Tina

"I can tell everyone from experience that un-schooling works.
I have adult children who graduated with honors from leading
Universities. The interesting thing is they found college level
work very simple!"

The above quote inspired my question. It seems that when reading
about unschooling and how it's successful we often hear about these
amazing projects that are mastered by young unschoolers. We hear
about admittance to top-notch colleges and universities and
graduating with honors. We hear about all these impressive things
that seem to be the same goals of schooled and traditionally
homeschooled families.

I am interested in a different perspective. Honestly, all the mind-
blowing success is rather intimidating to me. Is there anyone out
there that has unschooled to young adulthood that is successful and
didn't attend college? Is there anyone out there with a more simple
idea of success? Is there anyone that defines success outside the
paramaters of extended, institutional education?

I'd love to hear your ideas and experiences...

Tina

John & Karen Buxcel

I'm here! I don't define success as attending any ivy league college, or
any college at all for that matter. If my (very young) sons choose college,
fine, if they don't, fine. We already talk about all of the things they
could do w/out going to college.
My definition of success, one which I share with them often, is a feeling of
peace about who you are, knowing who you are and what is important to you,
and living life doing only the things that bring you utter bliss.
I went to college, because that's what I was 'supposed' to do. Now, my
teachers certificate sits there in a filing cabinet, with thousands of
dollars of paid off student loans sitting behind it. I always wish someone
would have shared other options with me; hey karen, have you thought about
traveling? backpacking around the country/world? peace corps?
I would have made a different decision, I'm almost certain of that.

to quote the Cranberries (i think?) "The world is your oyster, babe, you
can do what you want to do!"

Karen

http://www.thewildtribe.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Laura

oh tina, i am so glad you asked this question. i feel the very same way and when asked about "success" this is how i have described a possible scenario for success for one of my kids:

my son is an artist and i said that my idea of success for him would be that he make a living doing his artwork....BUT....i also think that success would be that he find a little place he could afford that has good working space in it and that he has few bills so he can maybe work at some coffee shop and make enough working part time to live on and the rest of his time he spends doing something he really really loves. that would be success...total success. happiness=success, it is that simple. if that means school for some people, then so be it. if my son wants to go to school one day to learn more about something, that will be his choice but it won't be about "becoming" successful, it will be just another avenue to learning something (like anything else he chooses to do to learn something new)

that's my version of success...and i'm sure i've got tons more, but for different things.

good discussion topic!!
la

Tina <zoocrew@...> wrote:
"I can tell everyone from experience that un-schooling works.
I have adult children who graduated with honors from leading
Universities. The interesting thing is they found college level
work very simple!"

The above quote inspired my question. It seems that when reading
about unschooling and how it's successful we often hear about these
amazing projects that are mastered by young unschoolers. We hear
about admittance to top-notch colleges and universities and
graduating with honors. We hear about all these impressive things
that seem to be the same goals of schooled and traditionally
homeschooled families.

I am interested in a different perspective. Honestly, all the mind-
blowing success is rather intimidating to me. Is there anyone out
there that has unschooled to young adulthood that is successful and
didn't attend college? Is there anyone out there with a more simple
idea of success? Is there anyone that defines success outside the
paramaters of extended, institutional education?

I'd love to hear your ideas and experiences...

Tina






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tina

> My definition of success, one which I share with them often, is a
feeling of peace about who you are, knowing who you are and what is
important to you, and living life doing only the things that bring
you utter bliss.>

I agree 100% with that idea. I would love to be surrounded by
people that think along the same line. I'm almost 36, a Domestic
Engineer, a wife, mother, grandmother and facilitator to my
children. Due to my upbringing, I'm sure, I am still trying very
actively to find what brings me utter bliss.

