elfmama_2

Okay, I have somehting I just don't know how to deal with. I have 2
boys 4 and 1.5, they are both very active and love to play together.
But almost always Jaiden-the 4 year old-takes it to far. He has this
need to turn everything into a fight. I have tried talking to him and
explaining that Avery doesn't like to be hit and just wants to play,
not hit and kick and punch and pull...it just goes on and on. Jaiden
always nods his head,says yes mama and goes right back to what he is
doing. I understand that Jaiden is just playing but he is hurting
people. Jaiden has also started doing this to other people. I go to
give him a hug and I get tackled to the ground, I know it's in fun, I
ask him to stop, he says he will, but it happens again.

I don't know if I'm saying the wrong things, if there is something
more I should be doing. 6 months ago he would have been spanked, but
we stoped spanking and now I just really don't know what to do. I
want him to have fun but not at the expence of others getting hurt.
Any advice would help.

Rebecca

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/12/03 9:14:02 PM, elfmama@... writes:

<< I don't know if I'm saying the wrong things, if there is something

more I should be doing. 6 months ago he would have been spanked, but

we stoped spanking and now I just really don't know what to do. I

want him to have fun but not at the expence of others getting hurt. >>

I think a sharp and serious, "I SAID 'NO'" might help.

And walking away in a huff if he tackles you could help. Kids don't like to
see their moms walking away at that age, and it will serve to remind him that
when people have the freedom to leave, they probably WILL leave if he's not
nicer to them.

You could tell him to leave his brother entirely alone, or only play where
he's more than arm's length away until he learns to be gentle.

"Touch nice!" was what we said a lot, to and of babies, and we'd act it out.

Your older one is too old for that, probably, but it shouldn't be a
negotiable option about the baby being safe.

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/12/03 9:14:02 PM, elfmama@... writes:

<< I don't know if I'm saying the wrong things, if there is something

more I should be doing. 6 months ago he would have been spanked, but

we stoped spanking and now I just really don't know what to do. I

want him to have fun but not at the expence of others getting hurt. >>

Oh. I thought of another thing that has worked well a couple of times.

For kids old enough to discuss things, say "Why did you do that?"

"It was fun."

"Well it wasn't fun for him. Do it with a teddy bear next time, or don't do
it at all."

or

"I don't know why."

you can say "I know of some reasons you should NOT, so my reasons are better
than yours."

or
"He has my toy."

"Well give him something better and he'll probably give yours back!" (or some
other actually useful idea for resolving if there actually IS a reason)

Sandra

Mary

From: "elfmama_2" <elfmama@...>

<<Jaiden has also started doing this to other people. I go to
give him a hug and I get tackled to the ground, I know it's in fun, I
ask him to stop, he says he will, but it happens again.>>


It doesn't sound like he's mad when he does it or really wants to hurt
anyone. Is it possible that he just has some major extra energy inside
himself that he needs to get out???
Have you tried maybe having some kind of sport activity for him with other
kids doing the same thing or even him by himself at home. I punching bag or
even go outside and ride a bike or throw a ball or play tag. Something to
help with the extra energy.

My Joseph was like this when he was about 5-6. Even playing around with my
mom he would end up hurting her. So along with the explaining that everyone
doesn't think it's fun and everyone can't handle the physical part of his
playing, we got him out doing things more. Swimming or even swinging worked
on him. Plus sports camp and just one day a week at the playground to run it
off. I think some of it he just grew out of as well.

Mary B

[email protected]

>> 6 months ago he would have been spanked...

Could it be he's acting violently based on the prior incidences of being
spanked? Just a passing thought and it was the first thing that came to
mind.

JenW


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 4/13/03 12:55:26 PM, JennWeed1@... writes:

<< >> 6 months ago he would have been spanked...

Could it be he's acting violently based on the prior incidences of being
spanked? Just a passing thought and it was the first thing that came to
mind. >>

That was the first thing that popped into my head. I'd say yes to that Q.
Kids that have been spanked before, even if you stopped a long time ago,
still have a definite journey back to be close to their counterparts who were
never spanked. That journey varies on many things, some being, how long they
were spanked, how old were they when spanking began and how old they were
when it ended, what are the spanker views *to the child* ABOUT spanking now,
the reactions and words from the adult (spanker) as he's acting different
stuff out on his journey back, and maybe most important, what kind of child
is it. (As in Temperament.) (There's a GREAT book on temperament;
Understanding your child's Temperament" by William B. Carey M.D.) So, I say y
our right in thinking it came from him formally being spanked, and that you
just need to keep chugging along in your violence free and loving home, and
it will come together. It's a journey though, the ramifications of spanking
aren't just gone the day you decided to stop spanking. Lara.......

