lukesmama2003

First of all - it isn't me! My 7 year old has mentioned several times that he doesn't know his letters and would like to. We have always unschooled so there never been any curriculum or push to learn anything in particular. He is very proficient at computer games and even knows some words, but doesn't read yet. He asks me type for him a lot, which I do, but there are times I am busy with his other brothers and try to give him the letters to type in. That's when he says he doesn't know the letters so can't type them himself.

We talked about playing some fun games to help with letter recognition and played around on star fall.com a bit this morning. But it wasn't really that interesting for him and there was a lot of phonics stuff which I don't think is that helpful for *him* and what he is seeking right now.

Any suggestions for fun ways to learn letters?

Thanks,
Karen

Joyce Fetteroll

On Feb 25, 2013, at 10:19 AM, lukesmama2003 wrote:

> We talked about playing some fun games to help with letter recognition

While letter recognition is part of what will help, he'll also need to know where the letters are on the keyboard. My daughter could recognize letters for years but until her fingers knew where they were on the keyboard, that knowledge wasn't much help!

So, maybe a typing program. I'm sure there's loads of fun ones out there now. It could be he can learn the letters and where they are at the same time.

Does he enjoy crafty things? You could make the letters out of cookie dough.

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

regan

I'll let others field the question of interesting alphabet games that your son would like,
but I wanted to bring up the idea that it could be the keyboard orientation that's getting to him.
My son is particularly interested in letters and symbols (to the exclusion of many other things!) and knows the alphabet inside and out� and yet, gets very frustrated when it comes to type things with a keyboard, because the letters are all randomly mixed up, compared with alphabet order. I imagine it must be maddening at times. "Where's B?" "Uh� bottom row, between N and V."

If there are keyboard games, that might help your son get closer to what he needs the alphabet for -- typing.

I wonder if keyboards will turn out to have be a temporary technology, like rotary telephones. Seems like in the future we'll use spoken or handwritten words and then tweak them afterwards�


cheers,
Regan


On Feb 25, 2013, at 10:19 AM, "lukesmama2003" <karenandjoe2@...> wrote:

> First of all - it isn't me! My 7 year old has mentioned several times that he doesn't know his letters and would like to. We have always unschooled so there never been any curriculum or push to learn anything in particular. He is very proficient at computer games and even knows some words, but doesn't read yet. He asks me type for him a lot, which I do, but there are times I am busy with his other brothers and try to give him the letters to type in. That's when he says he doesn't know the letters so can't type them himself.
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

cyberbreadbowl

If his main concern is that he doesn't know how to type them, could you get him a voice recognition program that would allow him to dictate to it?

Have you already made sure his environment is text rich, by posting lots of notes and signs (I would keep them all positive), labeling kitchen drawers, making sure text subtitles are always on on the TV, and reading him graphic novels (which have the words in the pictures, keeping the eye near the text)?

Letter recognition does come at different rates to different people, but I would also wonder if he's had a real vision test, not just an eye chart, because as someone with both astigmatism and a visual processing difference, sometimes things aren't caught that might interfere with vision. I passed the eye chart test, but always knew that reading was difficult for me. It wasn't until I was in college that I figured it out on my own. You can find a visual therapist, who is a specially trained optometrist, to test his vision, but the earlier you do it the better, since school kids by the time they are 7 have usually already learned to read and write. It will be harder and harder to tell if it's a learning disability or just a choice on his part as he gets older.


--- In [email protected], "lukesmama2003" <karenandjoe2@...> wrote:
>
> First of all - it isn't me! My 7 year old has mentioned several times that he doesn't know his letters and would like to. We have always unschooled so there never been any curriculum or push to learn anything in particular. He is very proficient at computer games and even knows some words, but doesn't read yet. He asks me type for him a lot, which I do, but there are times I am busy with his other brothers and try to give him the letters to type in. That's when he says he doesn't know the letters so can't type them himself.
>

lukesmama2003

Ah great idea. And that is exactly the use he has in mind. I actually believe one could learn to read without knowing specific letters or the alphabet, but typing is another thing. I will look into the programs. and he occasionally likes crafts. Cee haven't made homemade play dough in a whole so I think that might be fun.



