Different styles for diff kids?
jennifer in IL
Hi,
I have been reading for a while now and so appreciate this list. I wonder if I am alone in this type of situation....I have 3 kids, 2 "neuro typical" in public school who thrive there. Never thought of homeschooling them, let alone unschooling them. I parent them pretty typically - though I feel we have more of a partnership in more ways than I see my friends or neighbors have who are more authoritative with their kids.
Enter my 3rd child with special needs. Life is hard enough for him, let alone school. He made it to his 6th day of 1st grade when I pulled him out and decided to homeschool him. I NEVER thought I would homeschool! This was not something I had a calling for but it was just clear he couldn't cut it in a cookie cutter system like public school.
Over the last 2 years I have relaxed quite a bit with him. I used to just recreate school in my living room and that was pretty miserable. So we did more unit studies, which we still like to do, but then I found unschooling/whole life learning/etc.... It seemed like the more I read, the more it made sense especially for my youngest.
Here is my rub - it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules." I am sure logically they get why I do this with him, but they are teens and aren't always so understanding.
I'd love any ideas/thoughts on this.
I have been reading for a while now and so appreciate this list. I wonder if I am alone in this type of situation....I have 3 kids, 2 "neuro typical" in public school who thrive there. Never thought of homeschooling them, let alone unschooling them. I parent them pretty typically - though I feel we have more of a partnership in more ways than I see my friends or neighbors have who are more authoritative with their kids.
Enter my 3rd child with special needs. Life is hard enough for him, let alone school. He made it to his 6th day of 1st grade when I pulled him out and decided to homeschool him. I NEVER thought I would homeschool! This was not something I had a calling for but it was just clear he couldn't cut it in a cookie cutter system like public school.
Over the last 2 years I have relaxed quite a bit with him. I used to just recreate school in my living room and that was pretty miserable. So we did more unit studies, which we still like to do, but then I found unschooling/whole life learning/etc.... It seemed like the more I read, the more it made sense especially for my youngest.
Here is my rub - it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules." I am sure logically they get why I do this with him, but they are teens and aren't always so understanding.
I'd love any ideas/thoughts on this.
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
What do you mean by you have different set of rules and parenting?
Do you let your son eat what he wants when he wants but limits the other two ?
Do you punish your two older kids but does not punish the younger?
If that is what you mean it may be a problem. Your two older ones can
resent their younger brother
and that will may harm your relationship with your children.
I parents my kids with the same principles but the way I handle each situation
may be different from one
child and the other due to their personalities but not in a way that would make
one resent the other.
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Do you let your son eat what he wants when he wants but limits the other two ?
Do you punish your two older kids but does not punish the younger?
If that is what you mean it may be a problem. Your two older ones can
resent their younger brother
and that will may harm your relationship with your children.
I parents my kids with the same principles but the way I handle each situation
may be different from one
child and the other due to their personalities but not in a way that would make
one resent the other.
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jennifer in IL
Hi,
I mean that two go to school, they have to do homework, there are rules they have to follow, there are expectations that come from external sources. Then I have one with me all the time where he is more free - ie he doesn't have to get up at a certain time to get ready for school/bus/breakfast. Does that make sense? Clearly that is one example.
I mean that two go to school, they have to do homework, there are rules they have to follow, there are expectations that come from external sources. Then I have one with me all the time where he is more free - ie he doesn't have to get up at a certain time to get ready for school/bus/breakfast. Does that make sense? Clearly that is one example.
--- In [email protected], BRIAN POLIKOWSKY <polykowholsteins@...> wrote:
>
> What do you mean by you have different set of rules and parenting?
> Do you let your son eat what he wants when he wants but limits the other two ?
> Do you punish your two older kids but does not punish the younger?
