Some thoughts on previous posts
gruvystarchild
I don't remember who wrote what, and I don't usually post here but I
couldn't pass up on a couple of the posts...
The story about the 15 year old with massive problems because his
parents "asked nothing of him"
Is that what unschooling is being equated with?
Unschooling in the ideal situation, is (to me) a give and take,
mutual respect, not doing everything for someone.
Because many people here advocate not forcing their will upon
children, does not mean they aren't also giving their children many
opportunities to do for themselves. A big part of what unschooling is
about. Freedom.
It doensn't sounds to me like this teen felt needed nor capable. If
there was another adult living with you, would you "ask nothing of
them"? Of course not. The mutual give and take means treating kids
with the same respect you would give another adult. It would be rude
to try and do for another adult, the things they could do themselves.
If you understand child development and enable kids, this type of
respect will give them profound confidence in their abilities. Not
what that teen had at all.
I get frustrated when I see Unschooling being equated with doing
everything for a child...the opposite couldn't be more true.
But when the child asks for help, we willingly give it, just as if
another adult asked for our help.
Give and take, mutual respect...do you see what I'm saying?
That story about the depressed 15 y.o. is like comparing apples to
oranges (or onions more like it).
And was he homeschooled? Did he have choices about the direction his
life would take? Maybe that fed the depression as well?!!
Parents that do everything for their child, whether the child wants
it that way or not, are sending the message that the child isn't
capable.
They are also disrespecting that childs wishes and needs.
Child-led learning does neither of those things.
It respects the child's need to attempt activities on their own, it
says we must assist as needed, that we give them freedom to explore
the world on their own terms and bring them into our world as human
beings worthy of being part of the adult world...not lesser citizens.
To tell that story as though it's the result of what allowing
children to make their own choices is false.
Also, I've noticed in the TV discussion that certain individuals use
the terms "educational"...
I think it pays to lose those narrow definitions of the world if we
are to embrace unschooling in it's most joyful form.
To value all activities as worthy is so helpful!! It certainly has
helped me to try and lose those ideas of what is
educational/noneducational, worthy/not worthy etc....when looking at
the things my kids choose.
Life is learning. All activities can teach us something. And learning
all the time is what unschooling is all about.
Humans learn....you can't stop it unless you try to force it.
Ren
couldn't pass up on a couple of the posts...
The story about the 15 year old with massive problems because his
parents "asked nothing of him"
Is that what unschooling is being equated with?
Unschooling in the ideal situation, is (to me) a give and take,
mutual respect, not doing everything for someone.
Because many people here advocate not forcing their will upon
children, does not mean they aren't also giving their children many
opportunities to do for themselves. A big part of what unschooling is
about. Freedom.
It doensn't sounds to me like this teen felt needed nor capable. If
there was another adult living with you, would you "ask nothing of
them"? Of course not. The mutual give and take means treating kids
with the same respect you would give another adult. It would be rude
to try and do for another adult, the things they could do themselves.
If you understand child development and enable kids, this type of
respect will give them profound confidence in their abilities. Not
what that teen had at all.
I get frustrated when I see Unschooling being equated with doing
everything for a child...the opposite couldn't be more true.
But when the child asks for help, we willingly give it, just as if
another adult asked for our help.
Give and take, mutual respect...do you see what I'm saying?
That story about the depressed 15 y.o. is like comparing apples to
oranges (or onions more like it).
And was he homeschooled? Did he have choices about the direction his
life would take? Maybe that fed the depression as well?!!
Parents that do everything for their child, whether the child wants
it that way or not, are sending the message that the child isn't
capable.
They are also disrespecting that childs wishes and needs.
Child-led learning does neither of those things.
It respects the child's need to attempt activities on their own, it
says we must assist as needed, that we give them freedom to explore
the world on their own terms and bring them into our world as human
beings worthy of being part of the adult world...not lesser citizens.
To tell that story as though it's the result of what allowing
children to make their own choices is false.
Also, I've noticed in the TV discussion that certain individuals use
the terms "educational"...
I think it pays to lose those narrow definitions of the world if we
are to embrace unschooling in it's most joyful form.
To value all activities as worthy is so helpful!! It certainly has
helped me to try and lose those ideas of what is
educational/noneducational, worthy/not worthy etc....when looking at
the things my kids choose.
Life is learning. All activities can teach us something. And learning
all the time is what unschooling is all about.
Humans learn....you can't stop it unless you try to force it.
Ren
Karin
: : : CHEERING : : : GO REN!
We needed your voice here. :-)
Karin
Also, I've noticed in the TV discussion that certain individuals use
the terms "educational"...
I think it pays to lose those narrow definitions of the world if we
are to embrace unschooling in it's most joyful form.
To value all activities as worthy is so helpful!! It certainly has
helped me to try and lose those ideas of what is
educational/noneducational, worthy/not worthy etc....when looking at
the things my kids choose.
Life is learning. All activities can teach us something. And learning
all the time is what unschooling is all about.
Humans learn....you can't stop it unless you try to force it.
