Hole in the Milkbox
Tina
So the other day we went to the mall to meet up with some friends to
play. We stopped in a coffee shop and I bought all my children
chocolate milkboxes. I put the straws in and my son wigged out b/c
he wanted to do his own. I didn't know this and was very sorry. But
this led to a 1/2 an hour long fit. He wanted me to buy another one.
I didn't want to buy another one but wished I did just to save us
from his wig out session. After a half an hour he finally accepted
it asked for it back to drink it.
My son has outbursts when something doesn't go the way he thinks it
should and he has very intense emotions. He gets frustrated very
easily. When this happens the only thing I can do is to leave him
alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. I know some people just need
time.
But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way. And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can help? And what to
do in these situations?
play. We stopped in a coffee shop and I bought all my children
chocolate milkboxes. I put the straws in and my son wigged out b/c
he wanted to do his own. I didn't know this and was very sorry. But
this led to a 1/2 an hour long fit. He wanted me to buy another one.
I didn't want to buy another one but wished I did just to save us
from his wig out session. After a half an hour he finally accepted
it asked for it back to drink it.
My son has outbursts when something doesn't go the way he thinks it
should and he has very intense emotions. He gets frustrated very
easily. When this happens the only thing I can do is to leave him
alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. I know some people just need
time.
But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way. And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can help? And what to
do in these situations?
Sandra Dodd
-=-When this happens the only thing I can do is to leave him
alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. -=-
Think of the cost of counselling or psychiatry, and consider that a
carton of milk is practically FREE compared to that.
Maybe ask him more often what he wants. Moms sometimes just do
things automatically without even looking at the kid to see what he
wants, and then they justify it and blame the kid.
There were probably other factors involved too, stressing him out,
but I would guess he felt ignored and disregarded.
-=-But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried.-=-
The less ignored your son is now, the more he will learn to be
generous with others. He might forever have very quick biochemistry,
but if he knows what it feels like for people to be compassionate,
he'll be more likely to want to show compassion too, I think.
Maybe when he's calm, talk to him about ways to calm down if he's
feeling frustration or fury. Breathing. Walking away a little ways
and breathing, maybe. Going to the bathroom and washing his hands
while he breaths.
-=-. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way.-=-
Was it "healthy" for you not to just get him another milk? One of the
other kids would've finished his first one.
Model healthy. Redefine "healthy."
-=-And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. -=-
Maybe talk to him about your own frustrations and how you've dealt
with them, but conversationally as they come up, not as a big lecture.
Are you considering your not getting him another carton in the
category of things he can't change? If his requests and persuasion
and words can't make a change, is it fair to say "things he can't
change" about it?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. -=-
Think of the cost of counselling or psychiatry, and consider that a
carton of milk is practically FREE compared to that.
Maybe ask him more often what he wants. Moms sometimes just do
things automatically without even looking at the kid to see what he
wants, and then they justify it and blame the kid.
There were probably other factors involved too, stressing him out,
but I would guess he felt ignored and disregarded.
-=-But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried.-=-
The less ignored your son is now, the more he will learn to be
generous with others. He might forever have very quick biochemistry,
but if he knows what it feels like for people to be compassionate,
he'll be more likely to want to show compassion too, I think.
Maybe when he's calm, talk to him about ways to calm down if he's
feeling frustration or fury. Breathing. Walking away a little ways
and breathing, maybe. Going to the bathroom and washing his hands
while he breaths.
-=-. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way.-=-
Was it "healthy" for you not to just get him another milk? One of the
other kids would've finished his first one.
Model healthy. Redefine "healthy."
-=-And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. -=-
Maybe talk to him about your own frustrations and how you've dealt
with them, but conversationally as they come up, not as a big lecture.
Are you considering your not getting him another carton in the
category of things he can't change? If his requests and persuasion
and words can't make a change, is it fair to say "things he can't
change" about it?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Chester Crump
Hi,I'm new to this group and haven't introduced myself yet but want to respond to this post if I may.
I too have a son who is quick to have meltdowns. He will melt over seemingly insignificant things. BUT,they are not insignificant to him. I've been a mama for 27 years,5 children and he is by far the most emotional,sensitive child I have.
It may seem to the world outside that I *give in* alot. Contrary,it's not giving in,it's being mature enough myself to see my *child* having a hard time with emotions he couldn't explain if he tried(being a child) that I find the best way to help him not explode. If I see an explosion starting to brew I do whatever I can to dissuade it.
For instance,he wanted to wear his underwear underneath his swim trunks. My husband told him to take off his underwear,that he didn't need them with his trunks. Kenny started to cry,my husband saw that it mattered to Kenny to have his underwear on,so he said hey son,it's alright if you want to wear your underwear too,no big deal. That was it. Kenny didn't meltdown. We went to the pool and had a great time.
We have potential meltdowns everyday,or meltdowns period. I just go with the flow,love him,try to validate his feelings,and take nice naps when I can so I can recharge.
I've learned alot from this little guy. Mainly to be flexible in my thinking,to be more compassionate,to truly *see* through a childs eyes and heart.
Kim
Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
-=-When this happens the only thing I can do is to leave him
alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. -=-
Think of the cost of counselling or psychiatry, and consider that a
carton of milk is practically FREE compared to that.
Maybe ask him more often what he wants. Moms sometimes just do
things automatically without even looking at the kid to see what he
wants, and then they justify it and blame the kid.
There were probably other factors involved too, stressing him out,
but I would guess he felt ignored and disregarded.
-=-But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried.-=-
The less ignored your son is now, the more he will learn to be
generous with others. He might forever have very quick biochemistry,
but if he knows what it feels like for people to be compassionate,
he'll be more likely to want to show compassion too, I think.
Maybe when he's calm, talk to him about ways to calm down if he's
feeling frustration or fury. Breathing. Walking away a little ways
and breathing, maybe. Going to the bathroom and washing his hands
while he breaths.
-=-. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way.-=-
Was it "healthy" for you not to just get him another milk? One of the
other kids would've finished his first one.
Model healthy. Redefine "healthy."
-=-And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. -=-
Maybe talk to him about your own frustrations and how you've dealt
with them, but conversationally as they come up, not as a big lecture.
Are you considering your not getting him another carton in the
category of things he can't change? If his requests and persuasion
and words can't make a change, is it fair to say "things he can't
change" about it?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I too have a son who is quick to have meltdowns. He will melt over seemingly insignificant things. BUT,they are not insignificant to him. I've been a mama for 27 years,5 children and he is by far the most emotional,sensitive child I have.
It may seem to the world outside that I *give in* alot. Contrary,it's not giving in,it's being mature enough myself to see my *child* having a hard time with emotions he couldn't explain if he tried(being a child) that I find the best way to help him not explode. If I see an explosion starting to brew I do whatever I can to dissuade it.
For instance,he wanted to wear his underwear underneath his swim trunks. My husband told him to take off his underwear,that he didn't need them with his trunks. Kenny started to cry,my husband saw that it mattered to Kenny to have his underwear on,so he said hey son,it's alright if you want to wear your underwear too,no big deal. That was it. Kenny didn't meltdown. We went to the pool and had a great time.
We have potential meltdowns everyday,or meltdowns period. I just go with the flow,love him,try to validate his feelings,and take nice naps when I can so I can recharge.
I've learned alot from this little guy. Mainly to be flexible in my thinking,to be more compassionate,to truly *see* through a childs eyes and heart.
Kim
Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
-=-When this happens the only thing I can do is to leave him
alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. -=-
Think of the cost of counselling or psychiatry, and consider that a
carton of milk is practically FREE compared to that.
Maybe ask him more often what he wants. Moms sometimes just do
things automatically without even looking at the kid to see what he
wants, and then they justify it and blame the kid.
There were probably other factors involved too, stressing him out,
but I would guess he felt ignored and disregarded.
-=-But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried.-=-
The less ignored your son is now, the more he will learn to be
generous with others. He might forever have very quick biochemistry,
but if he knows what it feels like for people to be compassionate,
he'll be more likely to want to show compassion too, I think.
Maybe when he's calm, talk to him about ways to calm down if he's
feeling frustration or fury. Breathing. Walking away a little ways
and breathing, maybe. Going to the bathroom and washing his hands
while he breaths.
-=-. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way.-=-
Was it "healthy" for you not to just get him another milk? One of the
other kids would've finished his first one.
Model healthy. Redefine "healthy."
-=-And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. -=-
Maybe talk to him about your own frustrations and how you've dealt
with them, but conversationally as they come up, not as a big lecture.
Are you considering your not getting him another carton in the
category of things he can't change? If his requests and persuasion
and words can't make a change, is it fair to say "things he can't
change" about it?
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
marji
At 13:54 6/3/2007, you wrote:
If you want to call a candle a "hammer," that doesn't make it a
hammer! Folks see situations like kids having meltdowns and moms
"giving in," and they like to call them "power struggles," but that
does not make it so!
