects my friendships with others. This is one
reason why I don't get involved as much as I should with our local support group
as I can't always commit to things and
sometimes show up and sometimes don't. I wonder what they think! :o)
Katie and Anna don't seem to be suffer embarrassement from my illness - yet, but
the other day I broke down crying in public over a seperate situation and Anna
was mortified!! She said afterwards she pretended not to know me. Hopefully
though we will through avoiding alot of revolting peer pressure etc, be able to
help them grow even more in compassion and kindness and an ability to see the
'person' inside. So yes - I think I can say my illness is shapING my kids for
good! YAH!!
As for me.....it is a continual struggle, but sometimes I hate to think of what
type of person I would be without it. Weird huh?! Maybe* I* would lack
compassion? :o)
It is nice (and sad) to know I'm not the only homeschooling mum who has to cope
with these things.
Wow this post got long! OOPS.
Michele.
NZ. It is hot!
Monkeycoop@... wrote:
believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.
My kids are wonderful about it. They will often ask to help, and they take very
good care of me!!!!
They would rather not go somewhere exciting if they thought the driving there
would make me sore, in fact Anna was in tears one time with worry for me!
Sometimes I wonder though if that is just too much for a six year old and I
really worry sometimes if that will cause some sort of negative outcome in my
daughters lives. On the other hand the girls are filled with compassion for
everyone that is hurting and they seem to have developed without the typical
egocentric behaviour I see in kids their own age. (mostly <g>)
I also worry about how this affects my friendships with others. This is one
reason why I don't get involved as much as I should with our local support group
as I can't always commit to things and
sometimes show up and sometimes don't. I wonder what they think! :o)
Katie and Anna don't seem to be suffer embarrassement from my illness - yet, but
the other day I broke down crying in public over a seperate situation and Anna
was mortified!! She said afterwards she pretended not to know me. Hopefully
though we will through avoiding alot of revolting peer pressure etc, be able to
help them grow even more in compassion and kindness and an ability to see the
'person' inside. So yes - I think I can say my illness is shapING my kids for
good! YAH!!
As for me.....it is a continual struggle, but sometimes I hate to think of what
type of person I would be without it. Weird huh?! Maybe* I* would lack
compassion? :o)
It is nice (and sad) to know I'm not the only homeschooling mum who has to cope
with these things.
Wow this post got long! OOPS.
Michele.
NZ. It is hot!
Monkeycoop@... wrote:
> From: Monkeycoop@...
>
> Hi,
> Have your children had to deal with serious illness? Buzz, I know yours
> have. How did they cope? Do you think it has shaped them in any way?
>
> My lupus is flaring right now and I just can't do all the things I normally
> do. The kids are somewhat frustrated when I can't jump right up and join
> them in work or play. I am forgetful (I just found the salad from last
> night's dinner in a plastic bag in the drawer with the paper clips and
> stuff), and my mind loses a lot of its agility. It takes me a while to find
> the words I'm looking for. I can't run up and down the stairs everytime they
> need help with something. Sometimes I worry that the children will think I'm
> a couple of nuggets shy of a happy meal. Am I an embarrassment to them?
> Will I be as they get older?
>
> On the other hand, has my illness taught them compassion, perserverance,
> endurance, and faith? Our 3 month old baby daughter was in the hospital all
> week with RSV. The boys are so accustomed to my illness that they weren't
> frightened for her at all. She came home yesterday and the boys help me by
> giving her the breathing treatments. I don't envision that being "normal"
> for most 8 and 5 year olds. Does that mean that they have been strengthened
> and tempered by their experience with illness? Are they better for it?
>
> I'd love to hear your thoughts. This has been zinging around in my mind for
> the last few days and it's cathartic to write it down.
>
> KIM
> ***runs with scissors***
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa. ZERO. Rates as low as 0
> percent Intro or 9.9 percent Fixed APR, online balance transfers,
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> get the credit you deserve. Apply now. Get your NextCard Visa at
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Debra Bures
Two years ago this week my mother died-my grandmother had died 5 wks
earlier. My mom had been in the hospital almost 7 months after open heart
surgery (she had had rheumatic fever as a child and had severe valve
damage). My children learned a lot about compassion, love, difficult
decisions, and pain, too. These were lessons of the heart. Would that it
had not happened, but since it did, i feel blessed to have shared it.
~~Debra~~
earlier. My mom had been in the hospital almost 7 months after open heart
surgery (she had had rheumatic fever as a child and had severe valve
damage). My children learned a lot about compassion, love, difficult
decisions, and pain, too. These were lessons of the heart. Would that it
had not happened, but since it did, i feel blessed to have shared it.
~~Debra~~
----- Original Message -----
From: <Monkeycoop@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2000 1:13 AM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Illness
> From: Monkeycoop@...
>
> Hi,
> Have your children had to deal with serious illness? Buzz, I know yours
> have. How did they cope? Do you think it has shaped them in any way?
>
> My lupus is flaring right now and I just can't do all the things I
normally
> do. The kids are somewhat frustrated when I can't jump right up and join
> them in work or play. I am forgetful (I just found the salad from last
> night's dinner in a plastic bag in the drawer with the paper clips and
> stuff), and my mind loses a lot of its agility. It takes me a while to
find
> the words I'm looking for. I can't run up and down the stairs everytime
they
> need help with something. Sometimes I worry that the children will think
I'm
> a couple of nuggets shy of a happy meal. Am I an embarrassment to them?
> Will I be as they get older?
>
> On the other hand, has my illness taught them compassion, perserverance,
> endurance, and faith? Our 3 month old baby daughter was in the hospital
all
> week with RSV. The boys are so accustomed to my illness that they weren't
> frightened for her at all. She came home yesterday and the boys help me
by
> giving her the breathing treatments. I don't envision that being "normal"
> for most 8 and 5 year olds. Does that mean that they have been
strengthened
> and tempered by their experience with illness? Are they better for it?
>
> I'd love to hear your thoughts. This has been zinging around in my mind
for
> the last few days and it's cathartic to write it down.
>
> KIM
> ***runs with scissors***
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa. ZERO. Rates as low as 0
> percent Intro or 9.9 percent Fixed APR, online balance transfers,
> Rewards Points, no hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and
> get the credit you deserve. Apply now. Get your NextCard Visa at
> <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative3 ">Click Here</a>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
>
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/19/00 9:15:45 AM Central Standard Time,
klement@... writes:
<<to hear the *walking hormone*
wail and moan sometimes drives me up the wall.>>
ROFL. Such an apt description.
<< I do feel guilty though when my brain's area of discretionary power is
not functioning and I run off at the mouth with comments that are...to
say the least...not very productive or kind. I almost always
apologize....sometimes my occaisional bouts of moodiness don't let me
aplogize. People with MS sometimes have extreme brain fog that doesn't
accomodate *thinking before speaking*....it's a fact of life for us and not an
*excuse*. We have *wiring* problems in the brain that alters our normal
brain functions. >>
Buzz, I have the exact same thing with my lupus. Because my lupus causes
inflammation and scarring in the central nervous system, it mimics MS very,
very closely. I know EXACTLY what you're talking about.
<>
I've got this too. In fact, optic neuritis is one of my most frequent
problems. I've just finished a course of steroids to treat the most recent
bout of it. My vision didn't return to normal this time, which is
frightening to me.
<<and I passed a kidney stone last week>>
OK, now I'm laughing WITH you, not AT you! I also currently have a kidney
stone (also my third round with them). Are we sure that we were not
separated at birth?
BTW, I've got the boot camp hairdo again. It's been falling out in huge
chunks since Josephine was born and I couldn't stand having one more chunk
plop into my breakfast cereal. I got out the clippers and - VOILA! Actually
I love it, although it isn't terribly slimming...
Thanks for your response. It's a comfort just to be reminded that others
have gone through the same thing. I'm glad your kids are largely OK with the
whole thing.
KIM
***runs with scissors***
klement@... writes:
<<to hear the *walking hormone*
wail and moan sometimes drives me up the wall.>>
ROFL. Such an apt description.
