guilt over saying no and what am I doing wrong?-re-breathless
flyingtwinsmom
In the breathless thread Joyce wrote
---
Kat brought home stories from the kids she met in high school art and math classes who resented being given the old BMW while Dad got the
new one. Those kids don't have parents snuggling with them watching
Spongebob and House, absorbing enough of the kids' favorite video
games (and playing some!) to know the importance of beating the Boss
that was plaguing them, supportively making a stop at a second
restaurant so no one has to eat food they don't like.
Joyce
____________
My girls have this attitude. It's not about everything, but it is about enough to drive me nuts. They have many of their own electronics, including laptops and IPods. They get to go away relatively often. We try to accommodate and offer as much as we can, and yet we still hear "but why can't we go to the beach? Our cousins get to." Never mind the fact that we have a Disney vacation planned for this fall. And this is just one example of which there are many.
I am still in the deschooling phase, but am I missing something here? I'm feeling like they just aren't appreciating things. And maybe they are still a bit young(10) to understand that they can't have everything, but I'm just clueless as to why my girls sound more like they think they are entitled to have everything than kids that are grateful. We have always tried our best to accommodate them, not just by giving them things but by doing what they want also. Lately, I feel like I've created monsters by this though because they just want more and more.
I guess I'm trying to work out what I could be doing wrong. I have always been at home with them. They have never been to school, but I was a "school at home" mom until recently. They have a 2 parent home where we spend as much time as possible with them, and yet they still feel they are lacking because of what others have. I'm not sure how I can move past my gut reaction of saying that they should be grateful for what they do have when they make me feel guilty because I can't give them something. And we are coming into some really tight financial times so my guilt and need to say no is going to increase tremendously. How can I successfully handle those times when I can't give them what they want?
---
Kat brought home stories from the kids she met in high school art and math classes who resented being given the old BMW while Dad got the
new one. Those kids don't have parents snuggling with them watching
Spongebob and House, absorbing enough of the kids' favorite video
games (and playing some!) to know the importance of beating the Boss
that was plaguing them, supportively making a stop at a second
restaurant so no one has to eat food they don't like.
Joyce
____________
My girls have this attitude. It's not about everything, but it is about enough to drive me nuts. They have many of their own electronics, including laptops and IPods. They get to go away relatively often. We try to accommodate and offer as much as we can, and yet we still hear "but why can't we go to the beach? Our cousins get to." Never mind the fact that we have a Disney vacation planned for this fall. And this is just one example of which there are many.
I am still in the deschooling phase, but am I missing something here? I'm feeling like they just aren't appreciating things. And maybe they are still a bit young(10) to understand that they can't have everything, but I'm just clueless as to why my girls sound more like they think they are entitled to have everything than kids that are grateful. We have always tried our best to accommodate them, not just by giving them things but by doing what they want also. Lately, I feel like I've created monsters by this though because they just want more and more.
I guess I'm trying to work out what I could be doing wrong. I have always been at home with them. They have never been to school, but I was a "school at home" mom until recently. They have a 2 parent home where we spend as much time as possible with them, and yet they still feel they are lacking because of what others have. I'm not sure how I can move past my gut reaction of saying that they should be grateful for what they do have when they make me feel guilty because I can't give them something. And we are coming into some really tight financial times so my guilt and need to say no is going to increase tremendously. How can I successfully handle those times when I can't give them what they want?
Pam Sorooshian
On 7/27/2010 12:49 PM, flyingtwinsmom wrote:
Sometimes what I see is that the kids don't feel like the parents are
being entirely honest about what is affordable and what isn't, so they
beg and whine and, sometimes, the parent "gives in" and gets it. This
reinforces the feeling that the parents are not being up front in the
first place.
Sometimes the parents are NOT really being honest - they are buying
stuff for themselves (even if it is for the whole family, it is the
stuff the parents want to buy for the family), while saying that they
can't afford what the kids want. Hypocrisy - which kids are super
sensitive to.
Sometimes the parents say no to something because the parent thinks of
what would have to be given up to get it and thinks it is not worth it.
But the kids don't experience that parental thought process (and
sometimes the parent isn't conscious of it, either), so it seems very
arbitrary to the kids. A solution to that is to not just say no, but to
say right out loud, "I think that to afford it we'd have to give up the
Disneyland vacation." NOT exaggerated - realistic. Don't say you could
give up the Disneyland vacation if you've already put down big deposits
or paid for nonrefundable airfare. Maybe you could have vegetarian meals
for a week to pay for it.
Lots of times kids handle these things better when give more options.
They're asking for a new videogame that costs $50. Think of what else
you're planning to spend $50 on, that you could give up, and let them
choose. I have heard my kids say to friends, "I could have gotten the X
but I thought about it chose the Y instead." They might still wish they
could have the X, but they come to terms with not having it when it wsa
their choice.
-pam
> they still feel they are lacking because of what others have.Do they? Have you asked them if they feel that way?
Sometimes what I see is that the kids don't feel like the parents are
being entirely honest about what is affordable and what isn't, so they
beg and whine and, sometimes, the parent "gives in" and gets it. This
reinforces the feeling that the parents are not being up front in the
first place.
Sometimes the parents are NOT really being honest - they are buying
stuff for themselves (even if it is for the whole family, it is the
stuff the parents want to buy for the family), while saying that they
can't afford what the kids want. Hypocrisy - which kids are super
sensitive to.
Sometimes the parents say no to something because the parent thinks of
what would have to be given up to get it and thinks it is not worth it.
But the kids don't experience that parental thought process (and
sometimes the parent isn't conscious of it, either), so it seems very
arbitrary to the kids. A solution to that is to not just say no, but to
say right out loud, "I think that to afford it we'd have to give up the
Disneyland vacation." NOT exaggerated - realistic. Don't say you could
give up the Disneyland vacation if you've already put down big deposits
or paid for nonrefundable airfare. Maybe you could have vegetarian meals
for a week to pay for it.
Lots of times kids handle these things better when give more options.
They're asking for a new videogame that costs $50. Think of what else
you're planning to spend $50 on, that you could give up, and let them
choose. I have heard my kids say to friends, "I could have gotten the X
but I thought about it chose the Y instead." They might still wish they
could have the X, but they come to terms with not having it when it wsa
their choice.
-pam
wtexans
===We try to accommodate and offer as much as we can, and yet we still hear "but why can't we go to the beach? Our cousins get to." Never mind the fact that we have a Disney vacation planned for this fall.===
Have you asked if they'd prefer to swap the Disney trip for a trip to the beach? Or could a trip to the beach be tacked on to the trip to Disney (the Disney part could be shortened, perhaps)?
Instead of it being "this OR that", brainstorm ways with them that it can maybe be "this AND that" if both trips really are important to them.
Get their input on why they want to go to the beach, what they want to do there. "I want to because they are" can be a knee-jerk reaction and the details haven't been thought about. Help them think about the details. Maybe they'll discover they really don't want to go to the beach after all; maybe they'll discover they do and then y'all can move forward from there.
This can be applied to any "I want" situation.
At 10, they're old enough to talk with about the family budget. Include them in financial discussions and decisions that affect the whole family. Help them be informed.
===Lately, I feel like I've created monsters by this though because they just want more and more.===
Do they get allowances? There have been great discussions recently on this list about allowances and also about "more", so maybe take a look-see through the archives. I know you said you're coming into tight financial times, but if it's possible to eek out a little money each week or month to give them to spend as they wish, that can create the feeling of "more".
What about going to yard sales and/or thrift stores?
Do they have any toys or collectibles they would like to sell on eBay or Craigslist to generate some income? My son has a big collection of Pokemon action figures and Pokemon cards that he's holding on to as a possible way to fund a big purchase in the future (plus he's simply not ready to part with them yet).
My son keeps an ongoing wish list of video games and game systems that he wants and he looks around online for prices and includes those, then when he gets his allowance (or this month when he received birthday money) he refers back to his wish list to figure out what he wants to get and what he's okay leaving on the list a while longer.
===I'm not sure how I can move past my gut reaction of saying that they should be grateful for what they do have when they make me feel guilty because I can't give them something.===
They are not *making* you feel guilty, that's a feeling you chose yourself.
When they want more, instead of feeling guilty about not being able to provide it right then, become their partner and brainstorm with them possible ways to make whatever it is happen. It still may not happen "right now", but working with them to figure out how it *can* happen is so much more positive than thinking "you should be grateful for what you do have" and feeling guilty.
Glenda
Have you asked if they'd prefer to swap the Disney trip for a trip to the beach? Or could a trip to the beach be tacked on to the trip to Disney (the Disney part could be shortened, perhaps)?
Instead of it being "this OR that", brainstorm ways with them that it can maybe be "this AND that" if both trips really are important to them.
Get their input on why they want to go to the beach, what they want to do there. "I want to because they are" can be a knee-jerk reaction and the details haven't been thought about. Help them think about the details. Maybe they'll discover they really don't want to go to the beach after all; maybe they'll discover they do and then y'all can move forward from there.
This can be applied to any "I want" situation.
At 10, they're old enough to talk with about the family budget. Include them in financial discussions and decisions that affect the whole family. Help them be informed.
===Lately, I feel like I've created monsters by this though because they just want more and more.===
Do they get allowances? There have been great discussions recently on this list about allowances and also about "more", so maybe take a look-see through the archives. I know you said you're coming into tight financial times, but if it's possible to eek out a little money each week or month to give them to spend as they wish, that can create the feeling of "more".
What about going to yard sales and/or thrift stores?
Do they have any toys or collectibles they would like to sell on eBay or Craigslist to generate some income? My son has a big collection of Pokemon action figures and Pokemon cards that he's holding on to as a possible way to fund a big purchase in the future (plus he's simply not ready to part with them yet).
My son keeps an ongoing wish list of video games and game systems that he wants and he looks around online for prices and includes those, then when he gets his allowance (or this month when he received birthday money) he refers back to his wish list to figure out what he wants to get and what he's okay leaving on the list a while longer.
