Deschooling-video games
[email protected]
I HAVE let my son play video games for hours in hopes that
he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
impact on the brain. Some studies have been done to show that video
games affect humans self-control capability. I don't know if this
can be said of all cases but I can attest to its effects on my son.
He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
amounts of time playing video games. These are not violent games but
they are "action" games. He does fine with games like Sim City or
Pokemon (gameboy version). By the way, I have played numerous
Nintendo and Playstation games with him.
As in all cases, some recommendations will work with some
children but not with others. I will NEVER again allow my son to get
immersed in the "gaming" world.
I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
as well. It is hard to erase 15+ years of repeated brainwashing. Yes,
we are devouring books on unschooling, reading websites,and talking
with like-minds (when available). No, we may not have all the support
we would like from family or even spouses. WE ARE TRYING! We are
DOING! We are learning all the time... right along with our children.
We are loving, we are biting our tongues, we are enjoying. But there
are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having a private
MELTDOWN!! Those quiet hours when the kids are in bed and you
wonder....
I would LOVE to always have the faith in myself,in the natural
progression of life, but sometimes I falter. Everyday, I get
stronger. Please be there not to judge but to show the way when
others faith may be lost. Sometimes a simple word such as "patience"
can speak volumes and may be just what is needed.
Tara
he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
impact on the brain. Some studies have been done to show that video
games affect humans self-control capability. I don't know if this
can be said of all cases but I can attest to its effects on my son.
He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
amounts of time playing video games. These are not violent games but
they are "action" games. He does fine with games like Sim City or
Pokemon (gameboy version). By the way, I have played numerous
Nintendo and Playstation games with him.
As in all cases, some recommendations will work with some
children but not with others. I will NEVER again allow my son to get
immersed in the "gaming" world.
I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
as well. It is hard to erase 15+ years of repeated brainwashing. Yes,
we are devouring books on unschooling, reading websites,and talking
with like-minds (when available). No, we may not have all the support
we would like from family or even spouses. WE ARE TRYING! We are
DOING! We are learning all the time... right along with our children.
We are loving, we are biting our tongues, we are enjoying. But there
are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having a private
MELTDOWN!! Those quiet hours when the kids are in bed and you
wonder....
I would LOVE to always have the faith in myself,in the natural
progression of life, but sometimes I falter. Everyday, I get
stronger. Please be there not to judge but to show the way when
others faith may be lost. Sometimes a simple word such as "patience"
can speak volumes and may be just what is needed.
Tara
[email protected]
--- VERY WELL SAID!!!! :-)))
SHAWN
In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., TarazSpot@a... wrote:
SHAWN
In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., TarazSpot@a... wrote:
> I HAVE let my son play video games for hours in hopes thatlong
> he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
> unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
> impact on the brain. Some studies have been done to show that video
> games affect humans self-control capability. I don't know if this
> can be said of all cases but I can attest to its effects on my son.
> He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending
> amounts of time playing video games. These are not violent gamesbut
> they are "action" games. He does fine with games like Sim City orget
> Pokemon (gameboy version). By the way, I have played numerous
> Nintendo and Playstation games with him.
> As in all cases, some recommendations will work with some
> children but not with others. I will NEVER again allow my son to
> immersed in the "gaming" world.Yes,
>
> I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
> new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
> concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
> times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
> as well. It is hard to erase 15+ years of repeated brainwashing.
> we are devouring books on unschooling, reading websites,and talkingsupport
> with like-minds (when available). No, we may not have all the
> we would like from family or even spouses. WE ARE TRYING! We arechildren.
> DOING! We are learning all the time... right along with our
> We are loving, we are biting our tongues, we are enjoying. Butthere
> are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having aprivate
> MELTDOWN!! Those quiet hours when the kids are in bed and younatural
> wonder....
> I would LOVE to always have the faith in myself,in the
> progression of life, but sometimes I falter. Everyday, I getas "patience"
> stronger. Please be there not to judge but to show the way when
> others faith may be lost. Sometimes a simple word such
> can speak volumes and may be just what is needed.
>
> Tara
[email protected]
I HAVE let my son play video games for hours in hopes
forgets about everything else.
He forgets to eat. When he is hungry and doesn't know it because he's
very focused on something else, he is very temperamental. I have found
that taking him some food at regular intervals, sitting quietly beside
him, and engaging him, will get him interested in eating ( snarf! ) and
then he's fine.
He plays all kinds of video games, with no restrictions ever and has a
brilliant mind for puzzles, games, geometric shapes, blueprints,
schematics, ( good story here; When we moved into this house we had it
re-wired. He looked at the electrition's plans for a few minutes and
said, "I think you've forgotten the door bell here, and the motion sensor
light on the north side.) No kidding! He was seven! His fine motor
skills are exceptional as is his hand - eye coordination.
Deb L
> thatMy son can get so engrossed in projects, including video games, that he
> > he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
> > unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
> > impact on the brain.
forgets about everything else.
He forgets to eat. When he is hungry and doesn't know it because he's
very focused on something else, he is very temperamental. I have found
that taking him some food at regular intervals, sitting quietly beside
him, and engaging him, will get him interested in eating ( snarf! ) and
then he's fine.
He plays all kinds of video games, with no restrictions ever and has a
brilliant mind for puzzles, games, geometric shapes, blueprints,
schematics, ( good story here; When we moved into this house we had it
re-wired. He looked at the electrition's plans for a few minutes and
said, "I think you've forgotten the door bell here, and the motion sensor
light on the north side.) No kidding! He was seven! His fine motor
skills are exceptional as is his hand - eye coordination.
Deb L
Lynda
I've been reading this thread and kept my mouth shut but there seems to be a
very big misconception. One size does NOT fit all. Yes, some parents don't
wait long enough to see if their children "deschool," however, not all
activities have anything to do with deschooling.
If a child sits for hours and hours in front of the boob tube, video games
or other venues which can be (please, before folks jump on their high
horses, read what I wrote "can" be, not "are") mindless unactivities, does
NOT mean they are deschooling nor does it mean they will stop doing this at
some point and move on to other activities.