The beautiful look of gratitude and appreciation on my son's face
when he understands that I hear him and am helping him get what he
needs is worth, to me, a whole case of milk boxes. That look on his
face tells a deeper story of learning compassion and understanding
(for me and for other folks). Who knew that a simple three-letter
word could have such a profound effect!?
~Marji
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>It may seem to the world outside that I *give in* alot.Beautiful.
>Contrary,it's not giving in,it's being mature enough myself to see
>my *child* having a hard time with emotions he couldn't explain if he tried...
If you want to call a candle a "hammer," that doesn't make it a
hammer! Folks see situations like kids having meltdowns and moms
"giving in," and they like to call them "power struggles," but that
does not make it so!
The beautiful look of gratitude and appreciation on my son's face
when he understands that I hear him and am helping him get what he
needs is worth, to me, a whole case of milk boxes. That look on his
face tells a deeper story of learning compassion and understanding
(for me and for other folks). Who knew that a simple three-letter
word could have such a profound effect!?
~Marji
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-That look on his
face tells a deeper story of learning compassion and understanding
(for me and for other folks). Who knew that a simple three-letter
word could have such a profound effect!?-=-
I knew! <g>
http://sandradodd.com/yes
Much of that is written by others, but it makes the BIGGEST
difference, to find ways to say "yes."
My young childhood was a dark, scary forest of "no," and "stop" and
"don't."
My children's childhoods were a meadow of "okay, let's try it" and
"yes" and "sure."
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
face tells a deeper story of learning compassion and understanding
(for me and for other folks). Who knew that a simple three-letter
word could have such a profound effect!?-=-
I knew! <g>
http://sandradodd.com/yes
Much of that is written by others, but it makes the BIGGEST
difference, to find ways to say "yes."
My young childhood was a dark, scary forest of "no," and "stop" and
"don't."
My children's childhoods were a meadow of "okay, let's try it" and
"yes" and "sure."
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Nicole Willoughby
But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he will
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way. And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can help? And what to
do in these situations?
I was a bit worried about my 4 year old.....she had been in school a short time while I was having to work then i quit and we pulled the girls out, She asked permission for everything.
I have to admit I felt annoyed by all the can I ........questions at first. Then they changed she was no longer asking can i watch tv , or go to the bathroom its can I give you a kiss , can I pour the milk for you when I was getting a bowl of cereal. I believe she has seen me care about what she wants and thinks to ask me because maybe *I* wanted to pour my own milk :)
My 4 year old is very spirited and we have had this same drink problem only with a straw in sprite. Finances are very tight and I truly didnt have money to buy a new one but would have if I did .....so i removed the straw and offered a new one. This compromise was accepted and we went on with our lunch.
In your post you said I want him to accept the things he cant change. Some things cant be changed, like the death of a relative. Getting a new milk , or a new straw and milk closed and re-open can be changed ....either by doing it yourself or persuading another to do it for you.
Nicole
---------------------------------
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now 18
and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried. B/c I want
him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
things out in a healthy way. And I want him to be able to accept the
things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment of
life. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can help? And what to
do in these situations?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>First...was the 18 year old unschooled? Did he get lots of undivided attention from his parents? I think often when children are raised being told what to do and when to do it with little regard for what they want and how they feel , they do not learn to consider other peoples feeling, wants, needs, very well.
I was a bit worried about my 4 year old.....she had been in school a short time while I was having to work then i quit and we pulled the girls out, She asked permission for everything.
I have to admit I felt annoyed by all the can I ........questions at first. Then they changed she was no longer asking can i watch tv , or go to the bathroom its can I give you a kiss , can I pour the milk for you when I was getting a bowl of cereal. I believe she has seen me care about what she wants and thinks to ask me because maybe *I* wanted to pour my own milk :)
My 4 year old is very spirited and we have had this same drink problem only with a straw in sprite. Finances are very tight and I truly didnt have money to buy a new one but would have if I did .....so i removed the straw and offered a new one. This compromise was accepted and we went on with our lunch.
In your post you said I want him to accept the things he cant change. Some things cant be changed, like the death of a relative. Getting a new milk , or a new straw and milk closed and re-open can be changed ....either by doing it yourself or persuading another to do it for you.
Nicole
---------------------------------
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kimbrah
Tina-
I know exactly what you are talking about here. My oldest is exactly
the same way. Can you tell at the very beginning of the day whether
it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with Karlos
from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me about
everything all day long or whether we can all get along famously.
I am not going to give you advice, because every family has it's own
way of doing things and what works for me might now necessarily work
for you. What I will do is recommend the book "Raising Your Spirited
Child" by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka. I wish someone would have given me
that book to read when I first got married before I even thought about
having children. It would have saved us so much struggle and
heartache. I found it so helpful in addressing my concerns, helping me
to move past my frustrations and actually having solid steps for me to
take to understand and help my child instead of just mindlessly
disciplining him.
Be encouraged, our kids are going to be the movers and shakers in the
adult world if we can help them to use the gifts and talents they were
given for good instead of for ill. I believe in you Tina, you are a
good mother and you are going to make it through, and so are your kids.
Blessings,
Kimbrah
I know exactly what you are talking about here. My oldest is exactly
the same way. Can you tell at the very beginning of the day whether
it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with Karlos
from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me about
everything all day long or whether we can all get along famously.
I am not going to give you advice, because every family has it's own
way of doing things and what works for me might now necessarily work
for you. What I will do is recommend the book "Raising Your Spirited
Child" by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka. I wish someone would have given me
that book to read when I first got married before I even thought about
having children. It would have saved us so much struggle and
heartache. I found it so helpful in addressing my concerns, helping me
to move past my frustrations and actually having solid steps for me to
take to understand and help my child instead of just mindlessly
disciplining him.
Be encouraged, our kids are going to be the movers and shakers in the
adult world if we can help them to use the gifts and talents they were
given for good instead of for ill. I believe in you Tina, you are a
good mother and you are going to make it through, and so are your kids.
Blessings,
Kimbrah
Sandra Dodd
-=-Can you tell at the very beginning of the day whether
it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with Karlos
from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me about
everything all day long or whether we can all get along famously.-=-
On behalf of Karlos, I wish to object to this statement.
On behalf of all other children whose parents read this list, I wish
to say that declaring a whole day good or bad is a fallacy and a trap.
If one moment isn't good, the next moment can be better.
If a mother decides that she knows at the beginning that something
will be "a bad day," why should she take any responsibility for
improving 8:20 or 9:10, or to wait just another couple of seconds
before she decides how to respond to someone or something?
One of the most valuable things I've ever learned in the unschooling
discussions online was someone years ago who said she never thought
of "a bad day," but thought there were bad moments.
People can live with bad moments, and overcome them, and move on to
much better moments.
-=-I know exactly what you are talking about here. My oldest is exactly
the same way-=-
Maybe it's hard to know exactly or that someone is the same way from
just a short statement.
-=-I believe in you Tina, you are a good mother and you are going to
make it through, and so are your kids.-=-
We can't really tell from a distance whether someone's a good mother
and their friends will make it through, can we?
These kinds of affirming statements are really common on some women's
discussion lists, but I'd prefer to keep this list to ideas about
learning and unschooling. Let's talk about ideas and not about
individuals, when we can do so.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with Karlos
from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me about
everything all day long or whether we can all get along famously.-=-
On behalf of Karlos, I wish to object to this statement.
On behalf of all other children whose parents read this list, I wish
to say that declaring a whole day good or bad is a fallacy and a trap.
If one moment isn't good, the next moment can be better.
If a mother decides that she knows at the beginning that something
will be "a bad day," why should she take any responsibility for
improving 8:20 or 9:10, or to wait just another couple of seconds
before she decides how to respond to someone or something?
One of the most valuable things I've ever learned in the unschooling
discussions online was someone years ago who said she never thought
of "a bad day," but thought there were bad moments.
People can live with bad moments, and overcome them, and move on to
much better moments.
-=-I know exactly what you are talking about here. My oldest is exactly
the same way-=-
Maybe it's hard to know exactly or that someone is the same way from
just a short statement.
-=-I believe in you Tina, you are a good mother and you are going to
make it through, and so are your kids.-=-
We can't really tell from a distance whether someone's a good mother
and their friends will make it through, can we?
These kinds of affirming statements are really common on some women's
discussion lists, but I'd prefer to keep this list to ideas about
learning and unschooling. Let's talk about ideas and not about
individuals, when we can do so.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tina
Hey, everyone, thanks for the responses. I want to let you all know
that I do spend alot of time with Isaiah. We watch tv together, we
cuddle alot, read stories, play outside. As much as possible with
the other 3. I felt like some people were making it sound like I
ignore my son and neglect his needs.
I knew I should've got him the other milk. No the other kids would
not have drank it. I thought I was being sensitive to his needs when
I bought him what he asked for. But it would have made him feel like
I cared a/b his feelings if I bought him the other one- I agree with
you all on that. It was my mistake. It is difficult when I go out to
make sure I am meeting every single childs needs all of the time.
