Jon and Rue Kream

*disclaimer: Kathy, I understand you said you didn't agree with everything
in the article, so I am picking on the good Dr., not you*

Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things like,
"1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her a dollar
a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing", so maybe this
article annoyed me more than it usually would have :), but...this man
seriously stated that the ages of 3-6 serve the developmental purpose of
preparing children for school, that we should make sure our kids are the
same SIZE as the other children in their class, and that not sending your
kids to school deprives them of the stimualtion they need to mature! He
also assumes that if the kids don't go to kindergarten, they'll be in
preschool anyway. I'm going to go bang my head against the wall for a
while. Anybody want to pay me a dollar to do it? ~Rue

-----Original Message-----
From: MICHAEL MARTINEZ [mailto:mamkmm2@...]
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2001 7:52 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......


I found this article interesting .... though of course I don't agree or
espouse everything that was said. But, it is interesting to see that even
those contemplating sending their children to a traditional school setting
are considering the issues of "school readiness" and developmental
readiness.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/574210.asp?bt=prgy

Kathy in FL mamkmm2@...
My Website: http://www.easyfunschool.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com

To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom

Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
http://www.home-ed-magazine.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

MICHAEL MARTINEZ

I found this article interesting .... though of course I don't agree or espouse everything that was said. But, it is interesting to see that even those contemplating sending their children to a traditional school setting are considering the issues of "school readiness" and developmental readiness.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/574210.asp?bt=prgy

Kathy in FL mamkmm2@...
My Website: http://www.easyfunschool.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jon and Rue Kream

Somebody else at the bbq was saying that playing classical music raised IQs.
I said, "We try not to do anything that would increase their intelligence".
Dead silence :) The whole school conversation just stopped. I'll have to
remember it for the next family get together. ~Rue

-----Original Message-----
From: Angela [mailto:unschooling@...]
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2001 9:06 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......


Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things like,
"1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her a
dollar
a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing",

I have some inlaws who pay their children money depending on what grades
they get. I think this is so sad. When I asked "What ever happened to
their love of learning?" She didn't *get* my question at first and then
thought hard about it and said it went away in abouth 2nd grade. But she
didn't think that it had anything to do with how the schools teach or
anything................ (like it is so obvious) They think we are total
nuts to home school. Wait till they find out we unschool! Actually, I
think I sent them a link to my web page but I never heard anything about it.
We are just the odd relatives in the family. Ain't it great!!! ;-)

Angela in Maine
Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
www.geocities.com/



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com

To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom

Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
http://www.home-ed-magazine.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Angela

Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things like,
"1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her a
dollar
a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing",

I have some inlaws who pay their children money depending on what grades
they get. I think this is so sad. When I asked "What ever happened to
their love of learning?" She didn't *get* my question at first and then
thought hard about it and said it went away in abouth 2nd grade. But she
didn't think that it had anything to do with how the schools teach or
anything................ (like it is so obvious) They think we are total
nuts to home school. Wait till they find out we unschool! Actually, I
think I sent them a link to my web page but I never heard anything about it.
We are just the odd relatives in the family. Ain't it great!!! ;-)

Angela in Maine
Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
www.geocities.com/



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Angela

LOL, Rue!! That's a great one when you don't feel up to trying to convince
the the closed minded!!

Angela in Maine
Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
www.geocities.com/autonomousangela


-----
Somebody else at the bbq was saying that playing classical music raised
IQs.
I said, "We try not to do anything that would increase their
intelligence".
Dead silence :) The whole school conversation just stopped. I'll have to
remember it for the next family get together. ~Rue




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Valerie Stewart

Somebody else at the bbq was saying that playing classical music raised IQs.
I said, "We try not to do anything that would increase their intelligence".
Dead silence :) The whole school conversation just stopped. I'll have to
remember it for the next family get together. ~Rue

***Oh Rue, you wicked thing! Can I use that line next time I need one? I'm
getting tired of "We're letting them raise themselves."