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
This may help you:
http://sandradodd.com/schoolchoice
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
http://sandradodd.com/schoolchoice
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
lylaw
do they have to go to school or want to? what would happen if they said they didn’t want to? do they feel free to say they want to unschool too? what about skip a day here or there? there are unschooling teens who have chosen to go to school for some period of time, but that’s very different from mandated school for some but not all kids in a family. my son started unschooling (left school) about 6 months before my daughter. but if she had been ready to/wanted to come home sooner, that would have been ok. if the requirements are more external and their CHOICE (they are free to choose to be late, to skip school, to not do their home work, etc) then that’s really different from you mandating that they follow the requirements of a life that you are also mandating. does that make sense?
lyla
From: jennifer in IL
Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 8:41 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Different styles for diff kids?
Hi,
I mean that two go to school, they have to do homework, there are rules they have to follow, there are expectations that come from external sources. Then I have one with me all the time where he is more free - ie he doesn't have to get up at a certain time to get ready for school/bus/breakfast. Does that make sense? Clearly that is one example.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
lyla
From: jennifer in IL
Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 8:41 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Different styles for diff kids?
Hi,
I mean that two go to school, they have to do homework, there are rules they have to follow, there are expectations that come from external sources. Then I have one with me all the time where he is more free - ie he doesn't have to get up at a certain time to get ready for school/bus/breakfast. Does that make sense? Clearly that is one example.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Jennifer Schuelein
I would also like to know how you feel about giving your older 2 the option to homeschool. If they do want to still attend school, then that is their choice, but if they want to homeschool I would try it!
My son has autism and that is one reason why he has never gone to school. He tried pre-school at age 2 and that was the first and last school type experience he's ever had.
Be open and honest with the older kids. Have a conversation about their needs and desires. Ask them if the situation with their younger sibling bothers them. You might be worrying for little reason or they might have some issues that you need to work out.
I would try approaching parenting the older kids the same way you are parenting the younger child. You might open up an entirely new relationship with them! If the dichotomy of your parenting styles is bothering you then I would say, "Change it!"
Jennifer
My son has autism and that is one reason why he has never gone to school. He tried pre-school at age 2 and that was the first and last school type experience he's ever had.
Be open and honest with the older kids. Have a conversation about their needs and desires. Ask them if the situation with their younger sibling bothers them. You might be worrying for little reason or they might have some issues that you need to work out.
I would try approaching parenting the older kids the same way you are parenting the younger child. You might open up an entirely new relationship with them! If the dichotomy of your parenting styles is bothering you then I would say, "Change it!"
Jennifer
--- In [email protected], "jennifer in IL" <jennifer@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I have been reading for a while now and so appreciate this list. I wonder if I am alone in this type of situation....I have 3 kids, 2 "neuro typical" in public school who thrive there. Never thought of homeschooling them, let alone unschooling them. I parent them pretty typically - though I feel we have more of a partnership in more ways than I see my friends or neighbors have who are more authoritative with their kids.
>
> Enter my 3rd child with special needs. Life is hard enough for him, let alone school. He made it to his 6th day of 1st grade when I pulled him out and decided to homeschool him. I NEVER thought I would homeschool! This was not something I had a calling for but it was just clear he couldn't cut it in a cookie cutter system like public school.
>
> Over the last 2 years I have relaxed quite a bit with him. I used to just recreate school in my living room and that was pretty miserable. So we did more unit studies, which we still like to do, but then I found unschooling/whole life learning/etc.... It seemed like the more I read, the more it made sense especially for my youngest.
>
> Here is my rub - it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules." I am sure logically they get why I do this with him, but they are teens and aren't always so understanding.
>
> I'd love any ideas/thoughts on this.
>
wtexans
===they are teens and aren't always so understanding===
That's a derogatory remark. You're saying *because* they're teens, they're not always so understanding.
Regardless of age, if they're being parented differently than their youngest sibling -- he's being given more freedom with how his days are spent & he's being parented in a more relaxed manner -- it'd be challenging to *want* to be understanding of why he has those options and they don't.
===I have 3 kids, 2 "neuro typical" in public school who thrive there===
I looked up "neurotypical" on wikipedia and found that it refers to "people who are not on the autism spectrum".