> I went to college, because that's what I was 'supposed' to do.
Now, my teachers certificate sits there in a filing cabinet, with
thousands of dollars of paid off student loans sitting behind it. I
always wish someone would have shared other options with me; hey
karen, have you thought about traveling? backpacking around the
country/world? peace corps? I would have made a different decision,
I'm almost certain of that.>

I did something similar. Although, I tended to do things the "hard"
way the rebel that I was. (I say tongue in cheek) I had my first
child very young, graduated high school with my class, went to
community college under the thumb of my grandfather. There was so
much control and stress there it wasn't funny. I quit and just
lived and worked for a while. Then on my own accord went to
business school and graduated with a good GPA. This was when I was
in my twenties, had two children and was supporting myself and
figuring things out on my own.

In hindsight, I wish I would have had someone showing me how to
think outside the box. Why did I feel the only way to have a life
was through continued education? I still get stuck on this spot.
My husband and I have the same struggle. Here I am trying to
instill in my children that there are choices outside of
institutionalized education, but I haven't even figured out how to
have a life outside of the very institution I am trying to get them
to stretch their thinking outside of.

Hence my query of others. The Peace Corps, backpacking across
Europe, traveling the U.S. or the world...all these things are
possible. I know that. What I just can't get my brain around is
how. As I mentioned above, my husband and I are struggling with
this very issue. We have been for years. He is in a tough
profession, transmission mechanic. We have owned our own business,
but it was inner-city and tough to run. We'd like to go back into
business for ourselves, but we'd like to do something different. We
are desperately trying to figure out HOW to make that happen.
Progress is being made, but by no means are we even certain of WHAT
it is we want to do.

In regard to our children, how have other unschoolers achieved their
bliss OUTSIDE of institutional education? How have parents of
unschoolers transformed their lives to follow their personal bliss?
How are others doing this?

Thanks - Tina

Laura

>>Now, my
teachers certificate sits there in a filing cabinet, with thousands of
dollars of paid off student loans sitting behind it.<<

i totally feel this...we are still paying student loans and i haven't been in school since '93...i still have about 10 more years to pay....that's a freakin' house by then!!!

i too wish someone had pointed me in a different direction (or had i read "teenage liberation handbook") but i can't dwell on that now. i can use that "wish" to make it a reality for my kids...giving them what i wish i'd had. i've healed a lot of my "school" wounds just by giving my kids differently.


---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

mtc

I unschooled myself, though I didn't know the word for it. I started
extricating myself from school around age 12 and left completely at 15.
(Even before then, I followed a very unschooly path and resisted the
efforts of teachers and parents to train my curiosity.) Unfortunately, I
also had to leave home, because my mother wouldn't support any decision that
wasn't "normal". She even turned down a chance for me
<?auth=DQAAAG8AAADVJwWqT9hGTwG_wnqYg3_FOirTCw7fSC7dcgdGhz_fQchymBV_bKd1D8rM2XI3FX2ezUlR57AcL8b4nUpH__fuISqAoX4SjagTvRICnf44VrT7MyVBe3LGZuaMRUvIP-31m-bFFkvfp0dOQ7TyaEEM>to
finish my high school diploma while attending classes at the local community
college, because "you have to do what everyone else is doing".

So I took it upon myself to seek an education of my own making. I've never
been to college, and didn't graduate high school. I've never made very much
money, but I've also never made it a priority in life. Instead I've focused
on self-directed learning and building joyful relationships, including, now,
with my child. I've met many amazing people from all walks of life, and
encountered a great diversity of ideas and information.

I'm 27 now, stay at home dad to a young toddler, and starting my own
business (slowly, because the child is the priority right now). I feel
successful in many ways, including that I know I'm free to spend the rest of
my life jumping from interest to interest if that's what I like, as my
daughter is as well. My life isn't perfect, but I've never regretted
deschooling for a moment. I might have reached this place regardless, but I
know it would have taken longer.

--Tom C.

On 11/13/06, Tina <zoocrew@...> wrote:
>
>
> I am interested in a different perspective. Honestly, all the mind-
> blowing success is rather intimidating to me. Is there anyone out
> there that has unschooled to young adulthood that is successful and
> didn't attend college? Is there anyone out there with a more simple
> idea of success? Is there anyone that defines success outside the
> paramaters of extended, institutional education?
>
> I'd love to hear your ideas and experiences...
>
> Tina
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ren Allen

~~Is there anyone that defines success outside the
paramaters of extended, institutional education?~~

There are a lot of them. I think the college successes get talked
about more, because it's what people want to hear.