The fallacy of using a label such as "deschooling" is that some children who
have never been to school nor have they ever been in an environment that was
controlling will still sit like mindless little bloob in front of the tube.
Everyone (an inclusive word including children) is an individual and the
important thing is to discover and encourage that individuality to the best
of the parents ability. Sometimes parents must make choices for their
children because in that INDIVIDUAL child's case, they cannot or will not
make choices that are good for them.
Youngest kidlet is one who does not stop. She has no self regulating
"button" that tells her when she is tired and NEEDS sleep. She goes on and
on and one until she literally makes herself sick, physically sick. When
she was little she had a bedtime. Now that she is older we have discussed
this and when she is beyond tired, I tell her to go look at what she calls
her "saggy, baggy" tired eyes and then she takes herself off to bed.
The is no such thing as "A" definition of unschooling, nor is there any one,
single "correct" way of doing it. Sometimes folks forget that the whole
idea of unschooling is to allow a child to be an individual AND that
sometimes, some adult help is needed.
So, Tara, here is your encouragement and the pat on the back that needs to
be handed out more frequently. All steps toward unschooling are good steps,
even baby steps and even when one sometimes takes one step backwards as long
as one's next steps are a vigorous forward!
Lynda
very big misconception. One size does NOT fit all. Yes, some parents don't
wait long enough to see if their children "deschool," however, not all
activities have anything to do with deschooling.
If a child sits for hours and hours in front of the boob tube, video games
or other venues which can be (please, before folks jump on their high
horses, read what I wrote "can" be, not "are") mindless unactivities, does
NOT mean they are deschooling nor does it mean they will stop doing this at
some point and move on to other activities.
The fallacy of using a label such as "deschooling" is that some children who
have never been to school nor have they ever been in an environment that was
controlling will still sit like mindless little bloob in front of the tube.
Everyone (an inclusive word including children) is an individual and the
important thing is to discover and encourage that individuality to the best
of the parents ability. Sometimes parents must make choices for their
children because in that INDIVIDUAL child's case, they cannot or will not
make choices that are good for them.
Youngest kidlet is one who does not stop. She has no self regulating
"button" that tells her when she is tired and NEEDS sleep. She goes on and
on and one until she literally makes herself sick, physically sick. When
she was little she had a bedtime. Now that she is older we have discussed
this and when she is beyond tired, I tell her to go look at what she calls
her "saggy, baggy" tired eyes and then she takes herself off to bed.
The is no such thing as "A" definition of unschooling, nor is there any one,
single "correct" way of doing it. Sometimes folks forget that the whole
idea of unschooling is to allow a child to be an individual AND that
sometimes, some adult help is needed.
So, Tara, here is your encouragement and the pat on the back that needs to
be handed out more frequently. All steps toward unschooling are good steps,
even baby steps and even when one sometimes takes one step backwards as long
as one's next steps are a vigorous forward!
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: <TarazSpot@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, November 09, 2001 12:55 AM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Deschooling-video games
> I HAVE let my son play video games for hours in hopes that
> he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
> unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
> impact on the brain. Some studies have been done to show that video
> games affect humans self-control capability. I don't know if this
> can be said of all cases but I can attest to its effects on my son.
> He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
> amounts of time playing video games. These are not violent games but
> they are "action" games. He does fine with games like Sim City or
> Pokemon (gameboy version). By the way, I have played numerous
> Nintendo and Playstation games with him.
> As in all cases, some recommendations will work with some
> children but not with others. I will NEVER again allow my son to get
> immersed in the "gaming" world.
>
> I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
> new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
> concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
> times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
> as well. It is hard to erase 15+ years of repeated brainwashing. Yes,
> we are devouring books on unschooling, reading websites,and talking
> with like-minds (when available). No, we may not have all the support
> we would like from family or even spouses. WE ARE TRYING! We are
> DOING! We are learning all the time... right along with our children.
> We are loving, we are biting our tongues, we are enjoying. But there
> are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having a private
> MELTDOWN!! Those quiet hours when the kids are in bed and you
> wonder....
> I would LOVE to always have the faith in myself,in the natural
> progression of life, but sometimes I falter. Everyday, I get
> stronger. Please be there not to judge but to show the way when
> others faith may be lost. Sometimes a simple word such as "patience"
> can speak volumes and may be just what is needed.
>
> Tara
>
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Tia Leschke
> I HAVE let my son play video games for hours in hopes thatI'm just musing here, and this may not be a good idea at all.
>he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
>unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
>impact on the brain. Some studies have been done to show that video
>games affect humans self-control capability. I don't know if this
>can be said of all cases but I can attest to its effects on my son.
>He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
>amounts of time playing video games. These are not violent games but
>they are "action" games. He does fine with games like Sim City or
>Pokemon (gameboy version). By the way, I have played numerous
>Nintendo and Playstation games with him.
How about tying his game playing to his behavior. Any time his behavior
deteriorates right after playing video games, he doesn't play again for a
certain amount of time. Or there's a limit on his playing time. Then he
can try again. I'm thinking that maybe it will let him see for himself
what it does to *his* behavior. And someone else mentioned food. That's
also a very good idea. "You can keep playing as soon as you've eaten some
food to get your blood sugar up."
> I would LOVE to always have the faith in myself,in the naturalOk here goes. Patience, Tara.
>progression of life, but sometimes I falter. Everyday, I get
>stronger. Please be there not to judge but to show the way when
>others faith may be lost. Sometimes a simple word such as "patience"
>can speak volumes and may be just what is needed.
Now, you'll do the same for me the next time I get stressed out. Right? <g>
Tia
Tia Leschke leschke@...
On Vancouver Island
**************************************************************************
It is the answers which separate us, the questions which unite us. - Janice
Levy
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/9/01 1:56:15 AM, TarazSpot@... writes:
<< He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
amounts of time playing video games. >>
Or is that when he's asked to stop?
<< I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
as well.>>
And? Are people here not offering freely their own experiences, and ways
they tried that failed, and beliefs they had that have changed? Part of the
deschooling process needs to be to REALLY look at what IS going on, rather
than looking at what you wish were going on.
