Kids and pets
Gwen
First some background - we live in my mom's daylight basement. Our space is the entire downstairs and we share the kitchen. We moved in last May and will likely be here for about five more years. Before we moved in there was a discussion about not adding any more pets to her house.
Megan has wanted a dog forever. Because of our living situation we have had to tell her that a dog is a possibility in the future, but not right now.
Well, on Sunday, my mom changed her mind. She said a smaller dog would be fine. She was thinking of something Cocker Spaniel size. As I check shelters and rescue organizations, I am
not finding anything in the small size she wanted that is also good
with small kids and cats. I am finding some medium sized (under fifty pounds) dogs that
might work for our family. There is also a family preference for something larger than a cat.
Her reasoning for not allowing a bigger dog is that they poop and pee in the yard and it ruins the grass. At one point my family owned a lab (after I had moved out of the house). No one took the dog for walks and it was left alone in the backyard for 90% of the time. It was also fed people food, never trained, and bascially not well cared for. While I know her belief makes sense to her, I think a well trained, well cared for dog would be an exception.
Megan, after being told "no dog", is beside herself with happiness about getting a dog. Megan is seven and wants a dog now. Today. Right now. Yesterday, even. I understand how hard this is for her. We've talked about making sure we get the right dog for our family. She's helping me look at dogs on petfinder.com. We are
talking about breeds and sizes and colors. We stopped at a shelter yesterday and while they didn't have a dog that would match what we needed, the attendant did bring out a dog that he thought we might like. It would not have been a good match. But Megan was hugely upset that we didn't take the dog home. Megan didn't even really like the dog we saw, but she really wants a dog now. I don't know how to help her. We did a visualization exercise about what her perfect dog would be like and that helped. She's going to have to meet all the dogs we look at and I know it is going to be really hard on her. She is getting upset just looking at pictures of dogs and realizing that this dog or that dog won't work for our family.
We are getting a dog. There is no question about that. While Megan is excited, I have to admit I am worried that I am taking on more than I can handle by adding a dog to the family. Zoe is 2.5, Megan is 7.5, we have a rabbit and cat. My husband works and goes to school full time. We take care of my niece on the weekends. There is alot going on and I'm sure adding one more thing is possible, but I still have concerns. I know I will be taking on 98% of the work of a new pet. My husband tells me I over-think things to the point of being paralyzed and he's mostly right. My only real experience with dogs is my family's lab, so I don't even know how a dog really behaves.
So, in addition to having trouble finding a dog in the pre-approved size, Megan wants a dog now and there is nothing available *right now*. I need some suggestions on how to make this waiting time easier for Megan. And helping her if she finds a dog she loves and we aren't able to get it (either it is adopted while we are deciding or it is too large).
Gwen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Megan has wanted a dog forever. Because of our living situation we have had to tell her that a dog is a possibility in the future, but not right now.
Well, on Sunday, my mom changed her mind. She said a smaller dog would be fine. She was thinking of something Cocker Spaniel size. As I check shelters and rescue organizations, I am
not finding anything in the small size she wanted that is also good
with small kids and cats. I am finding some medium sized (under fifty pounds) dogs that
might work for our family. There is also a family preference for something larger than a cat.
Her reasoning for not allowing a bigger dog is that they poop and pee in the yard and it ruins the grass. At one point my family owned a lab (after I had moved out of the house). No one took the dog for walks and it was left alone in the backyard for 90% of the time. It was also fed people food, never trained, and bascially not well cared for. While I know her belief makes sense to her, I think a well trained, well cared for dog would be an exception.
Megan, after being told "no dog", is beside herself with happiness about getting a dog. Megan is seven and wants a dog now. Today. Right now. Yesterday, even. I understand how hard this is for her. We've talked about making sure we get the right dog for our family. She's helping me look at dogs on petfinder.com. We are
talking about breeds and sizes and colors. We stopped at a shelter yesterday and while they didn't have a dog that would match what we needed, the attendant did bring out a dog that he thought we might like. It would not have been a good match. But Megan was hugely upset that we didn't take the dog home. Megan didn't even really like the dog we saw, but she really wants a dog now. I don't know how to help her. We did a visualization exercise about what her perfect dog would be like and that helped. She's going to have to meet all the dogs we look at and I know it is going to be really hard on her. She is getting upset just looking at pictures of dogs and realizing that this dog or that dog won't work for our family.
We are getting a dog. There is no question about that. While Megan is excited, I have to admit I am worried that I am taking on more than I can handle by adding a dog to the family. Zoe is 2.5, Megan is 7.5, we have a rabbit and cat. My husband works and goes to school full time. We take care of my niece on the weekends. There is alot going on and I'm sure adding one more thing is possible, but I still have concerns. I know I will be taking on 98% of the work of a new pet. My husband tells me I over-think things to the point of being paralyzed and he's mostly right. My only real experience with dogs is my family's lab, so I don't even know how a dog really behaves.
So, in addition to having trouble finding a dog in the pre-approved size, Megan wants a dog now and there is nothing available *right now*. I need some suggestions on how to make this waiting time easier for Megan. And helping her if she finds a dog she loves and we aren't able to get it (either it is adopted while we are deciding or it is too large).
Gwen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Jenny C
>about getting a dog. Megan is seven and wants a dog now. Today. Right
>>> Megan, after being told "no dog", is beside herself with happiness
now. Yesterday, even. I understand how hard this is for her. We've
talked about making sure we get the right dog for our family. She's
helping me look at dogs on petfinder.com. >>>
We had absolutely no luck looking for a dog at the humane society or
shelters. We looked within an 80 mile radius of our house. Where we
live, there was a weight restriction for dogs. It had to be under 40
lbs. That may seem like a big dog, but it's not.
We encountered the same kind of thing that you have at all the shelters,
they wouldn't adopt a small dog out to anyone with young children, and
Margaux was little at the time. I know why people give up and go to the
pet stores, they can get any dog they like there.
We looked for over a month at shelters, and petfinder, then I started
perusing craigslist. That is where I found our dog and we got her for
free, which was good because we had to get her spayed and all that. She
was 11 months old when we got her, so still a bit of a puppy, but potty
trained and trainable for other things still. In many ways, I think we
lucked out, but I also think, going through the pet ads on craigslist
was a way better means of finding what we wanted without all the
qualifying!
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
petfinder.com/
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
space_and_freedom
> I know why people give up and go to theIf you get to the point of paying for a breed, at least go to a breeder, not a pet store. A friend of mine got a schnoodle. Schnauzer/Poodle mix, no shedding, little dog, good with kids, and very cute.
> pet stores, they can get any dog they like there.
Jen H. (DD8, DD6, DS3)
Jenny C
>>>But Megan was hugely upset that we didn't take the dog home. Megandidn't even really like the dog we saw, but she really wants a dog now.
I don't know how to help her. We did a visualization exercise about
what her perfect dog would be like and that helped. She's going to have
to meet all the dogs we look at and I know it is going to be really hard
on her. She is getting upset just looking at pictures of dogs and
realizing that this dog or that dog won't work for our family.>>>
I just remember something that Chamille did when we were on our search.
She was the same way, every dog was hers from the moment we said "hi".
There were many heartbreaking moments that happened. She made herself a
folder of dogs. She did this on her own accord, she used a three ring
binder, and printed out pictures of the dogs that we met, that were on
petfinder or the humane society and put their names on the pictures and
put them all in a folder. I ran across that folder about a month or so
ago and it made me smile. I don't know why she did it, or what her
reasoning was for doing it, but it helped tremendously to keep on with
her search for the "right" dog.
