"Help we're sinking"
Sandra Dodd
I have a private e-mail I'm going to answer here for two reasons: 1) better use of my volunteer time, and 2) more opportunity for the questioner to get the benefit of a range of ideas. So please respond if you'd like to! I've asked her to join the list (and she might already be on).
The core of the letter, and my first-pass response:
----------------------------------
I would love to have some suggestions or a page on burn out. Both my husband and I hit the bottom again this afternoon. We are laughing saying maybe we should drink more.
We bring into our lives being mindful (Jon kabit zin is often in our lives). We feel that we are attachment parents...both our kids are co-sleeping right now. We listen suggest choices We just live
Our children are little 2 & 5... And we are really tired. The questions are endless when we start the day we have energy to answer... Towards the end the children are often not even listening just talking for the sake of contact. We try the contact...They want to do something exciting everything i suggest is not good enough. They interrupt constantly and we can't even finish a thought in our own heads. We try to fill the "love cups" but man they must be very big.
We need some tips on burn out.
Maybe this is more a parenting issue... There just does not seem to be any time for me any more. And poor husband said almost word for word what I'm feeling...we are to the point we don't want to hear their lovely little voices anymore.
We've tried hard out working at all ideas to fill their little needs thinking they might let us breath for a moment...but it's constant..maybe we live too far out too rural...but it's wonderful here
Just some ideas or how others or your self got through the very needful times... When the you had no substance. Maybe how not to use all the bank up have a little left so you can be human.
-------------------------------------
-=- We listen suggest choices We just live-=-
Beware "just." It minimizes. Live big. Be sparkly. Take unexpected little turns to get out of the rut.
-=- The questions are endless when we start the day we have energy to answer... Towards the end the children are often not even listening just talking for the sake of contact. -=-
Then make the answers funny to get their attention. Or ask them questions instead. Fun questions.
What-if questions that will make them think, and laugh, but not meanly or sarcastically.
-=-Our children are little 2 & 5... And we are really tired. -=-
They will only be 2 and 5 for less than a year. No one is 2 for more than a year.
"Tired" can (sometimes, not always) from thoughts. The way you see what's going on, the way you categorize it, can make it seem like a gigantic imposition or a huge drag, or like an opportunity or a blessing or a joy. Nothing but words. And people say "That's just semantics," and I (now for the first time, but not the last) can counter with, "Oh, HUH! That's biochemistry. That's the difference between gratitude and suicide, for some people."
A recent quote from Just Add Light and Stir (to which you might want to subscribe if you haven't already):
The same life can be seen from many different angles.
The same situation can be seen while holding one's breath and being furious,
or while seeing the alternatives and finding ways to be grateful,
no matter how small,
because on one small bit of gratitude,
one can step up and see another one,
and another.
http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/
-=-Maybe this is more a parenting issue... -=-
Unschooling is a way of parenting, a way of living together.
-=-There just does not seem to be any time for me any more. And poor husband said almost word for word what I'm feeling...we are to the point we don't want to hear their lovely little voices anymore.-=-
There are quieter things to do, perhaps. There's a game called "dead lions" that can be fun, but involves some quiet. Not total quiet, but it might be a start. Watching videos that aren't raucous, but have nice music and pretty scenery might be a way to move from constant chatter to less.
If the kids are asking questions, you could practice giving short answers. One, three, five-word answers, rather than wikipedia-type responses. Elegant, profound answers. Or fantasy answers, like "I WISH the answer were... " and spin a little fantasy. Historical answers. "Well, 100 years ago they thought..."
Here are other kinds of angles to consider using when answering:
http://sandradodd.com/checklists
-=-We've tried hard out working at all ideas to fill their little needs thinking they might let us breath for a moment...but it's constant..-=-
When you do breath, make it count.
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
I'm as serious as a heart attack. You can breath shallowly, with frustration and resentment, or you can take a baby step toward one deep breath of acceptance and gratitude. One can lead to another, but if you resist ever taking the first, you never ever can get the third, and the fourth, or the day when it comes naturally to do that.