On an autism-related list, it might be helpful to define kids in that way, but this isn't such a list. It'd be helpful on this list to not use terms that aren't relevant to unschooling.
===it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules."===
What about the here and now, the short run? There's no guarantee the two children in school will have a long enough life to qualify as "the long run".
Why can't those two children have the same opportunities and freedoms that your youngest child has? Today, right now?
If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?
===So we did more unit studies, which we still like to do===
By "we", does that mean if you never brought up the idea of unit studies again, your youngest son would still ask to do them?
Unit studies is not unschooling. "Unit studies" is school terminology, and it's hard to unschool if you're still thinking in school terminology.
Glenda
That's a derogatory remark. You're saying *because* they're teens, they're not always so understanding.
Regardless of age, if they're being parented differently than their youngest sibling -- he's being given more freedom with how his days are spent & he's being parented in a more relaxed manner -- it'd be challenging to *want* to be understanding of why he has those options and they don't.
===I have 3 kids, 2 "neuro typical" in public school who thrive there===
I looked up "neurotypical" on wikipedia and found that it refers to "people who are not on the autism spectrum".
On an autism-related list, it might be helpful to define kids in that way, but this isn't such a list. It'd be helpful on this list to not use terms that aren't relevant to unschooling.
===it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules."===
What about the here and now, the short run? There's no guarantee the two children in school will have a long enough life to qualify as "the long run".
Why can't those two children have the same opportunities and freedoms that your youngest child has? Today, right now?
If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?
===So we did more unit studies, which we still like to do===
By "we", does that mean if you never brought up the idea of unit studies again, your youngest son would still ask to do them?
Unit studies is not unschooling. "Unit studies" is school terminology, and it's hard to unschool if you're still thinking in school terminology.
Glenda
Joyce Fetteroll
On Feb 27, 2011, at 10:01 PM, jennifer in IL wrote:
it will damage the relationship between you and them and perhaps
between them and him.
and he isn't their son. They have needs that they look to you to meet.
If they *feel* you aren't meeting them, if they *feel* their needs are
being put in second place to his (or yours), then they're going to
resent that. Even if they understand why he needs more from you, if
they feel that their time, their resources are being taken and
channeled to him, they're understanding a very different situation
than what you are.
If you feel the need to be the school's advocate to get them to do
what they "need" to do, The Parent/Teen Breakthrough: The Relationship
Approach by Mira Kirshenbaum will be a big help.
http://tinyurl.com/23rhfms
It's like the bible of parenting teens. It will help you see where you
may be inadvertently damaging the relationship for what you feel are
sensible reasons.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Here is my rub - it seems like I am two different parents and I'mIf they feel you are less giving and more controling with them, then
> not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big
> kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules."
it will damage the relationship between you and them and perhaps
between them and him.
> I am sure logically they get why I do this with him, but they areThey can't have the same understanding as you because they aren't you
> teens and aren't always so understanding.
and he isn't their son. They have needs that they look to you to meet.
If they *feel* you aren't meeting them, if they *feel* their needs are
being put in second place to his (or yours), then they're going to
resent that. Even if they understand why he needs more from you, if
they feel that their time, their resources are being taken and
channeled to him, they're understanding a very different situation
than what you are.
If you feel the need to be the school's advocate to get them to do
what they "need" to do, The Parent/Teen Breakthrough: The Relationship
Approach by Mira Kirshenbaum will be a big help.
http://tinyurl.com/23rhfms
It's like the bible of parenting teens. It will help you see where you
may be inadvertently damaging the relationship for what you feel are
sensible reasons.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joyce Fetteroll
On Feb 28, 2011, at 7:34 AM, Joyce Fetteroll wrote:
If they feel that their time *from you*, the resources they need *from
you* are being channeled to him ...
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> ifSorry, not clear.
> they feel that their time, their resources are being taken and
> channeled to him
If they feel that their time *from you*, the resources they need *from
you* are being channeled to him ...