Angela Shaw
If you went to see the dogs yourself without her first and only took her to
meet ones that you felt were possibly a good match, it might be easier on
her emotionally. I think Craig's list or a local newspaper might be a good
way to find a good dog. Sometimes families just realize they bit off more
than they could chew and even though the dog might be a nice dog, they may
still want to re-home him, often for free.
We got a dog last spring and even though I planned to do 95% of the dog
care, it is still frustrating sometimes when the kids complain about doing
something for him. I try to remember that I knew I would do 95% of the care
but I still get frustrated sometimes. (And it shows because he gives me 95%
of his attention) I would really recommend you try to find a mature dog that
was raised with children which would be easier than all the puppy training.
Angela
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
meet ones that you felt were possibly a good match, it might be easier on
her emotionally. I think Craig's list or a local newspaper might be a good
way to find a good dog. Sometimes families just realize they bit off more
than they could chew and even though the dog might be a nice dog, they may
still want to re-home him, often for free.
We got a dog last spring and even though I planned to do 95% of the dog
care, it is still frustrating sometimes when the kids complain about doing
something for him. I try to remember that I knew I would do 95% of the care
but I still get frustrated sometimes. (And it shows because he gives me 95%
of his attention) I would really recommend you try to find a mature dog that
was raised with children which would be easier than all the puppy training.
Angela
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Zerena
Hi I am new to this list but have to say that we have never gone out and
looked for a dog. Never wanted a dog actually because of our sensitivity to
flee bites. But we belong to the local freecycle groups on Vancouver Island
and one year just after we rented some acreage an Akita/Malamute came up for
adoption on it. It was perfect, we went to look at it and he came home with
us 3.5 yrs ago, the day before my husband's birthday and the same breeding
as his childhood dog. Then this past November (again we weren't looking) we
adopted a Shitzu/Boston Terrier from a friend who had 3 puppies left and
couldn't sell them. Both were free and neither were being sought out, they
just happened. I think sometimes we look too hard for things that when given
a chance what we want, or don't want, will appear at the right moment.
Maybe you can check the local freecycle groups (not all allow pet adoption)
and maybe check with friends and neighbours or put up signs. Could be
someone is looking to adopt out their pet or puppy and your ad will bring
the right one to you.
Zerena
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Jenny C
Sent: April-02-09 3:34 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Kids and pets
now. Yesterday, even. I understand how hard this is for her. We've
talked about making sure we get the right dog for our family. She's
helping me look at dogs on petfinder.com. >>>
We had absolutely no luck looking for a dog at the humane society or
shelters. We looked within an 80 mile radius of our house. Where we
live, there was a weight restriction for dogs. It had to be under 40
lbs. That may seem like a big dog, but it's not.
We encountered the same kind of thing that you have at all the shelters,
they wouldn't adopt a small dog out to anyone with young children, and
Margaux was little at the time. I know why people give up and go to the
pet stores, they can get any dog they like there.
We looked for over a month at shelters, and petfinder, then I started
perusing craigslist. That is where I found our dog and we got her for
free, which was good because we had to get her spayed and all that. She
was 11 months old when we got her, so still a bit of a puppy, but potty
trained and trainable for other things still. In many ways, I think we
lucked out, but I also think, going through the pet ads on craigslist
was a way better means of finding what we wanted without all the
qualifying!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
looked for a dog. Never wanted a dog actually because of our sensitivity to
flee bites. But we belong to the local freecycle groups on Vancouver Island
and one year just after we rented some acreage an Akita/Malamute came up for
adoption on it. It was perfect, we went to look at it and he came home with
us 3.5 yrs ago, the day before my husband's birthday and the same breeding
as his childhood dog. Then this past November (again we weren't looking) we
adopted a Shitzu/Boston Terrier from a friend who had 3 puppies left and
couldn't sell them. Both were free and neither were being sought out, they
just happened. I think sometimes we look too hard for things that when given
a chance what we want, or don't want, will appear at the right moment.
Maybe you can check the local freecycle groups (not all allow pet adoption)
and maybe check with friends and neighbours or put up signs. Could be
someone is looking to adopt out their pet or puppy and your ad will bring
the right one to you.
Zerena
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Jenny C
Sent: April-02-09 3:34 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Kids and pets
>about getting a dog. Megan is seven and wants a dog now. Today. Right
>>> Megan, after being told "no dog", is beside herself with happiness
now. Yesterday, even. I understand how hard this is for her. We've
talked about making sure we get the right dog for our family. She's
helping me look at dogs on petfinder.com. >>>
We had absolutely no luck looking for a dog at the humane society or
shelters. We looked within an 80 mile radius of our house. Where we
live, there was a weight restriction for dogs. It had to be under 40
lbs. That may seem like a big dog, but it's not.
We encountered the same kind of thing that you have at all the shelters,
they wouldn't adopt a small dog out to anyone with young children, and
Margaux was little at the time. I know why people give up and go to the
pet stores, they can get any dog they like there.
We looked for over a month at shelters, and petfinder, then I started
perusing craigslist. That is where I found our dog and we got her for
free, which was good because we had to get her spayed and all that. She
was 11 months old when we got her, so still a bit of a puppy, but potty
trained and trainable for other things still. In many ways, I think we
lucked out, but I also think, going through the pet ads on craigslist
was a way better means of finding what we wanted without all the
qualifying!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-If you went to see the dogs yourself without her first and only
took her to
meet ones that you felt were possibly a good match, it might be easier
on
her emotionally.-=-
When I needed to buy a van, I was impatient and wanted every one I
saw, so my husband and a friend of ours went shopping and only brought
home the ones they thought were great. The first one, I didn't love.
That was EASY! The second one I did love, and drove it until it fell
apart.
Going shopping for a car, for me, is "THIS ONE!" and that's not a good
way to shop.
-=I would really recommend you try to find a mature dog that
was raised with children which would be easier than all the puppy
training.-=-
Not generally as fun for the kids, though. <g>
I've had puppies, and you just have to factor in that you will might
lost some shoes, clothes or toys. Poor Holly had Barbies lose some
hands and feet.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
took her to
meet ones that you felt were possibly a good match, it might be easier
on
her emotionally.-=-
When I needed to buy a van, I was impatient and wanted every one I
saw, so my husband and a friend of ours went shopping and only brought
home the ones they thought were great. The first one, I didn't love.
That was EASY! The second one I did love, and drove it until it fell
apart.
Going shopping for a car, for me, is "THIS ONE!" and that's not a good
way to shop.
-=I would really recommend you try to find a mature dog that
was raised with children which would be easier than all the puppy
training.-=-
Not generally as fun for the kids, though. <g>
I've had puppies, and you just have to factor in that you will might
lost some shoes, clothes or toys. Poor Holly had Barbies lose some
hands and feet.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kelly_sturman
--- In [email protected], Gwen <willow_selene@...> wrote:
There is good reason that shelters and rescues (and many breeders)
do not want a dog to go to a home with children under eight years
of age.
http://www.canismajor.com/dog/kidsdog2.html
My husband works and goes to school full time. We take care of my niece
on the weekends.
You have a very full life! A dog is a big commitment. Dogs need
training, exercise, proper socialization at specific stages of their
development, grooming, vet care, proper nutrition, etc., etc. I do
not think you are over-thinking this; in fact, it is wise to go slowly.
Many people think of a dog as a "thing" but it is a living being, with
a 10-15 year life span, and definite needs of its own.
Considerations before you get a dog:
http://www.doginfomat.com/b4ugetadog.htm
How a real dog behaves depends upon its background
(both genetic and social) and how it is treated (trained, socialized,
exercised, etc.). If you don't know how a dog really behaves,
that is another reason to take this slowly and not rush into
a commitment you are not necessarily really and truly ready
to make.
children when they face disappointments? Surely there are
folks on this list who have lots of thoughtful ideas on how
to help children cope with disappointment.
