Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Community was Re: Dealing with doubts
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/5/03 11:33:27 PM, sheran@... writes:
<< how important is
that kind of community to human development. If we don't have it
naturally, should we try to create it? >>
By encouraging their children to play, unschoolers are coming closer than
anyone else.
People running private schools have a financial stake in making parents feel
they're doing something "natural" by spending big bucks to have their kids
away for many hours, many days. Nobody running a private school is likely to
say "No, this is just a poor excuse for an enriched life, and you can do it
at home for free."
As kids get older, and parents give them more freedom, they'll do what kids
do in the early 21st century. They can't do what kids did in 1950, or 1930.
That's gone.
I think one of the most counterproductive things people can do is pine for
the good old days, instead of finding the joy in today.
Just about every sect or philosophy that pushes for "getting back to..." some
time or other is glorifying a time when the people of that time were wanting
to "get back to" some 70 or a hundred years before THAT. The Amish are stuck
in a time; nuns dress like they're living in the Middle Ages, sometimes, if
their order was founded then. Hippies wanted to live like pioneers. Some
kids now want to live like 1970's hippies.
Some kids went to play because their families were sadistic and they hid out
elsewhere when they could, or their moms told them to go away and not come
home until supper. I have a friend whose mom did that in the 1960's. "GO
PLAY," by which she meant "be elsewhere and do not be here" on any days he
wasn't in school.
I think idealizing other times and places is likely to give a sugared
version. But I DO think playing is totally important, and I think
unschooling families should try as much as they can to find other families,
neighbors, friends who can be at their house as much as possible, and other
places for their kids to be--with other families in other houses, visiting to
the point that they're not treated like company.
Sandra
<< how important is
that kind of community to human development. If we don't have it
naturally, should we try to create it? >>
By encouraging their children to play, unschoolers are coming closer than
anyone else.
People running private schools have a financial stake in making parents feel
they're doing something "natural" by spending big bucks to have their kids
away for many hours, many days. Nobody running a private school is likely to
say "No, this is just a poor excuse for an enriched life, and you can do it
at home for free."
As kids get older, and parents give them more freedom, they'll do what kids
do in the early 21st century. They can't do what kids did in 1950, or 1930.
That's gone.
I think one of the most counterproductive things people can do is pine for
the good old days, instead of finding the joy in today.
Just about every sect or philosophy that pushes for "getting back to..." some
time or other is glorifying a time when the people of that time were wanting
to "get back to" some 70 or a hundred years before THAT. The Amish are stuck
in a time; nuns dress like they're living in the Middle Ages, sometimes, if
their order was founded then. Hippies wanted to live like pioneers. Some
kids now want to live like 1970's hippies.
Some kids went to play because their families were sadistic and they hid out
elsewhere when they could, or their moms told them to go away and not come
home until supper. I have a friend whose mom did that in the 1960's. "GO
PLAY," by which she meant "be elsewhere and do not be here" on any days he
wasn't in school.
I think idealizing other times and places is likely to give a sugared
version. But I DO think playing is totally important, and I think
unschooling families should try as much as they can to find other families,
neighbors, friends who can be at their house as much as possible, and other
places for their kids to be--with other families in other houses, visiting to
the point that they're not treated like company.
Sandra
kayb85 <[email protected]>
Sandra,
How did you get so WISE?! Darn, you're good! :) Your insight is
always remarkable.
Sheila
How did you get so WISE?! Darn, you're good! :) Your insight is
always remarkable.
Sheila
--- In [email protected], SandraDodd@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 1/5/03 11:33:27 PM, sheran@p... writes:
>
> << how important is
> that kind of community to human development. If we don't have it
> naturally, should we try to create it? >>
>
> By encouraging their children to play, unschoolers are coming
closer than
> anyone else.
>
> People running private schools have a financial stake in making
parents feel
> they're doing something "natural" by spending big bucks to have
their kids
> away for many hours, many days. Nobody running a private school is
likely to
> say "No, this is just a poor excuse for an enriched life, and you
can do it
> at home for free."
>
> As kids get older, and parents give them more freedom, they'll do
what kids
> do in the early 21st century. They can't do what kids did in
1950, or 1930.
> That's gone.
>
> I think one of the most counterproductive things people can do is
pine for
> the good old days, instead of finding the joy in today.
>
> Just about every sect or philosophy that pushes for "getting back
to..." some
> time or other is glorifying a time when the people of that time
were wanting
> to "get back to" some 70 or a hundred years before THAT. The Amish
are stuck
> in a time; nuns dress like they're living in the Middle Ages,
sometimes, if
> their order was founded then. Hippies wanted to live like
pioneers. Some
> kids now want to live like 1970's hippies.
