Choosing not to eat chicken and asking us to do the same
<zurrolaur@...>
Caitlyn, almost 7, decided about a month ago that she no longer wanted to eat chicken because she had finally made the connection that chicken (something she liked to eat) was the same animal that ran around at the farms that we buy our meats from (and she adores chickens). So we respected her wishes and I've stopped giving her anything that has chicken in it. Stephane and I still eat chicken, but have tried to be a bit more discreet - ie me not talking about how we're eating chicken for dinner.
Last night we were watching Earthflight which is all about birds and their lives and includes natural predators hunting the birds. Caitlyn turned to me and said "mommy, do you think you and daddy could stop eating chicken too?" I told her that I would talk to her dad about it and we would discuss it as a family. Incidentally, she said she's fine with eating beef - knows it's from a cow and said but I love chickens and I don't want to eat them.
We're willing to work around this, although I'm not sure if I'm completely ready to stop eating chicken since it often comprises a couple of meals a week for us and would require shifting eating habits for him and I. But we're open to it. I also wonder if beef and pork (which we rarely eat anyway, might not be far behind).
Looking to hear if anyone has had any experiences with this and also different ways of looking at solutions.
Thanks
Laura & Caitlyn (almost 7)
Last night we were watching Earthflight which is all about birds and their lives and includes natural predators hunting the birds. Caitlyn turned to me and said "mommy, do you think you and daddy could stop eating chicken too?" I told her that I would talk to her dad about it and we would discuss it as a family. Incidentally, she said she's fine with eating beef - knows it's from a cow and said but I love chickens and I don't want to eat them.
We're willing to work around this, although I'm not sure if I'm completely ready to stop eating chicken since it often comprises a couple of meals a week for us and would require shifting eating habits for him and I. But we're open to it. I also wonder if beef and pork (which we rarely eat anyway, might not be far behind).
Looking to hear if anyone has had any experiences with this and also different ways of looking at solutions.
Thanks
Laura & Caitlyn (almost 7)
Sandra Dodd
I wouldn't stop eating chicken, but I WOULD shield a sensitive child.
You've already said you're being discreet about it. That's kind.
Holly babysat for a girl who loved birds of all sorts, and wouldn't eat chicken or turkey or duck. No birds. When she went to school, later, because of family circumstances, I don't know how that was handled, but I hope kindly.
If a child asked me why I was eating chicken, I would say people are generally omnivores. My own ancestors are. My grandparents raised chickens and killed one every Sunday for Sunday dinner. Maybe you could talk about different traditions and religions and who will or won't eat what animals (not a full breakdown, but maybe a few examples) without trying to gross her out—just present the idea that there are people who won't eat various kinds of things—dogs, shellfish, cows, pigs—and other people who will, and do, and that it's been that way for thousands of years. Not as persuasion or argument, just as information. She has years to think about it and might change her own dietary preferences several times.
Sandra
You've already said you're being discreet about it. That's kind.
Holly babysat for a girl who loved birds of all sorts, and wouldn't eat chicken or turkey or duck. No birds. When she went to school, later, because of family circumstances, I don't know how that was handled, but I hope kindly.
If a child asked me why I was eating chicken, I would say people are generally omnivores. My own ancestors are. My grandparents raised chickens and killed one every Sunday for Sunday dinner. Maybe you could talk about different traditions and religions and who will or won't eat what animals (not a full breakdown, but maybe a few examples) without trying to gross her out—just present the idea that there are people who won't eat various kinds of things—dogs, shellfish, cows, pigs—and other people who will, and do, and that it's been that way for thousands of years. Not as persuasion or argument, just as information. She has years to think about it and might change her own dietary preferences several times.
Sandra
Jennifer Smith
My sister raises and LOVES her chickens as pets. She does eat their eggs. Really she loves all birds. She has been a vegetarian most of her life because she doesn't see the purpose in killing and eating animals.
I, on the other hand, love meat and it is a part of my everyday diet. When I go visiting my sister we never expect to be served meat at her house. We graciously eat whatever foods she prepares for us. However, she does like to surprise me with a meat dish every now and then and has no problem with me or my family eating meat. When she visits me, I prepare our typical meals plus special no meat dishes for her. In other words, we do not impose our beliefs on each other. We have discussed our thoughts about meat together but have never said to each other, "Don't eat meat or you need to eat meat."
