[AlwaysLearning] Too Many Sweets
Nanci Kuykendall
>>We are also struggling with going overboard withCrackers of variouos kinds, vegetable sticks, and
>>sweets around here lately. The boys really need to
>>learn some moderation and I am trying to maintain my
>>confidence that this will pass. >>
>Are there other options as readily available?
yogurt are readily available for them to help
themselves. Good point though, perhaps I should make
more things available for them to help themselves to.
I was just discussing that last night with my husband,
making more options available and making me less their
food slave every ten minutes. I think I will even put
cups of juice in the fridge so that they don't have to
ask me to pour from the pitcher all the time.
Nanci K.
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callymom2000
: Nanci Kuykendall <aisliin@y...> wrote
<<<<<I should make
more things available for them to help themselves to>>>>>
<<<<<I think I will even put
cups of juice in the fridge so that they don't have to
ask me to pour from the pitcher all the time.>>>>>>>
When I was nursing, and my other children were little (always wanting
a drink as soon as I sat down with the baby) I used syrup
bottles filled with juice, water, or whatever, so they could get
their own drink. A stack of near by paper cups was helpful too. Now
you can just buy a small bottle w/ one of those squirter tops. My
children drank more water that way because it was *cool* to get their
own drink that was cold.
Cally
<<<<<I should make
more things available for them to help themselves to>>>>>
<<<<<I think I will even put
cups of juice in the fridge so that they don't have to
ask me to pour from the pitcher all the time.>>>>>>>
When I was nursing, and my other children were little (always wanting
a drink as soon as I sat down with the baby) I used syrup
bottles filled with juice, water, or whatever, so they could get
their own drink. A stack of near by paper cups was helpful too. Now
you can just buy a small bottle w/ one of those squirter tops. My
children drank more water that way because it was *cool* to get their
own drink that was cold.
Cally
Nanci Kuykendall
The bottled water thing reminds me...I do keep bottled
water in the fridge for me, several smaller bottles at
a time, and the kids have been drinking from those a
lot lately. So I guess I will just start doing it
more regularly and make it clear that these are for
them too. The do like the cold drinks better, and
they drink a lot of water.
This morning I made pancakes (on request) and then
they were refused in favor of jellybeans (Grrrr.....)
They are still sitting there on the plate I do not
have the heart to clean up yet. They asked me to get
the cookie jar out for cookies, passing up the carrot
sticks sitting in ice water and the yogurt they got
out but didn't eat. Yesterday they poured two bowls
of berry granola which were then ignored as they ate
ice cream sandwiches for breakfast (really tofu ones
because of the milk allergies around here.) I am
always irritated with having to throw away food that
they asked for, or served themselves, and then left
untouched. I am getting really frustrated and trying
not to say judgenmental things to them about their
food choices. I make suggestions and recommendations,
but I don't stand in the way of their choices. When
they complain about not feeling well I try to suggest
that perhaps their food choices have something to do
with this. The say "no, it's not that."
One bonus, they are brushing their teeth more now.
Guess they don't like the sugar on them.
Nanci K.
__________________________________________________
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water in the fridge for me, several smaller bottles at
a time, and the kids have been drinking from those a
lot lately. So I guess I will just start doing it
more regularly and make it clear that these are for
them too. The do like the cold drinks better, and
they drink a lot of water.
This morning I made pancakes (on request) and then
they were refused in favor of jellybeans (Grrrr.....)
They are still sitting there on the plate I do not
have the heart to clean up yet. They asked me to get
the cookie jar out for cookies, passing up the carrot
sticks sitting in ice water and the yogurt they got
out but didn't eat. Yesterday they poured two bowls
of berry granola which were then ignored as they ate
ice cream sandwiches for breakfast (really tofu ones
because of the milk allergies around here.) I am
always irritated with having to throw away food that
they asked for, or served themselves, and then left
untouched. I am getting really frustrated and trying
not to say judgenmental things to them about their
food choices. I make suggestions and recommendations,
but I don't stand in the way of their choices. When
they complain about not feeling well I try to suggest
that perhaps their food choices have something to do
with this. The say "no, it's not that."
One bonus, they are brushing their teeth more now.
Guess they don't like the sugar on them.
Nanci K.
__________________________________________________
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http://greetings.yahoo.com
Pat Cald...
I am new to the "let them eat cake" mentality so let me know if I am way off here.
This is what I have done with my girls.
I told my girls what we eat plays a major role in our health. It affects how we feel today, how well our bodies fight off germs and how our bodies protect themselves from diseases like cancer and heart disease. I then asked the girls what they thought and whether they felt eating healthy food was important. Of course they said yes. Then I told them that their bodies can only fill up on so much food every day before being too full, so if they fill up on lots of sweets, their bodies would not have any room for healthy food. Everyone likes sweets and it is ok to eat sweets but they need to be eaten in moderation. I asked them how much room their bodies would have for dessert if they ate enough nutritious food to be healthy. They gave some thought to that and decided on a balance.
On days they seem to be going overboard with sweets, I don't say anything to them at the time I see them eating the desserts. Later on that day I might say something like "how are you doing getting your healthy food today?"
Would that work for you Nancy?
I also think a discussion about wasting food and wasting your time is in order.
In the situation you mentioned, I might have said "why don't you have the pancakes now since I made them for you and you can have the jelly beans a little later."
Pat
This is what I have done with my girls.
I told my girls what we eat plays a major role in our health. It affects how we feel today, how well our bodies fight off germs and how our bodies protect themselves from diseases like cancer and heart disease. I then asked the girls what they thought and whether they felt eating healthy food was important. Of course they said yes. Then I told them that their bodies can only fill up on so much food every day before being too full, so if they fill up on lots of sweets, their bodies would not have any room for healthy food. Everyone likes sweets and it is ok to eat sweets but they need to be eaten in moderation. I asked them how much room their bodies would have for dessert if they ate enough nutritious food to be healthy. They gave some thought to that and decided on a balance.