What have you done to help her through past disappointments,
and would that work now?
I wish I could be more help regarding the issue of disappointment,
but you know Megan best.
I would proceed slowly. Just because grandmother has now
given approval and even if you have promised Megan you
will get a dog, you really do need to consider how Megan
would feel if you got a dog and then found you had to
give it up because you could not adequately care for it or
because a safety issue came up between the dog and the
kids.
YMMV,
Kelly Sturman
>As I check shelters and rescue organizations, I am not finding anythingin the small size she wanted that is also good with small kids and cats.
There is good reason that shelters and rescues (and many breeders)
do not want a dog to go to a home with children under eight years
of age.
http://www.canismajor.com/dog/kidsdog2.html
> I am worried that I am taking on more than I can handle by addinga dog to the family. Zoe is 2.5, Megan is 7.5, we have a rabbit and cat.
My husband works and goes to school full time. We take care of my niece
on the weekends.
You have a very full life! A dog is a big commitment. Dogs need
training, exercise, proper socialization at specific stages of their
development, grooming, vet care, proper nutrition, etc., etc. I do
not think you are over-thinking this; in fact, it is wise to go slowly.
Many people think of a dog as a "thing" but it is a living being, with
a 10-15 year life span, and definite needs of its own.
Considerations before you get a dog:
http://www.doginfomat.com/b4ugetadog.htm
>My only real experience with dogs is my family's lab, so I don't even knowhow a dog really behaves.
How a real dog behaves depends upon its background
(both genetic and social) and how it is treated (trained, socialized,
exercised, etc.). If you don't know how a dog really behaves,
that is another reason to take this slowly and not rush into
a commitment you are not necessarily really and truly ready
to make.
> I need some suggestions on how to make this waiting time easierOr, to phrase it in a more general way, how can we support our
> for Megan.
children when they face disappointments? Surely there are
folks on this list who have lots of thoughtful ideas on how
to help children cope with disappointment.
What have you done to help her through past disappointments,
and would that work now?
I wish I could be more help regarding the issue of disappointment,
but you know Megan best.
I would proceed slowly. Just because grandmother has now
given approval and even if you have promised Megan you
will get a dog, you really do need to consider how Megan
would feel if you got a dog and then found you had to
give it up because you could not adequately care for it or
because a safety issue came up between the dog and the
kids.
YMMV,
Kelly Sturman
Robyn L. Coburn
<<<< Poor Holly had Barbies lose some
dolls, she might be interested.
http://www.patriciaanders.com/?page_id=541
Robyn L. Coburn
www.Iggyjingles.etsy.com
www.iggyjingles.blogspot.com
www.allthingsdoll.blogspot.com
> hands and feet.>>>>Check out this doll artist and her plans. If Holly still has those damaged
dolls, she might be interested.
http://www.patriciaanders.com/?page_id=541
Robyn L. Coburn
www.Iggyjingles.etsy.com
www.iggyjingles.blogspot.com
www.allthingsdoll.blogspot.com
kelly_sturman
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
his gut and our choice was euthanasia or a very expensive surgery,
which the dog might not even survive, to open him up and remove
the blockage. We opted for the surgery and he did survive; he's
still with us in his dotage. Not to spread negativity to more
mailboxes, but our vet said this sort of event is not uncommon,
and as a mother of five children, plus three dogs (and a cat),
I *know* that when you chose to bring a dog, especially a pup,
into a home with children, you are choosing to take on a lot of
responsibility. I am also not comfortable with the analogy of
purchasing a thing (like a van). This is a living creature with
feelings, needs, wants, drives, its own unique personality and
perspective. I would approach this decision almost as seriously
as a decision to bring a new child into the family. Our society
says that dogs are disposable things, but then, our society says
a lot of things which we think about and realize are wrong... right?
Kelly Sturman
>One of our dogs chewed the head off a teddy bear. It lodged in
> I've had puppies, and you just have to factor in that you will might
> lost some shoes, clothes or toys. Poor Holly had Barbies lose some
> hands and feet.
his gut and our choice was euthanasia or a very expensive surgery,
which the dog might not even survive, to open him up and remove
the blockage. We opted for the surgery and he did survive; he's
still with us in his dotage. Not to spread negativity to more
mailboxes, but our vet said this sort of event is not uncommon,
and as a mother of five children, plus three dogs (and a cat),
I *know* that when you chose to bring a dog, especially a pup,
into a home with children, you are choosing to take on a lot of
responsibility. I am also not comfortable with the analogy of
purchasing a thing (like a van). This is a living creature with
feelings, needs, wants, drives, its own unique personality and
perspective. I would approach this decision almost as seriously
as a decision to bring a new child into the family. Our society
says that dogs are disposable things, but then, our society says
a lot of things which we think about and realize are wrong... right?
Kelly Sturman
Pam Sorooshian
On 4/2/2009 7:39 PM, kelly_sturman wrote:
eagerness compared to Sandra's.
considered as long-term commitment, you CAN give a dog away a whole lot
more easily than you can give your child away. I don't think that is a
great comparison.
something you think was wrong.
My dog is 14 years old. We got her as an 8 week old puppy when my kids
were 10, 7, and 4. Golden retriever. She's as sweet as sweet can be and
I don't regret one minute of having her. The children LOVED her and
she's part of our family. We've never had any problems with her and
children. She chewed a few things over the years. We never really
"trained" her, but somehow she learned to "sit" and "stay" just from
people fooling around with her. She doesn't bark. She doesn't whine. She
has very occasionally dug a hole in a flower bed. She stayed VERY
puppy-like for a couple of years - lots of energy. But, even so, dogs
sleep a LOT.
If I had it to do again, I'd get a smaller dog - maybe a 30 poundish
one. That's just because it would be more convenient for traveling. My
sister has had different smaller dogs - both poodle/something mixes and
both have been truly awesome dogs with little children. My other sister
has two australian shepherds and I wouldn't recommend them for families
just because they absolutely need to get out and get a LOT of exercise
every single day. Smaller dogs can get enough exercise running around
the house with the kids, so that's a big plus.
Kids and dogs are great together if you do some good research on which
breeds are calm and handle being handled well.
-pam
> Not to spread negativity to moreSomeone posting here for advice is probably not taking it overly lightly.
> mailboxes, but our vet said this sort of event is not uncommon,
> and as a mother of five children, plus three dogs (and a cat),
> I*know* that when you chose to bring a dog, especially a pup,
> into a home with children, you are choosing to take on a lot of
> responsibility.
> I am also not comfortable with the analogy ofThe analogy wasn't the dog compared to the van, it was the child's
> purchasing a thing (like a van).
eagerness compared to Sandra's.
> This is a living creature withI don't know what your "almost" means - but, while I agree it should be
> feelings, needs, wants, drives, its own unique personality and
> perspective. I would approach this decision almost as seriously
> as a decision to bring a new child into the family.
considered as long-term commitment, you CAN give a dog away a whole lot
more easily than you can give your child away. I don't think that is a
great comparison.
> Our societyMaybe your society does. I don't know anybody who would say that.
> says that dogs are disposable things,
> but then, our society saysYou said something that I think was wrong. I'm sure I've just said
> a lot of things which we think about and realize are wrong... right?
>
something you think was wrong.
My dog is 14 years old. We got her as an 8 week old puppy when my kids
were 10, 7, and 4. Golden retriever. She's as sweet as sweet can be and
I don't regret one minute of having her. The children LOVED her and
she's part of our family. We've never had any problems with her and
children. She chewed a few things over the years. We never really
"trained" her, but somehow she learned to "sit" and "stay" just from
people fooling around with her. She doesn't bark. She doesn't whine. She
has very occasionally dug a hole in a flower bed. She stayed VERY
puppy-like for a couple of years - lots of energy. But, even so, dogs
sleep a LOT.
