I'm so deschooled now I honestly forget
Sandra Dodd
I forget when school vacations are; I have to think about it.
Corresponding with people about dates for speaking in England and France and Portugal (that one in 2013), I was trying to get clear on when school is out there--it's later than in the U.S. I was looking on google to see if there was a calendar, but didn't find one. I did find this, and it hit me a little hard.
-=-While absence may be granted for a holiday during term time, it is entirely the school�s decision and is not a parental right.-=-
Here it is in context (it's at the bottom) and it came from this UK site:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Schoolslearninganddevelopment/SchoolLife/DG_4016103
I can't even read that calmly anymore. I don't want to get off on the subject of schools, really, but just wanted to remind you to cherish and appreciate the freedom you have to live in a year that is marked by natural seasons, making decisions by weather and temperature, sunrises, sunsets.
Sandra
Holidays during term time - what the law says
You should not normally take your child on holiday in term time - it can be disruptive both to your child's learning and to the school. Schools will only consider holidays in term time where both:
the application is made to the headteacher in advance of the holiday by a parent the child normally lives with
there are special reasons for needing to take the holiday, like the inflexibility of the parents� holiday leave
Applications should be made as far in advance of the holiday as possible and you should speak to the school before you book. Schools will only agree to more than 10 school days of absence in any school year in exceptional circumstances.
How do schools consider term time holiday requests?
Schools will judge each holiday request individually, taking into consideration:
the time of year for the proposed trip
if it's close to any exam dates
your child's overall attendance record
any holidays already taken in the school year
the age and stage of education of your child
the ability of your child to catch up the work that they have missed
the reason why you are taking the time off during term time
While absence may be granted for a holiday during term time, it is entirely the school�s decision and is not a parental right.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Corresponding with people about dates for speaking in England and France and Portugal (that one in 2013), I was trying to get clear on when school is out there--it's later than in the U.S. I was looking on google to see if there was a calendar, but didn't find one. I did find this, and it hit me a little hard.
-=-While absence may be granted for a holiday during term time, it is entirely the school�s decision and is not a parental right.-=-
Here it is in context (it's at the bottom) and it came from this UK site:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Schoolslearninganddevelopment/SchoolLife/DG_4016103
I can't even read that calmly anymore. I don't want to get off on the subject of schools, really, but just wanted to remind you to cherish and appreciate the freedom you have to live in a year that is marked by natural seasons, making decisions by weather and temperature, sunrises, sunsets.
Sandra
Holidays during term time - what the law says
You should not normally take your child on holiday in term time - it can be disruptive both to your child's learning and to the school. Schools will only consider holidays in term time where both:
the application is made to the headteacher in advance of the holiday by a parent the child normally lives with
there are special reasons for needing to take the holiday, like the inflexibility of the parents� holiday leave
Applications should be made as far in advance of the holiday as possible and you should speak to the school before you book. Schools will only agree to more than 10 school days of absence in any school year in exceptional circumstances.
How do schools consider term time holiday requests?
Schools will judge each holiday request individually, taking into consideration:
the time of year for the proposed trip
if it's close to any exam dates
your child's overall attendance record
any holidays already taken in the school year
the age and stage of education of your child
the ability of your child to catch up the work that they have missed
the reason why you are taking the time off during term time
While absence may be granted for a holiday during term time, it is entirely the school�s decision and is not a parental right.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Vanessa Orsborn
I'm from the UK and have nieces and nephews in school.
It depends on the school but the most you can get permission to be off for during term time, is a few days. Some schools will give a week attached to a summer/Easter/Xmas holiday if one parent is foreign (for example we have a lot of Australians in London, and to go back to Australia for Xmas needs 3 weeks to make it worrhwhile (due to jetlag and costs).
My sister got in trouble with her sons school for taking him on holiday during term time on numerous occasions. She pretends he is ill normally, but he goes back to school with a tan in winter which doesn't help ;-). Luckily the school is fairly relaxed, she could has faced big fines.
Vanessa
It depends on the school but the most you can get permission to be off for during term time, is a few days. Some schools will give a week attached to a summer/Easter/Xmas holiday if one parent is foreign (for example we have a lot of Australians in London, and to go back to Australia for Xmas needs 3 weeks to make it worrhwhile (due to jetlag and costs).
My sister got in trouble with her sons school for taking him on holiday during term time on numerous occasions. She pretends he is ill normally, but he goes back to school with a tan in winter which doesn't help ;-). Luckily the school is fairly relaxed, she could has faced big fines.