===I'm not sure how I can move past my gut reaction of saying that they should be grateful for what they do have when they make me feel guilty because I can't give them something.===
They are not *making* you feel guilty, that's a feeling you chose yourself.
When they want more, instead of feeling guilty about not being able to provide it right then, become their partner and brainstorm with them possible ways to make whatever it is happen. It still may not happen "right now", but working with them to figure out how it *can* happen is so much more positive than thinking "you should be grateful for what you do have" and feeling guilty.
Glenda
plaidpanties666
"flyingtwinsmom" <flyingtwinsmom@...> wrote:
Compassion for their perspective. Parents can get bogged down thinking about all the things they give/do for kids and then expecting something in return - gratitude is the word that gets used, but there's more to it than that. Parents can get stuck wanting something "back" from kids in emotional terms without realizing it.
Are you feeling guilty because you wish you could do more? Give them more? It might help you be more clear about that wistfulness - just like your girls, you desire some things you can't have. Why aren't *you* grateful for what you *can* give them? That's not meant to be an attack, but a way for you to see how your own reaction is similar, in some ways, to your daughters'.
At some point, it would be a good idea to talk about that, but Not when you're feeling resentful towards them or they seem to be resentful towards you. Let it be something that comes up in conversation - watching tv or playing a game together, perhaps.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
>> I am still in the deschooling phase, but am I missing something here?*************
Compassion for their perspective. Parents can get bogged down thinking about all the things they give/do for kids and then expecting something in return - gratitude is the word that gets used, but there's more to it than that. Parents can get stuck wanting something "back" from kids in emotional terms without realizing it.
>>we still hear "but why can't we go to the beach? Our cousins get to."What do you say? Do you start explaining why not and then tallying up all the things they get instead? That's not a good way to build a relationship. If you were wishing your husband brought you flowers and he bought you a new coffee pot and tickets to a show, you might still wish for flowers - not because you don't appreciate what he's done, but because you have this other unmet desire. So be compassionate about those unmet desires your girls have. Commiserate over the fact that they aren't going to the beach. Ask them to tell you what would be wonderful and see if you can make some plans for the day when you *can* go. Maybe they'd rather re-arrange the plans that are already set up - but they could be really excited about what's coming up and *still* be disappointed, too. Its normal to have complex emotions and conflicting feelings sometimes.
>they make me feel guilty"Catch" yourself when you find you're thinking that. They don't "make" you feel anything. If guilt is a habit you have, then that's something for you to work on, but don't blame that on your kids.
Are you feeling guilty because you wish you could do more? Give them more? It might help you be more clear about that wistfulness - just like your girls, you desire some things you can't have. Why aren't *you* grateful for what you *can* give them? That's not meant to be an attack, but a way for you to see how your own reaction is similar, in some ways, to your daughters'.
At some point, it would be a good idea to talk about that, but Not when you're feeling resentful towards them or they seem to be resentful towards you. Let it be something that comes up in conversation - watching tv or playing a game together, perhaps.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
Pam Sorooshian
>Everyone wants more and more. That is basic human nature. You're
> ===Lately, I feel like I've created monsters by this though because
> they just want more and more.===
bothered by the fact that your kids are completely open about it, not
having learned to adjust their expectations to their means, yet. It
isn't considered "nice" for adults to express their desires for more and
more and more - it would be thought of as greedy and grasping and trying
to live too high, etc. But everybody has wants they can't satisfy. There
is not one single person on this list who couldn't name things they wish
they could have, but can't afford.
It is part of maturing to learn to be satisfied with what you can get
and not dissatisfied by what you can't get. Help them, over the next
few years, to be more appreciative of what they do have by being clearly
appreciative yourself, while not expecting them to be, yet. But also,
maybe be a bit more open about what you wish you had and how you're
happy, anyway, without it, and model being patient and not getting
things on a whim, but delaying your own gratification.
Your kids are still little - they don't have a lot of empathetic ability
yet - they don't read your mind. So they don't realize that you're
already trying to give them as much as possible - do not expect them to
be grateful for that at all. Gratitude does come, but you have some
years to go, probably, before it will be expressed to you. And even
then, our kids never really fully grasp how much they have to be
grateful for, as unschoolers, because it is the life they knew and they
can't really fully imagine living differently. Which is great - because
that's why they, themselves, will probably be even better parents to
their children than we were to them!
-pam
flyingtwinsmom
--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
==Sometimes the parents are NOT really being honest - they are buying
stuff for themselves (even if it is for the whole family, it is the
stuff the parents want to buy for the family), while saying that they can't afford what the kids want. Hypocrisy - which kids are super sensitive to.==
I'm guilty of this. I can remember one particular time when E wanted a glass diamond, just a few dollars, but I already had a buggy of stuff that I had chosen for them so I told her we couldn't afford it. She responded by telling me it wasn't fair that I could buy what I wanted when she couldn't get what she wanted. I had a knee-jerk reaction to that because everything that I had was for them. I'll have to watch myself better.
==Sometimes the parents say no to something because the parent thinks of
what would have to be given up to get it and thinks it is not worth it.
But the kids don't experience that parental thought process (and
sometimes the parent isn't conscious of it, either), so it seems very
arbitrary to the kids.==
I've tried to share more with them, but they are very sensitive and get easily overwhelmed and frightened so I try to be very careful about not giving them too much. I've been afraid to try this with them because I don't want them to worry too much. Has anyone found that it works that way, or has it worked just the opposite?
Bonni
>Shame on me, but I haven't. I have based this on what they say and how they act, but I have never asked them if they felt they were lacking.
> On 7/27/2010 12:49 PM, flyingtwinsmom wrote:
> > they still feel they are lacking because of what others have.
>
> Do they? Have you asked them if they feel that way?
==Sometimes the parents are NOT really being honest - they are buying
stuff for themselves (even if it is for the whole family, it is the
stuff the parents want to buy for the family), while saying that they can't afford what the kids want. Hypocrisy - which kids are super sensitive to.==
I'm guilty of this. I can remember one particular time when E wanted a glass diamond, just a few dollars, but I already had a buggy of stuff that I had chosen for them so I told her we couldn't afford it. She responded by telling me it wasn't fair that I could buy what I wanted when she couldn't get what she wanted. I had a knee-jerk reaction to that because everything that I had was for them. I'll have to watch myself better.
==Sometimes the parents say no to something because the parent thinks of
what would have to be given up to get it and thinks it is not worth it.
But the kids don't experience that parental thought process (and
sometimes the parent isn't conscious of it, either), so it seems very
arbitrary to the kids.==
I've tried to share more with them, but they are very sensitive and get easily overwhelmed and frightened so I try to be very careful about not giving them too much. I've been afraid to try this with them because I don't want them to worry too much. Has anyone found that it works that way, or has it worked just the opposite?
Bonni
flyingtwinsmom
--- In [email protected], "wtexans" <wtexans@...> wrote:
But that also comes back into play with giving them everything resulting in children always expecting everything. Won't that follow them all their lives? Part of me says that they can't go through life expecting to always get everything they want because they won't always get it, but the other part says that if they learn creative ways to do that now, they will find ways later. So am I spoiling (I know children don't spoil, but I'm picturing whiny give me, give me scene here.) them or training them to be creative?
Bonni
> Instead of it being "this OR that", brainstorm ways with them that it can maybe be "this AND that" if both trips really are important to them.I'm sure this applies to every situation so do you do this in the middle of the store while they want both things or how do you handle it? I'm not a calm shopper. I hate shopping unless by myself when I can take my time and not feel pressure. I am not always able to stop and brainstorm because I'm just not relaxed enough for any ideas to enter. I have found that the more tense I am feeling, the more I resort back to my old behaviors. Any thoughts on how to work through that so I can train myself to find ways to get them both?
But that also comes back into play with giving them everything resulting in children always expecting everything. Won't that follow them all their lives? Part of me says that they can't go through life expecting to always get everything they want because they won't always get it, but the other part says that if they learn creative ways to do that now, they will find ways later. So am I spoiling (I know children don't spoil, but I'm picturing whiny give me, give me scene here.) them or training them to be creative?
> Get their input on why they want to go to the beach, what they want to do there. "I want to because they are" can be a knee-jerk reaction and the details haven't been thought about. Help them think about the details. Maybe they'll discover they really don't want to go to the beach after all; maybe they'll discover they do and then y'all can move forward from there.How do you help children express these things? My dh is never any good at talking about what he thinks or feels. He just says "I don't know." and doesn't take it farther. This has caused a lot of problems for him in his personal life. He can't understand or express his own feelings. They have gotten this from him, and I need to work it out so they won't bury themselves.
>
> Do they get allowances? There have been great discussions recently on this list about allowances and also about "more", so maybe take a look-see through the archives. I know you said you're coming into tight financial times, but if it's possible to eek out a little money each week or month to give them to spend as they wish, that can create the feeling of "more".>I can manage to find some money, but that would mean giving up something else, ie a trip to DQ for them. I have tried giving them some money each week, but they always want me to buy them things too. So how do you figure out what their money should be used for versus what you can still get for them?
> They are not *making* you feel guilty, that's a feeling you chose yourself.>I don't feel like I'm choosing it myself, although I know you are right, so how do I work past that? Is it something that I just set in my mind saying that I know I'm doing the best I can so I refuse to feel bad about it?
Bonni
Sandra Dodd
-=-I'm sure this applies to every situation so do you do this in the
middle of the store while they want both things or how do you handle
it? I'm not a calm shopper. I hate shopping unless by myself when I
can take my time and not feel pressure. I am not always able to stop
and brainstorm because I'm just not relaxed enough for any ideas to
enter. I have found that the more tense I am feeling, the more I
resort back to my old behaviors. Any thoughts on how to work through
that so I can train myself to find ways to get them both? -=-
You've defined yourself in ways that will be hard to overcome. You've
set yourself in a spot with how you are and what you hate and what
your abilities are and aren't.