On days they seem to be going overboard with sweets, I don't say anything to them at the time I see them eating the desserts. Later on that day I might say something like "how are you doing getting your healthy food today?"
Would that work for you Nancy?
I also think a discussion about wasting food and wasting your time is in order.
In the situation you mentioned, I might have said "why don't you have the pancakes now since I made them for you and you can have the jelly beans a little later."
Pat
----- Original Message -----
From: Nanci Kuykendall
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 5:37 PM
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Too Many Sweets
The bottled water thing reminds me...I do keep bottled
water in the fridge for me, several smaller bottles at
a time, and the kids have been drinking from those a
lot lately. So I guess I will just start doing it
more regularly and make it clear that these are for
them too. The do like the cold drinks better, and
they drink a lot of water.
This morning I made pancakes (on request) and then
they were refused in favor of jellybeans (Grrrr.....)
They are still sitting there on the plate I do not
have the heart to clean up yet. They asked me to get
the cookie jar out for cookies, passing up the carrot
sticks sitting in ice water and the yogurt they got
out but didn't eat. Yesterday they poured two bowls
of berry granola which were then ignored as they ate
ice cream sandwiches for breakfast (really tofu ones
because of the milk allergies around here.) I am
always irritated with having to throw away food that
they asked for, or served themselves, and then left
untouched. I am getting really frustrated and trying
not to say judgenmental things to them about their
food choices. I make suggestions and recommendations,
but I don't stand in the way of their choices. When
they complain about not feeling well I try to suggest
that perhaps their food choices have something to do
with this. The say "no, it's not that."
One bonus, they are brushing their teeth more now.
Guess they don't like the sugar on them.
Nanci K.
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In a message dated 2/8/02 8:14:39 PM, homeschoolmd@... writes:
<< I asked them how much room their bodies would have for dessert if they ate
enough nutritious food to be healthy. They gave some thought to that and
decided on a balance.
<<On days they seem to be going overboard with sweets, I don't say anything
to them at the time I see them eating the desserts. Later on that day I
might say something like "how are you doing getting your healthy food today?"
This kind of still-counting stuff isn't the self-regulation which has
happened at my house. If you still separate "good food" from "bad food" the
decisions will be made based on labels.
The word "dessert" literally means "what you earned." If you still see
sweets and refer to them as something which is so wonderful that it can only
be earned by eating things which they don't think are wonderful, I believe
they will not balance themselves out, but will still crave sweets.
We had kids here today--several, and a 23 yr old. They did get Dr Peppers,
three of them, at one point. Kirby was making a birthday cake for someone
not here. He wanted to give away the beaters after making homemade chocolate
frosting. The two people he offered them to first turned them down politely.
One said he couldn't eat sweets anymore--last time he had sweets he didn't
feel good.
They all did eat meatballs in sauce (which Kirby had made up) and noodles.
Marty later made a turkey sandwich. I saw several glasses of milk go by.
Nobody added chocolate, but two Hershey's syrup bottles were in view. Nobody
had cookies or candy (in view). Nobody touched the corn chips.
Kirby had forgotten a knife to cut the cake, when he left for the
meeting/party/anime thing. I drove it up there, and saw fifteen teenaged
boys eating pizza, and eating meatballs. Not the height of health food, but
not sweets either.
I'm not explaining this well tonight. I'm tired. Sorry.
Sandra
<< I asked them how much room their bodies would have for dessert if they ate
enough nutritious food to be healthy. They gave some thought to that and
decided on a balance.
<<On days they seem to be going overboard with sweets, I don't say anything
to them at the time I see them eating the desserts. Later on that day I
might say something like "how are you doing getting your healthy food today?"
>>If you want to limit sweets, do.
This kind of still-counting stuff isn't the self-regulation which has
happened at my house. If you still separate "good food" from "bad food" the
decisions will be made based on labels.
The word "dessert" literally means "what you earned." If you still see
sweets and refer to them as something which is so wonderful that it can only
be earned by eating things which they don't think are wonderful, I believe
they will not balance themselves out, but will still crave sweets.
We had kids here today--several, and a 23 yr old. They did get Dr Peppers,
three of them, at one point. Kirby was making a birthday cake for someone
not here. He wanted to give away the beaters after making homemade chocolate
frosting. The two people he offered them to first turned them down politely.
One said he couldn't eat sweets anymore--last time he had sweets he didn't
feel good.
They all did eat meatballs in sauce (which Kirby had made up) and noodles.
Marty later made a turkey sandwich. I saw several glasses of milk go by.
Nobody added chocolate, but two Hershey's syrup bottles were in view. Nobody
had cookies or candy (in view). Nobody touched the corn chips.
Kirby had forgotten a knife to cut the cake, when he left for the
meeting/party/anime thing. I drove it up there, and saw fifteen teenaged
boys eating pizza, and eating meatballs. Not the height of health food, but
not sweets either.
I'm not explaining this well tonight. I'm tired. Sorry.
Sandra
Pat Cald...
From: SandraDodd@...
Have your kids ever done what Nancy's kids are doing and eaten candy for breakfast, etc. If so, how long does it generally take for them to begin balancing themselves out?
I have to regulate my own sweets intake in order to try to get enough healthy food and keep my weight down. There is no question that people like sweet food. Do you make a conscious effort of any kind with regard to eating. I remember you had a food chart up in your house. Would you say it would be better to just talk about good nutrition as explained on the food chart and then not offer any suggestions about eating less sweets? I'm not arguing, I'm questioning because I may need to make some changes. Why can't healthy food have a priority just like learning. If it does, how should that be communicated without cause cravings?