<< I do feel guilty though when my brain's area of discretionary power is
not functioning and I run off at the mouth with comments that are...to
say the least...not very productive or kind. I almost always
apologize....sometimes my occaisional bouts of moodiness don't let me
aplogize. People with MS sometimes have extreme brain fog that doesn't
accomodate *thinking before speaking*....it's a fact of life for us and not an
*excuse*. We have *wiring* problems in the brain that alters our normal
brain functions. >>
Buzz, I have the exact same thing with my lupus. Because my lupus causes
inflammation and scarring in the central nervous system, it mimics MS very,
very closely. I know EXACTLY what you're talking about.
<>
I've got this too. In fact, optic neuritis is one of my most frequent
problems. I've just finished a course of steroids to treat the most recent
bout of it. My vision didn't return to normal this time, which is
frightening to me.
<<and I passed a kidney stone last week>>
OK, now I'm laughing WITH you, not AT you! I also currently have a kidney
stone (also my third round with them). Are we sure that we were not
separated at birth?
BTW, I've got the boot camp hairdo again. It's been falling out in huge
chunks since Josephine was born and I couldn't stand having one more chunk
plop into my breakfast cereal. I got out the clippers and - VOILA! Actually
I love it, although it isn't terribly slimming...
Thanks for your response. It's a comfort just to be reminded that others
have gone through the same thing. I'm glad your kids are largely OK with the
whole thing.
KIM
***runs with scissors***
D Klement
Monkeycoop@... wrote:
the *extra* work she has to do. I don't think it's really extra. She
does the supper dishes, wipes the counters and sweeps the kitchen floor
every night. She changes the cat litter on Tuesday night for garbage day
and takes out the recycles to the curb once a week. She does her own
laundry. I don't think that's a lot but to hear the *walking hormone*
wail and moan sometimes drives me up the wall.
I do however offer to pay for what I consider *extra* jobs. Jobs like
washing the kitchen floor or helping me spring clean, changing the
sheets on her brother and sister's beds. Jobs that are a little taxing
for me. She could make a really decent wage too if she wanted too(g).
I've offered to pay her up to what a local cleanning lady would
get....she's not interested except when there is something she wants to
buy.
The other two younger ones deal with it pretty good. The youngest is
ready to help at the drop of a hat. The middle one sometimes needs a
nudge.
I do feel guilty though when my brain's area of discretionary power is
not functioning and I run off at the mouth with comments that are...to
say the least...not very productive or kind. I almost always
apologize....sometimes my occaisional bouts of moodiness don't let me
aplogize.
People with MS sometimes have extreme brain fog that doesn't accomodate
*thinking before speaking*....it's a fact of life for us and not an
*excuse*. We have *wiring* problems in the brain that alters our normal
brain functions.
more because of damage to my optic nerve from the MS. Sometimes Sam has
to miss Brownies 'cause I won't endanger us by driving in the dark.
pockets the other day.....
understand perfectly.
though I'm not visibly disabled, it's for when I get tired walking and
then I start to stagger and I think that it emarrasses them a little.
Some days I must appear sooooo dense in the head to them. Other days I'm
in a state of manic silliness and will laugh hystericaly at anything
odd/silly until the tears are streaming and I'm snorting.
The kids love those days though ;-)
just happen and you really don't have any control over ANYTHING in life.
So just pull up your socks, set you jaw and tackle the problem head on.
I think it teaches them perserverance. They've watched me tear out a
sweater piece I was knitting. I tore it apart and re did it three times.
They asked why when the mistake (which I kept making over and over,
duh!), wouldn't show,why was I tearing it out......so I told them...I
wanted it done properly and I would keep at it until I'd done it right.
They watched me perservere until it was correct. I explained how it
might affect the final fit, how all the pieces needed to be right to fit
together properly.
and fretting wouldn't change the siuation. They met it head on and
proved to them selves that they can be helpful in stressful situations
and a comfort to you.
This is great! Perhaps they will be able to use this strength in a
future career.....nursing, couselling, social work etc.
Right now I'm laid up with walking pneumonia......went to the doctors
yesterday.....cost me $134 for medication and two different inhalers.
Katie has it too but her antibiotics were less expensive than mine
'cause she can't get pills down so she's on a supension liquid and the
same two inhalers as I ($106). I'm sooo glad hubby has %100 presciption
coverage! We're soo lucky to have that!
Geez....MS....pneumonia .....and I passed a kidney stone last week (at
least this time I didn't have enough pain to warrant a third
*kidneystone hospital visit*!)......what a life eh!!!
Buzz
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Klement Family "Education is what survives when
Darryl, Debbie, what has been learned has been
Kathleen, Nathan & forgotten"
Samantha B.F. Skinner in "New Scientist".
e-mail- klement@...
Canadian homeschool page: http:\\www.flora.org/homeschool-ca/
Ont. Federation of Teaching Parents: http:\\www.flora.org/oftp/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>My kids are pretty good about it now. The oldest (14) sometimes resents
> From: Monkeycoop@...
>
> Hi,
> Have your children had to deal with serious illness? Buzz, I know yours
> have. How did they cope? Do you think it has shaped them in any way?
the *extra* work she has to do. I don't think it's really extra. She
does the supper dishes, wipes the counters and sweeps the kitchen floor
every night. She changes the cat litter on Tuesday night for garbage day
and takes out the recycles to the curb once a week. She does her own
laundry. I don't think that's a lot but to hear the *walking hormone*
wail and moan sometimes drives me up the wall.
I do however offer to pay for what I consider *extra* jobs. Jobs like
washing the kitchen floor or helping me spring clean, changing the
sheets on her brother and sister's beds. Jobs that are a little taxing
for me. She could make a really decent wage too if she wanted too(g).
I've offered to pay her up to what a local cleanning lady would
get....she's not interested except when there is something she wants to
buy.
The other two younger ones deal with it pretty good. The youngest is
ready to help at the drop of a hat. The middle one sometimes needs a
nudge.
I do feel guilty though when my brain's area of discretionary power is
not functioning and I run off at the mouth with comments that are...to
say the least...not very productive or kind. I almost always
apologize....sometimes my occaisional bouts of moodiness don't let me
aplogize.
People with MS sometimes have extreme brain fog that doesn't accomodate
*thinking before speaking*....it's a fact of life for us and not an
*excuse*. We have *wiring* problems in the brain that alters our normal
brain functions.
> My lupus is flaring right now and I just can't do all the things I normallyI feel bad when this happens to me too. I can't drive well at night any
> do. The kids are somewhat frustrated when I can't jump right up and join
> them in work or play.
more because of damage to my optic nerve from the MS. Sometimes Sam has
to miss Brownies 'cause I won't endanger us by driving in the dark.
> I am forgetful (I just found the salad from lastHey don't feel bad...I was walking around with potatoes in my housecoat
> night's dinner in a plastic bag in the drawer with the paper clips and
> stuff), and my mind loses a lot of its agility. It takes me a while to find
> the words I'm looking for.
pockets the other day.....
>I can't run up and down the stairs everytime theyIt's taken me 2 yrs to be able to *jog* up the stairs again so I
> need help with something.
understand perfectly.
>Sometimes I worry that the children will think I'mI worry about this too....some days I take my cane out with me even
> a couple of nuggets shy of a happy meal. Am I an embarrassment to them?
> Will I be as they get older?
though I'm not visibly disabled, it's for when I get tired walking and
then I start to stagger and I think that it emarrasses them a little.
Some days I must appear sooooo dense in the head to them. Other days I'm
in a state of manic silliness and will laugh hystericaly at anything
odd/silly until the tears are streaming and I'm snorting.
The kids love those days though ;-)
> On the other hand, has my illness taught them compassion, perserverance,I think it really teaches them compassion. They also learn that things
> endurance, and faith?
just happen and you really don't have any control over ANYTHING in life.
So just pull up your socks, set you jaw and tackle the problem head on.
I think it teaches them perserverance. They've watched me tear out a
sweater piece I was knitting. I tore it apart and re did it three times.
They asked why when the mistake (which I kept making over and over,
duh!), wouldn't show,why was I tearing it out......so I told them...I
wanted it done properly and I would keep at it until I'd done it right.
