Joel Hawthorne

I am sorely tempted to go into the consulting business (as a nurse) just to help
people out when they have to go to hospital. The sometimes tyrannical arrogance
of the medical establishment is mind boggling. A great, hard to find book
Modern Medical Mistakes, documents a litany of absurd treatments, theories etc.
that medicine has advocated in the last fifty years which have proven to be at
best useless and at worst killed numbers of people. All of these were advocated
with the same "We know exactly what we are doing and anyone who questions us is
an obstructionist, ignorant, non-expert who should mind their own business."
attitude which still permeates medicine, in so many ways, today. This topic
really sets me off. It is especially difficult for parents to resist. In part
because they (medical establishment) have the force of law and the power of
priesthood on their side.

We had a recent experience with a bee sting that would have resulted in our 6
year old being on IV antibiotics if my wife had not stood fast and said "No
antibiotics until the results of a blood test showing the white count." I,
being, immersed in hospital culture and seeing the very worst things that ever
happen to anybody would cave into their pressure much quicker if it weren't for
my dw's cooler head and absolutely iron resolve. We got the blood results back
and all that red, hot, swollen, foot was not infection but allergic reaction.
So we just treated it conservatively with benadryl and avoided antibiotics all
together. There is (in my mind) a place for the judicious use of the medical
model. It works wonderfully for some specific things. It always has a price
and sometimes we don't fully understand just what that price is because we all,
collectively are rather ignorant about reality in spite of our pretensions
(especially medicine's).


There I feel a little better.


"Joseph A. & Susan D. Fuerst" wrote:

> From: "Joseph A. & Susan D. Fuerst" <fuerst@...>
>
> I wish I had known about the home birthing earlier....though by our third
> child I knew, but decided against it ( I just couldn't figure out how it
> would work, though didn't explore it thoroughly). Our family physician's
> wife home birthed most of their children. (They also homeschool, so he is
> a 'true' physician for us!)
> Anyway, Joel, your post reminded me of my hospital experience with my
> second child.....I was there less than 24 hrs, and that seemed TOO long!!
> I could hardly wait to get put of there and back to the peace of our
> home...with our family together.
> And since I got on this hospital treatment topic.....Our toddler was
> recently hospitalized for croup. I battled all night with the resident who
> wanted to run a whole myriad of ridiculous tests to rule out every rare and
> unlikely disease in existence!! And he denied my simple request to have a
> humidifier to help her breathe.<<<<GRRRR!!!>>>>
> I literally had to fight off the phlebotomist (I can't remember why they
> wanted to collect blood...); I had to refuse the test repeatedly and
> finally, pulled my daughter out of her hands. The nurse also became my
> enemy rather than my daughter's advocate......She claimed to me that she'd
> try to convey my wishes to the resident, yet she advocated for him....and
> snuck the phlebotomist back in the room at 5:30 a.m. when I had fallen
> asleep. I saw her note that said I agreed to have the test in the early
> a.m. -- which I did not. I was able to confront her before she left her
> shift that morning. PHEW! It's exhausting in the retelling, too!!
> Well, thanks for listening everyone.....sorry to be such a lurker
> around here...I have so many opinions I'd like to contribute to these lively
> discussions Alas, I have committed myself to a personal fitness program,
> so my mornings are currently devoted to brisk 45 minute walks .... I'm
> barely able to read my e-mail, much less resapond!! ;-)
> Good night all....
> Susan

--
best wishes
Joel

All children behave as well as they are treated. The Natural Child
Project http://naturalchild.com/home/

Work together to reinvent justice using methods that are fair; which conserve,
restore and even create harmony, equity and good will in society i.e.
restorative justice.
We are the prisoners of the prisoners we have taken - J. Clegg
http://www.cerj.org

[email protected]

In a message dated 10/9/99 9:34:04 AM PST, jhawthorne@... writes:

<< We got the blood results back
and all that red, hot, swollen, foot was not infection but allergic reaction.
So we just treated it conservatively with benadryl and avoided antibiotics
all
together. There is (in my mind) a place for the judicious use of the medical
model. It works wonderfully for some specific things. It always has a price
and sometimes we don't fully understand just what that price is because we
all,
collectively are rather ignorant about reality in spite of our pretensions
(especially medicine's). >>

An essential component of ANY first aid kit should be Activated Charcoal.
Bee Stings, (even for those who are highly allergic) mosquito bites, spider
bites, etc can all be treated IMMEDIATELY with activated charcoal made into a
paste. (keep a small bottle of water too). The activated charcoal absorbs
the poison and gives immediate relief from pain or itching as well.

Mary

faith buckley

I know I said in an earlier post that my nurses were great, but there was only one,
out of all the nurses I had with all 3 births, who I certainly could've done w/o.
She missed the vein in my wrist the 1st try to put in an IV and put it in the
other. Then every time she took my blood pressure it was on the same arm I had the
IV. It was so painful. And I don't know if that has anything to do with this, but
the wrist that this all occured with is still very painful and very weak.