If we all make soothing noises here, it will take longer than if we point out
potential problems. I don't think soothing "support" of every idea no matter
what direction it's headed is what busy new unschoolers need. I think they
need REAL advice, and real help.
Yes, you could eventually figure it out on your own, but if you really wanted
to do that you might not have come here to read. And lots of schooly stuff
has to be undone, so the more that's avoided in the first place, the sooner
children think in different ways.
<<But there are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having a
private
MELTDOWN!!>>
So have all of us, and we're trying to help others get through the doubts
sooner and easier.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
<< He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
amounts of time playing video games. >>
Or is that when he's asked to stop?
<< I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
as well.>>
And? Are people here not offering freely their own experiences, and ways
they tried that failed, and beliefs they had that have changed? Part of the
deschooling process needs to be to REALLY look at what IS going on, rather
than looking at what you wish were going on.
If we all make soothing noises here, it will take longer than if we point out
potential problems. I don't think soothing "support" of every idea no matter
what direction it's headed is what busy new unschoolers need. I think they
need REAL advice, and real help.
Yes, you could eventually figure it out on your own, but if you really wanted
to do that you might not have come here to read. And lots of schooly stuff
has to be undone, so the more that's avoided in the first place, the sooner
children think in different ways.
<<But there are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having a
private
MELTDOWN!!>>
So have all of us, and we're trying to help others get through the doubts
sooner and easier.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/9/01 10:11:52 AM, lurine@... writes:
<< The fallacy of using a label such as "deschooling" is that some children
who
have never been to school nor have they ever been in an environment that was
controlling will still sit like mindless little bloob in front of the tube. >>
Not any child I have ever met or known.
You cannot tell by looking at someone what they are thinking, and they ARE
thinking. They're either thinking of what they're looking at and hearing, or
they're thinking of something else and using "I'm watching a show" as a
privacy screen so they can think.
I don't know any "mindless little bloobs."
Perhaps those who have children who are mindless little bloobs should have
their own list, because I don't like the phrase or the lack of respect behind
it, and I think it's a strawman created for the purposes of this discussion.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
<< The fallacy of using a label such as "deschooling" is that some children
who
have never been to school nor have they ever been in an environment that was
controlling will still sit like mindless little bloob in front of the tube. >>
Not any child I have ever met or known.
You cannot tell by looking at someone what they are thinking, and they ARE
thinking. They're either thinking of what they're looking at and hearing, or
they're thinking of something else and using "I'm watching a show" as a
privacy screen so they can think.
I don't know any "mindless little bloobs."
Perhaps those who have children who are mindless little bloobs should have
their own list, because I don't like the phrase or the lack of respect behind
it, and I think it's a strawman created for the purposes of this discussion.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
Carol & Mac
If one of MY sons sat all day in front of a 'boob tube' then, yes, I'd
be very worried - even if it was the 18yo! I'm sure any other aging
Kiwis or Aussies on the list will understand my feelings.
other activities! Arrrrgh!
'Cause my understanding of 'boob tube' is a very tight fitting ribbed
sleeveless t-shirt that starts just above the boobs (breasts) and
finishes just below them!
Sorry to introduce a note of frivolity but I just cracked up!
I do get fed up with my lot watching too much tv, playing too much
playstation and computer games, but they come up for air eventually. I
have 4 sons aged 11, 14, 18, 20, so I've seen it come and go for years.
Stay cool and wait.
Carol
'Wisdom is about letting go of attachment to outcomes.' Juliet Batten
be very worried - even if it was the 18yo! I'm sure any other aging
Kiwis or Aussies on the list will understand my feelings.
> If a child sits for hours and hours in front of the boob tube, video gamesRight! That's what I'd be scared of! Stopping looking and moving on to
> or other venues which can be (please, before folks jump on their high
> horses, read what I wrote "can" be, not "are") mindless unactivities, does
> NOT mean they are deschooling nor does it mean they will stop doing
> this at
> some point and move on to other activities.
other activities! Arrrrgh!
'Cause my understanding of 'boob tube' is a very tight fitting ribbed
sleeveless t-shirt that starts just above the boobs (breasts) and
finishes just below them!
Sorry to introduce a note of frivolity but I just cracked up!
I do get fed up with my lot watching too much tv, playing too much
playstation and computer games, but they come up for air eventually. I
have 4 sons aged 11, 14, 18, 20, so I've seen it come and go for years.
Stay cool and wait.
Carol
'Wisdom is about letting go of attachment to outcomes.' Juliet Batten
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> The fallacy of using a label such as "deschooling" is that some
> children who
> have never been to school nor have they ever been in an environment
> that was
> controlling will still sit like mindless little bloob in front of the
> tube.
>
> Everyone (an inclusive word including children) is an individual and the
> important thing is to discover and encourage that individuality to the
> best
> of the parents ability. Sometimes parents must make choices for their
> children because in that INDIVIDUAL child's case, they cannot or will not
> make choices that are good for them.
>
> Youngest kidlet is one who does not stop. She has no self regulating
> "button" that tells her when she is tired and NEEDS sleep. She goes
> on and
> on and one until she literally makes herself sick, physically sick. When
> she was little she had a bedtime. Now that she is older we have discussed
> this and when she is beyond tired, I tell her to go look at what she calls
> her "saggy, baggy" tired eyes and then she takes herself off to bed.
>
> The is no such thing as "A" definition of unschooling, nor is there
> any one,
> single "correct" way of doing it. Sometimes folks forget that the whole
> idea of unschooling is to allow a child to be an individual AND that
> sometimes, some adult help is needed.
>
> So, Tara, here is your encouragement and the pat on the back that needs to
> be handed out more frequently. All steps toward unschooling are good
> steps,
> even baby steps and even when one sometimes takes one step backwards
> as long
> as one's next steps are a vigorous forward!