I think being kind and discreet, as you've been, is good. I would also talk about how each family member has their own thoughts and beliefs and those should be respected without forcing others to believe what they believe. All on a scale she can understand. Even coming to a compromise and your family having more meatless meals per week, if that's what everyone can agree on. Ask her if she'd like to help research new and fun meatless recipes with you. It could turn out to be a fun experience for your family.
~Jen
I, on the other hand, love meat and it is a part of my everyday diet. When I go visiting my sister we never expect to be served meat at her house. We graciously eat whatever foods she prepares for us. However, she does like to surprise me with a meat dish every now and then and has no problem with me or my family eating meat. When she visits me, I prepare our typical meals plus special no meat dishes for her. In other words, we do not impose our beliefs on each other. We have discussed our thoughts about meat together but have never said to each other, "Don't eat meat or you need to eat meat."
I think being kind and discreet, as you've been, is good. I would also talk about how each family member has their own thoughts and beliefs and those should be respected without forcing others to believe what they believe. All on a scale she can understand. Even coming to a compromise and your family having more meatless meals per week, if that's what everyone can agree on. Ask her if she'd like to help research new and fun meatless recipes with you. It could turn out to be a fun experience for your family.
~Jen
Sandra Dodd
-=- Even coming to a compromise and your family having more meatless meals per week, if that's what everyone can agree on. Ask her if she'd like to help research new and fun meatless recipes with you. It could turn out to be a fun experience for your family. -=-
This reminds me that for three or four years when Holly was younger—9, 10 and around there—she didn't like the texture of meat. We would keep meat separate from other things, or make her a meatless sauce, or a cheese option.
Sandra
Hannah North
Tomorrow I am going to cook sausage stew. The weather has turned cold here in the UK! Oscar is not keen on sausage stew though he likes the sausages and the roast veg that I normally add into the tomato base. I'll serve his sausages out of the stew, and keep some roasted veg separate for him. Since I'm cooking his favourite tonight (Shepherds pie), he is absolutely fine about having his meal differently tomorrow. I always adapt our meals to accommodate his preferences.
On 13 Oct 2013, at 17:04, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
-=- Even coming to a compromise and your family having more meatless meals per week, if that's what everyone can agree on. Ask her if she'd like to help research new and fun meatless recipes with you. It could turn out to be a fun experience for your family. -=-
This reminds me that for three or four years when Holly was younger—9, 10 and around there—she didn't like the texture of meat. We would keep meat separate from other things, or make her a meatless sauce, or a cheese option.Sandra
Juliet Kemp
On Sun, Oct 13, 2013 at 07:14:47AM -0700, Jennifer Smith wrote:
and vegetarian for even longer. In all honesty, it does upset me that
people I love do something I consider to be morally wrong. However, as
an adult, I understand that it's their decision and not mine, and I
don't say that to them or encourage them to change their beliefs. But a
child doesn't necessarily understand that social expectation yet. From
her point of view, if this is a Bad Thing to do (whatever 'bad thing'
means to her exactly), then it's a Bad Thing whoever is doing it, and
it's not unreasonable that she would like for other people not to do it
either. Equally, it's not unreasonable for you not to take her beliefs
as your own! But that's not an obvious principle. It's a useful one to
come to terms with, though, for social reasons.
If it really does bother her that other people don't share her views,
maybe you could help her explore other more socially acceptable options
for persuading people. She could look into something like the Vegetarian
Society if that exists where you are, or other campaigns or
organisations that act to inform people about the issues she's concerned
with. Of course, those have their social boundaries too (eg not passing
campaign postcards around at the dinner table!) but you can talk to her
about that as well.
Juliet
>I think this is maybe the key point. I've been vegan for a long time,
> --- I think being kind and discreet, as you've been, is good. I would also
> talk about how each family member has their own thoughts and beliefs
> and those should be respected without forcing others to believe what
> they believe. All on a scale she can understand. ---
and vegetarian for even longer. In all honesty, it does upset me that
people I love do something I consider to be morally wrong. However, as
an adult, I understand that it's their decision and not mine, and I
don't say that to them or encourage them to change their beliefs. But a
child doesn't necessarily understand that social expectation yet. From
her point of view, if this is a Bad Thing to do (whatever 'bad thing'
means to her exactly), then it's a Bad Thing whoever is doing it, and
it's not unreasonable that she would like for other people not to do it
either. Equally, it's not unreasonable for you not to take her beliefs
as your own! But that's not an obvious principle. It's a useful one to
come to terms with, though, for social reasons.