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>If you want to limit sweets, do.There is no question that there are good and bad foods. Allison hates broccoli, never wants to eat it. She would say "why do we have broccoli". I generally told her that broccoli was good for us and I liked it. One day I told her that broccoli was one of the vegetables that was found to help prevent cancer. Ever since then, she makes a point of eating some broccoli. She asks for hers raw because she doesn't like it cooked. Jelly beans have no redeeming nutritional value. They help promote tooth decay. Jelly beans are not good food although quite tasty. We don't limit jelly beans but we discuss the benefits of more nutritious foods over jelly beans.
>
>This kind of still-counting stuff isn't the self-regulation which has
>happened at my house. If you still separate "good food" from "bad food" the
>decisions will be made based on labels.
>The word "dessert" literally means "what you earned." If you still seeWe use the word dessert like we use breakfast, lunch and dinner. I have never rewarded the kids with sweets and have talked about how bad schools are in using sweets as a reward. We don't say if you eat you "fill in the blank" you can have dessert. That would make it a reward.
>sweets and refer to them as something which is so wonderful that it can only
>be earned by eating things which they don't think are wonderful, I believe
>they will not balance themselves out, but will still crave sweets.
Have your kids ever done what Nancy's kids are doing and eaten candy for breakfast, etc. If so, how long does it generally take for them to begin balancing themselves out?
I have to regulate my own sweets intake in order to try to get enough healthy food and keep my weight down. There is no question that people like sweet food. Do you make a conscious effort of any kind with regard to eating. I remember you had a food chart up in your house. Would you say it would be better to just talk about good nutrition as explained on the food chart and then not offer any suggestions about eating less sweets? I'm not arguing, I'm questioning because I may need to make some changes. Why can't healthy food have a priority just like learning. If it does, how should that be communicated without cause cravings?
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sharon Rudd
Just have GOOD cake (lots of extra eggs, add extra
powdered milk...unless there are allergies)!
Oatmeal cookies are as "good for you" as a bowl of
oatmeal, so why not?
If sodas and packages snacks are a problem, just don't
buy them!
Even with bigger kids, it is usually, the
just-before-everything-is-ready time that is a
problem. The good smells say "time to eat" and they
don't want to wait. Just don't have anything else
available and whenever they come in the kitchen, put
something in their hands to do to help get good food
ready. Those little nibbles, then, won't hurt....that
is what you are gonna eat anyway.
Papa Bear is a another story.
Sharon of the Swamp
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powdered milk...unless there are allergies)!
Oatmeal cookies are as "good for you" as a bowl of
oatmeal, so why not?
If sodas and packages snacks are a problem, just don't
buy them!
Even with bigger kids, it is usually, the
just-before-everything-is-ready time that is a
problem. The good smells say "time to eat" and they
don't want to wait. Just don't have anything else
available and whenever they come in the kitchen, put
something in their hands to do to help get good food
ready. Those little nibbles, then, won't hurt....that
is what you are gonna eat anyway.
Papa Bear is a another story.
Sharon of the Swamp
__________________________________________________
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[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 6:42:17 AM, homeschoolmd@... writes:
<< I generally told her that broccoli was good for us and I liked it. >>
For people with blood clotting problems, broccoli is a very bad thing. I
have a close friend who had a blood clot in her leg a year ago, and is not
ever to eat broccoli or spinach anymore. Her dad died of a blood clot when
he was about the age she is now.
<<Have your kids ever done what Nancy's kids are doing and eaten candy for
breakfast, etc. If so, how long does it generally take for them to begin
balancing themselves out?>>
Because I never limited them, they don't loves sweets more than they love
other foods.
One of our notable moments was at a restaurant out of state with several
other adult friends when Kirby and Marty were two and five. This was
pre-homeschooling. It's probably something that made homeschooling easy for
me, or something in our understandings that made the whole package deal make
sense.
I knew it would be a while before food came. All these childless folk would
be grumpy if my kids were distracting, because they hadn't seen us for a
couple of years. And I wanted them to see my kids at their best. So rather
than leave waiting, hungry, in a room full of food, I ordered apple pie for
them right away.
One of the other childless folks said that meant they woudn't eat any dinner.
I said "No, they will. They don't know what order food is 'supposed' to be
eaten in because we don't do desserts."
So they ate pie happily, and when food came they ate chicken and vegetables
and bread happily.
The other folks were surprised. I wasn't.
Because we never told them which movies or music or books or ideas were "good
for them" and which were "of no value," they chose things which interested
them, and which caused them to think and know more. People LIKE to know
more, unless others are making a big controlling deal about it, unless
they're saving some activities for dessert, not to be had, or to be commented
on (you watched cartoons two hours today--how did you do on educational
activities?).
Given a level, non-emotional, non-shame-based and non-reward-based choice of
all things, people will choose good things more than bad, and will learn to
be discerning and make good choices on their own, for real reasons. They
will choose a good friend over an irritating one. They will choose something
satisfying to eat. They will choose something new and thought-provoking to
discuss or watch or read.
If they never actually have those choices, they can never actually make those
choices.
Sandra
<< I generally told her that broccoli was good for us and I liked it. >>
For people with blood clotting problems, broccoli is a very bad thing. I
have a close friend who had a blood clot in her leg a year ago, and is not
ever to eat broccoli or spinach anymore. Her dad died of a blood clot when
he was about the age she is now.
<<Have your kids ever done what Nancy's kids are doing and eaten candy for
breakfast, etc. If so, how long does it generally take for them to begin
balancing themselves out?>>
Because I never limited them, they don't loves sweets more than they love
other foods.