>
> > We talked about playing some fun games to help with letter recognition
>
> While letter recognition is part of what will help, he'll also need to know where the letters are on the keyboard. My daughter could recognize letters for years but until her fingers knew where they were on the keyboard, that knowledge wasn't much help!
>
> So, maybe a typing program. I'm sure there's loads of fun ones out there now. It could be he can learn the letters and where they are at the same time.
>
> Does he enjoy crafty things? You could make the letters out of cookie dough.
>
> Joyce
>

>

Meredith

"lukesmama2003" <karenandjoe2@...> wrote:
> I actually believe one could learn to read without knowing specific letters or the alphabet
************

Absolutely! and you have evidence already that he Is learning to read without knowing the letters.

In addition to typing programs, part of the problem is that he's trying to line up what you're saying when you spell out a word to a character. And even if he knows the alphabet song, that won't help with a Qwerty keyboard. If he's typing on something else, he at least has a way to look up which letter is which - he can sing his way through the song and find the letters that way. And over time he'll remember.

You could make a chart, maybe, if he knows the alphabet song, but it will be laborious. You could look into getting a keyboard with an ABC layout. You could look into getting a fancy keyboard with a logo on each letter... I'll dig around and see where I saw that... a comic book site, maybe, with each letter relating to a character. Then you could make a chart (for yourself maybe or for him) so you can say "B - Batman" and he could find it more easily that way.

None of those are really fun, though, just utilitarian.

What about Bingo or I Spy sorts of games? does he enjoy those?

---Meredith

Debra Rossing

Cookie dough, gelatin 'jigglers' (mix unflavored gelatin with fruit juice and pour into a shallow baking pan then cut out with cookie cutters), soft pretzel dough are all fun, edible ways to make letters.

Maybe get a set of large magnetic letters and arrange them somewhere in the same order as the keyboard - bigger and more colorful might be helpful in locating keys (laptop keyboards are especially little relatively speaking). You might even look into the alternative style keyboards that are non-qwerty.

Deb R


**********************************************************************
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.

This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.

www.mastercam.com
**********************************************************************


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Meredith

>>reading him graphic novels (which have the words in the pictures, keeping the eye near the text)
**********

If he likes them, by all means read them, but not with the expectation that they'll... hmm, keep the eye near the text. What's marvelous about graphic works is that so much of the information Isn't in the text. I found I had to learn how to read them, after years of text-only works - I had learned not to look at the pictures "too much" because, well, I was a "good" reader.

One of the ideas which gets passed around a lot to parents and kids is that graphic novels and comics are a lesser type of literature. Real people read real books, those other things aren't more than teaching tools for "slow learners". It's an idea I know I got from school and library propaganda! And then I got to be the mom of a kid who loves graphic novels and realized they're a marvelous medium in and of themselves. It's a little embarrassing, now, to walk into the comic shop and know that I used to look down on "all that".

> Have you already made sure his environment is text rich, by posting lots of notes and signs
*************

I'm going to quibble about this use of "text rich". If he's on the internet, playing video games, etc, he's already living in a text rich environment. Which isn't to say it's bad to put up those kinds of signs if it's fun or interesting, or a kid wants to feel like he or she is "learning to read" even if he or she isn't ready yet but is maybe getting pressure from other kids or extended family.

---Meredith

Joyce Fetteroll

> Have you already made sure his environment is text rich,
> by posting lots of notes and signs

Meredith made a good point.

When you read "text rich environment" picture the world you're living in where there are signs on shops and streets everywhere, print on packages, print on ads and show titles on TV, text ALL over the internet.

And in that "text rich environment" kids should be having a positive experience in it. They shouldn't feel pressured to read. They shouldn't be made to feel uncomfortable about print. Parents should read to them what they ask about.

They *might* pick up negative feelings naturally. There might be neighbor kids. They might want to read before they're developmentally ready. It happens. Be supportive. *Know* they will read when they can.

Unless you're living on the Alaskan tundra with no internet -- in which case you're not reading this ;-) -- no books. And don't buy commercial products. And don't have money with printing on it ;-) ... kids can't help but read when they can.

