Maintaining Friendships with People Who Parent Conventionally?
kelly_sturman
As I move further down the deschooling path,
I find it harder to stomach my friends' application
of Skinnerian behaviorism to their children. It has
become painful to watch, and to hear.
How have you all handled this? Do old friendships
fall away in favor of new friendships with unschoolers?
Or do you find a way to set aside judgment of others
parenting styles?
Kelly Sturman
I find it harder to stomach my friends' application
of Skinnerian behaviorism to their children. It has
become painful to watch, and to hear.
How have you all handled this? Do old friendships
fall away in favor of new friendships with unschoolers?
Or do you find a way to set aside judgment of others
parenting styles?
Kelly Sturman
Michelle Thedaker
Kelly,
In some of my relationships with non-unschooling friends, I find that
spending time with *just* the friend - without our children - is the way to
go. I often go out once a week in the evening to a local coffeeshop with
friends who are available, and it's a "girls' night" type of outing. We
don't talk about kids (much), the conversations drift towards other things.
I have friendships that have fallen away, because we're running out of
common ground and the time spent together isn't enjoyable. I find that
these things usually resolve on their own, gradually over time morphing into
a different relationship. I'm finding new friends who unschool and that
aides my transition and keeps me from feeling alone and isolated.
Shell
_____
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of kelly_sturman
Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 11:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Maintaining Friendships with People Who Parent
Conventionally?
As I move further down the deschooling path,
I find it harder to stomach my friends' application
of Skinnerian behaviorism to their children. It has
become painful to watch, and to hear.
How have you all handled this? Do old friendships
fall away in favor of new friendships with unschoolers?
Or do you find a way to set aside judgment of others
parenting styles?
Kelly Sturman
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
In some of my relationships with non-unschooling friends, I find that
spending time with *just* the friend - without our children - is the way to
go. I often go out once a week in the evening to a local coffeeshop with
friends who are available, and it's a "girls' night" type of outing. We
don't talk about kids (much), the conversations drift towards other things.
I have friendships that have fallen away, because we're running out of
common ground and the time spent together isn't enjoyable. I find that
these things usually resolve on their own, gradually over time morphing into
a different relationship. I'm finding new friends who unschool and that
aides my transition and keeps me from feeling alone and isolated.
Shell
_____
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of kelly_sturman
Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 11:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Maintaining Friendships with People Who Parent
Conventionally?
As I move further down the deschooling path,
I find it harder to stomach my friends' application
of Skinnerian behaviorism to their children. It has
become painful to watch, and to hear.
How have you all handled this? Do old friendships
fall away in favor of new friendships with unschoolers?
Or do you find a way to set aside judgment of others
parenting styles?
Kelly Sturman
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
I personally judge them but at the same time that is how they are and I have the choice to .
either don't hang out anymore or I keep my friendship apart from parenting.
My best friend is far from parenting the way I do.
I love her. We have been friends for 30 years. We don;t talk much about the kids because I do not want to
get into that with her. We have differences in that aspect but we have other parts of our lives that we have a lot in common.
Some friendships will end because of it if there is nothing else in common between you two.
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
either don't hang out anymore or I keep my friendship apart from parenting.
My best friend is far from parenting the way I do.
I love her. We have been friends for 30 years. We don;t talk much about the kids because I do not want to
get into that with her. We have differences in that aspect but we have other parts of our lives that we have a lot in common.
Some friendships will end because of it if there is nothing else in common between you two.
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-Some friendships will end because of it if there is nothing else in
common between you two.-=-
I knew for sure I was putting my relationship with my children first
when I let some longtime friendships slip peacefully away rather than
deal with any disdain or explanation to people who didn't know.
Yesterday Holly and I went to a bridal shower in a nearby town. I
knew almost everyone there; only a few knew Holly and some hadn't seen
her since she was a baby. The bride to be is older than I am. She's
lived with the same man for 35 years, but they never were married.
Most of the guests were older than I am. The "younger" ones were in
their 40's. Then there were two teens whose mothers were there.