One of our notable moments was at a restaurant out of state with several
other adult friends when Kirby and Marty were two and five. This was
pre-homeschooling. It's probably something that made homeschooling easy for
me, or something in our understandings that made the whole package deal make
sense.
I knew it would be a while before food came. All these childless folk would
be grumpy if my kids were distracting, because they hadn't seen us for a
couple of years. And I wanted them to see my kids at their best. So rather
than leave waiting, hungry, in a room full of food, I ordered apple pie for
them right away.
One of the other childless folks said that meant they woudn't eat any dinner.
I said "No, they will. They don't know what order food is 'supposed' to be
eaten in because we don't do desserts."
So they ate pie happily, and when food came they ate chicken and vegetables
and bread happily.
The other folks were surprised. I wasn't.
Because we never told them which movies or music or books or ideas were "good
for them" and which were "of no value," they chose things which interested
them, and which caused them to think and know more. People LIKE to know
more, unless others are making a big controlling deal about it, unless
they're saving some activities for dessert, not to be had, or to be commented
on (you watched cartoons two hours today--how did you do on educational
activities?).
Given a level, non-emotional, non-shame-based and non-reward-based choice of
all things, people will choose good things more than bad, and will learn to
be discerning and make good choices on their own, for real reasons. They
will choose a good friend over an irritating one. They will choose something
satisfying to eat. They will choose something new and thought-provoking to
discuss or watch or read.
If they never actually have those choices, they can never actually make those
choices.
Sandra
Tia Leschke
>You'd have to add an awful lot of trans fats and sugar to the bowl of
>
>Oatmeal cookies are as "good for you" as a bowl of
>oatmeal, so why not?
oatmeal to make that statement true.
Tia
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 6:42:17 AM, homeschoolmd@... writes:
<< I have to regulate my own sweets intake in order to try to get enough
healthy food and keep my weight down.>>
Were they limited when you were younger?
<< There is no question that people like sweet food. >>
I like dark chocolate. I like GS Thin Mint cookies. <g> Annually, I get
some. If I hadn't been totally forbidden chocolate for a few years in my
youth, and had it measured out stingily thereafter, I wouldn't worship it.
But over the years I came to trust that if I didn't eat it all it wouldn't be
snatched away by others in my family. There's no desperation for food in my
family now as there was when I was little. It makes a difference.
<<Do you make a conscious effort of any kind with regard to eating.>>
We make sure there is always milk and bread, often a choice between wheat
bread or Roman Meal, and homemade bread the kids like. There's always
cheese, lunch meat, tuna, fruit, lettuce, and juice easily available. There
are freezer foods the teenagers like--frozen pizzas, chimichangas.
<<I remember you had a food chart up in your house. Would you say it would
be better to just talk about good nutrition as explained on the food chart
and then not offer any suggestions about eating less sweets?>>
The food pyramid was in itself a diagram recommending eating more of other
foods than sweets. I don't need to talk to them about eating fewer sweets
because they've never had sweets made glorious. They're just there.
At the moment, there's ice cream in the freezer, biscochitos in the cookie
jar (they've been there since early January, one goes every day or two),
chocolate syrup which they sometimes add to milk (but they like milk and
don't have to be bribed or augmented to drink it), sweetened breakfast
cereals, and red vines (those are Kirby's but he's willing to share. There
are jelly beans in two places, but hardly anyone here likes them. They're
both bags from last year. Holly had a box of Fruit Roll Ups two days ago.
She finished the last one last night. She offered them to other kids.
There's part of a chocolate cake. When Kirby made one to take away
yesterday, I made one with funky pans to keep here. He made double frosting
when he made homemade frosting. I showed him making different sized layers
with different pans and a rounded mixing bowl, and making a dome-shaped cake.
That way he did the safe two-9"-layers and I showed him the experimental
goofy option. With my husband and several teenagers in the house, there's
still some of that cake there.
<< I'm not arguing, I'm questioning because I may need to make some changes.
to see that it didn't mess them up to give them freedom.
<< Why can't healthy food have a priority just like learning. >>
If that's your priority, then it IS your priority. Choice and understanding
are mine.
My priority about learning is that given two choices of things (physical,
aural, positional--visits, etc) I can provide for my kids, other things being
equal I will go with what presents them new information or ideas or exposure.
<<If it does, how should that be communicated without cause cravings? >>
I don't know how you can label something that children like and want as "bad"
and them as bad for wanting it, and keep it from being "forbidden fruit."
Things treated casually are casual things. Lots of rule can make for lots
of rule-breaking, and ultimately lots of satisfaction in obtaining the thing,
either with being sneaky or being away from the controlling house, or
thinking "When I grow up, I can have all the candy I want."
Sandra
<< I have to regulate my own sweets intake in order to try to get enough
healthy food and keep my weight down.>>
Were they limited when you were younger?
<< There is no question that people like sweet food. >>
I like dark chocolate. I like GS Thin Mint cookies. <g> Annually, I get
some. If I hadn't been totally forbidden chocolate for a few years in my
youth, and had it measured out stingily thereafter, I wouldn't worship it.
But over the years I came to trust that if I didn't eat it all it wouldn't be
snatched away by others in my family. There's no desperation for food in my
family now as there was when I was little. It makes a difference.
<<Do you make a conscious effort of any kind with regard to eating.>>
We make sure there is always milk and bread, often a choice between wheat
bread or Roman Meal, and homemade bread the kids like. There's always
cheese, lunch meat, tuna, fruit, lettuce, and juice easily available. There
are freezer foods the teenagers like--frozen pizzas, chimichangas.