If I had it to do again, I'd get a smaller dog - maybe a 30 poundish
one. That's just because it would be more convenient for traveling. My
sister has had different smaller dogs - both poodle/something mixes and
both have been truly awesome dogs with little children. My other sister
has two australian shepherds and I wouldn't recommend them for families
just because they absolutely need to get out and get a LOT of exercise
every single day. Smaller dogs can get enough exercise running around
the house with the kids, so that's a big plus.
Kids and dogs are great together if you do some good research on which
breeds are calm and handle being handled well.
-pam
Sandra Dodd
-=-> I am also not comfortable with the analogy of
eagerness compared to Sandra's.-=-
Correct. But it's okay for someone to be uncomfortable with my
analogies.
When Marty wanted a dog, 11 years or 12 ago, I took him to the city
shelter, and then to the other shelter 15 miles away, and then to the
humane society, and back to both city shelters. I was amazed that he
could say no to so many dogs who so obviously wanted to go home with us.
I wish someone else had taken him, who also found it easy to say "not
this one." I would have taken the first dog that looked at me
lovingly. Marty had other criteria.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> purchasing a thing (like a van).-=-The analogy wasn't the dog compared to the van, it was the child's
eagerness compared to Sandra's.-=-
Correct. But it's okay for someone to be uncomfortable with my
analogies.
When Marty wanted a dog, 11 years or 12 ago, I took him to the city
shelter, and then to the other shelter 15 miles away, and then to the
humane society, and back to both city shelters. I was amazed that he
could say no to so many dogs who so obviously wanted to go home with us.
I wish someone else had taken him, who also found it easy to say "not
this one." I would have taken the first dog that looked at me
lovingly. Marty had other criteria.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-
I would proceed slowly. Just because grandmother has now
given approval and even if you have promised Megan you
will get a dog, you really do need to consider how Megan
would feel if you got a dog and then found you had to
give it up because you could not adequately care for it or
because a safety issue came up between the dog and the
kids.-=-
That, and the stress of living in someone else's house (five years is
a LONG TIME in kid years) would make me say "Not until we have our own
place; sorry."
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I would proceed slowly. Just because grandmother has now
given approval and even if you have promised Megan you
will get a dog, you really do need to consider how Megan
would feel if you got a dog and then found you had to
give it up because you could not adequately care for it or
because a safety issue came up between the dog and the
kids.-=-
That, and the stress of living in someone else's house (five years is
a LONG TIME in kid years) would make me say "Not until we have our own
place; sorry."
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kelly_sturman
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>I misread/misunderstood and apologize for that confusion.
> -=-> I am also not comfortable with the analogy of
> > purchasing a thing (like a van).
>
> -=-The analogy wasn't the dog compared to the van, it was the child's
> eagerness compared to Sandra's.-=-
>
kelly_sturman
--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
urgency sets off my alarm bells. op mentioned DH saying she
over thinks things, and that *that* is probably a correct assessment.
I only meant that in this case, it really does *not* sound like she is over
thinking it. It really *is* a big decision.
energy, patience, and attention to be well-cared for. If it is a pup,
then it is a baby. Not a human baby, but still, it will have many
constant needs to be met. With two young children in the home
(three on the weekends), op would do well to really stop and consider if
she has the time and energy to devote to another living being, and still
be fully present for them all, and not wear herself down. And she is
very honest about the fact that she is questioning that. She also very honestly
states that she doesn't know what a normal dog is like, which is one
reason I suggest slowing down and thinking about this more.
poke eyes and pull ears and tails and hug tightly and don't
realize that this is hurting the dog. They are just exploring!
Still, it is very natural for the dog to react by biting the child.
This does not mean that the dog is vicious, but it can't stay,
"Please stop!" or "Ouch, that hurts!" The dog can't push curious
hands away. The dog has a growl, which a toddler may well
not understand means, "I don't like that!" And the dog has teeth.
Once the dog has bitten, finding it a home becomes more difficult.
It gets labeled "vicious dog." I'm speaking from experience.
And while some adults may find giving the dog away easy,
I think many children would find it a great disappointment
to have to give up their dog. As the op is very concerned
about her DDs sense of disappointment, that is a real
concern that merits more consideration... IMO.
society" on this list. Fair enough.
dogs. And those dogs weren't calm; they were Border Collies! I am not saying,
"Don't do this!" I *am* saying, "Don't rush into this." Megan is in a big hurry,
but mother should set the pace in this case. She may very well be doing
exactly that, but if so, that didn't come through clearly in the original
post.
We've given op one idea on how to help Megan deal with disappointment:
show her fewer dogs. So that is one thing she can do. And what else?
Would spending time with other people's dogs... dogs that have families...
where it is clear that Megan is just visiting, not looking for a dog of
her own to keep... would that help Megan during the wait for the perfect
dog? If she wanted to, and the dog's owners were willing, Megan could
play with the dogs, pat them, maybe help groom them, maybe help
feed them, maybe walk them. Is there a dog in the neighborhood she
could befriend? Or a local dog park she could visit, one that allows kids
under 8 to come in? (Some don't for the same reasons that many agencies
won't adopt dogs out to families with kids under 8.)
That would give her some opportunity to experience the joys
of being around dogs, and if there was a very clear understanding that
these dogs are for making friends with, not for bringing into our own
family, could Megan enjoy something like that? It would also give her
more opportunities to spend time with dogs, and then go home without
the dogs. That could be good or bad for Megan. Her mom would be
the best judge of that.
What about reading dog books? I read a book at Christmastime, _A Dog
Named Christmas_ by Greg Kincaid. Kinda saccharine for my taste,
but, still heartwarming, and on-topic. It's about a Vietnam vet who
doesn't want to commit to bringing another dog into the family,
after the painful loss of two dogs, and his conflict with an adult son
(20 yo son, with Down Syndrome, who wants very much to have a dog.)
I wonder if Megan would enjoy having her mother read this story to
her? My 8 yo's wouldn't find the war references and the father's sadness
too heavy... but mine are not Megan! The book has a lot of good
messages about relationships and overcoming grief and taking a chance,
even when it feels uncomfortable, on saying "yes." It presents the young
man in a positive light, too; he is the real hero of the story and the father
is really focused on all the wonderful things that the young man can do,
rather than being focused on his "disability." And, of course, the young
man does convince his father (and many others in their community) to get
a dog, and all works out happily. So, that might be a good read, if Megan
likes being read to, or perhaps others could suggest books with a similar
theme: child wants dog and is disappointed at having to wait to see that happen?
Oh! Some more thoughts on books... if books will help.
_The Stray Dog_ is a nice picture book, (and a true story!), about a family
that finds the perfect dog when they aren't looking for it.
_A Dog on Barkham Street_ is about two boys, one boy who loses his dog
because his parents expect him to take care of it, and he doesn't, 'cause he's
just a kid and not ready for that responsibility, and one boy who gains a dog
but loses an uncle. The boy's feelings of disappointment, and yes, shame, come
through. We read it here and it led to interesting observations from my kids on
how those boys' parents had a very different relationship with him (and his sister,
and each other) than the relationships we have in our family. It is told from the
POV of the boy who gets to keep the perfect dog, but has to lose an uncle in
the process.
_The Bully of Barkham Street_ tells the same story from the other boy's POV.
Warning: One of these books includes a scene in which some boys get
accidentally locked in a boxcar, and there is some hinting at the fact that
it was lucky that they were found before they died in there. Might be
disturbing for a 7 yo!