You're also asking for ideas. That's good. But you're asking for
ways to "train yourself." That sounds like hard work, and the very
thought of that leads you away from unschooling and not toward it.
The help you need is help to make a decision. One decision. Each
better decision makes the next one easier.
Before you even got to the store, though, you made decisions.
Before you even planned to go to the store, there were decisions.
Here's some reading that might help with all of that, and even with
getting through the frustration of someone examining the elements of
the thoughts you shared in a single paragraph. :-)
http://sandradodd.com/parentingpeacefully
http://sandradodd.com/choices
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
http://sandradodd.com/being
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
middle of the store while they want both things or how do you handle
it? I'm not a calm shopper. I hate shopping unless by myself when I
can take my time and not feel pressure. I am not always able to stop
and brainstorm because I'm just not relaxed enough for any ideas to
enter. I have found that the more tense I am feeling, the more I
resort back to my old behaviors. Any thoughts on how to work through
that so I can train myself to find ways to get them both? -=-
You've defined yourself in ways that will be hard to overcome. You've
set yourself in a spot with how you are and what you hate and what
your abilities are and aren't.
You're also asking for ideas. That's good. But you're asking for
ways to "train yourself." That sounds like hard work, and the very
thought of that leads you away from unschooling and not toward it.
The help you need is help to make a decision. One decision. Each
better decision makes the next one easier.
Before you even got to the store, though, you made decisions.
Before you even planned to go to the store, there were decisions.
Here's some reading that might help with all of that, and even with
getting through the frustration of someone examining the elements of
the thoughts you shared in a single paragraph. :-)
http://sandradodd.com/parentingpeacefully
http://sandradodd.com/choices
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
http://sandradodd.com/being
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wtexans
===I'm not a calm shopper. I hate shopping unless by myself when I can take my time and not feel pressure. I am not always able to stop and brainstorm because I'm just not relaxed enough for any ideas to enter.===
Go shopping and browsing with them just for fun, at times other than when it "has" to be done. Give youself a couple hours to enjoy the outing without feeling pressured to be home by a certain time.
Be interested in the things they're looking at, rather than focusing on "not" and "hate" ("not a calm shopper", "hate shopping", "not relaxed enough"). When you find yourself feeling anxious, make the choice to stop that line of thought. Breathe. Bring the focus back to enjoying the time with your kids.
I usually do the grocery shopping by myself, but once in a while my son will go along and I find that if he's pacing around and/or asking "how many more things", I begin to feel stressed. Moreso if we're shopping when the aisles are busy. So I generally grocery shop later in the evening so Andrew can hang at home with my hubby. But if my hubby's out of town and Andrew and I need certain groceries during that time, I tend to opt for a less busy, smaller grocery store that requires less walking to get the things we want so we can be in and out quicker.
Talking before getting to the store about how much money is available to be spent is extremely helpful. Go to the areas of the store they're interested in first and allow them plenty of time to look around. Breathe, keep your focus on enjoying the time with them.
If they can't decide between two things and you *truly* can't afford to get both things, tell them they can hang onto the two things while you do your other shopping and then they'll need to decide which they want to get this time. Sometimes being put on the spot to make a decision ("hurry up, we have to go!") results in not being able to make a decision, so give them time and space to make a decision.
When you notice you're starting to feel anxious, stop right then and take a couple deep breaths and purposely shift your perspective. If that's not your usual way of being, it *will* take thought and effort. But it *does* come easier the longer you do it.
Glenda
Go shopping and browsing with them just for fun, at times other than when it "has" to be done. Give youself a couple hours to enjoy the outing without feeling pressured to be home by a certain time.
Be interested in the things they're looking at, rather than focusing on "not" and "hate" ("not a calm shopper", "hate shopping", "not relaxed enough"). When you find yourself feeling anxious, make the choice to stop that line of thought. Breathe. Bring the focus back to enjoying the time with your kids.
I usually do the grocery shopping by myself, but once in a while my son will go along and I find that if he's pacing around and/or asking "how many more things", I begin to feel stressed. Moreso if we're shopping when the aisles are busy. So I generally grocery shop later in the evening so Andrew can hang at home with my hubby. But if my hubby's out of town and Andrew and I need certain groceries during that time, I tend to opt for a less busy, smaller grocery store that requires less walking to get the things we want so we can be in and out quicker.
Talking before getting to the store about how much money is available to be spent is extremely helpful. Go to the areas of the store they're interested in first and allow them plenty of time to look around. Breathe, keep your focus on enjoying the time with them.
If they can't decide between two things and you *truly* can't afford to get both things, tell them they can hang onto the two things while you do your other shopping and then they'll need to decide which they want to get this time. Sometimes being put on the spot to make a decision ("hurry up, we have to go!") results in not being able to make a decision, so give them time and space to make a decision.
When you notice you're starting to feel anxious, stop right then and take a couple deep breaths and purposely shift your perspective. If that's not your usual way of being, it *will* take thought and effort. But it *does* come easier the longer you do it.
Glenda
plaidpanties666
"flyingtwinsmom" <flyingtwinsmom@...> wrote:
This is when having a clear budget can make a big difference - clear to the kids, I mean. If they don't know how far the budget will stretch they'll keep asking and asking, trying to make sense of something that's vague and fluid.
A list can help, with costs of things broken down, so that you can show them where money is going and all of you brainstorm together - its not just *you* figuring it out, its a group endeavor. Maybe you can get a cheaper brand of this, a little less of that in order to come up with the "extra" money for something. If its just you doing the figuring, that can seem even more vague and arbitrary - they need to see the "thinking process" as it were, how the decision gets made, and be part of that process, too.
What is it you hate? Take some time to think about that and see if its something you can modify. For example, I used to hate spending a loooooong time in a store because I'd get hungry and my patience would wane. So I started bringing snacks and drinks for myself. I'd be sure to wear comfortable shoes and clothes, even sit down now and then if my kid needed some extra time to look around. I'd *plan* for long trips the way I'd plan for an outting to a playground - something I was doing for my kids, so I wanted to be comfortable and happy For Them, to help them have a good time and get their needs met. Your girls need to learn about finances and shopping - if you've been blasting through shops with them, you're doing the equivalent of hussling them around the playground and then away before they've had a chance to know what they want to do.
Realistically, its not possible to give them Everything. Even with all the money in the world, you can't give them the power to be in two places at once, a trip to Saturn, or 28 hour days ;) There will always be limits and disapointments in life. What you Can give them is help seeing limits and disappointments as problems to solve. That's really valuable!
Do you know the expression "When life hands you lemons, make lemonade?" Show them how to make lemonade, as it were, by looking at problems as opportunities. You can't afford this one thing? What are some other options? What is it you like about the thing? Can you save up for it? Reallocate finances? Borrow? Trade? Get it used? Split the cost with a friend and share it?
"Show them" doesn't go far enough, bring them into the process. Ask their help coming up with ideas - at first they won't have many, maybe none at all because they're not used to the process. That's okay, you're not used to it, either. Y'all can learn together. See this as somthing You're learning, too. You won't "get it right" all the time, but you can also appologise when you don't, say "I don't have a good solution, right now, I'm sorry!" Let them know you're not happy with your lack of imagination in the moment, either, that you wish you could do more, and then try again next time.
If asking questions doesn't help, then don't ask for now. Offer suggestions, offer commiseration, tell stories of times you've been disappointed. Or offer a shoulder, a hug, and don't say much of anything - that's a personality thing, you may have to experiment a little and see what works for each of your kids. Some people respond well to having their words echoed back at them "You want to go to the beach, you really want to go" - and will take that as an opportunity to say more, but others will find it annoying, or will just say "Yes" and nothing more, so you'd need a different way of communicating with that person.
Rather than "refuse to feel bad" decide what you want to think/feel instead. One example might be to pick something you like about a person and think about that. So if one of your girls wants something and you can't figure out how to get/do it, when you notice you're feeling guilty activly looking for something nice about that daughter. It will take practice! You've had years for guilt to wear a deep groove in your habits and you'll need time to cut a new groove, as it were.
---Meredith
>> I'm sure this applies to every situation so do you do this in the middle of the store while they want both things or how do you handle it?***************
This is when having a clear budget can make a big difference - clear to the kids, I mean. If they don't know how far the budget will stretch they'll keep asking and asking, trying to make sense of something that's vague and fluid.
A list can help, with costs of things broken down, so that you can show them where money is going and all of you brainstorm together - its not just *you* figuring it out, its a group endeavor. Maybe you can get a cheaper brand of this, a little less of that in order to come up with the "extra" money for something. If its just you doing the figuring, that can seem even more vague and arbitrary - they need to see the "thinking process" as it were, how the decision gets made, and be part of that process, too.
>>I'm not a calm shopper. I hate shopping unless by myself when I can take my time and not feel pressure.***********
What is it you hate? Take some time to think about that and see if its something you can modify. For example, I used to hate spending a loooooong time in a store because I'd get hungry and my patience would wane. So I started bringing snacks and drinks for myself. I'd be sure to wear comfortable shoes and clothes, even sit down now and then if my kid needed some extra time to look around. I'd *plan* for long trips the way I'd plan for an outting to a playground - something I was doing for my kids, so I wanted to be comfortable and happy For Them, to help them have a good time and get their needs met. Your girls need to learn about finances and shopping - if you've been blasting through shops with them, you're doing the equivalent of hussling them around the playground and then away before they've had a chance to know what they want to do.
>>> But that also comes back into play with giving them everything resulting in children always expecting everything.***********
Realistically, its not possible to give them Everything. Even with all the money in the world, you can't give them the power to be in two places at once, a trip to Saturn, or 28 hour days ;) There will always be limits and disapointments in life. What you Can give them is help seeing limits and disappointments as problems to solve. That's really valuable!