>
> Lynda
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <TarazSpot@...>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, November 09, 2001 12:55 AM
> Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Deschooling-video games
>
>
> > I HAVE let my son play video games for hours in hopes that
> > he would tire of them. He did not. His temperament became
> > unbearable and I firmly believe that video games have a negative
> > impact on the brain. Some studies have been done to show that video
> > games affect humans self-control capability. I don't know if this
> > can be said of all cases but I can attest to its effects on my son.
> > He becomes aggresive and loses his temper easily after spending long
> > amounts of time playing video games. These are not violent games but
> > they are "action" games. He does fine with games like Sim City or
> > Pokemon (gameboy version). By the way, I have played numerous
> > Nintendo and Playstation games with him.
> > As in all cases, some recommendations will work with some
> > children but not with others. I will NEVER again allow my son to get
> > immersed in the "gaming" world.
> >
> > I would also like to second Lori's statements. Those of us
> > new to unschooling would like to have somewhere to turn with our
> > concerns to gather the strength and support we could beneit from in
> > times of need. Yes, we are going through the "deschooling" process
> > as well. It is hard to erase 15+ years of repeated brainwashing. Yes,
> > we are devouring books on unschooling, reading websites,and talking
> > with like-minds (when available). No, we may not have all the support
> > we would like from family or even spouses. WE ARE TRYING! We are
> > DOING! We are learning all the time... right along with our children.
> > We are loving, we are biting our tongues, we are enjoying. But there
> > are days we are doubting, questioning, and sometimes having a private
> > MELTDOWN!! Those quiet hours when the kids are in bed and you
> > wonder....
> > I would LOVE to always have the faith in myself,in the natural
> > progression of life, but sometimes I falter. Everyday, I get
> > stronger. Please be there not to judge but to show the way when
> > others faith may be lost. Sometimes a simple word such as "patience"
> > can speak volumes and may be just what is needed.
> >
> > Tara
> >
> >
> >
> > Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> > Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
> >
> > To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> > http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
> >
> > Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> > http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
Lynda
Well, I haven't met any honest politicians but that doesn't mean they don't
exist. I haven't met you, that doesn't mean you don't exist. And, I'm sure
there are far more unschooling children that you haven't met than those that
you have met. Doesn't mean they don't exist either. It also doesn't mean
that they aren't different than the finite number you have met.
"LIKE" was the operative word. "LIKE mindless little bloobs" is a
descriptive phrase used to describe how they may look as they sit there. It
does not say anything whatsoever about the child's ability to think. Please
try to read what I wrote, not what you have decided I am writing.
And, actually a study was done that shows that some children, a limited
number, do not think while "zoning" in front of the boob tube. Some
children actually go into an almost sleep/dream state, a sort of
self-hypnosis inwhich they brain waves patterns indicate no active thought
patterns.
Lynda
exist. I haven't met you, that doesn't mean you don't exist. And, I'm sure
there are far more unschooling children that you haven't met than those that
you have met. Doesn't mean they don't exist either. It also doesn't mean
that they aren't different than the finite number you have met.
"LIKE" was the operative word. "LIKE mindless little bloobs" is a
descriptive phrase used to describe how they may look as they sit there. It
does not say anything whatsoever about the child's ability to think. Please
try to read what I wrote, not what you have decided I am writing.
And, actually a study was done that shows that some children, a limited
number, do not think while "zoning" in front of the boob tube. Some
children actually go into an almost sleep/dream state, a sort of
self-hypnosis inwhich they brain waves patterns indicate no active thought
patterns.
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: <SandraDodd@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, November 09, 2001 10:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Deschooling-video games
>
> In a message dated 11/9/01 10:11:52 AM, lurine@... writes:
>
> << The fallacy of using a label such as "deschooling" is that some
children
> who
> have never been to school nor have they ever been in an environment that
was
> controlling will still sit like mindless little bloob in front of the
tube. >>
>
> Not any child I have ever met or known.
>
> You cannot tell by looking at someone what they are thinking, and they ARE
> thinking. They're either thinking of what they're looking at and hearing,
or
> they're thinking of something else and using "I'm watching a show" as a
> privacy screen so they can think.
>
> I don't know any "mindless little bloobs."
>
> Perhaps those who have children who are mindless little bloobs should have
> their own list, because I don't like the phrase or the lack of respect
behind
> it, and I think it's a strawman created for the purposes of this
discussion.
>
> Sandra
>
>
> "Everything counts."
> http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
> http://expage.com/SandraDodd
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Fetteroll
on 11/9/01 2:03 PM, Lynda at lurine@... wrote:
(over and over and over) is a quote from "Battle for Your Mind: Subliminal
Programming": by Dick Sutphen:
associated with spoken and written language, numerical and scientific skills
and reasoning. Right brain activity is associated with musical and artistic
awareness, space and pattern perception, insight, imagination, generating
mental images to compare spatial relationships. (No connection is made
between right brained activities and being in a trance like state.)
From that list, it makes sense to me that TV watching would be a right
brained activity. I suppose if there's something inherently wrong with right
brained activities, we should stop kids from drawing and imagining and being
insightful.
The text says that alpha waves are present in the EEGs of nearly all normal
individuals when they are awake and resting with their eyes closed. These
waves disappear entirely during sleep. Beta waves generally appear when the
nervous system is active, that is, during periods of sensory input and
mental activity. (Not that it says generally.)
(Just as an interesting factoid, it says delta waves occur during deep sleep
but they are also normal in an awake infant.)
Another site says alpha waves are brought out by closing the eyes and by
relaxation, and abolished by eye opening or alerting by any mechanism
(thinking, calculating). It is the major rhythm seen in normal relaxed
adults - it is present during most of life especially beyond the thirteenth
year when it dominates the resting tracing. (Alpha waves are also present
during meditation and hypnosis.) And that beta waves are the dominant rhythm
in patients who are alert or anxious or who have their eyes open.
That would suggest people aren¹t thinking when they watch TV. But does that
make sense? I could list off a huge number of things that I¹ve learned from
watching TV. How can learning take place without thinking? There is also
research into Controlling Computers With Neural Signals (in Scientific
American at http://www.sciam.com/1096issue/1096lusted.html) which uses Alpha
and Mu waves. If alpha waves stop when thought happens, how could those
waves be used to perform a computer action if we have to stop thinking in
order to generate them?
