[email protected]

Here's something from a few weeks back. I took out the name of the person,
but it's a homeschooler in New Mexico. I'm bringing this because of the
question of whether everything labelled unschooling is equally valid. I
think there's a continuum along which people move as far as they're
comfortable, and sometimes it takes examples or pointed questions for them to
see how to move a little further along.

Over eleven years of homeschooling, I've seen hundreds of families move from
structure to less structure and GUSH about how thrilled they were. I've seen
a few (a couple of dozen) families move from what they claim was unschooling
to go toward structure. And on closer examination, when they would allow it,
it seemed they didn't really get unschooling, or somehow it never took at
their house. (Because they didn't relax? Because they didnt' believe it was
going to work? Because they couldn't stop the background noise of their
relatives saying "When are you doing to TEACH them things"?)

Anyway, here's an exmple:



Subj: Thank You
Date: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 1:22:10 PM
From:
To: SandraDodd@...


Hi Sandra –



I attended a forum at the Rio Grande Homeschooling conference where you spoke
about unschooling.


I have to tell you that I thought it was a crock at the time. I believed
that the only way to truly teach a child was to make them do worksheets,
drill and repetition. Since hearing you speak, my husband and I have
discussed our approach to teaching many times. I was slowly starting to
realize the benefits of an unschooling approach. Reading an article by
Daniel Quinn (link below) was the last straw.



I’m not ready to throw away all of my curriculum, but I am definitely making
the move toward a more relaxed, child led style. I’m going to see myself
much more as a nurturer of Connor’s love of reading and learning, rather
than an instructor.

I thank you (and my kids would too, if they knew) for your inspiration.



You’ve probably already seen this – but here’s the link to Daniel Quinn’s
article. I don’t agree with all of his ideas. Most are probably truer
than I’m willing to admit.


www.ishmael.org/education/writings/unschooling.shtml


Thanks again,

Betsy

**
Here's something from a few weeks back. I took out the name of the
person,
but it's a homeschooler in New Mexico. I'm bringing this because of the
question of whether everything labelled unschooling is equally valid. I
think there's a continuum along which people move as far as they're
comfortable, and sometimes it takes examples or pointed questions for
them to
see how to move a little further along. **


I have the strange notion that maybe we should make a party game out of
this and cheerfully tell people "you're getting warmer" and "you're
getting cold".

I wonder if that would be any easier to take. It might make the
feedback less disturbing... but sometimes the goal IS to disturb people
and shake them out of their existing patterns.

Betsy

[email protected]

Betsy <ecsamhill@...> wrote:

>
>
>**
>Here's something from a few weeks back.nbsp; I took out the name of the
>person,
>but it's a homeschooler in New Mexico.nbsp; I'm bringing this because of the
>question of whether everything labelled unschooling is equally valid.nbsp; I
>think there's a continuum along which people move as far as they're
>comfortable, and sometimes it takes examples or pointed questions for
>them to
>see how to move a little further along.nbsp; **
>
>
>I have the strange notion that maybe we should make a party game out of
>this and cheerfully tell people quot;you're getting warmerquot; and quot;you're
>getting coldquot;.
>
>I wonder if that would be any easier to take.nbsp; It might make the
>feedback less disturbing... but sometimes the goal IS to disturb people
>and shake them out of their existing patterns.
>
>Betsy<<

I would find it disheartening to be the object of that kind of thinking and behavior....Am I misreading your intent?