Do you know the expression "When life hands you lemons, make lemonade?" Show them how to make lemonade, as it were, by looking at problems as opportunities. You can't afford this one thing? What are some other options? What is it you like about the thing? Can you save up for it? Reallocate finances? Borrow? Trade? Get it used? Split the cost with a friend and share it?
"Show them" doesn't go far enough, bring them into the process. Ask their help coming up with ideas - at first they won't have many, maybe none at all because they're not used to the process. That's okay, you're not used to it, either. Y'all can learn together. See this as somthing You're learning, too. You won't "get it right" all the time, but you can also appologise when you don't, say "I don't have a good solution, right now, I'm sorry!" Let them know you're not happy with your lack of imagination in the moment, either, that you wish you could do more, and then try again next time.
>>> How do you help children express these things? My dh is never any good at talking about what he thinks or feels. He just says "I don't know." and doesn't take it farther.**************
If asking questions doesn't help, then don't ask for now. Offer suggestions, offer commiseration, tell stories of times you've been disappointed. Or offer a shoulder, a hug, and don't say much of anything - that's a personality thing, you may have to experiment a little and see what works for each of your kids. Some people respond well to having their words echoed back at them "You want to go to the beach, you really want to go" - and will take that as an opportunity to say more, but others will find it annoying, or will just say "Yes" and nothing more, so you'd need a different way of communicating with that person.
>> Is it something that I just set in my mind saying that I know I'm doing the best I can so I refuse to feel bad about it?***************
Rather than "refuse to feel bad" decide what you want to think/feel instead. One example might be to pick something you like about a person and think about that. So if one of your girls wants something and you can't figure out how to get/do it, when you notice you're feeling guilty activly looking for something nice about that daughter. It will take practice! You've had years for guilt to wear a deep groove in your habits and you'll need time to cut a new groove, as it were.
---Meredith
Pam Sorooshian
On 7/28/2010 10:18 AM, wtexans wrote:
walks around a bookstore and ends up with 15 or 20 books piled in her
arms. My heart sometimes skips a beat when she walks up to me loaded
down with all those books and my first thought is sometimes, "Oh no,
she's going to want to BUY all those and be so disappointed when she
can't." But that's a left-over thought from when she was little and it
is instantly replaced, these days, by fascination with how she decides
which (if any) to actually buy. She piles them all on a table and picks
up one at a time and puts them into piles of "REALLY want right now,"
"Wish I could get now but can wait," and "I don't really want this one
that much compared to the others." So then she looks at the "REALLY want
right now" pile, which usually still has 5 or 6 books in it. And she
opens each one and thnks about it and kind of puts them in order of
priority. VERY often, she'll then pick up just the top one and say, "I'm
just going to get this one, for now." Sometimes she'll pick two. Very
very seldom will she choose more. She does a bit of moaning and
groaning and agonizing as she makes her choices - but I never am
involved unless she asks my opinion about a book. If she asks my
opinion, usually it is a comparison question - "Which one do you think I
should get?" And I'll often ask, "Well, which do you think you'd want to
read right away - like in the car on the way home?" Something like that,
to help her think about it.
She got a Nook a couple of weeks ago, and she's having no problem at all
with over-buying, which I can see could be very easy and tempting - with
the new technology. Instead, she's concentrated on downloading free
books - all the classics that she either already loves or those she's
never read. I think she's only actually purchased one or maybe two books.
When Rosie was little, we'd always right away get something to carry
around with her in the grocery store - a bag of beans or a bag of rice.
She called it her "baby" and pretended to nurse it and played happily
with it while I shopped. It was something she only did in the grocery
store - but it was something she looked forward to and really enjoyed.
She'd just leave it at the checkout counter when we were done and never
seemed to mind.
When I took all three girls with me to the grocery store - sometimes I'd
give them little challenges to do (this was based on "Grocery Cart Math"
a hands-on workbook for kids to do math activities in the grocery store
- but I just made them up). I'd say, "Find something that is sold in
liters," for example. Or "Find something that is sold as a 2fer"
(meaning 2 for a dollar or 2 for something). Or - find something sold in
both quarts and half gallons." Find something that is 25 cents per
ounce. And so on. I didn't make it a contest - I gave each of them
different ones and they'd usually help each other. When they were
older, the tasks were harder -- they would look at shelf price, the
container the stuff came in, the shelf label info, and the nutrition
info on the packages.
-pam
> If they can't decide between two things and you *truly* can't affordIt surprises me how helpful this is - but it is. Rosie, who is 19, now
> to get both things, tell them they can hang onto the two things while
> you do your other shopping and then they'll need to decide which they
> want to get this time. Sometimes being put on the spot to make a
> decision ("hurry up, we have to go!") results in not being able to
> make a decision, so give them time and space to make a decision.
walks around a bookstore and ends up with 15 or 20 books piled in her
arms. My heart sometimes skips a beat when she walks up to me loaded
down with all those books and my first thought is sometimes, "Oh no,
she's going to want to BUY all those and be so disappointed when she
can't." But that's a left-over thought from when she was little and it
is instantly replaced, these days, by fascination with how she decides
which (if any) to actually buy. She piles them all on a table and picks
up one at a time and puts them into piles of "REALLY want right now,"
"Wish I could get now but can wait," and "I don't really want this one
that much compared to the others." So then she looks at the "REALLY want
right now" pile, which usually still has 5 or 6 books in it. And she
opens each one and thnks about it and kind of puts them in order of
priority. VERY often, she'll then pick up just the top one and say, "I'm
just going to get this one, for now." Sometimes she'll pick two. Very
very seldom will she choose more. She does a bit of moaning and
groaning and agonizing as she makes her choices - but I never am
involved unless she asks my opinion about a book. If she asks my
opinion, usually it is a comparison question - "Which one do you think I
should get?" And I'll often ask, "Well, which do you think you'd want to
read right away - like in the car on the way home?" Something like that,
to help her think about it.
She got a Nook a couple of weeks ago, and she's having no problem at all
with over-buying, which I can see could be very easy and tempting - with
the new technology. Instead, she's concentrated on downloading free
books - all the classics that she either already loves or those she's
never read. I think she's only actually purchased one or maybe two books.
When Rosie was little, we'd always right away get something to carry
around with her in the grocery store - a bag of beans or a bag of rice.
She called it her "baby" and pretended to nurse it and played happily
with it while I shopped. It was something she only did in the grocery
store - but it was something she looked forward to and really enjoyed.
She'd just leave it at the checkout counter when we were done and never
seemed to mind.
When I took all three girls with me to the grocery store - sometimes I'd
give them little challenges to do (this was based on "Grocery Cart Math"
a hands-on workbook for kids to do math activities in the grocery store
- but I just made them up). I'd say, "Find something that is sold in
liters," for example. Or "Find something that is sold as a 2fer"
(meaning 2 for a dollar or 2 for something). Or - find something sold in
both quarts and half gallons." Find something that is 25 cents per
ounce. And so on. I didn't make it a contest - I gave each of them
different ones and they'd usually help each other. When they were
older, the tasks were harder -- they would look at shelf price, the
container the stuff came in, the shelf label info, and the nutrition
info on the packages.
-pam
Sandra Dodd
>>> How do you help children express these things? My dh is never anygood at talking about what he thinks or feels. He just says "I don't
know." and doesn't take it farther.
**************
Meredith wrote:
If asking questions doesn't help, then don't ask for now. Offer
suggestions, offer commiseration, tell stories of times you've been
disappointed. Or offer a shoulder, a hug, and don't say much of
anything - that's a personality thing, you may have to experiment a
little and see what works for each of your kids. Some people respond
well to having their words echoed back at them "You want to go to the
beach, you really want to go" - and will take that as an opportunity
to say more, but others will find it annoying, or will just say "Yes"
and nothing more, so you'd need a different way of communicating with
that person.
======
I like that, but wanted to add something else.
When I'm tired or pressured, I don't want to be the creative thinker
in the group. When I'm really hungry, I don't want someone to say
"SO! The six of us are all going out. Of all the restaurants in
Albuquerque, where do *you* want to go?" Sometimes I don't have the
ability to think that hard, and it would be a gift to me for my
husband or one of my kids to ask questions like "Chicken or pizza?"
My answer could be chicken, or pizza, or not those. But in a 20-
questions way, that narrows down the thinking really well. If pizza,
probably Dion's. Not near a high school if it's a game night. But I
don't want to be thinking all those factors if I have an imploding
headache and a need for food.
Maybe the thing to do is for someone to hand me a chunk of cheese or a
handful of almonds or cashews while we're all thinking about whereto
eat.
Sometimes "Do you want to wear the red shirt or the blue one?" is all
the choice-making the other person wants to handle right then. And
if "neither" is an acceptable option, it's more like 20 questions than
it is "limited options" or "false choices." I'm tired of people
suggesting that helping people make decisions needs to be always "What
do you want in the whole wide world?" Nobody has the whole wide world
at hand. Sometimes there are only two pairs of jeans clean and it's
time to go. Which one do you want to wear? Sometimes there are only
two restaurants and money is limited, and so then are the choices. As
the kids come to trust the parents, they will be more accepting of
"Sorry, can't."
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
>> Is it something that I just set in my mind saying that I know I'mdoing the best I can so I refuse to feel bad about it?-=-
Somewhere people are picking up a kind of self-soothing mantra about
knowing that they're doing the best they possibly can, and that their
children are doing the best they can.
Sheesh... way to lose the motivation to change. Way to call meanness
"best you could do," and not think about better.
So I don't think you should "set in your mind saying that you know
you're doing the best you can." I think you should decide what you'd
like to move toward, and make the majority of your steps in that
direction.
If I were going to walk to Santa Fe from Albuquerque, sometimes I
would take steps that weren't directly toward Santa Fe, to get around
obstacles, to take a better way up a mountain, to get into the shade,
to find a safe place to sleep. But just because all steps are not
compass-straight-toward-Santa Fe doesn't mean there aren't really
wrong-direction steps. Going the wrong direction right at the
beginning would be no help at all. Taking a long detour when I'm
almost out of food and water would be an irresponsible and grave
mistake.
