Stressed out
Jennifer Croce
< Please don't take this the wrong way, but something I have noticed in a lot of your responses. You have the ability to justify why you can't do things, most of it in a negative way. Perhaps looking for more positive ways to approach any given situation. It really sounds like everything causes you to feel extremely stressed out. So perhaps the starting point for you will for you to find ways to help deal with stress and stressful situations. The more stressed you are the more negative reactions you are going to get from your girls. I highly recommend that you learn some coping techniques then many of these situations won't seem quite so overwhelming and it will allow you to find the positive, joyful way to handle them. >
I absolutely do not take it the wrong way, I see how I can appear like a constant stress case since I only post stressful situations and not the joyful ones. I appreciate all the help and feedback from this list and am trying to see things more positively every post helps me realize that. I also subscribe to Scott Noelle's newsletter, he gives a lot of the same advice and his reflections really make me stop and reexamine how I think and look at things.
Thanks,
Jen
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I absolutely do not take it the wrong way, I see how I can appear like a constant stress case since I only post stressful situations and not the joyful ones. I appreciate all the help and feedback from this list and am trying to see things more positively every post helps me realize that. I also subscribe to Scott Noelle's newsletter, he gives a lot of the same advice and his reflections really make me stop and reexamine how I think and look at things.
Thanks,
Jen
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ren Allen
~~I was watching Dayna Martin on YouTube yesterday. She was talking about how unschooling allows for everyone's needs to be met in a respectful way. That is where I am stuck, I don't see how I can meet everyone's needs respectfully.~~
Maybe the missing piece is that no matter how present and connected you are, you CAN'T meet everyone's needs all at once sometimes. Not in the moment, but long-term the needs can be met.
I think people get stuck feeling like they are responsible when they're children are freaking out, even after they've done everything "right". Rather than feeling responsible, or even feeling YOU alone must meet everyone's needs, maybe just trust that the freaking out moment is PART of their process. You are responsible for creating a respectful environment. If a need doesn't get met in the moment, it's still important but maybe you can breathe and trust that the greatest need a child has is to feel loved, safe and important. They can know their need is important even if things don't seem to be going well.
~~It seems like no matter what I do someone is upset (either younger dd for having to get in her carseat, older dd for having to wait or not go and me for being frustrated about the whole thing). I hate resorting to conventional strategies (yelling, bribing) but they are the methods that seem to work.~~
The method "works" if your goal is to get everyone quiet and/or doing what you want right at the moment. It doesn't work so well if your goal is to have a peaceful, respectful environment.
I just did a talk at Life is Good about "Perfect Imperfection" in which the "peace" I refer to allows space for melt-downs and bickering.:) If peace is harmonious relationships, then part of that is trusting the process to harmony. Our children need space to learn about these things. If we don't resist the difficulties, if we can embrace them as part of our (and our childrens) development, then maybe it won't seem so overwhelming when those conflicts arise.
Happy, healthy families have upheaval, challenges and YES, disagreements. Maybe some people here have very quiet, compliant children and their families look to be the epitome of peace. Not mine!!! We can be noisy and boisterous and I have quite a mix of personalities. Noisy disagreement and resolutions are often a part of our dynamics.
Being ok with that process is part of it. Staying with the process shows respect to our children....reverting back to old tools is part of YOUR learning journey (as it is for all of us!) but each time you are faced with a choice of what to do in the moment of stress...breathe deep and BE right there with the ugly feelings. Be present for the feelings and recognize that in the moment of BEing with those feelings of frustration, you get a choice. Make a better choice each time and before long it starts to become natural. I'm still shocked at some of my responses, but disliking how I act helps me grow.... it's all a part of unschooling/living.:)
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
Maybe the missing piece is that no matter how present and connected you are, you CAN'T meet everyone's needs all at once sometimes. Not in the moment, but long-term the needs can be met.
