More benefits of sleep
Sandra Dodd
Abi Fuller sent this:
-=-I found this article from last week's Guardian Family section
interesting regarding the tv-watching-equals-obesity myth. You may
have seen it but if not here's a link:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2010/jan/23/children-sleep-obesity-nurtureshock
-=-The descriptions in the article about the effect of lack of sleep
on children also fit with the differences in energy / enthusiasm I
have observed recently between my son (5 1/2 - who goes to sleep when
tired & gets up when he wakes up) and his peers who began school last
August. They all seem so tired and their mum's have tales of having to
peel them out of bed in the morning. -=-
Before any jump to what's in that article (an excerpt from
Nurtureshock), I want to say that energy and enthusiasm also have to
do with happy anticipation, and not just the number of hours slept.
If there's something wonderful going to happen, people can wake up
energetic and enthusiastic for it. I don't think there are enough
hours in the year for a teenager who is beat down by school, and tired
of school, to wake up with energy and enthusiasm for another schoolday.
The article is about lack of sleep contributing to obesity, rather
than TV. It's interesting. It's supportive of what unschoolers do.
It is NOT supportive of anything it suggests will help, really. The
"fixes" mentioned in the article reminded me of a story I can't find
now. I thought it was AEsop, but it might be someone else.
A farmer had a garden, and the birds kept getting in. He watched, to
see how to keep them out. He noticed that when they entered the
garden, they barely skimmed the top of the garden wall. So he added
one more row of bricks to the wall to keep them out.
What will help is not starting school half an hour later, or an hour
later, or trying to make teenagers go to bed an hour early. Making
school really useful and exciting might work, but that's not going to
happen.
What helps with all the things mentioned in the article is letting
children and teens sleep until they wake up naturally.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-=-I found this article from last week's Guardian Family section
interesting regarding the tv-watching-equals-obesity myth. You may
have seen it but if not here's a link:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2010/jan/23/children-sleep-obesity-nurtureshock
-=-The descriptions in the article about the effect of lack of sleep
on children also fit with the differences in energy / enthusiasm I
have observed recently between my son (5 1/2 - who goes to sleep when
tired & gets up when he wakes up) and his peers who began school last
August. They all seem so tired and their mum's have tales of having to
peel them out of bed in the morning. -=-
Before any jump to what's in that article (an excerpt from
Nurtureshock), I want to say that energy and enthusiasm also have to
do with happy anticipation, and not just the number of hours slept.
If there's something wonderful going to happen, people can wake up
energetic and enthusiastic for it. I don't think there are enough
hours in the year for a teenager who is beat down by school, and tired
of school, to wake up with energy and enthusiasm for another schoolday.
The article is about lack of sleep contributing to obesity, rather
than TV. It's interesting. It's supportive of what unschoolers do.
It is NOT supportive of anything it suggests will help, really. The
"fixes" mentioned in the article reminded me of a story I can't find
now. I thought it was AEsop, but it might be someone else.
A farmer had a garden, and the birds kept getting in. He watched, to
see how to keep them out. He noticed that when they entered the
garden, they barely skimmed the top of the garden wall. So he added
one more row of bricks to the wall to keep them out.
What will help is not starting school half an hour later, or an hour
later, or trying to make teenagers go to bed an hour early. Making
school really useful and exciting might work, but that's not going to
happen.
What helps with all the things mentioned in the article is letting
children and teens sleep until they wake up naturally.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
R
Just curious...my boys have been setting there sleeping and waking times for about 3 months now...they are 6 and almost 4. They have been choosing to go to bed most nights between 10 and 11. They have been still waking up at around 8 in the morning and both seem like they need more sleep. Sometimes if my youngest wakes up first I can lie with him and he will go back to sleep....but if I am going to work and my husband is there he wont or if I dont get to him soon enough. If he wakes up the older one it is pretty much a given that the day has started :) Throughout the day they are irritable and easily provoked by one another and complain that they are tired. At around 8 pm they seem to get a second wind and are very energetic and alive and sometimes even get along with each other. My oldest actually took a nap this week for the first time since he was four...so that was a positive thing for him to recognize his need for more sleep.
My question is will their bodies eventually reprogram themselves to rest longer? Or is that what their sleep needs are....
as a side note....tonite they were both in bed by 8:40....so I am curious as to what time they will wake up tomorrow... ;)
My question is will their bodies eventually reprogram themselves to rest longer? Or is that what their sleep needs are....
as a side note....tonite they were both in bed by 8:40....so I am curious as to what time they will wake up tomorrow... ;)
tealzabet
Yes sleep is good!