I'm not going to walk to Santa Fe. That would be crazy.
Some people think unschooling crazy, but I did step gradually toward,
into and through that. Sometimes I stumbled. Sometimes I relaxed
into my own emotions in ways that weren't great for my family.
Sometimes I told myself it was the best I could do, but if it wasn't,
really, I DID feel bad about that, and that's how I chose not to
"choose" that action/emotion/behavior again.
If we're going to help our children learn to make good decisions and
to handle their own emotions in sociable and positive ways, we can't
be preaching any "I'm sure you're doing the best you can" when a big
kid is walloping a little kid.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wtexans
===But that also comes back into play with giving them everything resulting in children always expecting everything. Won't that follow them all their lives?
The reality is that many (most?) of us won't be able to give our children EVERYTHING they want.
If we say "yes" when we can, they'll understand that when we say "no" it's because we truly can't do or fund whatever request was made. For families who are deschooling, that's not going to happen overnight.
Be consistent in saying "yes" as often as possible -- not just about money stuff but also about other "can you" and "will you" requests. If you find yourself saying or thinking "no", stop and ask yourself "why not?".
Last night my son and I went to the video game store. He found something he wanted but we'd forgotten to take his gift card with us and there's not enough money in our checking account right now for me to have bought it for him. He asked if we could go home, get the g.c., and go back. My first answer was, "no, it's nearly dark out" (I don't like driving my unreliable car after dark when my hubby's out of town and my kiddo's aware of that). But I didn't like hearing the "no" come out of my mouth so I thought "why not?" and then told him, "if it's not raining hard, we can get the g.c. and come back tonight, but if it is raining hard I'd rather wait until tomorrow because driving in the dark AND rain is really stressful for me." It wasn't raining hard between the store and our house, so when we pulled into the driveway I asked if he wanted to grab his g.c. and go back to the store. He said no, that waiting til tomorrow (today) would be okay.
He knows that when I say I can't afford something, I really can't afford it. He knows "no" doesn't come out of my mouth often, and that when it does I will usually follow it with a "but". ("I'm not comfortable driving when it's dark *and* rainy, but I'll bring you back to the store after you wake up tomorrow.")
He doesn't expect EVERYTHING, but he *does* expect me to be honest with him, because I *have* been honest with him day after day, year after year.
The expectations he has of other people is they be honest and treat him kindly. At his birthday and Christmas, he expects gifts from certain family members because they've given him gifts every year, but he knows other family members don't send anything and so he doesn't expect anything from them. When he's ready to live on his own, he knows he'll be paying rent and utilities. He knows when he gets a job, he'll have certain duties that will have to be done in order to get a paycheck. So, no, having abundance doesn't equate to always expecting everything.
Glenda
The reality is that many (most?) of us won't be able to give our children EVERYTHING they want.
If we say "yes" when we can, they'll understand that when we say "no" it's because we truly can't do or fund whatever request was made. For families who are deschooling, that's not going to happen overnight.
Be consistent in saying "yes" as often as possible -- not just about money stuff but also about other "can you" and "will you" requests. If you find yourself saying or thinking "no", stop and ask yourself "why not?".
Last night my son and I went to the video game store. He found something he wanted but we'd forgotten to take his gift card with us and there's not enough money in our checking account right now for me to have bought it for him. He asked if we could go home, get the g.c., and go back. My first answer was, "no, it's nearly dark out" (I don't like driving my unreliable car after dark when my hubby's out of town and my kiddo's aware of that). But I didn't like hearing the "no" come out of my mouth so I thought "why not?" and then told him, "if it's not raining hard, we can get the g.c. and come back tonight, but if it is raining hard I'd rather wait until tomorrow because driving in the dark AND rain is really stressful for me." It wasn't raining hard between the store and our house, so when we pulled into the driveway I asked if he wanted to grab his g.c. and go back to the store. He said no, that waiting til tomorrow (today) would be okay.
He knows that when I say I can't afford something, I really can't afford it. He knows "no" doesn't come out of my mouth often, and that when it does I will usually follow it with a "but". ("I'm not comfortable driving when it's dark *and* rainy, but I'll bring you back to the store after you wake up tomorrow.")
He doesn't expect EVERYTHING, but he *does* expect me to be honest with him, because I *have* been honest with him day after day, year after year.
The expectations he has of other people is they be honest and treat him kindly. At his birthday and Christmas, he expects gifts from certain family members because they've given him gifts every year, but he knows other family members don't send anything and so he doesn't expect anything from them. When he's ready to live on his own, he knows he'll be paying rent and utilities. He knows when he gets a job, he'll have certain duties that will have to be done in order to get a paycheck. So, no, having abundance doesn't equate to always expecting everything.
Glenda
wtexans
===How do you help children express these things?===
Using the cousins' beach trip as an example: "What interests you about going to the beach?" and/or "What kinds of things would you like to do there?". Be sure the questions are asked in a friendly way, much as you'd phrase them to one of your friends.
If your kids aren't used to that kind of discussion, you may end up with an "I don't know", which could mean they haven't thought beyond "our cousins are doing something that sounds cool so we want to do it too" -or- it could mean they have thought about it but aren't used to having that kind of discussion.
Either way, you could encourage discussion by telling them what *you* like about the beach (if you've been) -- feeding the seagulls, finding seashells, building a sandcastle, burying your legs in the sand, body surfing, looking for hermit crabs, etc. If that sparks discussion, great! If it doesn't, let that be the end of the discussion and move on to something else. They'll have heard what you've said. When or if the request to go to the beach comes up again, ask what they'd like to do there -- see if they're more willing to go beyond "I don't know".
Sometimes "I don't know" means "I don't want to talk about it right now". That's where knowing your kids comes into play. I know that a certain tone of voice with "I don't know" means my son's open to discussion, and that another certain tone of voice means "I don't want to talk about it right now".
Glenda
Using the cousins' beach trip as an example: "What interests you about going to the beach?" and/or "What kinds of things would you like to do there?". Be sure the questions are asked in a friendly way, much as you'd phrase them to one of your friends.
If your kids aren't used to that kind of discussion, you may end up with an "I don't know", which could mean they haven't thought beyond "our cousins are doing something that sounds cool so we want to do it too" -or- it could mean they have thought about it but aren't used to having that kind of discussion.
Either way, you could encourage discussion by telling them what *you* like about the beach (if you've been) -- feeding the seagulls, finding seashells, building a sandcastle, burying your legs in the sand, body surfing, looking for hermit crabs, etc. If that sparks discussion, great! If it doesn't, let that be the end of the discussion and move on to something else. They'll have heard what you've said. When or if the request to go to the beach comes up again, ask what they'd like to do there -- see if they're more willing to go beyond "I don't know".
Sometimes "I don't know" means "I don't want to talk about it right now". That's where knowing your kids comes into play. I know that a certain tone of voice with "I don't know" means my son's open to discussion, and that another certain tone of voice means "I don't want to talk about it right now".
Glenda
Jenny Cyphers
***But that also comes back into play with giving them everything resulting in
children always expecting everything. Won't that follow them all their lives?
Part of me says that they can't go through life expecting to always get
everything they want because they won't always get it, but the other part says
that if they learn creative ways to do that now, they will find ways later. So
am I spoiling (I know children don't spoil, but I'm picturing whiny give me,
give me scene here.) them or training them to be creative?***
You shouldn't do either of those 2 things. The goal isn't to manipulate the
kids to behave a certain way. The goal is peace around a feeling of lack. I've
felt what it feels like to have no money for food. That's a big ugly feeling,
but in the middle of all that feeling you can still choose to see abundance. I
can go into my pantry and see what I DO have. I can see that I have rice and
milk, or running water and dishes and soap to clean them. Parents can be a
buffer for their kids for monetary lack, they really can.
What I DO have an abundance of is time. My kids get me, I can give them the
gift of me. In all the abundance that *I* have, with time and all my creative
resources, I can do things with and for my kids, things that they perhaps don't
think of on their own. With my wealth of knowledge, by being older and having
more ideas and experiences to draw from, I can share all that with my kids. I
CAN fill up a swimming pool, I CAN find things to play with in water. I CAN
make paper airplanes with scraps of paper and I CAN make bird feeders out of
recycled things with leftover birdseed.
I order for kids to feel and see abundance, they first must have parents who
feel and see it too, even IF there is no money. Go to parks, pick up sticks,
ride bikes to new places, swing on the swing differently, make bubbles and blow
them in front of a fan. Look at stars at night and try to find constellations,
light things on fire with magnifying glass, roast hot dogs for dinner (it's
cheap), the possibilities are limitless, but only if you choose to see them.
THAT is what will help your kids learn how to be creative thinkers, by seeing
and doing creative things.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
children always expecting everything. Won't that follow them all their lives?
Part of me says that they can't go through life expecting to always get
everything they want because they won't always get it, but the other part says
that if they learn creative ways to do that now, they will find ways later. So
am I spoiling (I know children don't spoil, but I'm picturing whiny give me,
give me scene here.) them or training them to be creative?***
You shouldn't do either of those 2 things. The goal isn't to manipulate the
kids to behave a certain way. The goal is peace around a feeling of lack. I've
felt what it feels like to have no money for food. That's a big ugly feeling,
but in the middle of all that feeling you can still choose to see abundance. I
can go into my pantry and see what I DO have. I can see that I have rice and
milk, or running water and dishes and soap to clean them. Parents can be a
buffer for their kids for monetary lack, they really can.
What I DO have an abundance of is time. My kids get me, I can give them the
gift of me. In all the abundance that *I* have, with time and all my creative
resources, I can do things with and for my kids, things that they perhaps don't
think of on their own. With my wealth of knowledge, by being older and having
more ideas and experiences to draw from, I can share all that with my kids. I
CAN fill up a swimming pool, I CAN find things to play with in water. I CAN
make paper airplanes with scraps of paper and I CAN make bird feeders out of
recycled things with leftover birdseed.