Maybe Kelly will come on and talk about Cameron....he's not attending
college (doesn't mean he never will) but at 18 he's living an active,
full and interesting life of his choosing.

Peter Kowalke actually tried college and decided it wasn't for him.

Barb Lundgren's (of the Rethinking Education conference in TX) son
spent some time homeless as a social experiment.:) I believe for three
months or some such time.....
He's extremely bright and interesting from all accounts, but not
interested in fitting any mainstream ideals. Neat kid.

My Trevor is 17 in just weeks and has no desire to get his drivers
license yet, or even think about moving away or go to college. He's
interesting, fun and a delight to be around but certainly not winning
awards or doing anything to set the world on fire at this time!

I know that if college becomes important to any of these kids, they'll
use it as ONE tool among many in this life, not the end-all-be-all
that most people seem to think it is.

Ren
learninginfreedom.com

Ren Allen

~~i too wish someone had pointed me in a different direction (or had i
read "teenage liberation handbook") but i can't dwell on that now.~~

Exactly.
Your past is exactly that...PAST. We can all live the lives of our
choosing at any time. Nobody said it's easy to make those changes, but
the story we write for ourselves is our CHOICE. Plain and simple.

The adults in most of our lives didn't know any better. They had the
puritanical education and work ethic pounded into them also. If you
think about unschooling from a historical perspective, we're really
living in extreme luxury to even be discussing and debating this
lifestyle.

Most people have to focus so much on survival, the idea of "living the
life of your choosing" wouldn't be comprehendable. I think we OWE the
universe an amazing life, as a way to help this earth evolve forward.:)
I think we're helping point the arrow of evolution by grabbing hold of
the wealth of opportunities we enjoy and MASSIVE abundance and living
the life of our dreams!

The world can change through such actions. I know that the things we
LOVE to do, the passions we have are still alive even when ignored.
What is it that natters at you late into the night? What joyful
activity do you tell yourself isn't practical? What desires are you
trying to ignore because you "can't afford it" or "don't have time"?
THOSE are the very things your heart and soul need to be doing.
Find a way. Even if it's baby steps....little steps towards the
things you love brings great PEACE.

I recently made a commitment to myself about some of those "baby
steps" http://teawithren.blogspot.com/

Ren
learninginfreedom.com

Vickisue Gray

It's hard for me to image a 17yo not wanting to drive. My 16yo needs her car.
But that probably has more to do with the fact we live in the middle of nowhere
and even the mailbox is four miles away. (nearest grocery store 11 miles)
She also, plans to go to the University of Florida (un)homeschool friendly,
but more because of their overseas program. She wants to live and study in Europe.


----- Original Message ----
From: Ren Allen <starsuncloud@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 10:48:53 AM
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Unschooling Success?

~~Is there anyone that defines success outside the
paramaters of extended, institutional education?~~

There are a lot of them. I think the college successes get talked
about more, because it's what people want to hear.

Maybe Kelly will come on and talk about Cameron....he' s not attending
college (doesn't mean he never will) but at 18 he's living an active,
full and interesting life of his choosing.

Peter Kowalke actually tried college and decided it wasn't for him.

Barb Lundgren's (of the Rethinking Education conference in TX) son
spent some time homeless as a social experiment.: ) I believe for three
months or some such time.....
He's extremely bright and interesting from all accounts, but not
interested in fitting any mainstream ideals. Neat kid.

My Trevor is 17 in just weeks and has no desire to get his drivers
license yet, or even think about moving away or go to college. He's
interesting, fun and a delight to be around but certainly not winning
awards or doing anything to set the world on fire at this time!