Vanessa
>
Sandra Dodd
-=-Luckily the school is fairly relaxed, she could has faced big fines.-=-
That's what stunned me.
In the U.S., the threat would be that the child would be required to repeat a year at school
When I was first around homeschool discussion in the early 1980's there were stories of schools having said "NO" to requests for time off. One was for a teen from the US, I think, to tour Europe with an orchestra. School said no. The other was a family wanting to go to Australia, and the school saying no. And the families went along with those judgments, those refusals, those proclamations. And what it proved, to me, was that schools think they own not only the students, but their entire families. And that was certainly never the intent when schools were first created, but it grew like a cancer within the system to the point that there are parents who, when asked to come to the principal's office, don't consider that they could say "No, I don't want to. Put it in writing." Or "How about meeting me for lunch at my office?" Seriously. It's as though school principals think they have the power of federal judges to summon people to appear. When someone fails to answer a court summons, they can be arrested. When a parent doesn't "answer a school summons" though, those people have your child hostage.
It just seems horrible to me, like something that has gone way beyond any thought of the purpose of schools.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
That's what stunned me.
In the U.S., the threat would be that the child would be required to repeat a year at school
When I was first around homeschool discussion in the early 1980's there were stories of schools having said "NO" to requests for time off. One was for a teen from the US, I think, to tour Europe with an orchestra. School said no. The other was a family wanting to go to Australia, and the school saying no. And the families went along with those judgments, those refusals, those proclamations. And what it proved, to me, was that schools think they own not only the students, but their entire families. And that was certainly never the intent when schools were first created, but it grew like a cancer within the system to the point that there are parents who, when asked to come to the principal's office, don't consider that they could say "No, I don't want to. Put it in writing." Or "How about meeting me for lunch at my office?" Seriously. It's as though school principals think they have the power of federal judges to summon people to appear. When someone fails to answer a court summons, they can be arrested. When a parent doesn't "answer a school summons" though, those people have your child hostage.
It just seems horrible to me, like something that has gone way beyond any thought of the purpose of schools.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
chris ester
On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 6:01 PM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
my own children (they were an infant and not yet born at the time) came
from my experience with schools as a social worker. It always amazed me
that school officials (particularly principals) would consistently block
parents when they were attempting to access services for their child and
would be generally difficult and problematic until I got involved as
another "official" from another branch of the local government. Or how
the school system would completely discount any input from a parent about
their child, even if the parent were an educated, reasonable person who was
articulate and savvy. It was really bizarre to me to watch school
personnel try to tell a parent about their child as if the parent didn't
know their child or understand that child's needs. After I saw this happen
over and over, I decided that I just wanted to circumvent the whole
experience for my family.
And like you, I totally forget about the 'school year', I have to mark it
on my calendar in the rare event that it is relevant to our lives (for
ballet school for instance).
Chris
> **The original impetus for me to begin exploring alternatives to school for
>
>
>
>
> ^^^^^^When I was first around homeschool discussion in the early 1980's
> there were stories of schools having said "NO" to requests for time off.
> One was for a teen from the US, I think, to tour Europe with an orchestra.
> School said no. The other was a family wanting to go to Australia, and the
> school saying no. And the families went along with those judgments, those
> refusals, those proclamations. And what it proved, to me, was that schools
> think they own not only the students, but their entire families. And that
> was certainly never the intent when schools were first created, but it grew
> like a cancer within the system to the point that there are parents who,
> when asked to come to the principal's office, don't consider that they
> could say "No, I don't want to. Put it in writing." Or "How about meeting
> me for lunch at my office?" Seriously. It's as though school principals
> think they have the power of federal judges to summon people to appear.
> When someone fails to answer a court summons, they can be arrested. When a
> parent doesn't "answer a school summons" though, those people have your
> child hostage.
>
> It just seems horrible to me, like something that has gone way beyond any
> thought of the purpose of schools.
>
> Sandra^^^^^^^^^^^
>
my own children (they were an infant and not yet born at the time) came
from my experience with schools as a social worker. It always amazed me
that school officials (particularly principals) would consistently block
parents when they were attempting to access services for their child and
would be generally difficult and problematic until I got involved as
another "official" from another branch of the local government. Or how
the school system would completely discount any input from a parent about
their child, even if the parent were an educated, reasonable person who was
articulate and savvy. It was really bizarre to me to watch school
personnel try to tell a parent about their child as if the parent didn't
know their child or understand that child's needs. After I saw this happen
over and over, I decided that I just wanted to circumvent the whole
experience for my family.