What it really means is that people enjoy dabbling in pseudoscience. They
are using faulty logic -- hypnosis may generate alpha but that doesn¹t mean
alpha indicates hypnosis, thinking may generate beta but that doesn¹t mean
that beta indicates thinking (or that lack of beta means lack of thinking)
-- to draw a conclusion to fit their theory.
To get a more complete picture we¹d need to know what the waves look like
when we¹re deeply involved in a novel. Or watching a play. Or playing a
video game. Or watching a sporting event. Or painting. Or gazing down at a
sleeping or nursing infant. (Not that it would indicate anything. It would
just be more data on how the brain operates.) If alpha waves increased
during those times, should we stop those things? Or does it merely mean that
³thinking stops alpha waves² and ³beta is present during mental activity²
are too simplistic and don¹t adequately describe what¹s going on?
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> "LIKE" was the operative word. "LIKE mindless little bloobs" is aHow we choose to describe someone shapes our attitude towards them.
> descriptive phrase used to describe how they may look as they sit there. It
> does not say anything whatsoever about the child's ability to think. Please
> try to read what I wrote, not what you have decided I am writing.
> And, actually a study was done that shows that some children, a limitedCan you site a source for this? I can't seem to find one. What I did find
> number, do not think while "zoning" in front of the boob tube. Some
> children actually go into an almost sleep/dream state, a sort of
> self-hypnosis inwhich they brain waves patterns indicate no active thought
> patterns.
(over and over and over) is a quote from "Battle for Your Mind: Subliminal
Programming": by Dick Sutphen:
> Recent tests by researcher Herbert Krugman showed that, whileLeft brain activity (according to an anatomy and physiology text) is
> viewers were watching TV, right-brain activity outnumbered left-brain
> activity by a ratio of two to one. Put more simply, the viewers were
> in an altered state . . . in trance more often than not. They were
> getting their Beta-endorphin "fix."
>
> To measure attention spans, psychophysiologist Thomas Mulholland
> of the Veterans Hospital in Bedford, Massachusetts, attached young
> viewers to an EEG machine that was wired to shut the TV set off
> whenever the children's brains produced a majority of alpha waves.
> Although the children were told to concentrate, only a few could
> keep the set on for more than 30 seconds!
associated with spoken and written language, numerical and scientific skills
and reasoning. Right brain activity is associated with musical and artistic
awareness, space and pattern perception, insight, imagination, generating
mental images to compare spatial relationships. (No connection is made
between right brained activities and being in a trance like state.)
From that list, it makes sense to me that TV watching would be a right
brained activity. I suppose if there's something inherently wrong with right
brained activities, we should stop kids from drawing and imagining and being
insightful.
The text says that alpha waves are present in the EEGs of nearly all normal
individuals when they are awake and resting with their eyes closed. These
waves disappear entirely during sleep. Beta waves generally appear when the
nervous system is active, that is, during periods of sensory input and
mental activity. (Not that it says generally.)
(Just as an interesting factoid, it says delta waves occur during deep sleep
but they are also normal in an awake infant.)
Another site says alpha waves are brought out by closing the eyes and by
relaxation, and abolished by eye opening or alerting by any mechanism
(thinking, calculating). It is the major rhythm seen in normal relaxed
adults - it is present during most of life especially beyond the thirteenth
year when it dominates the resting tracing. (Alpha waves are also present
during meditation and hypnosis.) And that beta waves are the dominant rhythm
in patients who are alert or anxious or who have their eyes open.
That would suggest people aren¹t thinking when they watch TV. But does that
make sense? I could list off a huge number of things that I¹ve learned from
watching TV. How can learning take place without thinking? There is also
research into Controlling Computers With Neural Signals (in Scientific
American at http://www.sciam.com/1096issue/1096lusted.html) which uses Alpha
and Mu waves. If alpha waves stop when thought happens, how could those
waves be used to perform a computer action if we have to stop thinking in
order to generate them?
What it really means is that people enjoy dabbling in pseudoscience. They
are using faulty logic -- hypnosis may generate alpha but that doesn¹t mean
alpha indicates hypnosis, thinking may generate beta but that doesn¹t mean
that beta indicates thinking (or that lack of beta means lack of thinking)
-- to draw a conclusion to fit their theory.
To get a more complete picture we¹d need to know what the waves look like
when we¹re deeply involved in a novel. Or watching a play. Or playing a
video game. Or watching a sporting event. Or painting. Or gazing down at a
sleeping or nursing infant. (Not that it would indicate anything. It would
just be more data on how the brain operates.) If alpha waves increased
during those times, should we stop those things? Or does it merely mean that
³thinking stops alpha waves² and ³beta is present during mental activity²
are too simplistic and don¹t adequately describe what¹s going on?
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bridget E Coffman
OOooo . . .I would love to have seen Wyndham's results on that about six
months ago. I bet he would have looked dead 'cuz that's how he looked
from the outside. Mindless bloob about describes it perfectly. When we
dragged him away he was this bright intelligent child after a while, when
he was watch all TV all the time he barely communicated at all. In fact
you could walk in the room and talk to him and he would not even know it,
it was like he just went completely away.
I have no regrets about my actions in limiting his TV and nothing anyone
here says is going to change that. Some may say things like, "you only
see what you want to be true." But perhaps it kinda, sorta is the other
way 'round. Perhaps they think that everyone should do exactly what they
did and what worked for them precisely because they have never met one
like mine. And I give them the benefit of the doubt and listen (except
to the condescending stuff) but find that usually, it comes down to
trusting that I see the situation more clearly here living in it than
they do, especially considering that they have no contact with 5 of the
people involved, only contact with me.
So once again, my advice is to trust your instincts. But step back and
look at the situation to be sure. I have two that were fine with
unlimited TV and one that is definitely not fine. It actually took my a
long time (probably longer than it should have) to step in and stop it
because I believed so much in them taking responsibility for themselves
(after all it had worked with the first two).
