Unschooling with Down syndrome
fordhomed
Hello. My daughter is 8 and has Down syndrome. She has been deschooling since last spring. Since then, she has potty trained, learned to ride a trike, and can be taken into a store. None of those were in her IEP of course. She spends her days playing and is very happy.
Does a diagnosis of Down syndrome have any impact whatsoever on how unschooling is done? Can I read and apply unschooling to our lives without modifying it because of special needs?
Do therapies such as speech, OT, and PT have a place in unschooling? She hated speech therapy, so we dropped it. It feels like a dirty little secret sometimes, but the thing is, I would never force my other kids to take a weekly lesson in something they hated, so I don't think she should either.
With gratitude,
Kim
Does a diagnosis of Down syndrome have any impact whatsoever on how unschooling is done? Can I read and apply unschooling to our lives without modifying it because of special needs?
Do therapies such as speech, OT, and PT have a place in unschooling? She hated speech therapy, so we dropped it. It feels like a dirty little secret sometimes, but the thing is, I would never force my other kids to take a weekly lesson in something they hated, so I don't think she should either.
With gratitude,
Kim
Sandra Dodd
-=-Does a diagnosis of Down syndrome have any impact whatsoever on how unschooling is done? Can I read and apply unschooling to our lives without modifying it because of special needs?-=-
I think helping a child do what she might want to do, and finding things that might be of interest to her, works the same way for anyone.
The special services offered to "special needs" students of any kind are pretty much designed to enable them to advance in school, to keep schools from being sued for not offering services, and to help them become employable.
I think it's great that she's learned so much even though you've been ignoring the professional IEP measures. That by itself will give you confidence and experience that the professionals won't have and couldn't have risked discovering, while they're being half pushy and half cautious, looking at charts and averages rather than into the soul of your daughter.
Here's an earlier discussion that might help:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AlwaysLearning/message/60313
and here are notes on special needs (which is where I found the link above):
http://sandradodd.com/special/
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I think helping a child do what she might want to do, and finding things that might be of interest to her, works the same way for anyone.
The special services offered to "special needs" students of any kind are pretty much designed to enable them to advance in school, to keep schools from being sued for not offering services, and to help them become employable.
I think it's great that she's learned so much even though you've been ignoring the professional IEP measures. That by itself will give you confidence and experience that the professionals won't have and couldn't have risked discovering, while they're being half pushy and half cautious, looking at charts and averages rather than into the soul of your daughter.
Here's an earlier discussion that might help:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AlwaysLearning/message/60313
and here are notes on special needs (which is where I found the link above):
http://sandradodd.com/special/
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
"fordhomed" <mkfamilydsm@...> wrote:
There really isn't one particular way "unschooling" is "done" - the basic assumption is that learning depends on the perceptions and perspectives of the individual. You could just as well ask "does gender impact unschooling?" Yes... and no.
But I suspect the question you're asking is closer to "are there some things my child will Have To be Taught?" and the answers to that will mostly come from your daughter herself. Is she curious about the world? Does she engage happily with things she enjoys? Does she like to play? Notice I'm not asking anything about skills or independence - like anyone, there will be things she needs help doing, help learning. Her needs will be bigger and last longer in some areas, maybe many areas. Like other people, there will probably be things she'll want to learn on her own, things she'll want to have someone show her, things she'll want to do with help, things she'll pick up without realizing she's learning. Because those are all ways people learn.
People do learn while they're miserable, but not much, certainly not much good. When a person is enjoying herself she's going to learn much more and more expansively. If some therapy or class or situation brings more joy and interest and expansiveness to your daughter's life, that's a good thing. If it makes her miserable, it's not. If she feels stuck in a situation, she's learning a lot about helplessness, powerlessness, and that's not good, either.
Beyond being stuck and unhappy, though, the worst thing teachers and tutors and therapists can do is give a person the sense that learning comes from teaching. Unschoolers can and do take classes and make use of therapies! but it's much better to do so when kids are experienced enough to know that learning is about them, their needs and interests, not about a teacher's checklist.
Don't hesitate to make use of "special needs" resources which are actually helpful to you and your daughter! Helpful in terms of helping her be and do what's important to Her, not necessarily the standard checklist designed to make her fit conveniently in a mainstreamed school environment.
---Meredith
>> Does a diagnosis of Down syndrome have any impact whatsoever on how unschooling is done? Can I read and apply unschooling to our lives without modifying it because of special needs?**********************
There really isn't one particular way "unschooling" is "done" - the basic assumption is that learning depends on the perceptions and perspectives of the individual. You could just as well ask "does gender impact unschooling?" Yes... and no.
But I suspect the question you're asking is closer to "are there some things my child will Have To be Taught?" and the answers to that will mostly come from your daughter herself. Is she curious about the world? Does she engage happily with things she enjoys? Does she like to play? Notice I'm not asking anything about skills or independence - like anyone, there will be things she needs help doing, help learning. Her needs will be bigger and last longer in some areas, maybe many areas. Like other people, there will probably be things she'll want to learn on her own, things she'll want to have someone show her, things she'll want to do with help, things she'll pick up without realizing she's learning. Because those are all ways people learn.
>>> Do therapies such as speech, OT, and PT have a place in unschooling? She hated speech therapy, so we dropped it.**************
People do learn while they're miserable, but not much, certainly not much good. When a person is enjoying herself she's going to learn much more and more expansively. If some therapy or class or situation brings more joy and interest and expansiveness to your daughter's life, that's a good thing. If it makes her miserable, it's not. If she feels stuck in a situation, she's learning a lot about helplessness, powerlessness, and that's not good, either.
Beyond being stuck and unhappy, though, the worst thing teachers and tutors and therapists can do is give a person the sense that learning comes from teaching. Unschoolers can and do take classes and make use of therapies! but it's much better to do so when kids are experienced enough to know that learning is about them, their needs and interests, not about a teacher's checklist.