And like you, I totally forget about the 'school year', I have to mark it
on my calendar in the rare event that it is relevant to our lives (for
ballet school for instance).
Chris
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
<<<<<<When I was first around homeschool discussion in the early 1980's there were stories of schools having said "NO" to requests for time off. One was for a teen from the US, I think, to tour Europe with an orchestra. School said no. The other was a family wanting to go to Australia, and the school saying no. And the families went along with those judgments, those refusals, those proclamations. And what it proved, to me, was that schools think they own not only the students, but their entire families. And that was certainly never the intent when schools were first created, but it grew like a cancer within the system to the point that there are parents who, when asked to come to the principal's office, don't consider that they could say "No, I don't want to. Put it in writing." Or "How about meeting me for lunch at my office?" Seriously. It's as though school principals think they have the power of federal judges to summon people to appear.
When someone fails to answer a court summons, they can be arrested. When a parent doesn't "answer a school summons" though, those people have your child hostage. >>>>>>>>>>
My friend in Texas needs to go to Brazil for a week or two this month and the Principal was really nice but told her her best option was to pull the kids from school and re-enroll them when she gets back or they would be in great trouble.
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bob Collier
--- In [email protected], Vanessa Orsborn <orangeness1@...> wrote:
Isn't it ridiculous that you have to pretend your child is sick to get them even one day off school? My daughter (she's 26 now) worked hard at school and always did well and every so often she wanted a day off to just chill out at home and 'recharge her batteries'. Unlike her schools, who apparently believed that missing a day's lessons was the end of the world, my wife and I thought an occasional 'rest day' was a sensible idea, so our daughter was free to take a day off school at her discretion with no strings attached as far as we were concerned. The next morning I would write a blatant lie of our mutual devising in a "sick note" for her to hand in as required and I felt quite annoyed at times that it was necessary for us to play that silly game.
Mind you, at other times it felt rather like "sticking it to the man", so I guess there was an element of fun in there somewhere. :-)
Bob
>I went through all that with my daughter when she was at school in the UK and then here in Australia.
>
> I'm from the UK and have nieces and nephews in school.
> It depends on the school but the most you can get permission to be off for during term time, is a few days. Some schools will give a week attached to a summer/Easter/Xmas holiday if one parent is foreign (for example we have a lot of Australians in London, and to go back to Australia for Xmas needs 3 weeks to make it worrhwhile (due to jetlag and costs).
> My sister got in trouble with her sons school for taking him on holiday during term time on numerous occasions. She pretends he is ill normally, but he goes back to school with a tan in winter which doesn't help ;-). Luckily the school is fairly relaxed, she could has faced big fines.
> Vanessa
>
> >
>
Isn't it ridiculous that you have to pretend your child is sick to get them even one day off school? My daughter (she's 26 now) worked hard at school and always did well and every so often she wanted a day off to just chill out at home and 'recharge her batteries'. Unlike her schools, who apparently believed that missing a day's lessons was the end of the world, my wife and I thought an occasional 'rest day' was a sensible idea, so our daughter was free to take a day off school at her discretion with no strings attached as far as we were concerned. The next morning I would write a blatant lie of our mutual devising in a "sick note" for her to hand in as required and I felt quite annoyed at times that it was necessary for us to play that silly game.
Mind you, at other times it felt rather like "sticking it to the man", so I guess there was an element of fun in there somewhere. :-)
Bob
Kim Zerbe
Wow. Guess I should consider myself lucky then. We're in Hawaii right now, for 12 days total. I didn't ask anyone if it was OK. My son would've missed 7 or 8 days of school (I'm not sure if kids have off for MLK tomorrow, that's how much I know about school schedules). Several times here I've marvelled at HOW we're learning things (touching, tasting, listening to people tell stories who grew up here) and how some kids will only learn about Hawaii from a book while sitting at a desk. And maybe only for a day (if they're lucky) and when it's time (not necessarily when they're interested).