I asked Holly, before we went, to go easy on any talk or jokes of
children. The party organizer is married and childless. The hostess
was never married but I think she would like to have been. The bride
to be has had a pituitary tumor for many years, and couldn't have
children because what they're giving her to control the tumor couldn't
be taken during pregnancy. She would've made a great mom, without
that. She was pregnant once, by accident, and had to choose.
It was basically fifteen old hippie women, almost all childless, and a
few friends and relatives. That would have been my crowd had I not
had children. That WAS my crowd before I had children. The bride to
be was my bridesmaid when I got married 25 years ago.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
common between you two.-=-
I knew for sure I was putting my relationship with my children first
when I let some longtime friendships slip peacefully away rather than
deal with any disdain or explanation to people who didn't know.
Yesterday Holly and I went to a bridal shower in a nearby town. I
knew almost everyone there; only a few knew Holly and some hadn't seen
her since she was a baby. The bride to be is older than I am. She's
lived with the same man for 35 years, but they never were married.
Most of the guests were older than I am. The "younger" ones were in
their 40's. Then there were two teens whose mothers were there.
I asked Holly, before we went, to go easy on any talk or jokes of
children. The party organizer is married and childless. The hostess
was never married but I think she would like to have been. The bride
to be has had a pituitary tumor for many years, and couldn't have
children because what they're giving her to control the tumor couldn't
be taken during pregnancy. She would've made a great mom, without
that. She was pregnant once, by accident, and had to choose.
It was basically fifteen old hippie women, almost all childless, and a
few friends and relatives. That would have been my crowd had I not
had children. That WAS my crowd before I had children. The bride to
be was my bridesmaid when I got married 25 years ago.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Three Mommies
On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 2:45 PM, kelly_sturman
<conspicuousfamily@...>wrote:
As I move further down the deschooling path, I find it harder to stomach my
groups of homeschoolers who try to control their kids.
How have you all handled this? Do old friendships fall away in favor of new
friends that I saw infrequently. I find that I can discuss parenting with
most of my friends. Our styles differ, but I find that we are pretty
tolerant of each other. In groups I tend to avoid people who interact with
their children (or adults) in ways I find upsetting. I avoid people who are
disrepectful or who don't listen. I avoid people who react instead of
responding. I do judge other parenting styles, but I keep my judgements to
myself and talk about things with the other 2 mommies here if I need to
discuss something.
It's kind of weird for me though. I have a few, very long-standing
friendships (over 25 years) and I don't think those friendships will ever
end. My oldest friends live in NYC, and I haven't lived there in 17 years.
Only one of those people has children. He and I have always had "ideological
differences" (for lack of a better term at the moment). We have long since
learned how to discuss them and find common ground or let them drop. I don't
see him parent on a day-to-day basis, so our parenting styles/lifestyles are
not an issue. My friend Jo visits at least once a month. She is single and
childless. (Yes, I am using that word deliberately. If she met someone she
wanted to marry, she would marry and have kids. She even thought about
having kids on her own, but her current living situation makes that
impossible.) She would not be an unschooler never mind a radical unschooler,
but she respects and supports our choices even if she does bring the kids
educational materials. To her credit, she doesn't care if they use them or
not. She is wonderful in that she listens to the guys and follows their
desires when she's here.
I rarely see my friends from New Orleans. (We left New Orleans the day
before Hurricane Katrina and then settled in Connecticut.) The friendships
we were building there were interrupted by the hurricane in a way I'm too
tired to explain right now.
We have only been in Connecticut for 3 years and have met a number of
homeschoolers, most of whom we don't socialize with outside of groups
events. In the groups we do attend at least twice a month, there are a few
people who don't even understand unschooling. I've been told, "Well, even
unschoolers use workbooks and some cirriculum." Even when they ask about our
day-to-day lives, they just don't hear that I don't teach my guys. I model
things for them, explore things with them, and participate in their learning
on their terms.
I wish we could socialize with more radical unschoolers on a more regular
basis. So far, our attempts at making spaces for that to happen haven't
worked out, but we're still working on it. :)
I'm really grateful for the people I"ve met at conferences and those I"ve
met on-line. People like you Kelly :)
I have no idea if that answered your question, but it was interesting for me
to puzzle through it.
