[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 7:31:44 AM Central Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

<< So, she only read part of the post then responded? >>

No Teresa, the first post did not indicate or hint at a solution, it just
talked about how she shouldn't have to give up what she needed for the childs
persistance on pancakes.
But later, she described the actual scene.
We can only go on the information given at the time.
Please quite being so angry, it is harming the flow of conversation.

Ren
"Knowledge will not always take the place of simple observation."
~Arnold Lobel
Unschooling support at pensacolaunschoolers.com

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 10:54:35 AM Eastern Standard Time,
starsuncloud@... writes:

> Please quite being so angry, it is harming the flow of conversation.
>
> Ren
>

I am angry. Is anger not a viable emotion? When words are twisted,
implications and accusations made without forethought or consideration for
others, it makes me angry. I could go back and cut and paste the entire
thread of who said what. But, it doesnt matter. Someone could post in big
block letters.. TERESA IS A HATEFUL, VINDICITIVE PERSON WHO DOES NOT CARE
ABOUT HER CHILDRENS NEEDS . SHE IS ARROGANT AND DISTRUPTIVE. They could
sign their name to it and say BECAUSE I SAID SO. And other folks would say
it was general statment made to "help" and not aimed at anyone in
particular. I wont apologize for harming your flow of conversation. You
are acting like middle schoolers.. Hey, we dont like you and we cant talk
about what we like, so get out of here. Name calling and exclusion is an
immature action as well.

AND I am angry because things are taken out of context.

You sad
No Teresa, the first post did not indicate or hint at a solution, it just
talked about how she shouldn't have to give up what she needed for the childs

persistance on pancakes.
But later, she described the actual scene.
We can only go on the information given at the time

I am the "she" that wrote the post about the pancakes!!.. It was all in one
post .. from beginning to end. Did you happen to read it? If you did. then
you would know that I told the whole event in one post. Elissa replied in
one tone, then after reading Joyces response, she came back and tried to make
nice. Where is the confusion in that???

Teresa


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[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 10:48:16 AM, grlynbl@... writes:

<< I am angry. Is anger not a viable emotion? >>

It's not helpful for you to make the list about you instead of about
unschooling.

<< I wont apologize for harming your flow of conversation. You
are acting like middle schoolers.. >>

Stop, please.

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 12:47:52 PM Eastern Standard Time,
grlynbl@... writes:

> Elissa replied in
> one tone, then after reading Joyces response, she came back and tried to
> make
> nice. Where is the confusion in that???
>
> Teresa
>
>
>

No I didn't. I explained that more than once. You are obviously going to
believe what you want. SO let's just stop it. Let's not telk about each other
at all. Let's let it go.
Elissa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Denese Kolb

Stop, please.

Sandra

I would like to second that.
I am brand new to unschooling and very excited about learning all I can.
This arguing is a pointless waste of time.
Denese
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Stephanie Elms

> But, it doesnt matter. Someone
> could post in big
> block letters.. TERESA IS A HATEFUL, VINDICITIVE PERSON WHO
> DOES NOT CARE
> ABOUT HER CHILDRENS NEEDS . SHE IS ARROGANT AND DISTRUPTIVE.
> They could
> sign their name to it and say BECAUSE I SAID SO. And other
> folks would say
> it was general statment made to "help" and not aimed at anyone in
> particular. I wont apologize for harming your flow of

Teresa...I am by no means an old timer here. I started reading somewhere around
Sept or Oct. I consider myself an extremely relaxed parent...not controlling
at all. My parents think that I do not have enough discipline with my kids
and most of my friends can not believe what I "let my kids get away with". But I
came here and read posts about not controlling junk food that their kids eat,
not controlling tv their kids watch, about seeing things from the kids point of
view and not making decisions for my kids "because I am the parent". I started
getting ticked off, because here I was, this great relaxed parent and they were
saying that things that I did were "controlling".

But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that they were just pointing
out the truth...limiting junk food *is* controlling what my kids eat, limiting tv
*is* controlling what my kids watch, telling my kids that they can't have/do something
until they do what I want *is* disrespectful. Does that mean that I am some
terrible, controlling parent who never respects my children? No. There are
lots of areas where I am great at seeing my kids point of view. They do have a lot
of freedom (especially when compared with some of my friends). BUT what I have
found by listening here is that there are even more areas where I can give my kids
freedom and control and not have wild unmanageable kids. This is the only place that I
hear that...mainstream parenting is full of dire warnings, my friends and even my
family keep telling me that I *have* to do things a certain way. It is so refreshing
to hear what Joyce and Sandra and Ren and others are saying. That there is another
level of parenting where you can see yourself as a partner with your children rather
then as a gatekeeper. This one concept has improved so many of my interactions with my
kids. I do not feel that I have to take the advice given and do it 100%. But it does
get me thinking about options that I might not have thought about. There are still
areas where I control my kids more then some here, but right now it is working and
when it doesn't, I know I can do differently. But I am also not going to come on
this list and try to convince them (or anyone else) that in these areas I am right
and they are wrong.

I can see where you can feel jumped on, you offer something that works for you and
people here say that it is not the best way. It is easy to translate that into
people saying that you are not a good parent. But that is NOT what they said.
Since then, some things have gotten personal and heated and that is a shame.
And Joyce has been doing her best to explain where the disconnects are happening,
with possible explanations as to why and handling things off list when needed. You can
believe or not believe her when she says that no one has said that you are this
horrible parent.

Just my 2 cents as a relative newbie who has gone from being ticked off to
learning a lot.

Stephanie E.

Stephanie Elms

> I am brand new to unschooling and very excited about learning
> all I can.
> This arguing is a pointless waste of time.

I agree with you about the personal arguing, but on the other hand, sometimes these
debates result in the best in depth posts about unschooling (just check out
the last 3 or 4 from Joyce!).

Don't let these heated exchanges deter you, they do pop up now and again, but
the things that you will learn on this list are amazing!

Welcome!

Stephanie E.

Denese Kolb

I agree with you about the personal arguing, but on the other hand, sometimes these
debates result in the best in depth posts about unschooling (just check out
the last 3 or 4 from Joyce!).

Don't let these heated exchanges deter you, they do pop up now and again, but
the things that you will learn on this list are amazing!

Welcome!

Stephanie E.

Thank you Stephanie. I love a good, loud exchange of ideas as much as the next guy. But, I think it has dissolved into something far less than that here.
There is nothing like a debate to clarify your own ideas and beliefs. Mudslinging and name calling are another matter.
I'll be sticking around, I like it here.
I am afraid I'm going to delete something worthwhile as I am flying past all the bickering <G>
Denese

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To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
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