Lynda

For those that have been worried about Gore's stand on homeschooling, this
should answer the question.

Lynda

----------
> email: townhall@...
>
> >From another list:
> http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
> Fwd: Re: [homeschooling_preK-K] Gore's Response to HSing ??
> **>Town Hall Question
> >
> >August 31, 2000
> >
> >I am a mother of six children and enjoy the freedom of home schooling. I
> >have not heard you address this issue. Do you feel parents should have
> >the freedom of choice to home school their children? This is a concern
> of
> >mine and I would like to hear your view of this subject.
> >
> >Yvonne Myrick
> >
> >Yvonne, thank you for visiting my website and asking an important
> >question about educating our children. As you well know, parents are a
> >child's first teachers. Home schooling is a growing effort by many
> >parents to direct the education of their children. There are no U.S.
> >Department of Education regulations related to home schooling. States
> >have set parameters, such as regular testing and reporting, to assure
> >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement or
> >discourage parents from teaching their children in their home.
> >
> >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase individual
> >attention for children. It can also increase parental involvement in
> >their children's lives. These elements are essential to improving
> >education for our children attending public schools as well. My
> >administration would be fully committed to making sure more students in
> >public schools get individual attention through Head Start, voluntary
> >universal preschool, and smaller classes. I wish you and your children
> >great success in home schooling.

Billy or Nancy

I don't think anyone should cast their vote on the basis of a single issue.
Homeschooling is but one of the factors you must evaluate when deciding who
to vote for.

Since this is a homeschooling forum, I will stay away from other issues and
point out the following:

Almost 1 in 10 of the delegates to the Democratic National Convention are
members of the NEA. The NEA (National Education Association - the largest
teachers union)has nearly 2.5 million members and the AFT (American
Federation of Teachers - another union) has more than 1 million members. In
the sphere of political influence, these two unions are extremely well
funded, represent 3.5 million members, and influence many people because
they have the image of representing "education" rather than being seen as a
unions that represents teachers. They have been against school choice,
accountability for teachers, charter schools, public money to support any
form of education other than government run schools, and school reform.
Their primary mantra is that all the educational problems would be solved if
more money was given to government run schools and teachers. (Private school
teachers are paid less than government school teachers and that the cost of
attending private school is less per student than the cost of government
school. Most people agree that private schools are doing better than the
government schools, so how can more money be the issue?)

Let's look at what Gore said in his response and I think you will see that
the words reveal some biases. Applying a Clintonesque interpretation of the
meaning of words, I see the following:

> > States
> > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> reporting, to assure
> > >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement . . .

So he would do nothing to alter states that have set parameters like testing
and reporting, but is the statement carefully worded to allow changes in
states that do not require testing or reporting?

> > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase individual
attention for > > >children. It can also increase parental involvement in
their children's lives.
> > >These elements are essential to improving education for our children
attending
> > >public schools as well.

Does anybody else detect that typical bias that sure, some people can
homeschool successfully, but not many? How many opponents to homeschooling
start off with saying that homeschooling can be very successful for "some"
families followed by a "but" and their list of objections. Notice that Gore
doesn't even say that homeschooling can be successful, only that it can
increase "individual attention" on the children and increase parental
involvement. He mentions that these are important for public school kids
too, and immediately uses that to segue into his initiatives for government
schools.

In his response, Gore does not use any adjectives to describe homeschooling.
He seems to be very careful to not say anything positive about it, while not
being negative either.

Clinton and Gore have been very reserved about homeschooling and have
expressed
concerns that while it can work out fine, accountability needs to be in
place to make sure the parents are doing their job.

Clinton said while he would not choose it for his own child, home schooling
can work well when students and parents are made to answer for the students'
learning.

"We should say, 'Look, there's a good way to do this and a not-so-good way
to do this,"' and require that home-schooled students meet academic
benchmarks, he said.

"But if you're going to do this," he added, "your children have to prove
that they're learning on a regular basis, and if they don't prove that
they're learning then they have to go into a school -- either into a
parochial or private school or a public school."

The Gore campaign has criticized Bush's stance on homeschooling as follows:

"Bush has repeatedly called for more accountability in public schools,
but has made no effort to apply those standards to home schooled
children. In Texas, Bush has supported home schooling, despite the
fact that Texas mandates no regulations on attendance or achievement
standards for home schooled students and requires no certification
for home school teachers. Texas officials have even criticized the
Texas system for offering the parents of truant children a way to get
around the system without actually educating their children."

Gore has even been against vouchers and school choice because of the
influence of the NEA, and Liberman had to retreat from his long held stance
of supporting vouchers once he got the VP nomination.