I order for kids to feel and see abundance, they first must have parents who
feel and see it too, even IF there is no money. Go to parks, pick up sticks,
ride bikes to new places, swing on the swing differently, make bubbles and blow
them in front of a fan. Look at stars at night and try to find constellations,
light things on fire with magnifying glass, roast hot dogs for dinner (it's
cheap), the possibilities are limitless, but only if you choose to see them.
THAT is what will help your kids learn how to be creative thinkers, by seeing
and doing creative things.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Jenny Cyphers
***Go shopping and browsing with them just for fun, at times other than when it
"has" to be done. Give youself a couple hours to enjoy the outing without
feeling pressured to be home by a certain time.***
That's a really old fashioned idea, one that's been around for a LONG time, it's
called window shopping! Window shopping can be very very fun and gratifying!
Go where you can actually look into windows. Malls are good for that, so are
downtown areas in small or large cities. Stores like Target or Walmart are no
good for window shopping, where you can see price tags and sale racks and
shelves, with a potential to pick up that needed gallon of milk and "well, I
guess we could get that $5 toy simply because it's on sale".
Then, IF you have $5, stop in and get an ice cream or a soda at a place you've
never been, or IF you see a store display that really catches your fancy, then
go in and explore. If the point is visual stimulation, and thinking and
exploring, then it can be done and it can be fun, and you don't need to spend
money at all. You can make a list of things that you see for potentially saving
money for, or for birthday presents. One of my favorite toys stores is downtown
and it's really big and has lots of really amazing stuff, but my favorite aspect
is that it has a huge section with $.10 and $.25 tubs of interesting things. A
kid could go to a place like that and literally spend hours there playing and
looking and STILL come home with something interesting that can fit in a pocket.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
"has" to be done. Give youself a couple hours to enjoy the outing without
feeling pressured to be home by a certain time.***
That's a really old fashioned idea, one that's been around for a LONG time, it's
called window shopping! Window shopping can be very very fun and gratifying!
Go where you can actually look into windows. Malls are good for that, so are
downtown areas in small or large cities. Stores like Target or Walmart are no
good for window shopping, where you can see price tags and sale racks and
shelves, with a potential to pick up that needed gallon of milk and "well, I
guess we could get that $5 toy simply because it's on sale".
Then, IF you have $5, stop in and get an ice cream or a soda at a place you've
never been, or IF you see a store display that really catches your fancy, then
go in and explore. If the point is visual stimulation, and thinking and
exploring, then it can be done and it can be fun, and you don't need to spend
money at all. You can make a list of things that you see for potentially saving
money for, or for birthday presents. One of my favorite toys stores is downtown
and it's really big and has lots of really amazing stuff, but my favorite aspect
is that it has a huge section with $.10 and $.25 tubs of interesting things. A
kid could go to a place like that and literally spend hours there playing and
looking and STILL come home with something interesting that can fit in a pocket.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
Gigi loves shopping and I have really had to let go of not liking to go shopping
and taking the time
to just look at stuff with her.
I also take her to toddler days at the local Goodwill when every toy and
children;s clothes ar 50 % off.
We have a budget but we fill the cart with everything she wants and them she
decides what she will keep.
She is 4 years old and can make decisions of what she would rather get at that
time.
I just drove 200 miles on Monday to go get a box of My Little Pony stuff for
her.
We have been having so much fun looking up names online and playing with all of
it.
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
and taking the time
to just look at stuff with her.
I also take her to toddler days at the local Goodwill when every toy and
children;s clothes ar 50 % off.
We have a budget but we fill the cart with everything she wants and them she
decides what she will keep.
She is 4 years old and can make decisions of what she would rather get at that
time.
I just drove 200 miles on Monday to go get a box of My Little Pony stuff for
her.
We have been having so much fun looking up names online and playing with all of
it.
Alex Polikowsky
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
plaidpanties666
"flyingtwinsmom" <flyingtwinsmom@...> wrote:
I treat it as a kind of puzzle - hmm, lets see, where in the budget can I find an extra five dollars? And then talk through my process. Morgan likes to look at things - looking at something helps her "see" what's going on, if you will, so I'll work my way down a list, or pick over items in the cart, naming prices and doing the math out loud. Maybe think of the process as something more like a treasure hunt - its not a scary reflection of your (lack of) buying power, but a game to find five more dollars in the shopping budget.
Shifting your own perspective can help your dds shift theirs, too. If you're reaction has been "OMG, there's not enough money, this is Terrible! I'm such a Bad Mommy!" (hopefully not that extreme) then its natural that your girls would be nervous and worry - but at the same time still Want things. As you learn to shift your way of thinking, they'll relax, too, and over time join in the problem solving in ways that work for them.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
> I've been afraid to try this with them because I don't want them to worry too much. Has anyone found that it works that way, or has it worked just the opposite?**************
I treat it as a kind of puzzle - hmm, lets see, where in the budget can I find an extra five dollars? And then talk through my process. Morgan likes to look at things - looking at something helps her "see" what's going on, if you will, so I'll work my way down a list, or pick over items in the cart, naming prices and doing the math out loud. Maybe think of the process as something more like a treasure hunt - its not a scary reflection of your (lack of) buying power, but a game to find five more dollars in the shopping budget.
Shifting your own perspective can help your dds shift theirs, too. If you're reaction has been "OMG, there's not enough money, this is Terrible! I'm such a Bad Mommy!" (hopefully not that extreme) then its natural that your girls would be nervous and worry - but at the same time still Want things. As you learn to shift your way of thinking, they'll relax, too, and over time join in the problem solving in ways that work for them.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
Sandra Dodd
-=-I've tried to share more with them, but they are very sensitive and
get easily overwhelmed and frightened so I try to be very careful
about not giving them too much. I've been afraid to try this with them
because I don't want them to worry too much. Has anyone found that it
works that way, or has it worked just the opposite?-=-
If "anyone" responded in the positive or the negative here, it
wouldn't be at all helpful.
That would be "support." As in "Keep doing what you're doing." Or
"Abandon what you're doing; I tried it and it didn't work."
The purpose of this list isn't to get one person to agree or disagree,
nor to take a vote. The purpose is to look at ideas and dissect them
under a bright unschooling light.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
get easily overwhelmed and frightened so I try to be very careful
about not giving them too much. I've been afraid to try this with them
because I don't want them to worry too much. Has anyone found that it
works that way, or has it worked just the opposite?-=-
If "anyone" responded in the positive or the negative here, it
wouldn't be at all helpful.
That would be "support." As in "Keep doing what you're doing." Or
"Abandon what you're doing; I tried it and it didn't work."
The purpose of this list isn't to get one person to agree or disagree,
nor to take a vote. The purpose is to look at ideas and dissect them
under a bright unschooling light.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wtexans
===I've tried to share more with them, but they are very sensitive and get easily overwhelmed and frightened so I try to be very careful about not giving them too much. I've been afraid to try this with them because I don't want them to worry too much.===
This goes back to what Jenny said about parents' reflecting a feeling of abundance in spite of how tight finances may be. If you are frightened about what's going to happen and how you will make ends meet, your kids are going to pick up on that. If you share information in an anxious or negative way, that will surely create feelings of worry on their part. If you can't currently share the details of your budget with them in a non-anxious way, don't share it with them until you can approach it from a "what we DO have" perspective.
My son definitely picks up on my worry. He knows our finances are tight right now, but he doesn't know that the emergency-surgery vet bill we incurred over the weekend means we're in the hole until payday next week -- him knowing that would stress him out unnecessarily. I can't go to the grocery store to buy some of the favorite foods of his we're out of right now, BUT I can (much as Jenny said) look at what's in the pantry and fridge and come up with some other meals he likes but doesn't have as often -- chocolate-chip pancakes or french toast, for example.
What I don't do is say "we can't afford that" and then turn around and buy something that is truly unnecessary. If we go into Hastings (video game/dvd/book store) and I say, "We can only spend $10," then I need to be sure I don't change that just because I find a magazine I want. If he wants to rent a game and I want a magazine and the two together are more than $10, I'll rent the game for him and get the magazine another time (or not). Or I'll forgo the magazine so we can each get a candy bar -- for us, a candy bar gives the feeling of abundance!
It helps to do comparison shopping with your kids. Maybe one day go to the grocery store when you only need to pick up a few things -- look with them at how much favorite snacks (chips, soda, frozen foods, etc.) cost and see what options you have to decrease those costs -- maybe buy a generic brand, maybe get the ingredients to make whatever it is from scratch (homemade potato chips!), maybe only buy certain things every other shopping trip. I know my son was astounded the first time he saw how much a family-size bag of chips costs ("and it's only half-full, Mom!!").
If we can afford to get a bag of chips OR a particular frozen pizza he likes, I let him make the choice. If we can't really afford either, he'll get a candy bar. Or I'll get the ingredients to make cookies or rice krispy treats. I find ways to keep things around that equate to "treats", for him *and* for my husband and I, because they create the feeling of abundance in our diet.
For a while we only had one car and when my husband would be working out of town for a week at a time, leaving Andrew and I without a mode of transportation while he was gone, I struggled with finding a feeling of abundance, especially during the summer when it was too stinkin' hot to be outdoors without wilting. We couldn't afford a second car, but we *could* afford a small above-ground pool so we saved up and bought one and my hubby got it all set up for us and showed me how to maintain it when he was out of town -- being able to stay cool outdoors in our own backyard in the dead of summer helped *me* get out of that "stuck" and "don't have" mindset.
If you know things are going to be tight in the near future, maybe you could start stashing away a small amount of money each payday as your "fun money" fund now for when you can no longer afford to stash money away. That could be ice-cream-truck money when you're at the park, or dollar-store or yard-sale money when all the current toys are stale, or the entrance fee to the local state park for a day trip, or movie-rental money, etc. I know Michael's and Target both have $1 clearance bins and I often pick up a handful of stuff out of those and stash them away for a rainy day.