I think people get stuck feeling like they are responsible when they're children are freaking out, even after they've done everything "right". Rather than feeling responsible, or even feeling YOU alone must meet everyone's needs, maybe just trust that the freaking out moment is PART of their process. You are responsible for creating a respectful environment. If a need doesn't get met in the moment, it's still important but maybe you can breathe and trust that the greatest need a child has is to feel loved, safe and important. They can know their need is important even if things don't seem to be going well.
~~It seems like no matter what I do someone is upset (either younger dd for having to get in her carseat, older dd for having to wait or not go and me for being frustrated about the whole thing). I hate resorting to conventional strategies (yelling, bribing) but they are the methods that seem to work.~~
The method "works" if your goal is to get everyone quiet and/or doing what you want right at the moment. It doesn't work so well if your goal is to have a peaceful, respectful environment.
I just did a talk at Life is Good about "Perfect Imperfection" in which the "peace" I refer to allows space for melt-downs and bickering.:) If peace is harmonious relationships, then part of that is trusting the process to harmony. Our children need space to learn about these things. If we don't resist the difficulties, if we can embrace them as part of our (and our childrens) development, then maybe it won't seem so overwhelming when those conflicts arise.
Happy, healthy families have upheaval, challenges and YES, disagreements. Maybe some people here have very quiet, compliant children and their families look to be the epitome of peace. Not mine!!! We can be noisy and boisterous and I have quite a mix of personalities. Noisy disagreement and resolutions are often a part of our dynamics.
Being ok with that process is part of it. Staying with the process shows respect to our children....reverting back to old tools is part of YOUR learning journey (as it is for all of us!) but each time you are faced with a choice of what to do in the moment of stress...breathe deep and BE right there with the ugly feelings. Be present for the feelings and recognize that in the moment of BEing with those feelings of frustration, you get a choice. Make a better choice each time and before long it starts to become natural. I'm still shocked at some of my responses, but disliking how I act helps me grow.... it's all a part of unschooling/living.:)
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
Jennifer Croce
Posted by: "Ren Allen"
<Maybe the missing piece is that no matter how present and connected you are, you CAN'T meet everyone's needs all at once sometimes. Not in the moment, but long-term the needs can be met. >
and
< I think people get stuck feeling like they are responsible when they're children are freaking out, even after they've done everything "right". Rather than feeling responsible, or even feeling YOU alone must meet everyone's needs, maybe just trust that the freaking out moment is PART of their process. You are responsible for creating a respectful environment. If a need doesn't get met in the moment, it's still important but maybe you can breathe and trust that the greatest need a child has is to feel loved, safe and important. They can know their need is important even if things don't seem to be going well.>
Thanks for this reply Ren.
I think I have idealized unschooling and think that it is going to make us all one big happy family. I am learning that what I need to do is sit back and chill out a bit more. It's hard for me not to try to control everything. I need to stop feeling like I am letting someone down or not meeting my family's needs in some way if I can't accommodate everyone 24/7.
Jen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<Maybe the missing piece is that no matter how present and connected you are, you CAN'T meet everyone's needs all at once sometimes. Not in the moment, but long-term the needs can be met. >
and
< I think people get stuck feeling like they are responsible when they're children are freaking out, even after they've done everything "right". Rather than feeling responsible, or even feeling YOU alone must meet everyone's needs, maybe just trust that the freaking out moment is PART of their process. You are responsible for creating a respectful environment. If a need doesn't get met in the moment, it's still important but maybe you can breathe and trust that the greatest need a child has is to feel loved, safe and important. They can know their need is important even if things don't seem to be going well.>
Thanks for this reply Ren.
I think I have idealized unschooling and think that it is going to make us all one big happy family. I am learning that what I need to do is sit back and chill out a bit more. It's hard for me not to try to control everything. I need to stop feeling like I am letting someone down or not meeting my family's needs in some way if I can't accommodate everyone 24/7.
Jen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ren Allen
~~I think I have idealized unschooling and think that it is going to make us all one big happy family.~~
It happens.;)
A big, happy family includes conflict and people being upset sometimes. It's learning how to navigate those upsets more gracefully that we all aim for. Learning how to stay in the moment with the rough feelings and trust that they too are important to honor. The more you can be with what IS happening, the more space you give for respect to grow even when things are uncomfortable.
