Angel

Hi. My name is Angel and I am new to the group and more so new to
the concept of "unschooling." Truthfully I have no idea what it is
really is. I am a former school teacher who now is a SAHM. I love
it! I have a wonderful four year old boy and I started his day like
I would if he were in a pre-k classroom. I had lesson plans and
materials ready to enrich his world. Well, my son was not having
it. I am NOT a ditto or workbook kind of mommy or teacher. The
activities I provided were based on interest and a variety of
materials-play-doh, paint, dirt, etc. But any effort I made seemed
to be shot down by my son. So, I thought okay I will allow my boy
to pick out the book when it is story time, I will allow him to pick
the songs to sing, and material to use, but the schedule to do these
activities will remain the same as before. Well, that does not seem
to be working either. So, one day I just let him do his own thing
and I was there to be his mommy, playmate, and resource whenever he
needed me. AND GUESS WHAT- I observed so much learning and
excitement from my little boy. I was told that this is a form of
unschooling, is it???? I have some more info I have included and I
could sure use your advice. I do not want to teach my son based on
my "teaching degree." I want to teach my son to develop a love for
learning that would be in the best of his interest. Thanks.
Ok, I have had wonderful answers about how you do it. But now I
would love to know and for us to share; What do you do? Ok, I am
allowing my son's learning and activities to be based on his
interests. I have set up a routine schedule. For example: In the
morning we will do story time and he picks out the story. During
another part of the day it is sensory time and my boy picks out the
sensory activity. Although, he has the freedom to pick out the book
or activity, he may not be motivated at that time to do it. Well, It
is not working for me. I redo the schedule and I reschedule all the
activities and you know what it keeps changing. It was so much
easier being a classroom teacher. I thought having a routine chart
would work and provide structured. However, my son may not be
physically and mentally ready for that activity during that specific
time of day. He is a YOUNG four year old. Do you have this
problem? Alright moms, I need your advice and input. My son is very
well behaved and is responsible about helping around the home and
being considerate of others, but should I just do story time when
he picks up a book and says, "mommy, please read this story to me?"
Should I completely just let my son flow throughout the day as long
as learning and teaching responsibility occurs? Should the
activities happen based on spontaneous learning? Moms, it would be
nice to know how it works for you. I do not want the "loving-
control" part of me to come before the natural interest of my son.
Am I making any sense?????

tbain2

Hi Angel,
My name is Toni and I am also new to the group. I have an only son
who is nine and has always been homeschooled. Like you, I tried the
schedule thing, the workbook thing etc etc etc. My son always fought
me on any of it. Our current approach is that I offer ideas of
things he may want to pursue on any given day, sometimes it's
something I've just come across, and sometimes it's an extension of
what I've noticed him enjoying most recently. It's never required,
and I try to have more than one option to offer, and if he has
something specific he wishes to pursue, we try to do that. As for
the playmate, reading stories part, I try to offer certain periods in
any given day when I will be available for those things. If he
wishes me to read to him, or play with him during those times I do.
If he doesn't want my interaction then, we wait for another available
time. This gives him the understanding that I have responsiblities
of my own to attend and can't simply be "on call" all the time, but I
am still readily available if he wants my company, though I may not
be available to sit down and read to him or play at the exact
moment. Every time I think we have gotten a groove, the rules change
and we have to have a "re-invention". I hope this helps.
Toni