Rebecca DeLong

SandraDodd@... wrote:


<<<I think a sharp and serious, "I SAID 'NO'" might help.>>>

We do this, although we have toned down our tone, because before when ever we said it Jaiden would run and hide under his bed, and we figured that it was to sharp so we toned it down, but now it's 5-6x before he paying attention. I guess we need to try again.

<<<And walking away in a huff if he tackles you could help.>>>

I haven't tried walking away, I've tried explaining that I don't like being knocked down and I've asked him to try and remember that. I'll try walking away, thanks.

<<<Kids don't like to
see their moms walking away at that age, and it will serve to remind him that
when people have the freedom to leave, they probably WILL leave if he's not
nicer to them.>>>

This is something we've been worried about, the fact that it's extending to others, and not everybody likes to play as rough as him and they will not want to play with him. We've tried talking to him about it, and he says he understands, but in the moment he just gets to rough.

<<<You could tell him to leave his brother entirely alone, or only play where
he's more than arm's length away until he learns to be gentle>>>

There have been times when we've told Jaiden to leave Avery alone, but, Avery's almost 2 and likes to play with Jaiden, the problem seems to be that, Jaiden doesn't pay attention to Averys limits and goes beyond and ends up to rough and Avery gets hurt.

Any ideas on helping Jaiden to see others limits?

Rebecca




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Rebecca DeLong

These are all great, thank you, I'll try them.
Rebecca
SandraDodd@... wrote:
Oh. I thought of another thing that has worked well a couple of times.

For kids old enough to discuss things, say "Why did you do that?"

"It was fun."

"Well it wasn't fun for him. Do it with a teddy bear next time, or don't do
it at all."

or

"I don't know why."

you can say "I know of some reasons you should NOT, so my reasons are better
than yours."

or
"He has my toy."

"Well give him something better and he'll probably give yours back!" (or some
other actually useful idea for resolving if there actually IS a reason)

Sandra

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Rebecca DeLong

Mary <mummy124@...> wrote:


<<<It doesn't sound like he's mad when he does it or really wants to hurt
anyone.>>>

No, he's not mad, he's playing, he just get really rough. Jason and I were talking about this last night. JAiden loves to play, wrestling, rough housing, but he gets carried away int he moment, and someone gets hurt. Also, when he's asked to stop of to calm it down, he's having so much fun that he doesn't want to stop, so he doesn't, and thats a problem, people are getting angry.

<<<Is it possible that he just has some major extra energy inside
himself that he needs to get out???>>>

I think that is deffienatly part of it.


<<<Have you tried maybe having some kind of sport activity for him with other
kids doing the same thing or even him by himself at home.>>>

He really wants to start karate, but we've been told that he has to be 6 or they won't take him. He plays tag sometimes with some of the kids in our complex, but they change the rules so that he is always it. He doesn't really like sports, he says it's not nice that someone always looses.

<<<A punching bag or
even go outside and ride a bike or throw a ball or play tag. Something to
help with the extra energy.>>>

He rides his bike, scooter, and skateboard everyday. We go to the park 2-3x a week with some friends. And we walk everywere, we don't have a car. But he needs more, I just don't know how to help him.

<<<My Joseph was like this when he was about 5-6. Even playing around with my
mom he would end up hurting her. So along with the explaining that everyone
doesn't think it's fun and everyone can't handle the physical part of his
playing, we got him out doing things more. Swimming or even swinging worked
on him. Plus sports camp and just one day a week at the playground to run it
off. I think some of it he just grew out of as well.>>>

Sounds just like Jaiden. Nice to know it my not be forever.

Rebecca





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Rebecca DeLong

JennWeed1@... wrote:
<<<Could it be he's acting violently based on the prior incidences of being
spanked? Just a passing thought and it was the first thing that came to
mind.>>>

I've wondered this too, but he has always been very physical. i do think his reactions to being asked to stop are related to his being spanked, and we knew that would be part of the healing process, and give him the space that he needs.

I honestly think so much of it is his age and just him needing to be physical, I just am having trouble with him,understanding that not everybody has his need and that he has to respect other peoples boundries and limits.

Rebecca

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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the_clevengers

--- In [email protected], Rebecca DeLong
<elfmama@s...> wrote:
> I haven't tried walking away, I've tried explaining that I don't
like being knocked down and I've asked him to try and remember that.
I'll try walking away, thanks.

> This is something we've been worried about, the fact that it's
extending to others, and not everybody likes to play as rough as him
and they will not want to play with him. We've tried talking to him
about it, and he says he understands, but in the moment he just gets
to rough.>>>

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but some kids are extremely
sensory-seeking. This can be related to all kinds of things - diet,
basic brain wiring, environmental influences, etc. There are all
kinds of things you can do to help him get his needs for sensory
input met. Do a Google serach on "sensory integration" and you'll
find a lot of information. I also like the book "The Out-Of-Sync
Child" (don't let the title throw you off), which completely
explains sensory integration.