Bridget
PS Lynda, I suspect that obsession with things electronic is a genetic
predisposition - he gets it from me. Through the years I have had to
take conscious control of Tetris, Poppit, Carnival, Galaga, TV and the
Internet. It took me a LONG time to recognize it in myself. Now, if
something starts interfering with my life, I recognize it faster because
I saw it in my son. The worst was when I was obsessed with a stand alone
arcade game because I had to be wherever the machine was a LOT!
In three words I can sum up everything I've learned about life: it
goes on.
- Robert Frost
months ago. I bet he would have looked dead 'cuz that's how he looked
from the outside. Mindless bloob about describes it perfectly. When we
dragged him away he was this bright intelligent child after a while, when
he was watch all TV all the time he barely communicated at all. In fact
you could walk in the room and talk to him and he would not even know it,
it was like he just went completely away.
I have no regrets about my actions in limiting his TV and nothing anyone
here says is going to change that. Some may say things like, "you only
see what you want to be true." But perhaps it kinda, sorta is the other
way 'round. Perhaps they think that everyone should do exactly what they
did and what worked for them precisely because they have never met one
like mine. And I give them the benefit of the doubt and listen (except
to the condescending stuff) but find that usually, it comes down to
trusting that I see the situation more clearly here living in it than
they do, especially considering that they have no contact with 5 of the
people involved, only contact with me.
So once again, my advice is to trust your instincts. But step back and
look at the situation to be sure. I have two that were fine with
unlimited TV and one that is definitely not fine. It actually took my a
long time (probably longer than it should have) to step in and stop it
because I believed so much in them taking responsibility for themselves
(after all it had worked with the first two).
Bridget
PS Lynda, I suspect that obsession with things electronic is a genetic
predisposition - he gets it from me. Through the years I have had to
take conscious control of Tetris, Poppit, Carnival, Galaga, TV and the
Internet. It took me a LONG time to recognize it in myself. Now, if
something starts interfering with my life, I recognize it faster because
I saw it in my son. The worst was when I was obsessed with a stand alone
arcade game because I had to be wherever the machine was a LOT!
> Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2001 11:03:46 -0800^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> From: "Lynda" <lurine@...>
> Subject: Re: Deschooling-video games
>
>
> And, actually a study was done that shows that some children, a
> limited
> number, do not think while "zoning" in front of the boob tube. Some
> children actually go into an almost sleep/dream state, a sort of
> self-hypnosis inwhich they brain waves patterns indicate no active
> thought
> patterns.
>
> Lynda
>
In three words I can sum up everything I've learned about life: it
goes on.
- Robert Frost
[email protected]
>a sort ofThis happens to my mother every time I talk about unschooling.
> self-hypnosis inwhich the brain waves patterns indicate no active
> thought
> patterns.
Deb L
[email protected]
In a message dated 11/10/01 4:42:54 AM, fetteroll@... writes:
<< That would suggest people aren1t thinking when they watch TV. But does that
make sense? I could list off a huge number of things that I1ve learned from
watching TV. How can learning take place without thinking? >>
Not all right brain activity is non-thinking, just because it's non-verbal.
I can play piano without thinking IF I'm familiar with the piece. (I don't
play by ear with both hands, only from music, so I'm talking about reading
music.) If I don't know the piece, I'm thinking in words and note names and
conscious awareness of things like "triplets" or "repeats" or "thirds" but
once I'm familiar with the structure of the piece and what it's supposed to
sound like, I play it straight from eyes to fingers without any brain-noise
about words. It's then that it sounds like music to me and I can play it
with expression.
It's like I'm still thinking, but thinking in a different language.
And when I have a piece in that state (not perfectly played, but reading it
that visual and non-verbal way, kind of like when you can read a passage
without having to sound out any words, just b glancing and going straight to
meaning), I can carry on a conversation with someone and still play.
And about the study you saw, Joyce, having wired all those subjects up and
shown them a video (I presume they used the same program for all tests, or it
wouldn't be worth much scientifically), did they show them something soothing
and with pattern art and peaceful music? Or Jaws? Or something with
sub-titles? (That would be interesting to track--like teens watching anime
in Japanese with sub-titles, which Kirby does LOTS at his anime club
meetings.) I'd like for them to show Holly a musical when she knows the
music but hasn't seen the staging and costumes and dancing. That would not
be hypnotic. They might be tempted to give her a sedative to keep her wired
up in the chair and not up pointing "LOOK!" or singing and dancing, or
calling for the remote to rewind.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
<< That would suggest people aren1t thinking when they watch TV. But does that
make sense? I could list off a huge number of things that I1ve learned from
watching TV. How can learning take place without thinking? >>
Not all right brain activity is non-thinking, just because it's non-verbal.
I can play piano without thinking IF I'm familiar with the piece. (I don't
play by ear with both hands, only from music, so I'm talking about reading
music.) If I don't know the piece, I'm thinking in words and note names and
conscious awareness of things like "triplets" or "repeats" or "thirds" but
once I'm familiar with the structure of the piece and what it's supposed to
sound like, I play it straight from eyes to fingers without any brain-noise
about words. It's then that it sounds like music to me and I can play it
with expression.
It's like I'm still thinking, but thinking in a different language.
And when I have a piece in that state (not perfectly played, but reading it
that visual and non-verbal way, kind of like when you can read a passage
without having to sound out any words, just b glancing and going straight to
meaning), I can carry on a conversation with someone and still play.
And about the study you saw, Joyce, having wired all those subjects up and
shown them a video (I presume they used the same program for all tests, or it
wouldn't be worth much scientifically), did they show them something soothing
and with pattern art and peaceful music? Or Jaws? Or something with
sub-titles? (That would be interesting to track--like teens watching anime
in Japanese with sub-titles, which Kirby does LOTS at his anime club
meetings.) I'd like for them to show Holly a musical when she knows the
music but hasn't seen the staging and costumes and dancing. That would not
be hypnotic. They might be tempted to give her a sedative to keep her wired
up in the chair and not up pointing "LOOK!" or singing and dancing, or
calling for the remote to rewind.