And I do try. I was standing in line at the coffee shop with the
baby in my arms. my 2 yr old in the stroller trying to distract him
so he wouldnt climb out and run off and the other 2 who are prone to
wondering. So when I got them their drinks I was hurrying to get
them to them so we could make it to the play area before my 2 babies
started to cry.
Even today when we went to the mall to get some toys and some
icecream. My older 2 take off running when we get in the mall and I
have my toddler in my hand. ( My hubby kept the baby) Maya won the
race and Isaiah wigged b/c he wasnt first and sat down in the chair
and threw his money down and said he wasnt going anywhere. I got on
his level and asked him if he would like to be the leader on the way
to the icecream and he said no. Meanwhile Mayas wondering off into a
store and Ezra is fighting me to run off as well. So I was being
very sensitive in this situation but still didnt know what to do. Im
trying the best I can-the best I know. That is why I come here to
get suggestions and different ideas.
We want to go out and enjoy our time together but I usually end up
feeling frazzled and like I cant handle it. I try explainig and
suggesting and distraction but sometimes it is so overwhelming.
I am not into controlling my kids or bossing them around and think
of them as people not as objects at my command.
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
that I do spend alot of time with Isaiah. We watch tv together, we
cuddle alot, read stories, play outside. As much as possible with
the other 3. I felt like some people were making it sound like I
ignore my son and neglect his needs.
I knew I should've got him the other milk. No the other kids would
not have drank it. I thought I was being sensitive to his needs when
I bought him what he asked for. But it would have made him feel like
I cared a/b his feelings if I bought him the other one- I agree with
you all on that. It was my mistake. It is difficult when I go out to
make sure I am meeting every single childs needs all of the time.
And I do try. I was standing in line at the coffee shop with the
baby in my arms. my 2 yr old in the stroller trying to distract him
so he wouldnt climb out and run off and the other 2 who are prone to
wondering. So when I got them their drinks I was hurrying to get
them to them so we could make it to the play area before my 2 babies
started to cry.
Even today when we went to the mall to get some toys and some
icecream. My older 2 take off running when we get in the mall and I
have my toddler in my hand. ( My hubby kept the baby) Maya won the
race and Isaiah wigged b/c he wasnt first and sat down in the chair
and threw his money down and said he wasnt going anywhere. I got on
his level and asked him if he would like to be the leader on the way
to the icecream and he said no. Meanwhile Mayas wondering off into a
store and Ezra is fighting me to run off as well. So I was being
very sensitive in this situation but still didnt know what to do. Im
trying the best I can-the best I know. That is why I come here to
get suggestions and different ideas.
We want to go out and enjoy our time together but I usually end up
feeling frazzled and like I cant handle it. I try explainig and
suggesting and distraction but sometimes it is so overwhelming.
I am not into controlling my kids or bossing them around and think
of them as people not as objects at my command.
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>Karlos
> -=-Can you tell at the very beginning of the day whether
> it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with
> from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me about=-
> everything all day long or whether we can all get along famously.-
>wish
>
> On behalf of Karlos, I wish to object to this statement.
> On behalf of all other children whose parents read this list, I
> to say that declaring a whole day good or bad is a fallacy and atrap.
>something
> If one moment isn't good, the next moment can be better.
> If a mother decides that she knows at the beginning that
> will be "a bad day," why should she take any responsibility forunschooling
> improving 8:20 or 9:10, or to wait just another couple of seconds
> before she decides how to respond to someone or something?
>
> One of the most valuable things I've ever learned in the
> discussions online was someone years ago who said she neverthought
> of "a bad day," but thought there were bad moments.to
>
> People can live with bad moments, and overcome them, and move on
> much better moments.exactly
>
> -=-I know exactly what you are talking about here. My oldest is
> the same way-=-from
>
> Maybe it's hard to know exactly or that someone is the same way
> just a short statement.to
>
> -=-I believe in you Tina, you are a good mother and you are going
> make it through, and so are your kids.-=-mother
>
> We can't really tell from a distance whether someone's a good
> and their friends will make it through, can we?women's
> These kinds of affirming statements are really common on some
> discussion lists, but I'd prefer to keep this list to ideas about
> learning and unschooling. Let's talk about ideas and not about
> individuals, when we can do so.
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
marji
--- In [email protected], "Tina" <kunjaana@...> wrote:
overwhelming and chaotic, not only for you but also for Isaiah. I
understand that you all want to go out, but perhaps you could pick
less stimulating, intense destinations than the mall (just for now)?
In this example you gave, it sounds like Isaiah has a hard time with
competition. I forget how old he is, but some folks just don't do
competition well (and they usually, but now always, grow out of it).
I would be on the alert for these kinds of situations and try to head
them off with whatever tool I could find. My goal would be to replace
the yucky feelings with Joyful times.
For example, my son has never done competition too well and would get
very upset if someone else won. So, we defuse competitions by goofing
about it. He and my husband came up with changing things up so that
the *last* one there wins, or you don't win unless you've cheated.
Now, instead of getting hot under the collar and taking things so
seriously, there's gales of laughter around races to the car, etc.
Other games like chess and Monopoly and poker are more fun now because
Liam (now 12) sees how he can learn from playing with someone who is
more adept at the game than he is. But, this is a recent change, and
we just stayed away from stuff like that until now.
Our situation is different than yours because our son has no sibs to
measure himself to, but perhaps you and Isaiah and Maya can come up
with creative ideas (during calmer times) to eliminate competitive
situations and replace them with fun for fun's sake.
But, I would really consider toning down the outings to keep Isaiah in
less stressful situations until you feel that he would be better able
to handle them. Or, perhaps consider going on special outings with
just him sometimes and just Maya sometimes.
or being authoritarian. If you can look at situations that arise
through a lens of how you can best help your kids get what they need,
and if you keep Joy as your goal for you and for your kids, you'll
probably come closer to finding solutions for this dilemma.
I hope that helps!
Marji
> Even today when we went to the mall to get some toys and someThe feeling I'm getting from your post is that this is all very
> icecream. My older 2 take off running when we get in the mall and I
> have my toddler in my hand. ( My hubby kept the baby) Maya won the
> race and Isaiah wigged b/c he wasnt first and sat down in the chair
> and threw his money down and said he wasnt going
> anywhere...[snip]...So I was being very sensitive in this situation
> but still didnt know what to do.
overwhelming and chaotic, not only for you but also for Isaiah. I
understand that you all want to go out, but perhaps you could pick
less stimulating, intense destinations than the mall (just for now)?
In this example you gave, it sounds like Isaiah has a hard time with
competition. I forget how old he is, but some folks just don't do
competition well (and they usually, but now always, grow out of it).
I would be on the alert for these kinds of situations and try to head
them off with whatever tool I could find. My goal would be to replace
the yucky feelings with Joyful times.
For example, my son has never done competition too well and would get
very upset if someone else won. So, we defuse competitions by goofing
about it. He and my husband came up with changing things up so that
the *last* one there wins, or you don't win unless you've cheated.
Now, instead of getting hot under the collar and taking things so
seriously, there's gales of laughter around races to the car, etc.
Other games like chess and Monopoly and poker are more fun now because
Liam (now 12) sees how he can learn from playing with someone who is
more adept at the game than he is. But, this is a recent change, and
we just stayed away from stuff like that until now.
Our situation is different than yours because our son has no sibs to
measure himself to, but perhaps you and Isaiah and Maya can come up
with creative ideas (during calmer times) to eliminate competitive
situations and replace them with fun for fun's sake.
But, I would really consider toning down the outings to keep Isaiah in
less stressful situations until you feel that he would be better able
to handle them. Or, perhaps consider going on special outings with
just him sometimes and just Maya sometimes.
> I am not into controlling my kids or bossing them around and thinkI don't think the only two choices you have are either allowing chaos
> of them as people not as objects at my command.
or being authoritarian. If you can look at situations that arise
through a lens of how you can best help your kids get what they need,
and if you keep Joy as your goal for you and for your kids, you'll
probably come closer to finding solutions for this dilemma.
I hope that helps!
Marji
Nicole Willoughby
There is a lady on unschooling basics who has 6...I think 6 kids. How do you feel about your e-mail being posted there to see what suggestions she or maybe someone else has?
Is a mothers helper an option? An older child who could go with you on some trips and help keep an eye on kids in exchange for a small payment or treat while you are out shopping?
Is going other places besides the mall an option? Not saying thats all you go to but perhaps leaving most or all kids with dh to get something you need at the mall and taking the kids somehwere a bit less crowded with more room to run around?
---------------------------------
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Is a mothers helper an option? An older child who could go with you on some trips and help keep an eye on kids in exchange for a small payment or treat while you are out shopping?
Is going other places besides the mall an option? Not saying thats all you go to but perhaps leaving most or all kids with dh to get something you need at the mall and taking the kids somehwere a bit less crowded with more room to run around?
---------------------------------
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pamela Sorooshian
Don't go to the mall with all those little kids - that is
overwhelming for you AND them.
