Marla B.

Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.

Help?


Marla

Betj

Glad I'm not the only one with a kid with that idea! Do you know anyone with a "safer" roof?
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: "Marla B." <marla@...>

Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 23:37:32
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] 5 yo. wants to play on the roof


Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.

Help?


Marla




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robin Krest

Our now 5 y/o was up on the roof with us when he was 4. We talked about safety, and were always with him.

WHY is it too much? WHY is this hitting your stop button?

Robin K.


---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Marla B." <marla@...>
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] 5 yo. wants to play on the roof
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 23:37:32 -0000

Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.

Help?


Marla



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




____________________________________________________________
Looking for insurance? Click to compare and save big.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTInoKbVi4YBC9GHh4Rtu0vgPn3Yau1JEE0ylKlkYtQjNLHdNrmpoM/

caradove

How high/steep is the roof?
Has he seen anyone do roofing work?
Can you get up with him and walk around?

We used to live in an earth sheltered house, so roof was low to the ground at the back, 3yo ds got up and jumped off the back gable, 8ft and broke three metatarsal bones. I wish he had asked me about playing on the roof first, I would have come out and helped him play on it, but realise the jump was a bit too high!!!

cara





--- In [email protected], "Marla B." <marla@...> wrote:
>
> Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.
>
> Help?
>
>
> Marla
>

Marla B.

Well, it's kind of a hot button between my dh and I. Her 10 y0. sister has a window leading out to a small pc. of roof that is low. And her sister won't let her on this. So, I said she could go on the roof of the front porch, which is attached to the rest of the roof (there are several different levels. The highest area is the flattest. But it is a 2-story house in parts). So, she started there, but kept going up as high as she could go (she loves high places, I actually built an indoor tree house in our home because she kept climbing on the beams). I told her that it was serious and that she couldn't run or go near the edge and had to be careful (things that I rarely say to her). Now she wants to go up all the time and we do have a good friend who fell off a roof and is in a wheelchair, so it is a very present possibility to us.

My dh disagrees with it completely (he even wants to take down the tree house on occassion). So, I struggle. Am I allowing my kids so much freedom that I am putting their lives or health at stake?

Thanks for your ideas and help!

Marla
--- In [email protected], "Robin Krest" <rlkrest@...> wrote:
>
> Our now 5 y/o was up on the roof with us when he was 4. We talked about safety, and were always with him.
>
> WHY is it too much? WHY is this hitting your stop button?
>
> Robin K.
>
>
> ---------- Original Message ----------
> From: "Marla B." <marla@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [unschoolingbasics] 5 yo. wants to play on the roof
> Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 23:37:32 -0000
>
> Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.
>
> Help?
>
>
> Marla
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Looking for insurance? Click to compare and save big.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTInoKbVi4YBC9GHh4Rtu0vgPn3Yau1JEE0ylKlkYtQjNLHdNrmpoM/
>

Schuyler

Linnaea must have been about 6 and Simon when they used to climb on the garage and the shed and the summer house roofs. They would jump off as well. I never climbed on the house roof as the roof tiles were too fragile to take playing on, but there was a flat roof above the sunroom that they could climb on. In the house we rent now there are no roofs that they could climb on. Maybe the next house will be more roof friendly. Is the roof accessible? Can you get on the roof too? Can you find other roofs to go on? Sometimes at parks they have little summer house things that have a roof that could be climbed on? Do you have friends with lower roofs who don't mind having your family climbing about on them?

Schuyler




________________________________
From: Marla B. <marla@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, 30 March, 2009 12:37:32 AM
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] 5 yo. wants to play on the roof

Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.

Help?


Marla

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Faith Void

I understand this fear. We have a friend (15) who is paraplegic after being
hit while seat belted in a car. He was 6. We all still ride in a car. We all
still seat belt in. Plenty of people don't fall, especially once they know
safety rules and follow them. I just wanted to put some perspective on your
fear.

I figure that if this does happen to one of my children then that is there
life. I would surely do what I can to make it the best life possible for
them.

Faith

On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 11:29 PM, Marla B. <marla@...> wrote:

> Now she wants to go up all the time and we do have a good friend who
> fell off a roof and is in a wheelchair, so it is a very present possibility
> to us.
>
>

--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Schuyler

"and Simon 9" is what I was supposed to have written.




________________________________
From: Schuyler <s.waynforth@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, 30 March, 2009 12:29:41 PM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] 5 yo. wants to play on the roof

Linnaea must have been about 6 and Simon when


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

koko Jamison

we had a hook attached to the roof-so people can attach to it with a rope to do roof repairs. Tie her up there!