>
> Some kids went to play because their families were sadistic and
they hid out
> elsewhere when they could, or their moms told them to go away and
not come
> home until supper. I have a friend whose mom did that in the
1960's. "GO
> PLAY," by which she meant "be elsewhere and do not be here" on any
days he
> wasn't in school.
>
> I think idealizing other times and places is likely to give a
sugared
> version. But I DO think playing is totally important, and I think
> unschooling families should try as much as they can to find other
families,
> neighbors, friends who can be at their house as much as possible,
and other
> places for their kids to be--with other families in other houses,
visiting to
> the point that they're not treated like company.
>
> Sandra
Deborah Lewis
On Mon, 06 Jan 2003 06:32:50 -0000 "kayb85 <sheran@...>"
<sheran@...> writes:
***One argument a Sudbury guy made was that it used to be
that it was common for kids to leave their house during the day and
run around the village to play and create their own world apart from
the adults.***
My aunt was born in 1917 the oldest of about six hundred siblings. They
were required to get up early, do their chores, bring in water from the
spring, milk cows, etc, and then they were sent outside. That was it.
Go outside. Their mom just had too much to do to have that many kids
running around the house all day.
Their mom was also a midwife and sometimes when they woke up in the
morning she wouldn't be there. If their dad was off working, setting or
checking trap lines, and she got called to a birth, she would go and
expect her kids to fend for themselves for two or three days sometimes.
My mom remembers crying and wondering if they would be alone forever.
I'm with Sandra on this. The people who pine for how it used to be are
seldom the people who had to live through how it used to be.
Deb L
<sheran@...> writes:
***One argument a Sudbury guy made was that it used to be
that it was common for kids to leave their house during the day and
run around the village to play and create their own world apart from
the adults.***
My aunt was born in 1917 the oldest of about six hundred siblings. They
were required to get up early, do their chores, bring in water from the
spring, milk cows, etc, and then they were sent outside. That was it.
Go outside. Their mom just had too much to do to have that many kids
running around the house all day.
Their mom was also a midwife and sometimes when they woke up in the
morning she wouldn't be there. If their dad was off working, setting or
checking trap lines, and she got called to a birth, she would go and
expect her kids to fend for themselves for two or three days sometimes.
My mom remembers crying and wondering if they would be alone forever.
I'm with Sandra on this. The people who pine for how it used to be are
seldom the people who had to live through how it used to be.
Deb L
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/7/03 11:36:47 PM, ddzimlew@... writes:
<< My mom remembers crying and wondering if they would be alone forever.
<<I'm with Sandra on this. The people who pine for how it used to be are
seldom the people who had to live through how it used to be. >>
There are people who even pine for the 1950's! YIKES.
Yes, the war was over. Yes, lots of people had new cars and houses.
Kids' clothes were awful. Bikes were pretty crummy. Television was in black
and white...
But socially, it was not glorious.
Keith said one of the humor shows Saturday had a sketch about a 50's diner,
and two couples go in and they won't serve the black couple, as part of their
'50's ambiance. And they wouldn't serve diet coke because it hadn't been
invented. I'm sorry I missed it. Women were treated very badly then too.
And their clothes were pretty awful too (except maybe rich women). Too-tight
shoes, deformed toes, awful cotton bras made kinda like pointy pot-holders,
hooks and eyes on skirts, everything having to be starched and ironed, women
expected to wear curlers EVERY night or else all day. People eating
breaded-pan-fried, deep-fried, jello-salad everything.
Sandra
<< My mom remembers crying and wondering if they would be alone forever.
<<I'm with Sandra on this. The people who pine for how it used to be are
seldom the people who had to live through how it used to be. >>
There are people who even pine for the 1950's! YIKES.
Yes, the war was over. Yes, lots of people had new cars and houses.
Kids' clothes were awful. Bikes were pretty crummy. Television was in black
and white...
But socially, it was not glorious.
Keith said one of the humor shows Saturday had a sketch about a 50's diner,
and two couples go in and they won't serve the black couple, as part of their
'50's ambiance. And they wouldn't serve diet coke because it hadn't been
invented. I'm sorry I missed it. Women were treated very badly then too.
And their clothes were pretty awful too (except maybe rich women). Too-tight
shoes, deformed toes, awful cotton bras made kinda like pointy pot-holders,
hooks and eyes on skirts, everything having to be starched and ironed, women
expected to wear curlers EVERY night or else all day. People eating
breaded-pan-fried, deep-fried, jello-salad everything.