You could have stayed home with all of them and your husband could
have run out for some ice cream. Malls are awful for those of us who
are more sensitive to sound and lighting and temperature and have a
smidgen of claustrophobia and feel crowded by too many people all in
one place. I'm 55 and can barely be in a mall for an hour before I
feel the effects - I start feeling impatient and cranky.
Really - I'd bet my house that your real problem is that you're
trying to do too much with those young children and your son is the
one who is sort of the "lightening rod" of the family - all the
tension and stress comes out in him.
Read, "The Explosive Child," by Ross Greene, focusing on the parts
about setting up a working environment. Try to create a calm oasis in
your own home and yard - make it possible for him to play with and in
water a lot (very soothing), to always have the option of spending
time alone (so he never has the feeling of being trapped in close
proximity to other people, including siblings), give him hours and
hours of uninterrupted pretend-play time (this is the time he
desperately needs for working through all kinds of anxieties).
-pam
overwhelming for you AND them.
You could have stayed home with all of them and your husband could
have run out for some ice cream. Malls are awful for those of us who
are more sensitive to sound and lighting and temperature and have a
smidgen of claustrophobia and feel crowded by too many people all in
one place. I'm 55 and can barely be in a mall for an hour before I
feel the effects - I start feeling impatient and cranky.
Really - I'd bet my house that your real problem is that you're
trying to do too much with those young children and your son is the
one who is sort of the "lightening rod" of the family - all the
tension and stress comes out in him.
Read, "The Explosive Child," by Ross Greene, focusing on the parts
about setting up a working environment. Try to create a calm oasis in
your own home and yard - make it possible for him to play with and in
water a lot (very soothing), to always have the option of spending
time alone (so he never has the feeling of being trapped in close
proximity to other people, including siblings), give him hours and
hours of uninterrupted pretend-play time (this is the time he
desperately needs for working through all kinds of anxieties).
-pam
On Jun 3, 2007, at 5:48 PM, Tina wrote:
> Even today when we went to the mall to get some toys and some
> icecream. My older 2 take off running when we get in the mall and I
> have my toddler in my hand. ( My hubby kept the baby) Maya won the
> race and Isaiah wigged b/c he wasnt first and sat down in the chair
> and threw his money down and said he wasnt going anywhere. I got on
> his level and asked him if he would like to be the leader on the way
> to the icecream and he said no. Meanwhile Mayas wondering off into a
> store and Ezra is fighting me to run off as well. So I was being
> very sensitive in this situation but still didnt know what to do. Im
> trying the best I can-the best I know. That is why I come here to
> get suggestions and different ideas.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tina
We took them to see Shrek 3 today and Maya wanted to get a toy so we
told her wed take her later. We went home and counted her money and
went to the dollar store which is in the mall and she wanted
icecream which was in the mall as well. Isaiah wanted to join in so
Im being sensitive to thier needs planning to do things they want to
do. I personally cant stand going to the mall. But went for them.
We go out and do lots of things. They like to go to the science
center,the park, the coffee shops, the zoo.
I think that is part of unschooling-being ready to open up the world
for our children to learn. If we stayed home he would be asking to
go somewhere and my hubby works so it is always me and the children.
No, Isaiah doesnt deal with competition well or taking turns. He
gets severely pissed off and doesnt understand why he cant go.
We went to a rocketry presentation with our homeschooling group and
they were taking turns finding the rockets in groups and Isaiah got
so angry that he couldnt go every time. He walked off and was
screaming. But I cant talk to him when he gets like this, it just
escalates so I watched from a distance giving him the space to cool
down. This is something he wanted to go to and once we got there
Maya and Ezra enjoyed it so much. Just another example. This is a
regular thing when we go out. And I feel so bad when he gets upset.
I just want him to be able to enjoy the things he wants to do. It
makes me sad b/c I feel like I should be able to help him but dont
know how. :(
--- In [email protected], Pamela Sorooshian
<pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
told her wed take her later. We went home and counted her money and
went to the dollar store which is in the mall and she wanted
icecream which was in the mall as well. Isaiah wanted to join in so
Im being sensitive to thier needs planning to do things they want to
do. I personally cant stand going to the mall. But went for them.
We go out and do lots of things. They like to go to the science
center,the park, the coffee shops, the zoo.
I think that is part of unschooling-being ready to open up the world
for our children to learn. If we stayed home he would be asking to
go somewhere and my hubby works so it is always me and the children.
No, Isaiah doesnt deal with competition well or taking turns. He
gets severely pissed off and doesnt understand why he cant go.
We went to a rocketry presentation with our homeschooling group and
they were taking turns finding the rockets in groups and Isaiah got
so angry that he couldnt go every time. He walked off and was
screaming. But I cant talk to him when he gets like this, it just
escalates so I watched from a distance giving him the space to cool
down. This is something he wanted to go to and once we got there
Maya and Ezra enjoyed it so much. Just another example. This is a
regular thing when we go out. And I feel so bad when he gets upset.
I just want him to be able to enjoy the things he wants to do. It
makes me sad b/c I feel like I should be able to help him but dont
know how. :(
--- In [email protected], Pamela Sorooshian
<pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>could
> Don't go to the mall with all those little kids - that is
> overwhelming for you AND them.
> You could have stayed home with all of them and your husband
> have run out for some ice cream. Malls are awful for those of uswho
> are more sensitive to sound and lighting and temperature and havea
> smidgen of claustrophobia and feel crowded by too many people allin
> one place. I'm 55 and can barely be in a mall for an hour beforeI
> feel the effects - I start feeling impatient and cranky.the
>
> Really - I'd bet my house that your real problem is that you're
> trying to do too much with those young children and your son is
> one who is sort of the "lightening rod" of the family - all theparts
> tension and stress comes out in him.
>
> Read, "The Explosive Child," by Ross Greene, focusing on the
> about setting up a working environment. Try to create a calm oasisin
> your own home and yard - make it possible for him to play with andin
> water a lot (very soothing), to always have the option ofspending
> time alone (so he never has the feeling of being trapped in closeand
> proximity to other people, including siblings), give him hours
> hours of uninterrupted pretend-play time (this is the time heand I
> desperately needs for working through all kinds of anxieties).
>
> -pam
>
> On Jun 3, 2007, at 5:48 PM, Tina wrote:
>
> > Even today when we went to the mall to get some toys and some
> > icecream. My older 2 take off running when we get in the mall
> > have my toddler in my hand. ( My hubby kept the baby) Maya wonthe
> > race and Isaiah wigged b/c he wasnt first and sat down in thechair
> > and threw his money down and said he wasnt going anywhere. I goton
> > his level and asked him if he would like to be the leader on theway
> > to the icecream and he said no. Meanwhile Mayas wondering offinto a
> > store and Ezra is fighting me to run off as well. So I was beingdo. Im
> > very sensitive in this situation but still didnt know what to
> > trying the best I can-the best I know. That is why I come here to
> > get suggestions and different ideas.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Sandra Dodd
-=-I felt like some people were making it sound like I
ignore my son and neglect his needs. -=-
I think your son was indicating it very, very clearly but you hoped
we would say something different.
Instead of blaming your son for being too quick to be upset, what if
you start to look at that as reasonable communication in the only way
he can find to get your attention?
The suggestions about not going to the mall are sound.
If he has two or three younger siblings, he might have been feeling
left out and needy since the first one of them was born.
It is possible to have so many children so quickly that the mom can't
provide them all with the touch and direct attention and mom-gaze
that they would like to have (or need). I know it's not popular or
politically correct to say so, but if four isn't too many, would five
be? Six? Seven?
You can't reason away the fact that he's needy. More of his needs
need to be met somehow.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ignore my son and neglect his needs. -=-
I think your son was indicating it very, very clearly but you hoped
we would say something different.
Instead of blaming your son for being too quick to be upset, what if
you start to look at that as reasonable communication in the only way
he can find to get your attention?
The suggestions about not going to the mall are sound.
If he has two or three younger siblings, he might have been feeling
left out and needy since the first one of them was born.
It is possible to have so many children so quickly that the mom can't
provide them all with the touch and direct attention and mom-gaze
that they would like to have (or need). I know it's not popular or
politically correct to say so, but if four isn't too many, would five
be? Six? Seven?
You can't reason away the fact that he's needy. More of his needs
need to be met somehow.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pamela Sorooshian
Think of it as a season of life - right now you really can't do so
much. You don't have to go out to all those activities, now. They'll
all be there later, too. The kids will get even more out of them as
they get older. Create a warm and cozy nest, first and foremost.
When they ask to go out to a museum or movie or to buy a toy or
whatever, you can accommodate that, but it doesn't have to be today
or tomorrow. Put it on the calendar - and space things out. You can
have days and days of not going out - learn to relax and have fun at
home, for the sake of your son.
-pam
much. You don't have to go out to all those activities, now. They'll
all be there later, too. The kids will get even more out of them as
they get older. Create a warm and cozy nest, first and foremost.
When they ask to go out to a museum or movie or to buy a toy or
whatever, you can accommodate that, but it doesn't have to be today
or tomorrow. Put it on the calendar - and space things out. You can
have days and days of not going out - learn to relax and have fun at
home, for the sake of your son.