The record in Texas (which has one of the least restrictive homeschooling
laws in the nation) is a pretty good indicator of the Bush attitude about
homeschooling. Bush has a strong stand on public school accountability,
which I do not see as a conflict. Schools should be held accountable to
parents who are entrusting them to educate their children. Most parents with
children in public schools would definitely want that school accountable for
their education efforts. However, parents who take full responsibility for
the education of their own children do not have to be held to the same
standards. They are providing a service for themselves and their own
children and can judge if it is meeting their needs.

Here are some comments by someone who lived in Gore's home state:

>I lived in TN a few years ago when we were putting in a mobile home on some
>land. I swear we had to get a permit for blowing our noses!

>to homeschool your elementary kids was pretty simple, just
>have a high-school diploma or GED and tell what curriculum you'll be using
>to school your child(ren), *but* unless you had your BA you couldn't
>homeschool your middle or high schoolers unless you had an umbrella school.
>TN seemed to be extremely regulated in all areas.

In the area of education, I think it is clear that one candidate wants to
focus on improving government education and one candidate wants to focus on
improving education opportunities in a variety of formats.

Here are some links:

Homeschoolers for Bush
http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/

Bush letter in response to questions about homeschooling
http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/Bush%20Letter%20to%20Home%20School%20M
om.htm

Gore response to questions about homeschooling (second letter)
http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html

Democratic attack on Bush homeschooling stance
http://www.democrats.org/gopwatch/bushwatch/accountability/home.html

Link to parody of NEA homeschooling resolutions along with a link to actual
NEA resolutions
http://www.unschooling.org/resolutions.htm

Bottom line, I should also add that I think the President can strongly
influence the atmosphere and attitude toward homeschooling, but I do not
think you need to be concerned that the legality of homeschooling will be
immediately affected by the outcome of the election.

Billy



> -----Original Message-----
>
> For those that have been worried about Gore's stand on
> homeschooling, this
> should answer the question.

> > >From another list:
> > http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
> > Fwd: Re: [homeschooling_preK-K] Gore's Response to HSing ??
> > **>Town Hall Question

> > >Yvonne, thank you for visiting my website and asking an important
> > >question about educating our children. As you well know,
> parents are a
> > >child's first teachers. Home schooling is a growing effort by many
> > >parents to direct the education of their children. There
> are no U.S.
> > >Department of Education regulations related to home
> schooling. States
> > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> reporting, to assure
> > >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement or
> > >discourage parents from teaching their children in their home.
> > >
> > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase
> individual
> > >attention for children. It can also increase parental
> involvement in
> > >their children's lives. These elements are essential to improving
> > >education for our children attending public schools as well. My
> > >administration would be fully committed to making sure
> more students in
> > >public schools get individual attention through Head
> Start, voluntary
> > >universal preschool, and smaller classes. I wish you and
> your children
> > >great success in home schooling.

Bonnie Painter

I don't see any quotable sources (besides unnamed) to support what you are
saying. I think that to "translate" what Gore is saying and then quoting
"unnamed" sources to support your opinion is weak at best.

I also know that not all members of the NEA are against homeschooling since
my sister and sister-in-law are both members and teachers.

Bush's accountability adds to more testing. So now, the children will be
focusing even more on passing these "tests" and not on true learning. It is
a good thing that homeschooling will be flexible under Bush, since the kids
who are in public school will only be learning how to test and it will no
longer even be an option for us.