They watched me perservere until it was correct. I explained how it
might affect the final fit, how all the pieces needed to be right to fit
together properly.
>Our 3 month old baby daughter was in the hospital allPerhaps they knew they couldn't change the situation and, that moaning
> week with RSV. The boys are so accustomed to my illness that they weren't
> frightened for her at all. She came home yesterday and the boys help me by
> giving her the breathing treatments. I don't envision that being "normal"
> for most 8 and 5 year olds. Does that mean that they have been strengthened
> and tempered by their experience with illness? Are they better for it?
and fretting wouldn't change the siuation. They met it head on and
proved to them selves that they can be helpful in stressful situations
and a comfort to you.
This is great! Perhaps they will be able to use this strength in a
future career.....nursing, couselling, social work etc.
Right now I'm laid up with walking pneumonia......went to the doctors
yesterday.....cost me $134 for medication and two different inhalers.
Katie has it too but her antibiotics were less expensive than mine
'cause she can't get pills down so she's on a supension liquid and the
same two inhalers as I ($106). I'm sooo glad hubby has %100 presciption
coverage! We're soo lucky to have that!
Geez....MS....pneumonia .....and I passed a kidney stone last week (at
least this time I didn't have enough pain to warrant a third
*kidneystone hospital visit*!)......what a life eh!!!
Buzz
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Klement Family "Education is what survives when
Darryl, Debbie, what has been learned has been
Kathleen, Nathan & forgotten"
Samantha B.F. Skinner in "New Scientist".
e-mail- klement@...
Canadian homeschool page: http:\\www.flora.org/homeschool-ca/
Ont. Federation of Teaching Parents: http:\\www.flora.org/oftp/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
susan
hi,
i have still's disease, which is and autoimmune disease akin to rheumatoid
arthritis and lupus. my whole life i have been really healthy (i.e. 5 years
between colds) but when i hit my 30's and was vaccinated with mmr vaccine my
health took a turn for the worse, but it wasn't until rene' was 20 months when
this disease actually surfaced and i was finally diagnosed.
the whole experience of the 1st 3 weeks, when the dr. thought i was a hippy
scamming for drugs and would not help me, not being able to move , losing 20 lbs
of muscle -mostly in my shoulders (it was so severe that i could not pick up an
empty paper cup let alone dress myself or even get up) were completely surreal.
my husband is deaf so i had to kick a 5 lb weight off the bed to vibrate the
house so he would come help me (creative problem solving:) we were new to the
area and no family or friends to speak of so my husband had to stop working for
2 months. it was a real nightmare.
since rene' was not really talking yet and i was so overwhelmed - kind of like
being stuck in an undertow and not knowing which end is up- he's emotional needs
kind of got lost in the mayhem. it was about 2 months after the onset and
things started to quiet down, when it dawned on me that i hadn't talked to him
about what was happening- he had been very distant and would not look at me,
especially in the hospital, which he hated. when i came home (he and i had
rarely spent anytime apart, no babysitters - mostly because we had no $ or
friends or family in the area) he stood on the porch laughed and laughed when he
saw me get out of the car. i really think he thought i had moved out and into
the hospital and he was very angry i had left him. at this time he had the
worst diaper rash ever. i think it was because he was so stressed and he is
very stoic by nature that he toughed it out causing his body to get very very
acidic.
anyway, we revisit this time periodically. especially when i go some place to
have treatment. i've done this twice - once to the chopra center in san diego
for 10 days and the 2nd to dallas maharishi ayurvedic center for 3 weeks. both
times were very hard on him. he hangs in there and is fine or appears fine but
after a few days some minor incident crushes him and he inevitably get sick and
stays sick until i return. it's very sad.
recently, about 2 1/2 years after onset, we were talking about horses and i was
telling him about the horses we had when i was a kid. he asked me if he was
going to meet them and i said no because they were dead - well he broke down and
cried and cried, which is very unusual for him. we talked about it and i asked
him if part of the reason he was so upset about the horses dying was because of
me being sick and he said ' i thought you were going to die'. it was so sad but
also very good that we found a way to release some of this stress that had been
burdening him.
the wonderful thing about this situation for him (for me is a whole other
story:) is that he has developed compassion, flexibility, independence, a
deeper ability to cooperate and think of others, as well as a good
understanding of the human body - before he was 4 he knew the different body
systems and the name of the organs, their basic functions and where they
belonged in the body. i've spent a lot of time and energy feeling very guilty
for not being able to do things with him, for relying so heavily on tv to make
it through the day, for not being able to drive a car (because of the severe
lost of muscle in my shoulder i get fatigued just by sitting up) etc. but now i
have accepted it as a wonderful gift rather than seeing as a burden and
something that ruined rene's chances at having a happy childhood. we learn
things in so many diverse ways who's to really say what is the best way to
learn.
-susan
austin,tx
dessert first
p.s. i do have a question for others with autoimmune diseases. last monday i
miscarried at 11 weeks because of this and i was wondering if any of you had
similar problem. if so what have you done to calm your immune system down?
i have still's disease, which is and autoimmune disease akin to rheumatoid
arthritis and lupus. my whole life i have been really healthy (i.e. 5 years
between colds) but when i hit my 30's and was vaccinated with mmr vaccine my
health took a turn for the worse, but it wasn't until rene' was 20 months when
this disease actually surfaced and i was finally diagnosed.
the whole experience of the 1st 3 weeks, when the dr. thought i was a hippy
scamming for drugs and would not help me, not being able to move , losing 20 lbs
of muscle -mostly in my shoulders (it was so severe that i could not pick up an
empty paper cup let alone dress myself or even get up) were completely surreal.
my husband is deaf so i had to kick a 5 lb weight off the bed to vibrate the
house so he would come help me (creative problem solving:) we were new to the
area and no family or friends to speak of so my husband had to stop working for
2 months. it was a real nightmare.
since rene' was not really talking yet and i was so overwhelmed - kind of like
being stuck in an undertow and not knowing which end is up- he's emotional needs
kind of got lost in the mayhem. it was about 2 months after the onset and
things started to quiet down, when it dawned on me that i hadn't talked to him
about what was happening- he had been very distant and would not look at me,
especially in the hospital, which he hated. when i came home (he and i had
rarely spent anytime apart, no babysitters - mostly because we had no $ or
friends or family in the area) he stood on the porch laughed and laughed when he
saw me get out of the car. i really think he thought i had moved out and into
the hospital and he was very angry i had left him. at this time he had the
worst diaper rash ever. i think it was because he was so stressed and he is
very stoic by nature that he toughed it out causing his body to get very very
acidic.
anyway, we revisit this time periodically. especially when i go some place to
have treatment. i've done this twice - once to the chopra center in san diego
for 10 days and the 2nd to dallas maharishi ayurvedic center for 3 weeks. both
times were very hard on him. he hangs in there and is fine or appears fine but
after a few days some minor incident crushes him and he inevitably get sick and
stays sick until i return. it's very sad.
recently, about 2 1/2 years after onset, we were talking about horses and i was
telling him about the horses we had when i was a kid. he asked me if he was
going to meet them and i said no because they were dead - well he broke down and
cried and cried, which is very unusual for him. we talked about it and i asked
him if part of the reason he was so upset about the horses dying was because of
me being sick and he said ' i thought you were going to die'. it was so sad but
also very good that we found a way to release some of this stress that had been
burdening him.
the wonderful thing about this situation for him (for me is a whole other
story:) is that he has developed compassion, flexibility, independence, a
deeper ability to cooperate and think of others, as well as a good
understanding of the human body - before he was 4 he knew the different body
systems and the name of the organs, their basic functions and where they
belonged in the body. i've spent a lot of time and energy feeling very guilty
for not being able to do things with him, for relying so heavily on tv to make
it through the day, for not being able to drive a car (because of the severe
lost of muscle in my shoulder i get fatigued just by sitting up) etc. but now i
have accepted it as a wonderful gift rather than seeing as a burden and
something that ruined rene's chances at having a happy childhood. we learn
things in so many diverse ways who's to really say what is the best way to
learn.