<<I remember you had a food chart up in your house. Would you say it would
be better to just talk about good nutrition as explained on the food chart
and then not offer any suggestions about eating less sweets?>>
The food pyramid was in itself a diagram recommending eating more of other
foods than sweets. I don't need to talk to them about eating fewer sweets
because they've never had sweets made glorious. They're just there.
At the moment, there's ice cream in the freezer, biscochitos in the cookie
jar (they've been there since early January, one goes every day or two),
chocolate syrup which they sometimes add to milk (but they like milk and
don't have to be bribed or augmented to drink it), sweetened breakfast
cereals, and red vines (those are Kirby's but he's willing to share. There
are jelly beans in two places, but hardly anyone here likes them. They're
both bags from last year. Holly had a box of Fruit Roll Ups two days ago.
She finished the last one last night. She offered them to other kids.
There's part of a chocolate cake. When Kirby made one to take away
yesterday, I made one with funky pans to keep here. He made double frosting
when he made homemade frosting. I showed him making different sized layers
with different pans and a rounded mixing bowl, and making a dome-shaped cake.
That way he did the safe two-9"-layers and I showed him the experimental
goofy option. With my husband and several teenagers in the house, there's
still some of that cake there.
<< I'm not arguing, I'm questioning because I may need to make some changes.
>>It wouldn't hurt my feelings if you were arguing. I have my kids to look at
to see that it didn't mess them up to give them freedom.
<< Why can't healthy food have a priority just like learning. >>
If that's your priority, then it IS your priority. Choice and understanding
are mine.
My priority about learning is that given two choices of things (physical,
aural, positional--visits, etc) I can provide for my kids, other things being
equal I will go with what presents them new information or ideas or exposure.
<<If it does, how should that be communicated without cause cravings? >>
I don't know how you can label something that children like and want as "bad"
and them as bad for wanting it, and keep it from being "forbidden fruit."
Things treated casually are casual things. Lots of rule can make for lots
of rule-breaking, and ultimately lots of satisfaction in obtaining the thing,
either with being sneaky or being away from the controlling house, or
thinking "When I grow up, I can have all the candy I want."
Sandra
[email protected]
On Sat, 9 Feb 2002 08:39:34 -0500 "Pat Cald..." <homeschoolmd@...>
writes:
Dar
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writes:
> We use the word dessert like we use breakfast, lunch and dinner.So could carrots be dessert?
Dar
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In a message dated 2/9/02 11:13:26 AM, SandraDodd@... writes:
<< So rather
than leave waiting, hungry, in a room full of food, I ordered apple pie for
them right away.
One of the other childless folks said that meant they woudn't eat any dinner.
I said "No, they will. They don't know what order food is 'supposed' to be
eaten in because we don't do desserts."
So they ate pie happily, and when food came they ate chicken and vegetables
and bread happily. >>
I've also found this to be true. Even for my sweets-craving son. He loves
sweet things, never seems to get sick in any way - except for chocolate, so
he watches himself on that.
When we have cookies or whatever available, I just put them on the plate with
everything else. They usually get eaten first, but not to the exclusion of
anything else.
paula
<< So rather
than leave waiting, hungry, in a room full of food, I ordered apple pie for
them right away.
One of the other childless folks said that meant they woudn't eat any dinner.
I said "No, they will. They don't know what order food is 'supposed' to be
eaten in because we don't do desserts."
So they ate pie happily, and when food came they ate chicken and vegetables
and bread happily. >>
I've also found this to be true. Even for my sweets-craving son. He loves
sweet things, never seems to get sick in any way - except for chocolate, so
he watches himself on that.
When we have cookies or whatever available, I just put them on the plate with
everything else. They usually get eaten first, but not to the exclusion of
anything else.
paula
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 10:37:39 AM, leschke@... writes:
<< You'd have to add an awful lot of trans fats and sugar to the bowl of
oatmeal to make that statement true. >>
We eat oatmeal with butter and sugar. I've never known people who didn't.
Sandra
<< You'd have to add an awful lot of trans fats and sugar to the bowl of
oatmeal to make that statement true. >>
We eat oatmeal with butter and sugar. I've never known people who didn't.
Sandra
Pat Cald...
From: SandraDodd@...
<< I have to regulate my own sweets intake in order to try to get enough
healthy food and keep my weight down.>>
In one of your other posts you mentioned you don't do desserts. We do desserts. I love to bake and we have elaborate desserts.
Well I can't turn back the clock and the damage I have already caused. I'll need to give some thought to what changes should be made.
I'd be interested in Nancy's input into why she thinks her kids are choosing so many sweets in comparison to yours.
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<< I have to regulate my own sweets intake in order to try to get enough
healthy food and keep my weight down.>>
>Were they limited when you were younger?Food had issues when I was growing up. My mom was always on a diet and my dad picked on her about her weight. My dad had special food treats that we were never allowed to have. My father also told my sister that he would not love her if she didn't lose weight. So to answer your question - YES!
In one of your other posts you mentioned you don't do desserts. We do desserts. I love to bake and we have elaborate desserts.
Well I can't turn back the clock and the damage I have already caused. I'll need to give some thought to what changes should be made.
I'd be interested in Nancy's input into why she thinks her kids are choosing so many sweets in comparison to yours.
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pat Cald...
So could carrots be dessert?
Yes, carrots could be dessert and cookies could be lunch but for my post I was using dessert to mean sweet food. I looked it up in the dictionary when Sandra said dessert literally meant something earned. I do know the saying "get your just desserts" but we don't use it that way.
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yes, carrots could be dessert and cookies could be lunch but for my post I was using dessert to mean sweet food. I looked it up in the dictionary when Sandra said dessert literally meant something earned. I do know the saying "get your just desserts" but we don't use it that way.