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
It happens.;)
A big, happy family includes conflict and people being upset sometimes. It's learning how to navigate those upsets more gracefully that we all aim for. Learning how to stay in the moment with the rough feelings and trust that they too are important to honor. The more you can be with what IS happening, the more space you give for respect to grow even when things are uncomfortable.
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
N CONFER
I think I have idealized unschooling . . .
**********
That happens very easily. You hear all this advice worded in ways you are not familiar with and it may sound like you are supposed to throw everything you know out the window and everything will be peachy.
Well, no matter what you do, everything will not be peachy every moment of the day.
But unschooling is a lovely way to live and can lead to more overall peachiness. :)
But there are times when I do act like a pretty traditional Mom. When the almost-3-year-old Nephew discovered that he could reach the frontseat seat belt from his carseat in the backseat (it's a small car), that was a very traditional "pull the car over and pry the seat belt from the baby's hand" moment.
I then had to remember to buckle the thing even if there was no frontseat passenger. And, yes, if I had thought of it earlier, there never would have been the dramatic moment on US1. But I didn't and DN was not listening in the moments when I was telling him to stop playing with the seatbelt strap, pictures of a strangling 3-year-old quickly running through my mind. So there was no calm, sweet discussion. There was physical removal of the danger from the child.
And, yes, he was in his carseat. The car doesn't move unless we are all buckled in. It's about safety.
But, importantly, it's not about me. Not about me being in control or having power. It's not one of many nitpicking rules. It's one of very few, very basic, very necessary rules. When DN or one of the other kids gets a reaction from me like the yelp and the dash to the curb and the obviously upset looks and the removal of the frontseat strap from DN, it is unusual. I think it makes an impression because it is not just another dithering Mom thing. It must be important.
I also had a long talk one day with this same almost-3-year-old. About keeping his seatbelt on while in his car seat. Although DN does not talk yet he understands. Every darned word so don't mention going anywhere if you aren't prepared to leave now -- he loves to go! Or cookies -- don't mention cookies. Or his Uncle's van -- a wonderful place to play. :) Anyway, he had squirmed out from under the shoulder straps one day. I, again, pulled over and readjusted everything. But the whole time, I was talking to him in a serious voice. About being safe and not wanting him to get hurt and that's why he needed to stay buckled up, etc.
I don't think we'll never have that conversation again but I do know that my kids understood why we use seatbelts at a very young age and it wasn't long before it wasn't any issue at all. But it wasn't an arbitrary thing. There was a reason for it, explained in terms they understood.
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
**********
That happens very easily. You hear all this advice worded in ways you are not familiar with and it may sound like you are supposed to throw everything you know out the window and everything will be peachy.
Well, no matter what you do, everything will not be peachy every moment of the day.
But unschooling is a lovely way to live and can lead to more overall peachiness. :)
But there are times when I do act like a pretty traditional Mom. When the almost-3-year-old Nephew discovered that he could reach the frontseat seat belt from his carseat in the backseat (it's a small car), that was a very traditional "pull the car over and pry the seat belt from the baby's hand" moment.
I then had to remember to buckle the thing even if there was no frontseat passenger. And, yes, if I had thought of it earlier, there never would have been the dramatic moment on US1. But I didn't and DN was not listening in the moments when I was telling him to stop playing with the seatbelt strap, pictures of a strangling 3-year-old quickly running through my mind. So there was no calm, sweet discussion. There was physical removal of the danger from the child.
And, yes, he was in his carseat. The car doesn't move unless we are all buckled in. It's about safety.
But, importantly, it's not about me. Not about me being in control or having power. It's not one of many nitpicking rules. It's one of very few, very basic, very necessary rules. When DN or one of the other kids gets a reaction from me like the yelp and the dash to the curb and the obviously upset looks and the removal of the frontseat strap from DN, it is unusual. I think it makes an impression because it is not just another dithering Mom thing. It must be important.