-susan
austin,tx
dessert first
p.s. i do have a question for others with autoimmune diseases. last monday i
miscarried at 11 weeks because of this and i was wondering if any of you had
similar problem. if so what have you done to calm your immune system down?
susan
hi,
i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about autoimmune diseases and
there is a lot of info that supports this idea.
-susan
austin,tx
dessert first
michele clausen wrote:
i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about autoimmune diseases and
there is a lot of info that supports this idea.
-susan
austin,tx
dessert first
michele clausen wrote:
> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
>
> Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis) which I firmly
> believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.
>
> Michele.
> NZ. It is hot!
>
[email protected]
When I was a child my aunt, who was my mom's best friend and lived with us for a while, had lupus. She passed away when she was 24 and I was 10. My mother has always had health problems, which they're still not positive what it is. Fibromaylsia ,sp?> I think is what they've decided. When my aunt lived with us I would get up with her a 5 am to help her do her hair for work. On her days off we would tiptoe around the house so she could sleep until noon. When her hair fell out I went to help her pick out a wig. I was devastated when she died. I have always helped my mother with housework and taking care of my brother. To be perfectly honest, I do have to say that I feel that my mother depended too much on me (my dad left when I was 6) and was too hard on me (C's on my report card was not acceptable no matter what). But, I think that was because of her circumstances and not really illness related. I loved helping my aunt and never thought anything about it. After all I feel that we are on this earth to help each other. I think it has helped me to be more sensitive to others and also more intutive. And it a way it has been a blessing in my life. So I've grown to be unmateralistic and I think I cherish life perhaps a bit more then I would have without the experience. That which does not kill you should make you stronger. And I think that life's pain and difficulties are lessons that we need to learn from in order to become more well rounded people. Also, to let you know I have never been embarrassed by my mom or aunt even though we have plenty of stories that we look back and laugh about now.
~Heather
*** Free voicemail and email, by phone or Web! Free phone calls too! Get it today at http://www.myTalk.com ***
~Heather
*** Free voicemail and email, by phone or Web! Free phone calls too! Get it today at http://www.myTalk.com ***
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/20/00 11:26:48 AM Central Standard Time,
fxfireob@... writes:
<< last monday i
miscarried at 11 weeks because of this and i was wondering if any of you had
similar problem. if so what have you done to calm your immune system down? >>
Oh, Susan. I'm so very very sorry. I miscarried at 13 weeks about 1-1/2
years ago. It was probably related to my immune system. Fortunately, my
lupus calmed down immediately afterward and I got pregnant again 4 months
later. I'm very happy to say that she is now almost 4 months old! To calm
my immune system down I have done several rounds of chemotherapy. During
pregnancy I took a baby aspirin each day, at my doctor's suggestion. This
helps a lot. Please accept my condolences. I know that it can be a crushing
loss, even early in pregnancy. Take good care of yourself during this hard
time. Grief often triggers an autoimmune response. Peace be with you.
KIM
fxfireob@... writes:
<< last monday i
miscarried at 11 weeks because of this and i was wondering if any of you had
similar problem. if so what have you done to calm your immune system down? >>
Oh, Susan. I'm so very very sorry. I miscarried at 13 weeks about 1-1/2
years ago. It was probably related to my immune system. Fortunately, my
lupus calmed down immediately afterward and I got pregnant again 4 months
later. I'm very happy to say that she is now almost 4 months old! To calm
my immune system down I have done several rounds of chemotherapy. During
pregnancy I took a baby aspirin each day, at my doctor's suggestion. This
helps a lot. Please accept my condolences. I know that it can be a crushing
loss, even early in pregnancy. Take good care of yourself during this hard
time. Grief often triggers an autoimmune response. Peace be with you.
KIM
Campbell & Wyman
Dear Susan and Michele and others....,
We love, support, nurture our darling daughter. She has a tremendously
secure environment.
..with a loving mom :), a super Dad, and an empathetic and fun-loving
sister (to keep her laughing).
Our daughter's life is full, rich, bountiful...and we feel blessed every
day that we can home-learn together.
She is LOVED and NURTURED and SHE HAS a chronic auto-immune disorder.
However, I found the comments regarding abuse and neglect in regard to
having disease insensitive to all parents of children with auto-immune
disorders. These parents (me included) don't need any guilt trips. We have
met many, many parents of sick kids in our numerous visits to clinics and
med. specialists. These parents are dealing with huge issues on behalf of
their children. And these parents are , from what we have seen, loving and
supporting and caring parents as well.
Parents of children with auto-immune disorders live with constant stress.
We worry about what our sick children eat, and how they sleep, and how to
manage their chronic pain, and how to manage their many medications and
treatments, and how to support the family during emotionally stressful
times, and how to just carry on from one day to the next.
I had to write this note in support of any other parents who are on this
list and are dealing with similar issues with sick children.
I know there are terrible abuses inflicted on some children...and certainly
if children with auto-immune disorders had to deal with that abuse it would
exacerbate their conditions. But please do not suggest that abused and
neglected children get auto-immune disorders. It is a sweeping
generalization that does not deserve much merit.
Brooke
P.S. I agree with your earlier post, Susan, that stated that dealing with
these issues makes one a deeper and richer person with a profoundly
empathetic heart. Our daughter has certainly exhibited this on many
occasions.
We love, support, nurture our darling daughter. She has a tremendously
secure environment.
..with a loving mom :), a super Dad, and an empathetic and fun-loving
sister (to keep her laughing).
Our daughter's life is full, rich, bountiful...and we feel blessed every
day that we can home-learn together.
She is LOVED and NURTURED and SHE HAS a chronic auto-immune disorder.
However, I found the comments regarding abuse and neglect in regard to
having disease insensitive to all parents of children with auto-immune
disorders. These parents (me included) don't need any guilt trips. We have
met many, many parents of sick kids in our numerous visits to clinics and
med. specialists. These parents are dealing with huge issues on behalf of
their children. And these parents are , from what we have seen, loving and
supporting and caring parents as well.
Parents of children with auto-immune disorders live with constant stress.
We worry about what our sick children eat, and how they sleep, and how to
manage their chronic pain, and how to manage their many medications and
treatments, and how to support the family during emotionally stressful
times, and how to just carry on from one day to the next.
I had to write this note in support of any other parents who are on this
list and are dealing with similar issues with sick children.
I know there are terrible abuses inflicted on some children...and certainly
if children with auto-immune disorders had to deal with that abuse it would
exacerbate their conditions. But please do not suggest that abused and
neglected children get auto-immune disorders. It is a sweeping
generalization that does not deserve much merit.
Brooke
P.S. I agree with your earlier post, Susan, that stated that dealing with
these issues makes one a deeper and richer person with a profoundly
empathetic heart. Our daughter has certainly exhibited this on many
occasions.
>michele clausen wrote:firmly
>
>> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
>>
>> Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis) which I
>> believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.diseases and
>>
>> Michele.
>> NZ. It is hot!
>>
>i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about autoimmune
>there is a lot of info that supports this idea.brynlee@...
>-susan
Campbell & Wyman
Dear Susan and Michele and others....,
We love, support, nurture our darling daughter. She has a tremendously
secure environment.
..with a loving mom :), a super Dad, and an empathetic and fun-loving
sister (to keep her laughing).
Our daughter's life is full, rich, bountiful...and we feel blessed every
day that we can home-learn together.
She is LOVED and NURTURED and SHE HAS a chronic auto-immune disorder.
However, I found the comments regarding abuse and neglect in regard to
having disease insensitive to all parents of children with auto-immune
disorders. These parents (me included) don't need any guilt trips. We have
met many, many parents of sick kids in our numerous visits to clinics and
med. specialists. These parents are dealing with huge issues on behalf of
their children. And these parents are , from what we have seen, loving and
supporting and caring parents as well.
Parents of children with auto-immune disorders live with constant stress.
We worry about what our sick children eat, and how they sleep, and how to
manage their chronic pain, and how to manage their many medications and
treatments, and how to support the family during emotionally stressful
times, and how to just carry on from one day to the next.
I had to write this note in support of any other parents who are on this
list and are dealing with similar issues with sick children.