Robin S.
>
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kayb85 <[email protected]>

--- In [email protected], robin9700@c... wrote:
> Betsy <ecsamhill@e...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >**
> >Here's something from a few weeks back.nbsp; I took out the name
of the
> >person,
> >but it's a homeschooler in New Mexico.nbsp; I'm bringing this
because of the
> >question of whether everything labelled unschooling is equally
valid.nbsp; I
> >think there's a continuum along which people move as far as
they're
> >comfortable, and sometimes it takes examples or pointed questions
for
> >them to
> >see how to move a little further along.nbsp; **
> >
> >
> >I have the strange notion that maybe we should make a party game
out of
> >this and cheerfully tell people quot;you're getting warmerquot;
and quot;you're
> >getting coldquot;.
> >
> >I wonder if that would be any easier to take.nbsp; It might make
the
> >feedback less disturbing... but sometimes the goal IS to disturb
people
> >and shake them out of their existing patterns.
> >
> >Betsy<<
>
> I would find it disheartening to be the object of that kind of
thinking and behavior....Am I misreading your intent?
>
> Robin S.

Did you ever experience a paradigm shift? Did you ever travel from
one way of thinking to a new way of thinking? What did it take for
you to move to being an unschooler? For me, my thinking had to be
disturbed and shook up.

Sheila

Betsy

**
I would find it disheartening to be the object of that kind of thinking
and behavior....Am I misreading your
intent? **

I don't know.

Was it the childishness you objected to or the directionality?

Betsy

[email protected]

"kayb85 <sheran@...>" <sheran@...> wrote:
>Did you ever experience a paradigm shift?nbsp; Did you ever travel from
>one way of thinking to a new way of thinking?nbsp; What did it take for
>you to move to being an unschooler?nbsp; For me, my thinking had to be
>disturbed and shook up.nbsp;
>
>Sheila<<

For you.

Robin S.
>
>
> ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
>
>If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
>[email protected]
>
>Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
>
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>

kayb85 <[email protected]>

--- In [email protected], robin9700@c... wrote:
> "kayb85 <sheran@p...>" <sheran@p...> wrote:
> >Did you ever experience a paradigm shift?nbsp; Did you ever travel
from
> >one way of thinking to a new way of thinking?nbsp; What did it
take for
> >you to move to being an unschooler?nbsp; For me, my thinking had
to be
> >disturbed and shook up.nbsp;
> >
> >Sheila<<
>
> For you.
>
> Robin S.

What did it take to you to accept the ideas of unschooling?
Sheila

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/15/02 10:10:37 PM, robin9700@... writes:

<< >Did you ever experience a paradigm shift?nbsp; Did you ever travel from
>one way of thinking to a new way of thinking?nbsp; What did it take for
>you to move to being an unschooler?nbsp; For me, my thinking had to be
>disturbed and shook up.nbsp;
>
>Sheila<<

For you.

Robin S. >>

She said, "For me."

The implication seems to be (and we've had people come and say this before)
that you had a paradigm shift to unschooling with no change in what you had
believed before, no revision of your practices or beliefs.

Describing how you came to unschooling and what it's like for your family
would be really helpful. Suggesting that those who are here are just vaguely
wrong isn't so helpful.

Sandra

[email protected]

"kayb85 <sheran@...>" <sheran@...> wrote:

> --- In [email protected], robin9700@c... wrote:
>gt; quot;kayb85 lt;[email protected];quot; lt;[email protected]; wrote:
>gt; gt;Did you ever experience a paradigm shift?nbsp; Did you ever travel
>from
>gt; gt;one way of thinking to a new way of thinking?nbsp; What did it
>take for
>gt; gt;you to move to being an unschooler?nbsp; For me, my thinking had
>to be
>gt; gt;disturbed and shook up.nbsp;
>gt; gt;
>gt; gt;Sheilalt;lt;
>gt;
>gt; For you.nbsp;
>gt;
>gt; Robin S.
>
>What did it take to you to accept the ideas of unschooling?
>Sheila<<

Life, expereinces, being raised in an alcoholic home, therapy, reading John Bradshaw, reading Alice Miller, attending ACOA, Alanon, being raised a fundamentalist,being shamed, being slapped for speaking my mind and my feelings, being suppressed and repressed for the needs of others, reading Leo Buscaglia and Hugh Prather and Gary Zukov, having children, feeling n=my babies be born, nusring, Laleache League, looking nto the eyes of my children, being called "mommy," being validated by that witness that Alice Miller talks about, taoism, SARK, TCS, John Holt, Naomi Aldort, www.natural child.com, Dr. Sears, reading reading reading a library of books about being, feeling loved (finally) and validated as a person ....