-pam
On Jun 3, 2007, at 7:19 PM, Tina wrote:
> We go out and do lots of things. They like to go to the science
> center,the park, the coffee shops, the zoo.
> I think that is part of unschooling-being ready to open up the world
> for our children to learn.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tina
So your kids never had an outburst? You always meet every single one
of thier needs? You have no idea of my situation and I came here for
help and suggestions not for someone to tell me that having 4
children is too much. You didnt know that my husband had a vasectomy
when I got pregnant the last time. How dare you. So what-should I
have had an abortion-what is it exactly that you are implying here?
You have a problem. I think you have to always be right and if
someone crosses you or suggests that maybe something you said was a
little off you have to be right and have the last word.
Well, I guess you got it all together and all of the other people
that are asking for help are just losers. I guess this is what you
need to feel good about yourself to belittle people who are trying
to do the right thing and put them down.
You can kiss my ass.
And I hope I do run into you at the Rethinking education conference.
One Love-Tna
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
of thier needs? You have no idea of my situation and I came here for
help and suggestions not for someone to tell me that having 4
children is too much. You didnt know that my husband had a vasectomy
when I got pregnant the last time. How dare you. So what-should I
have had an abortion-what is it exactly that you are implying here?
You have a problem. I think you have to always be right and if
someone crosses you or suggests that maybe something you said was a
little off you have to be right and have the last word.
Well, I guess you got it all together and all of the other people
that are asking for help are just losers. I guess this is what you
need to feel good about yourself to belittle people who are trying
to do the right thing and put them down.
You can kiss my ass.
And I hope I do run into you at the Rethinking education conference.
One Love-Tna
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>hoped
> -=-I felt like some people were making it sound like I
> ignore my son and neglect his needs. -=-
>
> I think your son was indicating it very, very clearly but you
> we would say something different.if
>
> Instead of blaming your son for being too quick to be upset, what
> you start to look at that as reasonable communication in the onlyway
> he can find to get your attention?feeling
>
> The suggestions about not going to the mall are sound.
>
> If he has two or three younger siblings, he might have been
> left out and needy since the first one of them was born.can't
>
> It is possible to have so many children so quickly that the mom
> provide them all with the touch and direct attention and mom-gazeor
> that they would like to have (or need). I know it's not popular
> politically correct to say so, but if four isn't too many, wouldfive
> be? Six? Seven?needs
>
> You can't reason away the fact that he's needy. More of his
> need to be met somehow.
>
> Sandra
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Tina
Im sure if I wrote about how my children are having a hard time
staying at home and are bored you all would have told me to start
taking them out more.
staying at home and are bored you all would have told me to start
taking them out more.
--- In [email protected], "Tina" <kunjaana@...> wrote:
>
> So your kids never had an outburst? You always meet every single
one
> of thier needs? You have no idea of my situation and I came here
for
> help and suggestions not for someone to tell me that having 4
> children is too much. You didnt know that my husband had a
vasectomy
> when I got pregnant the last time. How dare you. So what-should I
> have had an abortion-what is it exactly that you are implying
here?
> You have a problem. I think you have to always be right and if
> someone crosses you or suggests that maybe something you said was
a
> little off you have to be right and have the last word.
> Well, I guess you got it all together and all of the other people
> that are asking for help are just losers. I guess this is what you
> need to feel good about yourself to belittle people who are trying
> to do the right thing and put them down.
> You can kiss my ass.
> And I hope I do run into you at the Rethinking education
conference.
> One Love-Tna
>
>
> --- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@>
> wrote:
> >
> > -=-I felt like some people were making it sound like I
> > ignore my son and neglect his needs. -=-
> >
> > I think your son was indicating it very, very clearly but you
> hoped
> > we would say something different.
> >
> > Instead of blaming your son for being too quick to be upset,
what
> if
> > you start to look at that as reasonable communication in the
only
> way
> > he can find to get your attention?
> >
> > The suggestions about not going to the mall are sound.
> >
> > If he has two or three younger siblings, he might have been
> feeling
> > left out and needy since the first one of them was born.
> >
> > It is possible to have so many children so quickly that the mom
> can't
> > provide them all with the touch and direct attention and mom-
gaze
> > that they would like to have (or need). I know it's not popular
> or
> > politically correct to say so, but if four isn't too many, would
> five
> > be? Six? Seven?
> >
> > You can't reason away the fact that he's needy. More of his
> needs
> > need to be met somehow.
> >
> > Sandra
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
Sandra Dodd
-=-So your kids never had an outburst? You always meet every single one
of thier needs?-=-
Yes, they did, and we dealt with it.
No, I don't always meet every single one of their needs, but I'm
absolutely clear that the more of their needs are met, the less needy
they are.
-=-You have no idea of my situation -=-
We know no more than you chose to write and send us.
You did write quite a bit, and you did ask for suggestions. And the
list exists for the purposes of discussion.
-=-Im sure if I wrote about how my children are having a hard time
staying at home and are bored you all would have told me to start
taking them out more. -=-
If you don't want suggestions freely made by moms for whom
unschooling has worked for a long time, this was an odd place for you
to have asked.
If you already know the answers and your life is working out well,
you don't need us.
If you DO want ideas, you might want to read and think instead of
having the online version of a fit.
Maybe you could suggest to your son that when he gets frustrated
about things he can't change that he not go on the internet and tell
a listowner to kiss his ass.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
of thier needs?-=-
Yes, they did, and we dealt with it.
No, I don't always meet every single one of their needs, but I'm
absolutely clear that the more of their needs are met, the less needy
they are.
-=-You have no idea of my situation -=-
We know no more than you chose to write and send us.
You did write quite a bit, and you did ask for suggestions. And the
list exists for the purposes of discussion.
-=-Im sure if I wrote about how my children are having a hard time
staying at home and are bored you all would have told me to start
taking them out more. -=-
If you don't want suggestions freely made by moms for whom
unschooling has worked for a long time, this was an odd place for you
to have asked.
If you already know the answers and your life is working out well,
you don't need us.
If you DO want ideas, you might want to read and think instead of
having the online version of a fit.
Maybe you could suggest to your son that when he gets frustrated
about things he can't change that he not go on the internet and tell
a listowner to kiss his ass.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tina
Im not angry about the suggestions you all made, I am angry about
the comment that Sandra made about 4 children not being enough!
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
the comment that Sandra made about 4 children not being enough!
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>single one
> -=-So your kids never had an outburst? You always meet every
> of thier needs?-=-needy
>
> Yes, they did, and we dealt with it.
> No, I don't always meet every single one of their needs, but I'm
> absolutely clear that the more of their needs are met, the less
> they are.the
>
> -=-You have no idea of my situation -=-
>
> We know no more than you chose to write and send us.
> You did write quite a bit, and you did ask for suggestions. And
> list exists for the purposes of discussion.you
>
> -=-Im sure if I wrote about how my children are having a hard time
> staying at home and are bored you all would have told me to start
> taking them out more. -=-
>
> If you don't want suggestions freely made by moms for whom
> unschooling has worked for a long time, this was an odd place for
> to have asked.well,
>
> If you already know the answers and your life is working out
> you don't need us.tell
> If you DO want ideas, you might want to read and think instead of
> having the online version of a fit.
>
> Maybe you could suggest to your son that when he gets frustrated
> about things he can't change that he not go on the internet and
> a listowner to kiss his ass.
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Sandra Dodd
-=-Im not angry about the suggestions you all made, I am angry about
the comment that Sandra made about 4 children not being enough!-=-
It's better not to post when you're angry.
I think four is too many if the children aren't getting the attention
they want and need. I never said four weren't enough. Perhaps you
could read back through the posts of today and see if you were
reading too quickly and too defensively. There were lots of good
suggestions made, but to blame a child or his temperament for his
feeling crowded and unheard isn't respectful to the child.
There are hundreds or thousands of places moms can go for other moms
to tell them they're doing great and it's the fault of the kids.
There are very few places moms can go to get free advice from people
who are really focussing on the happiness of their kids and their
families instead of just soothing the mom in the moment.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
the comment that Sandra made about 4 children not being enough!-=-
It's better not to post when you're angry.
I think four is too many if the children aren't getting the attention
they want and need. I never said four weren't enough. Perhaps you
could read back through the posts of today and see if you were
reading too quickly and too defensively. There were lots of good
suggestions made, but to blame a child or his temperament for his
feeling crowded and unheard isn't respectful to the child.
There are hundreds or thousands of places moms can go for other moms
to tell them they're doing great and it's the fault of the kids.
There are very few places moms can go to get free advice from people
who are really focussing on the happiness of their kids and their
families instead of just soothing the mom in the moment.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tina
I wasnt looking for soothing. And I did read the suggestions and
thought about them and am still thinking about them. And I am
grateful for the advice.