I also had a long talk one day with this same almost-3-year-old. About keeping his seatbelt on while in his car seat. Although DN does not talk yet he understands. Every darned word so don't mention going anywhere if you aren't prepared to leave now -- he loves to go! Or cookies -- don't mention cookies. Or his Uncle's van -- a wonderful place to play. :) Anyway, he had squirmed out from under the shoulder straps one day. I, again, pulled over and readjusted everything. But the whole time, I was talking to him in a serious voice. About being safe and not wanting him to get hurt and that's why he needed to stay buckled up, etc.
I don't think we'll never have that conversation again but I do know that my kids understood why we use seatbelts at a very young age and it wasn't long before it wasn't any issue at all. But it wasn't an arbitrary thing. There was a reason for it, explained in terms they understood.
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
rebecca de
Jen,
I think I've did the same thing with unschooling. Idealizing it that everything would be so easy going, no arguments, no struggles , etc. My biggest thing is learning to let my children just have there 'fits', or argue with each other. I try to give them ideas how to resolve arguments but sometimes it just doesn't work. I also try to control everything.
I think I've did the same thing with unschooling. Idealizing it that everything would be so easy going, no arguments, no struggles , etc. My biggest thing is learning to let my children just have there 'fits', or argue with each other. I try to give them ideas how to resolve arguments but sometimes it just doesn't work. I also try to control everything.
--- On Sun, 5/31/09, Jennifer Croce <jennifercroce37@...> wrote:
From: Jennifer Croce <jennifercroce37@...>
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Stressed out
To: [email protected]
Date: Sunday, May 31, 2009, 1:56 PM
Posted by: "Ren Allen"
<Maybe the missing piece is that no matter how present and connected you are, you CAN'T meet everyone's needs all at once sometimes. Not in the moment, but long-term the needs can be met. >
and
< I think people get stuck feeling like they are responsible when they're children are freaking out, even after they've done everything "right". Rather than feeling responsible, or even feeling YOU alone must meet everyone's needs, maybe just trust that the freaking out moment is PART of their process. You are responsible for creating a respectful environment. If a need doesn't get met in the moment, it's still important but maybe you can breathe and trust that the greatest need a child has is to feel loved, safe and important. They can know their need is important even if things don't seem to be going well.>
Thanks for this reply Ren.
I think I have idealized unschooling and think that it is going to make us all one big happy family. I am learning that what I need to do is sit back and chill out a bit more. It's hard for me not to try to control everything. I need to stop feeling like I am letting someone down or not meeting my family's needs in some way if I can't accommodate everyone 24/7.
Jen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Debra Rossing
> But it wasn't an arbitrary thing. There was a reason for it, explainedin terms they understood.
I think that is the key thing (to summarize your whole post in a
nutshell) - it's not one of a great many arbitrary rules and regulations
where Mom is nattering constantly about what not to do. When "NO!" or
"STOP!" is used only infrequently for really serious situations, it gets
heard more easily than if there's a constant stream of No, No, No, Stop,
Don't, ... No stands out when there are mostly Yeses. Oh, and
'arbitrary' is an important part of that - some people come to
unschooling thinking they are hearing "we never have ANY rules" and
think 'chaos'. Well, chaos happens (lol) but that's life with people.
The difference is that the rules that exist are there for a reason,
usually safety (of self, of others) not simply it's more convenient for
the adults.
When DS was a tot in a car seat, he was given the authority to YELL at
us if we somehow forgot to get him buckled and started the ignition. I
think it happened maybe twice in all his car seat years - those times
when DH and I both had our hands full and I thought DH buckled DS in and
DH thought I did and we got in and got the car started and DS would YELL
Buckle Buckle Buckle. Not only did it give him a bit of empowerment (to
borrow a very overused word) but that very empowerment reinforced how
important it was to be safe in that regard.
He turns 11 today and we've never had to change a rule because there are
only two in our house that apply to all persons at all times - be safe,
respect others - those two cover wearing car seats, not hitting, not
throwing other people's stuff around, etc. How it looks varies depending
on what's going on but the bottom line doesn't change.
Deb R
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