I am always amazed at the idea of "making them go to bed" and equating that with sleep,or even restful relaxation! (rather than resentment or worse)
The closest I can see to natural sleep cycles of the teens I know and love are the same as a toddler -- changing! growing!
sweet dreams
Liz T
I am always amazed at the idea of "making them go to bed" and equating that with sleep,or even restful relaxation! (rather than resentment or worse)
The closest I can see to natural sleep cycles of the teens I know and love are the same as a toddler -- changing! growing!
sweet dreams
Liz T
Sandra Dodd
-=-Just curious...my boys have been setting there sleeping and waking
times for about 3 months now...they are 6 and almost 4. -=-
By "setting their sleeping and waking times" do you mean that you told
them they can stay up as long as they want to?
The advice to avoid arguing over arbitrary bedtimes, and being more
flexible with kids turns too often into something like "Woohoo! No
more bedtime!" That isn't very helpful to kids or parents.
If the mom has to go to work in the morning, probably it would be a
good idea for the kids to sleep earlier the nights before she needs to
leave.
-=-Sometimes if my youngest wakes up first I can lie with him and he
will go back to sleep....but if I am going to work and my husband is
there he wont or if I dont get to him soon enough. If he wakes up the
older one it is pretty much a given that the day has started :)-=-
It might help to arrange for them to sleep in especially warm and dark
places so that they might sleep longer.
-=Throughout the day they are irritable and easily provoked by one
another and complain that they are tired.-=-
Maybe a calm, familiar DVD they know well, put on in the afternoon,
with a request for them to play quietly until the movie is over, would
induce a nap. That worked lots of times with my kids. blankets and
pillows, a futon, the couch near the TV, ceiling light off, soft toys
set out for them, or crayons and paper... often one would sleep.
-= At around 8 pm they seem to get a second wind and are very
energetic and alive and sometimes even get along with each other. -=-
They shouldn't be expected to find ways to get along, and if they
can't get along it shouldn't just be blamed on lack of sleep. There
should be an adult interacting with them and helping them find
interesting things to do together or separately.
-=-My question is will their bodies eventually reprogram themselves to
rest longer? Or is that what their sleep needs are....-=-
Nobody here knows the second part. The first part isn't
"programming." If you told them there's no bedtime, but if there is
pressure or criticism about their wakefulness, they're probably trying
to stay awake out of fear that the new experimental deal will end.
But it's possible that as young as they are, there should have been no
such experiment. It wouldn't be unreasonable to try make quiet-time
deals, or to find only quiet things to do late at night, especially if
both parents work, or if a parent needs to work the next morning.
http://sandradodd.com/gradualchange
http://sandradodd.com/sleep
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
times for about 3 months now...they are 6 and almost 4. -=-
By "setting their sleeping and waking times" do you mean that you told
them they can stay up as long as they want to?
The advice to avoid arguing over arbitrary bedtimes, and being more
flexible with kids turns too often into something like "Woohoo! No
more bedtime!" That isn't very helpful to kids or parents.
If the mom has to go to work in the morning, probably it would be a
good idea for the kids to sleep earlier the nights before she needs to
leave.
-=-Sometimes if my youngest wakes up first I can lie with him and he
will go back to sleep....but if I am going to work and my husband is
there he wont or if I dont get to him soon enough. If he wakes up the
older one it is pretty much a given that the day has started :)-=-
It might help to arrange for them to sleep in especially warm and dark
places so that they might sleep longer.
-=Throughout the day they are irritable and easily provoked by one
another and complain that they are tired.-=-
Maybe a calm, familiar DVD they know well, put on in the afternoon,
with a request for them to play quietly until the movie is over, would
induce a nap. That worked lots of times with my kids. blankets and
pillows, a futon, the couch near the TV, ceiling light off, soft toys
set out for them, or crayons and paper... often one would sleep.
-= At around 8 pm they seem to get a second wind and are very
energetic and alive and sometimes even get along with each other. -=-
They shouldn't be expected to find ways to get along, and if they
can't get along it shouldn't just be blamed on lack of sleep. There
should be an adult interacting with them and helping them find
interesting things to do together or separately.
-=-My question is will their bodies eventually reprogram themselves to
rest longer? Or is that what their sleep needs are....-=-
Nobody here knows the second part. The first part isn't
"programming." If you told them there's no bedtime, but if there is
pressure or criticism about their wakefulness, they're probably trying
to stay awake out of fear that the new experimental deal will end.