Just my opinion,

Bonnie


>From: "Billy or Nancy" <FUNLists@...>
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: <[email protected]>
>Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
>Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2000 12:02:27 -0400
>
>I don't think anyone should cast their vote on the basis of a single issue.
>Homeschooling is but one of the factors you must evaluate when deciding who
>to vote for.
>
>Since this is a homeschooling forum, I will stay away from other issues and
>point out the following:
>
>Almost 1 in 10 of the delegates to the Democratic National Convention are
>members of the NEA. The NEA (National Education Association - the largest
>teachers union)has nearly 2.5 million members and the AFT (American
>Federation of Teachers - another union) has more than 1 million members. In
>the sphere of political influence, these two unions are extremely well
>funded, represent 3.5 million members, and influence many people because
>they have the image of representing "education" rather than being seen as a
>unions that represents teachers. They have been against school choice,
>accountability for teachers, charter schools, public money to support any
>form of education other than government run schools, and school reform.
>Their primary mantra is that all the educational problems would be solved
>if
>more money was given to government run schools and teachers. (Private
>school
>teachers are paid less than government school teachers and that the cost of
>attending private school is less per student than the cost of government
>school. Most people agree that private schools are doing better than the
>government schools, so how can more money be the issue?)
>
>Let's look at what Gore said in his response and I think you will see that
>the words reveal some biases. Applying a Clintonesque interpretation of the
>meaning of words, I see the following:
>
> > > States
> > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > reporting, to assure
> > > >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement . . .
>
>So he would do nothing to alter states that have set parameters like
>testing
>and reporting, but is the statement carefully worded to allow changes in
>states that do not require testing or reporting?
>
> > > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase individual
>attention for > > >children. It can also increase parental involvement in
>their children's lives.
> > > >These elements are essential to improving education for our children
>attending
> > > >public schools as well.
>
>Does anybody else detect that typical bias that sure, some people can
>homeschool successfully, but not many? How many opponents to homeschooling
>start off with saying that homeschooling can be very successful for "some"
>families followed by a "but" and their list of objections. Notice that Gore
>doesn't even say that homeschooling can be successful, only that it can
>increase "individual attention" on the children and increase parental
>involvement. He mentions that these are important for public school kids
>too, and immediately uses that to segue into his initiatives for government
>schools.
>
>In his response, Gore does not use any adjectives to describe
>homeschooling.
>He seems to be very careful to not say anything positive about it, while
>not
>being negative either.
>
>Clinton and Gore have been very reserved about homeschooling and have
>expressed
>concerns that while it can work out fine, accountability needs to be in
>place to make sure the parents are doing their job.
>
>Clinton said while he would not choose it for his own child, home schooling
>can work well when students and parents are made to answer for the
>students'
>learning.
>
>"We should say, 'Look, there's a good way to do this and a not-so-good way
>to do this,"' and require that home-schooled students meet academic
>benchmarks, he said.
>
>"But if you're going to do this," he added, "your children have to prove
>that they're learning on a regular basis, and if they don't prove that
>they're learning then they have to go into a school -- either into a
>parochial or private school or a public school."
>
>The Gore campaign has criticized Bush's stance on homeschooling as follows:
>
> "Bush has repeatedly called for more accountability in public schools,
> but has made no effort to apply those standards to home schooled
> children. In Texas, Bush has supported home schooling, despite the
> fact that Texas mandates no regulations on attendance or achievement
> standards for home schooled students and requires no certification
> for home school teachers. Texas officials have even criticized the
> Texas system for offering the parents of truant children a way to get
> around the system without actually educating their children."
>
>Gore has even been against vouchers and school choice because of the
>influence of the NEA, and Liberman had to retreat from his long held stance
>of supporting vouchers once he got the VP nomination.
>
>The record in Texas (which has one of the least restrictive homeschooling
>laws in the nation) is a pretty good indicator of the Bush attitude about
>homeschooling. Bush has a strong stand on public school accountability,
>which I do not see as a conflict. Schools should be held accountable to
>parents who are entrusting them to educate their children. Most parents
>with
>children in public schools would definitely want that school accountable
>for
>their education efforts. However, parents who take full responsibility for
>the education of their own children do not have to be held to the same
>standards. They are providing a service for themselves and their own
>children and can judge if it is meeting their needs.
>
>Here are some comments by someone who lived in Gore's home state:
>
> >I lived in TN a few years ago when we were putting in a mobile home on
>some
> >land. I swear we had to get a permit for blowing our noses!
>
> >to homeschool your elementary kids was pretty simple, just
> >have a high-school diploma or GED and tell what curriculum you'll be
>using
> >to school your child(ren), *but* unless you had your BA you couldn't
> >homeschool your middle or high schoolers unless you had an umbrella
>school.
> >TN seemed to be extremely regulated in all areas.
>
>In the area of education, I think it is clear that one candidate wants to
>focus on improving government education and one candidate wants to focus on
>improving education opportunities in a variety of formats.
>
>Here are some links:
>
>Homeschoolers for Bush
>http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/
>
>Bush letter in response to questions about homeschooling
>http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/Bush%20Letter%20to%20Home%20School%20M
>om.htm
>
>Gore response to questions about homeschooling (second letter)
>http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
>
>Democratic attack on Bush homeschooling stance
>http://www.democrats.org/gopwatch/bushwatch/accountability/home.html
>
>Link to parody of NEA homeschooling resolutions along with a link to actual
>NEA resolutions
>http://www.unschooling.org/resolutions.htm
>
>Bottom line, I should also add that I think the President can strongly
>influence the atmosphere and attitude toward homeschooling, but I do not
>think you need to be concerned that the legality of homeschooling will be
>immediately affected by the outcome of the election.
>
>Billy
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > For those that have been worried about Gore's stand on
> > homeschooling, this
> > should answer the question.
>
> > > >From another list:
> > > http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
> > > Fwd: Re: [homeschooling_preK-K] Gore's Response to HSing ??
> > > **>Town Hall Question
>
> > > >Yvonne, thank you for visiting my website and asking an important
> > > >question about educating our children. As you well know,
> > parents are a
> > > >child's first teachers. Home schooling is a growing effort by many
> > > >parents to direct the education of their children. There
> > are no U.S.
> > > >Department of Education regulations related to home
> > schooling. States
> > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > reporting, to assure
> > > >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement or
> > > >discourage parents from teaching their children in their home.
> > > >
> > > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase
> > individual
> > > >attention for children. It can also increase parental
> > involvement in
> > > >their children's lives. These elements are essential to improving
> > > >education for our children attending public schools as well. My
> > > >administration would be fully committed to making sure
> > more students in
> > > >public schools get individual attention through Head
> > Start, voluntary
> > > >universal preschool, and smaller classes. I wish you and
> > your children
> > > >great success in home schooling.
>