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-===they are teens and aren't always so understanding===
-=-That's a derogatory remark. You're saying *because* they're teens, they're not always so understanding. -=-
It's derogatory, but if they've been schooled according to the default plan in this culture, they are probably also on the default curve as teens, and are very likely not very understanding about family life. They might know tons about the politics within their high school, but very little about their own mother's feelings.
Part of what school does is break bonds between and among family members. It's a "we're your family now" gang feeling sometimes, and it's a rare school student who doesn't feel some of that even if it's not stated.
Unschoolers (of the sort of unschooling discussed on this list) can forget how different their lives would have been had their children gone to school.
I don't see that this follows at all:
-=-If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?-=-
Thriving in school could make it MORE irritating. If they love school it could be for lots of good reasons. And they might love school. If that involves doing and being the way their parents told them was good, then they could easily resent the parents taking back the reward-based behavior before they finish the project. If the love of school involves loyalty to the entity, environment and other students, and they don't feel their mom is a strong partner, then the loss of even more of her time and attention would definitely be an irritant.
I have vivid emotional memories of my childhood. I wasn't thrilled when I was seven and my parents took in a cousin 8 months older than I am, and later her sister who was two years younger (and a year older than my only younger sister, which made her #4 of 4, rather than #2 of 2). My mom felt she was doing a great thing. My dad had hoped it would be temporary.
I remember the feelings I had when I waited until I was ten years old to get a bicycle, and my sister (who couldn't even ride one) got one at the same time.
Some parents might not have those kinds of memories. When that's the case, it might be better for them to hold off on some sorts of advice or analysis of what families and teens and kids might/should feel. Unschooling doesn't even always transform the relationships within a family, when the kids are older. It doesn't even BEGIN to transform relationships outside of unschooling.
-=-By "we", does that mean if you never brought up the idea of unit studies again, your youngest son would still ask to do them?
-=-Unit studies is not unschooling. "Unit studies" is school terminology-=-
It's a very common sort of "relaxed homeschooling" concept, unit studies. And if a family has always done unit studies, the child WOULD certainly ask for them, or think he wasn't learning.
When children are told that this or that is done because that's how learning works, because learning is important, because the child must do that to be successful, then it's evidence of a good relationship between parent and child that the child internalizes that. It does take a while for that conditioning to be overcome, which is what deschooling is about.
http://sandradodd.com/deschooling
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-=-That's a derogatory remark. You're saying *because* they're teens, they're not always so understanding. -=-
It's derogatory, but if they've been schooled according to the default plan in this culture, they are probably also on the default curve as teens, and are very likely not very understanding about family life. They might know tons about the politics within their high school, but very little about their own mother's feelings.
Part of what school does is break bonds between and among family members. It's a "we're your family now" gang feeling sometimes, and it's a rare school student who doesn't feel some of that even if it's not stated.
Unschoolers (of the sort of unschooling discussed on this list) can forget how different their lives would have been had their children gone to school.
I don't see that this follows at all:
-=-If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?-=-
Thriving in school could make it MORE irritating. If they love school it could be for lots of good reasons. And they might love school. If that involves doing and being the way their parents told them was good, then they could easily resent the parents taking back the reward-based behavior before they finish the project. If the love of school involves loyalty to the entity, environment and other students, and they don't feel their mom is a strong partner, then the loss of even more of her time and attention would definitely be an irritant.
I have vivid emotional memories of my childhood. I wasn't thrilled when I was seven and my parents took in a cousin 8 months older than I am, and later her sister who was two years younger (and a year older than my only younger sister, which made her #4 of 4, rather than #2 of 2). My mom felt she was doing a great thing. My dad had hoped it would be temporary.
I remember the feelings I had when I waited until I was ten years old to get a bicycle, and my sister (who couldn't even ride one) got one at the same time.
Some parents might not have those kinds of memories. When that's the case, it might be better for them to hold off on some sorts of advice or analysis of what families and teens and kids might/should feel. Unschooling doesn't even always transform the relationships within a family, when the kids are older. It doesn't even BEGIN to transform relationships outside of unschooling.