But it's possible that as young as they are, there should have been no
such experiment. It wouldn't be unreasonable to try make quiet-time
deals, or to find only quiet things to do late at night, especially if
both parents work, or if a parent needs to work the next morning.
http://sandradodd.com/gradualchange
http://sandradodd.com/sleep
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Lyla Wolfenstein
Just curious...my boys have been setting there sleeping and waking times for about 3 months now...they are 6 and almost 4. They have been choosing to go to bed most nights between 10 and 11. They have been still waking up at around 8 in the morning and both seem like they need more sleep. Sometimes if my youngest wakes up first I can lie with him and he will go back to sleep....but if I am going to work and my husband is there he wont or if I dont get to him soon enough. If he wakes up the older one it is pretty much a given that the day has started :) Throughout the day they are irritable and easily provoked by one another and complain that they are tired. At around 8 pm they seem to get a second wind and are very energetic and alive and sometimes even get along with each other. My oldest actually took a nap this week for the first time since he was four...so that was a positive thing for him to recognize his need for more sleep.
My question is will their bodies eventually reprogram themselves to rest longer? Or is that what their sleep needs are....
as a side note....tonite they were both in bed by 8:40....so I am curious as to what time they will wake up tomorrow... ;)
*********************
light and noise have a big impact on when my son (age 11) wakes. he has an ocean waves cd on continuous loop all night and also, in the summer, we foil his windows, so it will stay dark. your kids might be waking up because it's light or there are bustly, waking up type noises outside or inside...
lyla
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
My question is will their bodies eventually reprogram themselves to rest longer? Or is that what their sleep needs are....
as a side note....tonite they were both in bed by 8:40....so I am curious as to what time they will wake up tomorrow... ;)
*********************
light and noise have a big impact on when my son (age 11) wakes. he has an ocean waves cd on continuous loop all night and also, in the summer, we foil his windows, so it will stay dark. your kids might be waking up because it's light or there are bustly, waking up type noises outside or inside...
lyla
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
R
We did have a little bit of a period of WOOHOO...no bedtime...but that didnt last for long...I read your articles before and tried to implement a gradual change however it was so different than what we were doing before that they noticed and it wasnt as gradual as I would have liked....we speak about the needs of others and encourage them to play quietly and they seem to get that part of it now though. They dont like it when we go to bed so they usually go at about he same time or shortly after us.
What I meant by getting along is that during the day they are often competing for my attention and so they are at odds with one another...but it seems even more so when they sleep late and wake early. In the evenings I take a short shower and sometimes read in my room for a bit...they seem to play better when I am out of the mix for a bit. Please understand that I am not avoiding my kids or not paying attention to them.....my husband works long hours and is gone in the evenings so I try to rest a bit during this time. I tell them to let me know when they are ready for books, snuggles etc...
Their rooms are pretty dark....but cold...(both of them prefer it cold with a nice warm blanket) we do live right beside the gate to the complex though and both of their windows face that side of the house...so there could be something to that. The gate is quiet noisy and makes a loud bang when it closes. The 4 yr old falls asleep to music so music or a noise machine might be an option for him...but my oldest does not like music or white noise machines (he had one when he was younger and he told us that he does not like it)
What I meant by getting along is that during the day they are often competing for my attention and so they are at odds with one another...but it seems even more so when they sleep late and wake early. In the evenings I take a short shower and sometimes read in my room for a bit...they seem to play better when I am out of the mix for a bit. Please understand that I am not avoiding my kids or not paying attention to them.....my husband works long hours and is gone in the evenings so I try to rest a bit during this time. I tell them to let me know when they are ready for books, snuggles etc...
Their rooms are pretty dark....but cold...(both of them prefer it cold with a nice warm blanket) we do live right beside the gate to the complex though and both of their windows face that side of the house...so there could be something to that. The gate is quiet noisy and makes a loud bang when it closes. The 4 yr old falls asleep to music so music or a noise machine might be an option for him...but my oldest does not like music or white noise machines (he had one when he was younger and he told us that he does not like it)
Sandra Dodd
-=-What I meant by getting along is that during the day they are often
competing for my attention and so they are at odds with one
another...but it seems even more so when they sleep late and wake
early.-=-
The sleep will settle down, I'm sure, if you can figure out ways to
make it more comfortable and long-lasting. Maybe there's another room
not so near the gate. Maybe the child who didn't like the white noise
machine years ago would be willing to try again now that he sees a
potential benefit.
There could be all kinds of factors that would keep kids from getting
along ideally, but siblings ARE crowded sometimes. The only way to
deal with competition for attention is to give them both more attention.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
competing for my attention and so they are at odds with one
another...but it seems even more so when they sleep late and wake
early.-=-
The sleep will settle down, I'm sure, if you can figure out ways to
make it more comfortable and long-lasting. Maybe there's another room
not so near the gate. Maybe the child who didn't like the white noise
machine years ago would be willing to try again now that he sees a
potential benefit.
There could be all kinds of factors that would keep kids from getting
along ideally, but siblings ARE crowded sometimes. The only way to
deal with competition for attention is to give them both more attention.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]