But my situation is what it is. I am a young mom doing something I
have never seen modeled before and I have four children. I cant do
anything about that. I cannot go back in time and say oh, I only
want one child for now. It is what it is. And after Isaiah had his
fit we went and played in the play area and he had a great time.
They all did.It was fun and the only thing I would change is buying
him that other damn milk box. Im sure he was frustrated and I see
how he may have felt like I wasnt hearing him. But I am not going to
stop taking them to the play area. They really enjoy that even if
there are a few mishaps on the way. But I know that I pay attention
to him and my others as much as I can. My house is pretty much
trashed all the time b/c I am either with them or researching
unschooling on the net to get more ideas. I am putting a great
effort into this. I was just wondering if anyone else has gone
through this and could make some suggestions. Which some of you did.
I do believe that some things are just growing and learning for the
child. That you cant blame the parent for everything. You can blame
the parent for how they handle the situation but the child still has
the choice to make and that is something you can never change.
Influence-yes but change, no. You can give the child all the
attention in the world and they will still have outbursts and fits.
It may not be as frequent but Im sure it will happen sooner or later.
My children are happy and I enjoy them very much. And this is
something that happens when we go out but Im sure with more work and
more sensitivty it will change over time.
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
thought about them and am still thinking about them. And I am
grateful for the advice.
But my situation is what it is. I am a young mom doing something I
have never seen modeled before and I have four children. I cant do
anything about that. I cannot go back in time and say oh, I only
want one child for now. It is what it is. And after Isaiah had his
fit we went and played in the play area and he had a great time.
They all did.It was fun and the only thing I would change is buying
him that other damn milk box. Im sure he was frustrated and I see
how he may have felt like I wasnt hearing him. But I am not going to
stop taking them to the play area. They really enjoy that even if
there are a few mishaps on the way. But I know that I pay attention
to him and my others as much as I can. My house is pretty much
trashed all the time b/c I am either with them or researching
unschooling on the net to get more ideas. I am putting a great
effort into this. I was just wondering if anyone else has gone
through this and could make some suggestions. Which some of you did.
I do believe that some things are just growing and learning for the
child. That you cant blame the parent for everything. You can blame
the parent for how they handle the situation but the child still has
the choice to make and that is something you can never change.
Influence-yes but change, no. You can give the child all the
attention in the world and they will still have outbursts and fits.
It may not be as frequent but Im sure it will happen sooner or later.
My children are happy and I enjoy them very much. And this is
something that happens when we go out but Im sure with more work and
more sensitivty it will change over time.
--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...>
wrote:
>about
> -=-Im not angry about the suggestions you all made, I am angry
> the comment that Sandra made about 4 children not being enough!-=-attention
>
> It's better not to post when you're angry.
>
> I think four is too many if the children aren't getting the
> they want and need. I never said four weren't enough. Perhapsyou
> could read back through the posts of today and see if you weremoms
> reading too quickly and too defensively. There were lots of good
> suggestions made, but to blame a child or his temperament for his
> feeling crowded and unheard isn't respectful to the child.
>
> There are hundreds or thousands of places moms can go for other
> to tell them they're doing great and it's the fault of the kids.people
> There are very few places moms can go to get free advice from
> who are really focussing on the happiness of their kids and their
> families instead of just soothing the mom in the moment.
>
> Sandra
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Gold Standard
>>It is possible to have so many children so quickly that the mom can'tprovide them all with the touch and direct attention and mom-gaze
that they would like to have (or need).<<
I haven't read beyond this post, but had to say a resounding YES!! to this
question.
Having had 4 in 5 years, it WAS impossible to meet all their real needs all
the time. And while I know there is value in having siblings and even maybe
having to wait on occasion, each one of my kids was definitely shortchanged.
"It takes a village" means to me that the more trustworthy, loving adults in
our kids lives, the better. I once read a study that concluded that for each
member of a family to have their needs well taken care of, every child had
to have four caring adults taking care of them.
So our individual families in our individual homes with one or more working
parents may not be the best scenario for having many children.
Mine do seem to be doing well though :o) If we chose another lifestyle, they
wouldn't be as whole and healthy as they are.
With lots of young kids in a family, simplifying life seems pretty
important. No malls with all of them. I used to sit on the front lawn with
baby on the blanket and siblings blowing bubbles, dancing, picnicking, etc.
Most of our activities and excitement were within our own home-made space.
Our outings in public were usually not much fun for anyone.
>>You can't reason away the fact that he's needy. More of his needsOne of my kids was very needy emotionally, and had different and more
>>need to be met somehow.<<
immediate and intense needs than his siblings.
I think one key is to find the space, energy and time to be with each child
alone, and see through their eyes. Give them sole and undivided attention.
We made sure that one of us (dh and I) had alone time with each child each
day. That made a HUGE difference in our kids' lives...they knew that if
their needs weren't met at some point during the day because mom was taking
care of someone else, they would get their time soon.
The goal is to always support each one completely all the time though, even
with a brood.
Jacki
Fetteroll
On Jun 3, 2007, at 10:49 PM, Tina wrote:
had more children than you can take care of."
She meant there is a reality in your life that your children's needs
exceed your ability to meet them all.
That doesn't mean give up. It means putting them in a stressful
situation is not only going to be too much for you and them, it's
going to be *way* too much.
You need to pull back to the point where you can meet your children's
needs.
than a mom with two kids, one of which is having an outburst. It
isn't even in the same book as a mom with more kids than she can
handle at a mall that's stressing them out with a child having an
outburst.
The problem isn't the outburst. The problem is all that lead up to
the outburst. One problem is lots of kids. That's just your reality.
Right now it's raining. That's my reality. It means if I go outside
without adequate protection I'm going to get wet.
Another problem is adding to the stress.
Sandra just posted a bit of what I wrote on this but sometimes advice
for others seems like it isn't meant for our particular situation.
Conventional parenting advice focuses on children's behavior and what
to do in a particular situation. If a child is having a melt down, do
this.
Mindful parenting advice focuses on the cause of the behaviors and
helps parents figure out ways to adjust their environments to prevent
as many of the problems as possible. An outburst is an opportunity to
figure out what went wrong and what you might do next time to avoid
what lead up to it. Sometimes you have to move many steps back.
Meltdowns will happen and you deal with them as best you can, giving
a child as much love and attention as he needs. (And if a new milk
will help, a new milk.)
the mall and all will have a great time but that's because she has a
different mix of personalities.
It's way easier to help someone who has a small problem in a
particular situation than to help someone who is putting themselves
in a situation where there are so many problems that it leads to her
being frazzled. The *real* problem is going into situations that
create way more problems than you can handle.
Think of it this way. You can adequately juggle 4 balls. You're
trying to add 20 balls (by going to the mall or whatever situation
creates frazzlement) and then asking for advice on how to handle the
20 balls.
We're saying, don't add so many balls! Try one more ball. Try putting
down three balls and adding a plate.
If kids + mall = crying kids and frazzled mom, take out the mall! ;-)
Take one or two children to the mall. Take all the children to the park.
Your reality is that all going out together *is* going to be
stressful. There isn't a way around that with your particular
children and your particular situation. Rethink where you take them
for now. It might have been better for dad to take 1 or 2 kids to the
movies and you take the others somewhere else. It might have been
better to wait until Shrek came out on DVD.
Engage your kids in the process. Approach it with a "Let's see how we
can work this out" attitude. This might take some practice.
Especially if kids feel their needs aren't being met, they won't care
about stepping on the toes of others to get what they want. They
might feel the youngest's needs for less stress aren't as important
as their need for a toy. Rather than an indication of selfish
children, it's an indication of needs that aren't being met. When
kids are full and know they don't need to worry about not being full,
they don't need to fight each other to get what they need and can in
fact be generous and give up something for someone else.
Kids need to know that the parent takes the request for a toy
seriously and will get it for them when the situation will be good
for everyone. It can take a while of doing that in order for kids to
trust that.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> someone to tell me that having 4She didn't mean "You shouldn't think about asking advice because you
> children is too much.
had more children than you can take care of."
She meant there is a reality in your life that your children's needs
exceed your ability to meet them all.
That doesn't mean give up. It means putting them in a stressful
situation is not only going to be too much for you and them, it's
going to be *way* too much.
You need to pull back to the point where you can meet your children's
needs.
> So your kids never had an outburst?A mom with a single child having an outburst is a different situation
than a mom with two kids, one of which is having an outburst. It
isn't even in the same book as a mom with more kids than she can
handle at a mall that's stressing them out with a child having an
outburst.
The problem isn't the outburst. The problem is all that lead up to
the outburst. One problem is lots of kids. That's just your reality.
Right now it's raining. That's my reality. It means if I go outside
without adequate protection I'm going to get wet.
Another problem is adding to the stress.
> My son has outbursts when something doesn't go the wayThis is also part of your reality.
Sandra just posted a bit of what I wrote on this but sometimes advice
for others seems like it isn't meant for our particular situation.
Conventional parenting advice focuses on children's behavior and what
to do in a particular situation. If a child is having a melt down, do
this.