-----Original Message-----
>From: "Marla B." <marla@...>
>Sent: Mar 29, 2009 8:29 PM
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: 5 yo. wants to play on the roof
>
>Well, it's kind of a hot button between my dh and I. Her 10 y0. sister has a window leading out to a small pc. of roof that is low. And her sister won't let her on this. So, I said she could go on the roof of the front porch, which is attached to the rest of the roof (there are several different levels. The highest area is the flattest. But it is a 2-story house in parts). So, she started there, but kept going up as high as she could go (she loves high places, I actually built an indoor tree house in our home because she kept climbing on the beams). I told her that it was serious and that she couldn't run or go near the edge and had to be careful (things that I rarely say to her). Now she wants to go up all the time and we do have a good friend who fell off a roof and is in a wheelchair, so it is a very present possibility to us.
>
>My dh disagrees with it completely (he even wants to take down the tree house on occassion). So, I struggle. Am I allowing my kids so much freedom that I am putting their lives or health at stake?
>
>Thanks for your ideas and help!
>
>Marla
>--- In [email protected], "Robin Krest" <rlkrest@...> wrote:
>>
>> Our now 5 y/o was up on the roof with us when he was 4. We talked about safety, and were always with him.
>>
>> WHY is it too much? WHY is this hitting your stop button?
>>
>> Robin K.
>>
>>
>> ---------- Original Message ----------
>> From: "Marla B." <marla@...>
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: [unschoolingbasics] 5 yo. wants to play on the roof
>> Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 23:37:32 -0000
>>
>> Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.
>>
>> Help?
>>
>>
>> Marla
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> Looking for insurance? Click to compare and save big.
>> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTInoKbVi4YBC9GHh4Rtu0vgPn3Yau1JEE0ylKlkYtQjNLHdNrmpoM/
>>
>
>


Studio Glow
1025 South Sullivan Street
Seattle WA 98108
Studioglow@...
206 726 1147 shop
206 551 3022 cell

tcolleen_1

Please be very careful about this.

I had a high school teacher who was killed when he fell off a roof, and I have another friend who was left a quadriplegic after he fell off a roof.

I understand the "climbing" thing - I have a dd who is a climber, but I am the parent, and I am responsible for drawing the line at activities that I feel will endanger her.

For my dd, we enrolled her in gymnastics, and working on the high beam and the bars helped her satisfy her desire to be up high, but she learned how to do it (reasonably) safely, and she also heard from people other than her parents about the dangers of falling from a high point.

Another thing you may try is to see if there is a gym or facility near you that has a rock-climbing wall. Again, she will learn how to climb safely, and will have safety gear that will keep her from hitting the ground if she loses her grip.

Good luck! I know how persistent kids can be.

Teri


--- In [email protected], "Marla B." <marla@...> wrote:
>
> Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.
>
> Help?
>
>
> Marla
>

Heather & Markus Schleidt

I have to agree with this. Although I feel that as a supportive parent it is a great honor to be able to honor our children's wishes, a five-year old is not that capable of understanding the severity of their actions if they fall. While we can talk about falling, going to the hospital, becoming parapelegic, dying, etc none of these REALLY have the impact of understanding that we as adults understand it. I believe there are many other ways to satisfy this desire to climb (I have an outrageous climber who wants to jump from our loft onto the couch at 3 yo - NO FEAR), I do not believe that THIS activity of climbing on the roof is an age-appropriate one. I wouldn't let my 5 yo jump off trains if he was interested and climbing on the roof can be every bit as dangerous, especially since it seems more innocent and can lead to the belief that everything is ok and then - SLIP - one second later you have a terrible situation on your hand.



I also would not think to ask another neighbor about climbing on their rooftop, even if it were flat. Unless you have a familial-type relationship with another family, they would probably worry about being sued if the child fell.



To: [email protected]
From: tcolleen_1@...
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:52:16 +0000
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: 5 yo. wants to play on the roof





Please be very careful about this.

I had a high school teacher who was killed when he fell off a roof, and I have another friend who was left a quadriplegic after he fell off a roof.

I understand the "climbing" thing - I have a dd who is a climber, but I am the parent, and I am responsible for drawing the line at activities that I feel will endanger her.

For my dd, we enrolled her in gymnastics, and working on the high beam and the bars helped her satisfy her desire to be up high, but she learned how to do it (reasonably) safely, and she also heard from people other than her parents about the dangers of falling from a high point.

Another thing you may try is to see if there is a gym or facility near you that has a rock-climbing wall. Again, she will learn how to climb safely, and will have safety gear that will keep her from hitting the ground if she loses her grip.

Good luck! I know how persistent kids can be.