I didn't need to accept; I was led to where I am by my desire to be FREE and by the graciousness of poeple who were willing to share their truth.

Robin S.
>
>
> ~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~
>
>If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
>[email protected]
>
>Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 12:15:21 AM Eastern Standard Time,
sheran@... writes:
> --- In [email protected], robin9700@c... wrote:
> >"kayb85 <sheran@p...>" <sheran@p...> wrote:
> >>Did you ever experience a paradigm shift?nbsp; Did you ever travel
> from
> >>one way of thinking to a new way of thinking?nbsp; What did it
> take for
> >>you to move to being an unschooler?nbsp; For me, my thinking had
> to be
> >>disturbed and shook up.nbsp;
> >>
> >>Sheila<<
> >
> >For you.
> >
> >Robin S.
>
> What did it take to you to accept the ideas of unschooling?
> Sheila<<


Being raised in an alcoholic family, John Bradshaw, Alice Miller, therapy,
being raised a fundamentalist, being shamed, being repressed and supressed,
being validated by that witness that ALice Miller talks about, ALANON, ACOA,
Leo Buscaglia, Gary Zukov, Taoism, SARK, having children, constantly looking
into their eyes and hearing their sweet voices, feeling mybabies be born,
nursing, Laleache LEague, Dr. Sears, being slapped for speaking my mind and
my feelings, being abandoned and emotionally abused, being the first
born,,,the caretaker, feeling the pain from not beoingheld as a
child...feeling my past.....

I want my children to be FREE. I want more than anything to honor their
existance and way of being. I carry this quote from a girl named Michelle
(committed suicide) as quoted in one of Leo Buscaglia's books: "Why did you
spend my lifetime tyring to prove who you are?" I don't want my children to
ever think that of we.

I have been disturbed enoiugh. I am here....shedding willingly. I am
questioning. Who on this list has the right to determine how,when and what?
I am my own Dakini.

Robin S.

>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 12:10:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:

> ; For me, my thinking had to be
> >disturbed and shook up.nbsp;
> >
> >Sheila<<
>
> For you.
>
> Robin S.
> >
>

For many.
I feel like you are saying more Robin, but I'm not sure what direction you're
going.
Could you go on ?
Elissa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 4:33:24 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:

> Being raised in an alcoholic family, John Bradshaw, Alice Miller, therapy,
> being raised a fundamentalist, being shamed, being repressed and supressed,
>
> being validated by that witness that ALice Miller talks about, ALANON,
> ACOA,
> Leo Buscaglia, Gary Zukov, Taoism, SARK, having children, constantly
> looking
> into their eyes and hearing their sweet voices, feeling mybabies be born,
> nursing, Laleache LEague, Dr. Sears, being slapped for speaking my mind and
>
> my feelings, being abandoned and emotionally abused, being the first
> born,,,the caretaker, feeling the pain from not beoingheld as a
> child...feeling my past.....
>
>
You are very lucky. I had much of what you had but it wasn't enough. I needed
someone to tell me, straight out, that there was a better way. Since we are
human, I believe there will always be a better way. I can be a better cook,
better scrapbooker, better wife, better daughter, better mom, better
unschooler. Once I stop and say, I've found it, i've reached the pinnacle.
There is no more better, only worse. That to me would be sad, to know there
is only worse.
Elissa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 4:33:25 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:


> I am my own Dakini.
>

What's a Dakini?