I know there are terrible abuses inflicted on some children...and certainly
if children with auto-immune disorders had to deal with that abuse it would
exacerbate their conditions. But please do not suggest that abused and
neglected children get auto-immune disorders. It is a sweeping
generalization that does not deserve much merit.
Brooke
P.S. I agree with your earlier post, Susan, that stated that dealing with
these issues makes one a deeper and richer person with a profoundly
empathetic heart. Our daughter has certainly exhibited this on many
occasions.
We love, support, nurture our darling daughter. She has a tremendously
secure environment.
..with a loving mom :), a super Dad, and an empathetic and fun-loving
sister (to keep her laughing).
Our daughter's life is full, rich, bountiful...and we feel blessed every
day that we can home-learn together.
She is LOVED and NURTURED and SHE HAS a chronic auto-immune disorder.
However, I found the comments regarding abuse and neglect in regard to
having disease insensitive to all parents of children with auto-immune
disorders. These parents (me included) don't need any guilt trips. We have
met many, many parents of sick kids in our numerous visits to clinics and
med. specialists. These parents are dealing with huge issues on behalf of
their children. And these parents are , from what we have seen, loving and
supporting and caring parents as well.
Parents of children with auto-immune disorders live with constant stress.
We worry about what our sick children eat, and how they sleep, and how to
manage their chronic pain, and how to manage their many medications and
treatments, and how to support the family during emotionally stressful
times, and how to just carry on from one day to the next.
I had to write this note in support of any other parents who are on this
list and are dealing with similar issues with sick children.
I know there are terrible abuses inflicted on some children...and certainly
if children with auto-immune disorders had to deal with that abuse it would
exacerbate their conditions. But please do not suggest that abused and
neglected children get auto-immune disorders. It is a sweeping
generalization that does not deserve much merit.
Brooke
P.S. I agree with your earlier post, Susan, that stated that dealing with
these issues makes one a deeper and richer person with a profoundly
empathetic heart. Our daughter has certainly exhibited this on many
occasions.
>michele clausen wrote:firmly
>
>> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
>>
>> Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis) which I
>> believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.diseases and
>>
>> Michele.
>> NZ. It is hot!
>>
>i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about autoimmune
>there is a lot of info that supports this idea.brynlee@...
>-susan
michele clausen
Hi Brooke,
I am so sorry to have offended you, I certainly didn't mean too. I think it is
wonderful that you love and support your daughter in your journey thru her
illness, if my parents had been as loving as you are I would be very grateful. My
parents never bothered to be so interested in me, in fact they told me that my
condition was probably my fault so I could fix it on my own. However, I know why
*I* have my illness and I hope so much that I will never be proved wrong and have
to see one of my girls go thru what I do each day. I know that not every auto
immune disease is caused by abuse and neglect and I know that there is no reason
for alot of suffering. Just as I know that my condition is caused by hearing
everyday how much my mother never wanted me, how much she hated me, how hopeless,
lazy, blah, blah, blah I was. I know that the suffering in my soul that my father
caused by hitting me, swinging me around the room by my hair, and holding up
against the wall by my throat at least weekly caused *my* condition.
I certainly never meant to offend you or anyone else but if you re-read my post
you will see that I referred to myself only.
Perhaps you could be so good as to let me have my own opinion as to why *I* am
sick.
Please accept my apologies as sincere, I would never mean to hurt anyone.
Good luck with your daughter.
Michele.
Campbell & Wyman wrote:
I am so sorry to have offended you, I certainly didn't mean too. I think it is
wonderful that you love and support your daughter in your journey thru her
illness, if my parents had been as loving as you are I would be very grateful. My
parents never bothered to be so interested in me, in fact they told me that my
condition was probably my fault so I could fix it on my own. However, I know why
*I* have my illness and I hope so much that I will never be proved wrong and have
to see one of my girls go thru what I do each day. I know that not every auto
immune disease is caused by abuse and neglect and I know that there is no reason
for alot of suffering. Just as I know that my condition is caused by hearing
everyday how much my mother never wanted me, how much she hated me, how hopeless,
lazy, blah, blah, blah I was. I know that the suffering in my soul that my father
caused by hitting me, swinging me around the room by my hair, and holding up
against the wall by my throat at least weekly caused *my* condition.
I certainly never meant to offend you or anyone else but if you re-read my post
you will see that I referred to myself only.
Perhaps you could be so good as to let me have my own opinion as to why *I* am
sick.
Please accept my apologies as sincere, I would never mean to hurt anyone.
Good luck with your daughter.
Michele.
Campbell & Wyman wrote:
> From: Campbell & Wyman <brynlee@...>
>
> Dear Susan and Michele and others....,
>
> We love, support, nurture our darling daughter. She has a tremendously
> secure environment.
> ..with a loving mom :), a super Dad, and an empathetic and fun-loving
> sister (to keep her laughing).
> Our daughter's life is full, rich, bountiful...and we feel blessed every
> day that we can home-learn together.
> She is LOVED and NURTURED and SHE HAS a chronic auto-immune disorder.
>
> However, I found the comments regarding abuse and neglect in regard to
> having disease insensitive to all parents of children with auto-immune
> disorders. These parents (me included) don't need any guilt trips. We have
> met many, many parents of sick kids in our numerous visits to clinics and
> med. specialists. These parents are dealing with huge issues on behalf of
> their children. And these parents are , from what we have seen, loving and
> supporting and caring parents as well.
> Parents of children with auto-immune disorders live with constant stress.
> We worry about what our sick children eat, and how they sleep, and how to
> manage their chronic pain, and how to manage their many medications and
> treatments, and how to support the family during emotionally stressful
> times, and how to just carry on from one day to the next.
>
> I had to write this note in support of any other parents who are on this
> list and are dealing with similar issues with sick children.
>
> I know there are terrible abuses inflicted on some children...and certainly
> if children with auto-immune disorders had to deal with that abuse it would
> exacerbate their conditions. But please do not suggest that abused and
> neglected children get auto-immune disorders. It is a sweeping
> generalization that does not deserve much merit.
>
> Brooke
> P.S. I agree with your earlier post, Susan, that stated that dealing with
> these issues makes one a deeper and richer person with a profoundly
> empathetic heart. Our daughter has certainly exhibited this on many
> occasions.
>
>
>
> >michele clausen wrote:
> >
> >> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
> >>
> >> Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis) which I
> firmly
> >> believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.
> >>
> >> Michele.
> >> NZ. It is hot!
> >>
> >i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about autoimmune
> diseases and
> >there is a lot of info that supports this idea.
> >-susan
>
> brynlee@...
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Campbell & Wyman
>Please accept my apologies as sincere, I would never mean to hurt anyone.Thanks for your response Michele...
>Good luck with your daughter. Michele.
I hope that you can find peace as well.
Brooke
brynlee@...
susan
hi brooke,
i am so sorry. i did not mean to say the sole cause of autoimmune disease was
abuse experienced in childhood. i wanted to keep my reply short because i tend
to go on at some length. there are many reason why this happens and each case is
truly unique so no sweeping generalization makes any sense. i know as a parent
guilt is a very difficult to avoid and i certainly would not want to contribute
to yours, so please accept my heart felt apology for my utter insensitivity on
this subject.
what was told to me by western drs is: 'we simply have no idea what precipitates
autoimmune diseases'; but that they have found that emotion is a component, that
a good attitude tends to minimize the flares - the stress factor - the better you
can process and release stress the fewer symptoms you will experience. beyond
that they are really at a loss as to the cause as well as a 'cure'. what they
told me to do was to go home take a few meds, and advised me to enjoy my family
and to try to wean off the meds asap because of the side effects of long term
use. though there are lots of theories based on patterns seen in patients,
treatment to date has been based on symptoms and trying to make the person as
comfortable as possible.
in my case, simply stated, the disease appears to have developed over a period of
time as a reaction to the mmr vaccine i was give at the age of 29 (they think i
was over vaccinated), but according to the vedic dr i saw (on the advise of my
admitting allopathic dr at the hospital at onset) autoimmune disease is
basically a problem with digestion, both literal and figurative (the digestion
system is now believed by some to be a major component of the immune system).