Valerie in Tacoma

dawn

On Sun, 20 May 2001, Jon and Rue Kream wrote:

> Somebody else at the bbq was saying that playing classical music raised IQs.
> I said, "We try not to do anything that would increase their intelligence".
> Dead silence :) The whole school conversation just stopped. I'll have to
> remember it for the next family get together. ~Rue
>
:) I like that response. My sil just yesterday said (knowing they will
be sending their kids to high-powered private academies), "I can't just
let mine run wild like you do...I have to help them enhance their
intelectual capacities" to which I answered, "OH, that's too
bad." Followed up by, "THat's why I nurse mine for 7 years.....I want to
make sure they get all the brain power they have coming to them
naturally."
dhs

Jon and Rue Kream

Today Dagny and I decided that since we don't really want to write for 1/2
hour a day, this summer we are going to try a new ice cream once a week.
Sounds like more fun, doesn't it? Dagny thinks her cousin should write,
"My dad sucks. He's giving me a dollar to write this" over and over :).
~Rue

-----Original Message-----
From: dawn [mailto:dawn@...]
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 10:01 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......


On Sun, 20 May 2001, Jon and Rue Kream wrote:

> Somebody else at the bbq was saying that playing classical music raised
IQs.
> I said, "We try not to do anything that would increase their
intelligence".
> Dead silence :) The whole school conversation just stopped. I'll have to
> remember it for the next family get together. ~Rue
>
:) I like that response. My sil just yesterday said (knowing they will
be sending their kids to high-powered private academies), "I can't just
let mine run wild like you do...I have to help them enhance their
intelectual capacities" to which I answered, "OH, that's too
bad." Followed up by, "THat's why I nurse mine for 7 years.....I want to
make sure they get all the brain power they have coming to them
naturally."
dhs


Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com

To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom

Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
http://www.home-ed-magazine.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Jon and Rue Kream

What is this obsession with making kids smarter, anyway? Why don't we try
to make them taller, so they can reach things? Or, maybe if we get some
experts to do some studies, we can figure out how to make their toes grow
longer so they can use their feet as hands. Seems a lot simpler (and
kinder) to take them as they are. ~Rue

-----Original Message-----
From: SandraDodd@... [mailto:SandraDodd@...]
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 10:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......



In a message dated 5/21/01 8:37:14 AM, dawn@... writes:

<< "I can't just let mine run wild like you do...I have to help them enhance
their
intelectual capacities" >>

GROSS!!
Poor kids.
Limited in their intellectual capacities by a mom like that...

Moms never know what their kids are thinking at any given moment while
they're playing outside in the wind (might be discovering all kinds of
thoughts about physics or weather or world peace or music), nor do they have
a clue what a kid is thinking while he's gazing in the direction of a
classic
novel or a history text (could be thinking about how cool it would be to be
playing outside in the wind, or about how his butt itches, or how rock salt
works around an ice cream crank).

Sandra

Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com

To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom

Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
http://www.home-ed-magazine.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/21/01 8:37:14 AM, dawn@... writes:

<< "I can't just let mine run wild like you do...I have to help them enhance
their
intelectual capacities" >>

GROSS!!
Poor kids.
Limited in their intellectual capacities by a mom like that...

Moms never know what their kids are thinking at any given moment while
they're playing outside in the wind (might be discovering all kinds of
thoughts about physics or weather or world peace or music), nor do they have
a clue what a kid is thinking while he's gazing in the direction of a classic
novel or a history text (could be thinking about how cool it would be to be
playing outside in the wind, or about how his butt itches, or how rock salt
works around an ice cream crank).

Sandra

Valerie Stewart

What is this obsession with making kids smarter, anyway? Why don't we try
to make them taller, so they can reach things? ~Rue

***No, no! My 11 yo daughter is nearly my height already (5'7"). I'm
thinking of following through with her father's threat of tying bricks to
the top of her head so she can't grow anymore.

Valerie in Tacoma

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/21/01 9:11:18 AM, skreams@... writes:

<< Why don't we try
to make them taller, so they can reach things? >>

Isn't that what Wonder Bread is for?

(Oh, no, wait--that's stronger bodies twelve ways...)

We claim not to believe in magic in this culture, but we have magical
talismans and sacrifices all around us. "I will play Bach and turn off the
TV so my children will be smarter." "We will not wear t-shirts or sleep on
sheets with commercial art on them." "I will not let my children watch R or
PG 13 rated movies, and therefore they will have no cause for video-induced
disturbance."