Thanks for the reminder to appreciate our life! :)
Kim Z
writing from a warm breezy beach
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY <polykowholsteins@...> wrote:
Thanks for the reminder to appreciate our life! :)
Kim Z
writing from a warm breezy beach
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY <polykowholsteins@...> wrote:
>
>
>
><<<<<<When I was first around homeschool discussion in the early 1980's there were stories of schools having said "NO" to requests for time off. One was for a teen from the US, I think, to tour Europe with an orchestra. School said no. The other was a family wanting to go to Australia, and the school saying no. And the families went along with those judgments, those refusals, those proclamations. And what it proved, to me, was that schools think they own not only the students, but their entire families. And that was certainly never the intent when schools were first created, but it grew like a cancer within the system to the point that there are parents who, when asked to come to the principal's office, don't consider that they could say "No, I don't want to. Put it in writing." Or "How about meeting me for lunch at my office?" Seriously. It's as though school principals think they have the power of federal judges to summon people to appear.
> When someone fails to answer a court summons, they can be arrested. When a parent doesn't "answer a school summons" though, those people have your child hostage. >>>>>>>>>>
>
>
>My friend in Texas needs to go to Brazil for a week or two this month and the Principal was really nice but told her her best option was to pull the kids from school and re-enroll them when she gets back or they would be in great trouble.
>
>Alex Polikowsky
>
>
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Bob Collier
--- In [email protected], Kim Zerbe <kim.zerbe@...> wrote:
We'd had our cottage on the market for about a year and, while we were still seeking a buyer, my wife decided she wanted to take our daughter to Australia to spend some time, including Christmas, with her family. It was October. I informed our daughter's school and the Principal agreed to the three months absence providing our daughter took the appropriate school work with her to complete for the new term after Christmas. My wife and I agreed to that and then a week later we found a buyer for our cottage. So I informed our daughter's school that she wouldn't be coming back, we organised a farewell party for the saying of goodbyes and so on, and off my wife and daughter went to Australia and had a nice and relaxed three months holiday while I took care of the move to London. I was rather pleased with the way that worked out.
Bob
>That reminds me now of what happened when my wife and I were selling our little cottage in the country (Gloucestershire) to move to London when our daughter was eight.
> Wow. Guess I should consider myself lucky then. We're in Hawaii right now, for 12 days total. I didn't ask anyone if it was OK. My son would've missed 7 or 8 days of school (I'm not sure if kids have off for MLK tomorrow, that's how much I know about school schedules). Several times here I've marvelled at HOW we're learning things (touching, tasting, listening to people tell stories who grew up here) and how some kids will only learn about Hawaii from a book while sitting at a desk. And maybe only for a day (if they're lucky) and when it's time (not necessarily when they're interested).
>
> Thanks for the reminder to appreciate our life! :)
>
> Kim Z
> writing from a warm breezy beach
>
>
>
We'd had our cottage on the market for about a year and, while we were still seeking a buyer, my wife decided she wanted to take our daughter to Australia to spend some time, including Christmas, with her family. It was October. I informed our daughter's school and the Principal agreed to the three months absence providing our daughter took the appropriate school work with her to complete for the new term after Christmas. My wife and I agreed to that and then a week later we found a buyer for our cottage. So I informed our daughter's school that she wouldn't be coming back, we organised a farewell party for the saying of goodbyes and so on, and off my wife and daughter went to Australia and had a nice and relaxed three months holiday while I took care of the move to London. I was rather pleased with the way that worked out.
Bob
Sandra Dodd
-=-Wow. Guess I should consider myself lucky then. We're in Hawaii right now, for 12 days total. I didn't ask anyone if it was OK. -=-
SO much more is learned by travelling than by looking at pictures in books. Books don't tell you how it smells, how the people look at you, what the food tastes like, how the clouds look, how the sun comes up, how the houses are laid out differently than you're used to, what the street names are like compared to other places, what's in the grocery store that you don't have back home.
Today's Just Add Light and Stir has a photo I took in Hawaii, matched up with something Pam Sorooshian wrote about exploring at your own local grocery store. :-)
http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/2012/01/curiosity-wonder-fascination-and.html
Connecting those dots all the time.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SO much more is learned by travelling than by looking at pictures in books. Books don't tell you how it smells, how the people look at you, what the food tastes like, how the clouds look, how the sun comes up, how the houses are laid out differently than you're used to, what the street names are like compared to other places, what's in the grocery store that you don't have back home.
Today's Just Add Light and Stir has a photo I took in Hawaii, matched up with something Pam Sorooshian wrote about exploring at your own local grocery store. :-)
http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/2012/01/curiosity-wonder-fascination-and.html
Connecting those dots all the time.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]