when food (or experiences) is not properly digested, it creates toxins and these
toxins then accumulate in the joints - rheumatoid arthritis, the connective
tissues or systemically - lupus, the myelin surrounding the nerves - ms etc.
when the body tries to rid itself of these toxin it also rids the body of the
tissue the toxins have accumulated in.
i've read, in a study of people with rheumatoid arthritis, that100% of those
studied (the exact # in the study escapes me) were found to have toxic intestinal
linings making digestion and absortion nearly impossible which creates more
toxins and then the disease continues to progress. this in combination with the
side effects of the meds (e.g. destruction of cartilage & bone by the steroids)
creates more and more difficulties.
the vedic perspective links the mind and the body (much like einstein linked time
and space) so their approach is to eliminate toxins, but these toxins can be
created through the mind (experiences) leading to a disruption in the physiology
(poor digestion of food). this is were the abusive childhood plays in. the
vedics see that we digest experiences much like we digest food. if we experience
something we find overwhelming then we store what we can't process which creates
stress which in turn creates toxins then we find ourselves with difficulties of
all sorts - not just autoimmune but allergies as well as others maladies. the
vedics also hold similar perspectives as the buddist and see karma and past lives
as additional contributing factors.
regardless of the perspective there seems to be a consensus that something in the
brain - a switch of sorts - seems to be stuck in the on position and until this
switch moves freely in response to a genuine need the symptoms will continue.
for some of us this comes in the form of unconditional love, which was not
experienced in childhood, and for others like your daughter other factors are at
issue. perhaps one of the reasons autoimmune diseases prove to be such a
mystery, especially for allopathic dr, is because there are so many variables,
that generalization just don't hold water, making it impossible to have one fixed
approach - identify & name the disease then treat with standard protocol.
again i want you to know i am so sorry, i was being completely thoughtless in my
comments. having a sick child is so difficult, when i put myself is your place my
condition/situation pales. thank you for pointing out my insensitivity and
narrow minded comment and please know it was not my intent to make such a
generalization but was given simply as support and acknowledgement of one portion
of reality not the whole picture.
-susan
austin,tx
Campbell & Wyman wrote:
i am so sorry. i did not mean to say the sole cause of autoimmune disease was
abuse experienced in childhood. i wanted to keep my reply short because i tend
to go on at some length. there are many reason why this happens and each case is
truly unique so no sweeping generalization makes any sense. i know as a parent
guilt is a very difficult to avoid and i certainly would not want to contribute
to yours, so please accept my heart felt apology for my utter insensitivity on
this subject.
what was told to me by western drs is: 'we simply have no idea what precipitates
autoimmune diseases'; but that they have found that emotion is a component, that
a good attitude tends to minimize the flares - the stress factor - the better you
can process and release stress the fewer symptoms you will experience. beyond
that they are really at a loss as to the cause as well as a 'cure'. what they
told me to do was to go home take a few meds, and advised me to enjoy my family
and to try to wean off the meds asap because of the side effects of long term
use. though there are lots of theories based on patterns seen in patients,
treatment to date has been based on symptoms and trying to make the person as
comfortable as possible.
in my case, simply stated, the disease appears to have developed over a period of
time as a reaction to the mmr vaccine i was give at the age of 29 (they think i
was over vaccinated), but according to the vedic dr i saw (on the advise of my
admitting allopathic dr at the hospital at onset) autoimmune disease is
basically a problem with digestion, both literal and figurative (the digestion
system is now believed by some to be a major component of the immune system).
when food (or experiences) is not properly digested, it creates toxins and these
toxins then accumulate in the joints - rheumatoid arthritis, the connective
tissues or systemically - lupus, the myelin surrounding the nerves - ms etc.
when the body tries to rid itself of these toxin it also rids the body of the
tissue the toxins have accumulated in.
i've read, in a study of people with rheumatoid arthritis, that100% of those
studied (the exact # in the study escapes me) were found to have toxic intestinal
linings making digestion and absortion nearly impossible which creates more
toxins and then the disease continues to progress. this in combination with the
side effects of the meds (e.g. destruction of cartilage & bone by the steroids)
creates more and more difficulties.
the vedic perspective links the mind and the body (much like einstein linked time
and space) so their approach is to eliminate toxins, but these toxins can be
created through the mind (experiences) leading to a disruption in the physiology
(poor digestion of food). this is were the abusive childhood plays in. the
vedics see that we digest experiences much like we digest food. if we experience
something we find overwhelming then we store what we can't process which creates
stress which in turn creates toxins then we find ourselves with difficulties of
all sorts - not just autoimmune but allergies as well as others maladies. the
vedics also hold similar perspectives as the buddist and see karma and past lives
as additional contributing factors.
regardless of the perspective there seems to be a consensus that something in the
brain - a switch of sorts - seems to be stuck in the on position and until this
switch moves freely in response to a genuine need the symptoms will continue.
for some of us this comes in the form of unconditional love, which was not
experienced in childhood, and for others like your daughter other factors are at
issue. perhaps one of the reasons autoimmune diseases prove to be such a
mystery, especially for allopathic dr, is because there are so many variables,
that generalization just don't hold water, making it impossible to have one fixed
approach - identify & name the disease then treat with standard protocol.
again i want you to know i am so sorry, i was being completely thoughtless in my
comments. having a sick child is so difficult, when i put myself is your place my
condition/situation pales. thank you for pointing out my insensitivity and
narrow minded comment and please know it was not my intent to make such a
generalization but was given simply as support and acknowledgement of one portion
of reality not the whole picture.
-susan
austin,tx
Campbell & Wyman wrote:
> From: Campbell & Wyman <brynlee@...>
>
> Dear Susan and Michele and others....,
>
> We love, support, nurture our darling daughter. She has a tremendously
> secure environment.
> ..with a loving mom :), a super Dad, and an empathetic and fun-loving
> sister (to keep her laughing).
> Our daughter's life is full, rich, bountiful...and we feel blessed every
> day that we can home-learn together.
> She is LOVED and NURTURED and SHE HAS a chronic auto-immune disorder.
>
> However, I found the comments regarding abuse and neglect in regard to
> having disease insensitive to all parents of children with auto-immune
> disorders. These parents (me included) don't need any guilt trips. We have
> met many, many parents of sick kids in our numerous visits to clinics and
> med. specialists. These parents are dealing with huge issues on behalf of
> their children. And these parents are , from what we have seen, loving and
> supporting and caring parents as well.
> Parents of children with auto-immune disorders live with constant stress.
> We worry about what our sick children eat, and how they sleep, and how to
> manage their chronic pain, and how to manage their many medications and
> treatments, and how to support the family during emotionally stressful
> times, and how to just carry on from one day to the next.
>
> I had to write this note in support of any other parents who are on this
> list and are dealing with similar issues with sick children.
>
> I know there are terrible abuses inflicted on some children...and certainly
> if children with auto-immune disorders had to deal with that abuse it would
> exacerbate their conditions. But please do not suggest that abused and
> neglected children get auto-immune disorders. It is a sweeping
> generalization that does not deserve much merit.
>
> Brooke
> P.S. I agree with your earlier post, Susan, that stated that dealing with
> these issues makes one a deeper and richer person with a profoundly
> empathetic heart. Our daughter has certainly exhibited this on many
> occasions.
>
>
>
> >michele clausen wrote:
> >
> >> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
> >>
> >> Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis) which I
> firmly
> >> believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered as a child.
> >>
> >> Michele.
> >> NZ. It is hot!
> >>
> >i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about autoimmune
> diseases and
> >there is a lot of info that supports this idea.
> >-susan
>
> brynlee@...