I *loved* anything by James Herriot when I was Megan's age. I read
those books voraciously as a girl, even though I already had a dog and two
cats.
Kelly Sturman
>I apologize if I sounded caustic or judgmental. The sense of
> Someone posting here for advice is probably not taking it overly lightly.
urgency sets off my alarm bells. op mentioned DH saying she
over thinks things, and that *that* is probably a correct assessment.
I only meant that in this case, it really does *not* sound like she is over
thinking it. It really *is* a big decision.
> > This is a living creature withAlmost in that the dog may very well take a great deal of time,
> > feelings, needs, wants, drives, its own unique personality and
> > perspective. I would approach this decision almost as seriously
> > as a decision to bring a new child into the family.
> I don't know what your "almost" means -
energy, patience, and attention to be well-cared for. If it is a pup,
then it is a baby. Not a human baby, but still, it will have many
constant needs to be met. With two young children in the home
(three on the weekends), op would do well to really stop and consider if
she has the time and energy to devote to another living being, and still
be fully present for them all, and not wear herself down. And she is
very honest about the fact that she is questioning that. She also very honestly
states that she doesn't know what a normal dog is like, which is one
reason I suggest slowing down and thinking about this more.
> but, while I agree it should bein the home, biting is a real possibility. Toddlers explore. They
> considered as long-term commitment, you CAN give a dog
> away a whole lot more easily than you can give your child away.
>Yes, as long as it has not bitten anybody. And with a toddler
poke eyes and pull ears and tails and hug tightly and don't
realize that this is hurting the dog. They are just exploring!
Still, it is very natural for the dog to react by biting the child.
This does not mean that the dog is vicious, but it can't stay,
"Please stop!" or "Ouch, that hurts!" The dog can't push curious
hands away. The dog has a growl, which a toddler may well
not understand means, "I don't like that!" And the dog has teeth.
Once the dog has bitten, finding it a home becomes more difficult.
It gets labeled "vicious dog." I'm speaking from experience.
And while some adults may find giving the dog away easy,
I think many children would find it a great disappointment
to have to give up their dog. As the op is very concerned
about her DDs sense of disappointment, that is a real
concern that merits more consideration... IMO.
> Our society says that dogs are disposable things,Okay, I meant "American mainstream society" which is not "our
>
> Maybe your society does. I don't know anybody who would say that.
society" on this list. Fair enough.
> Kids and dogs are great together if you do some good research on whichAbsolutely. Our family, too, has successfully combined toddlers and
> breeds are calm and handle being handled well.
dogs. And those dogs weren't calm; they were Border Collies! I am not saying,
"Don't do this!" I *am* saying, "Don't rush into this." Megan is in a big hurry,
but mother should set the pace in this case. She may very well be doing
exactly that, but if so, that didn't come through clearly in the original
post.
We've given op one idea on how to help Megan deal with disappointment:
show her fewer dogs. So that is one thing she can do. And what else?
Would spending time with other people's dogs... dogs that have families...
where it is clear that Megan is just visiting, not looking for a dog of
her own to keep... would that help Megan during the wait for the perfect
dog? If she wanted to, and the dog's owners were willing, Megan could
play with the dogs, pat them, maybe help groom them, maybe help
feed them, maybe walk them. Is there a dog in the neighborhood she
could befriend? Or a local dog park she could visit, one that allows kids
under 8 to come in? (Some don't for the same reasons that many agencies
won't adopt dogs out to families with kids under 8.)
That would give her some opportunity to experience the joys
of being around dogs, and if there was a very clear understanding that
these dogs are for making friends with, not for bringing into our own
family, could Megan enjoy something like that? It would also give her
more opportunities to spend time with dogs, and then go home without
the dogs. That could be good or bad for Megan. Her mom would be
the best judge of that.
What about reading dog books? I read a book at Christmastime, _A Dog
Named Christmas_ by Greg Kincaid. Kinda saccharine for my taste,
but, still heartwarming, and on-topic. It's about a Vietnam vet who
doesn't want to commit to bringing another dog into the family,
after the painful loss of two dogs, and his conflict with an adult son
(20 yo son, with Down Syndrome, who wants very much to have a dog.)
I wonder if Megan would enjoy having her mother read this story to
her? My 8 yo's wouldn't find the war references and the father's sadness
too heavy... but mine are not Megan! The book has a lot of good
messages about relationships and overcoming grief and taking a chance,
even when it feels uncomfortable, on saying "yes." It presents the young
man in a positive light, too; he is the real hero of the story and the father
is really focused on all the wonderful things that the young man can do,
rather than being focused on his "disability." And, of course, the young
man does convince his father (and many others in their community) to get
a dog, and all works out happily. So, that might be a good read, if Megan
likes being read to, or perhaps others could suggest books with a similar
theme: child wants dog and is disappointed at having to wait to see that happen?
Oh! Some more thoughts on books... if books will help.
_The Stray Dog_ is a nice picture book, (and a true story!), about a family
that finds the perfect dog when they aren't looking for it.
_A Dog on Barkham Street_ is about two boys, one boy who loses his dog
because his parents expect him to take care of it, and he doesn't, 'cause he's
just a kid and not ready for that responsibility, and one boy who gains a dog
but loses an uncle. The boy's feelings of disappointment, and yes, shame, come
through. We read it here and it led to interesting observations from my kids on
how those boys' parents had a very different relationship with him (and his sister,
and each other) than the relationships we have in our family. It is told from the
POV of the boy who gets to keep the perfect dog, but has to lose an uncle in
the process.
_The Bully of Barkham Street_ tells the same story from the other boy's POV.
Warning: One of these books includes a scene in which some boys get
accidentally locked in a boxcar, and there is some hinting at the fact that
it was lucky that they were found before they died in there. Might be
disturbing for a 7 yo!
I *loved* anything by James Herriot when I was Megan's age. I read
those books voraciously as a girl, even though I already had a dog and two
cats.
Kelly Sturman
Gwen
I think that unless we pick the first dog we meet, there will be lots of little heartbreaks for her.
The right dog for her is the first one that says "hi" too. She also wants a dog that will play fetch and can maybe be taught some tricks *and* likes to snuggle with her.
The right dog for our family is one to five years old, housebroken, leash trained, and under fifty pounds.
We were talking about it tonight and she asked that I look at the dogs on petfinder.com and only show her the ones that might work for us. She said it was too frustrating seeing all those other dogs.
She did pull out her dog breed book and look at that for awhile tonight. Most of the dogs we are looking at are mixed breed, so she wanted to compare sizes and colors of the different mixes. Mixed breeds are one of those things that really spark her interest. It is one of the things that bleed over into Pokemon too!
Gwen
The right dog for her is the first one that says "hi" too. She also wants a dog that will play fetch and can maybe be taught some tricks *and* likes to snuggle with her.
The right dog for our family is one to five years old, housebroken, leash trained, and under fifty pounds.
We were talking about it tonight and she asked that I look at the dogs on petfinder.com and only show her the ones that might work for us. She said it was too frustrating seeing all those other dogs.
She did pull out her dog breed book and look at that for awhile tonight. Most of the dogs we are looking at are mixed breed, so she wanted to compare sizes and colors of the different mixes. Mixed breeds are one of those things that really spark her interest. It is one of the things that bleed over into Pokemon too!
Gwen
--- On Thu, 4/2/09, Jenny C <jenstarc4@...> wrote:
I just remember something that Chamille did when we were on our search.
She was the same way, every dog was hers from the moment we said
"hi".