--- In [email protected], "Angel" <aavery2121@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi. My name is Angel and I am new to the group and more so new to
> the concept of "unschooling." Truthfully I have no idea what it is
> really is. I am a former school teacher who now is a SAHM. I love
> it! I have a wonderful four year old boy and I started his day
like
> I would if he were in a pre-k classroom. I had lesson plans and
> materials ready to enrich his world. Well, my son was not having
> it. I am NOT a ditto or workbook kind of mommy or teacher. The
> activities I provided were based on interest and a variety of
> materials-play-doh, paint, dirt, etc. But any effort I made
seemed
> to be shot down by my son. So, I thought okay I will allow my boy
> to pick out the book when it is story time, I will allow him to
pick
> the songs to sing, and material to use, but the schedule to do
these
> activities will remain the same as before. Well, that does not
seem
> to be working either. So, one day I just let him do his own thing
> and I was there to be his mommy, playmate, and resource whenever he
> needed me. AND GUESS WHAT- I observed so much learning and
> excitement from my little boy. I was told that this is a form of
> unschooling, is it???? I have some more info I have included and I
> could sure use your advice. I do not want to teach my son based on
> my "teaching degree." I want to teach my son to develop a love for
> learning that would be in the best of his interest. Thanks.
> Ok, I have had wonderful answers about how you do it. But now I
> would love to know and for us to share; What do you do? Ok, I am
> allowing my son's learning and activities to be based on his
> interests. I have set up a routine schedule. For example: In the
> morning we will do story time and he picks out the story. During
> another part of the day it is sensory time and my boy picks out the
> sensory activity. Although, he has the freedom to pick out the
book
> or activity, he may not be motivated at that time to do it. Well,
It
> is not working for me. I redo the schedule and I reschedule all the
> activities and you know what it keeps changing. It was so much
> easier being a classroom teacher. I thought having a routine chart
> would work and provide structured. However, my son may not be
> physically and mentally ready for that activity during that
specific
> time of day. He is a YOUNG four year old. Do you have this
> problem? Alright moms, I need your advice and input. My son is
very
> well behaved and is responsible about helping around the home and
> being considerate of others, but should I just do story time when
> he picks up a book and says, "mommy, please read this story to me?"
> Should I completely just let my son flow throughout the day as long
> as learning and teaching responsibility occurs? Should the
> activities happen based on spontaneous learning? Moms, it would be
> nice to know how it works for you. I do not want the "loving-
> control" part of me to come before the natural interest of my son.
> Am I making any sense?????
>

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: aavery2121@...

So, one day I just let him do his own thing
and I was there to be his mommy, playmate, and resource whenever he
needed me. AND GUESS WHAT- I observed so much learning and
excitement from my little boy.

-=-==-

Right! They are Born Learners! School and school-at-home can dull that
excitement and even extinguish the *desire* to learn.

Let them pursue their passions, and---just like us!---they stay
passionate learners!

-=-=-=-=-

I want to teach my son to develop a love for
learning that would be in the best of his interest.

-=-=-=-

He already *has* a love of learning. You don't have to *teach* that!
Just let it keep growing!

-=-=-=-=--

Ok, I am
allowing my son's learning and activities to be based on his
interests. I have set up a routine schedule. For example: In the
morning we will do story time and he picks out the story. During
another part of the day it is sensory time and my boy picks out the
sensory activity. Although, he has the freedom to pick out the book
or activity, he may not be motivated at that time to do it. Well, It
is not working for me. I redo the schedule and I reschedule all the
activities and you know what it keeps changing.

-=-=-=-

Yeah--welcome to childhood! <bwg>

Can you just drop the scheduling? Just follow *his* lead?

-=-=-=-=-


It was so much
easier being a classroom teacher. I thought having a routine chart
would work and provide structured. However, my son may not be
physically and mentally ready for that activity during that specific
time of day.

-=-=-=-=-

Right. We all have different clocks---that change over time.

Go PLAY!

-=-=-=-=-

He is a YOUNG four year old. Do you have this problem?

-=-=-=-

Even if he were and OLD thirty year old <g>, just follow what he loves.
Do you try to use this kind of structure with your husband too? How
would *you* react if your husband tried to impose that stuff on *you*?

At 46, *I* have a problem with all your scheduling and routine and
structure! <g>

-=-=-=-==

Alright moms, I need your advice and input. My son is very
well behaved and is responsible about helping around the home and
being considerate of others, but should I just do story time when
he picks up a book and says, "mommy, please read this story to me?"

-=-=-=-=-

uh huh. Just pick up the book. Read. Stop when he's had enough.

-=-=-=-

Should I completely just let my son flow throughout the day as long
as learning and teaching responsibility occurs?

-=-=-=-=-

Well, how do you think you could stop him from learning?

Do you feel you need to *teach* responsibility? Do you not think he
learns that by watching *you* be responsible?

-=-=-=-=-

Should the activities happen based on spontaneous learning?

-=-=-=-=-

Huh? All learning is based on building upon what we already know. The
learning happens based on the activities---not the other way around.

-=-=-=-=-

Moms, it would be
nice to know how it works for you. I do not want the "loving-
control" part of me to come before the natural interest of my son.
Am I making any sense?????

-=-=-=-

Well there ARE a few *dads* here as well. <g>

Back off on the control. Watch your child as he learns. He's a learning
machine! Just go along for the ride. Clear the tracks when needed. Add
coal to the fire. Bring him food on a long run. Make sure he can reach
the horn and whistle. <g>

~Kelly



Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org




________________________________________________________________________
Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and
security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from
across the web, free AOL Mail and more.