Ren
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
We needed your voice here. :-)
Karin
Also, I've noticed in the TV discussion that certain individuals use
the terms "educational"...
I think it pays to lose those narrow definitions of the world if we
are to embrace unschooling in it's most joyful form.
To value all activities as worthy is so helpful!! It certainly has
helped me to try and lose those ideas of what is
educational/noneducational, worthy/not worthy etc....when looking at
the things my kids choose.
Life is learning. All activities can teach us something. And learning
all the time is what unschooling is all about.
Humans learn....you can't stop it unless you try to force it.
Ren
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pat Cald...
I'm glad you responded to the post. I was the one who wrote it and the reason I added it, was to give examples of children who watch TV all the time. I am just learning about unschooling and that is why I am following this list so all of your input helps expand my narrow view. I have never ever met a homeschooled child(except my own - just started in September) or family let alone an unschooled child. Sarah and others have brought up the fact that respect for children as equals is very important. I strongly agree! Sarah also said that possibly the fact that the two children I mentioned are ps kids has a lot to do with why they veg in front of the TV a lot. I have no way of knowing. I am a keen observer of parenting styles, I look at what works, what doesn't and try to figure out why. I think you hit the nail on the head when you said my nephew doesn't feel needed or capable and your reasons make a lot of sense. Your description of an unschooling family is certainly one I aspire to have. Posts like yours go a long way in helping me attain my goal. Thanks.
Pat
Pat
----- Original Message -----
From: gruvystarchild
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2002 4:33 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Some thoughts on previous posts
I don't remember who wrote what, and I don't usually post here but I
couldn't pass up on a couple of the posts...
The story about the 15 year old with massive problems because his
parents "asked nothing of him"
Is that what unschooling is being equated with?
Unschooling in the ideal situation, is (to me) a give and take,
mutual respect, not doing everything for someone.
Because many people here advocate not forcing their will upon
children, does not mean they aren't also giving their children many
opportunities to do for themselves. A big part of what unschooling is
about. Freedom.
It doensn't sounds to me like this teen felt needed nor capable. If
there was another adult living with you, would you "ask nothing of
them"? Of course not. The mutual give and take means treating kids
with the same respect you would give another adult. It would be rude
to try and do for another adult, the things they could do themselves.
If you understand child development and enable kids, this type of
respect will give them profound confidence in their abilities. Not
what that teen had at all.
I get frustrated when I see Unschooling being equated with doing
everything for a child...the opposite couldn't be more true.
But when the child asks for help, we willingly give it, just as if
another adult asked for our help.
Give and take, mutual respect...do you see what I'm saying?
That story about the depressed 15 y.o. is like comparing apples to
oranges (or onions more like it).
And was he homeschooled? Did he have choices about the direction his
life would take? Maybe that fed the depression as well?!!
Parents that do everything for their child, whether the child wants
it that way or not, are sending the message that the child isn't
capable.
They are also disrespecting that childs wishes and needs.
Child-led learning does neither of those things.
It respects the child's need to attempt activities on their own, it
says we must assist as needed, that we give them freedom to explore
the world on their own terms and bring them into our world as human
beings worthy of being part of the adult world...not lesser citizens.
To tell that story as though it's the result of what allowing
children to make their own choices is false.
Also, I've noticed in the TV discussion that certain individuals use
the terms "educational"...
I think it pays to lose those narrow definitions of the world if we
are to embrace unschooling in it's most joyful form.
To value all activities as worthy is so helpful!! It certainly has
helped me to try and lose those ideas of what is
educational/noneducational, worthy/not worthy etc....when looking at
the things my kids choose.
Life is learning. All activities can teach us something. And learning
all the time is what unschooling is all about.
Humans learn....you can't stop it unless you try to force it.
Ren
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rumpleteasermom
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "gruvystarchild" <starsuncloud@c...>
wrote:
have been said here leave that impression when the reality is quite
different. For example, there was talk a while back about what to do
if you need to go out but your child does not want to. The
impression I first got was that these people let their kid's needs
override their own entirely. I truly believe that that is not the
case, but given only the statements in those posts, that was how it
sounded.
I do think there are many people who do too much for their children
and don't allow them to learn to deal with life. I suspect they
exist in many circles, from unschoolers to public schoolers. The
problem is not confined to any one group.
Bridget
wrote:
> I don't remember who wrote what, and I don't usually post here butI
> couldn't pass up on a couple of the posts...I can see how you would get that idea. I think that somethings that
>
> The story about the 15 year old with massive problems because his
> parents "asked nothing of him"
> Is that what unschooling is being equated with?
have been said here leave that impression when the reality is quite
different. For example, there was talk a while back about what to do
if you need to go out but your child does not want to. The
impression I first got was that these people let their kid's needs
override their own entirely. I truly believe that that is not the
case, but given only the statements in those posts, that was how it
sounded.
I do think there are many people who do too much for their children
and don't allow them to learn to deal with life. I suspect they
exist in many circles, from unschoolers to public schoolers. The
problem is not confined to any one group.
Bridget