-=-maybe we live too far out too rural...but it's wonderful here-=-
"Wonderful," when a family is living as a team, needs to include the whole family. We knew a family that moved 50 miles from the city because the mom was attached to the idea of having chickens and a horse and a pig. Thing is, where they moved wasn't really great for the horse or the pig--no shade, no grass, no natural water. And she spent nearly every day driving one of her three kids to Albuquerque, through a mountain pass that wasn't always safe or open. MANY times she could have stayed in town, but there was nobody out there to feed her animals, so she had to drive back in the dark, late, or the animals went hungry. It would have been much, much safer and less expensive for her to choose her children's needs over her personal belief that it would be good for them to grow up with farm animals.
-=-Just some ideas or how others or your self got through the very needful times... When the you had no substance. Maybe how not to use all the bank up have a little left so you can be human.-=-
Your words have made you insubstantial. You imagined a bank, and you imagined yourself poor. Your words have made you less than human. Those words came from your thoughts. Recast your thoughts in different words or images: You are the mother of two children bright and energetic enough to ask you questions! You have a husband who loves you, who talks to you about important things, who loves your children. You have an intact family, living in a home you love. Look around you. You're in the minority. Look for what you have, and what your resources are for having more [emotionally, visually, auditorially (?)] What can you taste or smell today that would make the day a little better? Where is your abundance? What do you have plenty of?
Look at what you do have, and you won't have time or energy to focus so closely on what you imagine others have that you don't have.
You ARE human. That's what human is like. Don't imagine yourself to be inhuman or abnormal.
This article comes to mind:
http://sandradodd.com/fullofyourself
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
The core of the letter, and my first-pass response:
----------------------------------
I would love to have some suggestions or a page on burn out. Both my husband and I hit the bottom again this afternoon. We are laughing saying maybe we should drink more.
We bring into our lives being mindful (Jon kabit zin is often in our lives). We feel that we are attachment parents...both our kids are co-sleeping right now. We listen suggest choices We just live
Our children are little 2 & 5... And we are really tired. The questions are endless when we start the day we have energy to answer... Towards the end the children are often not even listening just talking for the sake of contact. We try the contact...They want to do something exciting everything i suggest is not good enough. They interrupt constantly and we can't even finish a thought in our own heads. We try to fill the "love cups" but man they must be very big.
We need some tips on burn out.
Maybe this is more a parenting issue... There just does not seem to be any time for me any more. And poor husband said almost word for word what I'm feeling...we are to the point we don't want to hear their lovely little voices anymore.
We've tried hard out working at all ideas to fill their little needs thinking they might let us breath for a moment...but it's constant..maybe we live too far out too rural...but it's wonderful here
Just some ideas or how others or your self got through the very needful times... When the you had no substance. Maybe how not to use all the bank up have a little left so you can be human.
-------------------------------------
-=- We listen suggest choices We just live-=-
Beware "just." It minimizes. Live big. Be sparkly. Take unexpected little turns to get out of the rut.
-=- The questions are endless when we start the day we have energy to answer... Towards the end the children are often not even listening just talking for the sake of contact. -=-
Then make the answers funny to get their attention. Or ask them questions instead. Fun questions.
What-if questions that will make them think, and laugh, but not meanly or sarcastically.
-=-Our children are little 2 & 5... And we are really tired. -=-
They will only be 2 and 5 for less than a year. No one is 2 for more than a year.
"Tired" can (sometimes, not always) from thoughts. The way you see what's going on, the way you categorize it, can make it seem like a gigantic imposition or a huge drag, or like an opportunity or a blessing or a joy. Nothing but words. And people say "That's just semantics," and I (now for the first time, but not the last) can counter with, "Oh, HUH! That's biochemistry. That's the difference between gratitude and suicide, for some people."
A recent quote from Just Add Light and Stir (to which you might want to subscribe if you haven't already):
The same life can be seen from many different angles.
The same situation can be seen while holding one's breath and being furious,
or while seeing the alternatives and finding ways to be grateful,
no matter how small,
because on one small bit of gratitude,
one can step up and see another one,
and another.
http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/
-=-Maybe this is more a parenting issue... -=-
Unschooling is a way of parenting, a way of living together.
-=-There just does not seem to be any time for me any more. And poor husband said almost word for word what I'm feeling...we are to the point we don't want to hear their lovely little voices anymore.-=-
There are quieter things to do, perhaps. There's a game called "dead lions" that can be fun, but involves some quiet. Not total quiet, but it might be a start. Watching videos that aren't raucous, but have nice music and pretty scenery might be a way to move from constant chatter to less.