Don't hesitate to make use of "special needs" resources which are actually helpful to you and your daughter! Helpful in terms of helping her be and do what's important to Her, not necessarily the standard checklist designed to make her fit conveniently in a mainstreamed school environment.
---Meredith
Vicki Dennis
I would like to add that it would probably be helpful to leave open the
possibility of speech therapy in the future. Very appropriate that you
allowed her to stop because "she hated it", just don't assume that hating
it is necessarily a permanent condition. Kinda like avoiding saying "Jane
does not like beets." Might be that she will never enjoy beets, but is
also possible that as she is older and taste buds change she will find that
they no longer taste like dirt!
I quit speech therapy as an 8 or 9 year old. It was not helping my speech
and it set me apart from my peers. Also I did not like missing the classes
I was removed from to have therapy. But when I was 12 I asked to utilize
it again for a very specific issue. Whether because I was more mature or
because the new therapist worked with me as a sensible partner instead of
just asking me to "practice" but without any practical instruction, the
sessions were productive. Main idea is that I asked for them and
participated fully.
vicki
possibility of speech therapy in the future. Very appropriate that you
allowed her to stop because "she hated it", just don't assume that hating
it is necessarily a permanent condition. Kinda like avoiding saying "Jane
does not like beets." Might be that she will never enjoy beets, but is
also possible that as she is older and taste buds change she will find that
they no longer taste like dirt!
I quit speech therapy as an 8 or 9 year old. It was not helping my speech
and it set me apart from my peers. Also I did not like missing the classes
I was removed from to have therapy. But when I was 12 I asked to utilize
it again for a very specific issue. Whether because I was more mature or
because the new therapist worked with me as a sensible partner instead of
just asking me to "practice" but without any practical instruction, the
sessions were productive. Main idea is that I asked for them and
participated fully.
vicki
On Tue, Jan 1, 2013 at 11:24 AM, Meredith <plaidpanties666@...> wrote:
> **
>
>
> "
>
>
>
> Don't hesitate to make use of "special needs" resources which are actually
> helpful to you and your daughter! Helpful in terms of helping her be and do
> what's important to Her, not necessarily the standard checklist designed to
> make her fit conveniently in a mainstreamed school environment.
>
> ---Meredith
>
>
> <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AlwaysLearning/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxYWJkNjhmBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzQ0MTAyNTAEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1NTQyMTExBG1zZ0lkAzcwMDcxBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTM1NzA2MTA2Mg--?act=reply&messageNum=70071>
>
>
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
keetry
== I quit speech therapy as an 8 or 9 year old. It was not helping my speech and it set me apart from my peers. Also I did not like missing the classes I was removed from to have therapy. But when I was 12 I asked to utilize it again for a very specific issue. Whether because I was more mature or because the new therapist worked with me as a sensible partner instead of just asking me to "practice" but without any practical instruction, the sessions were productive. Main idea is that I asked for them and participated fully.===
Thank you so much for sharing this. Everything I've looked at from "experts" says that there is a small window when you need to get the child in therapy or else they will never be able to talk properly. It's very helpful to read that speech therapy can help older children when they want it, especially from that person directly.
Alysia
Thank you so much for sharing this. Everything I've looked at from "experts" says that there is a small window when you need to get the child in therapy or else they will never be able to talk properly. It's very helpful to read that speech therapy can help older children when they want it, especially from that person directly.
Alysia
michelle_m29
> Thank you so much for sharing this. Everything I've looked at >from "experts" says that there is a small window when you need to get >the child in therapy or else they will never be able to talk properly.Last month, I had a long chat with the director of the center where my eight year old has been getting speech therapy for the past couple of years. He's made a lot of progress, but no one knows if that's because what they're doing is working, or because he's growing up.
She told me that the window is a myth and regardless of what they do or don't do, he may never have proper speech. Maybe that's just for Dyspraxia, which is what they tell me my son may or may not have... (We could spend a lot of money to get a formal label, which wouldn't change anything that they're doing -- so thank you to everyone here who's said that labels are only good if you're trying to get specific services. You kept me from panic when she brought up the specialized testing.)
I don't know if it's diffent for Down syndrome.
Michelle
Sandra Dodd
-=-Everything I've looked at >from "experts" says that there is a small window when you need to get >the child in therapy or else they will never be able to talk properly. -=-
Experts assume your child will go to school.
Experts know that school sorts children by performance.
Experts know that any lock-up environment creates cruel bullies.
Everything changes when school is removed from the scene.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Experts assume your child will go to school.
Experts know that school sorts children by performance.
Experts know that any lock-up environment creates cruel bullies.
Everything changes when school is removed from the scene.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
> She told me that the window is a myth and regardless of what they do or don't do, he may never have proper speech. Maybe that's just for Dyspraxia**************
The idea of a "critical period" is old and fading under modern research - there are critcal periods in the womb and the first few months of life, period.
But the idea is also confused by two things, the first is Maria Montessori's idea of the "sensitive period" and the second, overlapping that, is school. A sensitive period is a time when a child is ready and interested in learning something - and with a lot of things in young childhood, the two coincide. One year olds get very interested in mobility. Three year olds get very interested in causes and effects. Those are good examples of what a sensitive period looks like. In open classrooms and home-education, teachers are advised to be on the lookout for sensitive periods as the best times to teach specific subjects. The "teachable moment" theory is a correlary to sensitive periods.
In schools there Are windows when kids will get help for certain skills. That has more to do with classroom management than critical or sensitive periods, but it's a very real phenomenon and can make the difference between whether a child is labled "slow" or "bad" or some combination (like "unmotivated").
---Meredith