Schuyler

> My name is Toni and I am also new to the group. I have an only son
> who is nine and has always been homeschooled. Like you, I tried the
> schedule thing, the workbook thing etc etc etc. My son always fought
> me on any of it. Our current approach is that I offer ideas of
> things he may want to pursue on any given day, sometimes it's
> something I've just come across, and sometimes it's an extension of
> what I've noticed him enjoying most recently. It's never required,
> and I try to have more than one option to offer, and if he has
> something specific he wishes to pursue, we try to do that. As for
> the playmate, reading stories part, I try to offer certain periods in
> any given day when I will be available for those things. If he
> wishes me to read to him, or play with him during those times I do.

That is still scheduling. It still means that you aren't really available
outside of those times. And it really means that he is only of equal
importance with whatever else it is you are scheduling.

Yesterday Simon asked me to play a video game with him. I said I need to put
the laundry out to dry, so would it be okay if I did that first, or did he
want me to play with him first. He said he'd like me to play with him first,
so I did. Later in the day I was doing the dishes and he asked me to watch a
movie with him. I asked if I could quickly finish the dishes and then we
could watch a movie, he said sure. But if he'd wanted me to stop doing the
dishes, I would have.

There is nothing in my life more important than Simon or Linnaea. Nothing
that I am not willing to juggle around their needs.


> If he doesn't want my interaction then, we wait for another available
> time. This gives him the understanding that I have responsiblities
> of my own to attend and can't simply be "on call" all the time, but I
> am still readily available if he wants my company, though I may not
> be available to sit down and read to him or play at the exact
> moment.

Why would you want him to understand that you have things that supercede his
needs? Try reading here:
http://www.joyfullyrejoycing.com/commitments%20obligation%20responsi/haveto.html
or http://sandradodd.com/unschool/haveto for how you can change your
perspective on what you "have to" do.

> Every time I think we have gotten a groove, the rules change
> and we have to have a "re-invention".

Without rules there is nothing to change. If you live a life based on
principles, something that is completely flexible, than you won't have to
worry about re-inventing your system. You might want to read Danielle
Conger's essay on Rules versus Principles which is here:
http://danielleconger.organiclearning.org/rulesvsprinciples.html and Sandra
Dodd has put together a number of other people's writing on the subject,
including Danielle's, here: http://sandradodd.com/rules .

Schuyler
www.waynforth.blogspot.com

Ellen

I cannot speak to what the OP was referring to, but I think you do
have to remember that some people are working from home. And sometimes
that work cannot be put down at any moment. In an ideal world maybe,
but me working at home 3 afternoons a week is the trade off I make to
not have to work outside the home, at least for now. Much of what I do
has some flexibility but I have a crunch period for about 30 minutes
starting around 1 or so that I cannot work around.

Not meant as an attack, just a reminder that some external things are
forces we have to deal with. I do agree with your comments in the
sense that we need to remember that doing things around the house
should be made secondary to our kids when they want us.

> That is still scheduling. It still means that you aren't really
available
> outside of those times. And it really means that he is only of equal
> importance with whatever else it is you are scheduling.
>
> Yesterday Simon asked me to play a video game with him. I said I
need to put
> the laundry out to dry, so would it be okay if I did that first, or
did he
> want me to play with him first. He said he'd like me to play with
him first,
> so I did. Later in the day I was doing the dishes and he asked me to
watch a
> movie with him. I asked if I could quickly finish the dishes and
then we
> could watch a movie, he said sure. But if he'd wanted me to stop
doing the
> dishes, I would have.
>
> There is nothing in my life more important than Simon or Linnaea.
Nothing
> that I am not willing to juggle around their needs.
>

plaidpanties666

--- In [email protected], "Ellen" <ellen@...> wrote:
>
> I cannot speak to what the OP was referring to, but I think you do
> have to remember that some people are working from home. And
sometimes
> that work cannot be put down at any moment.

This is true. It is possible, though, to create an environment where
kids' needs are honored and respected while still being able to get
work done.

> me working at home 3 afternoons a week is the trade off I make to
> not have to work outside the home, at least for now. Much of what
I do
> has some flexibility but I have a crunch period for about 30
minutes
> starting around 1 or so that I cannot work around.

Would you be willing to post about some of your strategies for doing
this? My partner is often available if I need to spend some
uninterrupted time working in my studio, but not always.