Thanks.
(ps. Ethan says "Hi" to Amelia.)
Peace,
Jean Elizabeth
3mommies.blogspot.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<conspicuousfamily@...>wrote:
As I move further down the deschooling path, I find it harder to stomach my
> friends' application of Skinnerian behaviorism to their children. It hasI hear that. There are times I have to walk away for a while when I'm in
> become painful to watch, and to hear.
>
groups of homeschoolers who try to control their kids.
How have you all handled this? Do old friendships fall away in favor of new
> friendships with unschoolers? Or do you find a way to set aside judgment ofIf I only had friendships with unschoolers, I'd have a very limited group of
> others parenting styles?
>
friends that I saw infrequently. I find that I can discuss parenting with
most of my friends. Our styles differ, but I find that we are pretty
tolerant of each other. In groups I tend to avoid people who interact with
their children (or adults) in ways I find upsetting. I avoid people who are
disrepectful or who don't listen. I avoid people who react instead of
responding. I do judge other parenting styles, but I keep my judgements to
myself and talk about things with the other 2 mommies here if I need to
discuss something.
It's kind of weird for me though. I have a few, very long-standing
friendships (over 25 years) and I don't think those friendships will ever
end. My oldest friends live in NYC, and I haven't lived there in 17 years.
Only one of those people has children. He and I have always had "ideological
differences" (for lack of a better term at the moment). We have long since
learned how to discuss them and find common ground or let them drop. I don't
see him parent on a day-to-day basis, so our parenting styles/lifestyles are
not an issue. My friend Jo visits at least once a month. She is single and
childless. (Yes, I am using that word deliberately. If she met someone she
wanted to marry, she would marry and have kids. She even thought about
having kids on her own, but her current living situation makes that
impossible.) She would not be an unschooler never mind a radical unschooler,
but she respects and supports our choices even if she does bring the kids
educational materials. To her credit, she doesn't care if they use them or
not. She is wonderful in that she listens to the guys and follows their
desires when she's here.
I rarely see my friends from New Orleans. (We left New Orleans the day
before Hurricane Katrina and then settled in Connecticut.) The friendships
we were building there were interrupted by the hurricane in a way I'm too
tired to explain right now.
We have only been in Connecticut for 3 years and have met a number of
homeschoolers, most of whom we don't socialize with outside of groups
events. In the groups we do attend at least twice a month, there are a few
people who don't even understand unschooling. I've been told, "Well, even
unschoolers use workbooks and some cirriculum." Even when they ask about our
day-to-day lives, they just don't hear that I don't teach my guys. I model
things for them, explore things with them, and participate in their learning
on their terms.
I wish we could socialize with more radical unschoolers on a more regular
basis. So far, our attempts at making spaces for that to happen haven't
worked out, but we're still working on it. :)
I'm really grateful for the people I"ve met at conferences and those I"ve
met on-line. People like you Kelly :)
I have no idea if that answered your question, but it was interesting for me
to puzzle through it.
Thanks.
(ps. Ethan says "Hi" to Amelia.)
Peace,
Jean Elizabeth
3mommies.blogspot.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
BOY Kelly,
This is something I too struggle with currenlty. I was just going to ask a question when I saw a response to this for some others on this group. Somedays I feel like I have no "like minded" friends. I am going to read more of the responses and come back to this later.
Angela (Newbie here but have been unschooling a long time!)
This is something I too struggle with currenlty. I was just going to ask a question when I saw a response to this for some others on this group. Somedays I feel like I have no "like minded" friends. I am going to read more of the responses and come back to this later.
Angela (Newbie here but have been unschooling a long time!)
--- In [email protected], "kelly_sturman" <conspicuousfamily@...> wrote:
>
> As I move further down the deschooling path,
> I find it harder to stomach my friends' application
> of Skinnerian behaviorism to their children. It has
> become painful to watch, and to hear.
>
> How have you all handled this? Do old friendships
> fall away in favor of new friendships with unschoolers?
> Or do you find a way to set aside judgment of others
> parenting styles?
>
> Kelly Sturman
>