Mindful parenting advice focuses on the cause of the behaviors and
helps parents figure out ways to adjust their environments to prevent
as many of the problems as possible. An outburst is an opportunity to
figure out what went wrong and what you might do next time to avoid
what lead up to it. Sometimes you have to move many steps back.
Meltdowns will happen and you deal with them as best you can, giving
a child as much love and attention as he needs. (And if a new milk
will help, a new milk.)
> We want to go out and enjoy our time together but I usually end upI think this is the crux. Some mothers will be able to take 4 kids to
> feeling frazzled and like I cant handle it.
the mall and all will have a great time but that's because she has a
different mix of personalities.
It's way easier to help someone who has a small problem in a
particular situation than to help someone who is putting themselves
in a situation where there are so many problems that it leads to her
being frazzled. The *real* problem is going into situations that
create way more problems than you can handle.
Think of it this way. You can adequately juggle 4 balls. You're
trying to add 20 balls (by going to the mall or whatever situation
creates frazzlement) and then asking for advice on how to handle the
20 balls.
We're saying, don't add so many balls! Try one more ball. Try putting
down three balls and adding a plate.
If kids + mall = crying kids and frazzled mom, take out the mall! ;-)
Take one or two children to the mall. Take all the children to the park.
Your reality is that all going out together *is* going to be
stressful. There isn't a way around that with your particular
children and your particular situation. Rethink where you take them
for now. It might have been better for dad to take 1 or 2 kids to the
movies and you take the others somewhere else. It might have been
better to wait until Shrek came out on DVD.
Engage your kids in the process. Approach it with a "Let's see how we
can work this out" attitude. This might take some practice.
Especially if kids feel their needs aren't being met, they won't care
about stepping on the toes of others to get what they want. They
might feel the youngest's needs for less stress aren't as important
as their need for a toy. Rather than an indication of selfish
children, it's an indication of needs that aren't being met. When
kids are full and know they don't need to worry about not being full,
they don't need to fight each other to get what they need and can in
fact be generous and give up something for someone else.
Kids need to know that the parent takes the request for a toy
seriously and will get it for them when the situation will be good
for everyone. It can take a while of doing that in order for kids to
trust that.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-When kids are full and know they don't need to worry about not
being full,
they don't need to fight each other to get what they need and can in
fact be generous and give up something for someone else.-=-
This is my experience with food, toys, space, time...
My kids hang out together quite a bit, but not always. Because they
know (because Holly, the youngest, knows, mostly) that there will be
another time soon that they're all included, none of them get jealous
or angry when one or two of the others do something they're not in on.
If Holly were left out all the time, she would be really needy and
clingy, but they include her most of the time.
The prom I wrote about (I think on this list) came off, and I think I
had said four of the 22 were unschoolers, but there were five, and
then another showed up. So six kids of 23 were unschoolers. (Just
for the record, and I think that's part of what has caused that group
to include such a wide range of ages, because my kids are willing to
share with each other.)
It was hard when Kirby was five and Holly was born. There were
things I couldn't do with three children. Kirby needed more time and
touch and attention that he didn't get, and it showed then and it
shows now. If I was holding Holly and Holding Marty's hand, Kirby
held onto the diaper bag. A diaper bag just isn't a mom. Kirby had
to keep his toys up from the other kids, and defend his fragile
things, and that was hard for him.
When people live in very small houses, the advice is often for them
to get out and about into larger spaces. When people have very
little money, the advice is about finding interesting things to do
that are stimulating but not expensive. People who live in cities
need to find time to get to a park, at least, if not out of town into
the mountains or desert. People who live way out of town need to
find time to get their kids into town sometimes.
The more balance a family has, the more peaceful and calm they are.
Too much quiet and boredom doesn't contribute to learning, but
neither does too much stimulation and stress.
I have three short pieces that touch on the things above, and the
"nest" page (Pam Sorooshian wrote something very helpful), if anyone
wants to read some more.
http://sandradodd.com/spoiled
http://sandradodd.com/respect
http://sandradodd.com/balance
http://sandradodd.com/nest
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
being full,
they don't need to fight each other to get what they need and can in
fact be generous and give up something for someone else.-=-
This is my experience with food, toys, space, time...
My kids hang out together quite a bit, but not always. Because they
know (because Holly, the youngest, knows, mostly) that there will be
another time soon that they're all included, none of them get jealous
or angry when one or two of the others do something they're not in on.
If Holly were left out all the time, she would be really needy and
clingy, but they include her most of the time.
The prom I wrote about (I think on this list) came off, and I think I
had said four of the 22 were unschoolers, but there were five, and
then another showed up. So six kids of 23 were unschoolers. (Just
for the record, and I think that's part of what has caused that group
to include such a wide range of ages, because my kids are willing to
share with each other.)
It was hard when Kirby was five and Holly was born. There were
things I couldn't do with three children. Kirby needed more time and
touch and attention that he didn't get, and it showed then and it
shows now. If I was holding Holly and Holding Marty's hand, Kirby
held onto the diaper bag. A diaper bag just isn't a mom. Kirby had
to keep his toys up from the other kids, and defend his fragile
things, and that was hard for him.
When people live in very small houses, the advice is often for them
to get out and about into larger spaces. When people have very
little money, the advice is about finding interesting things to do
that are stimulating but not expensive. People who live in cities
need to find time to get to a park, at least, if not out of town into
the mountains or desert. People who live way out of town need to
find time to get their kids into town sometimes.
The more balance a family has, the more peaceful and calm they are.
Too much quiet and boredom doesn't contribute to learning, but
neither does too much stimulation and stress.
I have three short pieces that touch on the things above, and the
"nest" page (Pam Sorooshian wrote something very helpful), if anyone
wants to read some more.
http://sandradodd.com/spoiled
http://sandradodd.com/respect
http://sandradodd.com/balance
http://sandradodd.com/nest
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-I cannot go back in time and say oh, I only
want one child for now. It is what it is.-=-
No one was saying anything different.
-=-I do believe that some things are just growing and learning for the
child. That you cant blame the parent for everything.-=-
A parent came here for ideas, the child didn't.
If the parent expects the child to go 50/50 on solutions, that's not
going to work.
If the mom can change her actions or expectations, the child will
benefit.
If the parent expects the child to change, or understand things at an
adult level, neither child nor parent benefits.
-=-You can blame
the parent for how they handle the situation but the child still has
the choice to make and that is something you can never change.
Influence-yes but change, no.-=-
The more ideal the situation for the child, the better choices he can
make.
The more choices the child has, the sooner he will learn to make
better choices.
The better choices he makes now, the better choices he will make in
the future, when he's older, when he's a parent.
For me (and some others, I know), having children was a catalyst or
tool for working through and recovering from some bad parenting from
childhood. Giving my children opportunities and choices I didn't
have when I was their age made me feel better about the world and
about the value of experiences and advantages. I could have just
justified my mom's choices and repeated them, but it hadn't been good
for me, and I didn't want to pass that on.
Most people on this list and in similar discussions are also looking
for ways to make more compassionate and generous decisions in their
parenting. There are lots of people here with lots of experiences
to share, and ideas to offer.
-=-You can give the child all the
attention in the world and they will still have outbursts and fits.
It may not be as frequent but Im sure it will happen sooner or later.-=-
This sounds like justification and self comfort, but not logic.
It sounds like "it's not my fault," and "I can't change it."
When a mom feels helpless, she becomes helpless.
When a mom sees her choices, she can make choices.
The more choices the mom has, the better choices she can make.
http://sandradodd.com/choice (collection of good stuff from other
discussions)
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
want one child for now. It is what it is.-=-
No one was saying anything different.
-=-I do believe that some things are just growing and learning for the
child. That you cant blame the parent for everything.-=-
A parent came here for ideas, the child didn't.
If the parent expects the child to go 50/50 on solutions, that's not
going to work.
If the mom can change her actions or expectations, the child will
benefit.
If the parent expects the child to change, or understand things at an
adult level, neither child nor parent benefits.
-=-You can blame
the parent for how they handle the situation but the child still has
the choice to make and that is something you can never change.
Influence-yes but change, no.-=-
The more ideal the situation for the child, the better choices he can
make.
The more choices the child has, the sooner he will learn to make
better choices.
The better choices he makes now, the better choices he will make in
the future, when he's older, when he's a parent.
For me (and some others, I know), having children was a catalyst or
tool for working through and recovering from some bad parenting from
childhood. Giving my children opportunities and choices I didn't
have when I was their age made me feel better about the world and
about the value of experiences and advantages. I could have just
justified my mom's choices and repeated them, but it hadn't been good
for me, and I didn't want to pass that on.
Most people on this list and in similar discussions are also looking
for ways to make more compassionate and generous decisions in their
parenting. There are lots of people here with lots of experiences
to share, and ideas to offer.
-=-You can give the child all the
attention in the world and they will still have outbursts and fits.
It may not be as frequent but Im sure it will happen sooner or later.-=-
This sounds like justification and self comfort, but not logic.
It sounds like "it's not my fault," and "I can't change it."
When a mom feels helpless, she becomes helpless.
