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My husband and I are trying to decide whether or not to let our 10 yo
daughter ride in the front seat of the car (with airbag.) She really wants to ride
up there, and I'm inclined to say it's fine, especially for an upcoming long
trip she and I will be taking, but we haven't been able to let go of the
highway safety advisories saying that kids under 13 should ALWAYS ride in back,
and we worry that we may be doing something stupid.

I'm having trouble weeding through the available information. It seems that
most incidences of passenger airbag fatalities are caused by unbelted kids
or little ones in car seats. And that if you move the seat all the way back
the danger is greatly reduced if not prevented. Then again, we live in
Southern California where we have lots of traffic and accidents and careless
drivers.

I found this particularly interesting:

Several Factors
Is there something magical about age 13 that automatically makes children
fit to sit up front? Are they big enough at that age to withstand the airbag
forces or grown up enough to behave up front?
It's a little of both, actually. NHTSA officials said the agency basically
selected age 12 for the cutoff after reviewing crash statistics that showed
problems with frontal airbags seemed to decline as children get older.
Maturity Weighs In
Behavior is part of the problem. “Kids play with the radio,” move around
and tend not to be in proper position when an airbag deploys in a crash, NHTSA
spokeswoman Liz Neblett said.
Proximity to the frontal airbag is a big issue in airbag-caused injuries and
deaths; so is being properly positioned in the seat.
“Theoretically, we didn't know how successful you can be . . . in teaching a
child never to lean forward” in the front seat, said a NHTSA researcher who
asked not to be named, explaining why the agency felt obligated to list an
age.
Don't discount behavior out of hand. Some kids can't seem to sit still for
longer than 30 seconds at a time. Indeed, one longtime child safety advocate
said the NHTSA recommendation, while somewhat arbitrary in its age selection,
helped the agency send a simple, important message to parents.
Size Matters, Too
The NHTSA researcher also said the agency recognizes that “somewhere in that
area” of 11 and 12 years of age, “you have bigger children” who are more
akin to adults in size.
Nancy Delaney, chairperson of the Metro Detroit Safe Kids Coalition, said
physical stature matters because it's difficult for children to keep their
distance from that front airbag and keep their back against the seatback if their
feet don't touch the floor. “They tend to scrunch down” in the seat so
their feet touch the floor and then they're out of position for the deployment of
the frontal airbag, she said.
On the other hand, she noted that there also could be a problem with
children who pass age 12 and still are rather small. Parents think they can
automatically ride up front, but perhaps they should reconsider. “You get these kids
who are two-thirds leg [in body size] and they're willowy,” she said. “I'm
really tempted to keep them in a car seat” in the back seat, where they would
be safest.
A Simple Truth That Saves Lives
An often-overlooked fact, NHTSA advises that all people, including adults,
are safest in the back seat, regardless of size or behavior.
---
So what do you all think? Am I making too big of a deal out of it? Or not
enough? Most of our friends are super safety-conscious and I'm sure that
affects our thinking. Nowadays everything's the parents' fault, so part of us
fears that guilt and blame from ourselves and others would make an unthinkable
tragedy that much more tragic. But on the other hand it'd be cool to have my
daughter up front sitting next to me, especially when it's just us in the
car.
Patty




************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-Nancy Delaney, chairperson of the Metro Detroit Safe Kids
Coalition, said
physical stature matters because it's difficult for children to keep
their
distance from that front airbag and keep their back against the
seatback if their
feet don't touch the floor.-=-

Just yesterday, I met a woman who's probably in her late thirties
who's only about 4'9".
She should not sit in the front seat?

What about hyperactive people who fidget and want to lean over and
get things out of the backpack or serve drinks all around, or play
with the radio? That would be me. Should I not sit in the front seat?

They're trying to minimize their legal liability. By warning you,
they did their butt-saving-in-court duty.
Now you can do your duty as a mom, and not live by the dire warnings
of corporate defense lawyers.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

marji

At 20:28 6/29/2007, you wrote:
>Now you can do your duty as a mom, and not live by the dire warnings
>of corporate defense lawyers.

We just encountered this issue recently when we finally got a car new
enough to have a passenger-side airbag. I did all that same
research, and then Liam and I discussed it. I told him all about the
research and the statistics and that injuries occur when folks-big
and small-are too close to the bag if it deploys. So, armed with all
that information, it was *his* choice. I told him if he wanted to
continue riding in the front seat (something we both wanted), we'd
just need to be sure that his seat was as far back as possible and
that he stayed in the belt (something he's too smart not to do; he'd
*never* ride in the car without wanting the belt on). He agreed that
it would be better to minimize bending forward, but not to be crazy
or racked with fear about it. I do my part by being a very safe
driver, and I *know* we'll be all right.

The funny thing is after all that, when he got into the front seat of
our new car for the first time, the airbag light for the passenger
side indicated that the bag was "off" and would not deploy because,
said the manual, there was a seat sensor that determined Liam not to
weigh enough. Cool!!!