> Not meant as an attack, just a reminder that some external things
are
> forces we have to deal with.

Yes, absolutely. I think the big difference with unschooling,
though, is that rather than coming from the standpoint that "kids
must learn they can't always get what they want" we take the
approach of "how can I help my kids when they can't get what they
want in the moment?" That's a pretty significant mental shift,
there, from an antagonistic, "teaching", mindset to one of mutual
support and problem solving. Personally, I think its one of the
Biggest shifts in terms of understanding unschooling (maybe bc it
was for me!).

---Meredith (Mo 5, Ray 13)

tbain2

Thank you for that. I am the original poster, and I do work at home.
What you stated is the EXACT case. It's not as if I put doing
dishes, laundy, etc before my kid, but there are times when I cannot
stop in the middle of some work I am doing to be available right
now. I try to be as clear, honest, and upfront with my son about
when those times will be, so he knows I will be unavailable then.
Sometimes I can't warn him as things do sometimes come up, but
because I am otherwise totally available to him, and he knows that he
is not overall second to work, he is usually pretty patient with
that.
Thank you for jumping in here, the answering post did come off a
little attacking, though I doubt the poster meant it to be.
Toni

--- In [email protected], "Ellen" <ellen@...> wrote:
>
> I cannot speak to what the OP was referring to, but I think you do
> have to remember that some people are working from home. And
sometimes
> that work cannot be put down at any moment. In an ideal world maybe,
> but me working at home 3 afternoons a week is the trade off I make
to
> not have to work outside the home, at least for now. Much of what I
do
> has some flexibility but I have a crunch period for about 30 minutes
> starting around 1 or so that I cannot work around.
>
> Not meant as an attack, just a reminder that some external things
are
> forces we have to deal with. I do agree with your comments in the
> sense that we need to remember that doing things around the house
> should be made secondary to our kids when they want us.
>
> > That is still scheduling. It still means that you aren't really
> available
> > outside of those times. And it really means that he is only of
equal
> > importance with whatever else it is you are scheduling.
> >
> > Yesterday Simon asked me to play a video game with him. I said I
> need to put
> > the laundry out to dry, so would it be okay if I did that first,
or
> did he
> > want me to play with him first. He said he'd like me to play with
> him first,
> > so I did. Later in the day I was doing the dishes and he asked me
to
> watch a
> > movie with him. I asked if I could quickly finish the dishes and
> then we
> > could watch a movie, he said sure. But if he'd wanted me to stop
> doing the
> > dishes, I would have.
> >
> > There is nothing in my life more important than Simon or Linnaea.
> Nothing
> > that I am not willing to juggle around their needs.
> >
>

Joyce Fetteroll

On Feb 17, 2007, at 10:39 AM, tbain2 wrote:

> Thank you for jumping in here, the answering post did come off a
> little attacking, though I doubt the poster meant it to be.

As with all responses to the list, they should be directed not at
what goes on in a home -- we can't know that! -- but the *idea* that
is posted. Ren responded to:

> I try to offer certain periods in
> any given day when I will be available for those things. If he
> wishes me to read to him, or play with him during those times I do.
> If he doesn't want my interaction then, we wait for another available
> time. This gives him the understanding that I have responsiblities
> of my own to attend and can't simply be "on call" all the time

The above *idea* as written like that won't help people build
relationships or make unschooling run smoother. The idea as written
is to schedule particular blocks of time that a child may be with mom.

It sounds like what you do is different from above, but, again, the
list is for sharing ideas, not connecting in a "well, you know what I
mean" way that we all tend to do in real life with people we know. No
one here *can* know what another person means. We can only read what
the words say.

> I try to be as clear, honest, and upfront with my son about
> when those times will be, so he knows I will be unavailable then.

This is a great way to show respect. Traditional parenting would
suggest an "I have important things to do and you need to not bother
me," attitude. :-/

Joyce





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Nance Confer

unschoolingbasicsWhat she said!!