~Kelly, the uninformed and lost


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 4:40:05 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:

> I didn't need to accept; I was led to where I am by my desire to be FREE and
> by the graciousness of poeple who were willing to share their truth.
>
> Robin S.
>
Same here! Thanks to Sandra, Joyce, Deb L, Robyn in Ca, Ren, AnneO, Ginny on
the boards. Their various styles of explaining, from blunt to challenging to
soothing, to bubbly, all were beneficial! The blunt/challenging ones
especially so in the beginning when I needed "louder" explanations.
Love,
Elissa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/15/2002 10:58:37 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ecsamhill@... writes:
> I would find it disheartening to be the object of that kind of thinking
> and behavior....Am I misreading your
> intent? **
>
> I don't know.
>
> Was it the childishness you objected to or the directionality?
>
> Betsy


My heart is 100% with the message of unschooling, AP and TCL parenting
philosophies. It is the attitude of the messanger that I am peceiveing here
that truly bothers me.

Robin S


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 9:44:06 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:
> >Was it the childishness you objected to or the directionality?
> >
> >Betsy
>
>
> My heart is 100% with the message of unschooling, AP and TCL parenting
> philosophies. It is the attitude of the messanger that I am peceiveing
> here
> that truly bothers me.
>
> Robin S
Whoops! TCS...Taking Children Seriously...
R>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 9:21:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Earthmomma67@... writes:
> Same here! Thanks to Sandra, Joyce, Deb L, Robyn in Ca, Ren, AnneO, Ginny on
>
> the boards. Their various styles of explaining, from blunt to challenging
> to
> soothing, to bubbly, all were beneficial! The blunt/challenging ones
> especially so in the beginning when I needed "louder" explanations.
> Love,
> Elissa
>
> I do not mind being challenged. I do mind disrespect between adults and
> asumptions made regarding the motivations and intentions of others. We are
> not all the same and so not all need the same...just like our children.
> Are we not all unschoolers...should we not all be allowed the dignity of
> our own way ?
>
> Robin S.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 9:46:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:

> . It is the attitude of the messanger that I am peceiveing
> >here
> >that truly bothers me.
> >
> >Robin S
>

I truly believe that you are misreading her attitude. She is blunt, she
doesn't pull punches, she thinks of the Child before the parent. But she
cares. She cares alot. That's why she's here. That's why she leaves her
family to travel the country speaking, for little more than
airline/hotel/food. Tht's why she hosts folders on Unschooling.com, why she
spends hours each week answering questions, asking others to think. Why she
welcomes strangers from this list to her home to SEE that what she speaks of
is Truth.
Try changing her "writing voice" in your head, to gentle, kind and loving.
You may begin to hear her differently.
Elissa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 9:56:16 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:

> Are we not all unschoolers...should we not all be allowed the dignity of
> >our own way ?
> >
> >Robin S.
>
>
> But if we silenced the voices we don't like, it prevents others from
hearing the voices they need.
Elissa



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 10:05:10 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Earthmomma67@... writes:
> Are we not all unschoolers...should we not all be allowed the dignity of
> >>our own way ?
> >>
> >>Robin S.
> >
> >
> >But if we silenced the voices we don't like, it prevents others from
> hearing the voices they need.
> Elissa
I am not talking about silencing voices. Please share. I talking about
the way in which some/a few have expressed themselves. Again, you are
determining what others "need" to hear. Would you do that to an unschooling
child and wouldyou do that to a significant other?

Robin S.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 10:02:45 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Earthmomma67@... writes:
> I truly believe that you are misreading her attitude. She is blunt, she
> doesn't pull punches, she thinks of the Child before the parent. But she
> cares. She cares alot. That's why she's here. That's why she leaves her
> family to travel the country speaking, for little more than
> airline/hotel/food. Tht's why she hosts folders on Unschooling.com, why she
>
> spends hours each week answering questions, asking others to think. Why she
>
> welcomes strangers from this list to her home to SEE that what she speaks
> of
> is Truth.
> Try changing her "writing voice" in your head, to gentle, kind and loving.
> You may begin to hear her differently.
> Elissa


Isn't ones writing voivce one's on responsibility? Isn't it possible to
respect adults as well as children? Yes, I put the child's need above the
adults as well; and I am not talking about that at all. I am talking about
respect for and between adults. I believe that making a game out of, well
here:

>>I have the strange notion that maybe we should make a party game out of
this and cheerfully tell people "you're getting warmer" and "you're
getting cold".