_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

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Lynda

Let's take a good look at Dubya's letter:

"Education, in every form, must be concerned primarily about results."

This is straight out of a Farris campaign for testing.

"Home-schooling has shown those results. Research shows that children
taught at home consistently score higher on national standardized tests of
reading, math and language skills."

Reference to H$LDA backed research using testing.

Although some have called home-schooling a "non-traditional" approach to
education, the idea goes way back - and is mentioned in the Book of
Proverbs: "Hear, my son, your father's instruction. And do not forsake your
mother's teaching." That's about as traditional as it gets. As President, I
will work to protect and preserve this noble tradition in America.

Again, a reference straight from the 3R's backed Farris approach to
homeschooling. And exactly whose "noble tradition" will he use as the
model? H$LDA's?

And, looking close to home, which I figure brother Jeb is, Florida is a
mess and is knee deep in Farris manipulated garbage in homeschooling and
Gothard in public schools.

Lynda who doesn't want Farris or H$LDA or Gothard in her business!
----------
> From: Billy or Nancy <FUNLists@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> Date: Sunday, October 01, 2000 9:02 AM
>
> I don't think anyone should cast their vote on the basis of a single
issue.
> Homeschooling is but one of the factors you must evaluate when deciding
who
> to vote for.
>
> Since this is a homeschooling forum, I will stay away from other issues
and
> point out the following:
>
> Almost 1 in 10 of the delegates to the Democratic National Convention are
> members of the NEA. The NEA (National Education Association - the largest
> teachers union)has nearly 2.5 million members and the AFT (American
> Federation of Teachers - another union) has more than 1 million members.
In
> the sphere of political influence, these two unions are extremely well
> funded, represent 3.5 million members, and influence many people because
> they have the image of representing "education" rather than being seen as
a
> unions that represents teachers. They have been against school choice,
> accountability for teachers, charter schools, public money to support any
> form of education other than government run schools, and school reform.
> Their primary mantra is that all the educational problems would be solved
if
> more money was given to government run schools and teachers. (Private
school
> teachers are paid less than government school teachers and that the cost
of
> attending private school is less per student than the cost of government
> school. Most people agree that private schools are doing better than the
> government schools, so how can more money be the issue?)
>
> Let's look at what Gore said in his response and I think you will see
that
> the words reveal some biases. Applying a Clintonesque interpretation of
the
> meaning of words, I see the following:
>
> > > States
> > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > reporting, to assure
> > > >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement . . .
>
> So he would do nothing to alter states that have set parameters like
testing
> and reporting, but is the statement carefully worded to allow changes in
> states that do not require testing or reporting?
>
> > > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase individual
> attention for > > >children. It can also increase parental involvement in
> their children's lives.
> > > >These elements are essential to improving education for our children
> attending
> > > >public schools as well.
>
> Does anybody else detect that typical bias that sure, some people can
> homeschool successfully, but not many? How many opponents to
homeschooling
> start off with saying that homeschooling can be very successful for
"some"
> families followed by a "but" and their list of objections. Notice that
Gore
> doesn't even say that homeschooling can be successful, only that it can
> increase "individual attention" on the children and increase parental
> involvement. He mentions that these are important for public school kids
> too, and immediately uses that to segue into his initiatives for
government
> schools.
>
> In his response, Gore does not use any adjectives to describe
homeschooling.
> He seems to be very careful to not say anything positive about it, while
not
> being negative either.
>
> Clinton and Gore have been very reserved about homeschooling and have
> expressed
> concerns that while it can work out fine, accountability needs to be in
> place to make sure the parents are doing their job.
>
> Clinton said while he would not choose it for his own child, home
schooling
> can work well when students and parents are made to answer for the
students'
> learning.
>
> "We should say, 'Look, there's a good way to do this and a not-so-good
way
> to do this,"' and require that home-schooled students meet academic
> benchmarks, he said.
>
> "But if you're going to do this," he added, "your children have to prove
> that they're learning on a regular basis, and if they don't prove that
