Are you still an unschooler when you go to school?
Tawha
I have been in a discussion about a different topic over at the radical unschooling that is unquestionable related to the same thing if not is a big part of it..
here it raised these two questions:
- are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?( what about goverment programs which are not go to school but, you are part of the system which it doesnt go to school but, some requirements are applied and expected)
- when do you stop being an unschooler?!
here it raised these two questions:
- are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?( what about goverment programs which are not go to school but, you are part of the system which it doesnt go to school but, some requirements are applied and expected)
- when do you stop being an unschooler?!
Joyce Fetteroll
On Sep 17, 2012, at 11:00 AM, Tawha wrote:
If unschooling is seen as a philosophy to understand and make work in the home so that kids can learn what they need by exploring their interests, then the answer doesn't have much meaning.
I could make an argument there are no unschoolers. There are parents who are using the unschooling philosophy to create an atmosphere in their home that supports kids learning through their interests. And there are kids who are living and learning in that environment.
Wanting to hold onto the label of unschooler while in school sounds like a need to separate yourself from those who don't have a choice about being there. Using "unschooler" while someone is in school just muddies the definition of unschooling, making it more difficult for new people to understand what it is.
I think a better term would be autodidact. An autodidact is a self-directed learner which encompasses whatever way they'd like to learn. Unschooling is really about the atmosphere a parent creates around a child which is rather meaningless in school.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?If "unschooler" is seen as a club to belong to it makes a difference.
If unschooling is seen as a philosophy to understand and make work in the home so that kids can learn what they need by exploring their interests, then the answer doesn't have much meaning.
I could make an argument there are no unschoolers. There are parents who are using the unschooling philosophy to create an atmosphere in their home that supports kids learning through their interests. And there are kids who are living and learning in that environment.
Wanting to hold onto the label of unschooler while in school sounds like a need to separate yourself from those who don't have a choice about being there. Using "unschooler" while someone is in school just muddies the definition of unschooling, making it more difficult for new people to understand what it is.
I think a better term would be autodidact. An autodidact is a self-directed learner which encompasses whatever way they'd like to learn. Unschooling is really about the atmosphere a parent creates around a child which is rather meaningless in school.
> - when do you stop being an unschooler?!Personally I think if kids who grew up in an unschooling home want to call themselves unschoolers even beyond compulsory schooling age because they feel different, then they can :-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Jenny Cyphers
***- are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?( what about goverment programs which are not go to school but, you are part of the system which it doesnt go to school but, some requirements are applied and expected)
- when do you stop being an unschooler?!***
The issue that I see, is not a new one. This conversation gets batted around in homeschool forums as well. The question is better framed as, "At what point is a family considered homeschooling if they are using public funds for their homeschooling?"
Some people believe no amount of public funds should be allowed if a person is truly stepping away from public schooling. Some people believe that using an online publicly funded charter school, at home, is homeschooling. These sort of things are different all around the world. This particular idea was brought to Radical Unschooling Info on Facebook, an international group, as is this, about a program in Canada. Canada has pretty different ideas about homeschool than the USA, and probably very very different than India or any other various locations around the world.
One of my very favorite unschooling families uses a government program in Canada to fund their unschooling. They do some AMAZING things with that money! There is no question in my mind that they are an unschooling family. The kids love being able to decide what to do with their money throughout the year and the tiny bits of paper work and oversight are not a deterrent at all to the huge benefit they get from having that money at their disposal.
There are places in the world where we wouldn't even be able to have this conversation. I honestly believe that the more options available to families in regards to education, the better for everyone, including traditional public schoolers. It sets a higher standard of education and puts it clearly in the hands of parents which isn't a bad thing.
If a family is fully invested in public school, or school, or are emotionally or physically abusive, I don't think they can really call themselves an unschooler or an unschooling family.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- when do you stop being an unschooler?!***
The issue that I see, is not a new one. This conversation gets batted around in homeschool forums as well. The question is better framed as, "At what point is a family considered homeschooling if they are using public funds for their homeschooling?"
Some people believe no amount of public funds should be allowed if a person is truly stepping away from public schooling. Some people believe that using an online publicly funded charter school, at home, is homeschooling. These sort of things are different all around the world. This particular idea was brought to Radical Unschooling Info on Facebook, an international group, as is this, about a program in Canada. Canada has pretty different ideas about homeschool than the USA, and probably very very different than India or any other various locations around the world.
One of my very favorite unschooling families uses a government program in Canada to fund their unschooling. They do some AMAZING things with that money! There is no question in my mind that they are an unschooling family. The kids love being able to decide what to do with their money throughout the year and the tiny bits of paper work and oversight are not a deterrent at all to the huge benefit they get from having that money at their disposal.
There are places in the world where we wouldn't even be able to have this conversation. I honestly believe that the more options available to families in regards to education, the better for everyone, including traditional public schoolers. It sets a higher standard of education and puts it clearly in the hands of parents which isn't a bad thing.