I wonder if that would be any easier to take. It might make the
feedback less disturbing... but sometimes the goal IS to disturb people
and shake them out of their existing patterns.<<

I find these statement demeaning to those who have made their way to this
path and this site. The goal disturbs me as well. Again is this reflective
of unschooling philosophy?

Robin S.

>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Fetteroll

on 12/16/02 10:02 AM, Earthmomma67@... at Earthmomma67@... wrote:

> Try changing her "writing voice" in your head, to gentle, kind and loving.
> You may begin to hear her differently.

Or get one of Sandra's tapes. And you'll be able to hear the tone that goes
with the words. :-)

Joyce

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 2:33:27 AM, robin9700@... writes:

<< I have been disturbed enoiugh. >>

So you came to your changes through things that shook up your thinking.
So did all of us.

To complain about the shake-ups necessary for someone to move from worrying
about how their children will learn to read by the time they're seven to
getting unschooling seems counter to the needs of readers of the list.

If you were in ACOA meetings defending someone's desire to idealize an
alcoholic parent, and to justify the ways in which they were neglected or
abused, wouldn't some other member want you to stop so that those who needed
to get past that could do so?

(I'm not suggesting that parallels anything that happened here, but it is in
principle similar to badmouthing this list for seeming harsh to people who
are clinging to school-based practices or beliefs.)

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 7:56:25 AM, robin9700@... writes:

<< > I do not mind being challenged. I do mind disrespect between adults
and
> asumptions made regarding the motivations and intentions of others. We are
> not all the same and so not all need the same...just like our children.
> Are we not all unschoolers...should we not all be allowed the dignity of
> our own way ? >>

*Everything Joyce wrote about changing our beliefs about why we believe what
about our children.

(I don't want to quote it all, but that is the best response to the paragraph
above, so I hope you've all just read it not long before this and remember
it.)

Lots of people say "I'm an unschooler," but if they come here and give advice
which will serve to place or reinforce a wedge between parents and children,
I for one (and I could name some others) will take the part of the child and
say "There is a better way."

-=-We are not all the same and so not all need the same...just like our
children. -=-

For unschooling to work, there are things all children need. When a point of
philosophy is leaning toward traditional "parental rights" and away from
what's trusting and empowering of a child, I take the child's side over the
parent's.

I know women are used to "support group" mentality, and tea-party manners,
where they go somewhere and "get support" (traditionally in the form of
nodding and gushing and saying "You're so right," and "that's so true").
Then they go away feeling "supported," rarely thinking to realize that those
women just say "you're so right and that's so true" to just about anything
and then roll their eyes after the person's gone. That kind of support
doesn't happen on this list. There are lists where that does happen, and I
think it's a waste of time for someone who actually does want to discuss nuts
and bolts philosophy. But most people go their whole life in avoidance of
honest analysis of what and why. That's okay if that's what they want. They
have their tea parties and support groups, and I have my real discussions of
actual situations.

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 8:44:46 AM, robin9700@... writes:

<< I am not talking about silencing voices. Please share. I talking about
the way in which some/a few have expressed themselves. >>

Why not put that effort and attention into writing about unschooling instead
of writing about me. I'm not flattered. I feel harrassed and stalked when
people make a hobby of me.

<<Again, you are determining what others "need" to hear. Would you do that
to an unschooling
child and wouldyou do that to a significant other?>>

I do.
When there's something my husband needs to hear, I communicate it.
When there's something one of my children or one of their friends needs to
hear I find a time, soon, to talk with them.