> they're learning then they have to go into a school -- either into a
> parochial or private school or a public school."
>
> The Gore campaign has criticized Bush's stance on homeschooling as
follows:
>
> "Bush has repeatedly called for more accountability in public schools,
> but has made no effort to apply those standards to home schooled
> children. In Texas, Bush has supported home schooling, despite the
> fact that Texas mandates no regulations on attendance or achievement
> standards for home schooled students and requires no certification
> for home school teachers. Texas officials have even criticized the
> Texas system for offering the parents of truant children a way to get
> around the system without actually educating their children."
>
> Gore has even been against vouchers and school choice because of the
> influence of the NEA, and Liberman had to retreat from his long held
stance
> of supporting vouchers once he got the VP nomination.
>
> The record in Texas (which has one of the least restrictive homeschooling
> laws in the nation) is a pretty good indicator of the Bush attitude about
> homeschooling. Bush has a strong stand on public school accountability,
> which I do not see as a conflict. Schools should be held accountable to
> parents who are entrusting them to educate their children. Most parents
with
> children in public schools would definitely want that school accountable
for
> their education efforts. However, parents who take full responsibility
for
> the education of their own children do not have to be held to the same
> standards. They are providing a service for themselves and their own
> children and can judge if it is meeting their needs.
>
> Here are some comments by someone who lived in Gore's home state:
>
> >I lived in TN a few years ago when we were putting in a mobile home on
some
> >land. I swear we had to get a permit for blowing our noses!
>
> >to homeschool your elementary kids was pretty simple, just
> >have a high-school diploma or GED and tell what curriculum you'll be
using
> >to school your child(ren), *but* unless you had your BA you couldn't
> >homeschool your middle or high schoolers unless you had an umbrella
school.
> >TN seemed to be extremely regulated in all areas.
>
> In the area of education, I think it is clear that one candidate wants to
> focus on improving government education and one candidate wants to focus
on
> improving education opportunities in a variety of formats.
>
> Here are some links:
>
> Homeschoolers for Bush
> http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/
>
> Bush letter in response to questions about homeschooling
>
http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/Bush%20Letter%20to%20Home%20School%20M
om.htm
> om.htm
>
> Gore response to questions about homeschooling (second letter)
> http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
>
> Democratic attack on Bush homeschooling stance
> http://www.democrats.org/gopwatch/bushwatch/accountability/home.html
>
> Link to parody of NEA homeschooling resolutions along with a link to
actual
> NEA resolutions
> http://www.unschooling.org/resolutions.htm
>
> Bottom line, I should also add that I think the President can strongly
> influence the atmosphere and attitude toward homeschooling, but I do not
> think you need to be concerned that the legality of homeschooling will be
> immediately affected by the outcome of the election.
>
> Billy
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > For those that have been worried about Gore's stand on
> > homeschooling, this
> > should answer the question.
>
> > > >From another list:
> > > http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
> > > Fwd: Re: [homeschooling_preK-K] Gore's Response to HSing ??
> > > **>Town Hall Question
>
> > > >Yvonne, thank you for visiting my website and asking an important
> > > >question about educating our children. As you well know,
> > parents are a
> > > >child's first teachers. Home schooling is a growing effort by many
> > > >parents to direct the education of their children. There
> > are no U.S.
> > > >Department of Education regulations related to home
> > schooling. States
> > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > reporting, to assure
> > > >that children in home school settings are learning and progressing.
> > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement or
> > > >discourage parents from teaching their children in their home.
> > > >
> > > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase
> > individual
> > > >attention for children. It can also increase parental
> > involvement in
> > > >their children's lives. These elements are essential to improving
> > > >education for our children attending public schools as well. My
> > > >administration would be fully committed to making sure
> > more students in
> > > >public schools get individual attention through Head
> > Start, voluntary
> > > >universal preschool, and smaller classes. I wish you and
> > your children
> > > >great success in home schooling.
>
>
>
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Lynda

Before believing that homeschooling will be flexible under the shrub, take
a close look at Florida and who the shrub thinks walks on water (H$LDA).