>
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susan
hi michele,
i took your advise and reread both our posts and i didn't interpreted
either of them as saying anything other than abuse in childhood as a
real cause, not the sole cause. i too am very sorry for the
misunderstanding and feel that's all it was.
i personally have experienced similar 'annihilation' and invalidation as
you- and still do though to no avail. my family not only never came to
see me in the hospital (where the drs kept me for 10 days and thought i
might die) they treated me as if i were lying and looking for
attention. a few years later they hired a pi to investigate all the
kids (weird put true:), apparently the pi told them i was telling the
truth because now they seem to accept that i was ill. but i'm so
distant from them it just has no value and no real effect on my life.
what i have learned is to love them and accept them for who they are and
where they're at but i do it from a distance and keep my interactions
with them as superficial as possible.
i think if you have an autoimmune disease trust in yourself is critic no
matter what caused the disease. one should never undermine another's
self expression, especially in cases such as these, because development
of the self is paramount. we know and can all agree that stress is a
critical element in managing autoimmune diseases. when one experiences
acceptance of one's self expression, stress is reduces, which helps the
disease not to flare or at least the flares aren't as great. the vedics
see that self referral is the only real way to balance the system and
create homeostasis - the desired state. to do this you need to find
your own inner intelligence (the balanced functioning of the entire
system) this they view is done by connecting with everything around you
and seeing life as unified rather than disparate. so keep on know the
cause of your disease and loving your family - i find that this has
helped me tremendously too.
best wishes
susan
austin,tx
michele clausen wrote:
i took your advise and reread both our posts and i didn't interpreted
either of them as saying anything other than abuse in childhood as a
real cause, not the sole cause. i too am very sorry for the
misunderstanding and feel that's all it was.
i personally have experienced similar 'annihilation' and invalidation as
you- and still do though to no avail. my family not only never came to
see me in the hospital (where the drs kept me for 10 days and thought i
might die) they treated me as if i were lying and looking for
attention. a few years later they hired a pi to investigate all the
kids (weird put true:), apparently the pi told them i was telling the
truth because now they seem to accept that i was ill. but i'm so
distant from them it just has no value and no real effect on my life.
what i have learned is to love them and accept them for who they are and
where they're at but i do it from a distance and keep my interactions
with them as superficial as possible.
i think if you have an autoimmune disease trust in yourself is critic no
matter what caused the disease. one should never undermine another's
self expression, especially in cases such as these, because development
of the self is paramount. we know and can all agree that stress is a
critical element in managing autoimmune diseases. when one experiences
acceptance of one's self expression, stress is reduces, which helps the
disease not to flare or at least the flares aren't as great. the vedics
see that self referral is the only real way to balance the system and
create homeostasis - the desired state. to do this you need to find
your own inner intelligence (the balanced functioning of the entire
system) this they view is done by connecting with everything around you
and seeing life as unified rather than disparate. so keep on know the
cause of your disease and loving your family - i find that this has
helped me tremendously too.
best wishes
susan
austin,tx
michele clausen wrote:
> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
>
> Hi Brooke,
>
> I am so sorry to have offended you, I certainly didn't mean too. I
> think it is wonderful that you love and support your daughter in your
> journey thru her illness, if my parents had been as loving as you are
> I would be very grateful. My parents never bothered to be so
> interested in me, in fact they told me that my condition was probably
> my fault so I could fix it on my own. However, I know why *I* have my
> illness and I hope so much that I will never be proved wrong and have
> to see one of my girls go thru what I do each day. I know that not
> every auto immune disease is caused by abuse and neglect and I know
> that there is no reason for alot of suffering. Just as I know that my
> condition is caused by hearing everyday how much my mother never
> wanted me, how much she hated me, how hopeless, lazy, blah, blah, blah
> I was. I know that the suffering in my soul that my father caused by
> hitting me, swinging me around the room by my hair, and holding up
> against the wall by my throat at least weekly caused *my* condition.
> I certainly never meant to offend you or anyone else but if you
> re-read my post you will see that I referred to myself only.
> Perhaps you could be so good as to let me have my own opinion as to
> why *I* am sick.
> Please accept my apologies as sincere, I would never mean to hurt
> anyone.
> Good luck with your daughter.
>
> Michele.
>
>
>> >michele clausen wrote:
>> >
>> >> From: michele clausen <madklausen@...>
>> >>
>> >> Hi, I too have an auto-immune disease ( Rheumatoid Arthritis)
>> which I
>> firmly
>> >> believe is caused my the emotional neglect and abuse I suffered
>> as a child.
>> >>
>> >> Michele.
>> >> NZ. It is hot!
>> >>
>> >i completely agree with. i've done a lot of reading about
>> autoimmune
>> diseases and
>> >there is a lot of info that supports this idea.
>> >-susan
>>
>> brynlee@...
>>
>
susan
> Oh, Susan. I'm so very very sorry. I miscarried at 13 weeks about 1-1/2hi kim & marcie,
> years ago. It was probably related to my immune system. Fortunately, my
> lupus calmed down immediately afterward and I got pregnant again 4 months
> later. I'm very happy to say that she is now almost 4 months old
thank you and i'm glad to hear you had a normal pregnancy so soon after your
miscarriage. it's encouraging and within the time frame we are hoping for.
since i'm 40 now the midwife is suggesting that we not wait too long and has
recommended an acupuncturist who has worked with women with autoimmune disease.
> To calm my immune system down I have done several rounds of chemotherapy.what did you think of this? and why did they have you do this ?
> During pregnancy I took a baby aspirin each day, at my doctor's suggestion.I am so sorry to hear about your loss. I lost four between 9-13 weeks. We
> This
> helps a lot. Please accept my condolences. I know that it can be a crushing
> loss, even early in pregnancy. Take good care of yourself during this hard
> time. Grief often triggers an autoimmune response. Peace be with you.
> KIM
went through so much testing. The drs. came up with a slight something
indicative of lupus or arthritis or another auto-immune disorder. They sent
me to a rheumatologist and didn't come up with anything.
wow 4 miscarriages that's must have been a very difficult time for you. how is
your health now? have you had any other problems?
I took a baby aspirin a day until week 12 of my next (successful!) pregnancy. In
addition to progesterone and Clomid.
Marcie
baby aspirin, this is interesting i'll talk to both my acupuncturist and my
midwife and see what their take is.
what is clomid for?
thanks a lot,
susan
austin,tx
susan
hi,
thank you so much for share this with me. i really appreciate it, more than i
can say. family is so important to me especially since i wasn't blessed with a
loving and supportive birth family. i met my husband, who is 8 years younger
than me, when i was 34 and had rene' when i was 36. we originally wanted just
one but after a while i realized how much i really loved our family and being a
mom and want to pursue that rather than a career as a painter (at least for a
long while). so we decided to have another kid. we were just about to try,
about a week before i was to ovulate, when out of the blue i got sick and the
drs said i had still's disease. so we tried 6 months later, and i miscarried
but that was no big surprise - i was still quite sick but off meds for 3+ months
but still very laid up. so we waited, about 2 years, while i tried many
alternative treatments. i began to feel much better so we tried again and i
miscarried again. so hopefully '3's a charm':) and this acupuncturist will be
of help. though i'll be happy either way. rene' was upset because he really
wants to be a big brother but he got over it very fast. he had requested 3 sets
of twins lol. i told that perhaps he would father 3 sets of twins one day and
his dream can be fulfilled that way:) but i most certain got not grant that
request. he said that was fine and that he would be ok if he ended up an only
child. so the pressures off <g>.
thanks again,
susan,
austin, tx
p.s. nice dream i hope it becomes a reality
dwbtrhalf@... wrote:
thank you so much for share this with me. i really appreciate it, more than i
can say. family is so important to me especially since i wasn't blessed with a
loving and supportive birth family. i met my husband, who is 8 years younger
than me, when i was 34 and had rene' when i was 36. we originally wanted just
one but after a while i realized how much i really loved our family and being a
mom and want to pursue that rather than a career as a painter (at least for a
long while). so we decided to have another kid. we were just about to try,
about a week before i was to ovulate, when out of the blue i got sick and the
drs said i had still's disease. so we tried 6 months later, and i miscarried
but that was no big surprise - i was still quite sick but off meds for 3+ months
but still very laid up. so we waited, about 2 years, while i tried many
alternative treatments. i began to feel much better so we tried again and i
miscarried again. so hopefully '3's a charm':) and this acupuncturist will be
of help. though i'll be happy either way. rene' was upset because he really
wants to be a big brother but he got over it very fast. he had requested 3 sets
of twins lol. i told that perhaps he would father 3 sets of twins one day and
his dream can be fulfilled that way:) but i most certain got not grant that
request. he said that was fine and that he would be ok if he ended up an only
child. so the pressures off <g>.
thanks again,
susan,
austin, tx
p.s. nice dream i hope it becomes a reality
dwbtrhalf@... wrote:
> From: dwbtrhalf@...