Teri

--- In [email protected], "Marla B." <marla@...> wrote:
>
> Our very persistant 5 yo. wants to play up on our roof. I'm usually pretty open to some crazy stuff, but this is too much for me.
>
> Help?
>
>
> Marla
>









_________________________________________________________________
Quick access to Windows Live and your favorite MSN content with Internet Explorer 8.
http://ie8.msn.com/microsoft/internet-explorer-8/en-us/ie8.aspx?ocid=B037MSN55C0701A

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robin Bentley

> Well, it's kind of a hot button between my dh and I. Her 10 y0.
> sister has a window leading out to a small pc. of roof that is low.
> And her sister won't let her on this.
> So, I said she could go on the roof of the front porch, which is
> attached to the rest of the roof (there are several different
> levels. The highest area is the flattest. But it is a 2-story
> house in parts). So, she started there, but kept going up as high
> as she could go (she loves high places, I actually built an indoor
> tree house in our home because she kept climbing on the beams). I
> told her that it was serious and that she couldn't run or go near
> the edge and had to be careful (things that I rarely say to her).
> Now she wants to go up all the time and we do have a good friend who
> fell off a roof and is in a wheelchair, so it is a very present
> possibility to us
>
> My dh disagrees with it completely (he even wants to take down the
> tree house on occassion). So, I struggle. Am I allowing my kids so
> much freedom that I am putting their lives or health at stake?

It sounds like there is more to this than just the roof issue, with
regard to unschooling. Want to tell us more?

Robin B.

Robin Bentley

> Please be very careful about this.
>
> I had a high school teacher who was killed when he fell off a roof,
> and I have another friend who was left a quadriplegic after he fell
> off a roof.

On an unschooling list, it doesn't help to spread fear.
>
> I understand the "climbing" thing - I have a dd who is a climber,
> but I am the parent, and I am responsible for drawing the line at
> activities that I feel will endanger her.

"But I am the parent" has been used (somewhat like the "I know my
children best" statement) as an excuse to foist all manner of
restrictions on children. Sometimes for no other reason than the fears
of the parents.
>
> For my dd, we enrolled her in gymnastics, and working on the high
> beam and the bars helped her satisfy her desire to be up high, but
> she learned how to do it (reasonably) safely, and she also heard
> from people other than her parents about the dangers of falling from
> a high point.

So you helped to reinforce fear by making sure she heard it from
others, besides yourselves? What about helping her understand not only
the risks but why you feel the way you do?

How about imagining with her what it would be like to go up on a roof
(without any warnings)? She could talk about what she'd sees, what it
would smell like, where she'd place her hands and feel, how powerful
she'd feel? You could learn more about her that way.

Maybe you should watch the documentary "Man on Wire" to understand why
some people have no fear about being up high and what their
motivations are <g>.
>
> Another thing you may try is to see if there is a gym or facility
> near you that has a rock-climbing wall. Again, she will learn how
> to climb safely, and will have safety gear that will keep her from
> hitting the ground if she loses her grip.

Not a bad idea. Providing other opportunities to be up high is
definitely a way to help a child with what she wants to do.

Injecting fear into the process doesn't help, though.

Tell us more about you and your family and how long you've been
unschooling. Maybe that will put this post in context.

Robin B.

Ren Allen

~~Injecting fear into the process doesn't help, though.~~

I don't think it's always "injecting fear" to talk through potential outcomes with children. That is part of the inexperience of youth and I do think it can be helpful to verbally walk through potential outcomes in a situation where there is greater risk. Heck, even situations where there isn't a lot of risk that can be a useful tool.

Not to create fear, but awareness.

Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com

Robin Bentley

> ~~Injecting fear into the process doesn't help, though.~~
>
> I don't think it's always "injecting fear" to talk through potential
> outcomes with children. That is part of the inexperience of youth
> and I do think it can be helpful to verbally walk through potential
> outcomes in a situation where there is greater risk. Heck, even
> situations where there isn't a lot of risk that can be a useful tool.
>
> Not to create fear, but awareness.
>
Fair enough! It's good to talk through possibilities, especially if
outcomes can be dangerous. I was thinking one could probably do that
without a fear-based bias.

Robin B.

Ren Allen

~~I was thinking one could probably do that
without a fear-based bias.~~

Well yeah, saying "I am really concerned about x,y,z" is different than "I know a guy who is a paraplegic...." blah, blah, blah.

Everyone can come up with a horrific story about someone who was injured or died in some bizarre, risky way. But then, people shouldn't get on horses or in cars or fly on airplanes or go hiking/camping or any other number of things that have potential for death/injury!

'Course being alive is pretty risky.;)

I would personally have huge issues with any kid wanting to be on our roof. I'd be finding another roof or another outlet for that fascination because ours is definitely not safe on the best day. Unschooling is about creative problem solving not just ignoring my safety instincts as a Mum. "No" happens.

Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com

Brad Holcomb

> I understand the "climbing" thing - I have a dd who is a climber,
> but I am the parent, and I am responsible for drawing
> the line at activities that I feel will endanger her.