Lynda

----------
> From: Bonnie Painter <bonniepainter@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> Date: Sunday, October 01, 2000 9:41 AM
>
> I don't see any quotable sources (besides unnamed) to support what you
are
> saying. I think that to "translate" what Gore is saying and then quoting

> "unnamed" sources to support your opinion is weak at best.
>
> I also know that not all members of the NEA are against homeschooling
since
> my sister and sister-in-law are both members and teachers.
>
> Bush's accountability adds to more testing. So now, the children will be

> focusing even more on passing these "tests" and not on true learning. It
is
> a good thing that homeschooling will be flexible under Bush, since the
kids
> who are in public school will only be learning how to test and it will no

> longer even be an option for us.
>
> Just my opinion,
>
> Bonnie
>
>
> >From: "Billy or Nancy" <FUNLists@...>
> >Reply-To: [email protected]
> >To: <[email protected]>
> >Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> >Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2000 12:02:27 -0400
> >
> >I don't think anyone should cast their vote on the basis of a single
issue.
> >Homeschooling is but one of the factors you must evaluate when deciding
who
> >to vote for.
> >
> >Since this is a homeschooling forum, I will stay away from other issues
and
> >point out the following:
> >
> >Almost 1 in 10 of the delegates to the Democratic National Convention
are
> >members of the NEA. The NEA (National Education Association - the
largest
> >teachers union)has nearly 2.5 million members and the AFT (American
> >Federation of Teachers - another union) has more than 1 million members.
In
> >the sphere of political influence, these two unions are extremely well
> >funded, represent 3.5 million members, and influence many people because
> >they have the image of representing "education" rather than being seen
as a
> >unions that represents teachers. They have been against school choice,
> >accountability for teachers, charter schools, public money to support
any
> >form of education other than government run schools, and school reform.
> >Their primary mantra is that all the educational problems would be
solved
> >if
> >more money was given to government run schools and teachers. (Private
> >school
> >teachers are paid less than government school teachers and that the cost
of
> >attending private school is less per student than the cost of government
> >school. Most people agree that private schools are doing better than the
> >government schools, so how can more money be the issue?)
> >
> >Let's look at what Gore said in his response and I think you will see
that
> >the words reveal some biases. Applying a Clintonesque interpretation of
the
> >meaning of words, I see the following:
> >
> > > > States
> > > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > > reporting, to assure
> > > > >that children in home school settings are learning and
progressing.
> > > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement . .

Lynda

Before believing that homeschooling will be flexible under the shrub, take
a close look at Florida and who the shrub thinks walks on water (H$LDA).

Lynda

----------
> From: Bonnie Painter <bonniepainter@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> Date: Sunday, October 01, 2000 9:41 AM
>
> I don't see any quotable sources (besides unnamed) to support what you
are
> saying. I think that to "translate" what Gore is saying and then quoting

> "unnamed" sources to support your opinion is weak at best.
>
> I also know that not all members of the NEA are against homeschooling
since
> my sister and sister-in-law are both members and teachers.
>
> Bush's accountability adds to more testing. So now, the children will be

> focusing even more on passing these "tests" and not on true learning. It
is
> a good thing that homeschooling will be flexible under Bush, since the
kids
> who are in public school will only be learning how to test and it will no

> longer even be an option for us.
>
> Just my opinion,
>
> Bonnie
>
>
> >From: "Billy or Nancy" <FUNLists@...>
> >Reply-To: [email protected]
> >To: <[email protected]>
> >Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> >Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2000 12:02:27 -0400
> >
> >I don't think anyone should cast their vote on the basis of a single
issue.
> >Homeschooling is but one of the factors you must evaluate when deciding
who
> >to vote for.
> >
> >Since this is a homeschooling forum, I will stay away from other issues
and
> >point out the following:
> >
> >Almost 1 in 10 of the delegates to the Democratic National Convention
are
> >members of the NEA. The NEA (National Education Association - the
largest
> >teachers union)has nearly 2.5 million members and the AFT (American
> >Federation of Teachers - another union) has more than 1 million members.
In
> >the sphere of political influence, these two unions are extremely well
> >funded, represent 3.5 million members, and influence many people because
> >they have the image of representing "education" rather than being seen
as a
> >unions that represents teachers. They have been against school choice,
> >accountability for teachers, charter schools, public money to support
any
> >form of education other than government run schools, and school reform.
> >Their primary mantra is that all the educational problems would be
solved
> >if
> >more money was given to government run schools and teachers. (Private
> >school
> >teachers are paid less than government school teachers and that the cost
of
> >attending private school is less per student than the cost of government
> >school. Most people agree that private schools are doing better than the
> >government schools, so how can more money be the issue?)
> >
> >Let's look at what Gore said in his response and I think you will see
that
> >the words reveal some biases. Applying a Clintonesque interpretation of
the
> >meaning of words, I see the following:
> >
> > > > States
> > > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > > reporting, to assure
> > > > >that children in home school settings are learning and
progressing.
> > > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement . .

Lynda

Before believing that homeschooling will be flexible under the shrub, take
a close look at Florida and who the shrub thinks walks on water (H$LDA).