>
> Hello Susan,
>
> We actually had our second two daughters after the infertility treatment.
> The Clomid and progesterone are to regulate your hormones. The baby aspirin
> to calm down whatever little problem seemed to be causing my body to reject
> the fertilized eggs. After 6 (count them, not fun!) endometrial biopsies
> while taking the hormones, and no good results, the physicians threw up their
> hands and just said go ahead and try to get pregnant, taking all this
> medication. The very next month was when I got pregnant with Carolyn, my 6
> 1/2 year old. Had a totally normal and easy pregnancy. At age 39.
>
> We thought we were done, or at least, couldn't get pregnant without medical
> assistance. Yuk yuk. At the ripe old age of 43, I had to call my husband at
> work and say, "I hope you're sitting down." My precious Annie, now nearly 3,
> is the joy of our lives. I had a totally sick nine months with her, and both
> of us almost died during the C-section. She was the only one of my three
> whom we thought we would have to leave in the hospital. Fortunately, that
> didn't happen, at the last minute. She is now the most rip-roaring two year
> old you'd ever want to meet.
>
> My husband had a vasectomy last year. For me, a baby at 43 is one thing; a
> baby at 53 would be another. My dream is to move into a sprawling farm house
> and adopt some older kids who need homes.
>
> Marcie
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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[email protected]
In a message dated 2/20/00 11:16:20 PM Eastern Standard Time,
monkeycoop@... writes:
<<
<< last monday i
miscarried at 11 weeks because of this and i was wondering if any of you had
similar problem. if so what have you done to calm your immune system down?
went through so much testing. The drs. came up with a slight something
indicative of lupus or arthritis or another auto-immune disorder. They sent
me to a rheumatologist and didn't come up with anything. I took a baby
aspirin a day until week 12 of my next (successful!) pregnancy. In addition
to progesterone and Clomid.
Marcie
monkeycoop@... writes:
<<
<< last monday i
miscarried at 11 weeks because of this and i was wondering if any of you had
similar problem. if so what have you done to calm your immune system down?
>>I am so sorry to hear about your loss. I lost four between 9-13 weeks. We
>>
went through so much testing. The drs. came up with a slight something
indicative of lupus or arthritis or another auto-immune disorder. They sent
me to a rheumatologist and didn't come up with anything. I took a baby
aspirin a day until week 12 of my next (successful!) pregnancy. In addition
to progesterone and Clomid.
Marcie
Campbell & Wyman
Aplease know it was not my intent to make such a
toxins in the digestive tract...interesting. I will read some more on that.
And I especially liked your comments about how we are develop in wonderful
and profound ways when we live with chronic illness. It certainly has
changed our lives and how we 'see' things...we appreciate the 'better' days
and try to pay more attention to the messages that come to us when we are
struggling through a 'flare up'.
And we are thankful every single day that we home educate.
Brooke
brynlee@...
>generalization but was given simply as support and acknowledgement of oneThat is OK Susan. I appreciate all your comments...esp. the ones about the
>portion of reality not the whole picture. -susan
>austin,tx
>
toxins in the digestive tract...interesting. I will read some more on that.
And I especially liked your comments about how we are develop in wonderful
and profound ways when we live with chronic illness. It certainly has
changed our lives and how we 'see' things...we appreciate the 'better' days
and try to pay more attention to the messages that come to us when we are
struggling through a 'flare up'.
And we are thankful every single day that we home educate.
Brooke
brynlee@...
[email protected]
{{{{{Susan}}}}}
Being estranged somewhat from my parents and definitely from my siblings, I
can empathize with what you must feel. My parents have done many invasive
things to me; they used to live down the street from us but moved south in
September. The distance is helping.
My mother chose to call my family physician at the beginning of my
miscarriage problems. Fortunately, he told her that it was none of her
business. And my parents lived right down the street from us, and the
confrontation was difficult. My mother did apologize to me. That was 9
years before we had the nearly family-destroying confrontation over their
50th anniversary. My mother told me that she didn't believe that I was
seeing a psychologist because I wouldn't give her her name. More control
issues.
To be honest, having a renewed faith through a new church has helped me more
than the psychologist ever did. But that's only me and my own personal
experience.
Many blessings to you,
Marcie
Being estranged somewhat from my parents and definitely from my siblings, I
can empathize with what you must feel. My parents have done many invasive
things to me; they used to live down the street from us but moved south in
September. The distance is helping.
My mother chose to call my family physician at the beginning of my
miscarriage problems. Fortunately, he told her that it was none of her
business. And my parents lived right down the street from us, and the
confrontation was difficult. My mother did apologize to me. That was 9
years before we had the nearly family-destroying confrontation over their
50th anniversary. My mother told me that she didn't believe that I was
seeing a psychologist because I wouldn't give her her name. More control
issues.
To be honest, having a renewed faith through a new church has helped me more
than the psychologist ever did. But that's only me and my own personal
experience.
Many blessings to you,
Marcie
[email protected]
Hello Susan,
We actually had our second two daughters after the infertility treatment.
The Clomid and progesterone are to regulate your hormones. The baby aspirin
to calm down whatever little problem seemed to be causing my body to reject
the fertilized eggs. After 6 (count them, not fun!) endometrial biopsies
while taking the hormones, and no good results, the physicians threw up their
hands and just said go ahead and try to get pregnant, taking all this
medication. The very next month was when I got pregnant with Carolyn, my 6
1/2 year old. Had a totally normal and easy pregnancy. At age 39.
We thought we were done, or at least, couldn't get pregnant without medical
assistance. Yuk yuk. At the ripe old age of 43, I had to call my husband at
work and say, "I hope you're sitting down." My precious Annie, now nearly 3,
is the joy of our lives. I had a totally sick nine months with her, and both
of us almost died during the C-section. She was the only one of my three
whom we thought we would have to leave in the hospital. Fortunately, that
didn't happen, at the last minute. She is now the most rip-roaring two year
old you'd ever want to meet.
My husband had a vasectomy last year. For me, a baby at 43 is one thing; a
baby at 53 would be another. My dream is to move into a sprawling farm house
and adopt some older kids who need homes.
Marcie
We actually had our second two daughters after the infertility treatment.
The Clomid and progesterone are to regulate your hormones. The baby aspirin
to calm down whatever little problem seemed to be causing my body to reject
the fertilized eggs. After 6 (count them, not fun!) endometrial biopsies
while taking the hormones, and no good results, the physicians threw up their
hands and just said go ahead and try to get pregnant, taking all this
medication. The very next month was when I got pregnant with Carolyn, my 6
1/2 year old. Had a totally normal and easy pregnancy. At age 39.
We thought we were done, or at least, couldn't get pregnant without medical
assistance. Yuk yuk. At the ripe old age of 43, I had to call my husband at
work and say, "I hope you're sitting down." My precious Annie, now nearly 3,
is the joy of our lives. I had a totally sick nine months with her, and both
of us almost died during the C-section. She was the only one of my three
whom we thought we would have to leave in the hospital. Fortunately, that
didn't happen, at the last minute. She is now the most rip-roaring two year
old you'd ever want to meet.
My husband had a vasectomy last year. For me, a baby at 43 is one thing; a
baby at 53 would be another. My dream is to move into a sprawling farm house
and adopt some older kids who need homes.
Marcie
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/21/00 2:00:33 PM Eastern Standard Time,
fxfireob@... writes:
<<
baby aspirin, this is interesting i'll talk to both my acupuncturist and my
midwife and see what their take is.
what is clomid for?
stimulating the ovaries to produce eggs.
Marcie
fxfireob@... writes:
<<
baby aspirin, this is interesting i'll talk to both my acupuncturist and my
midwife and see what their take is.
what is clomid for?
>>Sorry, I didn't answer your question. Clomid is the standard drug for
stimulating the ovaries to produce eggs.
Marcie