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
Cacie likes it with brown sugar and half and half.
I don't eat oatmeal, except in cookie form, but I eat cream of wheat with
butter and salt.
Dar
On Sat, 9 Feb 2002 13:24:11 EST SandraDodd@... writes:
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I don't eat oatmeal, except in cookie form, but I eat cream of wheat with
butter and salt.
Dar
On Sat, 9 Feb 2002 13:24:11 EST SandraDodd@... writes:
>of
> In a message dated 2/9/02 10:37:39 AM, leschke@... writes:
>
> << You'd have to add an awful lot of trans fats and sugar to the bowl
> oatmeal to make that statement true. >>________________________________________________________________
>
> We eat oatmeal with butter and sugar. I've never known people who
> didn't.
>
> Sandra
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[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 6:38:42 AM Pacific Standard Time,
bearspawprint@... writes:
<<
Even with bigger kids, it is usually, the
just-before-everything-is-ready time that is a
problem. The good smells say "time to eat" and they
don't want to wait. Just don't have anything else
available and whenever they come in the kitchen, >>
Or prepare the salad first and let them eat their
first course!
Kathy
bearspawprint@... writes:
<<
Even with bigger kids, it is usually, the
just-before-everything-is-ready time that is a
problem. The good smells say "time to eat" and they
don't want to wait. Just don't have anything else
available and whenever they come in the kitchen, >>
Or prepare the salad first and let them eat their
first course!
Kathy
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 11:33:02 AM, homeschoolmd@... writes:
<< In one of your other posts you mentioned you don't do desserts. We do
desserts. I love to bake and we have elaborate desserts. >>
I like to bake, but we don't serve a sweet course at the end of a meal.
Baking's for baking--birthdays, or just for fun, or a party, or because
someone's coming over to play cards.
My husband's parents still do the "get skinny and we'll love you" stuff. I
hate that. His mom serves small portions, even at Thanksgiving. She decides
in advance what will be leftover, and puts it in the freezer before the meal.
Her priority is "skinny." <g>
I've seen photos of my husband in childhood. From birth, he was pudgy. He
always needed more food than she was giving him, and so he went elsewhere for
food, and as often as possible, because from the minute she saw his pudgy
newborn face she said she would love him if he was skinnier.
I don't think she would.
So I came from lack of food from lack of money and the measuring (dividing by
six) of everything with no slack for size, age, desire, etc. I was told
"you're not hungry, you've never been hungry a day in your life." So I
decided when I was grown I would eat when I was hungry and NOT eat if I
wasn't hungry. And so that's what I do.
And Keith finally got, after years, to the point that he will just eat some
and not all when food is there.
So we decided not to put either of those weird food things on our kids. They
eat when they're hungry, and they haven't developed the desire to eat all of
anything.
I realize we're lucky in that we can afford to replace the bagels and cream
cheese if they're gone, or buy more milk. And I appreciate it.
Occasionally a visiting kid goes food-crazy, but we let him do it. It's
interesting to see, and for our kids to see, that someone who's restricted or
limited gets a big desire and need. (One boy did half a carton of ice cream
one day, checking again to see if it was REALLY okay for him to have more.
It was.) They just see it and say "huh. weird." but they'll remember it
when they're parents, I think.
Sandra
<< In one of your other posts you mentioned you don't do desserts. We do
desserts. I love to bake and we have elaborate desserts. >>
I like to bake, but we don't serve a sweet course at the end of a meal.
Baking's for baking--birthdays, or just for fun, or a party, or because
someone's coming over to play cards.
My husband's parents still do the "get skinny and we'll love you" stuff. I
hate that. His mom serves small portions, even at Thanksgiving. She decides
in advance what will be leftover, and puts it in the freezer before the meal.
Her priority is "skinny." <g>
I've seen photos of my husband in childhood. From birth, he was pudgy. He
always needed more food than she was giving him, and so he went elsewhere for
food, and as often as possible, because from the minute she saw his pudgy
newborn face she said she would love him if he was skinnier.
I don't think she would.
So I came from lack of food from lack of money and the measuring (dividing by
six) of everything with no slack for size, age, desire, etc. I was told
"you're not hungry, you've never been hungry a day in your life." So I
decided when I was grown I would eat when I was hungry and NOT eat if I
wasn't hungry. And so that's what I do.
And Keith finally got, after years, to the point that he will just eat some
and not all when food is there.
So we decided not to put either of those weird food things on our kids. They
eat when they're hungry, and they haven't developed the desire to eat all of
anything.
I realize we're lucky in that we can afford to replace the bagels and cream
cheese if they're gone, or buy more milk. And I appreciate it.
Occasionally a visiting kid goes food-crazy, but we let him do it. It's
interesting to see, and for our kids to see, that someone who's restricted or
limited gets a big desire and need. (One boy did half a carton of ice cream
one day, checking again to see if it was REALLY okay for him to have more.
It was.) They just see it and say "huh. weird." but they'll remember it
when they're parents, I think.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 11:37:42 AM, homeschoolmd@... writes:
<< I looked it up in the dictionary when Sandra said dessert literally meant
something earned. I do know the saying "get your just desserts" but we don't
use it that way.
you're using it that way in your mind.
I really think words have power. I think when men stopped calling 60 year
old women "girls" in the 1970's (or later, for some of them, and never for
some) it changed their thinking about women (since before that they were NOT
thinking about women, just girls). It changes people's beliefs and
practices when their homeschooling moves from ideas about "teaching" to just
ideas about "learning."
I think if you were to stop using the word "dessert" it would eventually
change your thinking. It would no longer seem wrong, evil, or sneaky to
"have dessert" without having had a salad and a vegetable and a protein
course. If vegetables can be eaten all by themselves for fun, that changes
everything too.