Lynda

----------
> From: Bonnie Painter <bonniepainter@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> Date: Sunday, October 01, 2000 9:41 AM
>
> I don't see any quotable sources (besides unnamed) to support what you
are
> saying. I think that to "translate" what Gore is saying and then quoting

> "unnamed" sources to support your opinion is weak at best.
>
> I also know that not all members of the NEA are against homeschooling
since
> my sister and sister-in-law are both members and teachers.
>
> Bush's accountability adds to more testing. So now, the children will be

> focusing even more on passing these "tests" and not on true learning. It
is
> a good thing that homeschooling will be flexible under Bush, since the
kids
> who are in public school will only be learning how to test and it will no

> longer even be an option for us.
>
> Just my opinion,
>
> Bonnie
>
>
> >From: "Billy or Nancy" <FUNLists@...>
> >Reply-To: [email protected]
> >To: <[email protected]>
> >Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> >Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2000 12:02:27 -0400
> >
> >I don't think anyone should cast their vote on the basis of a single
issue.
> >Homeschooling is but one of the factors you must evaluate when deciding
who
> >to vote for.
> >
> >Since this is a homeschooling forum, I will stay away from other issues
and
> >point out the following:
> >
> >Almost 1 in 10 of the delegates to the Democratic National Convention
are
> >members of the NEA. The NEA (National Education Association - the
largest
> >teachers union)has nearly 2.5 million members and the AFT (American
> >Federation of Teachers - another union) has more than 1 million members.
In
> >the sphere of political influence, these two unions are extremely well
> >funded, represent 3.5 million members, and influence many people because
> >they have the image of representing "education" rather than being seen
as a
> >unions that represents teachers. They have been against school choice,
> >accountability for teachers, charter schools, public money to support
any
> >form of education other than government run schools, and school reform.
> >Their primary mantra is that all the educational problems would be
solved
> >if
> >more money was given to government run schools and teachers. (Private
> >school
> >teachers are paid less than government school teachers and that the cost
of
> >attending private school is less per student than the cost of government
> >school. Most people agree that private schools are doing better than the
> >government schools, so how can more money be the issue?)
> >
> >Let's look at what Gore said in his response and I think you will see
that
> >the words reveal some biases. Applying a Clintonesque interpretation of
the
> >meaning of words, I see the following:
> >
> > > > States
> > > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > > reporting, to assure
> > > > >that children in home school settings are learning and
progressing.
> > > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement . .
.
> >
> >So he would do nothing to alter states that have set parameters like
> >testing
> >and reporting, but is the statement carefully worded to allow changes in
> >states that do not require testing or reporting?
> >
> > > > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase
individual
> >attention for > > >children. It can also increase parental involvement
in
> >their children's lives.
> > > > >These elements are essential to improving education for our
children
> >attending
> > > > >public schools as well.
> >
> >Does anybody else detect that typical bias that sure, some people can
> >homeschool successfully, but not many? How many opponents to
homeschooling
> >start off with saying that homeschooling can be very successful for
"some"
> >families followed by a "but" and their list of objections. Notice that
Gore
> >doesn't even say that homeschooling can be successful, only that it can
> >increase "individual attention" on the children and increase parental
> >involvement. He mentions that these are important for public school kids
> >too, and immediately uses that to segue into his initiatives for
government
> >schools.
> >
> >In his response, Gore does not use any adjectives to describe
> >homeschooling.
> >He seems to be very careful to not say anything positive about it, while

> >not
> >being negative either.
> >
> >Clinton and Gore have been very reserved about homeschooling and have
> >expressed
> >concerns that while it can work out fine, accountability needs to be in
> >place to make sure the parents are doing their job.
> >
> >Clinton said while he would not choose it for his own child, home
schooling
> >can work well when students and parents are made to answer for the
> >students'
> >learning.
> >
> >"We should say, 'Look, there's a good way to do this and a not-so-good
way
> >to do this,"' and require that home-schooled students meet academic
> >benchmarks, he said.
> >
> >"But if you're going to do this," he added, "your children have to prove
> >that they're learning on a regular basis, and if they don't prove that
> >they're learning then they have to go into a school -- either into a
> >parochial or private school or a public school."
> >
> >The Gore campaign has criticized Bush's stance on homeschooling as
follows:
> >
> > "Bush has repeatedly called for more accountability in public
schools,
> > but has made no effort to apply those standards to home schooled
> > children. In Texas, Bush has supported home schooling, despite the
> > fact that Texas mandates no regulations on attendance or
achievement
> > standards for home schooled students and requires no certification
> > for home school teachers. Texas officials have even criticized the
> > Texas system for offering the parents of truant children a way to
get
> > around the system without actually educating their children."
> >
> >Gore has even been against vouchers and school choice because of the
> >influence of the NEA, and Liberman had to retreat from his long held
stance
> >of supporting vouchers once he got the VP nomination.
> >
> >The record in Texas (which has one of the least restrictive
homeschooling
> >laws in the nation) is a pretty good indicator of the Bush attitude
about
> >homeschooling. Bush has a strong stand on public school accountability,
> >which I do not see as a conflict. Schools should be held accountable to
> >parents who are entrusting them to educate their children. Most parents
> >with
> >children in public schools would definitely want that school accountable