"...hardbound books instead of paperback."

"...organic cola instead of Coke..."

Magic talismans.
Wishful, hopeful juju instead of dealing directly with the child's ideas and
feelings, sometimes.

And people with kids in school? All of the above plus:
Strict bedtimes
homework hours and requirements
grade average requirements to qualify for sports and extracurricular
activities
commute in a European car instead of American to ensure safety
wear certain clothing to avoid distraction and to impress other kids and
teachers

Many of people's everyday decisions and choices don't have to do with other
people directly, but with trying to guarantee a result or to affect the
unfolding of development.

Sandra

Tami Labig-Duquette

This reminds me of a cute story :)
When Ellysa was 5, her dad always said "go get a brick your growing to
fast", well we were making up our strawberry patch and asked Collin (our
son) to get some bricks in the wheelbarrow, Elly looked at me funny and said
" Are they for my head? I dont want them on my head". Poor dear LOL we
laughed and told her no one really puts bricks on anyones head its just a
saying, she wasnt amused at all.
Tami


>From: " Valerie Stewart" <vlos@...>
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: <[email protected]>
>Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......
>Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 08:12:13 -0700
>
>What is this obsession with making kids smarter, anyway? Why don't we try
>to make them taller, so they can reach things? ~Rue
>
>***No, no! My 11 yo daughter is nearly my height already (5'7"). I'm
>thinking of following through with her father's threat of tying bricks to
>the top of her head so she can't grow anymore.
>
>Valerie in Tacoma
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Lynda

Oh please, Rue, don't make their toes grow longer! They grow out of shoes
fast enough as is <g>

Lynda, who could use some taller folks in the house to reach the top shelves
for her <g>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jon and Rue Kream" <skreams@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 7:29 AM
Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......


> What is this obsession with making kids smarter, anyway? Why don't we try
> to make them taller, so they can reach things? Or, maybe if we get some
> experts to do some studies, we can figure out how to make their toes grow
> longer so they can use their feet as hands. Seems a lot simpler (and
> kinder) to take them as they are. ~Rue
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SandraDodd@... [mailto:SandraDodd@...]
> Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 10:46 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......
>
>
>
> In a message dated 5/21/01 8:37:14 AM, dawn@... writes:
>
> << "I can't just let mine run wild like you do...I have to help them
enhance
> their
> intelectual capacities" >>
>
> GROSS!!
> Poor kids.
> Limited in their intellectual capacities by a mom like that...
>
> Moms never know what their kids are thinking at any given moment while
> they're playing outside in the wind (might be discovering all kinds of
> thoughts about physics or weather or world peace or music), nor do they
have
> a clue what a kid is thinking while he's gazing in the direction of a
> classic
> novel or a history text (could be thinking about how cool it would be to
be
> playing outside in the wind, or about how his butt itches, or how rock
salt
> works around an ice cream crank).
>
> Sandra
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

scrunchy

Wow!! Reading this makes me so glad we are unschooling. Thanks for
sharing it.
Norma

MICHAEL MARTINEZ wrote:

> I found this article interesting .... though of course I don't agree
> or espouse everything that was said. But, it is interesting to see
> that even those contemplating sending their children to a traditional
> school setting are considering the issues of "school readiness" and
> developmental readiness.
>
> http://www.msnbc.com/news/574210.asp?bt=prgy
>
> Kathy in FL mamkmm2@...
> My Website: http://www.easyfunschool.com
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

scrunchy

It sure is great!! I love it. :)
We have told family that we homeschool, but I don't think some of them
are ready for the idea of unschooling. What matters is that it works for
our child and us.
Norma

Angela wrote:

> Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things
> like,
> "1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her
> a
> dollar
> a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing",
>
> I have some inlaws who pay their children money depending on what
> grades
> they get. I think this is so sad. When I asked "What ever happened
> to
> their love of learning?" She didn't *get* my question at first and
> then
> thought hard about it and said it went away in abouth 2nd grade. But
> she
> didn't think that it had anything to do with how the schools teach or
> anything................ (like it is so obvious) They think we are
> total
> nuts to home school. Wait till they find out we unschool! Actually,
> I
> think I sent them a link to my web page but I never heard anything
> about it.
> We are just the odd relatives in the family. Ain't it great!!! ;-)
>
> Angela in Maine
> Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
> www.geocities.com/
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
[Yahoo! Website Services- Click Here!]
Yahoo! Website Services- Click Here!