There were many heartbreaking moments that happened. She made herself a
folder of dogs. She did this on her own accord, she used a three ring
binder, and printed out pictures of the dogs that we met, that were on
petfinder or the humane society and put their names on the pictures and
put them all in a folder. I ran across that folder about a month or so
ago and it made me smile. I don't know why she did it, or what her
reasoning was for doing it, but it helped tremendously to keep on with
her search for the "right" dog.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Gwen
That is exactly what we are looking for. I know a puppy isn't the dog for us right now. I'd like a slightly older dog (around five or so).
Leaving Megan behind isn't an option. We don't have someone to watch her and she really does want to meet each dog. The biggest consideration is how she and the dog interact, so leaving her behind doesn't make sense in this case.
Gwen
Leaving Megan behind isn't an option. We don't have someone to watch her and she really does want to meet each dog. The biggest consideration is how she and the dog interact, so leaving her behind doesn't make sense in this case.
Gwen
--- On Thu, 4/2/09, Angela Shaw <game-enthusiast@...> wrote:
From: Angela Shaw <game-enthusiast@...>
Subject: RE: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Kids and pets
To: [email protected]
Date: Thursday, April 2, 2009, 9:18 PM
If you went to see the dogs yourself without her first and only took her to
meet ones that you felt were possibly a good match, it might be easier on
her emotionally. I think Craig's list or a local newspaper might be a good
way to find a good dog. Sometimes families just realize they bit off more
than they could chew and even though the dog might be a nice dog, they may
still want to re-home him, often for free.
We got a dog last spring and even though I planned to do 95% of the dog
care, it is still frustrating sometimes when the kids complain about doing
something for him. I try to remember that I knew I would do 95% of the care
but I still get frustrated sometimes. (And it shows because he gives me 95%
of his attention) I would really recommend you try to find a mature dog that
was raised with children which would be easier than all the puppy training.
Angela
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Gwen
Thank you for the links. Everything I read are things that have been taken into consideration. We are looking for an older dog, not a puppy. We have "permission" now, but my husband and I have been discussing the pros and cons of getting a dog for over a year.
I don't know if Megan is dealing with disappointment exactly. Maybe impatience. I imagine it feels like Christmas, but with no way to count down the exact date. If I could say in "x" number of days we'll have a dog, I know it would be easier for her.
We've talked about how it might take us several weeks or even a month (or longer) to find the right dog for us. But a month is a long time to wait.
Gwen
I don't know if Megan is dealing with disappointment exactly. Maybe impatience. I imagine it feels like Christmas, but with no way to count down the exact date. If I could say in "x" number of days we'll have a dog, I know it would be easier for her.
We've talked about how it might take us several weeks or even a month (or longer) to find the right dog for us. But a month is a long time to wait.
Gwen
--- On Thu, 4/2/09, kelly_sturman <kelly_sturman@...> wrote:
Or, to phrase it in a more general way, how can we support our
children when they face disappointments? Surely there are
folks on this list who have lots of thoughtful ideas on how
to help children cope with disappointment.
What have you done to help her through past disappointments,
and would that work now?
I wish I could be more help regarding the issue of disappointment,
but you know Megan best.
I would proceed slowly. Just because grandmother has now
given approval and even if you have promised Megan you
will get a dog, you really do need to consider how Megan
would feel if you got a dog and then found you had to
give it up because you could not adequately care for it or
because a safety issue came up between the dog and the
kids.
YMMV,
Kelly Sturman
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Gwen
To use Sandra's minivan analogy - I'm the type of buyer who would research every model, ask questions on a discussion board, make notes of all the specs, make a list of what I'd be using the mini-van for, test drive multiple models at different dealerships, make a comparison list of some kind, and probably bring along a tape measure to make sure the measurements were correct. And install the carseats in the back so I can get a feel of my space after things have been added to it.
The immediacy is on Megan's part. I'm just trying not to drag out the process. Which isn't to say that I'm not being very, very selective.
Gwen
The immediacy is on Megan's part. I'm just trying not to drag out the process. Which isn't to say that I'm not being very, very selective.
Gwen
--- On Thu, 4/2/09, kelly_sturman <kelly_sturman@...> wrote:
I apologize if I sounded caustic or judgmental. The sense of
urgency sets off my alarm bells. op mentioned DH saying she
over thinks things, and that *that* is probably a correct assessment.
I only meant that in this case, it really does *not* sound like she is over
thinking it. It really *is* a big decision.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Jimi Ann
Hi Gwen. I don't have any answers on how to help Megan to wait -- but I wanted to share our experience in owning dogs.
First to say, we are CAT people, I am not a DOG person. So, we started with one of those little hot-dog dogs, a miniature one (I can't remember their official name), but anyway, it was a pure-bred, and to me, seemed brain-dead. He was hyper as he could be, and we had no success in training him. After I'd take him out to pee, or for a walk, he'd come right back in and pee on the bed. And by walk, I mean ME carrying him because he refused to walk! We found him a nice new home. At the time, my oldest was a toddler, and Penny, the dog, would jump up in his face and scratch him a lot.
Next we tried a lab mix from the shelter. Mistake for us. When I would go outside to feed him, he'd flatten me on the ground, standing on me, licking my face (like Dino in Flintstone's!). He was a very happy, well-meaning dog, just too, too hyper. I took him to dog obedience school for a month, but to no avail. We found him a nice new home.
The last try was Tasha. She was a golden retriever/chow mix. Another big mistake. That dog never stopped barking. She was very sweet and very hyper also. My niece took her for us after we had Tasha about a year.
IF we try a dog again, we want to get a big, lazy dog, like a St. Bernard. I've read that even though they're huge, they don't eat as much as a hyper dog, like a lab, because they're so sedate. They just lay around and look cute, and let the children lay on them. That's my kind of dog.
Let us know what kind you end up getting. I'd be interested to hear about it. Jimi Ann
First to say, we are CAT people, I am not a DOG person. So, we started with one of those little hot-dog dogs, a miniature one (I can't remember their official name), but anyway, it was a pure-bred, and to me, seemed brain-dead. He was hyper as he could be, and we had no success in training him. After I'd take him out to pee, or for a walk, he'd come right back in and pee on the bed. And by walk, I mean ME carrying him because he refused to walk! We found him a nice new home. At the time, my oldest was a toddler, and Penny, the dog, would jump up in his face and scratch him a lot.
Next we tried a lab mix from the shelter. Mistake for us. When I would go outside to feed him, he'd flatten me on the ground, standing on me, licking my face (like Dino in Flintstone's!). He was a very happy, well-meaning dog, just too, too hyper. I took him to dog obedience school for a month, but to no avail. We found him a nice new home.
The last try was Tasha. She was a golden retriever/chow mix. Another big mistake. That dog never stopped barking. She was very sweet and very hyper also. My niece took her for us after we had Tasha about a year.
IF we try a dog again, we want to get a big, lazy dog, like a St. Bernard. I've read that even though they're huge, they don't eat as much as a hyper dog, like a lab, because they're so sedate. They just lay around and look cute, and let the children lay on them. That's my kind of dog.
Let us know what kind you end up getting. I'd be interested to hear about it. Jimi Ann
Jenny C
>>>Mixed breeds are one of those things that really spark her interest.It is one of the things that bleed over into Pokemon too! >>>
Do we have the same child?!?! I'm kidding of course, but having a dog,
and the right kind of dog, with the right kind of attributes, was very
much like going Pokemon hunting, looking and looking and finally
catching one to train! It's just one of the many things that came from
and was inspired by the love of Pokemon!
k
>>>> Maybe you can check the local freecycle groups (not all allow pet adoption)and maybe check with friends and neighbours or put up signs. Could be
someone is looking to adopt out their pet or puppy and your ad will bring
the right one to you. <<<<
I have a cat from freecycle. It was meant for company for my other
cat. Eventually it worked out but it might not have. I knew some of
the risks, that the cat might have been ill-treated and not be able to
overcome some of the conditioning. I kept in contact with the
freecycler by email and phone for a while to get information. The cat
was not spayed but had all her shots.