Glenda
This goes back to what Jenny said about parents' reflecting a feeling of abundance in spite of how tight finances may be. If you are frightened about what's going to happen and how you will make ends meet, your kids are going to pick up on that. If you share information in an anxious or negative way, that will surely create feelings of worry on their part. If you can't currently share the details of your budget with them in a non-anxious way, don't share it with them until you can approach it from a "what we DO have" perspective.
My son definitely picks up on my worry. He knows our finances are tight right now, but he doesn't know that the emergency-surgery vet bill we incurred over the weekend means we're in the hole until payday next week -- him knowing that would stress him out unnecessarily. I can't go to the grocery store to buy some of the favorite foods of his we're out of right now, BUT I can (much as Jenny said) look at what's in the pantry and fridge and come up with some other meals he likes but doesn't have as often -- chocolate-chip pancakes or french toast, for example.
What I don't do is say "we can't afford that" and then turn around and buy something that is truly unnecessary. If we go into Hastings (video game/dvd/book store) and I say, "We can only spend $10," then I need to be sure I don't change that just because I find a magazine I want. If he wants to rent a game and I want a magazine and the two together are more than $10, I'll rent the game for him and get the magazine another time (or not). Or I'll forgo the magazine so we can each get a candy bar -- for us, a candy bar gives the feeling of abundance!
It helps to do comparison shopping with your kids. Maybe one day go to the grocery store when you only need to pick up a few things -- look with them at how much favorite snacks (chips, soda, frozen foods, etc.) cost and see what options you have to decrease those costs -- maybe buy a generic brand, maybe get the ingredients to make whatever it is from scratch (homemade potato chips!), maybe only buy certain things every other shopping trip. I know my son was astounded the first time he saw how much a family-size bag of chips costs ("and it's only half-full, Mom!!").
If we can afford to get a bag of chips OR a particular frozen pizza he likes, I let him make the choice. If we can't really afford either, he'll get a candy bar. Or I'll get the ingredients to make cookies or rice krispy treats. I find ways to keep things around that equate to "treats", for him *and* for my husband and I, because they create the feeling of abundance in our diet.
For a while we only had one car and when my husband would be working out of town for a week at a time, leaving Andrew and I without a mode of transportation while he was gone, I struggled with finding a feeling of abundance, especially during the summer when it was too stinkin' hot to be outdoors without wilting. We couldn't afford a second car, but we *could* afford a small above-ground pool so we saved up and bought one and my hubby got it all set up for us and showed me how to maintain it when he was out of town -- being able to stay cool outdoors in our own backyard in the dead of summer helped *me* get out of that "stuck" and "don't have" mindset.
If you know things are going to be tight in the near future, maybe you could start stashing away a small amount of money each payday as your "fun money" fund now for when you can no longer afford to stash money away. That could be ice-cream-truck money when you're at the park, or dollar-store or yard-sale money when all the current toys are stale, or the entrance fee to the local state park for a day trip, or movie-rental money, etc. I know Michael's and Target both have $1 clearance bins and I often pick up a handful of stuff out of those and stash them away for a rainy day.
Glenda
wtexans
===One of my favorite toys stores is downtown and it's really big and has lots of really amazing stuff, but my favorite aspect is that it has a huge section with $.10 and $.25 tubs of interesting things. A kid could go to a place like that and literally spend hours there playing and looking and STILL come home with something interesting that can fit in a pocket.===
That reminds me of when Andrew was younger and we'd often go to the mall to poke around. We'd look at everything in the little toy store there and then he'd end up asking for quarters for the quarter-toy machines right at the entrance/exit of the store! I try to always have a few quarters in my wallet for those machines or the gumball machine (it's preferable to have a back-up quarter or two for when a machine "eats" a quarter! we now avoid the machines at certain stores for that very reason).
Glenda
That reminds me of when Andrew was younger and we'd often go to the mall to poke around. We'd look at everything in the little toy store there and then he'd end up asking for quarters for the quarter-toy machines right at the entrance/exit of the store! I try to always have a few quarters in my wallet for those machines or the gumball machine (it's preferable to have a back-up quarter or two for when a machine "eats" a quarter! we now avoid the machines at certain stores for that very reason).
Glenda
otherstar
From: flyingtwinsmom
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 9:26 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: guilt over saying no and what am I doing wrong?-re-breathless
Why you are sharing information with them? What are your motivations? Do you have any expectations tied to sharing the information? Are you sharing information because you want them to feel like a partner? Are you sharing information with them so they will stop asking for stuff so that you can avoid saying no? If the purpose of giving them information is so they will stop asking, then you will be disappointed. Even though my husband and I know the budget and have all of the pieces of information, we will ask each other about getting something that isn't in the budget. Knowing the budget and being part of the process doesn't mean that I don't want stuff. It also doesn't take away the disappointment that I experience when the answer is no.
Also, the amount of information to share can be very situational. There are times when I feel like knowing more about something and then there are times when I don't want to be bothered with too much information. My girls are the same way. Sometimes giving more information helps and sometimes it is just annoying. Like Meredith says, it is a puzzle. There is no one size fits all answer because every family and every situation is different. Sometimes, the nicest thing that you can do is say no because the reasons behind the no are too overwhelming to try to share with a child.
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 9:26 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: guilt over saying no and what am I doing wrong?-re-breathless
>>>I've tried to share more with them, but they are very sensitive and get easily overwhelmed and frightened so I try to be very careful about not giving them too much. I've been afraid to try this with them because I don't want them to worry too much. Has anyone found that it works that way, or has it worked just the opposite?<<<It depends on your child's personality. I have one daughter that likes to be given lots information and one daughter that just wants a simple yes or no.
Why you are sharing information with them? What are your motivations? Do you have any expectations tied to sharing the information? Are you sharing information because you want them to feel like a partner? Are you sharing information with them so they will stop asking for stuff so that you can avoid saying no? If the purpose of giving them information is so they will stop asking, then you will be disappointed. Even though my husband and I know the budget and have all of the pieces of information, we will ask each other about getting something that isn't in the budget. Knowing the budget and being part of the process doesn't mean that I don't want stuff. It also doesn't take away the disappointment that I experience when the answer is no.
Also, the amount of information to share can be very situational. There are times when I feel like knowing more about something and then there are times when I don't want to be bothered with too much information. My girls are the same way. Sometimes giving more information helps and sometimes it is just annoying. Like Meredith says, it is a puzzle. There is no one size fits all answer because every family and every situation is different. Sometimes, the nicest thing that you can do is say no because the reasons behind the no are too overwhelming to try to share with a child.
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
otherstar
From: Jenny Cyphers
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 2:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: guilt over saying no and what am I doing wrong?-re-breathless
***Go shopping and browsing with them just for fun, at times other than when it
"has" to be done. Give youself a couple hours to enjoy the outing without
feeling pressured to be home by a certain time.***
That's a really old fashioned idea, one that's been around for a LONG time, it's
called window shopping! Window shopping can be very very fun and gratifying!
Go where you can actually look into windows.
**************
The Internet has added another element to window shopping. My girls and I will go on Amazon and do all kinds of shopping and searches. If we see something that we really like, we can put it on our wish list. If we find some extra money in the budget, we can all go to the wish list and pick something to order. When we are out window shopping, we have been known to make mental notes so that we can go home and put it on the Amazon wish list. Instead of saying no, we can say, "ooh, that is a cool toy (or whatever it is), let's put that on the wish list when we get home."
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 2:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: guilt over saying no and what am I doing wrong?-re-breathless
***Go shopping and browsing with them just for fun, at times other than when it
"has" to be done. Give youself a couple hours to enjoy the outing without
feeling pressured to be home by a certain time.***
That's a really old fashioned idea, one that's been around for a LONG time, it's
called window shopping! Window shopping can be very very fun and gratifying!
Go where you can actually look into windows.
**************
The Internet has added another element to window shopping. My girls and I will go on Amazon and do all kinds of shopping and searches. If we see something that we really like, we can put it on our wish list. If we find some extra money in the budget, we can all go to the wish list and pick something to order. When we are out window shopping, we have been known to make mental notes so that we can go home and put it on the Amazon wish list. Instead of saying no, we can say, "ooh, that is a cool toy (or whatever it is), let's put that on the wish list when we get home."
Connie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-Also, the amount of information to share can be very situational.
There are times when I feel like knowing more about something and then
there are times when I don't want to be bothered with too much
information. My girls are the same way. Sometimes giving more
information helps and sometimes it is just annoying. Like Meredith
says, it is a puzzle. There is no one size fits all answer because
every family and every situation is different. Sometimes, the nicest
thing that you can do is say no because the reasons behind the no are
too overwhelming to try to share with a child. -=-
Holly just got a new bed. New frame with headboard; new mattress.
It wasn't cheap, but she didn't buy the most expensive ones she saw,
either. Two shopping trips, lots of time to think and talk, and then
one more trip to find her first choice couldn't be had until
September, and her second choice (at another store) would take two
months to get in the light green of her first choice, but black was at
the warehouse. So it was delivered today and that's that. She knows
that's the big expense for her for quite a while. For me to say
"Let's wait because you just got that bed" to Holly would make total
sense.
Same house and money, different angle:
For me to say "But Holly just got a bed" to Marty, when he needed
money to get an oil change because he couldn't get the plug off his
girlfriend's car when he told her he would change it for her would've
been a WAY different situation. He was lying in the driveway with a
patio umbrella up against the front of the car because it started
raining. I loaned him my charge card to go get that done. He
doesn't expect us to spend $800 on him because Holly got a new bed,
but neither would it have been cool for me to have said "You can't get
this $30 oil change because of Holly's new bed."
