Sandra@...

I found this!  Good.  Sorry it was lost for a couple of days.
This is Sandra, quoting the original.
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-=-My son, who is on the autism spectrum, is (appropriately, I think) testing the boundaries of self direction. 
 He is nine years old, but is really stuck on the idea of seeing rated R movies and has even expressed wanting to see rated X material.  My conversations with him lead me to believe that his interest is not an exploration of sexuality, but a desire to see what is forbidden.  One of his developmental issues is that he seems to lack a self restricting sense - what is physically dangerous, what he is mentally prepared for, etc.  This has lead to broken bones and other injuries, and seeking out terrifying images that he later has nightmares about.  I am finding it difficult to say "yes or something like it" with respect to sexually explicit and graphically violent material.  Anyone have any ideas or experiences to share regarding "adult" content for pre-adolescent kids, whatever that means?-=-


Sandra@...




This is Sandra, quoting from the original.
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-=-My son, who is on the autism spectrum, is (appropriately, I think) testing the boundaries of self direction. 


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I will come back to that in another post.

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-=-
 He is nine years old, but is really stuck on the idea of seeing rated R movies and has even expressed wanting to see rated X material.  My conversations with him lead me to believe that his interest is not an exploration of sexuality, but a desire to see what is forbidden.  One of his developmental issues is that he seems to lack a self restricting sense - what is physically dangerous, what he is mentally prepared for, etc.  This has lead to broken bones and other injuries, and seeking out terrifying images that he later has nightmares about.  I am finding it difficult to say "yes or something like it" with respect to sexually explicit and graphically violent material.  Anyone have any ideas or experiences to share regarding "adult" content for pre-adolescent kids, whatever that means? -=-

Ratings are different in different countries, but "R" rated usually has bad language, violence, or sex. There are other things that can contribute—alcohol, smoking, but in combination.

X used to be a designation for no one under 21, and then maybe no under 17, but it's not used anymore officially, I don't think.  NowI think only  the term "porn" is used, and it's illegal to share that with a minor, or to knowingly allow a child access to it.  So that's out.  This is something the mom should already have looked into—WHY are things R and X, and CAN it be shared?

Lots of kids have watched lots of PG and R rated movies because the parents are there with them and explaining, sharing, keeping it from being scary.  One of the easiest ways to remove a large layer of "scary" is to mute the sound, and "voice-over" what's going on, and remind them of cameras everwhere and sound and light and script and support people all over the place.  Some "Making of" of stunt shows might help lots.  Special effects movies. That might satisfy a lot of his curiosity, too.  

Explain that some kids (and some adults) have a hard time remembering that it's pretend, that it's acting, and make-up.

That's one of three responses I want to make.

Sandra

Sandra@...

-=-My son, who is on the autism spectrum, is (appropriately, I think) testing the boundaries of self direction. -=-


"The boundaries of self direction" is about half a mile from the place where unschooling works well.

We can help you get back to a more comfortable place, though. :-)

"Self direction" isn't a great goal.  Partnerships are better.  Creating a great environment for learning is good.

He shouldn't need to be "self directing," so that doesn't need to be a thing that has boundaries, so there won't be any testing of it, if you'll com back to a starting place that doesn't lead there.

I'm going to leave two things here that might help with that:

By Pam Sorooshian, Unschooling is not Child-Led Learning

Notes from a talk Joyce gave, called Unschooling Takeaway.  


I know there are lots of people who start of describing unschooling as self-directed learning, and that can help when comparing it to school, but part of deschooling is the parents learning enough about learning that they aren't planning to leave it to the kids while the parents do other things.

Sandra

Sandra@...

Sandra, again, third time.  I guess there will be four responses. :-)  Maybe five.

-=--=-My son, who is on the autism spectrum, is (appropriately, I think) testing the boundaries of self direction. -=--=-

I would prefer that people who are here to discuss unschooling avoid discussing "the autism spectrum."  
There is no difference in the way unschooling works for children, no matter how labelled.  I will make exceptions in part for kids who are blind or deaf.  They will need some special knowledge, but could still unschool beyond that.  For all kids, learning works the same way.  For all kids, the laws about movies, and the practicality of a parent knowing the child well and directly, knowing his interests, what he likes, what spooks him—same for all.


This isn't something I just thought up lately, nor something casual or small.  It is an idea that has been combed through and solidified in unschooling discussions since 1995, or a while longer.




I know there are unschooling groups that will praise and coo over moms who label their kids.  If the label is more important than some serious unschooling ideas, those other groups might be better.  If you like the messages of support, though, you can use these:



Sandra

Sandra@...

Sandra, responding.  I wish yahoogroups had already told you that, but it seems e-mails don't show the author anymore, so if others could also identify themselves up top, that might be helpful.  

-=- I am finding it difficult to say "yes or something like it" with respect to sexually explicit and graphically violent material.-=-

That's good.  Looking for a rule is a bad plan.  Look at principles.
Something like yes would be "I'll watch a movie with you, but that's not good for young kids."  Or "When you're fifteen, you can watch it, but for now, no."

Don't anyone take this group itself as legal advice, but I have seen laws (which might be state to state and not federal) about what age people can or can't be to watch exually explicit material together.  It was arranged kind of like the satutory rape age-ranges, the laws I saw.  There are people here from a dozen countries, so laws aren't the thing to be discussing, but the fact that every parent should know that there might be laws about it is true and right.

In any case, and in many cases, it's true and simple to tell a child that you can't let them do X or Y because child protective services would not approve.  It could be considered neglect or abuse, depending what it is.  Being out late at night, making too much noise, not wearing good shoes in the snow—whatever thing it might be.  Watching porn (with or without a parent) is not legal for kids.

Don't look for new rules, in unschooling.  It's not how it works. 

Find WHY and how, and as you see more learning and peace, it will be easy for you to find ways to have even more of it—learning and peace.

IF you've gone too far already, on advice that leads to rules, back up.  Say "sorry, I went too far too fast," or whatever you need to say.  Start more solidly.


Sandra


sukaynalabboun@...

I agree with everything Sandra has written so far, but wanted to add that we have had successful forays into scary or mature content by looking up shows or movies in IMDB beforehand, in the content section, and under spoilers and such. I'm more prepared to help decide if it's going to be ok and also to guide through or even skip some bits that might be problematic.
I also watch with them, we talk, not in a schooley way but more in a touching base or explaining things depending on what comes up or how it comes across. I did this even with books in the past, reading on my own but with them when something new (to me) was interesting to them. They read The Hunger Games, for example, when those were first out and they were quite young. I had been worried the content might be too intense and wanted to partner with them if that happened...so I prepared to BE there by knowing what they were reading and being able to chat with them having knowledge about the book.

Lots of times, with growing kids, this is the surest way to help them branch out into new territory from a loving, safe place, I have found. Makes conversations more interesting, too, when we've experienced the new media together, particularly when it's been designed with "older" tastes in mind, but really, being in tune with them, close and safe and involved, helps a lot.

Now as teens and young adults, they still share with me and bounce things off of me, but they no longer need me to look out for them as much. I still get things run by me, though, because they trust me and know I will point out anything that might upset them, then they choose.