I know that if college becomes important to any of these kids, they'll
use it as ONE tool among many in this life, not the end-all-be-all
that most people seem to think it is.

Ren
learninginfreedom. com






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sylvia Toyama

We don't care whether or not our boys go to college, or ever to any kind of school. Personally, I'd rather they not go to college, at least not unless they're convinced that's the necessary path to the life they want. I never went to college. Dh went to college because he was expected to -- it took him 3 yrs to declare a major, then he hated that field once he'd graduated. It took him some 25 yrs to find work he loves.

I shudder to think about the cost of university -- estimates I've heard say it will cost $200,000+ for today's young children to go to college. Yikes! The debt that would leave on a young person just starting out in his career is crushing -- three times the size of our mortgage, for crying out loud. If they do college, I'm going to strongly encourage local community colleges and state colleges, just for the cost alone.

Sylvia


---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sylvia Toyama

It's hard for me to image a 17yo not wanting to drive. My 16yo needs her car.
But that probably has more to do with the fact we live in the middle of nowhere

*****

I once had a 17yo who had no desire to get his driver's license. He's become a 21yo who doesn't have a driver's license -- still baffles his Dad. He had a license and a car briefly -- maybe 6 mos - when he lived away from home in North Carolina, where there wasn't any mass transit. He came back to New Mexico, and decided that owning a car just wasn't worth the expense or trouble -- insurance, fuel, repairs, etc. His solution was to find an apartment within an easy walk of work, the grocery store, laundromat, a few restaurants and two city bus routes. If he really needs to go somewhere - or do his laundry without quarters -- he calls me for a ride, which gives me an excuse to spend a day with him!

Really, his life is what I would consider a success, especially at 21yo. He only unschooled 2 yrs, after 11 years of public school, so his story really doesn't fit this question, except that I consider his choices to be successful, and acceptable for the younger boys when they grow up. Will (my 21yo ds) works at a job he really enjoys, has his own apartment, pays his bills on time, visits us every couple of weeks, calls more often. He has friends, and time to read or hang out -- most of all, he's happy and confident and growing every day, learning more about life every day. It doesn't get more successful than that in my book.

Sylvia


Mom to
Will (21) Andy (10) and Dan (5-1/2)

www.ourhapahome.blogspot.com

Life is what happens while you’re busy making other plans. ~ John Lennon











---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ren Allen

~It's hard for me to image a 17yo not wanting to drive.~

I think it's hard for people to imagine a 17y.o. that is perfectly
happy with his life as it is, and feels no need to change anything at
this time. Age is so arbitrary. Just because 16 makes it legal to
drive, doesn't mean every 16y.o. is ready or even wants to.

Most kids want to do everything at the earliest age possible because
adults are holding them back. Unschooled kids get to grow into
responsibility as they're ready. Some will want to drive before 16,
some won't care until their 20's probably.

One of our best friends is 18 and doesn't want to drive yet.
They can get where they want to go, whenever they want and they don't
really want the extra responsiblity just yet. They'll grow into it
when they're ready. In the meantime, I'm happy to not try and figure
out how I'll afford the insurance on him!!

Ren
learninginfreedom.com

jlh44music

Vickisue Gray <vickisue_gray@...> wrote:

> It's hard for me to image a 17yo not wanting to drive..>>>

I got my permit at 16 1/2, and was getting loads of practice driving,
but I didn't get my license until I was 20. I just wasn't ready
until then.
Jann

Sylvia Toyama

They'll grow into it when they're ready. In the meantime, I'm happy to not try and figure out how I'll afford the insurance on him!!

Ren

*****

That's how we felt -- the idea of paying for insurance for 17yo was scary. Some people never grow into driving -- neither of my grandmothers ever drove. My Mom didn't drive until she was almost 30, and I was 18 before I drove. Some people who live in cities with great mass transit, never need to own a car anyway.