If the kids are asking questions, you could practice giving short answers. One, three, five-word answers, rather than wikipedia-type responses. Elegant, profound answers. Or fantasy answers, like "I WISH the answer were... " and spin a little fantasy. Historical answers. "Well, 100 years ago they thought..."
Here are other kinds of angles to consider using when answering:
http://sandradodd.com/checklists
-=-We've tried hard out working at all ideas to fill their little needs thinking they might let us breath for a moment...but it's constant..-=-
When you do breath, make it count.
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
I'm as serious as a heart attack. You can breath shallowly, with frustration and resentment, or you can take a baby step toward one deep breath of acceptance and gratitude. One can lead to another, but if you resist ever taking the first, you never ever can get the third, and the fourth, or the day when it comes naturally to do that.
-=-maybe we live too far out too rural...but it's wonderful here-=-
"Wonderful," when a family is living as a team, needs to include the whole family. We knew a family that moved 50 miles from the city because the mom was attached to the idea of having chickens and a horse and a pig. Thing is, where they moved wasn't really great for the horse or the pig--no shade, no grass, no natural water. And she spent nearly every day driving one of her three kids to Albuquerque, through a mountain pass that wasn't always safe or open. MANY times she could have stayed in town, but there was nobody out there to feed her animals, so she had to drive back in the dark, late, or the animals went hungry. It would have been much, much safer and less expensive for her to choose her children's needs over her personal belief that it would be good for them to grow up with farm animals.
-=-Just some ideas or how others or your self got through the very needful times... When the you had no substance. Maybe how not to use all the bank up have a little left so you can be human.-=-
Your words have made you insubstantial. You imagined a bank, and you imagined yourself poor. Your words have made you less than human. Those words came from your thoughts. Recast your thoughts in different words or images: You are the mother of two children bright and energetic enough to ask you questions! You have a husband who loves you, who talks to you about important things, who loves your children. You have an intact family, living in a home you love. Look around you. You're in the minority. Look for what you have, and what your resources are for having more [emotionally, visually, auditorially (?)] What can you taste or smell today that would make the day a little better? Where is your abundance? What do you have plenty of?
Look at what you do have, and you won't have time or energy to focus so closely on what you imagine others have that you don't have.
You ARE human. That's what human is like. Don't imagine yourself to be inhuman or abnormal.
This article comes to mind:
http://sandradodd.com/fullofyourself
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
>maybe we live too far out too rural...but it's wonderful hereIt's not so wonderful if you're exhausted! If you think the kids need more time with other people, find ways to do that. Get out of the house, go shopping, go to parks, meet people and make friends.
> Our children are little 2 & 5... And we are really tired. The questions are endless when we start the day we have energy to answer...*********************
"We" is problematic. Are both of you with both kids all day long? Split that up so you each get a chance to rest a bit. Some kids really do need a loooooooot of conversation - I had one and it was tiring, for sure. It helped to recognize that I could take breaks in tiny little increments - five seconds! And sometimes I got ten! I learned to take a big, slow breath and really enjoy it and that was enough.
>> Towards the end the children are often not even listening just talking for the sake of contact.**************
Do they like tv or movies at all? That can be a good thing to suggest at the end of the day, curl up together with a movie so they have snuggles and love and get to hear someone Else's voice for a little while.
---Meredith
[email protected]
***There just does not seem to be any time for me any more. And poor husband said almost word for word what I'm feeling...we are to the point we don't want to hear their lovely little voices anymore.***
I have an idea for you having to do with mindfulness. First, I don’t think you’re listening to their lovely little voices, I think you’re listening to the voice in your own head in a way that’s causing you to be judgmental and unhappy. Since you mention Jon Kabat-Zinn I’ll suggest trying to cultivate that quality of mind which will let you experience your real life in a way that doesn’t leave you judging it. The danger of making a judgment like “not ...any time for me anymore” is that you begin to find ways to qualify that so that anything your kids want from then on will seem like too much. Maybe you can revisit Jon Kabat-Zinn.
Once you’re really listening to your kids and not your sense of injustice I think you’ll find that answering them and interacting with them is intellectually rewarding and stimulating and fun. It’s not something you *have* to do. It’s something you *get* to do for a very little while. You can’t change this need your kids have right now. You can only change how you see it, how you think about it and meet it. And that’s good because that’s entirely in your power to do.