When the kids were really little, we were poor. Kirby's toys were
mostly garage sale things or gifts. When Marty came along I sold
Discovery Toys so I could get nice toys cheap and free. We still have
most of those (games, construction sets, marble runs, toys...). But
years and years of being honest and generous, as others have mentioned
here, created an environment where the kids weren't desperate or
needy, and were willing to see one sibling get something really cool,
knowing they would have a turn, or that if they saw something they
really wanted, we would try to help them get it if we could.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
There are times when I feel like knowing more about something and then
there are times when I don't want to be bothered with too much
information. My girls are the same way. Sometimes giving more
information helps and sometimes it is just annoying. Like Meredith
says, it is a puzzle. There is no one size fits all answer because
every family and every situation is different. Sometimes, the nicest
thing that you can do is say no because the reasons behind the no are
too overwhelming to try to share with a child. -=-
Holly just got a new bed. New frame with headboard; new mattress.
It wasn't cheap, but she didn't buy the most expensive ones she saw,
either. Two shopping trips, lots of time to think and talk, and then
one more trip to find her first choice couldn't be had until
September, and her second choice (at another store) would take two
months to get in the light green of her first choice, but black was at
the warehouse. So it was delivered today and that's that. She knows
that's the big expense for her for quite a while. For me to say
"Let's wait because you just got that bed" to Holly would make total
sense.
Same house and money, different angle:
For me to say "But Holly just got a bed" to Marty, when he needed
money to get an oil change because he couldn't get the plug off his
girlfriend's car when he told her he would change it for her would've
been a WAY different situation. He was lying in the driveway with a
patio umbrella up against the front of the car because it started
raining. I loaned him my charge card to go get that done. He
doesn't expect us to spend $800 on him because Holly got a new bed,
but neither would it have been cool for me to have said "You can't get
this $30 oil change because of Holly's new bed."
When the kids were really little, we were poor. Kirby's toys were
mostly garage sale things or gifts. When Marty came along I sold
Discovery Toys so I could get nice toys cheap and free. We still have
most of those (games, construction sets, marble runs, toys...). But
years and years of being honest and generous, as others have mentioned
here, created an environment where the kids weren't desperate or
needy, and were willing to see one sibling get something really cool,
knowing they would have a turn, or that if they saw something they
really wanted, we would try to help them get it if we could.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
dola dasgupta-banerji
Hi,
Normally with me I have seen the feeling of guilt over many things generally
has nothing to do with others, but me. I too felt a lot of guilt with
similar issues that has been mentioned here. But when I did inner work I
always saw that I felt guilty for not sending them to school. The other
reactions just stemmed from that root.
Over the last two years I have progressively come out of it. I hope I am
making some sense here.
Dola from India (new Delhi)
Normally with me I have seen the feeling of guilt over many things generally
has nothing to do with others, but me. I too felt a lot of guilt with
similar issues that has been mentioned here. But when I did inner work I
always saw that I felt guilty for not sending them to school. The other
reactions just stemmed from that root.
Over the last two years I have progressively come out of it. I hope I am
making some sense here.
Dola from India (new Delhi)
On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 1:19 AM, flyingtwinsmom <flyingtwinsmom@...>wrote:
>
>
> In the breathless thread Joyce wrote
> ---
> Kat brought home stories from the kids she met in high school art and math
> classes who resented being given the old BMW while Dad got the
> new one. Those kids don't have parents snuggling with them watching
> Spongebob and House, absorbing enough of the kids' favorite video
> games (and playing some!) to know the importance of beating the Boss
> that was plaguing them, supportively making a stop at a second
> restaurant so no one has to eat food they don't like.
> Joyce
> ____________
> My girls have this attitude. It's not about everything, but it is about
> enough to drive me nuts. They have many of their own electronics, including
> laptops and IPods. They get to go away relatively often. We try to
> accommodate and offer as much as we can, and yet we still hear "but why
> can't we go to the beach? Our cousins get to." Never mind the fact that we
> have a Disney vacation planned for this fall. And this is just one example
> of which there are many.
>
> I am still in the deschooling phase, but am I missing something here? I'm
> feeling like they just aren't appreciating things. And maybe they are still
> a bit young(10) to understand that they can't have everything, but I'm just
> clueless as to why my girls sound more like they think they are entitled to
> have everything than kids that are grateful. We have always tried our best
> to accommodate them, not just by giving them things but by doing what they
> want also. Lately, I feel like I've created monsters by this though because
> they just want more and more.
>
> I guess I'm trying to work out what I could be doing wrong. I have always
> been at home with them. They have never been to school, but I was a "school
> at home" mom until recently. They have a 2 parent home where we spend as
> much time as possible with them, and yet they still feel they are lacking
> because of what others have. I'm not sure how I can move past my gut
> reaction of saying that they should be grateful for what they do have when
> they make me feel guilty because I can't give them something. And we are
> coming into some really tight financial times so my guilt and need to say no
> is going to increase tremendously. How can I successfully handle those times
> when I can't give them what they want?
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-But when I did inner work I
always saw that I felt guilty for not sending them to school. The other
reactions just stemmed from that root.-=-
Stepping away from expectations is scary.
The first couple of years we were homeschooling, when Kirby was
little, I had a couple of little nightmares--no details, just waking
up afraid, about maybe making the wrong decision, or a dream that we
were in trouble about it.
It's been a long time since I had fears, but I still remember them.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
always saw that I felt guilty for not sending them to school. The other
reactions just stemmed from that root.-=-
Stepping away from expectations is scary.
The first couple of years we were homeschooling, when Kirby was
little, I had a couple of little nightmares--no details, just waking
up afraid, about maybe making the wrong decision, or a dream that we
were in trouble about it.
It's been a long time since I had fears, but I still remember them.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
dola dasgupta-banerji
Hi,
I know exactly what you mean. Living a life which is out of the box and on
less trodden paths can always take toll on one. However I have been working
on feeling that as long as i do not consider anything that we are doing with
our lives as anti this and anti that, the fears also subside a lot.
I now like to trust that whatever we are doing is suitable for our familiy
and I do not look at others who continue to be in school. or at moms who
work and have high flying careers or kids who are "multifaceted". I simply
look at us and how we can keep it going on this path.
Dola
I know exactly what you mean. Living a life which is out of the box and on
less trodden paths can always take toll on one. However I have been working
on feeling that as long as i do not consider anything that we are doing with
our lives as anti this and anti that, the fears also subside a lot.
I now like to trust that whatever we are doing is suitable for our familiy
and I do not look at others who continue to be in school. or at moms who
work and have high flying careers or kids who are "multifaceted". I simply
look at us and how we can keep it going on this path.
Dola
On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 10:50 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
>
> -=-But when I did inner work I
>
> always saw that I felt guilty for not sending them to school. The other
> reactions just stemmed from that root.-=-
>
> Stepping away from expectations is scary.
>
> The first couple of years we were homeschooling, when Kirby was
> little, I had a couple of little nightmares--no details, just waking
> up afraid, about maybe making the wrong decision, or a dream that we
> were in trouble about it.
>
> It's been a long time since I had fears, but I still remember them.
>
>
> Sandra
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
smartymom5
> When you notice you're starting to feel anxious, stop right then andtake a couple deep breaths and purposely shift your perspective. If
that's not your usual way of being, it *will* take thought and effort.
But it *does* come easier the longer you do it.>
>I had an amazing experience with just this kind of thing last night. At
> Glenda
>
bedtime (which is about midnight in our family) I had just tucked in and
said goodnight to our two youngest (8 and 11 yo boys) and was climbing
into my own bed when I heard one of them calling me. My knee-jerk
reaction was a blast of annoyance - very typical of me in that
situation, exacerbated by the fact that I'd felt crummy all day and was
really looking forward to collapsing into bed. I huffed out an angry
breath, started to head back to their room and suddenly had a thought
from something I'd read here recently (or maybe on Sandra's website or
the RU Network): "First, breathe and center yourself." So I took a deep
breath, and as I inhaled I felt my whole being kind of slide into place
- it was weird, almost a tangible sensation - and suddenly I felt
completely peaceful. I walked into their room with a smile on my face
and asked if either of them had called me. It was ds 11, he wanted me
to set up his extra pillow (which was on the floor leaning against his
bed) behind him so he could sit up and read for a bit. Normally in this
circumstance I'd have walked into the room annoyed and impatient and
would have responded to this request by going on a rant about why he
couldn't just reach down and pick it up himself, why he had to call me
all the way back into his room for that, how tired and crummy I was
feeling and there is no reason why I have to be the one to do it since
he's perfectly capable himself! (You get the picture.) Last night I
just said, "Sure!" and set his pillows up behind him and gave them both
another kiss goodnight and then went to bed feeling exhausted but very
peaceful - and very thankful for my networks of unschoolers, from whom
I'm learning the precious principle of abundance.
~Leah Rose
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Sandra Dodd
This is beautiful:
-=-So I took a deep
breath, and as I inhaled I felt my whole being kind of slide into place
- it was weird, almost a tangible sensation - and suddenly I felt
completely peaceful.-=-
So as to get that sentence in context, I added that and the Glenda
quote here:
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
righthand side, halfway down.
Really nice.
I expect that some people's first thought will be that the mom is
"training" her child to all her, and that he will be spoiled, but it's
easier for the mom to go back to sleep happy than to yell "BE QUIET"
and lie awake full of adrenaline and regret. And when the mom needs
someone to come and help her sometime, the teen or adult who used to
be that little boy will think it's just a natural, normal thing, to
help another person.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-=-So I took a deep
breath, and as I inhaled I felt my whole being kind of slide into place
- it was weird, almost a tangible sensation - and suddenly I felt
completely peaceful.-=-
So as to get that sentence in context, I added that and the Glenda
quote here:
http://sandradodd.com/breathing
righthand side, halfway down.
Really nice.
I expect that some people's first thought will be that the mom is
"training" her child to all her, and that he will be spoiled, but it's
easier for the mom to go back to sleep happy than to yell "BE QUIET"
and lie awake full of adrenaline and regret. And when the mom needs
someone to come and help her sometime, the teen or adult who used to
be that little boy will think it's just a natural, normal thing, to
help another person.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]