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDoddArticles
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
Leslie
"How we choose to describe someone shapes our attitude towards them."
Joyce
Thanks for these ideas Joyce. You reminded me of an observation my sister made last week. It may seem totally unrelated to many of you but I think it's part of this discussion. She remarked that it looked like my bust had shrunk :~) In fact I'm the same size as I've been for most of my life but she has always perceived me differently.We're in our 40's and we see each other several times a week, and spend the summers together at our family cottage, so it's not as if she forgot, it is simply the way she perceives me. It's especially interesting as it pertains to a physical attribute, rather than a perception of personality or behavior, which is what I'd tend to consider to be the more subjective.
Our propensity to believe that we're rational thinkers, leads us to imagine that what we see and believe is the truth, rather than a perceived reality, based on our personal assumptions. We search for and surround ourselves with people, research and ideas, that support us rather than challenge us because of the comfort we naturally seek. It's not about right or wrong it's more about trying to make meaning and find comfort that stands in the way of really free thinking. We tend to gravitate toward what we conceive of as concrete and we're weary of abstract ideas which are harder to communicate and are more often misunderstood. Being a parent and feeling responsible for the outcome of another's life is a frightening endeavor however inconsequential our role may in fact be.
Standing by and watching our children "waste" their time with activity that we perceive/know will lead to negative outcomes is as difficult with grown children/people as it is with young ones who we have "control" over. The difference is that an older child/person might, at some point, insist on their autonomy being respected and will spend their time with those they perceive as respecting them. The little ones feel shame and anger but it takes them sometime to learn what to do with it. They are totally dependent on our benevolence and they know it. I've see the fear in my children's eyes more times than I'd like to admit. They don't know what a parents love feels like, they truly fear that my feelings could change and I might reject them. I nursed them all until they were 4 or 5, they sleep with us in our family bed until they decide they want more privacy, we remind them that their home is with us and for as long as we're alive we'll share all that we have, and still, I see that fear in their innocent faces when I push them or show them my disapproval.
If your worried about TV and Video games offer them an alternative activity that they will agree to. Take them to the park or for a bike ride, play a game together, involve them in the cooking or the house work etc... I've always found that when the kids are young they'd rather do something with me than anything else. That changes with teens and once they're sexual you can say good bye to the good times for a while! I'm too old to get on this roller coaster again and I fear that their heartbreaks and mistakes are harder for me to endure than my own were.
Leslie
ps. Joyce your link didn't work for me.
Joyce
Thanks for these ideas Joyce. You reminded me of an observation my sister made last week. It may seem totally unrelated to many of you but I think it's part of this discussion. She remarked that it looked like my bust had shrunk :~) In fact I'm the same size as I've been for most of my life but she has always perceived me differently.We're in our 40's and we see each other several times a week, and spend the summers together at our family cottage, so it's not as if she forgot, it is simply the way she perceives me. It's especially interesting as it pertains to a physical attribute, rather than a perception of personality or behavior, which is what I'd tend to consider to be the more subjective.
Our propensity to believe that we're rational thinkers, leads us to imagine that what we see and believe is the truth, rather than a perceived reality, based on our personal assumptions. We search for and surround ourselves with people, research and ideas, that support us rather than challenge us because of the comfort we naturally seek. It's not about right or wrong it's more about trying to make meaning and find comfort that stands in the way of really free thinking. We tend to gravitate toward what we conceive of as concrete and we're weary of abstract ideas which are harder to communicate and are more often misunderstood. Being a parent and feeling responsible for the outcome of another's life is a frightening endeavor however inconsequential our role may in fact be.
Standing by and watching our children "waste" their time with activity that we perceive/know will lead to negative outcomes is as difficult with grown children/people as it is with young ones who we have "control" over. The difference is that an older child/person might, at some point, insist on their autonomy being respected and will spend their time with those they perceive as respecting them. The little ones feel shame and anger but it takes them sometime to learn what to do with it. They are totally dependent on our benevolence and they know it. I've see the fear in my children's eyes more times than I'd like to admit. They don't know what a parents love feels like, they truly fear that my feelings could change and I might reject them. I nursed them all until they were 4 or 5, they sleep with us in our family bed until they decide they want more privacy, we remind them that their home is with us and for as long as we're alive we'll share all that we have, and still, I see that fear in their innocent faces when I push them or show them my disapproval.
If your worried about TV and Video games offer them an alternative activity that they will agree to. Take them to the park or for a bike ride, play a game together, involve them in the cooking or the house work etc... I've always found that when the kids are young they'd rather do something with me than anything else. That changes with teens and once they're sexual you can say good bye to the good times for a while! I'm too old to get on this roller coaster again and I fear that their heartbreaks and mistakes are harder for me to endure than my own were.
Leslie
ps. Joyce your link didn't work for me.
----- Original Message -----
From: Fetteroll
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2001 6:45 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Deschooling-video games
on 11/9/01 2:03 PM, Lynda at lurine@... wrote:
> "LIKE" was the operative word. "LIKE mindless little bloobs" is a
> descriptive phrase used to describe how they may look as they sit there. It
> does not say anything whatsoever about the child's ability to think. Please
> try to read what I wrote, not what you have decided I am writing.
> And, actually a study was done that shows that some children, a limited
> number, do not think while "zoning" in front of the boob tube. Some
> children actually go into an almost sleep/dream state, a sort of
> self-hypnosis inwhich they brain waves patterns indicate no active thought
> patterns.
Can you site a source for this? I can't seem to find one. What I did find
(over and over and over) is a quote from "Battle for Your Mind: Subliminal
Programming": by Dick Sutphen:
> Recent tests by researcher Herbert Krugman showed that, while
> viewers were watching TV, right-brain activity outnumbered left-brain
> activity by a ratio of two to one. Put more simply, the viewers were
> in an altered state . . . in trance more often than not. They were
> getting their Beta-endorphin "fix."