When Dylan was little and I was home with him all the time two things helped. I’d get up early and go for a run before David went to work and I’d get outside with Dylan to play and run around as much as possible. Dylan talked early and talked a lot and many of his games involved me taking direction and delivering dialog like an actor in a play. There isn’t much time for thinking your own thoughts when you’re talking to Space Command, trying to outrun Interpol, and smuggle monster back to Monster Island. But that was as rewarding and fun for me as it was for him. More, maybe because I still remember it and mostly he doesn’t. <g> Really focusing on him though, was the most important thing. Really living those monster stories instead of thinking how much I’d like a shower, really listening to his little voice instead of thinking about how long it will take to get the dishes done, that made all the difference.
Deb Lewis
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I have an idea for you having to do with mindfulness. First, I don’t think you’re listening to their lovely little voices, I think you’re listening to the voice in your own head in a way that’s causing you to be judgmental and unhappy. Since you mention Jon Kabat-Zinn I’ll suggest trying to cultivate that quality of mind which will let you experience your real life in a way that doesn’t leave you judging it. The danger of making a judgment like “not ...any time for me anymore” is that you begin to find ways to qualify that so that anything your kids want from then on will seem like too much. Maybe you can revisit Jon Kabat-Zinn.
Once you’re really listening to your kids and not your sense of injustice I think you’ll find that answering them and interacting with them is intellectually rewarding and stimulating and fun. It’s not something you *have* to do. It’s something you *get* to do for a very little while. You can’t change this need your kids have right now. You can only change how you see it, how you think about it and meet it. And that’s good because that’s entirely in your power to do.
When Dylan was little and I was home with him all the time two things helped. I’d get up early and go for a run before David went to work and I’d get outside with Dylan to play and run around as much as possible. Dylan talked early and talked a lot and many of his games involved me taking direction and delivering dialog like an actor in a play. There isn’t much time for thinking your own thoughts when you’re talking to Space Command, trying to outrun Interpol, and smuggle monster back to Monster Island. But that was as rewarding and fun for me as it was for him. More, maybe because I still remember it and mostly he doesn’t. <g> Really focusing on him though, was the most important thing. Really living those monster stories instead of thinking how much I’d like a shower, really listening to his little voice instead of thinking about how long it will take to get the dishes done, that made all the difference.
Deb Lewis
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
Deb Lewis wrote this:
-=-Once you�re really listening to your kids and not your sense of injustice I think you�ll find that answering them and interacting with them is intellectually rewarding and stimulating and fun. It�s not something you *have* to do. It�s something you *get* to do for a very little while. You can�t change this need your kids have right now. You can only change how you see it, how you think about it and meet it. And that�s good because that�s entirely in your power to do.
-=-
Deb Lewis will be in Albuquerque in late December, and will speak (briefly, formally) and discuss (informally) such ideas in person with those who attend this symposium:
http://sandradodd.com/all
Also speaking and hanging out for the entire time:
Joyce Fetteroll
Pam Sorooshian
Rosie Sorooshian
Jill Parmer
Me
There will be children other than Rosie there, too ("children" meaning grown unschoolers), though not all the children of all the speakers.
Things like this don't happen all the time. A symposium as serious and deep as this list? Rare. Those speakers won't live forever, y'know...
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-=-Once you�re really listening to your kids and not your sense of injustice I think you�ll find that answering them and interacting with them is intellectually rewarding and stimulating and fun. It�s not something you *have* to do. It�s something you *get* to do for a very little while. You can�t change this need your kids have right now. You can only change how you see it, how you think about it and meet it. And that�s good because that�s entirely in your power to do.
-=-
Deb Lewis will be in Albuquerque in late December, and will speak (briefly, formally) and discuss (informally) such ideas in person with those who attend this symposium:
http://sandradodd.com/all
Also speaking and hanging out for the entire time:
Joyce Fetteroll
Pam Sorooshian
Rosie Sorooshian
Jill Parmer
Me
There will be children other than Rosie there, too ("children" meaning grown unschoolers), though not all the children of all the speakers.
Things like this don't happen all the time. A symposium as serious and deep as this list? Rare. Those speakers won't live forever, y'know...
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]