My parents were *GREAT* (exceptional, really) at "drawing the line". It's
one of the things they were best at. No Playing On The Roof was a solid
rule (one of dozens), well understood by me. They "drew the line" at around
5 feet or so for climbing.

Anytime my parents were out of sight, I was on the roof. Or I was way up
high in the tallest tree I could find. I don't think I ever got caught, but
it left me completely solo in my research of heights for fear of being
discovered and punished.

Once I decided that jumping off the edge of a carport (6 or 7 feet high,
probably) on my hoppity-horse (inflatable ball with a handle) would be fun.
I landed pretty well but bounced crazily and flipped high in the air,
knocking the breath out of me when I landed. Plus my neck hurt for a while.

Another time I fell over 20 feet out of the top of a pine tree. I hit (or
grabbed at) most of the branches on the way down, mostly breaking my fall.
As I lay there with the wind completely knocked out of me, unable to move
yet, I remember thinking, "I hope there's no blood. Dang, I should have
been wearing long sleeves. If there's blood, I'm gonna get a spanking for
climbing high." And even if they didn't spank me, they were always ready
with an "I told you that would happen."

Go on youtube and search for things like "crazy roof trampoline jump". I'd
be willing to bet that most of the kids you see in those videos have parents
who "draw the line". When parents are away, the kids make crazy youtube
videos!!

I help my kid climb, including on roofs. "Drawing the line" is easy. I
prefer to face my fears and maintain open and honest communication with my
kid. Relationship first.

-=b.

Brad Holcomb

> 'Course being alive is pretty risky.;)


Over 500 people in the United States die from falling out of bed, every
single year. Seriously. Being alive is definitely risky business. :)

-=b.

Professional Parenting

My one absolute rule is (whether they wish to go on the roof, or play with matches, or whatever,) they need an adult with them at arms length at all times.
Usually, it's me, because most adults don't understand why I would let my child "play" with matches or allow them on the roof! Yes, it takes time and energy from me, but I'm happy to turn it into a learning experience.
We set up the safety provisions, such as having the fire extinguisher and a bucket of water close by, and cover the science principles such as why blowing out the flame can incite it more, etc. They learn quite a bit about safety, science and the answers to all their questions.
As a child, I set fire to kleenix in the bathtub while the babysitters talked on the phone, because I was not allowed to touch fire. I wouldn't dare do it while my parents were around. My husband set his bedroom carpet on fire. Kids are going to do it. Regardless. May as well teach them to do it safely and supervised.

Judy Arnall,
Parenting Speaker, Trainer and Author of the Canadian Bestseller:
Discipline Without Distress: 135 tools for raising caring,
Responsible children without time-out, spanking, punishment or bribery
www.professionalparenting.ca
http://bureau.espeakers.com/caps/speaker.php?sid=10763&showreturntoresults=true
Tele: (403) 714-6766
Email jarnall@...
Peace in the world begins in the home
Parenting is the best job in the world and the hardest! If you would like a daily parenting tip/strategy/affirmation/support
please follow me on http://twitter.com/JudyArnall

----- Original Message -----
From: Brad Holcomb
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 7:04 AM
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] Re: 5 yo. wants to play on the roof



> I understand the "climbing" thing - I have a dd who is a climber,
> but I am the parent, and I am responsible for drawing
> the line at activities that I feel will endanger her.

My parents were *GREAT* (exceptional, really) at "drawing the line". It's
one of the things they were best at. No Playing On The Roof was a solid
rule (one of dozens), well understood by me. They "drew the line" at around
5 feet or so for climbing.

Anytime my parents were out of sight, I was on the roof. Or I was way up
high in the tallest tree I could find. I don't think I ever got caught, but
it left me completely solo in my research of heights for fear of being
discovered and punished.

Once I decided that jumping off the edge of a carport (6 or 7 feet high,
probably) on my hoppity-horse (inflatable ball with a handle) would be fun.
I landed pretty well but bounced crazily and flipped high in the air,
knocking the breath out of me when I landed. Plus my neck hurt for a while.

Another time I fell over 20 feet out of the top of a pine tree. I hit (or
grabbed at) most of the branches on the way down, mostly breaking my fall.
As I lay there with the wind completely knocked out of me, unable to move
yet, I remember thinking, "I hope there's no blood. Dang, I should have
been wearing long sleeves. If there's blood, I'm gonna get a spanking for
climbing high." And even if they didn't spank me, they were always ready
with an "I told you that would happen."

Go on youtube and search for things like "crazy roof trampoline jump". I'd
be willing to bet that most of the kids you see in those videos have parents
who "draw the line". When parents are away, the kids make crazy youtube
videos!!

I help my kid climb, including on roofs. "Drawing the line" is easy. I
prefer to face my fears and maintain open and honest communication with my
kid. Relationship first.

-=b.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]