The freecycler reluctantly agreed to keep in contact .... which to me
was a sign that something was wrong. And there was. She had had many
cats and one tom cat she just had neutered had been confined to the
same small space of the cat she gave me. Also a toddler who had been
rough on the cat. My freecycler lived in a mobile home, and she had
rescued my cat as a kitten which had been hiding underneath the
bathtub. All 5 of the cats she had were in a mobile home and it was
too many, so they were having lots of behavior problems (peeing and
spraying). She insisted on keeping them all indoors even though some
of them really wanted out.
I was lucky to have the history of my cat to help me provide better
care and know some of the things that she was struggling with. I knew
she and my other cat might not end up being friends but took her in
because I had more space and have had lots of experience with cats
through the years. Now that we have so much space and live in the
country, my two cats are pretty happy and get along well together.
My suggestion when dealing with freecycle folks is to keep in contact
if at all possible. If you haven't had a lot of experience with your
type of pet, then I personally don't recommend freecycle.
~Katherine
Sandra Dodd
-=-Leaving Megan behind isn't an option. We don't have someone to
watch her and she really does want to meet each dog. -=-
Yes, it is an option. It's an option you've chosen against.
The question was how to avoid her frustration and disappointment. If
that is NOT your priority, that's okay.
Asking a question and rejecting all the advice isn't a good use of
this list.
http://sandradodd.com/choice
If you feel something "isn't an option" or you have no choice, you're
not thinking about what you're going to do, and that is acting
thoughtlessly. You either make a choice or you believe or decide you
don't have a choice.
Making choices and helping children learn to make choices is a move
toward understanding unschooling.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
watch her and she really does want to meet each dog. -=-
Yes, it is an option. It's an option you've chosen against.
The question was how to avoid her frustration and disappointment. If
that is NOT your priority, that's okay.
Asking a question and rejecting all the advice isn't a good use of
this list.
http://sandradodd.com/choice
If you feel something "isn't an option" or you have no choice, you're
not thinking about what you're going to do, and that is acting
thoughtlessly. You either make a choice or you believe or decide you
don't have a choice.
Making choices and helping children learn to make choices is a move
toward understanding unschooling.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Zerena
When we got ours from freecycle we did keep in contact with the other
family. Their situation had changed in that they were moving to a different
province and didn't have a way to transport him in their small car (he's a
61 lb fur ball), with their toddler, and no home for him when they arrived.
They were very upset to have to leave him but were happy with us, they even
sent him a Christmas package that first year. We hear from them from time to
time. Our dog was in a dog run so not free to roam the fenced yard, we kept
him on a chain for the first few months to get him used to us and our home,
then started letting him off during the day when we were home and then
always off unless we were away for a weekend, we lived on an unfenced 20
acres. We did have to take our children when we went to see him to see if he
would fit with us. My youngest was afraid of some bigger dogs after being
constantly (and unintentionally) knocked over by a friends pair of
Dobermans, they were young and were unaware of their bodies. While Yukon is
a high energy bouncy type of dog, he settled right down after his first
bounce around all of us and my youngest loved him.
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of k
Sent: April-03-09 8:33 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Kids and pets
and maybe check with friends and neighbours or put up signs. Could be
someone is looking to adopt out their pet or puppy and your ad will bring
the right one to you. <<<<
I have a cat from freecycle. It was meant for company for my other
cat. Eventually it worked out but it might not have. I knew some of
the risks, that the cat might have been ill-treated and not be able to
overcome some of the conditioning. I kept in contact with the
freecycler by email and phone for a while to get information. The cat
was not spayed but had all her shots.
The freecycler reluctantly agreed to keep in contact .... which to me
was a sign that something was wrong. And there was. She had had many
cats and one tom cat she just had neutered had been confined to the
same small space of the cat she gave me. Also a toddler who had been
rough on the cat. My freecycler lived in a mobile home, and she had
rescued my cat as a kitten which had been hiding underneath the
bathtub. All 5 of the cats she had were in a mobile home and it was
too many, so they were having lots of behavior problems (peeing and
spraying). She insisted on keeping them all indoors even though some
of them really wanted out.
I was lucky to have the history of my cat to help me provide better
care and know some of the things that she was struggling with. I knew
she and my other cat might not end up being friends but took her in
because I had more space and have had lots of experience with cats
through the years. Now that we have so much space and live in the
country, my two cats are pretty happy and get along well together.
My suggestion when dealing with freecycle folks is to keep in contact
if at all possible. If you haven't had a lot of experience with your
type of pet, then I personally don't recommend freecycle.
~Katherine
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
family. Their situation had changed in that they were moving to a different
province and didn't have a way to transport him in their small car (he's a
61 lb fur ball), with their toddler, and no home for him when they arrived.
They were very upset to have to leave him but were happy with us, they even
sent him a Christmas package that first year. We hear from them from time to
time. Our dog was in a dog run so not free to roam the fenced yard, we kept
him on a chain for the first few months to get him used to us and our home,
then started letting him off during the day when we were home and then
always off unless we were away for a weekend, we lived on an unfenced 20
acres. We did have to take our children when we went to see him to see if he
would fit with us. My youngest was afraid of some bigger dogs after being
constantly (and unintentionally) knocked over by a friends pair of
Dobermans, they were young and were unaware of their bodies. While Yukon is
a high energy bouncy type of dog, he settled right down after his first
bounce around all of us and my youngest loved him.
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of k
Sent: April-03-09 8:33 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Kids and pets
>>>> Maybe you can check the local freecycle groups (not all allow petadoption)
and maybe check with friends and neighbours or put up signs. Could be
someone is looking to adopt out their pet or puppy and your ad will bring
the right one to you. <<<<
I have a cat from freecycle. It was meant for company for my other
cat. Eventually it worked out but it might not have. I knew some of
the risks, that the cat might have been ill-treated and not be able to
overcome some of the conditioning. I kept in contact with the
freecycler by email and phone for a while to get information. The cat
was not spayed but had all her shots.
The freecycler reluctantly agreed to keep in contact .... which to me
was a sign that something was wrong. And there was. She had had many
cats and one tom cat she just had neutered had been confined to the
same small space of the cat she gave me. Also a toddler who had been
rough on the cat. My freecycler lived in a mobile home, and she had
rescued my cat as a kitten which had been hiding underneath the
bathtub. All 5 of the cats she had were in a mobile home and it was
too many, so they were having lots of behavior problems (peeing and
spraying). She insisted on keeping them all indoors even though some
of them really wanted out.
I was lucky to have the history of my cat to help me provide better
care and know some of the things that she was struggling with. I knew
she and my other cat might not end up being friends but took her in
because I had more space and have had lots of experience with cats
through the years. Now that we have so much space and live in the
country, my two cats are pretty happy and get along well together.
My suggestion when dealing with freecycle folks is to keep in contact
if at all possible. If you haven't had a lot of experience with your
type of pet, then I personally don't recommend freecycle.