He's still really careful, though, and I still am a safe driver. :-)


~Marji, who had an easy time letting go of *that* fear!



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

jenstarc4

When Chamille seemed big enough and old enough and wanted to ride in
the front seat, we went through the same thing.

I think she was about 10 at the time too. For the first year or so, we
had her sit in the back if we knew we were going on the freeway, and
let her sit in the front if we were just putting around town running
errands and stuff. I know air bags go off in accidents at slower
speeds too, but it seems that big big accidents happen on the freeway
where an airbag would be more likely to deploy. That was our reasoning
anyway and she was okay with that arrangement.

She gets car sick if she sits in the back, a lot easier than when she
sits in the front. I like having a driving companion too, I don't feel
so much like a taxi driver!

marji

At 20:53 6/29/2007, I wrote:
>So, armed with all that information, it was *his* choice....

By the way, I just want to say that I don't think that Liam is in any
way unique in his self-preservation instinct. I think it's that he
knows it's his choice, he is provided with all the information he
needs to make a choice, and he cares deeply about his own well being.

I believe that anyone who perceives him- or herself to be respected
enough to be able to make a choice with the proper information (and
without manipulation) will opt for the best choice. Who wouldn't?

Bon soir!

~Marji, too sleepy to go on.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Joylyn

My mom is 4'11", and we have all said she is not safe in the front
seat. She pushes the chair way back, and deals with it.

Alexx has been riding in the front seat about a year. She's now 12, so
since she was 11.

Joylyn

Sandra Dodd wrote:

> -=-Nancy Delaney, chairperson of the Metro Detroit Safe Kids
> Coalition, said
> physical stature matters because it's difficult for children to keep
> their
> distance from that front airbag and keep their back against the
> seatback if their
> feet don't touch the floor.-=-
>
> Just yesterday, I met a woman who's probably in her late thirties
> who's only about 4'9".
> She should not sit in the front seat?
>
> What about hyperactive people who fidget and want to lean over and
> get things out of the backpack or serve drinks all around, or play
> with the radio? That would be me. Should I not sit in the front seat?
>
> They're trying to minimize their legal liability. By warning you,
> they did their butt-saving-in-court duty.
> Now you can do your duty as a mom, and not live by the dire warnings
> of corporate defense lawyers.
>
> Sandra
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.9.14/880 - Release Date: 6/29/2007 2:15 PM
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C Johnson

Joylyn <joylyn1@...> wrote: I am probably about 4'9" or 4'10". I have always avoided cars with airbags, but I finally got the chance to own my dream car, so I took it! Due to being so short, I have to have the seat up close. If something happens that the air bag ever goes off, I will definately post and let everyone know how I fare :)
BB,
Chrissie
My mom is 4'11", and we have all said she is not safe in the front
seat. She pushes the chair way back, and deals with it.

Alexx has been riding in the front seat about a year. She's now 12, so
since she was 11.

Joylyn




>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------
>
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.9.14/880 - Release Date: 6/29/2007 2:15 PM
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






"All you have to decide is what to do with the time you have been given." Gandalf

---------------------------------
Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles.
Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Krisula Moyer

FWIW, My 11yo dd is as tall as an average adult woman, weighs more than many
and is strong and muscular. I have let her sit in the front since she was
tall enough to sit there with the belt fit properly (not cutting accross the
neck). I know many kids older than her who I would not feel comfortable
putting up front because their body types are more wirey or bc they are too
short for the belt. She has no problems keeping her feet on the floor and
her but on the seat. I think she started sitting up front just before her
10th birthday.
Krisula




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Robyn L. Coburn

<<<< My husband and I are trying to decide whether or not to let our 10 yo
daughter ride in the front seat of the car (with airbag.) She really wants
to ride
up there, and I'm inclined to say it's fine, especially for an upcoming
long
trip she and I will be taking, but we haven't been able to let go of the
highway safety advisories saying that kids under 13 should ALWAYS ride in
back,
and we worry that we may be doing something stupid. >>>

If Jayn tried to sit in the front seat now she wouldn't be able to see out
the window, and the seat belt wouldn't fit properly and safely. Those are
the criteria that I will use rather than her age. As someone who also lives
in vehicle dense Southern California, and having been personally lucky not
be killed in two serious car accidents, neither of which were my fault or
remotely predictable, I doubt I will be letting Jayn sit in the front seat
until she fits the belt and the chair. Just like she will
stay in her booster seat until she is around 4ft 9inches and the seat belt
doesn't visibly cut across her neck without the boost.

