Do any imposed limits have value?
lspswr
My dad recently asked a question about radical unschooling (not in a
critical way) which I don't yet fully understand for myself. His
question was, "Are there ever any limits *imposed* by unschoolers?"
My follow-up thoughts and personal ponderings are, "Do limits have
value?" and "Is there value in *imposed* _fill in the blank_?" I
would really like to hear thoughts from those of you with more RU
experience (I'm still very new).
Learning natural limits (gravity, physics, etc), lifestyle limits
(finances, health, etc), and other *non-imposed* limits happen as a
result of experiencing life. When I think about "What are imposed
limits?" I think of the word "withholding," which is not something of
value in my mind. A specific example my dad used in explaining his
question was that of families who are wealthy -- in an environment of
abundant wealth are spending limits, budgets, or allowances (all
imposed) valid learning tools or are they "arbitrarily imposed"
limits?
I know that "hypotheticals" are of limited value here, but the
questioning of *imposed limits* seems to me to be at the heart of
unschooling. I would love to hear from those of you with many more
years of experience!
Learning,
Linda
critical way) which I don't yet fully understand for myself. His
question was, "Are there ever any limits *imposed* by unschoolers?"
My follow-up thoughts and personal ponderings are, "Do limits have
value?" and "Is there value in *imposed* _fill in the blank_?" I
would really like to hear thoughts from those of you with more RU
experience (I'm still very new).
Learning natural limits (gravity, physics, etc), lifestyle limits
(finances, health, etc), and other *non-imposed* limits happen as a
result of experiencing life. When I think about "What are imposed
limits?" I think of the word "withholding," which is not something of
value in my mind. A specific example my dad used in explaining his
question was that of families who are wealthy -- in an environment of
abundant wealth are spending limits, budgets, or allowances (all
imposed) valid learning tools or are they "arbitrarily imposed"
limits?
I know that "hypotheticals" are of limited value here, but the
questioning of *imposed limits* seems to me to be at the heart of
unschooling. I would love to hear from those of you with many more
years of experience!
Learning,
Linda
Fetteroll
On May 11, 2007, at 1:13 PM, lspswr wrote:
budget on him without his input and against his will or by someone
happily explaining why she has set up the family budget as she has
when it comes up in daily life, answering questions, working with him
to adjust the budget to work in his needs? And perhaps asked if he'd
like to set up his own budget to see how it works (and be perfectly
happy if the budget project didn't last long.)
Would he learn percentages (writing, history, ...) better if someone
made him do something he had no interest in, or if someone showed him
cool stuff as it came up and answered questions he had?
It's not that something can't be learned through imposing your own
rules on someone. It's that:
1) it chips away at the relationship. It says right off the bat: "I
don't trust you." As soon as someone's defenses go up, learning goes
down.
2) they often learn other things beside (or instead of) what you had
in mind. For instance, they learn that it's great to have power and
it sucks to not have power.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> in an environment ofWould he learn more about the concept of budgets if someone imposed a
> abundant wealth are spending limits, budgets, or allowances (all
> imposed) valid learning tools or are they "arbitrarily imposed"
> limits?
budget on him without his input and against his will or by someone
happily explaining why she has set up the family budget as she has
when it comes up in daily life, answering questions, working with him
to adjust the budget to work in his needs? And perhaps asked if he'd
like to set up his own budget to see how it works (and be perfectly
happy if the budget project didn't last long.)
Would he learn percentages (writing, history, ...) better if someone
made him do something he had no interest in, or if someone showed him
cool stuff as it came up and answered questions he had?
It's not that something can't be learned through imposing your own
rules on someone. It's that:
1) it chips away at the relationship. It says right off the bat: "I
don't trust you." As soon as someone's defenses go up, learning goes
down.
2) they often learn other things beside (or instead of) what you had
in mind. For instance, they learn that it's great to have power and
it sucks to not have power.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
-=-His question was, "Are there ever any limits *imposed* by
unschoolers?" -=-
I don't make any arbitrary limits, if that's what he means.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
unschoolers?" -=-
I don't make any arbitrary limits, if that's what he means.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
jenstarc4
> A specific example my dad used in explaining hisWealthy families still have limits. Unless you are a billionare, I
> question was that of families who are wealthy -- in an environment of
> abundant wealth are spending limits, budgets, or allowances (all
> imposed) valid learning tools or are they "arbitrarily imposed"
> limits?
>
would think that you'd still have limits as to wether or not you should
get 2 jets instead of 1. I could be that you'd have to get a bigger
hanger for 2 jets and that it would mean not going to Paris for the
next few months, to have the money for you new hanger to house the 2nd
jet.
Very few people could actually afford to go to the moon.
More money just means more choices, not less.