Sylvia


---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vickisue Gray

Yes, that actually makes a lot of sense. My spouse is an emergency responder and he tells me that
many of the accidents involve teenagers. Not drunk or under the influence of anything other then youth. I worry greatly about my teen driving. I, personally, would go through withdrawl if I didn't have wheels but I guess I would adapt eventually. (The horses would get much more saddle time! lol)


----- Original Message ----
From: jlh44music <jlh44music@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 1:09:42 PM
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Unschooling Success?

Vickisue Gray <vickisue_gray@ ...> wrote:

> It's hard for me to image a 17yo not wanting to drive..>>>

I got my permit at 16 1/2, and was getting loads of practice driving,
but I didn't get my license until I was 20. I just wasn't ready
until then.
Jann






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vickisue Gray

rofl @ "I'm happy to not try and figure
out how I'll afford the insurance on him!!"

So true! Geico to the rescue! (and a 91' cadi in excellant shape~ proof age matters : ) )
If we lived near anything besides hundreds of acres of wilderness, she probably wouldn't want to drive either.


,___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vickisue Gray

Yes, this is the type of life my daughter talks of having in Germany or Amsterdam.



----- Original Message ----
From: Sylvia Toyama <sylgt04@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 1:02:09 PM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Unschooling Success?

It's hard for me to image a 17yo not wanting to drive. My 16yo needs her car.
But that probably has more to do with the fact we live in the middle of nowhere

*****

I once had a 17yo who had no desire to get his driver's license. He's become a 21yo who doesn't have a driver's license -- still baffles his Dad. He had a license and a car briefly -- maybe 6 mos - when he lived away from home in North Carolina, where there wasn't any mass transit. He came back to New Mexico, and decided that owning a car just wasn't worth the expense or trouble -- insurance, fuel, repairs, etc. His solution was to find an apartment within an easy walk of work, the grocery store, laundromat, a few restaurants and two city bus routes. If he really needs to go somewhere - or do his laundry without quarters -- he calls me for a ride, which gives me an excuse to spend a day with him!

Really, his life is what I would consider a success, especially at 21yo. He only unschooled 2 yrs, after 11 years of public school, so his story really doesn't fit this question, except that I consider his choices to be successful, and acceptable for the younger boys when they grow up. Will (my 21yo ds) works at a job he really enjoys, has his own apartment, pays his bills on time, visits us every couple of weeks, calls more often. He has friends, and time to read or hang out -- most of all, he's happy and confident and growing every day, learning more about life every day. It doesn't get more successful than that in my book.

Sylvia

Mom to
Will (21) Andy (10) and Dan (5-1/2)

www.ourhapahome. blogspot. com

Life is what happens while you�re busy making other plans. ~ John Lennon

------------ --------- --------- ---
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vickisue Gray

Florida has the Bright Futures Scholarships that pays 75% - 100% of the state college tuition if they score well on their SAT, etc... Homeschoolers are also eligible. (I have been told not to mention unschooling as people don't get it.) There's no way I could afford to pay the current prices. Even the Community Colleges are around $90. a credit hour. Quite pricey.


----- Original Message ----
From: Sylvia Toyama <sylgt04@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 12:44:32 PM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Unschooling Success?

We don't care whether or not our boys go to college, or ever to any kind of school. Personally, I'd rather they not go to college, at least not unless they're convinced that's the necessary path to the life they want. I never went to college. Dh went to college because he was expected to -- it took him 3 yrs to declare a major, then he hated that field once he'd graduated. It took him some 25 yrs to find work he loves.

I shudder to think about the cost of university -- estimates I've heard say it will cost $200,000+ for today's young children to go to college. Yikes! The debt that would leave on a young person just starting out in his career is crushing -- three times the size of our mortgage, for crying out loud. If they do college, I'm going to strongly encourage local community colleges and state colleges, just for the cost alone.

Sylvia

------------ --------- --------- ---
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vickisue Gray

Wow....I like this....Today, I wished I had a calmer horse so I could have joined my dh and ds on their ride. I think that will be my goal, to find a calm horse for me by my birthday.
Thanks for the post. Great food for thought.