When a mom sees her choices, she can make choices.
The more choices the mom has, the better choices she can make.
http://sandradodd.com/choice (collection of good stuff from other
discussions)
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Erica
> -=-Can you tell at the very beginning of the day whetherI think its important not to think of it in those terms. My 5 year
> it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with Karlos
> from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me about
> everything all day long or whether we can all get along famously.-=-
>
old DS is a very spirited child and he often wakes up on the "moody"
side. This morning he was upset that I had already made my coffee.
He usually sleeps later than me and has also never expressed any
interest in helping me with that so he was pretty upset. I sat with
him and talked to him and we talked about him helping me set up the
coffee pot in the evening so that he won't miss out on it in the
morning while he's sleeping. He was still a little grumpy though, not
my happy, smiley guy so I decided to try something new. I said "where
is Trevor's joy? did someone take his happy"? and I started looking
under things and behind things saying "where did his happy go?" and he
started to smile and laugh and was saying "Mom, your silly" but he was
enjoying it and brightening up. We finally found his joy in a shell
and he listened to the ocean and the joy went back into him through
his ear. LOL
Its a little silly but I'm finding more and more that I have to be a
little on the unconventional and silly side to help us all find joy in
our days. Don't think of it as a prelude him "fighting with you or
getting along" think of it as an opportunity to grow in your being
able to find a way to bring joy into your day.
Erica
Joanne
Hi Tina,
I haven't read any of the other posts so I apologise if I repeat
anything.
As someone who's only been on this planet for six short years, he
doesn't have it all figured out yet. Give him some time to grow and
mature. What type of behavior do you and your husband model to him
when things don't go your way? I myself have a quick temper when
things don't go the way I'd planned and I've had to really examine
that because I don't want the same for my daughters.
Also, please don't compare him to someone else. Every situation is
different. Who knows what your cousins life was like?
How much were the milk boxes? Were they that expensive that your son
being upset for 30 minutes was more important? Or were you trying to
teach him a "lesson"? Do you think maybe the lesson was that (in the
mind of a six year old upset boy) "Mom doesn't care how I feel or
what I want. She doesn't understand how important it was to me'. Did
he finally give up after 30 minutes, thinking you didn't care what
he wanted.
Just some food for thought. Please don't take it as an attack
because it's not meant to be. Imagine us just hanging out and having
a conversation. :-)
~ Joanne ~
Mom to Jacqueline (8), Shawna (11) & Cimion (14)
http://anunschoolinglife.blogspot.com/
I haven't read any of the other posts so I apologise if I repeat
anything.
As someone who's only been on this planet for six short years, he
doesn't have it all figured out yet. Give him some time to grow and
mature. What type of behavior do you and your husband model to him
when things don't go your way? I myself have a quick temper when
things don't go the way I'd planned and I've had to really examine
that because I don't want the same for my daughters.
Also, please don't compare him to someone else. Every situation is
different. Who knows what your cousins life was like?
How much were the milk boxes? Were they that expensive that your son
being upset for 30 minutes was more important? Or were you trying to
teach him a "lesson"? Do you think maybe the lesson was that (in the
mind of a six year old upset boy) "Mom doesn't care how I feel or
what I want. She doesn't understand how important it was to me'. Did
he finally give up after 30 minutes, thinking you didn't care what
he wanted.
Just some food for thought. Please don't take it as an attack
because it's not meant to be. Imagine us just hanging out and having
a conversation. :-)
~ Joanne ~
Mom to Jacqueline (8), Shawna (11) & Cimion (14)
http://anunschoolinglife.blogspot.com/
--- In [email protected], "Tina" <kunjaana@...> wrote:
>
> So the other day we went to the mall to meet up with some friends
to
> play. We stopped in a coffee shop and I bought all my children
> chocolate milkboxes. I put the straws in and my son wigged out b/c
> he wanted to do his own. I didn't know this and was very sorry.
But
> this led to a 1/2 an hour long fit. He wanted me to buy another
one.
> I didn't want to buy another one but wished I did just to save us
> from his wig out session. After a half an hour he finally accepted
> it asked for it back to drink it.
> My son has outbursts when something doesn't go the way he thinks
it
> should and he has very intense emotions. He gets frustrated very
> easily. When this happens the only thing I can do is to leave him
> alone to cool off. And Im OK with that. I know some people just
need
> time.
> But is the yelling and screaming at everyone something that he
will
> grow out of? He is only 6 now. My cousin was like this and is now
18
> and still has the problems. He's even gone to jail for having an
> outburst on a police officer. I guess Im just worried. B/c I want
> him to be able to have healthy relationships where he can work
> things out in a healthy way. And I want him to be able to accept
the
> things he cant change and not let it take away from his enjoyment
of
> life. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can help? And what
to
> do in these situations?
>
Tina
Thank you guys so much for your suggestions. It has cuased me to
reevaluate my life with my children and make the changes that need
to be made to meet their needs better. I have already begun to do
some things differently and have seen a change. I appreciate all the
time put into responding to my questions.
--- In [email protected], "Erica" <hakujin777@...>
wrote:
reevaluate my life with my children and make the changes that need
to be made to meet their needs better. I have already begun to do
some things differently and have seen a change. I appreciate all the
time put into responding to my questions.
--- In [email protected], "Erica" <hakujin777@...>
wrote:
>Karlos
>
> > -=-Can you tell at the very beginning of the day whether
> > it's going to be a "good" day or a "bad" day? I can tell with
> > from the minute that he wakes up whether he will fight me aboutfamously.-=-
> > everything all day long or whether we can all get along
> >the "moody"
>
> I think its important not to think of it in those terms. My 5 year
> old DS is a very spirited child and he often wakes up on
> side. This morning he was upset that I had already made mycoffee.
> He usually sleeps later than me and has also never expressed anywith
> interest in helping me with that so he was pretty upset. I sat
> him and talked to him and we talked about him helping me set up thenot
> coffee pot in the evening so that he won't miss out on it in the
> morning while he's sleeping. He was still a little grumpy though,
> my happy, smiley guy so I decided to try something new. Isaid "where
> is Trevor's joy? did someone take his happy"? and I startedlooking
> under things and behind things saying "where did his happy go?"and he
> started to smile and laugh and was saying "Mom, your silly" but hewas
> enjoying it and brightening up. We finally found his joy in ashell
> and he listened to the ocean and the joy went back into him througha
> his ear. LOL
>
> Its a little silly but I'm finding more and more that I have to be
> little on the unconventional and silly side to help us all findjoy in
> our days. Don't think of it as a prelude him "fighting with you or
> getting along" think of it as an opportunity to grow in your being
> able to find a way to bring joy into your day.
>
> Erica
>
Nicole Willoughby
and he
started to smile and laugh and was saying "Mom, your silly" but he was
enjoying it and brightening up. We finally found his joy in a shell
and he listened to the ocean and the joy went back into him through
his ear. LOL
I "superglue" my kids hands to the car. one hand each when we get out of the van . It keeps them from running out into the parking lot and I know all hands are away from the sliding door when I close it. Then i make a big deal out of pulling them free and we hold hands and laugh and giggle our way into the store.
ps...when hot in the summer I spray the "superglue" on their feet
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
started to smile and laugh and was saying "Mom, your silly" but he was
enjoying it and brightening up. We finally found his joy in a shell
and he listened to the ocean and the joy went back into him through
his ear. LOL
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Erica I love that .
I "superglue" my kids hands to the car. one hand each when we get out of the van . It keeps them from running out into the parking lot and I know all hands are away from the sliding door when I close it. Then i make a big deal out of pulling them free and we hold hands and laugh and giggle our way into the store.
ps...when hot in the summer I spray the "superglue" on their feet
---------------------------------
Be a PS3 game guru.
Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bob Collier
Ah, yes. Power struggles. What are those things exactly? I never have
found out. I'm the World's Biggest Softy as far as my children are
concerned - I give in every time. And my children are two of the most
delightful people I've ever known. I wonder if there's a connection.
found out. I'm the World's Biggest Softy as far as my children are
concerned - I give in every time. And my children are two of the most
delightful people I've ever known. I wonder if there's a connection.
--- In [email protected], marji <marji@...> wrote:
>
> At 13:54 6/3/2007, you wrote:
> >It may seem to the world outside that I *give in* alot.
> >Contrary,it's not giving in,it's being mature enough myself to see
> >my *child* having a hard time with emotions he couldn't explain if
he tried...
>
> Beautiful.
>
> If you want to call a candle a "hammer," that doesn't make it a
> hammer! Folks see situations like kids having meltdowns and moms
> "giving in," and they like to call them "power struggles," but that
> does not make it so!
>
> The beautiful look of gratitude and appreciation on my son's face
> when he understands that I hear him and am helping him get what he
> needs is worth, to me, a whole case of milk boxes. That look on
his
> face tells a deeper story of learning compassion and understanding
> (for me and for other folks). Who knew that a simple three-letter
> word could have such a profound effect!?
>
>
> ~Marji
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>