Holly likes spinach. We'll make spinach for a snack. (There's a bag of
fresh spinach in the fridge, and this reminds me we really need to use it
today.) She likes artichokes, and corn on the cob, and baked potatoes--for
snacks, for fun. If they had to be served with salad, protein course, and
before sweets, they would no longer be fun, they would be business. And
perhaps a dreaded business.
Sandra
<< I looked it up in the dictionary when Sandra said dessert literally meant
something earned. I do know the saying "get your just desserts" but we don't
use it that way.
>>If you think sweets should only be after, or a small percentage, or a reward,
you're using it that way in your mind.
I really think words have power. I think when men stopped calling 60 year
old women "girls" in the 1970's (or later, for some of them, and never for
some) it changed their thinking about women (since before that they were NOT
thinking about women, just girls). It changes people's beliefs and
practices when their homeschooling moves from ideas about "teaching" to just
ideas about "learning."
I think if you were to stop using the word "dessert" it would eventually
change your thinking. It would no longer seem wrong, evil, or sneaky to
"have dessert" without having had a salad and a vegetable and a protein
course. If vegetables can be eaten all by themselves for fun, that changes
everything too.
Holly likes spinach. We'll make spinach for a snack. (There's a bag of
fresh spinach in the fridge, and this reminds me we really need to use it
today.) She likes artichokes, and corn on the cob, and baked potatoes--for
snacks, for fun. If they had to be served with salad, protein course, and
before sweets, they would no longer be fun, they would be business. And
perhaps a dreaded business.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 12:05:24 PM, freeform@... writes:
<< I don't eat oatmeal, except in cookie form, but I eat cream of wheat with
butter and salt. >>
GRITS zone?
<g>
(Having left Texas as a very young child, I eat grits with butter and sugar
if I'm forced to eat grits.)
Sandra
<< I don't eat oatmeal, except in cookie form, but I eat cream of wheat with
butter and salt. >>
GRITS zone?
<g>
(Having left Texas as a very young child, I eat grits with butter and sugar
if I'm forced to eat grits.)
Sandra
Jorgen & Ann
>We eat oatmeal with butter and sugar. I've never known people who didn't.Oh yuck, yuck, yuck! My husband is the first one I ever met who did that. I
>
always thought that was some weird Danish thing--they just love butter. His
family also stirs the oatmeal when it's cooking until it is like paste.
Wow, what a sheltered life I've led (milk and brown sugar with peaches is
my favorite).
Ann
[email protected]
I eat mah gri-its with butter, salt an' haht sauce.
Elissa, who will soon be singing
Yippee - Kai - Yay!
Elissa, who will soon be singing
Yippee - Kai - Yay!
>(Having left Texas as a very young child, I eat grits with butter and sugar
>if I'm forced to eat grits.)
Pat Cald...
From: SandraDodd@...
When try to eat when I'm hungry and not eat when I'm not, it feels like I am putting controls on myself and then I go overboard. When ever I need to lose a few pounds I have to do it by stuffing myself with vegetables. I can't tell myself to eat less. My kids are very good about only eating when they are hungry and only until they are satisfied.
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>So I decided when I was grown I would eat when I was hungry and NOT eat if II wish I could do that!
>wasn't hungry. And so that's what I do.
When try to eat when I'm hungry and not eat when I'm not, it feels like I am putting controls on myself and then I go overboard. When ever I need to lose a few pounds I have to do it by stuffing myself with vegetables. I can't tell myself to eat less. My kids are very good about only eating when they are hungry and only until they are satisfied.
Pat
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
On Sat, 9 Feb 2002 14:22:44 EST SandraDodd@... writes:
always did sugar, too. I'm just weird like that...
Dar
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> In a message dated 2/9/02 12:05:24 PM, freeform@... writes:Never even visited The South, except the Southwest. My whole family
> << I don't eat oatmeal, except in cookie form, but I eat cream of
> wheat with butter and salt. >>
>
> GRITS zone?
>
> <g>
always did sugar, too. I'm just weird like that...
Dar
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Tia Leschke
>Fruit (usually hom-canned) and vanilla soy milk...yum.
>Oh yuck, yuck, yuck! My husband is the first one I ever met who did that. I
>always thought that was some weird Danish thing--they just love butter. His
>family also stirs the oatmeal when it's cooking until it is like paste.
>Wow, what a sheltered life I've led (milk and brown sugar with peaches is
>my favorite).
Tia
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*********************************************
Tia Leschke
leschke@...
On Vancouver Island
Nanci Kuykendall
>Just have GOOD cake (lots of extra eggs, add extraRight, this is me who started this thread with my
>powdered milk...unless there are allergies)!
"candy for breakfast" and other issues here remember?
We have a LOT of food allergies here and dairy and
eggs are two of the more serious ones. (sigh) Whole
and raw foods are some of the better sources of
nutrition for my oldest boy, who has a problem with
processed things, additives, dairy, eggs, nuts and
other things. I can offer more to my other son, but
it is hard to balance cooking for the whole family
when one preson cannot eat so many things.
Nanci K.
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In a message dated 2/9/02 12:55:27 PM, ElissaJC@... writes:
<< I eat mah gri-its with butter, salt an' haht sauce.
Elissa, who will soon be singing
Yippee - Kai - Yay!
to the East, Roswell to the south, and onward to Texas.
This is the green-chile-option zone.
Sandra
<< I eat mah gri-its with butter, salt an' haht sauce.
Elissa, who will soon be singing
Yippee - Kai - Yay!
>(Having left Texas as a very young child, I eat grits with butter and sugarNorthern New Mexico (and central) is not grits zone. Grits begin in Clovis
>if I'm forced to eat grits.)