----- Original Message ----
From: Ren Allen <starsuncloud@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 10:58:18 AM
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Unschooling Success?

~~i too wish someone had pointed me in a different direction (or had i
read "teenage liberation handbook") but i can't dwell on that now.~~

Exactly.
Your past is exactly that...PAST. We can all live the lives of our
choosing at any time. Nobody said it's easy to make those changes, but
the story we write for ourselves is our CHOICE. Plain and simple.

The adults in most of our lives didn't know any better. They had the
puritanical education and work ethic pounded into them also. If you
think about unschooling from a historical perspective, we're really
living in extreme luxury to even be discussing and debating this
lifestyle.

Most people have to focus so much on survival, the idea of "living the
life of your choosing" wouldn't be comprehendable. I think we OWE the
universe an amazing life, as a way to help this earth evolve forward.:)
I think we're helping point the arrow of evolution by grabbing hold of
the wealth of opportunities we enjoy and MASSIVE abundance and living
the life of our dreams!

The world can change through such actions. I know that the things we
LOVE to do, the passions we have are still alive even when ignored.
What is it that natters at you late into the night? What joyful
activity do you tell yourself isn't practical? What desires are you
trying to ignore because you "can't afford it" or "don't have time"?
THOSE are the very things your heart and soul need to be doing.
Find a way. Even if it's baby steps....little steps towards the
things you love brings great PEACE.

I recently made a commitment to myself about some of those "baby
steps" http://teawithren. blogspot. com/

Ren
learninginfreedom. com






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Michelle Leifur Reid

On 11/13/06, Ren Allen <starsuncloud@...> wrote:

> My Trevor is 17 in just weeks and has no desire to get his drivers
> license yet, or even think about moving away or go to college. He's
> interesting, fun and a delight to be around but certainly not winning
> awards or doing anything to set the world on fire at this time!
>

Oh but I've had the pleasure of talking to Trevor about his firey
passion for politics and his views on social inequities. He may not
be setting the world on fire, but he has inspired a spark in others!

Michelle

Ren Allen

~~Oh but I've had the pleasure of talking to Trevor about his firey
passion for politics and his views on social inequities. He may not
be setting the world on fire, but he has inspired a spark in others!~~


I'll have to share that with him!:)
We had a great discussion about "liberal" vs. "conservative" the other
day. He's a really fun person to chat with.

I have no doubt he will forge a positive life of his choosing. I guess
that's all that really matters to me, not that he(or any of my
children) do things that are typically considered "success" or noticable.

He's got a lot going on in that brain of his...keeps me on my toes (or
throws me offguard, depending:)

Ren
learninginfreedom.com

CookieBaker

Not every child will spark a fire in the world eyes. I'm not looking
for that in my children either. I didn't go to college, never wanted
to. Dh went to a semester of college and then dropped out. He's been
in the military for 12+ years now and is getting his education slowly
through them. It's hard for him to do since he works such ridiculous
hours. But, he has pride in his country and is an absolute patriot and
proud of it! I'm a very proud mom, wife and friend. As long as I'm
doing good by God that's what counts to me. As long as my children do
the same, that's fine with me and dh. :o)


Valerie K
...wife to Jason, homeschooling mom to Shawn and Haley...



-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Michelle Leifur
Reid
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:03 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Unschooling Success?



On 11/13/06, Ren Allen <starsuncloud@
<mailto:starsuncloud%40comcast.net> comcast.net> wrote:

> My Trevor is 17 in just weeks and has no desire to get his drivers
> license yet, or even think about moving away or go to college. He's
> interesting, fun and a delight to be around but certainly not winning
> awards or doing anything to set the world on fire at this time!
>

Oh but I've had the pleasure of talking to Trevor about his firey
passion for politics and his views on social inequities. He may not
be setting the world on fire, but he has inspired a spark in others!