-=-By "we", does that mean if you never brought up the idea of unit studies again, your youngest son would still ask to do them?
-=-Unit studies is not unschooling. "Unit studies" is school terminology-=-
It's a very common sort of "relaxed homeschooling" concept, unit studies. And if a family has always done unit studies, the child WOULD certainly ask for them, or think he wasn't learning.
When children are told that this or that is done because that's how learning works, because learning is important, because the child must do that to be successful, then it's evidence of a good relationship between parent and child that the child internalizes that. It does take a while for that conditioning to be overcome, which is what deschooling is about.
http://sandradodd.com/deschooling
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jennifer in IL
Thanks all for your responses. I do believe I may not be on the best list for me at the moment. Sorry to have stirred the pot with my question.
--- In [email protected], "wtexans" <wtexans@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> ===they are teens and aren't always so understanding===
>
> That's a derogatory remark. You're saying *because* they're teens, they're not always so understanding.
>
> Regardless of age, if they're being parented differently than their youngest sibling -- he's being given more freedom with how his days are spent & he's being parented in a more relaxed manner -- it'd be challenging to *want* to be understanding of why he has those options and they don't.
>
>
> ===I have 3 kids, 2 "neuro typical" in public school who thrive there===
>
> I looked up "neurotypical" on wikipedia and found that it refers to "people who are not on the autism spectrum".
>
> On an autism-related list, it might be helpful to define kids in that way, but this isn't such a list. It'd be helpful on this list to not use terms that aren't relevant to unschooling.
>
>
> ===it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their younger brother because he has "different rules."===
>
> What about the here and now, the short run? There's no guarantee the two children in school will have a long enough life to qualify as "the long run".
>
> Why can't those two children have the same opportunities and freedoms that your youngest child has? Today, right now?
>
> If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?
>
>
> ===So we did more unit studies, which we still like to do===
>
> By "we", does that mean if you never brought up the idea of unit studies again, your youngest son would still ask to do them?
>
> Unit studies is not unschooling. "Unit studies" is school terminology, and it's hard to unschool if you're still thinking in school terminology.
>
> Glenda
>
Jenny Cyphers
***Here is my rub - it seems like I am two different parents and I'm not sure if
that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their
younger brother because he has "different rules." I am sure logically they get
why I do this with him, but they are teens and aren't always so
understanding.***
Perhaps it might help to think about it in terms of, sometimes other members in
the family aren't understanding. It's possible the youngest doesn't entirely
understand his older siblings and it's possible that they don't understand him
either, with or without school in the mix. The school aspect is just one way in
which they are different with different experiences that they will view the
world.
Yesterday, my youngest, 9, wanted to have a conversation with my oldest, 16,
about something very specific. I had been kind of putting it off because my
youngest wasn't in the best mood and my oldest wasn't either. She insisted, so
I tried to navigate the conversation. Neither one of them were being
understanding of each other and the least understanding one was my oldest.
We took a break. I went and built a fort with my younger daughter, put on some
happy comedy with the aim to get in a better mood and mental place. I left my
older daughter with the idea that it would need to be discussed eventually
because the problem wasn't going to go away just because she was wishing it
would, that there was surely a solution to the problem being presented that
everyone could find peace with. I hugged her and then left to go build the
fort.
We did find a solution after everyone was calm, BUT the initial reaction was not
one of understanding and my kids are VERY good at being understanding,
especially my oldest who IS a teenager.
Perhaps it would be best to see that there is a problem, being that the kids may
feel that they are being treated differently, perhaps unfairly and that
resentment will build up. The best way that I know how to handle that is to
find a solution. If the assumption is that the kids want to each be treated
fairly and not feel resentment, then there will be things that work toward that
solution and things that work away from that.