This same nurse was told not to give me too much petocin (sp?) and to monitor me on
it, but she jacked it up every hour until my contractions were not deminishing at
all. They would spike up and go half way down and then spike up again, one after
another. The midwife was irrate when she came in and saw this. Thankfully, they
turned it down and by this time that nurses shift was over and she left. But
everyone else was awesome!

With my first, I was 19. I had gone through lamaze, but when it came down to it,
the pain numbed my mind to where I was forgetting and refusing to do what I had
learned. I wouldn't breathe with the contractions, I held my breath and cried. One
of the nurses, who was about 6ft tall and over 200lbs., got right in my face and
said, "BREATHE!!!". That was all it took! I breathed with every one after that and
did fine. I thank God for that nurse!!! :-)

Living for Him,
Faith

Joel Hawthorne wrote:

> From: Joel Hawthorne <jhawthorne@...>
>
> I am sorely tempted to go into the consulting business (as a nurse) just to help
> people out when they have to go to hospital. The sometimes tyrannical arrogance
> of the medical establishment is mind boggling. A great, hard to find book
> Modern Medical Mistakes, documents a litany of absurd treatments, theories etc.
> that medicine has advocated in the last fifty years which have proven to be at
> best useless and at worst killed numbers of people. All of these were advocated
> with the same "We know exactly what we are doing and anyone who questions us is
> an obstructionist, ignorant, non-expert who should mind their own business."
> attitude which still permeates medicine, in so many ways, today. This topic
> really sets me off. It is especially difficult for parents to resist. In part
> because they (medical establishment) have the force of law and the power of
> priesthood on their side.
>
> We had a recent experience with a bee sting that would have resulted in our 6
> year old being on IV antibiotics if my wife had not stood fast and said "No
> antibiotics until the results of a blood test showing the white count." I,
> being, immersed in hospital culture and seeing the very worst things that ever
> happen to anybody would cave into their pressure much quicker if it weren't for
> my dw's cooler head and absolutely iron resolve. We got the blood results back
> and all that red, hot, swollen, foot was not infection but allergic reaction.
> So we just treated it conservatively with benadryl and avoided antibiotics all
> together. There is (in my mind) a place for the judicious use of the medical
> model. It works wonderfully for some specific things. It always has a price
> and sometimes we don't fully understand just what that price is because we all,
> collectively are rather ignorant about reality in spite of our pretensions
> (especially medicine's).
>
> There I feel a little better.
>
> "Joseph A. & Susan D. Fuerst" wrote:
>
> > From: "Joseph A. & Susan D. Fuerst" <fuerst@...>
> >
> > I wish I had known about the home birthing earlier....though by our third
> > child I knew, but decided against it ( I just couldn't figure out how it
> > would work, though didn't explore it thoroughly). Our family physician's
> > wife home birthed most of their children. (They also homeschool, so he is
> > a 'true' physician for us!)
> > Anyway, Joel, your post reminded me of my hospital experience with my
> > second child.....I was there less than 24 hrs, and that seemed TOO long!!
> > I could hardly wait to get put of there and back to the peace of our
> > home...with our family together.
> > And since I got on this hospital treatment topic.....Our toddler was
> > recently hospitalized for croup. I battled all night with the resident who
> > wanted to run a whole myriad of ridiculous tests to rule out every rare and
> > unlikely disease in existence!! And he denied my simple request to have a
> > humidifier to help her breathe.<<<<GRRRR!!!>>>>
> > I literally had to fight off the phlebotomist (I can't remember why they
> > wanted to collect blood...); I had to refuse the test repeatedly and
> > finally, pulled my daughter out of her hands. The nurse also became my
> > enemy rather than my daughter's advocate......She claimed to me that she'd
> > try to convey my wishes to the resident, yet she advocated for him....and
> > snuck the phlebotomist back in the room at 5:30 a.m. when I had fallen
> > asleep. I saw her note that said I agreed to have the test in the early
> > a.m. -- which I did not. I was able to confront her before she left her
> > shift that morning. PHEW! It's exhausting in the retelling, too!!
> > Well, thanks for listening everyone.....sorry to be such a lurker
> > around here...I have so many opinions I'd like to contribute to these lively
> > discussions Alas, I have committed myself to a personal fitness program,
> > so my mornings are currently devoted to brisk 45 minute walks .... I'm
> > barely able to read my e-mail, much less resapond!! ;-)
> > Good night all....
> > Susan
>
> --
> best wishes
> Joel
>
> All children behave as well as they are treated. The Natural Child
> Project http://naturalchild.com/home/
>
> Work together to reinvent justice using methods that are fair; which conserve,
> restore and even create harmony, equity and good will in society i.e.
> restorative justice.
> We are the prisoners of the prisoners we have taken - J. Clegg
> http://www.cerj.org
>
> > Check it out!
> http://www.unschooling.com