~Katherine
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Robyn L. Coburn
<<<<My youngest was afraid of some bigger dogs after being
have dobies in Australia that were direct from breeders. One was sitting
outside her front gate in Galveston all beat up just waiting for her to come
out one morning. The shelter knew to call her when a doby came in which is
how she got her fourth as a pup (not all 4 at once). Eventually when Mom was
very ill, my dad found a lovely retired couple, former dog breeders with a
ranch, to take the old lady and still youngish male. The dogs are/were
really happy there. But from Mom's experience of what must be close to a
dozen different dobies over the course of 30+ years, they are not a breed
that likes children. Just not, in general. Plus very territorial. Henry
believed that Mom was alpha dog, but he was absolutely number 2 ahead of my
dad, Chelsea (dog) and anyone else in the house! He had to be locked out
when the maid came (she was terrified), and locked in when the pool guy came
(he was terrified), just because he would bail anyone up against a wall
until Mom (and only Mom) called him off. This was not a trained behavior; it
was his territorial personality. When we stayed there with Jayn the dogs
went into the Kennels.
Poodles - standard and smaller - now they love children. They can be played
with and are very patient with little ones. My uncle had a standard for a
long time who was a dear and very cute when his hair was long. My friend's
toddler was once saved from falling over a cliff by their standard poodle
who continually placed himself between the baby and the edge, barking oddly
until mom came running. They don't shed at all, and my friend also has a
bunch of cats in the house with which the poodle got along fine. So a poodle
or poodle mix might be a good choice for someone where there are concerns
about mess and relatively small spaces and other pets already.
Someone who knows more about St. Bernard's might be better to speak up, but
they are a working dog - they were bred to rescue people lost in the snow -
so perhaps the lying around personality is a bit of a movie myth?
Robyn L. Coburn
www.Iggyjingles.etsy.com
www.iggyjingles.blogspot.com
www.allthingsdoll.blogspot.com
> constantly (and unintentionally) knocked over by a friends pair ofMy mom had dobermans in later years that were all rescue dogs, and used to
> Dobermans, they were young and were unaware of their bodies. >>>>
have dobies in Australia that were direct from breeders. One was sitting
outside her front gate in Galveston all beat up just waiting for her to come
out one morning. The shelter knew to call her when a doby came in which is
how she got her fourth as a pup (not all 4 at once). Eventually when Mom was
very ill, my dad found a lovely retired couple, former dog breeders with a
ranch, to take the old lady and still youngish male. The dogs are/were
really happy there. But from Mom's experience of what must be close to a
dozen different dobies over the course of 30+ years, they are not a breed
that likes children. Just not, in general. Plus very territorial. Henry
believed that Mom was alpha dog, but he was absolutely number 2 ahead of my
dad, Chelsea (dog) and anyone else in the house! He had to be locked out
when the maid came (she was terrified), and locked in when the pool guy came
(he was terrified), just because he would bail anyone up against a wall
until Mom (and only Mom) called him off. This was not a trained behavior; it
was his territorial personality. When we stayed there with Jayn the dogs
went into the Kennels.
Poodles - standard and smaller - now they love children. They can be played
with and are very patient with little ones. My uncle had a standard for a
long time who was a dear and very cute when his hair was long. My friend's
toddler was once saved from falling over a cliff by their standard poodle
who continually placed himself between the baby and the edge, barking oddly
until mom came running. They don't shed at all, and my friend also has a
bunch of cats in the house with which the poodle got along fine. So a poodle
or poodle mix might be a good choice for someone where there are concerns
about mess and relatively small spaces and other pets already.
Someone who knows more about St. Bernard's might be better to speak up, but
they are a working dog - they were bred to rescue people lost in the snow -
so perhaps the lying around personality is a bit of a movie myth?
Robyn L. Coburn
www.Iggyjingles.etsy.com
www.iggyjingles.blogspot.com
www.allthingsdoll.blogspot.com
Jenny C
.
>I don't know... We had an old english sheep dog when I was a kid, very much a herder, but also would seemingly lie for hours totally doing nothing. That dog, even though you couldn't see his eyes or wether or not they were open, that would just lay there for hours, ALWAYS knew where the members of the family were. When we'd go camping, my sister and I would wander far away, and he would always find us, no matter how far we went.
> Someone who knows more about St. Bernard's might be better to speak up, but
> they are a working dog - they were bred to rescue people lost in the snow -
> so perhaps the lying around personality is a bit of a movie myth?
>
k
>>>> Someone who knows more about St. Bernard's might be better to speak up, butthey are a working dog - they were bred to rescue people lost in the snow -
so perhaps the lying around personality is a bit of a movie myth? <<<<
And of course they're massive. The St Bernard in the Beethoven movies
is very energetic. If movies are anything to go by (probably not).
Some collies are great protectors of children. Not all collies (like
a border collie I wouldn't characterize that way).
With any dog, it matters a lot how they've been treated, if they're
trained or at least very stable, and it helps tremendously to get to
know dogs yourself. I was strictly a cat person when I married Brian,
and he being a dog person and allergic to cats as well, well... I
eventually figured out dog language. It's very different from the
body language of cats.
I think if you go with your daughter to be around dogs for the purpose
of understanding them better, you'll have a much better chance of
success with the dog you pick for a pet. My sister has oodles of big
dogs and learning what they expect and how they communicate is key to
getting along with them.
To help your daughter with the wait, you could simply say let's get to
know the different kinds of dogs because people who know dogs have
said that would help us a lot. Or something like that.
If you're going to add an animal to your family you want to be as
considerate of the feelings of this new family member as much as you
would a person. (In my opinion.) And to make a place that welcomes
the animal and makes that family member comfortable as possible. It
*is* going to be a new home after all, and unfamiliar.
~Katherine
Sandra Dodd
-=-> Someone who knows more about St. Bernard's might be better to
speak up, but
dog, happy, gentle...
But the original poster was asking about SMALL dogs, so the poodle
suggestion was probably much, much better. <g>
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
speak up, but
> they are a working dog - they were bred to rescue people lost inthe snow -
> so perhaps the lying around personality is a bit of a movie myth?-=-Years ago I lived for three years with a Newfoundland, giant black
dog, happy, gentle...
But the original poster was asking about SMALL dogs, so the poodle
suggestion was probably much, much better. <g>
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joanna Murphy
--- In [email protected], Gwen <willow_selene@...> wrote:
The first is to set things up in a way that might help Megan with a framework for the dog search, such as, "We are going to look at X amount of dogs before we choose one." Or something like that, so that before you even look at the first one there is a deal in place to look at others. She may still want the first one, but the fallback position is to wait and see the other dogs.
The second is that she may just need to go through this process. You can only do so much, and should do your part to support her and set things up to her best advantage, but then the rest is her life experience to get. You can't, and shouldn't, imho, protect her from herself to the extent that she doesn't get to have these experiences. Some people are more impulsive than others and will learn through life experiences how to manage those emotions. We all have our own challenges to work out, and this may be a big one for Megan.
I see with my daughter that she is learning all the time how to come up with strategies to deal with that aspect of her nature. If I tried to shield her from all disappointment she wouldn't have the perspective that she does.
Joanna
>I've been mulling over this aspect of your post--the part about Megan being disappointed. I have a daughter that I can imagine being very similar in this regard, and I have two things to say.
> I think that unless we pick the first dog we meet, there will be lots of little heartbreaks for her.
>
The first is to set things up in a way that might help Megan with a framework for the dog search, such as, "We are going to look at X amount of dogs before we choose one." Or something like that, so that before you even look at the first one there is a deal in place to look at others. She may still want the first one, but the fallback position is to wait and see the other dogs.
The second is that she may just need to go through this process. You can only do so much, and should do your part to support her and set things up to her best advantage, but then the rest is her life experience to get. You can't, and shouldn't, imho, protect her from herself to the extent that she doesn't get to have these experiences. Some people are more impulsive than others and will learn through life experiences how to manage those emotions. We all have our own challenges to work out, and this may be a big one for Megan.
I see with my daughter that she is learning all the time how to come up with strategies to deal with that aspect of her nature. If I tried to shield her from all disappointment she wouldn't have the perspective that she does.
Joanna