> >for
> >their education efforts. However, parents who take full responsibility
for
> >the education of their own children do not have to be held to the same
> >standards. They are providing a service for themselves and their own
> >children and can judge if it is meeting their needs.
> >
> >Here are some comments by someone who lived in Gore's home state:
> >
> > >I lived in TN a few years ago when we were putting in a mobile home on

> >some
> > >land. I swear we had to get a permit for blowing our noses!
> >
> > >to homeschool your elementary kids was pretty simple, just
> > >have a high-school diploma or GED and tell what curriculum you'll be
> >using
> > >to school your child(ren), *but* unless you had your BA you couldn't
> > >homeschool your middle or high schoolers unless you had an umbrella
> >school.
> > >TN seemed to be extremely regulated in all areas.
> >
> >In the area of education, I think it is clear that one candidate wants
to
> >focus on improving government education and one candidate wants to focus
on
> >improving education opportunities in a variety of formats.
> >
> >Here are some links:
> >
> >Homeschoolers for Bush
> >http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/
> >
> >Bush letter in response to questions about homeschooling
>
>http://members.home.com/hsforbush2000/Bush%20Letter%20to%20Home%20School%20

M
> >om.htm
> >
> >Gore response to questions about homeschooling (second letter)
> >http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
> >
> >Democratic attack on Bush homeschooling stance
> >http://www.democrats.org/gopwatch/bushwatch/accountability/home.html
> >
> >Link to parody of NEA homeschooling resolutions along with a link to
actual
> >NEA resolutions
> >http://www.unschooling.org/resolutions.htm
> >
> >Bottom line, I should also add that I think the President can strongly
> >influence the atmosphere and attitude toward homeschooling, but I do not
> >think you need to be concerned that the legality of homeschooling will
be
> >immediately affected by the outcome of the election.
> >
> >Billy
> >
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > For those that have been worried about Gore's stand on
> > > homeschooling, this
> > > should answer the question.
> >
> > > > >From another list:
> > > > http://www.algore.com/townhall/th_education.html
> > > > Fwd: Re: [homeschooling_preK-K] Gore's Response to HSing ??
> > > > **>Town Hall Question
> >
> > > > >Yvonne, thank you for visiting my website and asking an important
> > > > >question about educating our children. As you well know,
> > > parents are a
> > > > >child's first teachers. Home schooling is a growing effort by many
> > > > >parents to direct the education of their children. There
> > > are no U.S.
> > > > >Department of Education regulations related to home
> > > schooling. States
> > > > >have set parameters, such as regular testing and
> > > reporting, to assure
> > > > >that children in home school settings are learning and
progressing.
> > > > >Nothing in my education proposal would alter this arrangement or
> > > > >discourage parents from teaching their children in their home.
> > > > >
> > > > >For those who have the means, home schooling can increase
> > > individual
> > > > >attention for children. It can also increase parental
> > > involvement in
> > > > >their children's lives. These elements are essential to improving
> > > > >education for our children attending public schools as well. My
> > > > >administration would be fully committed to making sure
> > > more students in
> > > > >public schools get individual attention through Head
> > > Start, voluntary
> > > > >universal preschool, and smaller classes. I wish you and
> > > your children
> > > > >great success in home schooling.
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________________
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aworthen

----- Original Message -----
From: Lynda <lurine@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2000 10:21 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long

Is something wrong at egroups Again? <big sigh> This is the third time I've
recieved this message today.

Amy
Mom to Samantha, Dana, and Casey
The World Is Our Classroom

Lynda

Sunday I didn't get any mail from two of the e-groups lists. I sent a test
message to 5 e-group lists and to a couple of other group lists. The other
3 e-group lists came in hours apart and the other 2 never showed up at all.

Lynda

----------
> From: aworthen <aworthen@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
> Date: Monday, October 02, 2000 8:07 AM
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Lynda <lurine@...>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2000 10:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Gore's response on hs question - long
>
> Is something wrong at egroups Again? <big sigh> This is the third time
I've
> recieved this message today.
>
> Amy
> Mom to Samantha, Dana, and Casey
> The World Is Our Classroom
>
>
>
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Addresses:
> Post message: [email protected]
> Unsubscribe: [email protected]
> List owner: [email protected]
> List settings page: http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>