>>
to the East, Roswell to the south, and onward to Texas.
This is the green-chile-option zone.
Sandra
Nanci Kuykendall
>In one of your other posts you mentioned you don't doWe don't DO desserts either, and we never have. But I
>desserts. We do desserts. I love to bake and we >
>have elaborate desserts.
also love to bake and make elaborate sweet treats.
Hmmm, how can I do both? We don't have desserts after
dinner. Sometimes we have them before dinner, or
after lunch, or whatever. I just like to make them,
and eat them, and share them. Occassionaly when we
have quests, we do tea and sweets long after we eat.
>Well I can't turn back the clock and the damage IYeah I feel that way too. I have to work with where
>have already caused. I'll need to give some thought
>to what changes should be made.
we are now, and getting comfortable with giving the
kids more freedoms than we have given them (which was
already too much for my family to be comfortable not
telling me about.)
>I'd be interested in Nancy's input into why sheJust FYI, it's Nanci, not Nancy. Perhaps there is
>thinks her kids are choosing so many sweets in
>comparison to yours.
something to the notion that refined sugars are more
addictive and affecting to some people or some
ethnicities than others. I don't think psychology is
ALL of it. I have seen too many dramatic effects of
the chemistry of food in different people.
But if that IS the case, it is even more important let
my sons learn how to self regulate their diets for
their own health. We decided it was important to
loosen up the strictures we had adopted for safety's
sake, now that Thomas is old enough to know and
recognize most of his allergens. I still keep a close
eye on what he eats and have to veto certain things,
but try to let him make his own choices when the
allergen or sensativity is not a dangerous one. If he
may get somewhat ill or have more minor reactions
(like upset stomache, headache, fatigue, emotional
uncontrollability, rashes, etc) due to intolerances, I
let him go ahead and eat it if he really wants to and
then help him through the aftermath, and talk about
why that is happening and why I recommended against
his eating that thing in the first place. He
generally trusts me and also will often take one bite
and then not eat any more of something that doesn't
"taste right" to him.
So perhaps they are going wile right now because we
have been strict in the past. We had to keep a lot of
food away from him when he was little, while we were
still discovering his allergies and having emergency
trips to the hospital. His little brother,
unfortunatly, got the fallout of all the food
stricture, even though he has very few and mild
sensativities. Alex (my younger) is also much more
relaxed about what he eats, and doesn't eat all the
sweets his brother does. Today they ate pretzels all
morning and then Alex had some eggs and Thomas had a
jelly sandwich (lots of carbos). Last night at
dinner, we have stuffed, roasted turkey, candied yams
and homemade biscuits. I had a big turkey to cook
that we got free, so I did the whole turkey thing.
Thomas ate a lot of turkey and a biscuit for dinner.
Things seem to be improving a bit but I anticipate
this will be a bit like the deschooling struggle is
for others. Is this Demenuing?
Nanci K.
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Jorgen & Ann
>Crackers of variouos kinds, vegetable sticks, andNanci,
>
>yogurt are readily available for them to help
>
>themselves. Good point though, perhaps I should make
>
>more things available for them to help themselves to.
>
One thing we used to do is take a couple of ice cube trays and fill the
compartments with different little things: olives, cheese cubes, mini rice
cakes, mini muffins, pretzels, raisins, pickles, little bits of fruits and
vegies. Then the kids could grab stuff from there by themselves. They also
really liked frozen raw vegies. And they still love frozen grapes.
Variety and presentation are important to my kids, so I cut vegies and
fruits in different ways, like carrots in sticks sometimes, in coins other
times, on the diagonal sometimes. It sounds weird, but it works for us and
I like doing it. And I tend to get in a food shopping rut, so I have to
remember to ask them when they want and to buy things we haven't eaten in a
while.
I also used really teeny cups, bowls, and plates when they were little.
That really cut down on wasting food.
When my kids were little I did restrict their sweets--I never thought about
it, just did it. So my kids weren't able to learn to choose for themselves
from the beginning, but I definitely see them choosing fewer sweets as they
grow older.
Ann
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/9/02 5:32:10 PM, stargate@... writes:
<< One thing we used to do is take a couple of ice cube trays and fill the
compartments with different little things: olives, cheese cubes, mini rice
cakes, mini muffins, pretzels, raisins, pickles, little bits of fruits and
vegies. Then the kids could grab stuff from there by themselves. They also
really liked frozen raw vegies. And they still love frozen grapes. >>
In the summer, still, with our youngest ten years old, we freeze juice in ice
cube trays and put one Discovery Toys "Boom-a-ring" in each one for a handle.
It's a summer comfort thing for Holly. Marty and Kirby still grab one once
in a while. And neighbor and visiting little kids are VERY excited at the
idea that they can have two or three. And it's just orange juice or
cranberry juice. They can have the whole tray if they want! And the handles
go in the dishwasher.
Sandra
<< One thing we used to do is take a couple of ice cube trays and fill the
compartments with different little things: olives, cheese cubes, mini rice
cakes, mini muffins, pretzels, raisins, pickles, little bits of fruits and
vegies. Then the kids could grab stuff from there by themselves. They also
really liked frozen raw vegies. And they still love frozen grapes. >>
In the summer, still, with our youngest ten years old, we freeze juice in ice
cube trays and put one Discovery Toys "Boom-a-ring" in each one for a handle.
It's a summer comfort thing for Holly. Marty and Kirby still grab one once
in a while. And neighbor and visiting little kids are VERY excited at the
idea that they can have two or three. And it's just orange juice or
cranberry juice. They can have the whole tray if they want! And the handles
go in the dishwasher.
Sandra