Since 2 kids are in school, I'd say that the mom is the one who needs to find
ways to navigate this, perhaps with input from her kids, but the onus is
definitely on mom. It would help to know whether or not the kids in school are
there by choice or not. That makes a BIG difference.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
that is ok or not in the long run. I don't want my big kids to resent their
younger brother because he has "different rules." I am sure logically they get
why I do this with him, but they are teens and aren't always so
understanding.***
Perhaps it might help to think about it in terms of, sometimes other members in
the family aren't understanding. It's possible the youngest doesn't entirely
understand his older siblings and it's possible that they don't understand him
either, with or without school in the mix. The school aspect is just one way in
which they are different with different experiences that they will view the
world.
Yesterday, my youngest, 9, wanted to have a conversation with my oldest, 16,
about something very specific. I had been kind of putting it off because my
youngest wasn't in the best mood and my oldest wasn't either. She insisted, so
I tried to navigate the conversation. Neither one of them were being
understanding of each other and the least understanding one was my oldest.
We took a break. I went and built a fort with my younger daughter, put on some
happy comedy with the aim to get in a better mood and mental place. I left my
older daughter with the idea that it would need to be discussed eventually
because the problem wasn't going to go away just because she was wishing it
would, that there was surely a solution to the problem being presented that
everyone could find peace with. I hugged her and then left to go build the
fort.
We did find a solution after everyone was calm, BUT the initial reaction was not
one of understanding and my kids are VERY good at being understanding,
especially my oldest who IS a teenager.
Perhaps it would be best to see that there is a problem, being that the kids may
feel that they are being treated differently, perhaps unfairly and that
resentment will build up. The best way that I know how to handle that is to
find a solution. If the assumption is that the kids want to each be treated
fairly and not feel resentment, then there will be things that work toward that
solution and things that work away from that.
Since 2 kids are in school, I'd say that the mom is the one who needs to find
ways to navigate this, perhaps with input from her kids, but the onus is
definitely on mom. It would help to know whether or not the kids in school are
there by choice or not. That makes a BIG difference.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wtexans
===Unschoolers (of the sort of unschooling discussed on this list) can forget how different their lives would have been had their children gone to school.===
My stepson attended public school through 12th grade, other than a six-month period when he lived with us and we homeschooled (he was 13; our youngest son was 2).
His experiences with public school were very front-and-center in our lives from grade school until graduation and were a huge catalyst in our decision to homeschool (and later, unschool) our youngest son.
===Unschooling doesn't even always transform the relationships within a family, when the kids are older.===
But aspects of unschooling can be brought into the relationships with the older kids who are attending school. There's no way to know if or how those relationships can be transformed if the effort isn't made.
As we moved into unschooling with our youngest son, we applied aspects of unschooling to our relationship with my stepson. It certainly wasn't the same kind of result that I imagine we'd have had if he'd been unschooled, but he was aware of the changes, we talked about the changes, and they did have a positive impact on his relationship with both my husband and me (which was very important through some turbulent times in my stepson's late teens / early 20's).
===It's a very common sort of "relaxed homeschooling" concept, unit studies. And if a family has always done unit studies, the child WOULD certainly ask for them, or think he wasn't learning.===
I think it depends on the child. We did a very loose form of unit studies when my stepson was living with us, and he'd done more structured unit studies in school up until that point, but when I could tell he wasn't enjoying the unit studies we dropped them and he didn't ask for them.
That's why I was questioning the original poster's use of "we" re: unit studies. Did the "we" in "we like unit studies" truly include her son, or would he be happy to never do a unit study again? I do think it's very possible for a child to not be interested in doing unit studies again if their parents never encouraged / suggested doing them again!
===Glenda said: If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?
Sandra said: I don't see that this follows at all===
To me, growing and flourishing in school ("thriving") happens when a child enjoys being there -- it's an interesting and happy place for them. If they're happy there, thriving there, a sibling not being in school, not having that experience, isn't cause for resentment. That's how my brain got to, "if you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you sure they're thriving in public school?".
BUT, I do understand what you (Sandra) are talking about in the following:
===Thriving in school could make it MORE irritating. If they love school it could be for lots of good reasons. And they might love school. If that involves doing and being the way their parents told them was good, then they could easily resent the parents taking back the reward-based behavior before they finish the project. If the love of school involves loyalty to the entity, environment and other students, and they don't feel their mom is a strong partner, then the loss of even more of her time and attention would definitely be an irritant.===
That's not an aspect I had thought of.