If it really does bother her that other people don't share her views,
maybe you could help her explore other more socially acceptable options
for persuading people. She could look into something like the Vegetarian
Society if that exists where you are, or other campaigns or
organisations that act to inform people about the issues she's concerned
with. Of course, those have their social boundaries too (eg not passing
campaign postcards around at the dinner table!) but you can talk to her
about that as well.
Juliet
<zurrolaur@...>
I'm already used to working with different palates because Stephane has a lot of texture issues and is not particularly adventurous (although better since we've been married). We eat a really wide variety of foods - with meat and without so it's not a huge stretch to work around this. Last week I made a small amount of with a huge pan of roasted vegetables, and most of what we ate was the veggies
It's also part of our normal conversations about how some people don't eat any meat, or only some things like eggs or dairy, or no gluten, and that different cultures also might eat something that we don't consider food or vice versa.
My main focus was how to handle her request for us, because just as we wouldn't expect her to eat something she didn't want to eat, we also aren't quite ready to give up certain things either. But we are cognizant that what we eat could be offensive to her and so want to be thoughtful and discreet, just as we would if we knew people in our company were vegetarian or vegan and would be bothered by talking about eating meat.
I think we'll let the subject rest, until she brings it up again,and continue to be discreet about the chicken.
Laura & Caitlyn (almost 7)
Colleen
*****My main focus was how to handle her request for us, because just as we wouldn't expect her to eat something she didn't want to eat, we also aren't quite ready to give up certain things either. But we are cognizant that what we eat could be offensive to her and so want to be thoughtful and discreet, just as we would if we knew people in our company were vegetarian or vegan and would be bothered by talking about eating meat.*****
My son (10) doesn't eat meat either. He has asked a couple times if I think his Dad and I will always eat meat, or if someday we'll stop. I've told him there have been times in my life when I haven't eaten meat, and that those times might come again. That seems to make him happy - the idea that it's a possibility :-)
I've also mentioned to him a couple times when it's been relevant in conversation that, just like it would be unkind to tell someone they Had to eat a certain food, it's also unkind to tell someone they Can't eat a certain food. He very much agreed with that. He has spent his life deciding what he wants to eat - but he has also spent time with kids whose parents decide their meals/snacks/etc. for them - and he doesn't think deciding for others makes those Others feel very good at all :-)
Colleen
tandos mama
I also wouldn't necessarily change my own diet nor attempt to change my husband's. We know a number of people who strictly control their family's diets. Some also work hard to convert others to their dietary regimens.
We've had lots of conversation about food choices with our kids. Our closest friends are strict vegans. Others are gluten-free Westin-Price followers, some are insistent upon organic-only or sugar&fat-free. Meanwhile we are raising much of our own meat and buy mostly local, but still have gummies and nutella in our pantry. My son is interested in trying out what it's like to eat a vegan diet at least some of the time. My daughter's favorite meal resolutely remains bacon and eggs.
We try to keep the focus on supporting individual choices. I think there can be a balance between supporting individual choice and shielding those who are sensitive. Our kids understand that many of their friends aren't allowed to make choices for themselves, so we all try to be supportive by providing foods the other kids are allowed to eat while they spend time with us and by saving treats that would be forbidden for time when our friends aren't present. I think this experience has helped our kids understand the value of being able to choose and to accept that even their own parents might choose to eat differently than they do. A bonus is that my husband eased up on expectations for the family to sit down and eat the same thing for dinner; I especially appreciate this since he does much of the cooking!
We've had lots of conversation about food choices with our kids. Our closest friends are strict vegans. Others are gluten-free Westin-Price followers, some are insistent upon organic-only or sugar&fat-free. Meanwhile we are raising much of our own meat and buy mostly local, but still have gummies and nutella in our pantry. My son is interested in trying out what it's like to eat a vegan diet at least some of the time. My daughter's favorite meal resolutely remains bacon and eggs.