If a family is fully invested in public school, or school, or are emotionally or physically abusive, I don't think they can really call themselves an unschooler or an unschooling family.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-- are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?( what about goverment programs which are not go to school but, you are part of the system which it doesnt go to school but, some requirements are applied and expected)-=-
I think you're looking for ammunition to use in a local-group discussion, and I'm not sure why.
Do what you want to do with your family, for good reasons. If you feel like that's unschooling then you are unschooling, if your decisions are made from those principles.
If people live where the local district or the provincial or state government will give them cash or some sort of benefits, it is possible that an unschooling family could take advantage of some of that and still be unschooling. Unschooling is about belief and practice--Principles in action.
Some people want unschooling to be a political statement. I have no interest in supporting that. The "radical" in radical unschooling is about the roots of the beliefs, not about being on beyond liberal. It has nothing on earth to do with "wild eyed radicals."
If that's where the confusion is coming from, please read here:
http://sandradodd.com/unschool/definition
http://sandradodd.com/hsc/radical
If you want others to say you're an unschooler, it might be good to wonder why that would be.
If you want to tell others in your local group that their unschooling souls are in peril if they accept silver from the Romans, that's a little too strident for my beliefs.
Unschooling is largely betwee you and the rest of your family. Have you really managed to created an environment in which learning is flowing freely?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I think you're looking for ammunition to use in a local-group discussion, and I'm not sure why.
Do what you want to do with your family, for good reasons. If you feel like that's unschooling then you are unschooling, if your decisions are made from those principles.
If people live where the local district or the provincial or state government will give them cash or some sort of benefits, it is possible that an unschooling family could take advantage of some of that and still be unschooling. Unschooling is about belief and practice--Principles in action.
Some people want unschooling to be a political statement. I have no interest in supporting that. The "radical" in radical unschooling is about the roots of the beliefs, not about being on beyond liberal. It has nothing on earth to do with "wild eyed radicals."
If that's where the confusion is coming from, please read here:
http://sandradodd.com/unschool/definition
http://sandradodd.com/hsc/radical
If you want others to say you're an unschooler, it might be good to wonder why that would be.
If you want to tell others in your local group that their unschooling souls are in peril if they accept silver from the Romans, that's a little too strident for my beliefs.
Unschooling is largely betwee you and the rest of your family. Have you really managed to created an environment in which learning is flowing freely?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Schuyler
If you live in a state where you have to report and oblige the powers that be with your conformance to their requirements can you not be an unschooler? Is unschooling only possible in a world without folks observing and judging what you are doing? 'Cause I don't live in that world. I live in a world with judgemental observers.
I am not an unschooler. I'm using the principles of unschooling to raise and educate my children. It's a paradigm that I'm applying. I don't think I could apply those principles if Simon and Linnaea were in school, but I do believe I could frame what we do in such a way as to meet the requirements of a government programme. I believe that I can bend and fold what we do to make it look like it fits in a box if so required. My beliefs haven't been tested, but I know other people who have done that without much difficulty.
Schuyler
________________________________
From: Tawha <tawha@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, 18 September 2012, 1:00
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Are you still an unschooler when you go to school?
I have been in a discussion about a different topic over at the radical unschooling that is unquestionable related to the same thing if not is a big part of it..
here it raised these two questions:
- are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?( what about goverment programs which are not go to school but, you are part of the system which it doesnt go to school but, some requirements are applied and expected)
- when do you stop being an unschooler?!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am not an unschooler. I'm using the principles of unschooling to raise and educate my children. It's a paradigm that I'm applying. I don't think I could apply those principles if Simon and Linnaea were in school, but I do believe I could frame what we do in such a way as to meet the requirements of a government programme. I believe that I can bend and fold what we do to make it look like it fits in a box if so required. My beliefs haven't been tested, but I know other people who have done that without much difficulty.
Schuyler
________________________________
From: Tawha <tawha@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, 18 September 2012, 1:00
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Are you still an unschooler when you go to school?
I have been in a discussion about a different topic over at the radical unschooling that is unquestionable related to the same thing if not is a big part of it..
here it raised these two questions:
- are you still an Unschooler when you go to school?( what about goverment programs which are not go to school but, you are part of the system which it doesnt go to school but, some requirements are applied and expected)
- when do you stop being an unschooler?!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
Schuyler <s.waynforth@...> wrote:
Sometimes those judgemental observers are other parents - I mean spouses and ex-spouses or even live-in grandparents. Making compromises for the sake of peace and harmony isn't necessarily about selling your soul to the evil empire, it can be about supporting your kids in their lives and relationships.
---Meredith
>Is unschooling only possible in a world without folks observing and judging what you are doing? 'Cause I don't live in that world. I live in a world with judgemental observers.**************
Sometimes those judgemental observers are other parents - I mean spouses and ex-spouses or even live-in grandparents. Making compromises for the sake of peace and harmony isn't necessarily about selling your soul to the evil empire, it can be about supporting your kids in their lives and relationships.
---Meredith