>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Johanna

yeah, black sheep, radical, a few cards short, strange, a hippie, i've been called them all at various times. Nothing like an original!!
Johanna
Life is the ultimate learning experience!
----- Original Message -----
From: Angela
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2001 8:05 PM
Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......


Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things like,
"1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her a
dollar
a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing",

I have some inlaws who pay their children money depending on what grades
they get. I think this is so sad. When I asked "What ever happened to
their love of learning?" She didn't *get* my question at first and then
thought hard about it and said it went away in abouth 2nd grade. But she
didn't think that it had anything to do with how the schools teach or
anything................ (like it is so obvious) They think we are total
nuts to home school. Wait till they find out we unschool! Actually, I
think I sent them a link to my web page but I never heard anything about it.
We are just the odd relatives in the family. Ain't it great!!! ;-)

Angela in Maine
Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
www.geocities.com/



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

Yahoo! Website Services- Click Here!


Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com

To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom

Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
http://www.home-ed-magazine.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Lynda

Well, personally I find words like "normal," "average," "grade level" and a
few others to be quite offensive AND *boring*!!!!!!!!!

I'll take hippie, etc. anyday over the rest!

Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Johanna" <saninocencio1@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, May 21, 2001 9:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......


> yeah, black sheep, radical, a few cards short, strange, a hippie, i've
been called them all at various times. Nothing like an original!!
> Johanna
> Life is the ultimate learning experience!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Angela
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2001 8:05 PM
> Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......
>
>
> Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things
like,
> "1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her a
> dollar
> a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing",
>
> I have some inlaws who pay their children money depending on what
grades
> they get. I think this is so sad. When I asked "What ever happened to
> their love of learning?" She didn't *get* my question at first and then
> thought hard about it and said it went away in abouth 2nd grade. But
she
> didn't think that it had anything to do with how the schools teach or
> anything................ (like it is so obvious) They think we are
total
> nuts to home school. Wait till they find out we unschool! Actually, I
> think I sent them a link to my web page but I never heard anything about
it.
> We are just the odd relatives in the family. Ain't it great!!! ;-)
>
> Angela in Maine
> Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
> www.geocities.com/
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
> Yahoo! Website Services- Click Here!
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Tami Labig-Duquette

Try topic of most conversation and much amusement! Thats me, the source for
my fam's talk and enjoyment! But hey I am there for them LOL
Tami


>From: "Johanna" <saninocencio1@...>
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: <[email protected]>
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......
>Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 23:45:01 -0500
>
>yeah, black sheep, radical, a few cards short, strange, a hippie, i've been
>called them all at various times. Nothing like an original!!
>Johanna
>Life is the ultimate learning experience!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Angela
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2001 8:05 PM
> Subject: RE: [Unschooling-dotcom] even traditional schoolers .......
>
>
> Ok, I just spent the day with a bunch of relatives who said things
>like,
> "1st grade is the most important year" and, "We're going to pay her a
> dollar
> a day over the summer if she does a 1/2 hour of writing",
>
> I have some inlaws who pay their children money depending on what
>grades
> they get. I think this is so sad. When I asked "What ever happened to
> their love of learning?" She didn't *get* my question at first and then
> thought hard about it and said it went away in abouth 2nd grade. But
>she
> didn't think that it had anything to do with how the schools teach or
> anything................ (like it is so obvious) They think we are
>total
> nuts to home school. Wait till they find out we unschool! Actually, I
> think I sent them a link to my web page but I never heard anything about
>it.
> We are just the odd relatives in the family. Ain't it great!!! ;-)
>
> Angela in Maine
> Unschooling mom to two beautiful daughters.
> www.geocities.com/
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
> Yahoo! Website Services- Click Here!
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com