Sandra
Kelli Traaseth
Sandra wrote:
There are people who even pine for the 1950's! YIKES.
Yes, the war was over. Yes, lots of people had new cars and houses.
Kids' clothes were awful. Bikes were pretty crummy. Television was in black
and white...
But socially, it was not glorious.
Keith said one of the humor shows Saturday had a sketch about a 50's diner,
and two couples go in and they won't serve the black couple, as part of their
'50's ambiance. And they wouldn't serve diet coke because it hadn't been
invented. I'm sorry I missed it. Women were treated very badly then too.
And their clothes were pretty awful too (except maybe rich women). Too-tight
shoes, deformed toes, awful cotton bras made kinda like pointy pot-holders,
hooks and eyes on skirts, everything having to be starched and ironed, women
expected to wear curlers EVERY night or else all day. People eating
breaded-pan-fried, deep-fried, jello-salad everything.
Yuck,
reminds me of Pleasantville, had some good talks with my daughter about the ideas in that movie. I thought it was kind-of dumb at first, but then it kind-of came around. Anyone else see is?
Kelli
SandraDodd@... wrote:
In a message dated 1/7/03 11:36:47 PM, ddzimlew@... writes:
<< My mom remembers crying and wondering if they would be alone forever.
<<I'm with Sandra on this. The people who pine for how it used to be are
seldom the people who had to live through how it used to be. >>
There are people who even pine for the 1950's! YIKES.
Yes, the war was over. Yes, lots of people had new cars and houses.
Kids' clothes were awful. Bikes were pretty crummy. Television was in black
and white...
But socially, it was not glorious.
Keith said one of the humor shows Saturday had a sketch about a 50's diner,
and two couples go in and they won't serve the black couple, as part of their
'50's ambiance. And they wouldn't serve diet coke because it hadn't been
invented. I'm sorry I missed it. Women were treated very badly then too.
And their clothes were pretty awful too (except maybe rich women). Too-tight
shoes, deformed toes, awful cotton bras made kinda like pointy pot-holders,
hooks and eyes on skirts, everything having to be starched and ironed, women
expected to wear curlers EVERY night or else all day. People eating
breaded-pan-fried, deep-fried, jello-salad everything.
Sandra
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
There are people who even pine for the 1950's! YIKES.
Yes, the war was over. Yes, lots of people had new cars and houses.
Kids' clothes were awful. Bikes were pretty crummy. Television was in black
and white...
But socially, it was not glorious.
Keith said one of the humor shows Saturday had a sketch about a 50's diner,
and two couples go in and they won't serve the black couple, as part of their
'50's ambiance. And they wouldn't serve diet coke because it hadn't been
invented. I'm sorry I missed it. Women were treated very badly then too.
And their clothes were pretty awful too (except maybe rich women). Too-tight
shoes, deformed toes, awful cotton bras made kinda like pointy pot-holders,
hooks and eyes on skirts, everything having to be starched and ironed, women
expected to wear curlers EVERY night or else all day. People eating
breaded-pan-fried, deep-fried, jello-salad everything.
Yuck,
reminds me of Pleasantville, had some good talks with my daughter about the ideas in that movie. I thought it was kind-of dumb at first, but then it kind-of came around. Anyone else see is?
Kelli
SandraDodd@... wrote:
In a message dated 1/7/03 11:36:47 PM, ddzimlew@... writes:
<< My mom remembers crying and wondering if they would be alone forever.
<<I'm with Sandra on this. The people who pine for how it used to be are
seldom the people who had to live through how it used to be. >>
There are people who even pine for the 1950's! YIKES.
Yes, the war was over. Yes, lots of people had new cars and houses.
Kids' clothes were awful. Bikes were pretty crummy. Television was in black
and white...
But socially, it was not glorious.
Keith said one of the humor shows Saturday had a sketch about a 50's diner,
and two couples go in and they won't serve the black couple, as part of their
'50's ambiance. And they wouldn't serve diet coke because it hadn't been
invented. I'm sorry I missed it. Women were treated very badly then too.
And their clothes were pretty awful too (except maybe rich women). Too-tight
shoes, deformed toes, awful cotton bras made kinda like pointy pot-holders,
hooks and eyes on skirts, everything having to be starched and ironed, women
expected to wear curlers EVERY night or else all day. People eating
breaded-pan-fried, deep-fried, jello-salad everything.
Sandra
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
[email protected]
Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Come forth into the light of things, let Nature be your teacher.
William Wordsworth
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]