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

twostorie

Any suggestions for fun ways to learn letters?
>
> Thanks,
> Karen


If you have a smart phone or iPad/iPod touch type of device, I think my kids got a lot out of games like "iWrite Words" which has them use their finger to draw letters while it tells you the letter aloud etc. However, I'm not sure if at 7 years old he would like it. It is geared toward younger kids but I think it's fun and if you want to learn the letters I think it helps. It has upper and lower case and number options too, It does say things like "very nice" and "good job" and "excellent" and that is a bit annoying to me since we do not do the "good job" thing in our home. (But it has not seemed to have much affect).(If he does not like, maybe you search for similar games he will like) My kids are very physical and I think for them it helps to use their bodies too. Maybe you could cut out big letters and put them on the ground like a QWERTY keyboard and have him jump to the letters of the words he wants to spell. (after he is more comfortable with recognition) like he's on a giant keyboard. ??? Just throwing out ideas. :) We also have a physical toy from Leap Frog called a "discovery ball" and it is a ball on a stand that spins, with the alphabet on it. You can choose to have it tell you the letter OR tell you the sound the letter makes. OR play music. Or maybe a "Speak and Spell" type toy would be fun. I agree with the typing program idea too, sounds like a winner. OH, and one more thing. We have an option on our computer which will allow it to speak the letters you type. That might be just the thing. As they type a letter a computerized voice says the letter aloud. Like a speak and spell on the computer but in QWERTY order! :) better that way. I am not sure if this is something all computers are now capable of but our MAC has this in the "system preference" area under "system" then "universal access" and turn on "voice over". Then you open a program like Word or Text Edit so they can just type whatever the want and it will speak the letters. Pretty cool, our kids had a ball playing on that. It will also speak a word you type if you click on it after. :) There may be something like that for the electronic devices as well ipod/ipad smart phone etc. ???

Good luck,
Jorie


-


>
>
>

Lauren McLaughlin

My kids learned a TON from Reading Eggs.


Lauren McLaughlin
970-846-6531

----- Original Message -----




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Renae R

Are there words that he uses more often than others? This might not be a
"fun" way, but when I was a child I had a "words journal" where I wrote
down the words that I was learning. When I would ask my mom to spell
something, I would write the words down in there so that I could keep track
of the words that I needed. Sometimes I would draw pictures to help me
remember what word it was or I would ask my mom again if I was having
trouble with a certain word. My middle name is Ashley and I always got the
y mixed up with the letter u (Ashleu) and I looked back at this word
journal almost every time I had to write my full name until I was 12!!
This might be a helpful reference for him to look back on when you are not
there to dictate for him. He could even have it in a word document and
just pull it up on the computer or print it off from time to time.


Renae


On Mon, Feb 25, 2013 at 1:35 PM, twostorie <joriedenny@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> Any suggestions for fun ways to learn letters?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Karen
>
> If you have a smart phone or iPad/iPod touch type of device, I think my
> kids got a lot out of games like "iWrite Words" which has them use their
> finger to draw letters while it tells you the letter aloud etc. However,
> I'm not sure if at 7 years old he would like it. It is geared toward
> younger kids but I think it's fun and if you want to learn the letters I
> think it helps. It has upper and lower case and number options too, It does
> say things like "very nice" and "good job" and "excellent" and that is a
> bit annoying to me since we do not do the "good job" thing in our home.
> (But it has not seemed to have much affect).(If he does not like, maybe you
> search for similar games he will like) My kids are very physical and I
> think for them it helps to use their bodies too. Maybe you could cut out
> big letters and put them on the ground like a QWERTY keyboard and have him
> jump to the letters of the words he wants to spell. (after he is more
> comfortable with recognition) like he's on a giant keyboard. ??? Just
> throwing out ideas. :) We also have a physical toy from Leap Frog called a
> "discovery ball" and it is a ball on a stand that spins, with the alphabet
> on it. You can choose to have it tell you the letter OR tell you the sound
> the letter makes. OR play music. Or maybe a "Speak and Spell" type toy
> would be fun. I agree with the typing program idea too, sounds like a
> winner. OH, and one more thing. We have an option on our computer which
> will allow it to speak the letters you type. That might be just the thing.
> As they type a letter a computerized voice says the letter aloud. Like a
> speak and spell on the computer but in QWERTY order! :) better that way. I
> am not sure if this is something all computers are now capable of but our
> MAC has this in the "system preference" area under "system" then "universal
> access" and turn on "voice over". Then you open a program like Word or Text
> Edit so they can just type whatever the want and it will speak the letters.
> Pretty cool, our kids had a ball playing on that. It will also speak a word
> you type if you click on it after. :) There may be something like that for
> the electronic devices as well ipod/ipad smart phone etc. ???
>
> Good luck,
> Jorie
>
> -
>
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>