Michelle






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Laura

>>Yes, that actually makes a lot of sense. My spouse is an emergency responder and he tells me that
many of the accidents involve teenagers. <<

i totaled my parents car when i was 16, could've killed my sister and myself. we were soooo lucky to walk away from it........totally unharmed.......unbelievable.

some days i think i'm still not ready to be behind that wheel!! it is a huge responsibility at any age.

i am in no hurry for my kids to drive and i agree with ren about most unschooled kids not being in a hurry to do the things that most school kids are. but we will cross that road when we get there...my oldest is 11...yipes.

laura


---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

On Nov 13, 2006, at 7:16 AM, Tina wrote:

> Hence my query of others. The Peace Corps, backpacking across
> Europe, traveling the U.S. or the world...all these things are
> possible. I know that. What I just can't get my brain around is
> how.

I know LOTS of unschooled young adults - and they ARE doing all kinds
of cool things with their lives. For some of them that involves
college, but definitely not for all of them. And even those going to
college are doing it on their own terms, not just going through the
standard programs.


-pam

Unschooling shirts, cups, bumper stickers, bags...
Live Love Learn
UNSCHOOL!
<http://www.cafepress.com/livelovelearn>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Laura

>>Exactly.
Your past is exactly that...PAST. We can all live the lives of our
choosing at any time. Nobody said it's easy to make those changes, but
the story we write for ourselves is our CHOICE. Plain and simple.<<

this has been a long hard lesson for me over the years...the just letting go of it all. the forgiving and moving on.

>>The adults in most of our lives didn't know any better. They had the
puritanical education and work ethic pounded into them also. If you
think about unschooling from a historical perspective, we're really
living in extreme luxury to even be discussing and debating this
lifestyle. Most people have to focus so much on survival, the idea of "living the
life of your choosing" wouldn't be comprehendable.<<

i think about how lucky i am all the time. that i can be home with my kids and even have the luxury to worry about whether i'm being a good enough mom, let alone whether there is enough food on the table or shelter or warmth. we do take a lot for granted these days. but mostly i am very thankful for my life. and i know that my parents came from very different worlds and situations that made them who they are which in turn made me who i am. given what they went through...i can't credit them enough for how they raised me, mistakes and all, it is what created me.

>> I think we OWE the universe an amazing life, as a way to help this earth evolve forward.:)
I think we're helping point the arrow of evolution by grabbing hold of
the wealth of opportunities we enjoy and MASSIVE abundance and living
the life of our dreams!<<

this is a wonderful perspective...owing the universe...it is a very healing concept. i'm imagining what the world would look like if everyone felt that they deserved more happiness and lived their lives amazingly. and that evolution can be guided just by our happiness, well that is just BIG.

>>The world can change through such actions. I know that the things we
LOVE to do, the passions we have are still alive even when ignored.
What is it that natters at you late into the night? What joyful
activity do you tell yourself isn't practical? What desires are you
trying to ignore because you "can't afford it" or "don't have time"?
THOSE are the very things your heart and soul need to be doing.
Find a way. Even if it's baby steps....little steps towards the
things you love brings great PEACE. <<

this i need to mount somewhere, frame it and mount it so i can see it everyday!! i am a big thinker...always stuck up in my head thinking away. so instead of mulling these things around...i want to actually attempt to answer them for all to see...i will try to be as honest as possible...that's scary:
1. what natters me late into the night? new ideas for art, my children's well-being, whether or not i am going to die in my sleep.
2. what joyful activity i tell myself isn't practical? doing artwork, marketing my artwork, having a studio, starting a business
3. what desires do i ignore because i can't afford it or don't have time? see answers to question 2.

these are big big things and my soul cries out for me to listen to what ren is saying...every day. but i can't seem to silence the voices inside telling me what is "realistic" and what isn't.

i think that this is a big reason for unschooling for me. it has as much given me back to myself as it has allowed my kids to be themselves. i think for a lot of us, unschooling is a big part of healing ourselves and learning to let go of all the old ways of thinking and doing. it may not sound like it, but i have come a long way. i work everyday on those voices and watching my children bloom inspires me all the time.

thanks for all these words ren!

peace and love,
laura




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Joyce Fetteroll

On Nov 13, 2006, at 8:23 AM, Tina wrote:

> It seems that when reading
> about unschooling and how it's successful we often hear about these
> amazing projects that are mastered by young unschoolers.