***********

Back off on the control. Watch your child as he learns. He's a learning
machine! Just go along for the ride. Clear the tracks when needed. Add
coal to the fire. Bring him food on a long run. Make sure he can reach
the horn and whistle. <g>

~Kelly

**********
Which reminds me, I should go see if DS needs some more dinner. :)

Really, your son sounds like a delightful, curious, wonderful 4-year-old. You've surrounded him with fun and interesting things. Now to let him enjoy them! :)

Nance



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ellen

--- In [email protected], "tbain2" <tbain2@...> wrote:
>
> Thank you for that. I am the original poster, and I do work at home.
> What you stated is the EXACT case. It's not as if I put doing
> dishes, laundy, etc before my kid, but there are times when I cannot
> stop in the middle of some work I am doing to be available right
> now. I try to be as clear, honest, and upfront with my son about
> when those times will be, so he knows I will be unavailable then.
> Sometimes I can't warn him as things do sometimes come up, but
> because I am otherwise totally available to him, and he knows that he
> is not overall second to work, he is usually pretty patient with
> that.
> Thank you for jumping in here, the answering post did come off a
> little attacking, though I doubt the poster meant it to be.
> Toni
>
Sounds to me like you are doing a pretty good job. I agree that being
upfront and honest is the way to go. And it is a chance for him to
learn to respect that Mommy has to do something sometimes just like
Mommy should respect him when he is busy doing something, you know?

I think the best strategy is prevention. Since my work is in the
afternoon, things go best if I can really fill her up in the morning
with my time and attention. That, and being really active in the
morning whether it is running errands, playing with other kids, or
some other fun activity for her. Then when the afternoon comes, she is
ready for some down time.

As for the specifics, there is the old standby, TV, or if your kid is
old enough, computer games. My DD is almost 3 and is not able to use
the computer on her own yet. That may change soon though. She seems
interested so we are trying to get her a computer for her own use.
Another thing that works some for us is I have boxed up some of her
toys because she has too many to have out all the time. The boxes are
clear and are out where she can see them and get them whenever she
wants but she seldom does. Then, when I need her to be entertained for
a little while or if we are dealing with rainy day blues, pulling out
a box like that can be like getting new toys almost.

But like everything with unschooling, you follow the lead of your
child and just do your best to help them even when you are busy. Moms
are always multi-tasking!

tbain2

Thanks Ellen. I agree about the mutual respect of each other's time.

My strategy is that I am awake for at least an hour before he gets
up, that's when I try to get my most focused work done. Of course, I
can't get it all done in an hour or so a day. But I try to keep it
to a before he gets up and after lunch schedule. That way, when he
awakes, I am available for a morning snuggle and breakfast. Then we
do something together. Sometimes it's something I suggested,
sometimes it's his suggestion. Then if I have more to do, I work
after lunch. During that time, he uses the computer, makes
inventions, works on remote control vehicles, writes in his journal,
plays with the dog, etc etc etc. It helps alot that he is older,
this was a lot bigger challenge when he was little. Now he has his
own interests, and the abilities to pursue many things on his own,
with maybe a little input from me. Like, "Mom, how can I find _____
on the internet?" Also, his dad gets home at 3PM, so if I need really
focused time, I can often get it then with dad doing stuff with our
son. We have a general "no tv in the daytime" rule unless you are
sick or on special occasions. That's just a personal preference for
me. However, when he was younger, we did not have that rule. TV can
be a great way to get even a few minutes of down time for mom.

You are right about following your child's lead. Every time I think
I know the route, a new one appears! It makes it interesting and
always exciting! I am thankful for the ability to multi task.
Toni


--- In [email protected], "Ellen" <ellen@...> wrote:

> Sounds to me like you are doing a pretty good job. I agree that
being
> upfront and honest is the way to go. And it is a chance for him to
> learn to respect that Mommy has to do something sometimes just like
> Mommy should respect him when he is busy doing something, you know?
>
> I think the best strategy is prevention. Since my work is in the
> afternoon, things go best if I can really fill her up in the morning
> with my time and attention. That, and being really active in the
> morning whether it is running errands, playing with other kids, or
> some other fun activity for her. Then when the afternoon comes, she
is
> ready for some down time.
>
> As for the specifics, there is the old standby, TV, or if your kid
is
> old enough, computer games. My DD is almost 3 and is not able to use
> the computer on her own yet. That may change soon though. She seems
> interested so we are trying to get her a computer for her own use.
> Another thing that works some for us is I have boxed up some of her
> toys because she has too many to have out all the time. The boxes
are
> clear and are out where she can see them and get them whenever she
> wants but she seldom does. Then, when I need her to be entertained
for
> a little while or if we are dealing with rainy day blues, pulling
out
> a box like that can be like getting new toys almost.
>
> But like everything with unschooling, you follow the lead of your
> child and just do your best to help them even when you are busy.
Moms
> are always multi-tasking!
>