--
Live Barefoot! <http://www.readbarefootbooks.com>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Katherine Havener

I would like to ask about spelling. The way I was parented, when I wanted to
know how to spell a word, my mom told me to look in the dictionary. My girls (9
and 6, and esp the 6 yo) ask me to spell things frequently. I do, of course,
but I worry. Does spelling things for them help them become good spellers? And
since neither girl really enjoys reading books yet, how will spelling come
along? I do believe that being able to spell correctly is an important tool in
being an effective communicator as an adult, so it does feel really important to
me that their spelling skills continue to develop.


Katherine Havener

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Joyce Fetteroll

On Feb 25, 2013, at 3:46 PM, Katherine Havener wrote:

> Does spelling things for them help them become good spellers?

Yes. If someone is asking for information, they *want* the information. Which means it's meaningful.

> And
> since neither girl really enjoys reading books yet, how will spelling come
> along?

It will come because it's in their lives and they'll absorb it. They'll refine it because it's personally important to them for others to read what they're writing. (They might, before that, share stories they've written. In that case, since you can ask them if you can't read a word, spelling is likely to be secondary to the story.

> I do believe that being able to spell correctly is an important tool in
> being an effective communicator as an adult,

Who are they communicating with that makes spelling important?

One day they might need to know how to manage a multi-million dollar corporation. Are you concerned that they aren't woking on that knowledge?

When knowledge is routinely forced into people, people start to assume it needs forced in.

How did they learn to speak? To walk? To form sentences with correct grammar?

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Lesley Cross

Spelling is one of those things that some people are more inclined to than others. My dh is quite intelligent yet can't spell (or write) himself out of a paper bag. He can explain technical things verbally very well and has quite a successful career in IT. I proofread/edit for him.... but it's only a few times a year. Usually his resume, cover letters and his written performance review. Also when it comes to purely spelling, these days we have spell checking software. It gets my dh through everyday business correspondence. While I'm sure he *could* become a better speller, it doesn't interest him and it isn't necessary.

I'm curious, and always have been, about how looking up a word in the dictionary is a preferable way to find how to spell a word than to be told how to spell it? I've never seen a logical explanation of it. If anything I think it's about an attempt to force independence.

My daughter often uses the free Dragon Dictation app on her iPhone (more of an iPod touch, as its a "retired" iphone)... her ability to write words has increased so much since she began doing this. It's like asking how to spell something...which she also does a lot, but if I'm not in the same room or she's doing a lot of writing she uses it instead of asking because it's quicker.

Lesley

http://euphorialifedesignstudio.com





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pam Sorooshian

On Mon, Feb 25, 2013 at 1:57 PM, Lesley Cross <lesleycross@...> wrote:

> My dh is quite intelligent yet can't spell (or write) himself out of a
> paper bag.


He probably went to school and had spelling lessons, too.

My youngest daughter could not spell at all - would spell "cat" three
different ways on one page up to the time she was 13 or 14. Then she slowly
got better as she messaged with friends who couldn't read what she was
writing. I spelled for her for YEARS - and thought she had some kind of
spelling disability and I was helping her come to terms with the fact that
spelling wasn't her thing. But, around 16 she began to spell better and
better and now, at 22, she's a truly excellent speller.

I firmly believe this is a matter of some part of the brain being very much
later to develop in her than in many other people.

I also believe that I could have messed her up by pushing spelling on her
when her brain wasn't ready.