We try to keep the focus on supporting individual choices. I think there can be a balance between supporting individual choice and shielding those who are sensitive. Our kids understand that many of their friends aren't allowed to make choices for themselves, so we all try to be supportive by providing foods the other kids are allowed to eat while they spend time with us and by saving treats that would be forbidden for time when our friends aren't present. I think this experience has helped our kids understand the value of being able to choose and to accept that even their own parents might choose to eat differently than they do. A bonus is that my husband eased up on expectations for the family to sit down and eat the same thing for dinner; I especially appreciate this since he does much of the cooking!
Tori
<alohabun@...>
My son Li (12) doesn't eat meat and avoids cheese with animal rennet. Though sometimes I'll make an entirely vegetarian meal, my husband prefers meat for dinner most of the time and sometimes I and the girls like it as well. His younger brother so far has not had meat.
Li has a hard time understanding how anyone could eat meat because he believes that animals should have the right to live and it is cruel for people to eat them. He wishes that we all felt the same.
We've had discussions over the years about how different people may choose to eat differently, how bodies are all different (someone might feel better eating one way and another person might feel better eating another way), and how a person may like to eat some of the foods they grew up eating (ie. Daddy likes a meat, potatoes and vegetable type of supper just like he had growing up).
I ate vegetarian when Li was a toddler, though went back to eating meat when I got pregnant.
Tonight my daughter's friend is staying the night and she eats no gluten or dairy. I purposely made a dish she could eat and made sure to use two separate frying pans; one for the chicken and veggies and one for veggies alone. Li asked if I had touched the chicken before preparing the vegetables. I had not. It was still in the fridge. (Had I touched the chicken first, he likely would not have eaten the veggies.) Laurie
---In [email protected], <tori.arpad.cotta@...> wrote:I also wouldn't necessarily change my own diet nor attempt to change my husband's. We know a number of people who strictly control their family's diets. Some also work hard to convert others to their dietary regimens.
We've had lots of conversation about food choices with our kids. Our closest friends are strict vegans. Others are gluten-free Westin-Price followers, some are insistent upon organic-only or sugar&fat-free. Meanwhile we are raising much of our own meat and buy mostly local, but still have gummies and nutella in our pantry. My son is interested in trying out what it's like to eat a vegan diet at least some of the time. My daughter's favorite meal resolutely remains bacon and eggs.
We try to keep the focus on supporting individual choices. I think there can be a balance between supporting individual choice and shielding those who are sensitive. Our kids understand that many of their friends aren't allowed to make choices for themselves, so we all try to be supportive by providing foods the other kids are allowed to eat while they spend time with us and by saving treats that would be forbidden for time when our friends aren't present. I think this experience has helped our kids understand the value of being able to choose and to accept that even their own parents might choose to eat differently than they do. A bonus is that my husband eased up on expectations for the family to sit down and eat the same thing for dinner; I especially appreciate this since he does much of the cooking!
Tori
Jennifer Smith
I believe our bodies have certain needs that it's important to stay attuned too. If I don't eat beef for long periods of time I literally start feeling ill. If I drink caffeinated beverages my throat will hurt. If I eat soy and too much gluten, I gain weight. Meat seams to work best for my body as well as a lot of green veggies (not raw, but cooked). My son feels sick when he eats meat everyday. His lips tingle and get swollen when he eats certain fruits and when he's sick he finds avoiding corn, soy and wheat help his immune system, get its healing done faster. Amazingly enough, we took him for allergy testing after several bouts of hives and grains where one of the things that showed he had a slight intolerance to. But we already knew that because we listened to his body. The kids can eat candy and feel great, I eat candy (sugary things) and I tend to not feel well. Except chocolate. I don't care how sick I get!!!!
Same with other things in life. I get on a swing and I'm going to barf. The kids can swing to the moon and back and have wonderful fun!! I'm good at pushing them on the swings and pretending to be their rocket power.
Maybe explaining things like this to your little one might help. We all have different needs and desires. I realize that hers seem to me to be more of an ethical/humane one, but other discussions might come up now or later that might be good for you to store away.
~Jen
Same with other things in life. I get on a swing and I'm going to barf. The kids can swing to the moon and back and have wonderful fun!! I'm good at pushing them on the swings and pretending to be their rocket power.
Maybe explaining things like this to your little one might help. We all have different needs and desires. I realize that hers seem to me to be more of an ethical/humane one, but other discussions might come up now or later that might be good for you to store away.
~Jen