I know what you mean. When I first started unschooling I'd be
intimidated by kids who were doing all these neat things and my
daughter was really into TV ;-)

I think it's because people don't often worry whether unschooling
will help kids be free spirits ;-) But parents do often worry whether
it's possible for unschooled kids who want to go to college, to do
so. That's the worry the posts are meant to address. They're not
intended to intimidate the parents of kids who aren't interested in
college courses at 15. They're just meant to say if unschooled kids
want to, they can. They're saying unschooling doesn't close doors on
that path for kids *despite* legions of people who will tell you that
you *have to* go to school and get good grades to get into college
and get a good job.

Joyce




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: zoocrew@...

I am interested in a different perspective. Honestly, all the mind-
blowing success is rather intimidating to me. Is there anyone out
there that has unschooled to young adulthood that is successful and
didn't attend college? Is there anyone out there with a more simple
idea of success? Is there anyone that defines success outside the
paramaters of extended, institutional education?

I'd love to hear your ideas and experiences...

-=-=-

Cameron has been successful so many times before he even HIT college
age. I think the best part of that was that he was able to see that he
could "make it" without the college degree. Magic, music, film,
sports---he could make a living at any of them.

He's always felt his weakness was school---school subjects like reading
and math. He never felt like a success there, even though he was a
*good* student. There were always *better* students who got the coveted
As. Then his crazy mom pulls him OUT of school---maybe she thought he
wasn't *smart* enough for school? I think there was a lot of doubt
there.

Oddly, this is where he is right now. His weaknesses.

I reminded him that we don't focus on our weaknesses. That's what
*schools* do. We celebrate strengths. I told him I didn't want him to
worry about what he can't do, but celebrate what he can---delve further
into *those* things.

At the same time, he's just written an article for Danielle's
_Connections_ about Not Back To School Camp. It's the first thing's
he's written since leaving school. His big weakness has just proved NOT
to be! <g>

He's started to write poetry. He's baking bread and cooking (salmon
with wild rice, green beans, and salad for supper last night. Mushroom
soup last week). He's looking at spending a week at The Farm ecovillage
in the spring. He has a busy house/pet-sitting service. He wants to
travel across the US by car with a friend or two. He's filming a
behind-the-scenes documentary for some friends---starring Patti Duke.
<g>

He *is* looking at college, but not as the be-all, end-all. I don't
know that he will go full-time. Maybe just sit in on a few classes or
take a few hours here and there. We may go visit ASU in the next few
weeks, just for kicks.

He visits his girlfriend, friends, and cousin at college and is
unimpressed with their attitudes and maturity levels. It's all about
getting drunk, staying up late, and belittling each other. So it's not
*that* he's looking for.

He's not *sure* what he wants to do right now, but I remind him he
doesn't have to make that decision *NOW*. He has his life to make
decisions and change them. He's not sure he wants to drum for a living
right now. That could change. He may dump it. He may go back to it. But
it's consumed his life for years now.

Whatever his decision, it wasn't wasted time. He's made all SORTS of
connections these last few years---not only with drums, but with
baseball, skating, magic, music, and film. ALL of them are important
and can (and already *have*) led to more connections and new ideas and
interesting people.

He feels a little in limbo right now---but I've assured him that's not
uncommon at this age! <G> He still doesn't know "what he wants to be."

He has SOOO many options and interests. He's open to new people and new
places. He's *EAGER* to learn more. It's that eagerness that shows *me*
he'll be just fine.

I suspect he'll find his "home" in the arts---writing, sculpting,
drawing, music, film, magic, performance art---but it could be in
opening a coffee house for musicians or organizing a camp for
unschoolers! <bwg>

The man loves life. He loves learning. He loves doing and being and
trying new things.

He's just fine. He's an unschooler.

~Kelly



















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