-pam


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jo Isaac

My son (6.5) enjoys Scribblenauts, and it uses a QUERTY keyboard (on the iPod at least - not sure about the PC/Wii U version). We recently got a little plastic game calle 'Gallows' which is basically Hangman in plastic, and he is enjoying that too. He also dislikes any kind of game with a phonics approach, like Star Fall or Reading Eggs.
When my son went through a phase of wanting to Skype/Minecraft with friends, I wrote down a lot of the words he used frequently (in captials, like the keyboard) and left them next to the keyboard - maybe you could do that too :)
Jo






subscribe � Terms of Use � Send us Feedback














.














[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

BRIAN POLIKOWSKY

My son is 10 and a great speller. I always answered his questions if he asked me how it was spelled.
I think some people are naturally good spellers others not so much.
I see pwoplw that write on the internet and their spelling is painful even for me that English is not my first language.
Spell check helps some people learn to spell. |Some people care more about spelling that others. 
I heard about well known writers that cannot spell and all you need is a good editor.
My son learned to read playing video games online.
He can spell amazingly well, not need for me to create little lessons on spelling.
 
Alex Polikowsky
 
 
 


________________________________
From: Katherine Havener <kchavener@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 2:46 PM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Fun online games to learn letters/alphabet


 
I would like to ask about spelling. The way I was parented, when I wanted to
know how to spell a word, my mom told me to look in the dictionary. My girls (9
and 6, and esp the 6 yo) ask me to spell things frequently. I do, of course,
but I worry. Does spelling things for them help them become good spellers? And
since neither girl really enjoys reading books yet, how will spelling come
along? I do believe that being able to spell correctly is an important tool in
being an effective communicator as an adult, so it does feel really important to
me that their spelling skills continue to develop.

Katherine Havener

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Meredith

Katherine Havener <kchavener@...> wrote:
>The way I was parented, when I wanted to
> know how to spell a word, my mom told me to look in the dictionary.

Me too! and I'm a terrible speller ;)
I'm actually very good at spelling in French - or I used to be, years ago - because the rules are all really consistent. But I can never remember when English rules corresponded with French rules and when they follow some other rationale. I remember feeling cheated when I realized that, despite years of spelling lessons, no-one had ever explained about all the various roots of English and how that affected spellings. It's the sort of thing that fascinates me, and has ever since I was a kid, but all I got was "learn the rule and exceptions, memorize the list" - and I'd dutifully memorize the stuff, ace the test and imediately forget how to spell those very words.

> Does spelling things for them help them become good spellers? And
> since neither girl really enjoys reading books yet, how will spelling come
> along?

My daughter has never had a spelling lesson and used invented spellings for years (she's 11). Now and then she'd ask me to spell something - almost at random it seemed. Over the last year, she has discovered online friendships in a big way and all of a sudden she can spell as well or better than school and homeschool kids her age. She's a little sketchy on apostrophes and when to use them, but otherwise... wow. When did That happen? It's pretty amazing.

She's the one who likes graphic novels - she still doesn't have much interest in print-only books and rarely touches them, but she listens to audio books and lately she's been reading (and writing) for hours every day on fan-fiction sites.

>I do believe that being able to spell correctly is an important tool in
> being an effective communicator as an adult

Not just as an adult! But context matters - the way people write in a quick-and-dirty text message isn't the same way people write stories, or reviews, or game walkthroughs, or invitations. People communicate So That they can be understood, and context is part of understanding. You don't expect a license plate to read like a brochure. One of the great disservices school does is it makes writing a mindless chore - no-one really cares what's in a 5th grade essay about anything, not the teacher who's going to grade a pile of them, and not the kids who write them. When Mo writes, it's real writing, not school writing: she's writing with the expectation that real people interested in the same topic are going to be reading.

---Meredith

Brice Johnson

Echoing others responses:



My 11 year old son is not a natural speller, wouldn't pick up a book, and
couldn't have cared less about grammar. Last month he started getting on
Minecart forums and FB. Then, began asking me how to spell things, and was
looking words up. He was typing at a good rate of speed; writing in
complete sentences with great punctuation; spelling like a champ. ALL
BECAUSE IT MATTERED TO HIM!!!



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]