Are you really suggesting that you don't do that?
That you don't communicate with your children and husband what seems
important to you?

Sandra

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/02 10:46:55 AM Eastern Standard Time,
robin9700@... writes:
>
> I am not talking about silencing voices. Please share. I talking about
> the way in which some/a few have expressed themselves.
> Robin S.
>
>
> You are talking about the *way* in which others have expressed themselves.
For what purpose? Because it bothers you? My point was that something that
may be uncomfortable for you to hear may be just what the next reader needs
to hear.
Not what *I* think they need to hear. What They think they need to hear. I'm
not trying to determine anybody's needs.
You keep pointing out the way particular people "speak" on the list. If we
say to you, You're right, they are too blunt/bubbly/tactless. Lets MAKE them
change.
That is silencing a voice.

Robin S.: <<Again, you are
determining what others "need" to hear. Would you do that to an unschooling
child and wouldyou do that to a significant other?>>
I'm a little confused. How am I doing that?
Elissa


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kelli Traaseth

Exactly! Sandra has the most pleasant calm voice,

Don't some types of writing styles reach some people and other styles reach different people. This is so important, to have all sorts,

When I first came to this list, I have to be honest and say I was a little put back at some comments I received. But I would then analyze what I was feeling and realize that what I was saying didn't coincide with unschooling philosophies. Even if I thought it did. And I'm glad people have been honest, some people may think its harsh or whatever, but I also needed that honesty. If there was beating around the bush I might still be floundering in alot of uncertainties.

To me its this beacon, others have said this too, but it is so true.

Kelli



Fetteroll <fetteroll@...> wrote:on 12/16/02 10:02 AM, Earthmomma67@... at Earthmomma67@... wrote:

> Try changing her "writing voice" in your head, to gentle, kind and loving.
> You may begin to hear her differently.

Or get one of Sandra's tapes. And you'll be able to hear the tone that goes
with the words. :-)

Joyce


~~~~ Don't forget! If you change topics, change the subject line! ~~~~

If you have questions, concerns or problems with this list, please email the moderator, Joyce Fetteroll (fetteroll@...), or the list owner, Helen Hegener (HEM-Editor@...).

To unsubscribe from this group, click on the following link or address an email to:
[email protected]

Visit the Unschooling website: http://www.unschooling.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 1:24:42 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
> Why not put that effort and attention into writing about unschooling instead
>
> of writing about me. I'm not flattered. I feel harrassed and stalked when
>
> people make a hobby of me.


What on earth makes yo think I am talking about you specificaly? I never
said that.
Robin S.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 12/16/2002 2:00:27 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Earthmomma67@... writes:
> My point was that something that
> may be uncomfortable for you to hear may be just what the next reader needs
>
> to hear.<<
Again, not message...the disrespecting attitude and intent behind some of
messages...the attitude of the messangers. I do not see how you all do not
hear yourselves and see this.

RObin S.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Fetteroll

on 12/16/02 4:16 PM, robin9700@... at robin9700@... wrote:

> Again, not message...the disrespecting attitude and intent behind some of
> messages...the attitude of the messangers. I do not see how you all do not
> hear yourselves and see this.

For one thing this topic is way too vague. If we can't hear it ourselves
obviously no one has a clue what posts you're talking about! So how can an
attitude that we are oblivious to be discussed?

For another thing, the topic of how people post recurs every 3 months or so.
It's been going on for years. The only result is that a lot of mean words
and hurtful things get said.

It's helps tremendously if you read assuming something is being said in a
gentle voice by your best friend. People are trying to help the best way
they know how.

But even with a new tone some people will never "get" some other people.
That doesn't mean what they have to say isn't valuable to someone else. It
just means that you should perhaps skip their posts.

If you want to email me the posts you're having trouble with I can discuss
them with you -- unless of course they're mine! -- but it's derailing the
list further from discussing unschooling.

Joyce
Unschooling-dotcom moderator