===I have vivid emotional memories of my childhood. <snip> Some parents might not have those kinds of memories. When that's the case, it might be better for them to hold off on some sorts of advice or analysis of what families and teens and kids might/should feel.===
I, too, have vivid emotional memories of my childhood, of resentments I felt towards my younger brothers, and towards my parents, because of choices my parents made.
And, since becoming a mom myself, I've kept those resentments in mind in my interactions with my stepson, and I've been a better stepmom because of that.
I understand now that my first reply to the original post was too harsh, and for that I apologize (and I apologized off-list to the original poster, because she'd left the list before I drafted this post). I appreciate Sandra teasing out some parts of my reply, because that helped me be more thoughtful about both the original post and my first reply.
Glenda
My stepson attended public school through 12th grade, other than a six-month period when he lived with us and we homeschooled (he was 13; our youngest son was 2).
His experiences with public school were very front-and-center in our lives from grade school until graduation and were a huge catalyst in our decision to homeschool (and later, unschool) our youngest son.
===Unschooling doesn't even always transform the relationships within a family, when the kids are older.===
But aspects of unschooling can be brought into the relationships with the older kids who are attending school. There's no way to know if or how those relationships can be transformed if the effort isn't made.
As we moved into unschooling with our youngest son, we applied aspects of unschooling to our relationship with my stepson. It certainly wasn't the same kind of result that I imagine we'd have had if he'd been unschooled, but he was aware of the changes, we talked about the changes, and they did have a positive impact on his relationship with both my husband and me (which was very important through some turbulent times in my stepson's late teens / early 20's).
===It's a very common sort of "relaxed homeschooling" concept, unit studies. And if a family has always done unit studies, the child WOULD certainly ask for them, or think he wasn't learning.===
I think it depends on the child. We did a very loose form of unit studies when my stepson was living with us, and he'd done more structured unit studies in school up until that point, but when I could tell he wasn't enjoying the unit studies we dropped them and he didn't ask for them.
That's why I was questioning the original poster's use of "we" re: unit studies. Did the "we" in "we like unit studies" truly include her son, or would he be happy to never do a unit study again? I do think it's very possible for a child to not be interested in doing unit studies again if their parents never encouraged / suggested doing them again!
===Glenda said: If you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you *sure* they're "thriving" in public school?
Sandra said: I don't see that this follows at all===
To me, growing and flourishing in school ("thriving") happens when a child enjoys being there -- it's an interesting and happy place for them. If they're happy there, thriving there, a sibling not being in school, not having that experience, isn't cause for resentment. That's how my brain got to, "if you have concerns the older kids might resent their younger brother, are you sure they're thriving in public school?".
BUT, I do understand what you (Sandra) are talking about in the following:
===Thriving in school could make it MORE irritating. If they love school it could be for lots of good reasons. And they might love school. If that involves doing and being the way their parents told them was good, then they could easily resent the parents taking back the reward-based behavior before they finish the project. If the love of school involves loyalty to the entity, environment and other students, and they don't feel their mom is a strong partner, then the loss of even more of her time and attention would definitely be an irritant.===
That's not an aspect I had thought of.
===I have vivid emotional memories of my childhood. <snip> Some parents might not have those kinds of memories. When that's the case, it might be better for them to hold off on some sorts of advice or analysis of what families and teens and kids might/should feel.===
I, too, have vivid emotional memories of my childhood, of resentments I felt towards my younger brothers, and towards my parents, because of choices my parents made.
And, since becoming a mom myself, I've kept those resentments in mind in my interactions with my stepson, and I've been a better stepmom because of that.
I understand now that my first reply to the original post was too harsh, and for that I apologize (and I apologized off-list to the original poster, because she'd left the list before I drafted this post). I appreciate Sandra teasing out some parts of my reply, because that helped me be more thoughtful about both the original post and my first reply.
Glenda