There are just too many drunken maniacs on the road in this region (many of
them idiot celebrities apparently) to do anything to increase the risk of
injury. Out in the country on a little used road, it might feel safer.
I like the CDC website for actual fatality and injury statistics.
http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/factsheets/childpas.htm

When we are going on long road trips, I tend to sit in the back with Jayn a
lot while dh drives - even though I do get a bit car sick. Chewing gum helps
a lot with feeling queasy. Also we have a portable dvd player which she
likes, and we bring along her nintendo ds and drawing materials. We minimize
the time driving and stop often to look at sights.

Robyn L. Coburn






I'm having trouble weeding through the available information. It seems
that
most incidences of passenger airbag fatalities are caused by unbelted kids
or little ones in car seats. And that if you move the seat all the way
back
the danger is greatly reduced if not prevented. Then again, we live in
Southern California where we have lots of traffic and accidents and
careless
drivers.

I found this particularly interesting:

Several Factors
Is there something magical about age 13 that automatically makes children
fit to sit up front? Are they big enough at that age to withstand the
airbag
forces or grown up enough to behave up front?
It's a little of both, actually. NHTSA officials said the agency basically
selected age 12 for the cutoff after reviewing crash statistics that showed
problems with frontal airbags seemed to decline as children get older.
Maturity Weighs In
Behavior is part of the problem. “Kids play with the radio,” move around
and tend not to be in proper position when an airbag deploys in a crash,
NHTSA
spokeswoman Liz Neblett said.
Proximity to the frontal airbag is a big issue in airbag-caused injuries
and
deaths; so is being properly positioned in the seat.
“Theoretically, we didn't know how successful you can be . . . in teaching
a
child never to lean forward” in the front seat, said a NHTSA researcher who
asked not to be named, explaining why the agency felt obligated to list an
age.
Don't discount behavior out of hand. Some kids can't seem to sit still for
longer than 30 seconds at a time. Indeed, one longtime child safety advocate
said the NHTSA recommendation, while somewhat arbitrary in its age
selection,
helped the agency send a simple, important message to parents.
Size Matters, Too
The NHTSA researcher also said the agency recognizes that “somewhere in
that
area” of 11 and 12 years of age, “you have bigger children” who are more
akin to adults in size.
Nancy Delaney, chairperson of the Metro Detroit Safe Kids Coalition, said
physical stature matters because it's difficult for children to keep their
distance from that front airbag and keep their back against the seatback if
their
feet don't touch the floor. “They tend to scrunch down” in the seat so
their feet touch the floor and then they're out of position for the
deployment of
the frontal airbag, she said.
On the other hand, she noted that there also could be a problem with
children who pass age 12 and still are rather small. Parents think they can
automatically ride up front, but perhaps they should reconsider. “You get
these kids
who are two-thirds leg [in body size] and they're willowy,” she said. “I'm
really tempted to keep them in a car seat” in the back seat, where they
would
be safest.
A Simple Truth That Saves Lives
An often-overlooked fact, NHTSA advises that all people, including adults,
are safest in the back seat, regardless of size or behavior.
---
So what do you all think? Am I making too big of a deal out of it? Or not
enough? Most of our friends are super safety-conscious and I'm sure that
affects our thinking. Nowadays everything's the parents' fault, so part of
us
fears that guilt and blame from ourselves and others would make an
unthinkable
tragedy that much more tragic. But on the other hand it'd be cool to have
my
daughter up front sitting next to me, especially when it's just us in the
car.
Patty




************************************** See what's free at
http://www.aol.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Yahoo! Groups Links

diana jenner

On 6/29/07, pattywithawhy@... <pattywithawhy@...> wrote:
>
> ---
> So what do you all think? Am I making too big of a deal out of it? Or not
> enough? Most of our friends are super safety-conscious and I'm sure that
> affects our thinking. Nowadays everything's the parents' fault, so part of
> us
> fears that guilt and blame from ourselves and others would make an
> unthinkable
> tragedy that much more tragic. But on the other hand it'd be cool to have
> my
> daughter up front sitting next to me, especially when it's just us in the
> car.
>










>
>

We road trip a lot. I move the seat back for Hayden (8); for airbag
avoidance and for increased floor space for his co-pilot supplies ::g::.
It's far safer to have him right next to me than to be constantly asking
"what?" and turning my head from the road to hear him behind me. We have
great conversations as we're side by side, with hands available to one
another for whatever comfort/assistance is needed.
Personally, I think the gains outweigh the fears by a long shot.
If you have a newer car, it may have *smart* airbags that turn off if the
weight requirement is not met, usually 100 lbs.
--
~diana :)
xoxoxoxo
hannahbearski.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Emily

I have told my son that he can ride up front once he is as tall as me.
I'm 5'1" but short waisted and the seat belt digs into my neck. I've
been in a car accident going 20mph max before and found out that air
bags are evil. I'm the type who keeps my kids rear facing until 33
pounds, my seats rear limit. My son is in a 5 point harness seat that
is up to 80 lbs and 53". It doesn't matter what any law might say or
recommend - I'm going to do what I think is safest.