>
> To measure attention spans, psychophysiologist Thomas Mulholland
> of the Veterans Hospital in Bedford, Massachusetts, attached young
> viewers to an EEG machine that was wired to shut the TV set off
> whenever the children's brains produced a majority of alpha waves.
> Although the children were told to concentrate, only a few could
> keep the set on for more than 30 seconds!
Left brain activity (according to an anatomy and physiology text) is
associated with spoken and written language, numerical and scientific skills
and reasoning. Right brain activity is associated with musical and artistic
awareness, space and pattern perception, insight, imagination, generating
mental images to compare spatial relationships. (No connection is made
between right brained activities and being in a trance like state.)
>From that list, it makes sense to me that TV watching would be a right
brained activity. I suppose if there's something inherently wrong with right
brained activities, we should stop kids from drawing and imagining and being
insightful.
The text says that alpha waves are present in the EEGs of nearly all normal
individuals when they are awake and resting with their eyes closed. These
waves disappear entirely during sleep. Beta waves generally appear when the
nervous system is active, that is, during periods of sensory input and
mental activity. (Not that it says generally.)
(Just as an interesting factoid, it says delta waves occur during deep sleep
but they are also normal in an awake infant.)
Another site says alpha waves are brought out by closing the eyes and by
relaxation, and abolished by eye opening or alerting by any mechanism
(thinking, calculating). It is the major rhythm seen in normal relaxed
adults - it is present during most of life especially beyond the thirteenth
year when it dominates the resting tracing. (Alpha waves are also present
during meditation and hypnosis.) And that beta waves are the dominant rhythm
in patients who are alert or anxious or who have their eyes open.
That would suggest people aren¹t thinking when they watch TV. But does that
make sense? I could list off a huge number of things that I¹ve learned from
watching TV. How can learning take place without thinking? There is also
research into Controlling Computers With Neural Signals (in Scientific
American at http://www.sciam.com/1096issue/1096lusted.html) which uses Alpha
and Mu waves. If alpha waves stop when thought happens, how could those
waves be used to perform a computer action if we have to stop thinking in
order to generate them?
What it really means is that people enjoy dabbling in pseudoscience. They
are using faulty logic -- hypnosis may generate alpha but that doesn¹t mean
alpha indicates hypnosis, thinking may generate beta but that doesn¹t mean
that beta indicates thinking (or that lack of beta means lack of thinking)
-- to draw a conclusion to fit their theory.
To get a more complete picture we¹d need to know what the waves look like
when we¹re deeply involved in a novel. Or watching a play. Or playing a
video game. Or watching a sporting event. Or painting. Or gazing down at a
sleeping or nursing infant. (Not that it would indicate anything. It would
just be more data on how the brain operates.) If alpha waves increased
during those times, should we stop those things? Or does it merely mean that
³thinking stops alpha waves² and ³beta is present during mental activity²
are too simplistic and don¹t adequately describe what¹s going on?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Leslie
a sort of self-hypnosis in which the brain waves patterns indicate no active thought patterns.
This happens to my mother every time I talk about unschooling.
Deb L
My mother, like most in our society, can finally cope with the idea of "homeschooling"! I wouldn't dare shake her up any more just yet :~D It's taken her 12 years to get to where she is now.
Leslie
This happens to my mother every time I talk about unschooling.
Deb L
My mother, like most in our society, can finally cope with the idea of "homeschooling"! I wouldn't dare shake her up any more just yet :~D It's taken her 12 years to get to where she is now.
Leslie
----- Original Message -----
From: ddzimlew@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2001 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Deschooling-video games
>
Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
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> he was watch all TV all the time he barely communicated at all. Infact
> you could walk in the room and talk to him and he would not evenknow it,
> it was like he just went completely away.I can say that I sometimes get this way...<g> We have 7 people in
>
our house and we make alot of noise. So when there is a show on that
I really want to watch. I have to really pay attention to hear and
understand the show. Tommy (hubby) always pokes fun at me cause I
don't hear anything around me. He'll come in the room and talk to
me...but I'm in my own little world TRYING to watch my show ..hehehe
I don't limit the t.v. I limit the shows that the children watch. I
don't like them watching rugrats or cartoons all day (since we have
seen all the shows a million times anyway). Some shows are
great...the children learn ALOT from them. Some people learn more in
this way, than in reading. BUt everyone is different!!
SHAWN
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In a message dated 11/9/01 12:11:15 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
lurine@... writes:
that one! I am struggling, usually without support from or against views of
family and friends, with LOTS of stuff in my life, unschooling is only one of
them.
As parents we all come into this arena of life from varying backgrounds.
Usually, we're doing the best we can with what we've got. Not spanking may
come quite naturally to one mother while it is a huge leap in changing
philosophy to another. Support and compassion make more changes that cold
truth and judgement.
I've also learned that making mistakes is a very important necessary, part of
learning.
And as far as the specifics, tv, workbooks, bedtimes, etc. I think that love,
openness and willing to change are more important than doing everything
'right'. Some of us may not be 'pure' unschoolers, but we're a far cry closer
than we were when we started.
And, yes Lynda, big pats on the back for all of us!!
Brenda
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lurine@... writes:
> All steps toward unschooling are good steps,I haven't read all of the posts on this thread but wanted to shout hoorah to
> even baby steps and even when one sometimes takes one step backwards as long
> as one's next steps are a vigorous forward!
>
> Lynda
>
that one! I am struggling, usually without support from or against views of
family and friends, with LOTS of stuff in my life, unschooling is only one of
them.
As parents we all come into this arena of life from varying backgrounds.
Usually, we're doing the best we can with what we've got. Not spanking may
come quite naturally to one mother while it is a huge leap in changing
philosophy to another. Support and compassion make more changes that cold
truth and judgement.
I've also learned that making mistakes is a very important necessary, part of
learning.
And as far as the specifics, tv, workbooks, bedtimes, etc. I think that love,
openness and willing to change are more important than doing everything
'right'. Some of us may not be 'pure' unschoolers, but we're a far cry closer
than we were when we started.
And, yes Lynda, big pats on the back for all of us!!
Brenda
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]