For my son, if he has dairy at all in any form, he gets extremely
sensory-seeking. He will literally run around the house crashing
into walls, people, furniture. It's like his body feels
disorganized, and the only way he can make it feel better is to have
serious sensory input. Obviously, he doesn't eat dairy anymore
unless he accidentally gets it. But he can become sensory-seeking in
a milder incarnation if he gets stressed or overtired or hungry or
is in a situation in which he feels nervous. Often he will come up
and bump or crash into me. Now that I've recognized this for what it
is, I can offer him a deep squeezing hug as much as he needs, and
this really seems to help. I'll just ask "Do you need a squeezy
hug?" and usually he'll say yes. I think it was really important for
me to move beyond *reacting* to what he's doing and to be proactive
about helping him with what his body is needing at the time. Sensory-
seeking kids can have a very hard time being around smaller or more
fragile kids, because they sometimes are not able to effectively
limit how much contact their body gives out. Not sure if this is the
case with your kid, but thought I'd throw this out in case it helps.

Blue Skies,
-Robin-

Tia Leschke

>
> No, he's not mad, he's playing, he just get really rough. Jason and I were
talking about this last night. JAiden loves to play, wrestling, rough
housing, but he gets >carried away int he moment, and someone gets hurt.
Also, when he's asked to stop of to calm it down, he's having so much fun
that he doesn't want to stop, so he >doesn't, and thats a problem, people
are getting angry.

This is really a common problem. My boys were both like this. Even the
girls were, but with words. They just keep on pushing, long after the fun
is gone. One thing that can help is to watch for when it's getting *close*
to the point where it's over the edge and saying something then. "You're
really having fun with that, aren't you. Remember that sometimes it goes
past the point of fun. Then the other person gets mad at you." Sometimes
that helps.

> He really wants to start karate, but we've been told that he has to be 6
or they won't take him. He plays tag sometimes with some of the kids in our
complex, but >they change the rules so that he is always it. He doesn't
really like sports, he says it's not nice that someone always looses.

He might like an individual sport like gymnastics. I know they can start
that pretty young.
>
>
> He rides his bike, scooter, and skateboard everyday. We go to the park
2-3x a week with some friends. And we walk everywere, we don't have a car.
But he >needs more, I just don't know how to help him.

Maybe he would like something like racing against a stopwatch in order to
better his time, something where he's just competing against himself but
really pushing.
Tia

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
saftety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Ben Franklin
leschke@...

Rebecca DeLong

the_clevengers <diamondair@...> wrote:


<<<I don't know if this has been mentioned, but some kids are extremely
sensory-seeking. This can be related to all kinds of things - diet,
basic brain wiring, environmental influences, etc. There are all
kinds of things you can do to help him get his needs for sensory
input met. Do a Google serach on "sensory integration" and you'll
find a lot of information. I also like the book "The Out-Of-Sync
Child" (don't let the title throw you off), which completely
explains sensory integration.>>>

Thank you for this idea, I've seen the book at the library, I'll put it on my list.

<<<I think it was really important for
me to move beyond *reacting* to what he's doing and to be proactive
about helping him with what his body is needing at the time. Sensory-
seeking kids can have a very hard time being around smaller or more
fragile kids, because they sometimes are not able to effectively
limit how much contact their body gives out. Not sure if this is the
case with your kid, but thought I'd throw this out in case it helps.>>>

Jason and I have been talking about the best way to deal with this, to give Jaiden what he needs without hurting and making others angry. It's hard, because I'm not entirely sure what it is that Jaiden needs.

Rebecca







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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

zenmomma *

>>>I don't know if this has been mentioned, but some kids are extremely
sensory-seeking.>>

Good point, Robin!

>>But he can become sensory-seeking in a milder incarnation if he gets
>>stressed or overtired or hungry or is in a situation in which he feels
>>nervous. Often he will come up and bump or crash into me. Now that I've
>>recognized this for what it is, I can offer him a deep squeezing hug as
>>much as he needs, and this really seems to help.>>

A good, steady sensory diet can help ward off these intensities, too. That
just means making sure your child gets regular movement opportunities
throughout the day. All movement is good, but make sure they're getting
enough of the kinds they seem to crave.

If he's bumping into people, you could get him a trampoline or mattress to
slam into. It they hang on you or their siblings more than is comfortable,
they may just want sensory input to their upper body. Hanging at the park
could help. Hugs and squeezes, spinning, swinging are all senory meovements
that could help prevent a breakdown or incident later on.

Life is good.
~Mary

"The miracle is not to walk on water. The miracle is to walk on the green
earth, dwelling deeply in the present moment and feeling truly alive."

~ Thich Nhat Hanh



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